/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13117803]

Why has black culture produced good/decent musicians but not a single respectable author?

[Anonymous No.13117810]

>>13117803
maybe because they didn't have access to a good education until a few decades ago?

[Anonymous No.13117814]

>>13117803
rhythm affects everything (even the spiritually barren anglo), while intelligence doesn't.

[Anonymous No.13117815]

>>13117803
>not a single respectable author?
??? do more research

[Anonymous No.13117817]

>>13117803
>Why has black culture produced good/decent musicians

black produced the only good musicians. white culture produced decent marketers.

[Anonymous No.13117818]

>>13117803
Nah this ruled

[Anonymous No.13117819]

Pushkin, Dumas, Machado de Assis, Zadie. Fuck off.

[Anonymous No.13117823]

>>13117810
I see what you mean. But one can argue the same about Ireland or Russia, or any country before the second half of the 20th century. The answer would be that the majority of the good authors were high class with acess to good education, and to that i say that there were plenty of high class blacks by now. They really shoud be putting up some good authors.

[Anonymous No.13117825]

>>13117819
Take DFW’s gf off the list and I’m cool with it

[Anonymous No.13117827]

>>13117819
They're all like 1/4 black. You can't claim them (whites can't claim them too).

[Anonymous No.13117829]

>>13117823
Because le niggers are monkeys lololololololololololol

Happy now?

[Anonymous No.13117830]

>>13117819
all mulatoos.

[Anonymous No.13117832]

>>13117819
>good

[Anonymous No.13117836]

Shakespeare

[Anonymous No.13117839]

>>13117832
Yeah, bro, only anglo writers from the last century are good. Sure, keep telling yourself that.

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » mxvabIoSIE No.13117840]

>>13117830
one drop rule, sweetheart

[Anonymous No.13117843]

>>13117803
Why the fuck would blacks have verbal iq

What would inspire them to devlop it historically?

[Anonymous No.13117844]

>>13117803
>hasn't read Coltrane's novel

[Anonymous No.13117846]

There are many great black authors, but contemporary American black culture, which I'd rather call 'hip-hop culture' is anti-intellectual, anti-'nerd' therefore, it is not likely to produce any great author - although there are so many people in it that, perhaps, someday, a great author will emerge, but probably not someone who belongs to it, but rather who was influenced by it.

Late 19th century Brazil probably had more great black authors - Machado de Asssis, Cruz e Souza, Lima Barreto; not forgetting that people like Gonçalves Dias would be seen as black by U.S. standards - than America has today, even though the number of blacks who could read and write was much, much, much smaller.

[Anonymous No.13117847]

>>13117829
I'm not sure if you're that anon, but i'm not a /pol/tard, and i don't want to take the direction of the discussion to "fuck niggers lole". I'm just genuinely curious. I've been reading some black authors and they were either subpar, or, at best, decent. Black music on the other hand is usually pretty good.

[Anonymous No.13117861]

>>13117810
imagine being such an inferior culture that your entire history has never built on anything, your art is a joke (until black culture molded with western culture to create the "nigga" culture (which is a superior culture to black (African) culture because it combines African culture with western culture, bastardizing both into one entity, in which at least western culture can raise the impact and power of it)), and you look down on intelligence, in such an early stage of development that a central religion was never even created (didn't even get to theocracy) (until "nigga" culture found out about Christianity, and the strange succumbed to Buddhism).
>>13117803
Alice Coltrane is superior

[Anonymous No.13117864]

>>13117818
hell yeah, don't see Ishmael Reed on /lit/ often. He just wrote a play about why Hamilton sucks and I wanna find a copy so bad.

[Anonymous No.13117882]

>>13117819
>Pushkin
born in Russia and was influenced by their superior culture.
>Dumas
born in France and was influenced by their superior culture.
>Machado
born in Brazil and was influenced by their (negligibly) superior culture (which is also why he is the worst author on the list).

[Anonymous No.13117885]

>>13117846
It's pretty weird how Brazil's intelligentsia was built by a bunch of Mullatos and "white" mixed people like Gonçalves Dias, Euclides da Cunha etc. The high class was pretty much all white and the mullatos and the rest of the population were illiterate but somehow they managed to make an impact through literature.

[Anonymous No.13117898]

>>13117882
also none of these people are black (other than Machado, who is "black" if you are using the term lightly and consider tanned south americans black).

[Anonymous No.13117920]

>>13117803
Read Invisible Man and eat your words.

[Anonymous No.13117927]

>>13117885
It's that Ireland effect. Pain breeds art.

[Anonymous No.13117935]

>>13117819
If Machado de Assis is black so am I

[Anonymous No.13117953]

>>13117935
He was definitely dark skinned.

[Anonymous No.13117967]

>>13117885
It's funny that the golden age of black Brazilian literature was the late 19th century.

We did have impressive black writers during the 20th century, but most of them - João Ubaldo etc. - were pretty much second-rate when compared to the truly major ones. Meanwhile, Drummond, Guimarães Rosa, Clarice Lispector, João Cabral were all white. Even Jorge de Lima was white by Brazilian standards.

[Anonymous No.13117971]

>>13117935
You are black and water is wet.

Anyway, apparently Machado wasn't as black as people says - it seems his mother was white and his father was mixed. Still, he was dark-skinned, had thick lips and definitely looked either like a black man or a 'pardo'.

[Anonymous No.13117973]

>>13117967
Don't forget Augusto dos Anjos, though. Definitely up there with the gods of poetry from the XX century.

[Anonymous No.13117975]

>>13117864
You’d think he’d get more attention from /lit/ after getting namedropped in GR, you can see he must’ve influenced Pynch

[Anonymous No.13117976]

>>13117971
>say

Fix'd.

[Anonymous No.13117986]

>>13117803
OP is gay

[Anonymous No.13117991]

Richard Wright
Jay Wright
Tolson
Cesaire

[Anonymous No.13118003]

mfw this thread

[Anonymous No.13118081]

>>13117803
It has more to do with the University structure. Canonical works are usually first recognized at the University level, but the professors who are all "muh representation" are more versed in social issues than aesthetic value. So they look for non-white nonmale authors to add, but usually they favor highly political author's with middlebrow prose. There are good authors like Jay Wright, but they don't get any attention

[Anonymous No.13118097]

>>13117803
Leon Forrest
William Melvin Kelley
Paul Laurence Dunbar

better than any black musicians

[Anonymous No.13118103]

>>13117953
>He was definitely dark skinned
Define dark skinned. If you're a white american my skin is probabily darker than yours. I'm not pale nor black my skintone must be closer to what you'd call "redbone". My lips are thick, my hair straight- wavy. Still most people here would call me white.

