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/lit/ - Literature

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12060915 No.12060915 [Reply] [Original]

Post the most outlandish yet logically coherent/possible philosophical positions you can think of. You do not need to actually believe them to post.

>> No.12060919

>>12060915
Why don't you start?

>> No.12060920

>>12060915

Everything is exactly the way we think it is.

>> No.12060922

Here's mine: the world is in singular, unmoving, eternal stasis and the feeling of time moving is only a component of that stasis; the past never happened and the future will never come. You are reading a 4chan post forever.

>> No.12060926

>>12060915
Humanity is valueless and its extinction can be considered a good

>> No.12060928

everything is conscious

>> No.12060988

There actually is an unspeakably large yet finite number N such that N+1 only equals N again, and likewise for -N

>> No.12061090

>>12060988
That’s the stupidest shit I ever read

>> No.12061119

ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff thats a lot of fs

>> No.12061159

>>12061119
Actually it's two lots of fs

>> No.12061230

>>12060915
Space is discrete and all differences we perceive depend on quantitative differences of the fundamental units of space.

>> No.12061238

You are in a coma and this post in this thread is your family's only chance to make any contact with you

>> No.12061251

Humans only become sentient and capable of phenomenological experience once they learn a language

>> No.12061271

The way the world is to you at this very moment is the only way it could ever possibly be and the existence of any other possible state is an illusion

>> No.12061298

>>12060988
This has to be bait

>> No.12061339

>>12061090
>>12061298
This thread isn't for you

>> No.12061360

>>12061339
You missed
‘Logically coherent’ part in op post

>> No.12061382

>>12061360
It's possible to imagine other number systems that blatantly contradict the logic of our own yet remain logically coherent
Modular arithmetic, for example

>> No.12061405

>>12061382
No you literally can’t add 1 to a number without increasing the metric stop being needlessly autistic

>> No.12061413

>>12061405
You can in a mod 1 system

>> No.12061457

Finnegans Wake by James Joyce is the most ontologically significant object in existence
It collapses the vertical nature of scale, making micro- and macro- one in the same
It collapses the horizontal nature of time, making the past and present occupy the same space in a rhyming loop of loops that rhyme
It collapses the natures of singularity and plurality, breaking the many into one, and the one into many
It collapses the nature of space, making all locations the same and every location many different ones
It collapses the binary of content and form, defining each by the other in uroboric symbiosis
The world swirls and teeters and rocks but in all circles around the Wake

>> No.12061506

>>12061238
pull the plug

>> No.12061526

>>12061506
This

>> No.12061535

Everyone who isn't you is God

>> No.12061546

possible girls

>> No.12061608

Human beings could theoretically advance enough technologically to survive or prevent the death of the universe and exist infinitely, meaning what you do right now technically does matter, as there would be no grand nothing-ening to undo everything we've done.

Laws of the universe technically do not have to apply to things outside this universe, or in another one, meaning that something could theoretically come from or be created by nothing. Given time may be infinite, it's all but certain another universe that allows you to reincarnate inside of it will eventually be born.

The brain is capable of convincing itself of anything. It can convince itself of something, then convince itself that it can't convince itself of said something, meaning the person inhabiting that brain believes it wholeheartedly. It can also retroactively edit memories to fix incongruities among those beliefs. It's entirely possible that a lot of people you know don't actually exist. Everyone who believes they exist are constantly hallucinating to match the stories of those around them who also believe in them to prevent the waveform from collapsing. This is how religions and political movements largely work already, just to a lesser degree. This is also how so many people manage to still believe in ghosts and shit.

>> No.12061619

i'll eventually have gf

>> No.12061623

>>12061608
ghosts and shit are real

>> No.12061624

>>12061405
If your understanding of mathematics is that of naive arithmetic, yes.

>> No.12061656
File: 34 KB, 480x480, 1532150980118.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
12061656

The universe (as defined by everything that is) is a one-dimensional mathematical structure
>t. Max Tegmark

>> No.12061660

>>12061619
Dude seriously wtf is your problem
Go get a gf if I do it by accident and it ruins my fucking life every couple months you can do it once and feel how worthless and shit being in a relationship is

>> No.12061667

>>12061230
I unironically think this as well :)

Besides, if space was continuous, then anything could [theorically] be infinitely divisible and that would end up gibing you zero, meaning that everything is made up of nothing(absurd).

