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/lit/ - Literature


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12191982 No.12191982 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Unironically, what's the philosophy behind all this "more than two genders" thing?
If this is the wrong board to ask this, please relocate it to the right place.

>> No.12191995

it's almost like there's a board entirely dedicated to faggot ecology on this website

>> No.12191995,1 [INTERNAL] 

De que se trata esta pagina web?

>> No.12192007

Nihilism.

>> No.12192010

There is none. It's just pointless people living in societies with some of the most liberal views on gender roles playing semantic games to justify extreme forms of attention seeking behavior.

>> No.12192015

>>12191982
it's just hollow people putting meaningless labels on themselves in a vain attempt to appear as an actual human being

>> No.12192017

>>12191995

>> No.12192024

>>12191982
I'm saying this unironically. Have you tried reading any of the academic literature behind it? This is a polarizing and extremely political issue and you will 100% not get any worth while discussion about it on here. I assume you are b8ing but if you're actually interested, read some of the notable works and form your own opinion. It is definitely not some wacky strawman or "I identify as an attack helicopter" type shit. I think one of the biggest issues people have with understanding this stuff is that they are unable to distinguish between the physical truth of sex and the more cultural conception of gender. They aren't exactly the same thing.

>> No.12192034

Petit bougie idiots with nothing better to worry about other than their gay and weird behavorial traits that they are rying to write off to being a different """""gender""""

>> No.12192074

>>12192024
>It is definitely not some wacky strawman or "I identify as an attack helicopter"
But it literally is.

>> No.12192126

Off topic. Report and sage.

>> No.12192398

>>12191982
Watch contrapoints (YouTube)

>> No.12192447

>>12192024
it's just simplistic truisms used as justifications for obnoxious behavior by bratty middle class kids with no sense of themselves

>> No.12192470
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12192470

Just read the Wikipedia article on it. Having a third gender isn't really that big of a deal. Most people in the west already functionally consider gay and gender non-conforming men neither men nor women so it's not that hard to imagine something like this being codified and formalized

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_gender

>> No.12192475

>>12191982
A misplaced dualism where people erroneously believe that there is a mind-body split which is simply not true
The mind and the body are the united ao a sick body creates a sick mind
This creates mental illness when the body is not cared for which can lead to such an extreme body dysmorphia

In some people it causes them to fervently abuse themselves in order to seek the ideal perfection of their own sex, while others get it in their minds that they can only be pure as the other sex.
Because this is a mental illness they will never ever be able to achieve this purity and there will always be "one more" leap to take again and again until they commit suicide in despair.

The idea of "multiple genders" is just an ad hoc handwave since people all know deep down that trans people can't change their sex so they come up with a new "sex" for them.

In reality the entire concept of Gender is faulty and was created in the 1960s

>> No.12192497

>>12192007
>>12192010
>>12192015
>>12192034
>>12192074
>>12192447
>>12192475
People who are even a bit homophobic and/or transphobic should unironically be placed in camps until a jury of their queers decides what to do with them.

>> No.12192511
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12192511

>>12192497
>Queers

>> No.12192514

>>12192497
>homophobic
>phobia, irrational fear
>one more faggot again threatening to kill us all
>irrational fear

>> No.12192524

>>12192024
This.

>> No.12192542

>>12192024
This. Start with judith butler

>> No.12192588

>>12192497
People who are you should be ironically gassed.

>> No.12192594

>>12192497
hello faggot remeber to dilute your "vagina" today and take your pills

>> No.12192599

>>12192594
you mean dilate

>> No.12192616
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12192616

>>12192594
Thanks for reminding me uwu!!!!! :)

>> No.12192619

>muh feels
>Human biology don't real.
>Facts are white, cis-gender oppressive structures that force cishetro-normativity on the disprivleged proletariat
This just about somes it up.

>> No.12192624
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12192624

>>12192024
Unironically John Money was a pedophile, gender is a grammatical term, and homosexuals should be thrown off tall buildings

>> No.12192634

>>12192470
Wikipedia can't be trusted on this issue, its take is nothing less than revisionist history. Take the instance from that page of the fa'afafine from Samoa and Tonga. Taken from the "third gender" page and its own page, you'd get the idea that fa'afafine is a culturally accepted third gender in Samoa and always has been. The thing is that's a total lie. "Fa'afafine" would best be translated "faggot," and the more common "fafa" would be "fag." You think the Polynesians are all accepting and loving of sexual nonconformists because their islands are warm and sunny? No, they beat their children, they beat up foreigners, and they beat the hell out of queers.
Don't believe everything you read, anon.