>You are black and water is wet.
Race is a complicated thing in Brazil. Most authors you gringos are claiming to be black are considered white around here.

[Anonymous No.13118105]

>>13117967
There's a vangaurdista who wasn't a communist? PCB was that cool?

[Anonymous No.13118117]

>>13117861
>Alice Coltrane is superior
Absolute shit take

[Anonymous No.13118118]

>>13117803
What other major black academics have there been? Identity studies is not academic btw.

[Anonymous No.13118125]

>>13117803
>why has black culture produced good/decent musicians but not a single respectable author
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.13118134]

>>13117823
>they really should be putting up some good authors
But do you actually believe that DFW and Pynchon are the greatest authors of 1970-present day? We should be comparing Toni Morrison to them, not to Homer or Shakespeare since it doesn't even make sense to compare DFW to Shakespeare.

[Anonymous No.13118246]

>>13117861
> Alice Coltrane is superior
You had a pretty good post going, but this ...

[Anonymous No.13118263]

>>13117817
Delusional.

[Anonymous No.13118269]

>>13117819
>Dumas
>black
Imagine having such a shit culture that you have to claim mixed writers from France lmao

[Anonymous No.13118271]

>>13117803
Really? Isn't Ben Okri one of the best authors working today?

[Anonymous No.13118273]

>>13117847
>I've been reading some black authors and they were either subpar, or, at best, decent.
lmao you know the answers to your questions.

[Anonymous No.13118279]

>>13117810
Pretty much this.

[Anonymous No.13118284]

>>13117803
>People on /lit/ see the race of the author before they decide whether they like the book or not.

[Anonymous No.13118291]

mlk wrote better prose than pynchon fuck you

[Anonymous No.13118293]

>>13117803
James Baldwin and Henry Dumas are fantastic though.

[Anonymous No.13118662]

>>13118293
Baldwin is a parasite. Ellision and Richard Wright are the answer we were looking for

[Anonymous No.13118704]

>>13118103
aren't you what's called a pardo in brazil? are pardos somehow considered white?

[Anonymous No.13118708]

>>13117803
>good/decent musicians
Like who?

[Anonymous No.13118718]

>>13118708
Mc hammer

[Anonymous No.13118730]

>>13118708
John Coltrane
Charles Mingus
Albert Ayler
Miles Davis
Duke Ellington
Thelonious Monk
Anthony Braxton
Eric Dolphy
Ornette Coleman
Pharoah Sanders
Sun Ra

[Anonymous No.13118737]

>>13118730
Get some taste you fucking retard.
>>13118718
I concede this point.

[Anonymous No.13118748]

>>13117803
Literary traditions, forms, and standards, as we think of them, have really always been a European thing, and they collapsed during the time that black Americans got the same meaningful opportunities to participate in them. Also, given how young it is, I don't think rap should be underrated in its potential to become a new Bardic tradition should be underrated---and Rap is obviously a product of black American culture.

[Anonymous No.13118761]

>>13117819
All more white than black

[Anonymous No.13118762]

>>13118730
Coltrane and Dolphy especially
Genuine geniuses
Cant leave Charlie Parker out though

[Anonymous No.13118765]

>>13118762
Coltrane is the greates musician of the 60s hands down

[Anonymous No.13118769]

>>13118730
>Anthony Braxton

[Anonymous No.13118775]

>>13118730
So indiscriminate to include Sanders and Sun Ra. Limited and indistinct musical identities those two

[Anonymous No.13118779]

>>13118775
>Sun Ra
>indistinct musical identity

[Anonymous No.13118782]

>>13118769
>Anthony Braxton

what's the matter? he was great!

[Anonymous No.13118783]

>>13118730
>/mu/ jazz starterpack

[Anonymous No.13118787]

>>13118782
its too academic

absolutely zero feeling to his music

[Anonymous No.13118797]

>>13117818
Yes

[Anonymous No.13118798]

>>13117861
>Alice Coltrane
her music is like 7/10 desu, her husband's is 10/10
>>13118730
that's a really good jazz starter pack

[Anonymous No.13118834]

>>13117920
Invisible Man is pure unfiltered shit.

[Anonymous No.13118841]

>>13118779
I should have said voice instead of identity. Fact is w/ both Sanders and Sun Ra that their afro-spiritualism/futurism dresses up pretty shallow playing with the aesthetic trappings of their respective philosophies in all-too-timely manner.

[Anonymous No.13118871]

>>13117803
It has to do with the type of music blacks produced. Always danceable countercultural music. They would obviously be the ones to makie it as the marginalised group in american society. The roots of all pop music is jazz which was invented through slaves playing marching band music for their slave masters. Whites were never gonna be the big innovators as the mainstream component where the respectable music they would make was restricted to european classical styles (no blacks there) but then that music isnt fun or exciting which is where the blacks would come in.

[Anonymous No.13118881]

>/lit/ talking about music
This is where I'd go if I wanted the most retarded opinions of all time

[Anonymous No.13118889]

>>13118881 whether /lit/ is worse than /mu/ for music discussion depends on whether /mu/ still like weezer or not

[Anonymous No.13118904]

Does every single person in this thread know every jazz musician that ever existed? What the fuck? I clicked on it because I was genuinely interested but all I see is people shit talking other people's taste in music. What the hell

[Anonymous No.13118914]

>>13117803
Langonston hughes
Maya Angelou

OP BTFO never to return /endthread

Bait harder polnigger

[Anonymous No.13118917]

>>13117803
No respectable writers have been produced anywhere since before blacks started learning how to read

[Anonymous No.13118922]

>>13118834
not an argument

[Anonymous No.13118932]

>>13118834
Covered in white paint

[Anonymous No.13118946]

>>13117810
I wonder how other races got "access" to good education in the past?

[Anonymous No.13118950]

>>13118904
Just /lit/ trying too hard like usual.

[Anonymous No.13118952]

>>13117803
Ellison retard

[Anonymous No.13118959]

>what is william shakespear

[Anonymous No.13118966]

>>13117823
Ireland and Russia have produced no good authors, so there

[Anonymous No.13118977]

>>13118904
Every single one mentioned ITT is entry level.

