Why does Marxism appeal to so many people? I simply can not comprehend it, especially when bookfags do it. Like, Marxism isn't conducive to the arts at all.

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Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:41:53 No.12366885 [Reply] [Original]

Why does Marxism appeal to so many people? I simply can not comprehend it, especially when bookfags do it. Like, Marxism isn't conducive to the arts at all.

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:47:16 No.12366904 >>12366885 Probably not dissiimilar to the appeal of the early Christian church. A teleological view of history. Opposition to the status quo. Allocation of purpose. The opportunity for martyrdom. Authority. Doctrines.

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:49:40 No.12366912 File: 37 KB, 300x300, WalmartChoir.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12366885 >all of the best films and modern art come out of Soviet Russia or marxism That's a big WHOOPS from me, bucko.

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:51:45 No.12366920 >>12366912 Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn disagrees with you.

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:53:46 No.12366924 The vast majority of people are poor and suffer from decaying economic material conditions. The only people who see no merit in Marxism are the rich and the small business owning rich people larpers

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:54:14 No.12366926
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>>12366885
Stop walking around with your nose in the air like you know anything about it.
You and Sowell have a surface level understanding of the whole picture at best. Capitalism does not work for the majority of people, it doesn't even pretend to. It is slavery and it is eating the finite resources of the world all up. Do some research.
Wolff, Harvey, Cockshott

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:55:09 No.12366933 File: 228 KB, 1278x902, IMEANREALLYDARK.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12366920 >MUH CIA LIT IS BEST lol

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:55:43 No.12366936 >Marxism isn't conducive to the arts at all. Yeah, capitalism is really great for the arts. Just look at the state of the film industry!

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:55:59 No.12366937 Art under capitalism is soooo much better. I cant wait for fast and the furious part 15: the squeakel. Why would anyone ever make art for other reasons than profit. ha ha

>>	Anonymous Mon, Jan 7, 2019 23:58:16 No.12366952 Your kind ain't welcome here sweetcheeks, this is a Marxist board

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:00:18 No.12366961

>>12366920
yikes. I like solzhenitsyn but this is a feeble refutation! don't turn solzhy into an item of mockery! and beside, what point are you trying to make? he is a product of the soviet union and socialism... you'd have been better off saying any of the great composers or writers in tsarist russia.

anyway, russian modernism and the avant garde had its peak in pre-rev and revolutionary russia. eisenstein, malevich, shostokavich, the list goes on. didn't last long. any new status quo inevitably becomes "conservative" -- the revolution always has to be "betrayed" if it's going to solidify rather than collapse.
>>12366924
poorfags have comparative little interest in marxism. labour movements, unions, social democracy, yes (well, in the 20th century at least). but weil was correct in calling it the "opiate of the intellectuals."

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:00:20 No.12366962 >>12366936 >>12366937 >if you're not a marxist you must be a capitalist!

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:01:20 No.12366965 >>12366961 by it i mean marxist theory

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:02:12 No.12366970 >>12366961 >https://youtu.be/WuVG8SnxxCM

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:05:24 No.12366978 >>12366961 Weil was a fucking kike LARPer.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:06:21 No.12366984

>>12366962
what art is is hard to define. What capitalism makes is surely not art. What capitalism makes if products that are meant to extract wealth and disposable income from markets.
Not even a simple definition of art as an expression or experience.
Capitalism does not make art it makes entertainment.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:10:30 No.12367002

>>12366984
though i agree with some marxist diagnoses of art commodity fetishism shit, i think your definitions are idealist and puritan, art has always been involved in commerce because humans have always been involved in commerce. transactions are impossible to avoid, even if they are not market based, a state grant or commission or patronage still implies some degree of tit-for-tat, being in their pocket.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:17:31 No.12367027 >>12367002 Do you think the cavemen where drawing on caves in order to make money? Do you think the great pyramids were made for commerce? Do you think religious icons were made for money or for faith? Capitlists are some really low iq retards

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:24:58 No.12367052 >>12366885 >Marxism isn't conducive to the arts at all Compare West German ‘film’ of the 1950s and early 1960s to DEFA films from the same period.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:30:35 No.12367078
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>>12366926
Honest reply from a different anon incoming. I am aware of the view concerning capitalism's failures, but virtually all of them can be pinpointed to either 1) a failure in implementing capitalism completely (not taking down monopolies, backward tax policies that any thinker would disagree with, etc), or 2) some pre-existing inequalities of the world before, the system was settled on, being carried forward by their own weight (racial income differences, etc). Basically, every anti-capitalist doesn't seriously content with what actually smart capitalists say.

Give me some legitimate, modern sources critiquing capitalism, not only from a first principles perspective but also proposing concrete alternatives to some specific aspects of the current system, and I promise to make multiple threads in the future sharing my enlightenment.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:32:13 No.12367086 >>12366924 How dare you pretend to be on the side of poor! Capitalism is the driving force behind lifting millions of people out of poverty in developed nations all across the world. You sicken me.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:32:50 No.12367093

>>12367027
did i say that art is always financially motivated? no. but the sistine chapel would not have been built, nor would it have been decorated, nor had its ceilings furnished with the paintings of michelangelo -- if not the exchange of coin for labour. do you think that because michelangelo received monetary incentive for his services, and that becasue his art would obviously increase the value of the church building, that his art expresses nothing? i am not making an apologia for mammon. i am not being prescriptivist. i just think you are being a psychotic moralist. too strict. treating art like a platonic form, rather than an emergent property of temporal biological existence.

humans exist in capitalism, as surely as they exist in feudalism, stalinism, hunter-gatherer societies. art, which is as dirty and as full of compromises (well, according to our standards) as the creatures who create it, seems to exist wherever humans do -- perhaps to greater or lesser degrees, but never to an extent where one can point to one sort of economic or social relationship and say unequivocally "this has not made art".

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:35:02 No.12367104 >>12366885 It appeals to the weak, lazy, stupid, and envious. AKA the majority among us.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:35:30 No.12367107 >>12366926 You are the absolute worst namefag and plague on this board you narcissistic scum. I hope you get raped by a pack of niggers

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:37:20 No.12367116 File: 8 KB, 250x202, cigarette.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367086 This is the most boomer post I've read this year.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:37:56 No.12367120 >>12367093 Yes you did. Your conception of art is that is only made for profit and commerce, and that art is only possible because the benevolent rich people fund it As they say. Van gogh only sold one painting his whole life

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:38:30 No.12367125 >>12366885 >Why does Marxism appeal to so many people? I simply can not comprehend it, especially when bookfags do it. Like, Marxism isn't conducive to the arts at all. You have autism and were probably born to a rich conservative family/area.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:41:20 No.12367137 >>12367120 >Van gogh only sold one painting his whole life How did that work out for him? >>12367125 >you are (class i do not like) Spoken like a true marxist.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:41:52 No.12367139 >>12367116 Not an argument

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:43:39 No.12367148 >>12367125 Lol this projecting

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:45:07 No.12367155 >>12366885 Because marxism is a lazy attempt at trying to be intellectually and morally superior.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:46:00 No.12367158

It’s absolutely destroying the arts. It’s no coincidence that there’s no good movies, music, books, or anything fun anymore. But if you want an honest answer it’s useless college degrees and massive debt/stagnant wages. Ironically academia tells students that Marxism is an answer to the very problem they perpetuate. But even beyond them the cost of living is so high and wages so low that people are turning to not just Marxism but other fringe groups as well. Philosophically I agree with capitalism and it has worked magic for us; but I think with the economy entering into the global marketplace and technology what it is now all of the models we have are outdated.

Hell,’ Marxism and capitalism were written down before we had nuclear arms or drones. None of this shit makes sense anymore so don’t even try.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:46:31 No.12367161
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>>12367078
>1) a failure in implementing capitalism completely (not taking down monopolies, backward tax policies that any thinker would disagree with, etc)
That IS capitalism. That is what happens in free markets. It frees the masters of the markets and capital to do whatever they want. It's broken from the start.
>Not real capitalism
It is! It doesn't work because it rewards an elitist crowd of sociopaths. Making a stronger government isn't the answer, making it small or trying to pretend you're doing capitalism without a government, isn't the answer

>Give me some legitimate, modern sources critiquing capitalism, not only from a first principles perspective but also proposing concrete alternatives to some specific aspects of the current system, and I promise to make multiple threads in the future sharing my enlightenment.
I already dropped three names. Read their work

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:47:17 No.12367164

>>12367120
boring antagonism. uncharitable mischaracterisations and reliance on exceptional factoids, as if i'm trying to argue that art always relies on commerce, rather than that art can coexist with it.

likely late adolescent, and if not, subdued transsexual - this being the only form of sexual deviatiation available to you, otherwise too milquetoast to be anything but vanilla heterosexual. authoritarian impulses. low agreeableness.

>>12367125
at first i thought you were profiling those drawn to marxism.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:48:19 No.12367170 >>12367164 oops *deviation

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:49:13 No.12367175

I am going to get into a rant but it's the same thing that 4channers obsessed with fascism/nazism, another system that has been proven to fail each time it's implemented: it is a compilation of the following factors:
(1) It allows a sense of identity, something the the (you) can be or aspire to be.
(2) It extensively uses the 'blame the other' argument, bourgeoisie in the case of marxism.
(3) It offers a simplified view of the world, a sort of magic manual which, if correctly followed, will lead to prosperity.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:49:26 No.12367177

>>12367120
Not him but you realize most artists and poets have always have patrons to pay them to do their work. This is how it was done for centuries. I understand under hyper-capitalism most art is sterile and hallow but your hippie notion that it has only value when it’s divorced from money is childish. Don’t forget it was the rich Catholic Church that hirer Michaela gelo.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:51:46 No.12367187 File: 34 KB, 640x392, c123.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12366885 Because learning Economics is hard.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:52:41 No.12367194

>>12366885
Because it literally cannot fail. Whenever marxism fails the adherents simply blame capitalism. It's an idea that has been designed to perfectly insulate itself from reality while killing hundreds of millions of people as brutally as possible.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:52:50 No.12367196

>>12367161
Make sure you say that capitalism doesn’t work *anymore* because it has indeed brought the world great peace and miracles like medicine and technology. Boomers only see it this way as they lived through a golden age. To deny this is disingenuous and a misunderstanding of history. Otherwise I completely agree with you.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:53:25 No.12367202 >>12367120 >Van gogh only sold one painting his whole life he wasn't that good

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:53:30 No.12367203 >>12367161 Don't drag Björk into this you twaddling cunt

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:54:28 No.12367216 >>12367175 >that has been proven to fail each time it's implemented wait, how many times has national socialism been implemented? Can you even define fascism without condemning the concept of government itself?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:56:09 No.12367226 >>12367194 or when it doesn't follow marx to a T it's no longer real socialism / communism.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:56:37 No.12367229 >>12367175 Capitalism does all of these as well. Especially American capitalism.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:56:52 No.12367231

>>12367177
This isnt a hippie notion. It is Schopenhauerian aesthetic.

