If you haven't read it from cover to cover, you don't belong here.

File: 42 KB, 323x500, 0141181265.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Fri Oct 1 06:59:23 2010 No.1172962 [Reply] [Original]

If you haven't read it from cover to cover, you don't belong here.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:00:23 2010 No.1172964 >>1172962 RIGHTEO. I'LL JUST LEAVE THEN, BECAUSE I HAVEN'T READ ONE PARTICULAR BOOK.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:00:23 2010 No.1172965 Reading and understanding are two entirely different things.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:02:23 2010 No.1172966 This is important. Mods, please sticky this thread.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:09:23 2010 No.1172969 The dick joke of academia.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:20:23 2010 No.1172972 riverrun, past Eve & Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay...

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:53:23 2010 No.1172988 sticky this shit

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 07:58:23 2010 No.1172992 James Joyce fanboys are some of the most annoying fucks I've ever had the displeasure of encountering. I refuse to read his work because I fear that it might magically transform me into an asshole somehow.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 08:11:23 2010 No.1173001 >>1172992 seems like its already too late...

Anonymous Fri Oct 1 08:25:23 2010 No.1173010

>>1172962

Your post should have read:

>you don't belong here. If you haven't read it from cover to cover,

Of course, you are completely correct, Anonymous, but the thing is, you also don't belong on this board unless you have read the complete works of Sappho in the original.

Shit sucks, I know, but you'll just ahve to deal with it.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 08:27:23 2010 No.1173012 >>1173010 *have

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 10:50:23 2010 No.1173109 File: 19 KB, 300x414, aip.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I belong! I belong! Wait, what do I get? [captcha: journal tradicat]

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 11:11:23 2010 No.1173123 I'm joyce- and sappho-complient. and unemployed.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 11:12:23 2010 No.1173127 File: 32 KB, 460x276, Eric-Morecambe-001.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1173109 A well-deserved round of applause. Now go read some more books.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 13:18:23 2010 No.1173312 Much-needed bump.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 13:20:23 2010 No.1173315 >>1172962 I am twelve and what is this?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 13:22:23 2010 No.1173318 >>1172962 OP, you should have written this in Joyce's style

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 1 13:30:23 2010 No.1173329 >>1173318 It really would have been an improvement, because then we wouldn't have understood what the fuck he meant.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 00:49:23 2010 No.1174600 the kite runner was god awful and would have never sold a single copy if it wasn't for 9/11...the terrorists won again

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 00:55:23 2010 No.1174609 yuh to this op.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 01:06:23 2010 No.1174617 File: 478 KB, 1064x1600, thom,thomeverywhere.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] BUT I'M A CREEEEPP

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 01:33:23 2010 No.1174649 File: 22 KB, 288x400, swish.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1173329 swish

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 02:29:23 2010 No.1174733 OP doesn't understand what he's read if in fact he even read it. No one who has actually read FW would ever say this b.s.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 02:35:23 2010 No.1174735 I just got this out from my library today, OP! I'm reading it once I get through The Castle and The Handmaid's Tale

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:22:23 2010 No.1175241 Agreed.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:41:23 2010 No.1175255 >>1172962 I read Dubliners and enjoyed the short stories, read Ulysses and thought what a dribble of wank. I wont read this because OP seems like a douche.

>>	The Sound and the Fury !!KlYr/MIPjaz Sat Oct 2 10:48:23 2010 No.1175262 >>1172962 This is the worst shit I have ever read.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:50:23 2010 No.1175263 >>1175255 this anon is a winner. captcha: homilisk letters, sounds like something joyce would've written

>>	The Sound and the Fury !!KlYr/MIPjaz Sat Oct 2 10:51:23 2010 No.1175264 >>1175255 I read all of Joyce's major works. Ulysses was decent, but I disliked it. FW is utter shit. Stephen Hero, Portrait, and Dubliners are great, great works of literature. Exiles is shit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:53:23 2010 No.1175270 File: 9 KB, 243x207, tossing.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >Finnegans Wake

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:57:23 2010 No.1175278

>>1172962

Motherfucking Finnegans Wake...
You can't attempt to assert intellectual superiority with this pile of shit, you just CAN'T.

Even die-hard Joyce scholars (real, educated professors who know wtf they're talking about, not some fuckstain on 4chan trying to look smart) have a hard time defending this incomprehensible literary nightmare.

Reading Finnegans Wake scores you exactly 0 imaginary literary points as, some 70-odd years later, literary critics still cannot reach a consensus on whether or not this book is even worth reading.

TL;DR version - Just in case you're someone who has not read much Joyce in the past, "Finnegans Wake" is the one to skip; all his other stuff is great but this one isn't worth the trouble.

>>	redcom !!+Kgteyi5ULQ Sat Oct 2 10:59:23 2010 No.1175281 Currently reading, and totally loving it. Even found some ancient 4chan references "an heroed" (I SHIT YOU NOT) and "to lol and lul".