[Anonymous No.13118985]

>>13118946
They paid for it if they were rich and didnt receive it if they were poor. Read more history

[Anonymous No.13118992]

>>13118730
jazz is dogshit

[Anonymous No.13119017]

>>13118992
t. Uncultured nincompoop7

[Anonymous No.13119020]

>>13119017
He is right, only an absolute moron would believe otherwise.

[Anonymous No.13119027]

>>13118704
Most Black Brazilians are, at least, 50% non-African (Ameridian/Colonial Portuguese contributions).
Pardos are 60% to 75% European.
White Brazilians are >75% European.
Brazil, although a very mixed country, is more related to the South Europeans (Portuguese, Spaniards, Italians) than anything.

[Anonymous No.13119064]

>>13118992
Correct. It hardly even qualifies as music.

[Anonymous No.13119068]

>>13119027
Mediterraneans is a better term than "south Europeans"

[Anonymous No.13119081]

>>13118841

Should have just said you have no idea what you are talking about.

[Anonymous No.13119139]

>>13118904
literally just top 20 most famous jazzmen

[Anonymous No.13119150]

>>13117803
I have no idea, since I have never read black authors. Have you read them?

[Anonymous No.13119169]

1/10 I responded

[Anonymous No.13119174]

>>13118992
Fuck off Adorno, you were wrong then and you're wrong now.

[Anonymous No.13119178]

>>13118103
>>13118704
>>13119027
I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you’re referring to as "Whiteness" in North America, is in fact, a bastardized form of early 20th century Nordicism, or as I’ve recently taken to calling it, Nordicism plus Slav. Nordicism is not strictly based on skin pigmentation itself, but rather a European tripartate of classic phenotypes, Nordic, Alpine, and Mediterranean.

Many Americans apply this modified version of Nordicism every day to race relations, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of Nordicism which is widely used today is often called “Whiteness”, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically Nordicism, now with the inclusion of slavic peoples because their skin is intuitively fair. There really are Nordics, and these people can recognize them, but now they include Slavs because Americans focus less on nationality and even more on phenotypes than Europeans.

Nordicism is the kernel: the idea in the system that allocates peoples' ideologies to the racial stereotypes you can have. The kernel is an essential part of the United States, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete ignorance of history. Whiteness is normally used in combination with Nordics and Slavs: the whole system is basically Nordicism with Slavs added, or Nordicism/Slav. All the so-called “Whiteness” declarations are really variations of Nordicism/Slav.

[Anonymous No.13119195]

>>13117882
If "their superior culture" is really a thing, then why south america, the continent where the novel didn't existed, made a significant result in literature?

[Anonymous No.13119203]

>>13119195
>the continent where the novel didn't existed
That should tell you enough about how behind their culture was.

[Anonymous No.13119209]

>>13117803
shakespeare, the greatest writer who has ever written, was black

what are you even on about?

[Anonymous No.13119211]

>>13117975
Maybe /lit/ is too well informed to give a damn about a nigger author just because some equally talentless jew critic says he's part of western canon.

[Anonymous No.13119214]

>>13118992
>>13119064
Wrong and wrong. Jazz musicians were some of the greatest geniuses of the 20th century

[Anonymous No.13119225]

>>13117975
95% of people on here never got that far into GR

[Anonymous No.13119297]

>>13118985
Imagine being so much of a parasite that you cannot conceive of creation.

[Anonymous No.13119330]

>no Walcott, no Glissant, no Chamoiseau
i love this board

[Anonymous No.13119385]

>>13117827
>>13117830
>>13117935
>>13118761
>>13118269
So .. one drop rule or not? please be consistent.

beside that, black genes are dominant, white are recesive, mullatoes are more black than white.

[Anonymous No.13119395]

>>13118269
>Imagine having such a shit culture of a country, that their best writer was a mutt lmao

[Anonymous No.13119399]

>>13119395
Damn, france btfo

[Anonymous No.13119759]

>>13117803
Because writing was never a part of traditional african culture and black people in Europe and the US have only gotten access to solid education in the last couple of decades.
Don't forget the much higher amount of education white people enjoyed and the substantialy higher amount of them and then take with that that most white authors are still garbage.

[Anonymous No.13119763]

>>13119385
>I do not understand the complexity of genetics and will argue from this ignorance now.

[Anonymous No.13119785]

>>13117823
No, one can't. Russia and Ireland still had rich people who were highly educated. Black people in america were not even let into any major educational institutions and their schools were (and still are) a lot worse than white americans.

[Anonymous No.13119788]

>>13118704
>are pardos somehow considered white?
Totally, on a day to day basis. Look at this guy here, he's a former President of Brazil. To me this guy is white, to most of you besides pol/, he's white too (Mediterranean, see>>13119178), to the people in the streets he's white undoubtely. He self declares "pardo"...
The important thing you're forgeting is that here in Brazil these race polls rely heavily on self-declaration and many people from older generations (black people from a time when you didn't have anything to gain for being black) trying and avoiding the stigma of blackdom self declare "pardos". I saw it clearly two weeks ago when talking to an old friend of my father who is darker than Coltrane and which self declared as "pardo", I couldn't help but laugh. Stil I didn't oppose him, today most blacks are proud he's from another time, another period without internet ativism.

[Anonymous No.13119812]

>>13119211
What does Bloom have to do with any of this

[Anonymous No.13119854]

>>13119785
Not if our future president and great defender of black pride has anything to do with it.

[Anonymous No.13119984]

>>13119788
Oh, and is good to remember that Black Brazilians is a very distinct from Sub-Saharan Africans nowadays, even though they are very related to them. I recommend to do some reading about their contributions to our (already dead) folklore.
Is so sad that the retarded brown petit-bourgeois Afrocentrist movement infected Brazil, with the "Black Power" identity. Thanks USA and their shitty politics.

[Anonymous No.13119998]

>>13119788
>>13119984
kek that stallman pasta is my shitpost, though I was somewhat familiar with the pardo situation in brazil already, it's just that I've heard some southern brazilian muh german heritage types refer to pardos disparagingly, so I wasn't sure if pardos are popularly considered lower class or if those guys I was talking too are just /pol/ tier, forgive me as I'm a bit drunk now

[Anonymous No.13120023]

>>13119984
>contributions
almost everything interesting of brasilian culture and folklore is from black brasilians. The little contributions came from other people.

[Anonymous No.13120062]

>>13120023
Not at all, friend. If you weren't from the self-hating Southeast you'd know how important Iberian culture is to Brazil. Just read Ariano Suassuna and stop bullshitting.