The aesthetic experience temporarily emancipates the subject from the Will's domination and raises them to a level of pure perception. "On the occurrence of an aesthetic appreciation, the will thereby vanishes entirely from consciousness."[7] Genuine art cannot be created by anyone who merely follows standard artistic rules. A genius is required, that is, a person who creates original art without concern for rules. The personality of the artist was also supposed to be less subject to Will than most: such a person was a Schopenhauerian genius, a person whose exceptional predominance of intellect over Will made them relatively aloof from earthly cares and concerns. The poet living in a garret, the absent-minded professor, Vincent van Gogh struggling with madness, are all (at least in the popular mind) examples of Schopenhauer's geniuses: so fixed on their art that they neglect the "business of life" that in Schopenhauer's mind meant only the domination of the evil and painful Will. For Schopenhauer, the relative lack of competence of the artist and the thinker for practical pursuits was no mere stereotype: it was cause and effect.

In proposing that art could offer deliverance from the Will, Schopenhauer elevated art from mere artisanry or decoration, and held that art potentially offered temporary deliverance from the aimless strife of the Will in nature. In effect, Schopenhauer turned art into a substitute religion by offering a doctrine of salvation through aesthetic experiences. Artists were not merely skilled hands; they were priests or prophets of this doctrine.[8] This teaching goes far to explain Schopenhauer's appeal to members of the creative communities over the second half of the nineteenth century. His doctrine of aesthetics justified artistic work as a matter of highest importance in human society.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:57:30 No.12367234 ITT: Brainlets arguing about economic systems they don't understand while claiming to be enlightened. Fucking pathetic all of you

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:59:07 No.12367247 >>12367229 No it doesn't

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 00:59:31 No.12367249

>>12367216
not him but fascism's emphasis on revanchism and irrational war for war's sake (inherited from wilhelmine germany) has tended to doom itself. then again, i try not to be a historical determinist. it would have been interesting to see how mussolini's italy would have turned out in another timeline. they might have followed the same path of squalor and decay as conservative authoritarian regimes like spain and portugal, but perhaps not.
>>12367231
i like schopenhauer but his views on art have always seemed anaemic to me. too ascetic. over-thought. i prefer nietzsches. more human, warm-blooded.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:01:55 No.12367261 >>12367231 U gay

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:02:57 No.12367267 >>12367247 >bootstraps >self-made man >Russian communists >American dream >We need more tax breaks >supply and demand

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:04:05 No.12367272 >>12367249 Lebensraum was not irrational considering the 800k germans that died due to the post-war blockade a decade earlier.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:06:46 No.12367290 >>12367267 That's political rhetoric you dolt

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:08:16 No.12367296 the only stable political system is one that exists atop an ethnically homogeneous society if we stopped debating diversity meme we could make progress on the most efficient system, and have time and resources to feed the nogs just to shut them up

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:09:52 No.12367303 >>12367296 feeding the nogs is the most certain way to ensure the greatest amount of suffering for nogs.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:10:27 No.12367307 >>12367296 Welfare doesn't work homie

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:14:51 No.12367325

>>12366885

To be honest, I hate Marxism OP. I am, despite being a retarded squishy meatbag, at least intelligent enough to see where this goes once everyone is allowed to eat each other "requisitioning" everyone else's stuff for themselves.

Having said that, this retarded squishy meatbag has a problem with the idea of laboring every day until I die if I don't want to starve, so I understand why people are drawn to the idea. The simple fact is, if my generation ever wants to succeed, we need the freedom to cut off the generations before us and plunder them of their wealth, so that my generation can have that wealth. Allowing the elites to continue passing down all of the centralized resources, finances and IPs to a tiny fraction of the people living means there's going to be a lot less for me and mine, and I don't particularly like that my labor will grow weaker and weaker in value as I grow older until I don't have a leg to stand on, and my only choice to sustain myself in the long term is to become one successful idea man out of a million, or a venture capitalist with pennies left for capital. I also don't appreciate not being able to afford a house ten years out of school with a solid job in the trades because all of the houses are half a million dollars and will be a cool mil by the time I save up that much cash. Inflation, you know?

Unfortunately we're mostly told that we need to stop being entitled or whining about our lot in life by the older folks who get to retire on the backs of our hard work. So our only choice is to kill them all and take their shit. Its nothing personal, you just think you're all entitled... to that shit that I also want.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:15:59 No.12367326

>>12367078
>every anti-capitalist doesn't seriously content with what actually smart capitalists say
That’s because the last honest capitalist thinker was Ricardo. Then Marx provided the logical continuation and conclusion of Smith and Ricardo’s work and forced capitalist thinkers to simultaneously elevate their forbears into patron saints and ignore all but a few useful phrases from their work. The most blatant example of this is marginalism, which runs completely counter to the observations of both.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:16:05 No.12367327 >>12367325 There's another choice. But it works so well that an entire mythological narrative had to be created to keep it down.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:17:53 No.12367334 >>12367307 Public opinion of welfare only dropped when blacks started getting it.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:17:57 No.12367335 >>12367327 And here we find the most insipid creature of all, the class collaborationist. Which flavor are you, social democrat or nazi.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:18:40 No.12367338 >>12367335 Neither. Nazis never existed.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:19:44 No.12367342 >>12367334 I'm brown Welfare only keeps us down

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:22:01 No.12367347 >the productor must own the product Sounds good, but most productor are lowbrow rats, so once again anti natalism is the answer.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:26:34 No.12367362 >>12367338 >REAL NAZISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED Oh boy

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:27:32 No.12367366
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>>12367196
How is this even a serious post?
You're unaware of all the wars capitalism causes? The real capitalists know damn well that's the cause, you know? The main thing about it is that it competes. Sure it can advance technology, mostly war applications, and medicines, usually only when it can turn a profit, but it sure as hell loves the smell of corpses and the sound of war orphans.

>>12367203
I look like a relative of hers, so go clean your penis off, four-chin.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:27:37 No.12367367 File: 369 KB, 300x450, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12366912 a lot of the best Russian art was critical of their regime.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:29:03 No.12367375 >>12367362 what's the etymology of the word "nazi"?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:32:02 No.12367393

>>12367375
Listen Gregor, I get that you’re still butthurt over that nice long knife Adolf shoved up your pooper, but your written works all talk about what a class collaborationist you are and what a good idea it is so you’re only slightly more ‘socialist’ than Adolf and friends.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:33:12 No.12367399 >>12367366 You're so fucking stupid and vain Of course you're female You think the whole world fits neatly into your little worldview and that you really know what's going on

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:33:33 No.12367402 All the best Soviet art was banned...it's a catch-22. They produce the best artists, but those artists are dangerous to the regime.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:33:47 No.12367404 >>12366885 Because its true. Sorry.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:34:26 No.12367406 >>12367393 What's the etymology? Is it a german word? Is it a portmanteau of german words? Which german words?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:36:50 No.12367422 >>12367406 Is there some kind of point coming here or are you really just planning on declaring that your totally ‘socialist’ TM version of National Sozialismus would be substantively different from the historical version:

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:37:57 No.12367425

>>12366885

News flash: Poor people dislike being poor. More at 11.

Also, strangely, we outnumber everyone who isn't poor. By a lot. A really quite absolutely huge number. For a third, the only real resistance is other poor people who have more than homeless people who are afraid that they'll also be homeless or dead once poor people kill everyone who isn't poor.

And for the low, low price of the property and inheritance rights of a small minority, and probably also their lives, a whole new group of people can finally grow up as slightly-less-poors. What a marvel!

Of course it doesn't really work that way in the real world, but as with every revolution, bread riot or mutiny, that won't stop people with nothing to lose from trying. I'm honestly surprised that you're even surprised.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:39:01 No.12367428 >>12367399 I do know a lot of what's going on, anon. The world is hugely complex, and the problems you all bitch about are held in place by this systemic linchpin problem. (For which Stirner identified perfectly) Don't make this about your dick.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:39:18 No.12367430

>>12367366
>You're unaware of all the wars capitalism causes?
Wow I didn't know capitalists invented war.
>Sure it can advance technology, mostly war applications, and medicines,
You didn't even mention a fraction of what capitalist societies have produced
>usually only when it can turn a profit
Yeah that's why the United States gives millions in foreign aid to other countries
>it sure as hell loves the smell of corpses and the sound of war orphans.
Do you even read your posts before hitting send? Fucking cringey man
You are the WORST namefag

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:41:23 No.12367440 >>12367234 Gives no opinion or thought on the matter yet feels they are above the rest. Just fucking kill yourself.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:43:20 No.12367448

>>12367366

Not that other guy, but...

>Loves the smell of corpses and the sound of war orphans

You can't really pin this on capitalism or any other ideology. Every single religeon, government, country, skin color and language is guilty of war crimes by any civilized modern standard if you go back far enough. Communists, Capitalists and Fascists all kill people with equal zeal. As long as there are two people on the planet, there will be conflict. There's never going to be any getting around that as long as everyone is allowed to be individuals, and I really hope you're not against THAT just for the sake of security.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:45:32 No.12367466

>>12366885
Marxism is appealing because it's a pretty common sense framework for analyzing why workers feel alienated.
More orthodox economists spend too much time wanking off the role of the entrepreneur while belittling the role of the blue collar worker, which at the end of the day, makes enterprise possible in the first place.
What I'm saying is to be understood as distinct, to some degree, of why people find socialism and communism appealing. In these cases, it is a mix seeing the imperfections of capitalism in their every day life, such as how competition inevitably leads to winners and the killing of competition, making it so a handful of firms dominate an industry, and a naive hopefulness of what's possible via the government or even via anarchistic cooperation.
I say it's healthy for people to read Marx in the right environment, namely one in which people don't pretend laissez-faire capitalism is the best system and workers are given their fair share of dignity.
People hate all the underlying elitism in the opposition.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:49:52 No.12367485 >>12367375 Abbreviation of German pronunciation of Nationalsozialist (based on earlier German sozi, popular abbreviation of "socialist"), from Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:53:56 No.12367499

>>12367430
Cause=/=invent
Historically wars grew from raids, piracy, thefts from one clan over another. All this over food and then other resources. Little but the scale of it has changed. In this modern scientific economy the wars have only gotten more vicious and cruel. Guns and gunpowder are made to be sold for wartime.
>You didn't mention a fraction...
I'm not pro-capitalist, dear. I hate the thing, for what it does to you as much as me and my friends, and all those dead people
>The US gives millions to foreign countries
Yeah, look at the billions we've pumped into Syria! But seriously, I think that phase of "neocolonialism" is over now, we're now a massive paranoid surveillance state looking for a fight even though our war spending is through the roof (Yes this is how nations fall, but this time the world economy is going to fall too. China saved us the last crash, but they may not have it in them to do it again)
>Caring about the dead is cringy
You are doing a terrible impression of a human being. Go flush yourself

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:55:55 No.12367508

>>12367366
You’re being absolutely histrionic. People like you are the reason nobody takes criticism of capitalism seriously. You aren’t intelligent for figuring out that capitalism has a dark past that isn’t taught in public education. Yes, it has cultivated much of the world in its image and perpetuated wars. I suppose next you’ll tell me that it’s the bloodiest or worst thing to happen to humanity. It’s literally all relative. South Korea might still be a war ridden hellhole without the US forcing capitalism on it. There have been far worse things humans have done. You must take the entire picture into account and frankly human beings will go to war with eachother. Technology will now march on without capitalism. But it’s still provided more to us than ever before. Are we empty because of consumerism? Is capitalism collapsing in on itself under globalism? There are plenty of valid points to be debated but your worldview is foolish. Take your bullshit war orphans to tumblr where the plebs belong.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:56:35 No.12367512 >>12367086 >>12367139 hi stef

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 01:58:46 No.12367517 >>12367499 The absolute power of your brain on liberalism.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:03:27 No.12367532 >>12367499 FUCKING LOL You're so pathetically idiotic. "People" like you are the reason I thank G*d every day I wasn't born a woman

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:04:52 No.12367539

>>12367448
I can pin it on capitalism, and I do pin it wider on legalism as a whole. If we had a better motivator for society we would be able to do away with widespread full scale wars. I guarantee.