>> No.12192672
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12192672

>>12192634
>ywn live on a tropical island spending your days eating delicious fruit and beating up children & gays

>> No.12192699

>>12192672
I know that feel. My Tongan friends would tell me the greatest stories of life back in the islands. Like how when they were bored they'd get their friends together and go find the chinaman who worked the local dollar store and beat the living daylights out of him. Or how there were two rival high schools across the street from each other and every so often they'd just have a war and start beating the snot out of each other. I'd walk into these Tongan homes and anytime the kid did something wrong—whack—right in the back of the head. But the kids love their parents despite the hidings they get, the families are huge and more close-knit than anything white people have ever seen. Everyone accepts Jesus as their Lord and Savior and goes to church and the churches and communities throw great parties and dances where everyone sings and everyone dances and everyone laughs and everyone loves. Now that's a culture. Western civilization was a mistake.

>> No.12192713
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12192713

>>12192699
Literal subhumans

>> No.12192780

What's the philosophy behind there being two genders?

>> No.12192798

>>12192780
>So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

>> No.12192813

>>12191995
There’s a board dedicated to you?

>> No.12192818

>>12192798
not exactly rigorous

>> No.12192825

>>12192798
This and biology.

>> No.12192828

>>12191982
Late-libertarianism. Thelemic "Do what you want" (referring to captial-w Will), thrust into a world of social media and armchair activism. It's no longer a case of being allowed to live your Will, but desperately trying to be unique in a sea of individualists. A discordant meshing of collectivism and individualism.

>> No.12192829

Yesterday I bought The Illiad and Odyssey
The day before that I watched that specific John Green's video and now I see it being spammed. Are you stalking me?

>> No.12192856

>>12191982
unironically why do human beings insist on catagorizing things into two bins

>> No.12192860

>>12191982
Foucault
by the way I think faggots should be either cured or killed

>> No.12192866

>>12192856
Because that's literally one of the fundamental laws of thought.

>> No.12192873

>>12192825
gender is a description of mental states. does biology fully descibe mental states?

>> No.12192878

>>12192828
Could you elaborate? I’m interested

>> No.12192881

>>12192873
>gender is a description of mental states.
No it’s not.

>> No.12192884

>>12192856
That's the great power of the human mind, the thing that animals lack: abstraction, the power to create and populate categories and create mental superstructures atop the underlying physical reality.
>>12192818
if you're looking for autistic symbol-pushing syllogisms you can jump in a lake
>>12192825
wise man

>> No.12192892

>>12192866
>law
set forth by whom

>> No.12192901

>>12192884
why not three bins why not four bins why not five bins?

>> No.12192908

>>12192892
God probably. Aristotle just enunciated them for us.

>> No.12192913

>>12192881
what do you think gender is?

>> No.12192929

>>12192913
A grammar term, it refers to nouns, pronouns, and abjective, not to people.
People use it to indicate people because they are ignorant and or with bad intentions

>> No.12192937

>>12192873
No it isn't. The word 'gender' has at most a remote relation to mental states. Mental states are constituted by thoughts and feelings, which are constantly in a state of change, whereas gender is a static, unchanging state of being (physical and mental), which is constituted by biological attributes and mental models which are ingrained to the brain at birth. Some people have the defect of being born with incompatible mental model and body attributes, but that doesn't mean there are more than two genders.

>> No.12192955

>>12192937
>a static, unchanging state of being
Nothing of the sort exists or possibly could exist outside of pure maths

>> No.12192971

>>12192929
and mood is the atmosphere of a piece of art and atmosphere is the gaseous outer shell of the earth and earth is arable land and words have one set meaning for all of time in all domains of inquiry and are not infact coopted and morphed to fit new ideas and ideals

>> No.12192985

>>12192937
gender is dynamic

>> No.12193043

>>12192542
this shit got so. rammed. down. my. fucking. throat in college.
>inside my head
>ALALALLALLLALALAL I'M NOT LISTENING THIS IS RETARDED