(do not think of this in the context of real numbers, but the hyperreals)

>> No.12061669

>>12061457
hah, I like this kinda stuff

>> No.12061671

>>12061624
If your definitions make fucking sense than it is

>> No.12061677

>>12061506
This
Thanks for everything
Live well without me

>> No.12061681

>>12061656
This is what my last acid trip that made me never take it again felt like to me. The world and myself included became a flowing, writhing, infinitely dense space-filling curve that would align and unalign with itself over and over in a weird floral dance. Felt like I was being shot in the heart every time it aligned with itself
Then it just became three hours of hellish thought loops along those lines

>> No.12061687

>>12061660
don't take it seriously, it's not meant to

>> No.12061689

>>12060988
Isn't this a common saying?

"If a poor man has 50 dollars, and you take away one dollar, he now has 49 dollars.

If a millionaire has 1 000 000 dollars, and you take away 1 dollar, he still has a million fucking dollars and he's still a fucking millionaire."

>> No.12061706

>>12061689
This is just pointing out the difference between 1:50 and 1:1000000 despite both being one to something or other
A dollar may be effectively meaningless to a millionaire but he's still a dollar short if you take one away

>> No.12061752

>>12061687
Of course
But I’m sick of this victim mentality this board seems to endorse so much
And I know some people actually feel like it’s ok to go on 4chan and complain about their virginity instead of just having sex
It’s fucking ridiculous, stop normalizing virginfags victim mentality.

>> No.12061753

>>12061119
>>12061159
One could say that the totality of fness is contained in a singular sample of the letter F. We've effed the ineffable.

>> No.12061760

>>12061753
>>12061119
>>12061159
Stop this infernal feffing around

>> No.12061782

>>12061689
congratulations, you rediscovered the curve of diminishing marginal utility, you dumb cunt

>> No.12061801

Evidence-based hemisolipsism.

Somewhere between 45-55% of humanity are non-sentient and simply mimic "normal" human behavior in order to fit in. The processes that result in self-awareness demand large amounts of energy and produces few tangible benefits, so conscious humans are gradually being weeded out by natural selection.

>> No.12061812

>>12061801
Google "breakdown of the bicameral mind"
I won't claim it's necessarily true but it's relevant to your interests

>> No.12061813

>>12061801
go on..

>> No.12061816

>>12061801
ah yes the meme of the month, I want a new meme of the month though

>> No.12061826

>>12061801
I want to write a book where this is actually true but the non-sentient humans develop the theory first and start waging genocide against the sentient ones, "thinking" the roles are reversed

>> No.12061833

living intelligences in nature are real. both modernity and magic are founded on the principle that your reality is your perception: if this is true, then it's possible human consciousness "enminds" nature through our contemplation of it. cities are like a gravity well that dampen pineal energies

>> No.12061852

>>12061760
Post rare Fefes

>> No.12061854

>>12060915
Learning is recollection

>> No.12061859

>>12061854
When did I forget?

>> No.12061858

>>12061854
I remember being told this by a Greek... only, I have never been to Greece!
>What could it mean?

>> No.12061867

Things like black holes, atoms, quarks, the observable universe, etc don't exist in the same way that the objects around you exist

>> No.12061869

>>12061854
Yeah yeah buddy, I've heard it before

>> No.12061879

>>12061535
I'm unironically interested in this

>> No.12061922
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12061922

>>12061782
That was needlessly mean given the nature of the thread and given the poster didn't claim to "discover" anything. There is obviously no practical answer for that first anon's hypothetical but the proverb provided by the second provides a satisfactory linguistic solution to the problem. Why would you be so vitriolic in a thread about making silly and fun philosophical problems?

>> No.12061925

>>12061922
you're right, I apologize

>> No.12061928

>>12061535
I used to think either this or substitute God with aliens or humans putting me in a simulation to study me

I stopped thinking this when I realized I'm not that interesting and nobody would waste this much time watching some guy masturbate and read russian novels

>> No.12061995

>>12060988
>>12061339

Is there an actual mathematical proof for N+1=N where N is real?

>> No.12062082

>>12061995
Of course not

>> No.12062093

>>12060915
God is pure existence

>> No.12062112

Itt

>Dude this will totally blow ur mind duuude check out this crazy idea I had whoahhhh dude I read a Nietzsche article on wikipedia and watched Jordan Peterson on Joe Rogan and the matrix duuuuude what if like artificial intelligence can mirror the collective unconscious and simulate reality dude? *mind=blown*

>> No.12062134

>>12062112
>You do not need to actually believe them to post.

>> No.12062221

>>12062134

I am on this God forsaken website all the damn time. I know what people seriously believe and it's disturbing. The amount of half baked theories involving AI, simulated reality, "dimensions" and technofuturism/"the singularity" is shocking.

People are eating a bunch of intellectual sugar cereal and impressed with their own colorful poop.