>>12367508
There have been many different people with many different angles critiquing and suggesting replacements for capitalism, and this is NOT the reason that some people wont listen. The reasons are for greed's sake and for the dummies in society other spooks, like nationhood, religion, culture or w/e

>it’s the bloodiest or worst thing to happen to humanity.
It will end up killing us all off if we don't stop it. You do the math. It depresses me. Your angle depresses me. You're just being stupid, and I don't care.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:05:36 No.12367541 >>12367485 Germans never called themselves nazis. That'd be like the Japanese calling themselves Japs. the nazis and the japs were caricatures used to dehumanize. They did not exist. They're the result of wartime and post-war propaganda.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:05:37 No.12367542 >>12367508 butterfly is an oldfag, and a valuable bulwark against /pol/tards, gtfo our board you disgusting 110 iq nigger

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:06:29 No.12367545 >>12367517 What a fool you are. YOU'RE THE LIBERAL You're the one who believes in capitalism. I'm the anarchist, the libertarian-socialist.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:06:42 No.12367547

>>12367425
Umm sweetie the poor have low class consciousness and act against their own interests (even when their life improves due to capitalism, this only decreases the incentive to resist an inherently exploitative system, so it’s bad). Emancipation of the lower classes is reactionary—Louis Napoleon, Hitler, Drumpf. The resistance doesn’t exist except in the lifeless letters of intellectuals rebelling against their bourgeois upbringing. The revolutionary potential of every oppressed group dissipates the moment they become “demographics” targeted by marketers

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:07:27 No.12367550 >>12367499 You've never been to a conflict zone in your life. You don't know a damn thing about what you're talking about. You don't care about war orphans or slaughtered innocents. You just want to feel good for standing up to "the Man." Grow up

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:08:47 No.12367556 >>12367093 Do you even know what capitalism is? There was no capitalism during the Renaissance dumbass

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:11:51 No.12367562 >>12367556 Capitalism is a spook.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:12:58 No.12367566 >>12367550 Baseless strawman junk, an*n Did you know ISIS are our troop? Our "moderate rebels", a CIA op >Grow up >Says the the freshman to a 47 year old

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:13:48 No.12367570 File: 154 KB, 1920x1080, maxresdefault.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367542 Look at this at white knight faggot and laugh >>12367545 >I'm the anarchist, the libertarian-socialist

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:15:27 No.12367578
File: 1.13 MB, 3212x1427, Civilization & Capitalism - Fernando Braudel.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12367556
The modern iteration, no. There was money, trade, and power. Much of what plagues us now plagued us then. Think of it as a Pokeman

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:15:53 No.12367582

>>12367342
I believe this would be less the case in a homogenous brown society, just as welfare worked fine as a social safety net in a homogenous white society. Look at the nordic countries.
Which isn't to say you can't go full retard by going past social democracy and into socialism.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:16:16 No.12367583

>>12367539
Is this because you believe the over population meme or the environmental catastrophe meme? What do you think about some of your fellow comrades suggesting that these are both farces to sell us more products/worldviews? How do you square this with China’s pollution yet claim this is inherent to capitalism?

These are the things that keep me up at night. Holy shit.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:16:47 No.12367585 File: 26 KB, 400x300, 00.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367570 Wrong board

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:17:23 No.12367586 >>12367578 God you're embarrassing, please stop posting

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:19:30 No.12367590 >>12367583 >Humans cint effect ther environment. Thats impossible >Damn climate sciencetists only doing it for the research money I'm not a big carbon tax advocate though

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:20:20 No.12367594 >>12367582 Scandinavian countries are many times smaller than the U.S. and their high tax rates would never fly here And they're being culturally enriched so there's nowhere to flee too Sorry but your dreams will never become reality

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:22:00 No.12367599 >>12367542 I would never side with a tripfag even if I think he's right

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:22:03 No.12367600 >>12367590 How much co2 do volcanoes put into the atmosphere every year? There sure are a lot of them, especially under the ocean.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:22:08 No.12367601 >>12366885 I agree, but I also don't see why people on /lit/ are so fond of Thomas Sowell. I'd take Marx over him any day.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:23:33 No.12367604

>>12367594
>Scandinavian countries are many times smaller than the U.S. and their high tax rates would never fly here
Only because the billionaires don't want to give back any of the money their workers make them.
Don't ever repeat that tired old rag of a statement again.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:24:39 No.12367610 >>12367566 >47 years old Wow so this the power of schizoid boomers

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:25:02 No.12367613

>>12367539

What motivator do you suggest other than food, wealth and resources? I've pondered on this problem for many unproductive hours and haven't come up with any solution rooted in reality. Someone is going to have to guarentee that I still get to eat in whatever we replace this with. What do I have to do to earn my food? Does my family get to eat? And is this just going to be reskinned capitalism with new people on top?

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:25:23 No.12367614 >>12367600 Not as much as the north pole, I'll bet >>12367601 No one from /lit/ is fond of sowell >>12367610 Gen Xer

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:25:30 No.12367616

>>12367590
I’m not a climate change denier but I like how you used that sweet ad hominem as your argument to deflect criticism from China lmao. Go ahead and explain to me how e-waste in India being thrown into rivers is more a problem of Capitalism than the local government even though consumer products touch every piece of soil on the planet. Can you even have a productive conversation without parroting bush era talking points? I’m a huge critic of capitalism myself but I’ve never seen anyone at such peak boomerism.

If capitalism disappeared tomorrow the same environmental problems would still exist.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:25:40 No.12367619 >>12367601 sowell's predictions actually came true. None of marx's have.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:26:09 No.12367623 >>12367604 >Only because the billionaires don't want to give back any of the money their workers make them. Our billionaires are the most philanthropic in the world. There's a difference between charity and theft/taxation you lunatic

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:27:18 No.12367627

>>12367614
>Not as much as the north pole, I'll bet
wait you think melting ice with gas trapped in it releases more co2 than thousands of volcanoes?

>>12367616
>climate change denier
Skeptic. When it comes to science if you don't accept something that makes you a skeptic. Denier is something for religions or other dogmas.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:27:59 No.12367628 >>12367619 >None of marx's have. Then you haven't read Marx. I detest him but even I'm aware a lot of his predictions were shockingly accurate.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:28:04 No.12367629

>>12367594
Again, Americans had a good perception of welfare before it was extended past white Americans. In the 50s under a republican president the top marginal tax rate was at 91% and the interstate highway was built.
People like social democracy, until their social democracy is culturally enriched, as you say.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:29:38 No.12367636 >>12367601 Sowell knows what he's talking about and sources his arguments properly unlike /leftypol/ shitpostere

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:30:26 No.12367639 >>12367623 Do you believe Jeff Bezos to be millions of times more skilled/talented/worthy or whatever other metric you want to use than his poorest employee? If not, then why should he be worth that much?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:31:45 No.12367645 >>12367639 I’m not a fan of Bezis but give me a real reason why he shouldn’t be worth that much.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:32:04 No.12367648

>>12367616
I can't tel who I'm talking to.
>If capitalism disappeared tomorrow the same environmental problems would still exist.
You think I don't know that?

>>12367613
Research the alternatives to capitalism, imagine how we could live without the exchange of money.

>>12367623
Which is why we have no decent healthcare, no free schools, and a booming homeless problem. You fool no one.

>>12367628
Sowell hasn't read him either of course.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:32:28 No.12367653 >>12367639 No he's actually billions of times more valuable

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:33:14 No.12367656 File: 3.96 MB, 2184x2600, Robert Owen.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367645 He didn't work for it.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:35:01 No.12367659

>>12367648

>Research the alternatives to capitalism

This doesn't answer my question, especially considering that most alternatives to capitalism have historically resulted in things very much akin to capitalism with different people on top.

My question was, what do you, personally, think would be a good replacement of motivation for FOOD, RESOURCES and WEALTH, the things most people enter into conflict over because we have finite amounts of these things and people need or want them.

Do you have a system under which every living person can have all the food they need? What about all the food they want?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:35:15 No.12367661 >>12367628 >I detest him but even I'm aware a lot of his predictions were shockingly accurate. Well then list all of them and then point out which ones you think have come true. I'd be surprised if he didn't predict one or two things.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:36:39 No.12367667

>>12367648
You are an actual cultist. It’s clear that you have deep utopian ideals and that sort of wishful thinking tells me 60 years ago you’d be emphatically religious. You probably had an ex slip you a beat up copy of some Howard Zinn book and never looked back. You are everything that is boomeristic.

Thank god there’s a new generation here to put you out of your misery. I bet you even actively complain about the degradation of this board LMAO.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:37:41 No.12367672 >>12367656 But he’s a known workaholic.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:37:53 No.12367673 File: 63 KB, 600x739, download (79).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367659 Depends. Do we count systems that only failed because they threatened other systems with their success and were thus attacked on all sides?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:38:43 No.12367674 >>12367659 Boomers won’t answer you without 12 layers of irony and the latest headline of Vox as their answer.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:38:44 No.12367675

>>12367645
I can give you two easy.

1) a man with that much wealth also has a destabilizing level of power. If current trends continue, it is almost inevitable that an oligarchy will be implemented. If this isn't bad enough, it will likely lead to further instability and open revolt.

2) People could be living better lives if he had less wealth. It's not like they haven't worked hard to earn this better life, certainly not millions of times less than Bezos, see >>12367656

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:39:42 No.12367681 File: 389 KB, 1622x2408, sowell-marx-cover.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367648 >Sowell hasn't read Marx You're so ignorant it's embarrassing https://youtu.be/uiYH66HznW0

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:40:42 No.12367688 >>12367675 Wealth isn’t finite. It’s created. America was dirt poor the first half of the 20th century.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:41:40 No.12367691

>>12367673

Depends on nothing. I simply asked you what you thought was a good alternative for all of us to value instead of food, resources and wealth.