>> No.12193058

First off, there are people who are born with both genitals or no genitals, so that blows the two genders thing out of the water. What are these peoples genders? The intellectually lazy cretins in this thread who toss aside gender theory without literally having ever interacted with dismiss this as an anomaly, but this is estimated to be about 1 in 100 people. So not insignificant. This should be enough to let people be willy nilly about their genders, but since no one on this board argues in good faith, I'll move on.
Let's move on to people with "normal" genitals.
The best place to start here is behavioral. The traits of "man" and woman" are obviously changing all the time and across cultures. You'd be hard-pressed to find universal behavioral characteristics. Think of how it used to be more proper for men to wear jewelry and what not. There are millions of examples of how the idea of masculinity has never been a solid thing. Pilgrims wore heels and makeup... it goes on and on. Even the idea that men do physical labor while the woman stays home is not even close to universal if you consult anthropology.
So what is it about a penis that makes someone a man? It would be impossible to say. People who don't believe in only two genders think the assignment of gender-based on genitalia is arbitrary (or at best a social construct), because they can for all purposes appear to be a woman, act like a woman, and feel like a woman ( or any combination of man and woman, that's the so-called spectrum).

>> No.12193063

>>12191982
boredom

>> No.12193064

>>12193043
so brave

>> No.12193082

>>12193058
It just makes more sense with what we know about biology and power structures in society to disconnect gender from genitalia. Even the dictionary does this now, (though it doesn't technically allow for more genders) Gender is the "state of being male or female, in reference to sociological or cultural differences.

>> No.12193095

>>12193082
And so what does it matter to you if someone with a penis wants to be some hitherto unknown combination between man and woman? It actually doesn't have anything to do with you, unless that person starts demanding respect from you. If you cannot find respect for someone different from you, you're just shitty and that's probably where you're starting from and I can't help you there.

>> No.12193103

>>12191982
You know how everyone thinks nazi larpers are just deluded morons buying into some moronic ideology to distract themselves from the hollowness of their lives? Tranny activism is the exact same thing just on the other side of the spectrum.

>> No.12193140

>>12193095
> it doesn't affect you
> accept my feminine penis!

We're all connected anon, nothing is isolated in a healthy society. It's not healthy to fantasize about something you can't get, whether it's incels brooding on the internet or men who want to be women. These unhealthy fantasies affect all of us, they affect our relationships with our friends and our family and our coworkers. Strong desires, especially unhealthy ones, affect the people around us. And transgenders end up coloring every facet of their relationships with other people around their fetish identities, which you can see if you've ever interacted with any transgender individuals.

> If you cannot find respect for someone different from you

Everyone is different from me, does that mean I owe everyone respect? Come on, you know that's not what this is about and you know your ideas are emotional not dispassionate.

>> No.12193150
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12193150

>>12193058
>First off, there are people who are born with both genitals or no genitals, so that blows the two genders thing out of the water. What are these peoples genders?
100% objectively determinable by analysis of their chromosomes, try again sweetie.
>>12193058
>The intellectually lazy cretins in this thread who toss aside gender theory without literally having ever interacted with dismiss this as an anomaly, but this is estimated to be about 1 in 100 people
Blatantly false.
>Estimated prevalence is approximately 1/20,000 births
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_hermaphroditism
So it's not even 1% of 1% of the population. Why should these freaks of nature have any bearing on normal non mutated people? I mean every now and then some weird Indian fucker is born with a 7 limbs and a penis on their forehead, pic related. Does the existence of this bitch mean octopus is now a gender? Obviously not.

>> No.12193167
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12193167

>>12193103
Funnily enough I treat people who deny the existence of the holocaust just as I do those who try and virtue signal by insisting I owe them something because they woke up yesterday and decided they were 1/128th bisexual cherokee and 1/64th Apache Helicopter.

>> No.12193177

>>12193058
So what could make someone a tranny now could just mean they're a dude in the future based on how society views gender in the future? Sounds pretty dumb.

>> No.12193197

>>12193140
transgender isn’t transsexual

>> No.12193312

>>12193150
OK so what gender is xxy etc

>> No.12193320

>>12192901
penis and vagina

>> No.12193328

>>12193177
society and customs are just a set of habits. why do people shake hands? why is kissing considered more intimate in some cultures? its mostly arbitrary

>> No.12193332

>>12193312
Male, you dunce.

>> No.12193340

>>12192908
airstotles sole contribution to gender studies is
>man good
>woman bad

>> No.12193350

>>12192884
>why do you need logic just read this old Jewish book

>> No.12193370

>>12193312
>Klinefelter syndrome
>Also called: XXY syndrome
>ABOUT
>SYMPTOMS
>TREATMENTS
>Young man standing with his shirt off to show a lack of body hair and enlarged breasts. Diagram showing an extra X chromosome.
>A genetic condition in which a male is born with an extra copy of the X chromosome
wew that was tough
do you not have Google?

