Preferred Translations

[Anonymous No.1294231]

Alright. I have yet to see a recommended translation.jpg for classic novels into English, so I would like to create at least a list of the best translation editions.

So far I only know of:
Pevear and Volokhonsky for anything Russian.

How about books like:
Don Quixote
Dante's Trilogy
Works by Alexandre Dumas
German works
Ancient Greek and Roman

Anyone have any suggestions? I figure if I am reading it, I might as well read the best translation. Especially since I don't have enough time in my life to master every language just to read a few books.

[Anonymous No.1294233]

The default translation for Classical texts is Robert Fagles.

[Anonymous No.1294244]

Pevear & Volokhonsky’s translations are awful travesties of the original Russian meaning and nuance. They succeed by virtue of seeming “weird” where the original text uses a completely commonplace idiom, or, vice versa, missing something unique to the writer’s style and replacing it with a pedestrian cliche. Readers who have no Russian think the “clunkiness” of the translation is a window to the original writer’s peculiar style and idiom. Unfortunately, they’re being deceived. The clunkiness is almost always the invention of the translators. The issue isn’t whether the original was “smooth” or not; it’s that it wasn’t smooth in ways entirely different than those ignorantly made-up by this team.

P&V seem to start with a completely literal word-by-word translation by Volokhonsky, one that doesn’t even preserve common idioms; it is then perhaps edited into shape by going after some clunkiness here and some inventiveness there, in total ignorance of what’s interesting or unique about the original author’s style or idiom.

[Anonymous No.1294261]

>>1294244
You shouldn't rely on translations to preserve style its just unrealistic. That said, P&V aren't great.

[Anonymous No.1294293]

>>1294244
>>1294261

Shit. I was on /lit/ in the summer and most people seemed to unanimously agree that the P&V translations of Dostoevsky are great. I picked up their Crime and Punishment a couple of months back and was planning on reading it over Christmas. I feel as though I've been deceived. I'll just have to read it and decide for myself; however, my main goal when reading is not always admiration of the way the text flows, but understanding the themes of the book and what the author is saying. As long as I can do that then I'm happy.

>>1294233

I enjoy Fagles' translation of The Iliad and The Odyssey. I have his translation of Sophocles' Theban Plays, and I plan on reading them along with C&P this Christmas.

For Dante I really like the Dorothy L. Sayers translation because it's very readable. Penguin Classics publishes them and each Canto is complete with notes explaining certain passages and the images Dante constructs in his poetry. I highly recommend the Sayers translation for new readers to Dante.

[Anonymous No.1294315]

Robin Buss version of The Count of Monte Cristo is the good one.

[Anonymous No.1294319]

>>1294293
thats what you get for trusting the summerfags...

... but overall I think relying on anything or anybody on 4chan is a pretty bad idea.

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294324]

>The default translation for Classical texts is Robert Fagles

Are you trying to say he's somehow a master of every classic language, rather than just one?

My BS senses are tingling.

[Anonymous No.1294330]

>>1294319

shut the fuck up.

if you know of a better alternative to P&V, please share.

[Anonymous No.1294367]

I'd say Burton for the 1001 Nights.

[Anonymous No.1294376]

Classical Texts - Robert Fagles
Dante - Dorothy L. Sayers
Dumas - Robin Buss
1001 Nights - Burton
So far you guys say this.

Any more languages I you know of that go well? I read the Starkie translation for Don Quixote, but I have nothing to compare it to. It seemed good enough for me.

[Anonymous No.1294387]

>>1294324

Shut the fuck up you fucking ignorant piece of shit I hope you die of drowning after someone gouges your shitty eyes out.

>>1294231

Homer: Lattimore for academic study, and either Fagles (more archaic) or Lombardo (more modern) for fun.

Virgil: either Fitzgerald or Lombardo. Probably Lombardo. That motherfucker's translations are TIGHT.

This topic also reminded me of the spectacular essay "The Translator of The Thousand and One Nights" by Borges. It's worth getting one of the non-fiction collections just for this essay.

Also: anyone know what the best translation of Goethe's Faust is?

[Anonymous No.1294391]

>>1294367
>>1294376
>mfw Burton removed all the "obscene" parts

[Anonymous No.1294392]

>>1294324
Ancient Greek and Latin, you can learn them both fine, those two languages are basically all that's important for the classical period, or classical studies and by extension classical literature.

[Anonymous No.1294419]

Can anyone weigh in on whether P&V are, in fact, or are not shit?

[Anonymous No.1294436]

>>1294376
>1001 Nights - Burton

lolno. Stick with Lang. Or one of the more recent translations. Burton's translation is flowery bullshit.

[Anonymous No.1294447]

In looking for the best translation of Kafka, I came across
http://www.nvcc.edu/home/vpoulakis/Translation/kafkatr1.htm

Anyone have a suggestion for the best translation of Kafka?

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294460]

>>1294419
I loved their translation of TBK, Constance Garnett's was really shit.

[Anonymous No.1294463]

>>1294391
Really? I thought it was the Galland translation that did that. I was told that Burton's was true to the original stories.

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294466]

>German works
is there even much difference between translators? I know its not as close to english as dutch but its still quite easy to translate isn't it?