I'm not even asking you to prove that something else can work. Just please, for the love of god, give me an alternative, ANY practical alternative, for people to care about and work for and strive towards other than physical stuff that isn't so based on magical good feels that no society can be trusted to work towards it.

Just one.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:41:41 No.12367692 >>12367688 Because of the "federal" reserve, yeah.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:42:36 No.12367700 >>12367688 So? What's your point? I gave you two reasons, and I don't see how this is a response to either of them.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:43:20 No.12367704 >>12367692 Break out the tin foil hats

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:43:23 No.12367705 >>12367691 Then you're looking at it. 30% unemployment to 2% during a global depression after financially apocalyptic war restitutions in under 6 years. There's a reason so much time and money has been spent to paint it as evil.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:44:21 No.12367710 >>12367700 Then I win.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:44:23 No.12367711 File: 13 KB, 261x193, 1513722125006.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367704 >printing money without limit has no effect on the value of said money

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:45:49 No.12367715 >>12367691 She clearly can't think for herself Elder abuse isn't cool; lighten up And give her enough time to change diapers in between posts

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:45:56 No.12367716 >>12367711 Who said anything about money? I’m talking about wealth retard.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:46:15 No.12367718

>>12367659
>Research doesn't answer my question
It does! Try it.

>>12367667
I'm an egoist-syndicalist, and I know you people aren't going to make it. Shove rat poison up your ass.

>>12367672
Look up how labor vouchers work.

>>12367681
Watch some Richard Wolff videos. Heaven knows you wont read anything

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:46:34 No.12367720 >>12366885 test

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:47:15 No.12367722 >>12367710 No how bout I win?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:47:50 No.12367724 >>12367716 so how exactly are you defining wealth?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:47:57 No.12367726 File: 58 KB, 450x373, 7FB458B1-6CA7-4735-B021-6E9F2C393644.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367718

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:49:02 No.12367731 >>12367722 I’ll let you win a merry go round ride on my dick

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:49:08 No.12367732 >>12367720 newfag get out

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:49:23 No.12367733 >>12367545 *idiot

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:50:03 No.12367736 >>12367724 There are some things more valuable in money. Money is for poor people.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:50:13 No.12367737 >>12367731 fag get out

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:50:40 No.12367743 >>12367736 Why are you wasting time? Define your terms.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:50:40 No.12367744 >>12366885 they need a high purpose after rejecting a religious doctrine

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:51:27 No.12367746 >>12367737 Make me nigger

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:52:05 No.12367748

>>12367539
>I can pin it on capitalism, and I do pin it wider on legalism as a whole. If we had a better motivator for society we would be able to do away with widespread full scale wars. I guarantee.
>>12367718
Since we're unable to get to the point without you falling back on buzzwords and tiny non-answers because you don't want to answer questions that you have no answers to, I'm going to rephrase this as a single question in reference to the post linked above that you made earlier.

What motivator in society do you suggest could be used to replace the current finite motivators of food, resources and wealth that we currently have and as you so succinctly put, cause widespread full scale wars?

Also, some secondary questions.

On the subject of food, does everyone still get to eat? Is this food still provided by some method of exchange for my labor or is it guarenteed to me by my government?

On the subject of resources, how do we determine who owns (or without ownership, who gets to use) resources? If I want to procure a hundred pounds of brass and steel scrap to continue my locksmith trade, how would I go about that without wealth?

Also, on the subject of wealth, how are we going to go about getting rid of it? Do we just declare, defacto, that the work and investment that every laborer has put into this system is null and void? Does my life savings suddenly become worthless or will I be compensated when we move to this new system? And what about everyone else's life savings?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:52:42 No.12367751 >>12367743 Wealth is measured in a number of ways anon. Value. Material goods. Quality of life. These are all things that can be expounded on.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:52:42 No.12367752 >>12367718 this dumb ass bitch can't argue for shit

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:53:40 No.12367756 >>12367722 u dont

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:53:58 No.12367757 >>12367751 The value of money?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:56:12 No.12367764 >>12367748 are you still seeking a legitimate answer? god bless you for trying, i guess

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:56:16 No.12367765 Any reason why this board fixates on this particular member of the Chicago school?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:58:17 No.12367772

>>12367757
Obviously. But to focus on that is to miss how the world turns completely. Money is just another invention, resources and wealth are not finite. It’s all about allocation. There’s nothing wrong with rich people.

Capitalism is very flawed right now but you shouldn’t be concerned with celebrities like Bezos, they give more wealth ( in this case measured in dollars ) to others than any other human beings to have ever existed. And you won’t ever be able to change these realities anyways.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:58:17 No.12367773

Seeing the same argument from both sides. When pointed to inefficiencies in capitalism, proponents say it's because it wasn't fully implemented. The same things that communists say.
What we need is an agreement on the terms. Either we term today's society capitalist. Or we take an ideal notion of an efficient market from an economics book. Either we say that USSR was communist. Or use Marx's definition.
The only question remaining would be: if we use definitions of the ideal world that never was, what practical merit would such a discussion have.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:58:29 No.12367775 File: 31 KB, 480x480, 9f3b025273760aeb5007c71b09f47d1a--great-quotes-politics.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367765 he says things that democrats don't like.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:58:56 No.12367780 >>12367648 >Sowell hasn't read him either of course. Sowell was literally a Marxist before he became a conservative god

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:59:16 No.12367781 >>12367765 Hes acnigger

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:59:31 No.12367782 >>12367772 bezos pays taxes? How much?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:59:32 No.12367783 >>12367773 The textbook definition of Scientology sounds great too. How do people ignore praxis so easily?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:59:33 No.12367784 >>12366885 It doesn't. Get off the computer for a bit, also the solution for one extreme is not to jump to another.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 02:59:39 No.12367786 >>12367765 Sowell is an easy writer to read

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:00:00 No.12367788

>>12367748
>Since we're unable to get to the point without you falling back on source material recommendations ...

It's because I'm tired. Were are you, Austrella?

I suggest NOT CAPITALISM. again, I did give recs for your research.
YES, I expect you to be serious when asking these questions enough to look to the sources and not someone who knows them second hand and is about to fall asleep. GO.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:00:33 No.12367789 >>12367782 Who cares?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:00:53 No.12367791 >>12367746 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-McIdVuY88 Anon is a mess Anon is a waste Anon is a big fat mistake

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:01:33 No.12367794 >>12367789 oh fuck off.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:01:33 No.12367795 >>12367788 She gives out research on the internet like its 2006 HAHAHAHAGA

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:02:50 No.12367797 >>12367791 I’m gonna sneak into your room at night and kiss your asshole

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:02:58 No.12367798

>>12367788
>I have the energy to argue my points as long as I don't have to provide any sources, recommendations, answer any questions about my rhetoric, explain myself or be held accountable for my actions when I tell people to go research that thing that when told to provide research for it turns out I haven't researched because I'm too tired

>But I'm too tired to research

You suck. I wanted one measly answer that would have taken the time it took to write that post about why you didn't answer. You didn't even have to answer the secondary questions. I can't believe you made me stand up and defend capitalism even though I work like a wageslave every day just because your arguments are so nonexistant that I had to stand up and call out the sheer childishness of them.

>I'm right all the time and if you wanted to argue with me you would have done better research than I did about the bold claims that I just made!

You make me sick, you fucker.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:03:07 No.12367799 >>12367775 Please tell me that's ironic.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:03:39 No.12367802 >>12367788 LMAO at your life. You're so pathetic and stupid Do us a favor and never wake up from your sleep

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:03:47 No.12367803

>>12367648
>Which is why we have no decent healthcare

Healthcare is the most regulated industry in America. That's partly why it sucks. Also because of government enforced insurance monopolies.

> no free schools
98% of Americans had free schooling Kindergarten through HS. Most of the universities are heavily subsidized. Federal funding on education has tripled since the 1970s (inflation-adjusted) and test scores have declined. And schooling is shit without the profit-incentive / legitimate competition.

>and a booming homeless problem. You fool no one.
This one's just false. Unless you count places like San Francisco where playgrounds are littered with syringes and the city spends $90K per homeless person

I legit can't tell if you're this stupid or just a conservative LARPing

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:05:11 No.12367808 File: 13 KB, 318x159, images (3).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367799

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:06:16 No.12367815

>>12367639
>Do you believe Jeff Bezos to be millions of times more skilled/talented/worthy or whatever other metric you want to use than his poorest employee? If not, then why should he be worth that much?

Because he played the game and he played it better than anyone. The game being, he raised the standard of living of literally millions. I have a fully stocked library that cost me on average 80 cents per book. I never even had to leave my apartment to get it. I found a skin creme that completely cured me of acne that I never would have found otherwise or would have trusted without their review system. I can go on and on.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:06:23 No.12367816 >>12367794 HAHAHAHA

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:06:26 No.12367817 >>12367803 >Federal funding on education has tripled since the 1970s (inflation-adjusted) and test scores have declined. Because the demographics have been forcefully changed.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:07:18 No.12367819 >>12367718 >Watch some Richard Wolff videos. Heaven knows you wont read anything You're projecting. I guarantee you've never read anything legitimate on economics

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:08:31 No.12367822 >>12367815 What cream

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:09:04 No.12367823 >>12367817 That's really not true. Though partly the decline in education is due in part to the NCLB bill, which is fucking stupid and a product of big government. With free market education you have free choice, not a one-size fits all approach

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:09:58 No.12367825 >>12367798 Way to blow this boomer cunt the fuck out But you really should know better than to argue with namefags

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:10:02 No.12367826 >>12366920 Solzhenitsyn is a hack

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:10:05 No.12367827 >>12367808 Skin in the mf game

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:10:06 No.12367828 >>12367823 >free market Oh boy, here we go.

>>	((’^_^’)) buttercup Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:11:01 No.12367832 >>12367819 HEY MISTER ILL HAVE TOU KNOW I READ NOAM CHIMSKIN IN COLLEGE AND THATS WHY IM AN ANARCHO CINDERELLA SO BUCK UP AND WATCH SOME YOUNG TURKS ON YOUTUBE YOU GARBAGE MAN

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:11:39 No.12367833 >>12367823 black schools do just as well as white schools?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:11:48 No.12367834

>>12367788
>>Since we're unable to get to the point without you falling back on source material recommendations ...

I can't argue my own points because they're bankrupt and fallacious, but here's a reading list to show you how I was indoctrinated and brainwashed

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:12:49 No.12367836 >>12367832 Jolly good show my man

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:13:11 No.12367837

marxism....capitalism, fascism...ism...ism..
Political and Economic Philosphies….
and moreover how strictly we adhere to them are irrelevant more often than not.

Pragmatic Methods are the only system that works in the end. Because It's only purpose is to work, To complete the tasks it sets out to accomplish within any given constraint or circumstance.

That means ignoring ideology and focusing on results...
results is what everyone actually cares about
because results are what we eat, what we live in, what we wear. Where we live and under what conditions.

generally people want to live day -to-day civilized lives and not struggle to survive and not have life suck...relative to living in a state of nature like animals.