>> No.12193374

>>12193328
calling it "arbitrary" makes it sound like you believe that customs are ordered into existence and enforced from the top-down. maybe you do believe this, but it's pretty retarded and you should stop.
read hegel.

>> No.12193389

Humans are categorical thinkers. We create labels for things and labels again for those labels. It used to be one category called "human", which was rightfully split into categories called "race" and "gender". Something about dissolving and further dissecting these categories appeals to people as a means for defining "their" world. Some think the existence of these categories at all is a means of enforcing a mindset of inequality, and some think the categories should be more specific for sake of a more refined, often more relatable, defintion to go along with the label. In the end it's all the pointless semantics of confused children without a sense group identity or belonging.

>> No.12193399

>>12193328
Customs are the result of evolutionary pressures, they aren't arbitrary, at best they are localized.

>> No.12193402

>>12192780
Natural law theory.

>> No.12193447

>>12193332
>>12193370
not an argument

>> No.12193492

>>12192024
Contrapoints, please go away

>> No.12193496

>>12193399
the generalities may be purposeful but not the specifics. it makes sense to have a universal greeting what form it takes is unimportant

>> No.12193520

>>12193496
>what form it takes is unimportant
But not random. Importance isn't the same thing as non-arbitrariness.

>> No.12193523

>>12193320
that’s sex not gender

>> No.12193539

>>12193402
I just opened my copy of the natural laws and it says you're a faggot

>> No.12193563

>>12193370
why does this argument always come to retarded semantics about this one rare syndrome

>> No.12193577
File: 53 KB, 480x254, Screen Shot 2018-12-07 at 03.47.14.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
12193577

No one's posted the Deleuze quote.

>> No.12193587

>>12193563
>you can't tell me definitively what gender this person with a chromosomal disorder is, so you must accept state-mandated genital surgery and HRT for your children
same thing as
>your tv is japanese therefore you must accept millions of 75 iq migrants from poor countries with outrageous crime rates who will ruin your country
it's really not relevant but these people are tactical nihilists

>> No.12193601
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12193601

>>12193577
>there are as many sexes as there are assemblages

>> No.12193604

>>12191982
Gender is like race. A social conceptualization based on biological observation. I can say "black is a social construct" and I would be right. But, That being said a European would be lying if he said he was "black", a African would be lying if he said he was "white", and a male would be lying if he said he was a "woman".

>> No.12193636

>>12193604
so are Jews white?

>> No.12193644

>>12193577
What is it about french 'intellectuals' that makes them hate humanity so much? Children are victimized by having a gender? Jesus christ.

>> No.12193698

>>12193644
They desire to see their inner ugliness impressed upon the outside world. Beauty and innocence is so painful to them that they misconstrue it as an evil that must be extinguished.

>> No.12193743

>>12193636
Oh hell no

>> No.12193772

>>12191982
Judith Butler
Who took most of her theory from Derrida and made it about gender.
But she's not really 'many gender pill' - more like 'gender is arbitrary and there could as well be many genders'

>> No.12193782

>>12193772
Butler is the origin of queer theory

>> No.12193787

>>12193772
she took her theory from foucault you got damn pseud, this board will actually make you more retarded if u read it

>> No.12193795

Wrong board! All posters in this thread please go with OP, you've a few options as to where

>>>/his/
>>>/pol/
>>>/b/

>> No.12193800

>>12193772
this is the actual truth but snowflakes coopted it and made these little identity islands all their own when gender should’ve just fucking ended right there

>> No.12193802
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12193802

>>12191982
Point 1
>gender and biology are two different things, one is an identity/code of behaviour, and it is a social construct; the other is biology
Point 2
>male and female 'patterns' do not exist in an universal way, since *cites cultural differences
Point 3
>male and female are not the only ways of gendered identity, and limiting ourselves to those two is falling to a cultural imposition
That's, watered down, the gist of the surface. In the end, it's bullshit, and Hegel was right, but whatever, it is true that often people hate on it by instinct without 'getting' the actual argument.

>> No.12193803

>>12193043
I got it too but in Denmark we make cases against most stuff we learn about - so we got a quite varied on it anyhow.

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