I have seen people declare, without a trace of irony, such nonsense as

>I am god/we are all god

using adjectives like

>Sisyphean

Intermixed with pop culture references like

>a glitch in the matrix

And with hat-tips towards all manner of

>Maslowe's Heirarchy
>Jungian theory
>personal identity

It is what happens when young people try and lace an intricate theory of everything using films, the handful of books they have been required to read for school, and a little bunch of semi-interesting ideas discovered in a psychology course, an internet article and a Youtube video.

>> No.12062351

>>12060915

Every conception of the afterlife is correct because the afterlife is different for each person, regardless of their personal belief.

>> No.12062389

>>12062221
I almost never see people posting about that reddit shit here on /lit/. /sci/ and /x/ for sure but the rare times it crops up here it’s ridiculed into oblivion pretty quickly
This thread is just a fun little exercise in the unfalsifiable. It gets your imagination going for a few moments, that’s it. No need to be a cocksucker

>> No.12062400

turtles all the way down

>> No.12062417

>>12062389

This thread is encouraging bad behavior, and is a fine example of rotten cereal brain internet thinking.

I'm also downvoting you for using the word "unfalsafiable."

>> No.12062431

>>12062082
Depends on what real means

>> No.12062433
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12062433

>>12060915
>possible worlds actually fucking exist you guys!
>possible worlds are just as real as this world

>> No.12062437
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12062437

>>12062417
>I'm also downvoting you

>> No.12062456

>>12062433
https://philpapers.org/archive/SINPG

>> No.12062463

>>12061681
read the tao te ching

>> No.12062668

>>12062463
A big part of making it through that trip was convincing myself it wasn't profound and that it was just a drug, plain and simple. Is this gonna undo that work and if so is it gonna be worth it?

>> No.12062908

Trees are mammals

>> No.12062939

>>12062668
Not him but you are right. The trip is an experiential byproduct of throwing a wrench into your animal brain via a drug. The experience means nothing, even if part of the experience is the sensation of deal meaning. As Hunter Thompson put it, the great lie and myth of the acid generation was that "there is someone or something tending to the light at the end of the tunnel" (approximate quote).

The light is bright but it is not God or the Angels or Truth. It's just iridescent neurotransmitters in disarray, and your soul yanked along for the ride.

>> No.12062943

>>12060988
mathfag master degree here, I think you want to refer a concept called "infinitesimal monad" but you describe in bad, strictly wrong way.

>> No.12062989

>>12061413
>mod 1 system
fuck off
>>12061457
FUCK OFF
>>12061801
now this I can get into

>> No.12063005

>>12062989
What an awful post
Of course the NPC meme appeals to you

>> No.12063013

>>12060915
Marx was right

>> No.12063050

>>12063013
Marx was right but he coded his correct theories in intentionally flawed literature

>> No.12063060

>>12061608

>Human beings could theoretically advance enough technologically to survive or prevent the death of the universe and exist infinitely

a player of a game can never be bigger than the game itself

>> No.12063125

>>12061656
>one-dimensional mathematical structure
>one-dimensional
a one dimensional what? vector space?
so then the universe is literally a field

>> No.12063291

>>12063125
Presumably he means a one-dimensional cellular automaton, probably Rule 110, which according to Wikipedia is Turing complete.

>> No.12063599

>>12060915
Panpsychism probably. Maybe Wittgenstein/Valberg's thanatological solipsism.

>> No.12063604

What if superman could fly so fast around the world he could turn back time??

>> No.12063704

>>12061623
Go home /x/

>> No.12064601

bump

>> No.12064624

Human will is the ultimate deciding factor of everything in the universe

>> No.12064640

>>12064624
Only because you decided it would be so

>> No.12064666

Your father exists only as a constructed memory-amalgam to help you steer yourself in the right direction. None of the memories you have of him were ever physically true

>> No.12064673

>>12064666
>exists only as a constructed memory-amalgam to help you steer yourself in the right direction

You could say the same about any moment before now and your current state of consciousness could actually be an awakening of sorts in which you've been placed into the middle of a life you've only just started.

>> No.12064680

>>12064673
Nah. It's actually just your dad

>> No.12064691

""""Cultural Marxism"""" and antisemitic conspiracy theories were actually designed by cunning Jews bent on destabilizing the West. Alex Jones is a Zionist.