But the absorption with the vivid fantasies of dusty, dead men who wrote dusty, old books has slaved naive youths and academics with soft unworked hands to the idea that they have to use The Proscribed methods they read in those books to reach the proscribed ends they believe their idols envisioned.

And in pursuing those visions they fail in achieving good, tangible results. simple as that.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:14:13 No.12367840 >>12367823 Students under voucher programs get worse scores than those in public education.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:15:55 No.12367842 >>12367815 Did he do that do. Or did he and a bunch of other people do that together? Would he have not done that if we'd capped him at 99 billion? Also what skin creme mine doesn't work too great. :(

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:17:54 No.12367848 >>12367840 Do you have a single fact to back that up?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:18:36 No.12367853 >>12367848 Who cares?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:18:53 No.12367854

>>12366885
This thread is exactly what will save American conservativism.

I really thought America was doomed. Bill Clinton was worshipped. George Bush was an idiot. Barack Obama was a god. Donald Trump is an idiot.

I assumed this meant the younger generations would never vote conservative.

But it seems this just meant the liberals (people like namefag girl) never had study politics, philosophy, or econ. They just assumed their position was naturally right. They've never tested it. The left has begun to eat itself. The liberal intellectual class is growing weaker and weaker, revealing themselves as naked as they are.

All true intellectuals will be right leaning in 15-20 years. And the republican party will be closer to libertarianism than the modern neoconservative movement.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:19:39 No.12367855 File: 1.18 MB, 250x250, 1533512154008.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367832

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:21:08 No.12367859 >>12367842 If anyone could have done it, anyone would have done it. recites man in the arena speech

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:21:28 No.12367860

capitalism has a better track record than Marxism because it's only a system. Not a Philosophy.

Marxism takes on moral, philosophical and even religious dimensions.
Capitalism is based in private property recognized by the authority and mutual exchange...all other elements of the system are extrapolated from whatever type of government the aforementioned authority is and what the resources being allocated are.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:21:47 No.12367861 >>12367854 What the hell is wrong with you Get real

((’^_^’)) buttercup Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:24:20 No.12367865

>>12367854
NOT IF I HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY ABOUT IT BUSTER! MY PUSSY GRABS BACK SO YOU POL BOYS BETTER LOOK OUT. WHEN RUTH BADER GINSBURG IS CROWNED QUEEN OF AMERICA US GIRLS ARE GONNA QUEEF ALL OVER THESE RUCH WHITE MEN ( CANCELLED!!)

CAPITALISM MAKES MY TITS HURT AND ITS NOT BECAUSE IM GETTING OLD

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:26:36 No.12367870

>>12367861
I just don't see it happening until some form of paradigm shift takes place allowing for more wealth to reach all of the people who have gotten out of school in the last 15 years only to find that all jobs are part time (So they don't have to give you any benefits) retirement is dead, one hospital bill can sink you for life and you will never own a home.

Once conservatives come up with a model, ANY model, other than the same old "Not my problem, work on it yourself" while chuckling all the way to the bank in clear view of everyone, they'll get all the votes they could ever want.

But they never will, because lording their success and the success of their forebears over everyone else is what they want, and for their real estate investments to hold up the amount of capital they invested PLUS inflation, all homes have to remain far, far out of the reach of people who actually work for a living. So... no white picket fence for me, someday.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:27:26 No.12367872

>>12366926
You're right. It doesn't work for the majority of people. It works for THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE. Never in the history of the world have there been more free, healthy, longevitous and autonomous people than there are right now. And it isn't Marxism that's caused that, sister.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:27:44 No.12367876

>>12367860
Capitalism is literally just freedom.

You have the right to your person and property because you are not a slave. You have the right to contract out your labor for whatever price you find agreeable. You don't have the rights to anyone else's person, property, or labor because that violates the first rule.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:30:08 No.12367883

>>12367842
>Did *he* do that do.
Of course he did it with a team of people, ALL OF WHOM GOT THEIR OWN CUT. Otherwise they wouldn't have helped...but they DID get pay they were content with and so it was done...
and it was for the company and system jeff created and owned, and *most importantly* he was LIABLE for so yeah, he deserves every cent he gets.
Just so you know Liability is the owner's responsibility for the expenses and debt their business accrues. Most business owners operate under debt that they PERSONALLY have to service, while STILL paying their employees as a part of operating expenses.

The Employees don't bear the burden of debt when times are bad so, nor do they enjoy the expansion of proffit when times are good.
That's the Risk/Reward system of OWNERSHIP.

You shit on Bezos because he's MASSIVELY successfull and for no other reason.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:32:01 No.12367888

>>12367876

I feel that this was implicitly true before everything was owned.

Now I have to compete in a capitalist market that inherently gives people whose families cornered markets and resources before they were even born a massive advantage generation after generation that enables them to continue to control those markets and resources despite increasing demand, dwindling supply and no claim on it other than aging paper.

There's nothing free about the fact that I can't get together with my buddies, determine that the ten or twelve or twenty of us have more need than that one oil baron's kid, and go shoot him and take the deed to the land.

It only really works if we all start on equal ground somehow and then rise or fall according to our merit. That's... not really what happens in capitalism, though.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:32:05 No.12367890 >>12367876 >Capitalism is literally just freedom. You have the right to your person and property because you are not a slave TRUE, insofar as I can personally maintain those rights or those rights are defended by a government. like I said.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:32:47 No.12367893 >>12367883 >You shit on Bezos because he's MASSIVELY successfull and for no other reason. his company pays no taxes and is fine with its employees being homeless. He's a typical kike who should burn.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:32:55 No.12367894 >>12367883 >You shit on Bezos because he's MASSIVELY successfull and for no other reason. I support markets but c'mon Bezos is a piece of shit

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:34:48 No.12367903

>>12367870
>I just don't see it happening until some form of paradigm shift takes place allowing for more wealth to reach all of the people who have gotten out of school in the last 15 years only to find that all jobs are part time (So they don't have to give you any benefits)
Or they'll just realize they got fucked up by the Dems who incentivized everyone to go to college and take out ridiculous loans they could never repay on their useless genders studies degrees

>retirement is dead,
Again, they'll realize the Dems fucked them by inventing social security. Created an incentive for people not to save for themselves while looting the till. Silly libs thinking you can ever rely on the government to provide for you

>one hospital bill can sink you for life and
I almost died 7 years ago. I had $20K in hospital bills. Wrote a sob story to all my doctors. Most of them said "no worries, we'll just take what insurance gave us, don't worry about the rest" (most places do this). The others just wanted me to pay monthly whatever I could (like $20/month).

>you will never own a home.
Anyone buying a home is an idiot. I could easily buy a home in cash right now entirely in cash. The market is inflated. The bubble is coming. I'll be renting happily (it's crazy affordable in comparison) until that happens

> Once conservatives come up with a model,

It's the one that was ingrained in the constitution, that led to the most prosperous time in human history. Libs fucked us. We're too far gone now. It's going to be a painful readjustment period, but we need to get back to individual and economic liberty

You've got me ramped up >>12367870

5 minutes until I start ranting about going back to the gold standard, I can feel it

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:36:42 No.12367910

>>12367290
The fascist principles you're criticizing also take the form of rhetoric.

I can think of more example of blame recipients that Americans resort to whenever hard work doesn't pay off, like immigrants, terrorists, welfare queens, politicians, etc.

The system is perfect. Its just that a few bad apples can ruin it for everyone else, especially you.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:37:48 No.12367914

>>12367888
>There's nothing free about the fact that I can't get together with my buddies, determine that the ten or twelve or twenty of us have more need than that one oil baron's kid, and go shoot him and take the deed to the land.

Uhhh, yeah, that's a good thing. Murder and theft are bad.

> Now I have to compete in a capitalist market that inherently gives people whose families cornered markets and resources before they were even born a massive advantage generation after generation that enables them to continue to control those markets and resources despite increasing demand, dwindling supply and no claim on it other than aging paper.

My daddy worked really hard to buy me a bike. Your daddy didn't. Why should I be punished because your parents sucked?

Gotta look at the long game. Work hard, save money, so when you're a daddy you can buy a bike for your kid

Also it's a myth that the hyper-rich stay that way for very long, or the poor stay that way for very long

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:38:50 No.12367916 >>12367890 >insofar as I can personally maintain those rights or those rights are defended by a government. That's not the debate. The debate is when is their immorality. It's when there's an infringement upon that right

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:38:55 No.12367917 >>12367910 >I can think of more example of blame recipients that Americans resort to whenever hard work doesn't pay off, like immigrants, terrorists, welfare queens, politicians, etc. don't forget whites.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:39:54 No.12367920

>>12367888
>It only really works if we all start on equal ground somehow.
There's no system, barring one capable of time travel that can mitigate the circumstances of one's birth... and it's not so much a fault of a person being born to wealth as it is the virtue of the parent who attained wealth setting it aside for their children.

>There's nothing free about the fact that I can't get together with my buddies, determine that the ten or twelve or twenty of us have more need than that one oil baron's kid, and go shoot him and take the deed to the land.

but you CAN, do that. You totally can kill and steal whatever you like...it's just incumbent on you to maintain your stolen loot and life if others come to do the same to you...
The alternative being you and your buddies offer your services for compensation that you can then use to grow your own wealth...
that way you can improve your situation without living or dying by the sword.
Pragmatism

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:41:42 No.12367925 >>12367399 >you think the whole world fits neatly into your little worldview and that you know what's really going on Can't think of a single person this doesn't apply to, especially here.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:42:17 No.12367930 >>12367893 If he's not paying taxes when he should be, then he ought to be punished for it. if he's not being punished then that's a fault of the State...which I agree with you on.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:42:37 No.12367936 >>12367925 "there's always a bigger jew"

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:43:49 No.12367939

>>12367903
WE didn't get fucked by the dems. Our parents got fucked by the dems and their parents got fucked by the dems. Even assuming you really believe its just one political party and not all of the entrenched elites on both sides playing both sides against the middle, which is more likely, or all of the elites in all of the nations on the planet playing a bunch of sides against each other, which is even more likely still. Its pretty obvious in any case to anyone without a ridiculously one-sided viewpoint that both democrats and republicans represent entrenched wealth voting for the interests of entrenched wealth. I don't see any political party working for the advancement of all of the labor that was too young to have been an influence on ANY of this when it was becoming a problem, but now have to live with the decisions and pains caused by the votes of people who were.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:44:08 No.12367940

>>12367930
because the state has conceded that amazon is a bigger power than they are. They're afraid of losing their sweetheart deals and gibs should they lose amazon's favor.

you can damn well bet bezos wouldn't be as rich if his company had to pay their fair share.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:45:09 No.12367942 >>12367939 you can bet that whoever the media labels as evil is the one that actually cares about the people.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:46:29 No.12367945 >>12367894 >Bezos is a piece of shit Oh yeah, he's a massive scumlord to his workers...so you have a valid point...