[Anonymous No.13120079]

zora neale hurston...

[Anonymous No.13120083]

>>13117991
This also Senghor.

[Anonymous No.13120110]

>>13118783
Well it's a starterpack for a reason.

[Anonymous No.13120126]

>>13119395
>the only French writer I know is Dumas
go back to r/books

[Anonymous No.13120131]

>>13118992
>>13119020
Reminder even Heifetz liked jazz music.

>inb4 litterally who ?

While play cultured music connoisseur if you are so obviously ignorant ?

[Anonymous No.13120135]

WEB Du Bois
Booker Washington
Frederick Douglass

[Anonymous No.13120144]

>>13119984
>Afrocentrist movement infected Brazil, with the "Black Power" identity. Thanks USA and their shitty politics.
That's where I was trying to get at. I feel like some people around here are trying really hard to copy-paste an U.S.A reality and modus operand without taking into account the brazilian historiograph and its peculiarities.
>>13119998
>it's just that I've heard some southern brazilian muh german heritage types refer to pardos disparagingly
That's just pol/ being pol/.

[Anonymous No.13120152]

>>13117803
>inafter people implicitly assume OP is only talking about Amrican blacks

With the exception of three posts we got what we could expect. Another proof that /lit/ doesn't read much outside of Anglotardism and a few influential Euros.

[Anonymous No.13120156]

>>13119984
>Afrocentrist movement infected Brazil, with the "Black Power" identity. Thanks USA and their shitty politics.
Did it really? Isn't 2/3 of Brazil a nignog or mixed?

[Anonymous No.13120161]

>>13117819
>pushkin
>dumas
WE WUZ WRITERS AND SHIET

[Anonymous No.13120164]

>>13120144
Even though only 30% of Brazilians could somehow be considered "Black'

[Anonymous No.13120177]

>>13120156
True. It's bizarre because my old brother looks like Cristiano Ronaldo and my youngest looks like Hugo Chávez

[Anonymous No.13120194]

>>13120177
None of those are black, though.

[Anonymous No.13120206]

>>13117803
It's possible that Africans do not have a genetic propensity for academic activities in the same way that whites don't have the physical genetic attributes to compete in activities like sprinting or basketball.

[Anonymous No.13120213]

>>13117814
You're talking about the Apollonian and Dionysian here. Typical negroid response not having the ability to look beyond their own monkey existence.

[Anonymous No.13120217]

>>13117819
>dumas
>5% african ancestry

WE WUZ

[Anonymous No.13120221]

>>13117817
>marketers
that's the jew. Europeans are responsible for the greatest works ever made. Just because the United States is pushing boom boom ooga booga shit at the moment doesn't mean it's good. Black music died with the blues genre.

[Anonymous No.13120226]

>>13120217
to elaborate, there are worthwhile black authors out there, but dumas is NOT one of them

it’s like retconning egypt or the aztecs as black, rather than acknowledging actual black history or cultural traditions; but intelligent blacks don’t actually do this

[Anonymous No.13120231]

The black contribution to literature is is better than their myriad contributions to music. The latter amounts nihilistic dance music while the former includes some genuinely great writers.

[Anonymous No.13120241]

>>13117803
Same reason there are no good novels written by someone under 25 while plenty of great music comes from the youth.

[Anonymous No.13120271]

>>13120135
Affirmative action-core

[Anonymous No.13120279]

>>13120206
It's possible that death rays from Mars killed her. But I don't think so.

[Anonymous No.13120306]

>>13117971
Water isn't wet

[Anonymous No.13120312]

>>13117830
always a retarded argument. "Black when convenient to my prejudices"

[Anonymous No.13120318]

>>13118730
>Sun Ra

[Anonymous No.13120332]

>>13118783
Full Mantis is such a trip. What a man. All The Notes is also a hell of a dive.

[Anonymous No.13120371]

>>13120213
I am. And, idiot, nobody CAN look beyond their existence. They can only interpret representations of things outside of their existence, which is not looking beyond (that implies existing there), but only looking at a model of what used to exist. But soon, the people who spend too much time trying to interpret representations of other existences outside of their existence loose sight of their own existence. Don't you know the past is used to model the present? But what is to be said of the importance of the past if you can't build on it (which you just denied me for doing).

You are a person who treasures others interpretations of representations of the past more than your own of the present, but are too cowardly to build on the past in the present, precisely because you ignore it for the past.
It is almost paradoxical: you don't build on the past because you are distracted by it.

[Anonymous No.13120372]

>>13117803

Its hard to thoroughly answer such a loaded question but I'll try my best. The issue of education is relevant but not complete, as evidenced by the Russia and Ireland mentions. There isnt a black Joyce nor Dostoevsky, but likewise there is no Irish Davis or Russian Parker. Yet there are a Gwendolyn Brooks, Ishmael Reed, Amiri Baraka, Etheridge Knight, Ntozake Shange, Langston Hughes, Claude McKay, Toni Morrison, James Baldwin, Richard Wright, and much more. But what's this to say? That these authors are equivalent or superior to their European counterparts? No, the point is actually quite simple and evident, if one allows it to be: different cultures excell in different areas, but this doesn't neceesitate a neglect of those areas which are not their expertise. There have been plenty of brilliant black writers, but /lit/ is just very blatantly under-read on the matter, and if not, often predisposed to not accept that black people, as all people, have multiple talents. Its doubtless most of the posters in this thread haven't read much of, if any, of the writers ive mentioned, and they're hardly obscure. So we take this ignorance accompanied by a will to disbelief and we result in the fantasy of "blacks are unable to produce good literature". There is very obviously a bevy of great work by black authors, surely not up to par with Flaubert or Tolstoy, but is that really relevant? The question is whether or not black people can write well, isnt it? Well then yes, or course, just pick up a book! But our talents excell most prominently in music, atheletics, oration, and plenty other arts recognized for their quality of uniqueness and soul. It's also relevant to mention that the quality of literature as a whole has diminished considerably since the time black people learned to pick up a pen, and mind you, this time was, in regards to the masses, considerably later than the Russian and the Irish. And due to their unique political status, black people were certainly inclined towards more biographical topics than the aforementioned Europeans, and therefore a little late to the game of makig art for its own sake. If we are being truly honest, black people have clearly done well for ourselves given the circumstances of our foray into literature, and I don't doubt that if the tradition had been introduced en masse in say, the 18th century, under different circumstances, we would certainly see a different tradition today.