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294470]

>Burton's best-known achievements include travelling in disguise to Mecca, an unexpurgated translation of One Thousand and One Nights (also commonly called The Arabian Nights in English after Andrew Lang's abridgement), bringing the Kama Sutra to publication in English,
hehe somehow i think this guy left it all the 'obscene' parts ^ ^

[Anonymous No.1294473]

>>1294466
being german and having seen how some guys translate it into english i know that there can be a huge difference (depending on the authors style of course).

[Anonymous No.1294491]

P&V, to me, seem the greatest translators of Russian so far. They're the default for Dostoevsky, and I'd also say for Tolstoy but the Maudes have also written some strong translations. Stay the fuck away from Garnett...*shudders*

For Don Quixote, I'd go with Edith Grossman (for most of Spanish works she's great for) or the older Tobias Smollett translation, written during the time of Cervantes.

Fagles seems to be the best balance of great translation and modern accessbility but I haven't read enough Homer or classics to be able to tell you if there's any one better.

[Anonymous No.1294501]

>>1294244
>> implying Dostoevsky isn't the clunkiest author of all-time
>> implying translations that read like translations are bad
>> my visage

[Anonymous No.1294515]

>>1294391

Are you kidding?
Burton was the first guy to translate the fucking Karma Sutra, your thinking about someone else.

[Anonymous No.1294557]

>>1294419

They are shit.
I think Volokhonsky can't speak very natural English and translates waaaay to literally and Pevear can't speak Russian so tries his best but ends up with wild inaccuracies.

Some examples of their mistranslations?

Russian: Доказательство мой почерк моя подпись молнируйте подтверждение
установите секретное наблюдение Воландом Лиходеев
Glenny: On a dark sheet of photographic paper the following lines were clearly visible
P&V: On a dark background of photographic paper, some black handwritten lines were barely discernible
They fucked that up. "Clearly visible" is correct, "barely discernible" is not only wrong but totally the opposite of what the sentence is meant to say!

Another thing the constantly (i.e. EVERY TIME) screw up is translating "тут" as "here" instead of "then". I know they mean "here in time" but this gets really confusing as you don't know whether they mean "here at this place" or "here at this time".

The P&V translations don’t give any sense of the original Russian. They aren’t “literal”; they are a mish-mash of styles, epochs, approaches; filled with mistakes in understanding the Russian and appalling English.

Plus they're awkward to read as hell. I could forgive mere clunkiness if the translations were even accurate, but they really are not.

[Anonymous No.1294767]

>>1294557
>> implying a stupid fucking russian knows anything about anything

so glad we own you guys

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294783]

However, according to Kevin Moss, who has at least two published papers on the book in literary journals, the early translations by Ginsburg and Glenny are quite hurried and lack much critical depth.[13] As an example, he claims that the more idiomatic translations miss Bulgakov's "crucial" reference to the devil in Berlioz's thought:

"I ought to drop everything and run down to Kislovodsk." (Glenny)
"It's time to throw everything to the Devil and go to Kislovodsk." (Burgin, Tiernan O'Connor)
"It's time to send it all to the devil and go to Kislovodsk." (Pevear, Volokhonsky)
"To hell with everything, it's time to take that Kislovodsk vacation." (Karpelson)

Yeah Glenny is a fucking wanker who just rushed all his translations to get mad bank

[Anonymous No.1294795]

>>1294557
>> a russian (presumably drunk) says P&V suck
>> Harold Bloom, world's best read human being says they are awesome

I'll go with the Russian from 4chan on this one.

[Anonymous No.1294819]

I've only read P&V translation of Notes from Underground and i probably won't read another translation by them. If i wanted a clunky, literal translation i would copy paste the original into Babelfish.

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294827]

>>1294819
>clunky, literal translation
>P&V
>literal
This thread is funnie

[Anonymous No.1294836]

>>1294827
STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING STOP POSTING

[Anonymous No.1294838]

>>1294819
Wow, do none of you faggots realize that Dostoesvky was not at all a polished writer? Every book of his is just, herp derp so ronery and isolated, oh shit! who's this new character that just showed up at the end of the chapter! oh shit! this woman is being hysterical! ETC. ETC

Either deal with Dostoevsky the way he is or don't read him.

[Anonymous No.1294885]

>>1294419
I've sampled a few of their translation works and I have to say I'm not as impressed as I've been led to expect.

>>1294767
>>1294795
It might shock you guys, but a person who knows how to speak Russian might not, necessarily, be Russian. So all these ad hominem attacks are just lol

captcha: Woomey Injuries.

[Anonymous No.1294900]

>>1294885
that's even worse that you;'re not a russian

just some fag with rosetta stone trying to show the world that he's smart

[Anonymous No.1294902]

>>1294838
I am a big fan of Dostoevsky, but I agree.

[None !WvWWh.l.CE No.1294903]

>>1294885
Even so, it still holds that it's you vs. Bloom + Dostoevsky Scholar ITT.

[Anonymous No.1294905]

>>1294902
As am I. It wasn't intended as an insult.

[Anonymous No.1294952]

Any opinion on Marian Schwartz?

I've read 2 books by her. "Oblomov", which was OK, and "White Guard", which was quite awful.