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:47:11 No.12367947

>>12367942
But the media labels EVERYONE as evil. Democratic-leaning media labels Republicans as evil, Republican-leaning media labels Democrats as evil. Its all a game to mask the fact that nobody is, or ever will be, working for the advancement of the working class or the poor. We don't HAVE representation, of any kind. Just two parties offering different carrots and sticks.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:48:52 No.12367952 >>12367765 He's an uncle tom and the conservatives on the board like that he's a black harvard-educated economist who contradicts most other black writers on race.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:49:04 No.12367953 >>12367872 >free, healthy, longevitous and autonomous >wakemeupcantwakeup.jpg

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:50:11 No.12367959

>>12367947
>But the media labels EVERYONE as evil.
Lol, no. The two party system is just smoke and mirrors.

The best way to destroy an idea is to make everyone think the idea and the people who believe in it are evil. What is the most evil idea of the last century according to the media?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:50:45 No.12367963 >>12367947 It's the nature of humanity to abuse power, whether political or financial. We've mostly figured out how to keep the political power in check, but keeping financial power in check continues to elude us.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:52:03 No.12367967 >>12367963 We figured it out, but we were not able to fully implement it before they struck back.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:53:12 No.12367974 >>12367872 Yikes

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:53:31 No.12367975

>>12367959
Okay, now moving right along to the rest of that post. Who exactly is it that you think is representing the interests of the working class, assuming that we're not all just "The Poor" at this point?

I don't see any party that is actually geared towards my interests.

>inb4 rights

We're talking about legislators, its their JOB to restrict rights, regardless of which side of the aisle they're on. If you're drinking the kool-aid so much that you believe any senator or congressman is there to protect your rights, there's nothing I can do to help you with your terminal case of shitforbrains.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:54:13 No.12367978 >>1236793 >Has a neat little worldview involving jewish conspiracy you proved me right. I'm disappointed.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:54:26 No.12367979

>>12367945
>he's a massive scumlord to his workers

i.e. that "team of people" you were talking about. So wtf man first you talk about how they knew what they were getting and got their fair share now you're saying he's a piece of shit who screwed them over. Pick a side, my dude.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:56:34 No.12367984

>>12367975
>Who exactly is it that you think is representing the interests of the working class, assuming that we're not all just "The Poor" at this point?

Well if you consider securing the existence of our people and our children to be a priority, there's really only one. But we're extremely suppressed atm. The US government as it is now is irreparably broken. Democracy itself is probably untenable in the modern era.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:58:25 No.12367995

>>12367952
>Thomas Sowell is an uncle tom

By all measures and accounts Malcolm X contradicts most of contemporary black thought and politics.

In fact a lot of what Malcolm X advocated for: Black independence in economics, politics and culture are well in line with What Thomas Sowell points out would be advantageous for blacks.
Blacks rising to meet standards rather than being condescended to like they are with Aff.Act. and pragrams of the sort that treat race as a handicap rather than actual handicaps like poverty as they should.

Disagreeing with Mainstream black opinions and politics does NOT an uncle tom make.

In fact Black politics and the collective culture is a shadow of its former self...having been co-opted and bought out with government interest and interference.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 03:59:07 No.12367997 >>12367995 >having been co-opted and bought out with government interest and interference. Government is the closest thing to a father that most blacks know.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:00:22 No.12368003

>>12367975
He's a Nazi, he's trying to get you to think Nazi. But the media hasn't successfully destroyed the concept of Nazism anymore than widespread democracy has "destroyed" the English monarchy so it's a bullshit argument.

His next post is about 'our people and our children' which is just kind of fashy who else says anything like that.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:01:06 No.12368008 >>12366885 It's mostly contrarians, who need an absurd Ideology to keep being contrarians.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:02:28 No.12368012 >>12367995 >disagreeing with mainstream black opinions does not an uncle tom make It does if its meant to cater to white racists. I've never heard a black person cite Sowell as an influence. Just people on here who have hangups about welfare.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:02:45 No.12368014 >>12368003 >His next post is about 'our people and our children' which is just kind of fashy who else says anything like that. yeah who would care about families lol what a fucking asshole lets all be buried with our cats.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:03:34 No.12368018

>>12367979
>Pick a side, my dude.

His Lowest Paid Workers are who I meant...

the specialist that designed the software infrastructure and helped with the automation, and laid out the logistics of the shipping and other portions of the supply chain.
The SKILLED subset of his workers who actually helped him BUILD amazon are the one I meant in the prior statement.

The common skilled, warehouse workers, are who suffer under his management.
important distinction. They deserve better than what they're getting.

Skilled labor does fine in this world, no matter what...the fact we fail to furnish EVERYONE with some form of specialty is the biggest flaw of what we're living in....but that's the educational system.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:03:44 No.12368019

>>12367984
I see absolutely no evidence whatsoever that either side is any less corrupt, self-interested or willing to lie than the other.

Don't get me wrong, I can see what goes on with the whitewash in the MSM and that they're pushing an agenda, but both sides do have their media giants and both sides do crank out propaganda constantly that pretty much says the same things from two different ends.

The problem is, nobody in the real world REALLY cares about any of that shit and they all just want to be left alone to go back to whatever it is they do. The whole thing is such an obvious shitshow, meant to soak up time, effort and attention. I just can't devote any serious effort to either side of that anymore, regardless of who has "Mainstream" control.

Let me know when there's a political cantidate that's going to find some way for me to earn myself a decent future through hard work instead of giving up ALL of my money to taxes, absurd rent and piling bills, while NOT reminding me that I don't really need a car or the few meager luxuries that keep me sane and that if I was willing to give everything enjoyable or superfluous in my life I would totally be rich tomorrow even though that's never going to happen...

Someday, he'll be here. But he won't be a Republican, and he won't be a Democrat. Probably not Green Party or Labor Party either.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:04:25 No.12368021 >>12368003 >our children' regardless of origin, there's nothing wrong with that phrase.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:05:19 No.12368027 >>12368014 "our people" "we're suppressed" "democracy is probably untenable" Not definitively fascist but kind of suspicious. Who's "we" and who are "our children?"

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:08:20 No.12368036 >>12368027 Actually scratch this. Red flags went up when you said 'what's the most evil idea of the last century according to the media?' That looks like fascist baiting.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:08:21 No.12368037

>>12368027
>Who's "we"
Each race on earth.

>"our children?"
Their children.

>>12368019
Dems and Repubs are just two sides of the same (((coin))). The only people who want better for people are considered pure evil by the very people who would lose their monopoly on human happiness.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:09:23 No.12368040 >>12368036 You sure are good at proving his point though.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:09:39 No.12368041 >>12366912 >come out of Soviet Russia like what? 19th century russia had a flourishing that rivaled the best of any other country ever. it all stopped once the commies took over.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:10:01 No.12368044 >>12368027 >>12368036 >wah fashiosm these are non arguments

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:10:04 No.12368045

>>12367997
>the closest thing to a father that most blacks know

And the Reason they don't know their fathers is because in 1965 the "Great Society" introduced assistance programs exclusively for women with children who had no men in the house.
This created a perverse incentive for women to reproduce for benefits that they'd keep preventing any male over the age of 18 from living with them...
the rate of wedlock went from the 25% it was then to the 70% it is now...

You Put the Cart before The horse.
Fathers provided for their family's before the government usurped that role as women are risk averse by nature and knew they could depend on the government...

And that dependency is the root of everything wrong with the black community in America.
Family disintegration, welfare mindset that supplants the need to gain skills to work and survive...creating a disgusting entitlement culture of unskilled, uncultured, undisciplined youth culture prone to violence and pregnancy at a young age.

Multiple people have studied and laid this fact bare but it goes against the political grain of liberal politics and black politics to say so.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:10:33 No.12368047 >>12366920 B-but his jaded ex-wife said that he made it up! The USSR was actually a paradise! Marxist /lit/ fags on suicide watch

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:10:33 No.12368048 >>12367997 Wasn't the case until the war on poverty

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:10:55 No.12368050 >>12368045 Yep. Because there are too many people, mostly on the left, who depend on the political benefits of having the races hate each other.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:11:37 No.12368053 >>12368044 That's because I'm not arguing. You're trying to start an argument about how an idea is bad because its the media's fault. Is it Nazism?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:11:56 No.12368055 >>12368048 Lots of things changed between 1945 and 1965.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:13:56 No.12368056 >>12368053 Not just the media, though they are one of the primary mouthpieces for it. It's not like they shout about the holodomor constantly. Why is that?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:14:48 No.12368059

>>12368012
well, *I* for one am a Black Man.
You'll see Sowell's name dropped every now and again if you drop into conversations with any group up of black Conservatives, Libertarians, Independents, Seperatists, Some Black Nationalists etc. etc.

him getting named dropped by white racists and white nationalists in regards to gripes about welfare is guilt by association which is fallacious...
they name drop him because he speaks truth.

https://youtu.be/pf_LQhcIO4g

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:16:05 No.12368061 >>12368056 >The only reason you don't like fascists is because they were the bad guys in Indiana Jones You're too far gone man. Not arguing with you.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:17:34 No.12368063 lit confirmed tankies

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:17:37 No.12368064 >>12368061 >Not arguing with you. you don't have any arguments, strawmanning is all you have.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:18:03 No.12368067 >>12368061 You said you weren't arguing to begin with, and even now you can only face your own strawmen. Is this all the strength your ideas give you?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:18:16 No.12368068 >>12367876 >Capitalism is literally just freedom. Okay, I laughed.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:18:48 No.12368069 With no ID you cannot have a conversation fuck this I do not know who is on my side and who is the liberal commie faggot. This board is not working and /pol/ is fucked I wonder where anons will go now.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:20:00 No.12368072 >>12366885 But marxism doesn't appeal to "so many people". Marxism as an ideology is mostly dead. What you have today at best is a lot of radical liberals who really really care about brown lesbian tranny immigrants.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:20:25 No.12368073

>>12368059
>because he speaks the truth

I believe you about the black conservatives, but mainly the stuff I see here is white racists who already agree with Sowell on some things (including complaining about other academics) and use his views as validation for their old prejudices.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:21:21 No.12368077 >>12368069 I'm pretty sure the liberal commie faggot is the one who started sweating when talk of focusing on families and providing a proper future for our children wasn't immediately demonized.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:22:29 No.12368082

>>12368067
In my experience, people who are going to make arguments for fascism aren't actually interested in exchanging ideas.

Media coverage of the holocaust is to discourage fascism, and that's because there's a widespread interest in avoiding another holocaust, but from what you've already said you probably don't think it really happened anyway, so what's the point of arguing.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:22:42 No.12368083 >>12368072 Marxism simply expanded the number of classes that war against each other. The "oppressed" vs the "oppressor" is still popular.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:22:45 No.12368087 >>12367775 What does he think capitalists are? They own the capital and sit back while their employees produce. I'm no communist but his statement better serves their cause than the capitalists'.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:22:46 No.12368086 >>12368082 In my experience, people who are going to make arguments for communism aren't actually interested in exchanging ideas.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:23:14 No.12368089 >>12368077 this >>12368073 is the same commie faggot

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:23:35 No.12368090 >i hate women and minorities. I love billionaires What a great thread.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:24:19 No.12368094

>>12368082
>In my experience, people who are going to make arguments for fascism aren't actually interested in exchanging ideas.
What experience would that be? neo-nazi larpers who know even less than your average liberal?