[Anonymous No.13120384]

>>13120372
Based. I've been reading more about black history and i'm starting to believe that blacks are kinda underrated in the whole scheme of things, given their historical circunstances (preceding even colonization and slavery). However, it takes one interaction with the average black for me to forget it all and think they're a lost cause. You guys make it hard for us outsiders to sympathize, yo.

[Anonymous No.13120398]

>>13120372
I get your point, and would add that looking for a black Joyce or Tolstoy is just a dishonest metric because they have no equivalent in any other cultures either. Literary writers form their own ontologies anyway, so unless there are clear similarities in their body of work or thematic interests comparison will always be misguided.

[Anonymous No.13120401]

>>13120372
>black is a race when convenient
>black is a culture when convenient

[Anonymous No.13120408]

>>13120372
>Yet there are a Gwendolyn Brooks, Ishmael Reed, Amiri Baraka, Etheridge Knight, Ntozake Shange, Langston Hughes, Claude McKay, Toni Morrison, James Baldwin, Richard Wright, and much more.
is it a coincidence that all these authors were born after 1900 in America? There are no coincidences. Because American culture is superior.
>and therefore a little late to the game of makig art for its own sake
lol. This alone should prove in an inferiority of culture. Consider: the art produced by black culture before slavery (that is, before black people started being shipped to America) was nearly non-existent, and after slavery (when black culture was mixed with american culture to produce a new culture) it was plentiful.

[Anonymous No.13120415]

>>13119385
>So .. one drop rule or not? please be consistent.

why are you attributing one-drop ideology to people on this board? even literal nazis didn’t abide by that. just because someone isn’t 100% white doesnt mean that they become 100% black lmao

[Anonymous No.13120417]

>>13120401
race is an outdated term. Any amerifat or retarded britbong will just see anyone with dark skin as of the same black race. Hell in pre-civil rights America there were people with like 1/16 African ancestry who could be legally white in one state then black in the next. Never mind that Africa is a huge continent with vastly different ethnic groups and cultures.

[Anonymous No.13120418]

>>13120401
That's how everyone uses it. Blackness is a spook.

[Anonymous No.13120426]

>>13120408
>Consider: the art produced by black culture before slavery (that is, before black people started being shipped to America) was nearly non-existent

That's just you being ignorant of pretty much anything about Africa. Lr2nto anthropology faggot.

[Anonymous No.13120429]

>>13117803

Writing is a necessarily intellectual enterprise, while musicianship is not.

[Anonymous No.13120434]

>>13119385
Nobody mentioned Burger rules here.

[Anonymous No.13120453]

>>13117803
Ralph Ellison
Toni Morrison is uncontested by literally anyone with an informed opinion about literature unless you weigh heavily on her unoriginality. But hey everyone is unoriginal in a certain light.
Langston Hughes
Ishmael Reed
Teju Cole
Colson Whitehead is unironically smarter than anyone who’s ever frequented this board.
James Baldwin

There’s not many there are some.

[Anonymous No.13120467]

>>13120401

Sorry if thats confusing. I'm referring to black culture as in black Americans. I wasn't trying to be unclear. By the "black race" i refer to the abstraction used to describe descendants from Africa with dark skin.

>>13120408

This is a dishonest reply. African art existed in the form of dance, sculptrure, and oral poetic traditions before the involvement of Europe. And I don't doubt there was more than that, but I wont feign to be very well read on the matter, and neither should you. The concept of superiority here, we know, is subjective, and obviously Euro-centric. "i like this type of art and mode of society more than this other one therefore it is better" is what you're saying. If anything, the ability to produce such plentiful amounts of wonderful art in the short time that black people did should be recognized as a feat of their own talents rather than a total European superiority. Obviously the introduction of European traditions resulted in the product, and theres no discredit towards Europea's artistic history here, but likewise, you have to give credit where it's due to black Americans for innovating beautifully. Think about it, what other American sub groups made such a unique impact on American culture? Italian Americans? Jewish Americans? Come on. And we know they had their own traditions back home but so did black people so the point is irrelevant to note.

>>13120398

Agreed. And on that note id compare Ishmael Reed with Joyce, not in terms of quality but the spitit of innovating the English language wad certainly there (Mumbo Jumbo).

[Anonymous No.13120486]

>>13120384
it's a classic trap, the real issue is that like one out of ten blacks is top tier, whereas with other races it's two out of ten. oversimplified of course. so blacks get the shit end of the stick; while most people are garbage of any race anyway, they have a bit of a higher percentage. africa just sucks. it's awful. for whatever reason, bemelanin'd folk do not tend to turn out as well, for genetic (one discoverer of DNA was crucified for this, james watson) or environmental reasons, they are just bollocks in too many ways. but don't believe me, believe the eternal NIMBY. that's why I don't care about being called a racist, people can wail about racism all they want but as long as they live in nigger-free environments, the message they send is clear: "my gated community is better without blacks." let's not let the percentage get too high, they say, while I actually live around black people, being a worker.

add to that the two components: 1) blacks of the american hemisphere do not represent actual africans, ours are an admixture, of higher IQ, while africa sits at retard levels and western blacks are 85 IQ which is bad but not "can't parse more than some animals" bad. then 2) many anti-black americans/europeans are themselves the "blacks" of "white" culture: how do you shit on people when you are the yourself the discards, the low end of the spectrum in the minds of your rulers and so-called anti-racist NIMBY-ists?

it's a mess. you can't win. in the end, if you are a decent black, you are the exception, and for the white it's the same, the ratios are different but one thing remains: the eternal NIMBY created this paradigm in the first place. no war but the class war, gamers rise up

[Anonymous No.13120497]

>>13117803
A few good works here and there but nothing superior to Asian or Latin American literature.

[Anonymous No.13120505]

>>13118730
>jazz
Kek

[Anonymous No.13120524]

>>13120467
>African art existed in the form of dance, sculptrure, and oral poetic traditions
all in an EXTREMELY underdeveloped form compared to their European counterparts. Pic related is laughable.
>The concept of superiority here, we know, is subjective
Classic. Thinking everything is equal because subjectivity exists. "Everything is subjective" means that everything can be perceived from a variety of perspectives, indeed an infinity of them, it doesn't mean that all perspectives are equal. From the plurality of subjects it by no means follows that all subjects are equal! For if all viewpoints were indeed equal they would have to be identical!
>Think about it, what other American sub groups made such a unique impact on American culture?
What about those that made American culture?