>> No.12065025

>>12064691
This theory itself was designed by an even more nefarious group

>> No.12065047

>>12065025

This

There is a secret group using Jews as pawns for their agenda and everyone has taken the bait

>> No.12065080

>>12061457
>Groundhog's Day (1993) is the most ontologically significant object in existence
>It collapses the vertical nature of scale, making micro- and macro- one in the same
>It collapses the horizontal nature of time, making the past and present occupy the same space in a rhyming loop of loops that rhyme
>It collapses the natures of singularity and plurality, breaking the many into one, and the one into many
>It collapses the nature of space, making all locations the same and every location many different ones
>It collapses the binary of content and form, defining each by the other in uroboric symbiosis
>The world swirls and teeters and rocks but in all circles around Bill Murray

>> No.12065107

>>12060915
Would OP have made this thread if I went back in time and fucked his mothers, thus becoming his dad?

>> No.12065109

>>12061782
Proof people who study economics are shitbags

>> No.12065111

none of this thread sounded like dropping acid with joe roge

>> No.12065138

>>12060915
Earth, and evolution, is a funnel designed to bring forth one single winner. The winner, the sole remaining surviving creature, who has to kill all others, is granted audience with the creator, ascending.

>> No.12065167

>>12065111
>>12062221
>>12062112
I would hate to be this insecure and void of playfulness

>> No.12065253

Why are people sperging out over this thread

>> No.12065268
File: 72 KB, 1041x397, 4ABE015E-227C-4E62-87E9-9FAFDB7D1642.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
12065268

>> No.12065382
File: 31 KB, 550x540, parmenijej.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
12065382

>>12060922
fuck off parmenides

>> No.12065410

>>12060915
Philosophy attempts to grapple with the notion of metaphysics. Music is metaphysics in practise.

>> No.12065502

every faggot in this thread, indeed the faggoty entirety of the world as i see it, is nought but a figment of my mind. so inasmuch as i love myself, i love all of you
and i don't so much as believe this as i have no reason to doubt it.

>> No.12065537

>>12060922
i doubt that i'm right, but for some reason i've always thought that this is what Parmenides was talking about

>> No.12065539

>>12060915
my dick is actually god and reality is its cum

asking for logical possibility is an extremely low bar, since there are a vast number of possibilities that don't involve contradictions

>> No.12065612

>>12060915
Objects exist.

>> No.12065620

>>12065537
Me too
If we’re wrong we’re at least wrong together

>> No.12065695

>>12060922
>>12065537
eternal return is what i think of

>> No.12065729

>>12065695
Completely distinct concept

>> No.12065821

>>12061928
I too thought of this when I was 11. Because I thought I would be responsible for how the entities would categorize human behavior I tried my best to be good.

>> No.12065822

>>12065502
Keked

>> No.12066088

>>12061801
Can confirm, am a P-Zombie

>> No.12066101

>>12062908
Mammals are trees

>> No.12066118

>>12061826
would be a good sequel to blade runner desu (sorry, haven't read the novel yet, sue me faggots)

>> No.12066135

numbers exist

>> No.12066138

This thead is unironically triggering my schizophrenia. How did I get to a point where I trust 4chan's IP counter more than my own brain

>> No.12066142

>>12065109
this

>> No.12066187

>>12065109
aren't most people shitbags, regardless of what they study?

>> No.12066190

Kant lol

>> No.12066202

>>12066187
Of course not.

>> No.12066211

>>12066187
projecting much?

>> No.12066249

>>12066211
Please stop saying this. It's as intelligent as "I'm rubber, you're glue..."

>> No.12066274

>>12066249
>I post on 4chan to look intelligent
you're still doing it

>> No.12066356

Gnosticism is the true religion

>> No.12066461
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12066461

>>12066211
projecting much?

>> No.12066559

Modern physical theories things that there is an (almost) infinite amounts of worlds - more worlds than we can imagine. This means that all the worlds we can imagine are out there, and are real there. When you imagine something, you are visiting another world.

For example, there is a world where dragons exists, because even if it is extremely unlikely that a beast of that weight and smaller wingspan could fly efficiently, there is a world where by luck, every dragon there ever was by happenstance in a position where they could fly efficiently, as in a world where every dragon was struck by a upwards win everytime they tried to fly. And in one of those worlds they are being hunted by Hegel on a scooter.

This does not mean that impossible worlds are possible, so imagining a world where 2+2 is 5 is to our knowledge not existant. But anything else, no matter how unlikely, its out there.

If you can imagine, and it is possible, it exists.

>> No.12066633

>>12066559
>This does not mean that impossible worlds are possible
*possible by our world's standards

>> No.12066689

>>12061506
This. Love you all. Thank you.