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 10:59:23 2010 No.1175282 This thread is satire

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 11:04:23 2010 No.1175295 Finnigans wake is just the ramblings of a man suffering from a severe psychosis.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 11:08:23 2010 No.1175303 >>1175278 Harold Bloom seems to think it's the pinnacle of literature post-Shakespeare, who cares what anyone else says

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 15:47:23 2010 No.1175817 File: 32 KB, 200x315, 1000486187.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1175303

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 15:50:23 2010 No.1175822 File: 23 KB, 300x294, mom_scolds.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1175295 Don't you dare.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 15:55:23 2010 No.1175831 Literary masturbation. Worthless.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 15:56:23 2010 No.1175834 Wayyyy to deep for everyone here.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 15:58:05 2010 No.1175838 >>1175822 i would rail that mom so hard her uterus would explode from all the cum i'd pump in it.

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:02:23 2010 No.1175848

>>1175831
Masturbation is worthless now? I guess I'll stop doing it.

All literature is masturbation. And masturbation feels great - that's why we read. That's why this board exists. Masturbation is a wonderful gift. We should not be ashamed of it. Joyce is simply the most prolific, most skilled, most public masturbator of them all.

>>	err... Sat Oct 2 16:10:23 2010 No.1175868 aight, i'm out

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:13:23 2010 No.1175872
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look, joyce spent 17 years writing it. if he thought it was worth the effort to spend two decades conveying all of human history through the subconscious in his puzzlespeak, then it's worth it for you to spend two months.

that's how long I took. did i get it? no. what's it about? i don't know. but my brain has never been so fucking stoned; i've never loved prose so much; and i can literally not stop thinking about shem, shaun, izzy, alpy, hce, butt and taff, the porters, the 29 rainbow girls, abcd-mamalujo, Tristan and Isolde, night lessons, Jaun, Yaun, .... it goes aun and aun and aun.

I disagree with op's ultimatum but i really can't recommend FW enough to everyone on this board

[trying not to be a joyce-fag right now, even though some people will call you a pretentious fuck if you admit that you read ulysses.]
[joyce fag starts rambling - the puzzles are there on purpose to make it more fun and complex. most of the novel was written by the 1930s; and he spent a decade complicating the language and adding echoes and puzzles. some people will always think that's invalid in literature; i disagree.] [and the first drafts are super fucking complicated even before the dreamspeak.]
[call it masturbation if you wish, but seriously if you think writing a book like this is jerking yourself off for your own pleasure, what art isn't masturbation? what literature isn't? how is any human activity not masturbation? don't throw around dismissals with implications you don't comprehend]

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:13:23 2010 No.1175873

My love for you allows me to pray to the
spirit of eternal beauty and tenderness
mirrored in your eyes or to fling you down
under me on that soft belly of yours and fuck
you up behind, like a hog riding a sow,
glorying in the very stink and sweat that rises
from your arse, glorying in the open shame
of your upturned dress and white girlish
drawers and in the confusion of your
flushed cheeks and tangled hair.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:14:23 2010 No.1175876 James Joyce is the Thom Yorke of /lit/

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:15:23 2010 No.1175878 File: 279 KB, 1200x800, p05.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1175873 YES!

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:34:23 2010 No.1175903 >>1175878 sauce?

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:37:23 2010 No.1175906 File: 42 KB, 292x302, 1235216002352.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Philippe Sollers praising Finnegans Wake for about 10 minutes http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xd33ub_entretien-ph-sollers-partie-i_creation

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:42:23 2010 No.1175914 >>1175878 souce pls in so turned on

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:42:23 2010 No.1175915 File: 7 KB, 299x159, htf.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] YOU MOTHERFUCKER

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 16:46:23 2010 No.1175921 seriouslyguys.jpg

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 18:47:23 2010 No.1176207 >>1175915 I know what he meant. captcha: thaysage left

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 18:48:23 2010 No.1176210 >>1175914 I feel much the same way. Moar

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 18:55:23 2010 No.1176238

Okay, here's the irony. (Speaking as somebody who actually HAS read FW cover to cover, and can answer questions about it if anybody seriously has them.)

You seem to think that this book is an irrelevant troll? Well, consider this. One of the first proper scholars of FW (in America) was Joseph Campbell, whose "Skeleton Key to Finnegans Wake" is still a decent intro. Joseph Campbell was fascinated by what he saw as the syncretic impulse towards all world mythologies in the book. That later moved him to write stuff which is basically an anthropological approach to the same thing that Joyce was doing: books like "Hero with a Thousand Faces" and "The Power of Myth". Which ended up inspiring stuff like "Star Wars", and nowadays, pretty much everybody in Hollywood has internalized the whole "Joseph Campbell" thing, so that it continues to be a profound influence on any big budget film that gets made.

In short, "Finnegans Wake" inadvertently led to George Lucas. So you can hardly call it uninfluential or unimportant or a massive troll.