> but from what you've already said you probably don't think it really happened anyway
You'd think that'd be a good thing. I'd certainly be happy if i was told that a great deal of my people weren't horribly murdered.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:24:26 No.12368096 >>12368086 My point is that if you don't think the holocaust happened, we're already not going to agree on anything else. So there's no point arguing.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:25:23 No.12368100
File: 137 KB, 804x802, 1512883818700.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12368077
Well obviously but I cannot see all of his posts and his way of thinking so I can btfo him. But anyways at least this board has no kikes orbiting it am I right?
>pic related

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:25:49 No.12368103 >>12368096 Because you've made up your mind on that and nothing can change it?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:26:36 No.12368107 >>12368073 Well /Pol/acks will spam any statistic, study, or statement that can be used to bash other races...it's their only highlight in life. I should know, I dip in /pol/ too much for my own good, lol

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:26:54 No.12368108 >>12368103 About the historical material fact of the holocaust, yeah.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:28:06 No.12368111 >>12368107 >spam any statistic, study, or statement that can be used to bash other races You mean like every race does? have you ever seen the koreans go at it with the japanese?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:28:25 No.12368114
File: 329 KB, 1575x1302, 0d24e62b1f913400a783b34870914e7b2646fe7615f2f48437886f6a11428cbc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12368096
THE HOLOCAUST HAPPENED OY VEY GEVALT
FOUND THE KIKE NO NEED FOR IDS YOU CAN ALL GO HOME GOYIM ONLY 6 GORILLION LOSES
fuck off retard lu rk 2 years or fuck off back to re ddit or twitter faggot

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:28:53 No.12368115 >>12368096 >My point is that if you don't think the holocaust happened, we're already not going to agree on anything else So if he thinks 2+2=4 that means you don't agree with that?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:29:17 No.12368116 >>12368108 Kind of silly then to accuse others of being closed-minded, isn't it?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:29:40 No.12368120 >>12368107 Yeah, pretty much. I haven't actually read Sowell, so it was hasty to call him an uncle tom, but I know well enough why people here like him.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:30:41 No.12368121 >>12368115 Depends on if he's taken common core math or not.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:31:30 No.12368124 >>12368116 not an argument >>12368115 bait >>12368114 asshole

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:31:54 No.12368127

>>12368087
People who own capital and operate it for profit don't just "sit back" they actively manage and hold liability for the costs including workers pay and benefits even when it drives them into debt...they also pay the lion's share of taxes.

From the Government perspective, Net Tax payers are the only contributors. It's why tax codes for the rich are so complex...

When social welfare for the poor is good when it's used to train people and get them to postions where they an earn their way out of poverty...however, I hate corporate welfare with a burning passion though, and you should too.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:32:23 No.12368128 >>12368120 He makes good arguments. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y021WAdUlW8

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:32:55 No.12368130 >>12368111 ever seen the koreans go at it with the japanese? you mean about the occupation? I bet!

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:33:25 No.12368131 >>12368124 More of an observation than an argument, but quoting molymeme, considering his somewhat radical shift as of late, is pretty funny in itself.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:33:38 No.12368132

>>12368124
it's not bait, it's literally showing how there's an idea that is so verboten in your mind that excludes the possibility of any agreement on anything. I think the holocaust happened, that there's really not much discussion to be had on it, but that doesn't mean I start to clutch my pearls when somebody doesn't believe in it.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:33:42 No.12368133 >>12368128 oh, I did know that he talked with Buckley once. I'll look into that later.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:33:59 No.12368134 >>12368108 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQVIeTLqgOw&t=2s Baby tier arguments get great videos to watch

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:34:28 No.12368135 File: 474 KB, 1246x1558, 1543606949944.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12368130 About everything, really. They're savage as fuck and it's goddamned hilarious.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:36:03 No.12368142

>>12368132
Usually if someone doesn't believe in the holocaust they've got a reason for doing so. It's not just a quirky alternative viewpoint, its always a way to make someone's shitty worldview seem more palatable. Usually so they can try and convert somebody.

As it "Nazis aren't so bad. They didn't even kill all those jews."

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:37:45 No.12368146
File: 446 KB, 750x750, 7b31ae5468fe61bd02718cf290be427dd728272f5ea78a50dee73600c64b7ae2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12368124
Asshole faggots I know you are a kike show me your nose or show me your liability to understand the world around you. If you are white stand aside and leave this site or face your judgment

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:38:56 No.12368148

>>12368142
>its always a way to make someone's shitty worldview seem more palatable
No, it's a thing that they believe because of some mistakes either in reasoning or data acquisition.
The fact that you believe people who you disagree with are all lying in order to convince you of their evil deeds is, again, telling.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:39:37 No.12368152 >>12368135 I'm the "communist fag" from earlier. Jesus Christ this made me laugh. >>12368146 Not Jewish. Was raised Catholic. Am not anymore. You're just an asshole

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:40:22 No.12368158 >>12368142 >>12368132 Oh wow now two have showed up if you don't know the truth about the holocaust you don't deserve to be on this site. It's the truth and if even admire the truth then you must research into this issue or go somewhere else

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:40:39 No.12368160 >>12368148 You think this is ironic? >>12368146

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:42:06 No.12368164 >>12368158 >don't deserve to be on this site Yeah right you've earned it

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:42:26 No.12368165

>>12368152
>Not Jewish. Was raised Catholic. Am not anymore. You're just an asshole
What makes you say that faggot? I was raised orthodox and I have more christian blood in me than you will ever have faggot. Raised catholic my ass then tell me the verse where the bible says that Judaism is the synagogue of satanism

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:43:06 No.12368167

>>12368142
>Usually if someone doesn't believe in the holocaust they've got a reason for doing so
I was told i had to believe it or i was a bigot. History doesn't fucking work like that, just about everything is a narrative, usually from the victors.

What i want to see is you explain why the holodomor isn't as well known and popularized as the holocaust.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:43:53 No.12368168 File: 132 KB, 1023x838, barbara-spectre-quote.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12368164 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGRZDDHuEY0 Oh yes please continue giving me info about the holohoax

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:44:59 No.12368172 >>12368165 "raised catholic" does not mean I've read the entire bible. Is this an attempt to win an argument? Consequentially, what verse is that?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:45:24 No.12368173 >>12368168 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ9j1VeXjv0&t=0s&index= Oh yes please continue winning the argument by calling me an asshole https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYoxc-xbMzs&t=47s

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:46:19 No.12368175 >>12368168 I wasn't the guy who posted the other video.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:46:44 No.12368177 >>12368172 One simple google search To the church in Smyrna, Jesus says, “I know your afflictions and your poverty—yet you are rich! I know about the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan” (Revelation 2:9).

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:47:28 No.12368179 >>12368173 If I argue with you, you're just gonna call me a libtard or something which is what you're already doing.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:49:34 No.12368181 >>12368179 I am not if you were arguing correctly and truthfully we would have already finished.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:49:48 No.12368183 >>12368177 "who say they are jews, but are not" So the synagogue of satan is made up of jew impostors who are not actual Jews. Christ doesn't call all the Jews a synagogue of satan. He is a Jew at this point (he's the king of them). You misquoted it.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:50:21 No.12368186 >>12368160 not an argument, strawmen once again

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:51:12 No.12368190 >>12368186 All I did there was reiterate that he's a Nazi

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:52:00 No.12368191 >>12368190 >he's a Nazi impossible, they no longer exist

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:52:49 No.12368193

>>12368183
He calls the jews who do most of the things we associate with modern jews the "synagogue of satan".

It's part of the reason why the talmud says a lot of horrible things about jesus, boiling him in excrement and forbidding jews from using the toilet on xmas eve and whatnot.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:53:01 No.12368194

>>12368183
>So the synagogue of satan is made up of jew impostors who are not actual Jews.
Do you seriously think that zionists are orthodox jews or jews pm that matter they will always call themselves atheists? They are not if you did you have that wrong also they never believed in judaism they just have the name and carry it around only when it's useful I didn't misquote him he tells the truth there are impostors that call themselves jews but do not believe in anything of that sort.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:53:51 No.12368197 >>12368191 correction; they never existed.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:55:39 No.12368202 So we're to believe that exactly 6,000,000 died? Not 5,953,204, not 6,000,001, but exactly 6,000,000 on the dot?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:56:07 No.12368203 >>12368194 Not really concerned with all these obscure corners of religious law. I grew up Catholic; we have hell for everyone including you and your friends in the Orthodox church. >>12368193 I think you just misquoted the bible, but that's just me.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:57:31 No.12368205 >>12368202 Never said that. Figure's closer to 12 million if you count non jews.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:57:32 No.12368206 >i support for the working class proletariats and hate capitalism >by importing their ethnic displacement with lower wage accepting minorities that benefits nobody but the bourgeois great thread

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:57:53 No.12368208 >>12368202 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWECElJ8QZw

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:58:51 No.12368211 File: 157 KB, 726x572, 1545508321088.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12368203 You should look it up if you think we're being deceptive.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:58:59 No.12368212 >>12368205 LOL ahahahah Ok now I am going it's certain that you are an idiot just continue believing the lies I am sure you will find great success and a lot of money oy vey so nice.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 04:59:50 No.12368215 >>12368206 never said I was a communist either. to be honest I'm between ideologies right now, but you guys just seem fucking miserable. i'm just done with liberalism so the wage thing doesn't really bug me.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:00:09 No.12368217 >>12368205 and that's the reason why the nazis are super evil and everything to do with them forever is super evil? But the people who died to communism don't count, because it wasn't real communism? Can you explain that one to me?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:01:00 No.12368218 >>12368212 you can keep assuming I'm jewish but i promise I'm not

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:01:50 No.12368220 >>12368217 communists killed more

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:02:01 No.12368221 >>12368217 Not really. I'm not a communist. Isn't killing the jews the point of Nazism though? Can we do it without killing all the disabled people this time?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:03:06 No.12368224 >>12368221 >Isn't killing the jews the point of Nazism though? no

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:03:18 No.12368225

>>12368220
so why the disparity in "evilness" levels? Why are communists okay to the media but anything within shelling distance of "nazis" is pure evil, to the point that even talking about securing a good future for children is pushing it or sending up red flags?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:04:22 No.12368226 >>12368221 >Isn't killing the jews the point of Nazism though? Not in the slightest bit. Making your race the best and happiest it possibly can be is the point. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haavara_Agreement

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:04:27 No.12368227

>>12368215
>but you guys just seem fucking miserable
Well that's what happens when the ruling class hunts your ideology and you are castrated from every group for your opinion. Until you are not and you don't give a fuck anymore and now wait for the collapse of society which is four years away

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:04:30 No.12368228 >>12368224 What is it then? What's all the aryan master race/ slave race stuff about then? Do Irish Catholics count as aryans now?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:05:40 No.12368232 >>12368226 Right, just like how communism is about how sharing is caring.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:06:37 No.12368237
File: 63 KB, 308x402, download (80).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12368228
>What's all the aryan master race/ slave race stuff about then?
War propaganda, mostly. Do you think all japanese americans during ww2 were sabotaging everything they could and leaking as much information back to the homeland as possible?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:06:56 No.12368238 File: 144 KB, 484x1024, 1515455166028m.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12368228 What made you think they didn't? And what made you think slavs where not also aryans.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:08:36 No.12368243 >>12368237 No, but I don't exactly consider that a shining moment for democracy either. What's the plan then? I want to hear it from you. How do we make the race happy?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:08:50 No.12368244

>>12368232
If killing the jews was the point of "nazisim", why did they wait ten years?