>> No.12066740

>>12060915
love is truth at a higher octave

>> No.12066750

>>12066740
First one in the thread to make me angry
Stupid, stupid post

>> No.12066783

>>12066740
and meaning is love at a higher octave

>> No.12066809

>>12066783
>>12066740
and the upright bass is a cello as a lower octave

>> No.12066847

>>12066809
completement basé

>> No.12066944

>>12066750
anger is a lower octave of fear, and fear is a lie

>> No.12067026

The human mind is free.

>> No.12067075

>>12060920
The world is flat.

>> No.12067077

>>12067026
I can assure you I've paid dearly

>> No.12067086

>>12067077
Respuesta [absolutamente] basada

>> No.12067101

>>12067077
first time i've laughed out loud in a week

>> No.12067126

>>12061457
Who says scale is vertical and time is horizontal?

>> No.12067132

>>12067126
Trivial choices to assist with the flow of the post

>> No.12067474

>>12065109
The law of marginal utility is a basic law in economics which can be derived very easily.

But yeah, I totally agree.

>> No.12067481

>>12060922
I unironically believe Parmenides was right.

>> No.12067502

Space taoism

>> No.12067509

>>12067481
I thought he was about constant change, not stasis

>> No.12067682

/lit/ is shit

>> No.12067690

>>12066559
>Modern physical theories think

no they don't

>> No.12067702

>>12066559
>And in one of those worlds they are being hunted by Hegel on a scooter.
tfw there is a world where Hegel makes sense

>> No.12068023

Dialetheism

>> No.12068131

>>12060988
Incompatible with peano axioms

>> No.12068329

>>12061251
how did a non-sentient being incapable of phenomenological experience develop language?

>> No.12068352
File: 148 KB, 332x332, 1541831064555.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
12068352

>>12062221
>reddit spacing

>> No.12068362

>>12060915
We are all in an artificial world designed by reified characters from a video game series I conceived of but didn't make, but which was made after the death of all of our original biological instantiations by advanced AI and expert systems in conjunction with hobbyist ancestor simulators who saw this comment and ironically decided to treat it as prescriptive. The video game series became popular, albeit probably mostly in an Ed Wood film sort of way, leading to the events described above.

>> No.12068364

>>12060915
God exists.

>> No.12068373

>>12062221
My excuse is schizophrenia, not any of what you just said.

>> No.12068381
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12068381

>>12061623
>ghosts and shit are real

>> No.12069335

>>12064640
Someone has to i guess

>> No.12069343

Anarcho Capitalism.

>> No.12069365

>>12060915
The world is ontologically incomplete and constructed by language, such that the development of new metaphors further creates new aspects of reality.

>> No.12069763

>>12069365
Posting actual truths is cheating

>> No.12069864

Time is the devil.

>> No.12070224

>>12069365
>>12069763
>the depth of our perceptual and conceptual development is tied to the complexity of our linguistic structures
this is right up my alley anons - i've only read julian jaynes on this, any more sources pls??

>> No.12070302

>>12065410
Read nobility of sight

>> No.12070318

>>12069365
You need to define 'the world' before asserting this.

>> No.12070490
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12070490

>>12066559
cringe

>> No.12071842

>>12061457
It's the dark souls of lit?

>> No.12071913

>>12067509
You're thinking Heraclitus

>> No.12072089

>>12065109
I study finance.
And I confirm that.

>> No.12072095

>>12060922
>>12065382
Real question: Does that mean death doesn't exist, despite me witnessing other people die?
And if it is the case, then what creates my solipsism-esque perception of non-existing past?

>> No.12072118

>>12072095
If that anon's theory were true, you'd never have really seen anyone die. That memory/feeling of death's existence would simply be a component of the stasis.
I'm not exactly sure what you mean in your second sentence. If you experience solipsism or anything else for that matter, that experience would simply be integral to the stasis

>> No.12072135

>>12060920
naive realism isn't too outlandish. Just lacking in imiganation and expoloration

>> No.12072139

>>12072118
What I meant by second sentence was: I have memory, I remember the past. But what makes me remember what I remember, if world is just continous and endless "now"? Why do I remember what I remember, and not something completely different? Where does it come from?

>> No.12072144

>>12072139
Ironically, >>12061271

>> No.12072201

>>12066559
>Infinite world's theory
HAHAHAH AHHA HA HA AH AHAHHAHAHAH AHHA OH NONO NO NO *breathes in* HAHAHHA OHOOHOHOHAHAOAHAOAHAHHA HAHA HAHA OAOOOOOO HAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH AHHAHAH AHH AHH AHHA OHNO I CAN'T HAHAHHAH

>> No.12072211

>>12072201
thers a world where you arent a pseud anon think of it that way

>> No.12072864

>>12072095
i am stuck typing send help