[Anonymous No.13120535]

>>13120426
Yeah, I should've used "underdeveloped", not negligible, because there certainly is a mass of it, because it was so easy to create.

[Anonymous No.13120542]

>>13120524
>compared to their European counterparts
took me ten seconds on google to find this.

[Anonymous No.13120545]

>>13120467
>Think about it, what other American sub groups made such a unique impact on American culture? Italian Americans? Jewish Americans?
you literally said it. Jewish americans.

[Anonymous No.13120562]

Jesus christ on what unmathable level of postmodern irony do I need to be to consider Pushkin a nigger.

[Anonymous No.13120566]

>>13120542
>making another disproportional head and using a stick to create lines across it is equivalent to pic rel
are you joking?

[Anonymous No.13120573]

>>13120562
Nothing "postmodern" or "ironic" about it. It's actually pretty old, and it's called one drop rule. Pushkin was black.

[Anonymous No.13120577]

>>13120542
african art, ladies and gentleman. Could barely make a head, let alone a body or hair

[Anonymous No.13120580]

>>13120566
lol nigger that's a metal alloy. Nice comprehension of art history though.
Now please tell me this is high European art.

[Anonymous No.13120585]

>>13120542
this is a bit embarrassing

[Anonymous No.13120587]

>>13120577
that particular piece was discovered in an excavation and most likely was a full body metal sculpture

[Anonymous No.13120591]

>>13120580
that art is shit. My whole point is culture (and art) isn't equal.
>lol nigger that's a metal alloy
your point? A painting is just a piece of paper

[Anonymous No.13120599]

>>13118662
>baldwin is a parasite
this week on groomed undergrad hot takes

[Anonymous No.13120600]

Why has black culture produced good/decent literature but not a single respectable musician?
fixd for you

[Anonymous No.13120602]

>>13120573
>It's actually pretty old, and it's called one drop rule.
We're not in Alabama, burgerfag. The world is not black and white.

[Anonymous No.13120603]

>>13120542
>l-look guys! We can art too!

[Anonymous No.13120606]

Wilson Harris is a T.S.Eliot approved sci fi author.

[Anonymous No.13120607]

>>13120591
You seriously suggested a stick was used to etch lines in bronze.

[Anonymous No.13120609]

>>13118985
They created it dumbass. Oxford university was established while the Aztecs were still sacrificing people and who knows what the fuck Africa was doing.

[Anonymous No.13120614]

>>13120602
It doesn't matter in which part of the world you're in. Science is science. And the science says that, one drop of nigger blood = nigger. Pushkin is black.

[Anonymous No.13120616]

>>13120603
top fucking keks

[Anonymous No.13120618]

>>13118834
you sound like you read two pages then finished the essay with wikigardening

[Anonymous No.13120620]

>>13120542
balanced and equal, as all things should be

[Anonymous No.13120623]

>>13117803
Unironically probably socioeconomic factors. Music has a pretty low barrier to entry from creative black kids so it makes sense they'd go towards it, plus black culture basically runs music so that's probably appealing to them too as they can see examples of success. We'll probably see more in the coming years as we keep working on pushing education in poorer areas. I'm always down for different voices telling compelling stories.

Also pic related was required reading in high school.

[Anonymous No.13120625]

>>13120614
>And the science says that, one drop of nigger blood = nigger.
That's not at all how genetics work, burger. He'd look 100% black if that were the case. Try again.

[Anonymous No.13120630]

>>13120144
Pretty much this. It's absolutely pathetic seeing black Brazilians larping as black panthers or quoting Black american authors nonstop.

[Anonymous No.13120632]

>>13119211
your entire worldview is founded on meme

[Anonymous No.13120636]

>>13120542
*breathes in* AHAHHAHAHAHA AHHAHA AHAHA HA H AH AH A A AHAHHAHA AHAHHA AHAHHA AHAH OH NONONO HAHA NO NO HEDIDNT HAHAHAHA AHAHHA AHHAHA AHAHHAHAHA AHAHHA AHAH AHAH AHAHHAHAHHA AHAHAHHA AHAHHA ON NO PLEASE NO HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA HE ACTUALLY POS- AHAHAHAHHAHAHA AHHAHAH HAHAGAGAH AHHAH AH A A PLEASE MAKE IT STAHAHAH AHAH ANO NO AHAHAH NOOOHAHAHA AHHAHA AHAHAHHAA AHAHA HAHA AAHA AHAHA AHAHA AHAHA AHA AHA HAHA AAAH AAHA AHA AHA AHAHAHHA

[Anonymous No.13120641]

>>13120625
Except that's not the case. African genes are dominant, and the man himself was 1/4 black. That's literally millions and millions of African genes which are dominant virile bulls. You can even see it in his behavior; the man wanted to go around killing everyone in duels and generally bullshitted through life instead of trying to work. He only looked white by chance. His brain was black.

[Anonymous No.13120644]

>>13120607
never said the stick was wooden. What do you think they used dumbass? Their hands?

[Anonymous No.13120645]

>>13117815
Why don't you actually recommend something instead of just saying "Ummmmm do more research sweetie ;)"

>>/r/eddit

[Anonymous No.13120652]

>>13120609
>Oxford university was established while the Aztecs were still sacrificing people.
The Oxford University was founded the same century the Crusades were still a thing (just starting, in fact).

[Anonymous No.13120655]

>>13120401
blah blah blah. you self-important whites are so predictable

[Anonymous No.13120657]

>>13120644
>the stick was wooden
Are you an ESL or just a complete retard. What is a stick to you but wood?

[Anonymous No.13120669]

>>13120641
>only blacks are violent and lying men
Never go full retard.

[Anonymous No.13120676]

>>13120609
it seems they already had a unviersity in Morocco centuries before that.

[Anonymous No.13120679]

>>13120655
Not even white, sweatie ;)
Are you butthurt?

[Anonymous No.13120681]

>>13120603
I sure am glad European sculpture has advanced past tribal art!

[Anonymous No.13120682]

>>13120657
stick1
/stik/
noun
1.
a thin piece of wood that has fallen or been cut from a tree.
synonyms: piece of wood, twig, small branch More
2.
a long, thin piece of something.
"a stick of dynamite"

[Anonymous No.13120683]

>>13120681
It sure as hell has, nig.