Was killing the japanese the point of americanism? Because we sure as shit stuck them in concentration camps too. The only difference is that ours didn't get their supply lines bombed and we didn't lose the war.

Or will you honestly disagree with the statement; "History is decided by the victors"?

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:11:03 No.12368252 >>12368243 >How do we make the race happy? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pol0zyH2klA&bpctr=1546944023

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:12:27 No.12368254

>>12368244
Would you agree that the point of Nazism was to secure Germany for the Germans?
How do you get the Jews to leave then? You can't deport them all; nobody wants them.

The point of "Americanism" if you want to call it that is to get rid of the indians for the sake of capitalist land grabs.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:13:31 No.12368257 >>12368252 I said I wanted to hear it from you. I'm not watching your videos. If you want my reasons, check why you wouldn't go check Butterfly's sources.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:15:18 No.12368261 >>12368254 >The point of "Americanism" if you want to call it that is to get rid of the indians for the sake of capitalist land grabs. fuck your stupid

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:15:19 No.12368262

>>12368254
>Would you agree that the point of Nazism was to secure Germany for the Germans?
I would call it National Socialism, but yes. Are you aware of the staggering loss of life imposed on the country shortly after the end of WW1?

>How do you get the Jews to leave then?
The same way you get a jew to do anything; you pay them, lol.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haavara_Agreement#The_Transfer_Agreement

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:18:21 No.12368270

>>12368262
But you can't mass deport your jewish population to a country that doesn't want them, a country that they're not originally from anyway, and where they don't even speak the language. It doesn't work in a practical sense.

Well there was a staggering loss of life during the war on all sides as well, and saying Germany got a raw deal at Versailles is not the same as justifying WWII.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:20:16 No.12368273

>>12368257
>I said I wanted to hear it from you. I'm not watching your videos.
Hearing it from me is insufficient. You need to see some evidence that the methods of national socialism produced results, don't you?

Here, i skipped a bit of hitler gushing, the next few minutes cover the economic system and the results.

https://youtu.be/Pol0zyH2klA?t=596

Again, my words and beliefs are completely empty without results.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:22:08 No.12368280

>>12368270
>But you can't mass deport your jewish population to a country that doesn't want them, a country that they're not originally from anyway, and where they don't even speak the language. It doesn't work in a practical sense.
Well they ended up doing it anyway. It's still a better option than killing them, isn't it?

>saying Germany got a raw deal at Versailles is not the same as justifying WWII.
Good thing germany didn't start it. Don't tell me the world gave a shit about poland when they promptly forgot about it and let russia destroy it for a few decades after the war.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:22:27 No.12368281 >>12368273 Hitler's results were the second world war. If you don't explain yourself without Hitler, I'm going to assume you're proposing big wars and mass genocides, but its ok because we'll make the race happy and the sun has a smiley face.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:23:29 No.12368284 >>12368280 They didn't deport them though. Except to countries they'd already conquered anyway. You see how this doesn't work because I believe the holocaust happened.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:27:19 No.12368294 >>12368273 If you're going to shut somebody down by not reading their sources because "arguments should stand on their own" then you pull this shit then fuck you hypocrite

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:29:24 No.12368305

>>12368281
>Hitler's results were the second world war.
Yes. But Germany did not start it. It was started to destroy what germany had become without banks.

>you're proposing big wars and mass genocides
Nope. The wars and genocides were the actions of the banks and their debt slave nations. Wars of unlimited destruction are not good for the people of any nation.

>They didn't deport them though.
Yes, they did. Read the wikipedia article i keep linking.

>You see how this doesn't work because I believe the holocaust happened.
Not that you have much choice in the matter.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:31:46 No.12368311

>>12368294
>"arguments should stand on their own"
I never said that. In fact you're the only one who has said that, so i'm at a loss as to what you're referring to.

Really though, i could say all sorts of flowery nonsense about how quickly national socialism revitalized germany in just a few years, but what actual good is it without any proof of the results? Isn't that what you wanted? A system that could fix the fucked up world? Wasn't that the point of WW2? To stop the world from becoming fucked up?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:35:11 No.12368317

>>12368305
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haavara_Agreement#The_Transfer_Agreement

Do you think they all agreed to leave right away though? They sure won't leave Palestine and they don't even have thousands of years of historical roots there. five years is not enough time tor remove your nation's entire Jewish population.

Also, Hitler definitely invaded Austria then France by going circumventing the Maginot line. My grandmother was there. Hitler started it because it was always part of the plan. Why are you still here?

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:38:28 No.12368326

>>12368311
>wasn't that the point of WWII
The point of WWII was that it was a shitshow because Hitler fucked everything up, and if you can't convince me you're any different from him I won't go along with you. WWII wasn't some great glorious thing. Anyway, I don't believe you have practical solutions and you haven't given me any.

The communist was higher up in the thread and the other fascists were vocally refusing to look into her sources so I assumed its you.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:39:20 No.12368328

>>12368317
>Do you think they all agreed to leave right away though?
No, but they should have, especially if you believe the holocaust was real.

>They sure won't leave Palestine and they don't even have thousands of years of historical roots there.
I agree, but now you sound like a nazi for criticizing israel, lol.

>five years is not enough time tor remove your nation's entire Jewish population.
Five years was all the banker nations gave them before they declared war. Had they not interfered, it would have gone off without a hitch.

>Also, Hitler definitely invaded Austria then France by going circumventing the Maginot line.
Before or after Britain and the others declared war on germany?

>Why are you still here?
Just to suffer.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:42:29 No.12368332

>>12368326
>and if you can't convince me you're any different from him I won't go along with you.
How do you even know what he was like? What would he have been like had he won? What does that mean for the popular conception? History is objective? I fucking wish it was!

>Anyway, I don't believe you have practical solutions and you haven't given me any.
I gave you a specific timestamp. Watch it or don't. Research it or don't. God knows everything has already been done to keep you from learning about it, the only thing that can change that is your own will.

>The communist was higher up in the thread and the other fascists were vocally refusing to look into her sources so I assumed its you.
Nope. I'm not a neo-nazi larper. I'm nothing like the caricatures you've seen on tv.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:43:48 No.12368334 >>12368328 1. The Jews shouldn't have had to leave in the first place but that's history for you. You're point doesn't stand anymore 2. anyone can criticize Israel 3&4. They certainly invaded before France declared war.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:47:35 No.12368341

>>12368334
>The Jews shouldn't have had to leave in the first place but that's history for you.
If the choices were a lot of dead jews or a lot of displaced jews, it's hard to see how the former was the more moral option.
>anyone can criticize Israel
and be labeled a nazi for it. You know how the media works.
>3&4. They certainly invaded before France declared war.
And the french lamented their departure, especially now.

How do you think the USA would have been treated had they firebombed dresden and nuked japan and lost the war? Would they still have been considered the heroes by the history written by the victors of that war? All this perfect good and evil shit is too storybook for real life.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:48:46 No.12368346 >>12368332 If I posted sources on communism would you read them? I still doubt it. If you can't explain yourself without linking a video of HItler, I won't listen to you. Wouldn't listen to you anyway, I'm not an anti-semite or anything.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:52:20 No.12368353

>>12368341
My Grandother is French, was there during occupation, and is still alive, what the fuck are you talking about. I'm assuming she knows more than you do, and she aided the allies during occupation. So did her father, who was kicked out of Italy by the fascists years before the war.

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 05:59:46 No.12368373

>>12368346
>If I posted sources on communism would you read them?
Sure. I've read quite a lot on it, good and bad. When it comes to the success of the ideals, you have many data points, i've only a single one. Both of ours point to failure, but i can't write mine off without more data points, probably the same as you.

>Wouldn't listen to you anyway
Again, that wasn't your choice. It can be though.

I'd love to keep this going all night but i've got to get some rest. It's been good talking to you all. I know you're coming from a place of virtue and a desire for good and i would never think of trying to change that. Just be aware of the tremendous responsibility of that desire.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 07:02:46 No.12368511 File: 154 KB, 480x349, 1546887402318.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12367623 >Our billionaires are the most philanthropic in the world

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 07:54:37 No.12368639 >>12367542 lol cuck the ugly obese woman won't even @ reply you

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 08:02:14 No.12368653

Seems most critics of OP's point rely on referencing low-brow media produced.

These are produced because many people choose to spend the income they worked for to consume those media - that is the source of profit for the entertainment industry. To try to paint this as a bad thing is inherently undemocratic because this is how people choose to spend their work compensation and free time.

As for the rest that do not enjoy such films, there are all possible alternatives avaiable from Oscar-bait to arthouse to indie to whathaveyou. And if you want to produce communist propaganda pieces, you can - if enough people like them, you can even earn your living that way.

There is no time or place on earth that has afforded as much creative freedom as the west, presently.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 08:39:25 No.12368821 LOL my great grandfather belonged to the "White terror" who went around dragging communists from their houses, taking them into the woods and shooting them back in the good old days of Finland. Communists BTFO!

Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 08:56:03 No.12368875
File: 293 KB, 321x480, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12366926
>>12367161
>>12367366
>>12367539
>>12367590
>>12367648
>>12367718
you're fucking embarrassing. don't start an argument about theoretical merits of Marxism if you can't generate your own talking points. this is /lit/ not fucking "sit watching YouTube videos about economics". it's apparent to me that's exactly what you've been doing and that you haven't genuinely read a lick of Marx or those he inspired outside the 21st century. why are you even on this board if you don't have the attention span for books? (or even writing a well-thought, effortful essay-argument on 4chan)
the fact that you're recommending Cockshott as an honest researcher sets off fire alarms for any academic that considers themselves Marxist.

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 09:05:00 No.12368902 >>12367578 you're not a Marxist

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 09:21:35 No.12368969 File: 54 KB, 499x499, 1457563800148.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12368653 you think you free but you isn't

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 10:41:55 No.12369292 >>12368511 Stupid anime poster Organizations like the Bill and Melinda Gates foundation provide an immense amount of foreign aid

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 11:05:43 No.12369400 >>12367872 Hello Benji

>>	Anonymous Tue, Jan 8, 2019 11:54:14 No.12369627 >>12368041 Imagine believing this

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/lit/ - Literature