[Anonymous No.13120690]

>>13120573
>miscegenation laws make this man black
Retard

[Anonymous No.13120694]

>>13120681
>Picasso's modern art garbage

[Anonymous No.13120701]

>>13120681
>even a shitty remake of post-modern art is better than african art
buy this here:
https://www.amazon.com/Handmade-European-Sculpture-XN-2113-Decor-Collectible/dp/B00MJ1QC3M

[Anonymous No.13120710]

>>13120683
and so has African art, from an ancient time
>b-but it's broken
So what? It's a sophisticated technique and piece.

[Anonymous No.13120713]

>>13120710
Not even on the same level. Try again.

[Anonymous No.13120716]

>>13120682
Stick of what then nigger? Stick refers to wood unless you specify.

[Anonymous No.13120721]

>>13120701
where can I buy this impressive piece of European art?

[Anonymous No.13120726]

>>13120721
>being this much of a philistine

[Anonymous No.13120729]

>>13120713
They are both realism pieces, both sculptures. One was a carving on stone, the other a metal alloy work. They both require a lot of skill, but there's no significant difference besides the David being more visible in European art culture.

[Anonymous No.13120733]

>>13117819
>Dumas
>Pushkin
being 88% white does not make you black

[Anonymous No.13120734]

>>13120721
I actually agree that modern art is garbage. It is just what happens when a culture expends all potentiality in a field of art, and moves on to a higher one (cinema).

[Anonymous No.13120741]

>>13120729
>there's no significant difference
This is bait, right?

[Anonymous No.13120750]

>>13120741
oh I'm sorry, one was made by a nigger right? If I told you it was actually a European sculptor this whole time, I'm sure you would still call it shit that a child could easily do.

[Anonymous No.13120754]

>>13120524

I think you've missed my point. The concept of superiority, as far as civilizations and cultutr goes, is inherently subjective as far as an individual opinion goes without a thoroughly established ranking system, and even then the system is only based on subjective senses of importance. But thats beside the point, no one said anything about "equality" to begin with, but rather, the culture exists with its own traditions. The anon, (not sure if its you) claimed Africa had no art and I counted it with verifiable fact, there was nothing in the mention of equality, this is a sentiment invented for vitriolic purposes, though never explicitly stated in my post. The point is, and I repeat, different cultures are good at different things, period. Whether or not theres an objective means of assessing this is a separate issue. If one denies that the whole of black diasporic art and African traditional art is worthless then thats their opinion. I'm only here to provide evidence of different black contributions to art and rebuke the idea that theres nothing respectable about it. I find it very strange that you and several posters have rallied around to mock a point that i never made, yet somehow maintain an air of superiority towards the argument. As for the question of "those that made American culture" this may do you more disservice than good to ask, as a considerably amount ot American culture has developed in reaction to the black person. Well of course, we have the American romantics like Melville and Hawthorn. And we have Poe, Dickinson, Whitman, Longfellow, and a beautiful tradition featuring white American authors, who would deny it? But the influence of black culture in American music, fashion, vernacular, and all sorts of trends is incredibly evident, if we are discussing America as an identity particularly unique from the British, which, in my opinion, cannot be recognized until the 19th century. So, since the emergence of black artistic expression, there has been profound levels of influence on American culture, whether you deem it "respectable" or not, it is there. Jazz, rock, punk, all genres pioneered by black people, and subsequently are very distinctly American. Now, I do believe the American cultural essence transcends racial boundaries, as any country's spirit does, and should not be attributed to any one influencer, given the great ethnic variety of the American population. But this all being said, really, there'd nothing to be so spiteful about. My whole argument boils down to "black people are good at making art, if they havent reached the same heights of other cultures in certain areas thats irrelevant to the main point". What is there to counter?

[Anonymous No.13120759]

>>13120721
Duchamp was a genius.

[Anonymous No.13120761]

>>13120710
pfft-yes, very sophisticated, fellow continent africa. Love how you did that, hand, that is?

[Anonymous No.13120771]

>>13120750
I'm not sure you're actually seeing the David... Search for a picture in better quality. Them being "realist sculptures" doesn't make them equal.

[Anonymous No.13120772]

>>13120754
Nah, actually you are right. I made a mistake in stating that black culture has made no art. Their art may be underdeveloped, but they still made art.

[Anonymous No.13120774]

>>13120761
>uh oh I've ran out of arguments, time to switch mediums and try again!

[Anonymous No.13120789]

>>13120750
>If I told you it was actually a European sculptor this whole time, I'm sure you would still call it shit that a child could easily do.
I know I would, because it is garbage, that, if a european did it, we wouldn't even be talking about it because it would get immediately flushed out by all other much more articulate and advanced european art.

[Anonymous No.13120795]

>>13120741
>>13120771
>>13120789
what's funny is that you think Michelangelo belongs to you any more than he belongs to the borderless arena of creative greatness. Here you are in the mud, slinging mud, eating the words of your own mud, and pretending Michelangelo stands behind you in this fight. He would recognize more in one African sculpture than in the artifacts of your entire life, for you are very small.

[Anonymous No.13120796]

>>13120542
>no one here recognizes the yoruba heads
the exception proves rule, but what an exception

[Anonymous No.13120806]

I, personally, don't need to find historical or artistic reasons to hate blacks

[Anonymous No.13120807]

>>13120774
Thats a different anon.

[Anonymous No.13120808]

>>13120789
Any anthropologist or art historian would tell you otherwise, but sure thing bro.

[Anonymous No.13120811]

>>13120774
>criticizes me because Africas art never advanced into architecture and painting
>thinks what he posted (which is half a body, missing a hand, with little to no articulation in defining muscles, wrinkles, or clothes, is equivalent to pic rel)

[Anonymous No.13120813]

>>13117814
>spiritually barren anglo
I see you've never met a german

[Anonymous No.13120815]

>>13120676
True, but they basically just studied Shaira law so it is a little different if we're being honest. They actually require people that "graduate" to remember the Quaran in full.

[Anonymous No.13120817]

>>13120811
>which is half a body, missing a hand
Why didn't they give him a nose! Was Plotinos just disformed or something?

[Anonymous No.13120826]

>>13117803
Evolution. Africans would sit in front of fire and sing and dance to their drum beats surrounded by their tribe, its what they done most of the time in the old days (and pretty much all they do today). Best singers/performers were probably favored by opposite sex. Their survival strategy wasnt dependent on resources and scarcity of food, they just fucked anyone and everyone no matter how useless they were. Useless people raised useless children and today the result is chimps in human civilization.

[Anonymous No.13120833]

>>13120795
>He would recognize more in one African sculpture
certainly not much to recognize.

[Anonymous No.13120834]

>>13120795
>what's funny is that you think Michelangelo belongs to you any more than he belongs to the borderless arena of creative greatness.
I'm not even European, faggot. The discussion was about European art being massively superior to African art, which it is. Not about who owns that art.
>He would recognize more in one African sculpture than in the artifacts of your entire life, for you are very small.
Conjectures about unknowable things are irrelevant and meaningless to the discussion. We can't know this. What we know is that he created the David and it's superior to your African sculpture.

[Anonymous No.13120836]

>>13117810
First post; best post

Music is something that requires a lot less academic overhead to produce something that sounds good. You can fuck around on an instrument for a few years in a vacuum and inherently learn what notes sound interesting to you (which will probably translate to someone else hearing it), but literature inherently requires synthesizing other work in order to learn the conventions of grammar and to have sufficient vocabulary. If you give someone a pen and paper in a vacuum, they aren't going to suddenly learn narrative conventions or new words in a given language.

tl;dr: Music doesn't require knowledge of formal language conventions as a prerequisite to creating work

[Anonymous No.13120839]

>>13120811
>never advanced into architecture

[Anonymous No.13120841]

>>13120811
like every other sculptureposter in this thread, you have a very shallow and narrow definition of aesthetic beauty, lazily modeled on the works you would see in art history 1 (I say "would" because it's clear you aren't even a college freshman yet)

[Anonymous No.13120854]

>>13120817
plotinus without a nose still looks way better than what you originally posted. Notice the greater articulation in detail around the eyes. Notice the various facial wrinkles. Notice the level of detail even in the hair.

[Anonymous No.13120858]

>>13120834
>superior
You are unable to define and contextualize how David is superior, so you instead restate your case ad nauseam. If you keep repeating meaningless phrases, you eventually believe them. All communists know this.

[Anonymous No.13120860]

>>13120710
Look at the texture of his (her?) skin and the size of his (her?) hand. That's not in any way "realism".

[Anonymous No.13120863]

>>13120841
>it's popular so it's bad
oh pseuds

[Anonymous No.13120868]

>>13120858
>You are unable to define and contextualize how David is superior
I'll do it for him: detail, which the african sculptures ultimately lack.

[Anonymous No.13120877]

>>13120858
>If you keep repeating meaningless phrases, you eventually believe them. All communists know this.
>the guy who thinks cultures are equal said this

[Anonymous No.13120881]

>>13120858
You said both are equal because both are "realism pieces". I said this: >>13120860
Look at David and then look at your thing. Not in any way on the same level.

[Anonymous No.13120886]

>>13120860
>the texture of the skin
it's metal faggot.
>>13120854
The contortions of the face are the same level, the "facial wrinkles" you are referring to are replaced by a fine line patterning in the first piece, clearly indicating it was a stylistic choice.You are really just grasping for straws without any knowledge of art at this point.

[Anonymous No.13120891]

>>13120881
>just LOOK at them, bro
boy you sure convinced me

[Anonymous No.13120892]

Africa isnt a monolithic place with a monolithic ethnicity, its literally more diverse than the rest of the world combined, you can't call it all "black culture" anymore than you can hoist up the Yoruba heads at one point and the kush pyramids across millenia and the continent at another, talk about places and peoples and influences and eras or shut the fuck up; you're all idiots and this thread should be pruned

[Anonymous No.13120896]

>>13120868
Detail, another meaningless word, no doubt founded on an outmoded and European idea of realism
>>13120881
I didn't say both are realism pieces. Multiple anons believe you are retarded.

[Anonymous No.13120919]

>>13120729
>They are both realism pieces, both sculptures
>>13120896
nice try, samefag. QED.

[Anonymous No.13120952]

>>13120919

[Anonymous No.13120961]

>>13120896
>I didn't say both are realism pieces
I quote: "They are both realism pieces, both sculptures. One was a carving on stone, the other a metal alloy work. They both require a lot of skill, but there's no significant difference besides the David being more visible in European art culture."
Someome actually thought this counted as an argument. Someone actually holds this retarded opinion. Whoever you are, rich or poor, handsome or ugly, please commit suicide immediately.

[Anonymous No.13120968]

>>13120892
a culture is only as important as its interface with markets, who gives a fuck about some random african conflict between tribeniggers when the result is something like the languages on this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_in_Africa

nobody cares, africa is diverse for the same reason that rednecks are diverse, nobody will remember their random farm animal squabblings. so "black culture" as a monolith is fine, it's the actual wheat anybody cares about, just because there's a bunch of extra chaff doesn't make it worth a shit

[Anonymous No.13120988]

>>13120896
detail. Yeah, totally meaningless word.

[Anonymous No.13120992]

>>13120968
Imagine being this retarded americuck. Is Mcdonalds the pinnacle of high culture then, being highly influence on the market? Marvel Movies? Neck yourself, you pop-art water-brained twat.

[Anonymous No.13120999]

>>13120961
You're a fucking dumbass. You are arguing with different anons. His viewpoints are not identical to mine. But we are both arguing against you because you are the kind of dumbass who would repeat pedantic shit like this.

[Anonymous No.13121001]

>>13120952

[Anonymous No.13121007]

>>13117803
Dubois
Hughes
Ellison
Delaney

I don’t even like nigs but they’ve had some decent writers

[Anonymous No.13121008]

>>13120992
sneed is the pinnacle of high culture

*clicks this message at you in nigger tongue*

[Anonymous No.13121015]

>>13117803
prevalent oral tradition

[Anonymous No.13121040]

>>13120968
I mean genetically diverse pal, grouping east africans with west aftican bantus is literally more retarded than lumping in pale east asians with whites

[Anonymous No.13121263]

>>13120761
Baroque shit, so fucking sophisticated. Just paint everything, just add gold, just do this. Gosh, this is pathetic.

[Anonymous No.13121278]

>>13120599
>Baldwin
Not really. He preaches victimhood and he's a fag. He is a precursor to SJW culture

[Anonymous No.13121294]

>>13117803
The Harlem renaissance and Ralph Ellison though.

[Anonymous No.13121351]

>>13117803

[Anonymous No.13121413]

>>13120632
>worldviews are founded on ideas
Whoa, is this your brain on nigger 'books'?