Yes, it's hard to read, but that doesn't mean it's meaningless or a troll. But if you think it's a troll, fine. You're in good company. Oliver St-John Gogarty called it the most colossal leg-pull in literary history, and Ezra Pound said---of the style in which it is written---that "nothing short of divine vision or a new cure for the clapp can possibly be worth all that circumambient peripherization." So plenty of other people think he was trolling: I happen to think he was trying to do something new, and he actually did it. Do I want to spend my life studying the book to get out of it everything he put in? No. But I was willing to read it carefully and with interest, because it's actually fairly amusing.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 18:57:23 2010 No.1176245 How is it any more original than Jabberwocky?

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:04:23 2010 No.1176265

>>1176245

Jabberwocky is, properly speaking, nonsense writing. Carroll's "portmanteau word" coinages there aren't really up to anything that you're meant to interpret, and Humpty-Dumpty's willingness to unpack them as "portmanteaus" is meant to be a commentary on the futility of meaning.

Whereas Joyce is quite deliberately writing in a kind of allusive patois where the multiple meanings are intentional, and are meant to point at something larger: a theory of history, language, culture, largely derived from Vico, but it's a sort of poetic expression of the eternal recurrence of all themes / motifs / narratives.

In other words: when Carroll talks about a "vorpal" sword, it's just a cool-sounding word for a sword that sounds like it could be Anglo-Saxon. When Joyce names his hero Earwicker, he's totally aware that the French word for Earwig is "perce-oreille" and that this sounds like the Irish names "Pearse" and "O'Reilly" and....oh seriously you can keep going with it. But it does have a purpose and he is up to something by doing it. It's NOT just nonsense like Carroll or Edward Lear.

>>	STLFag !IeX.oK0HUk Sat Oct 2 19:09:23 2010 No.1176285 >>1176265 >Patois I love this anon.

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:12:23 2010 No.1176292

>>1176245
Jabberwocky isn't meant to actually mean anything. It's nonsense for the sake of nonsense.

Finnegans Wake is meant to condense all of human history, all human language, all jokes and stories and products, into one book. According to Joyce, the Wake has everything needed to reconstruct a new universe should ours be destroyed.

Lewis Carroll was just trying to entertain some little girls with a funny poem.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:13:23 2010 No.1176296 >>1176292 No need to undermine Carroll, his works have merit as well.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:26:23 2010 No.1176332 >>1176292 Sounds incredibly pretentious

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:28:23 2010 No.1176335 File: 47 KB, 400x666, Finnegans-wake.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Should I read the French translation or try with the original text?

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:31:23 2010 No.1176351 >>1176335 The Japanese translation is pretty cool, too.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:32:23 2010 No.1176356 >>1176351 I don't speak Japanese

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:42:23 2010 No.1176372

>>1176335
English for sure. All the puns are multilingual and incredibly dense. There's a link somewhere where a Japanese to English translator was given a chunk of the Japanese Finnegans Wake translation, but wasn't told that it was Joyce. They posted his resultant translation online. It's hilarious, and hilariously bad.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:44:23 2010 No.1176376 >>1176372 It seems like a difficult text; last time I was at the bookstore I gave a look at the first few pages and it seemed pretty faithful to the original text and even had a shitton of footnotes

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:49:23 2010 No.1176379

>>1176376
The translator of the Wake into French is a really interesting guy. He discovered the book when he was a teenager and devoured it - reading and rereading constantly. His translation took about 20 years.

The problem with translating a book like this is that you can't translate what you don't see. There are so many puns under puns mixed with puns that no one person can possibly find them all. Reading a translation is reading a condensation. Every time the Wake is read it is different. Each translation cuts off a certain number of possibilities.

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:51:23 2010 No.1176388

English text:

>riverrun, past Eve and Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay, brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs.
>Sir Tristram, violer d'amores, fr'over the short sea, had passencore rearrived from North Armorica on this side the scraggy isthmus of Europe Minor to wielderfight his penisolate war: nor had topsawyer's rocks by the stream Oconee exaggerated themselse to Laurens County's gorgios while they went doublin their mumper all the time: nor avoice from afire bellowsed mishe mishe to tauftauf thuartpeatrick: not yet, though venissoon after, had a kidscad buttended a bland old isaac: not yet, though all's fair in vanessy, were sosie sesthers wroth with twone nathandjoe. Rot a peck of pa's malt had Jhem or Shen brewed by arclight and rory end to the regginbrow was to be seen ringsome on the aquaface.
>The fall (bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnu
k!)

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:52:23 2010 No.1176390

French translation:

>erre-revie, pass’Evant notre Adame, d’erre rive en rêvière, nous recourante via Vico par chaise percée de recirculation vers Howth Castle et Environs.
>Sire Tristram, violeur d’amoeurs, manchissant la courte oisie, n’avait pâque buissé sa derrive d’Armorique du Nord sur ce flanc de notre isthme décharné d’Europe Mineure pour y resoutenir le combat d’un presqu’Yseul penny : ni près du fleuve Oconee les roches premières ne s’étaient exaltruées en splendide Georgi Dublin de Laurens Comptez en doublant ses membres tout le temps ! nulle voix humaine n’avait dessouflé son micmac pour bêptiser Patrick : pas encore, mais nous y venaisons bientôt, n’avait un jeune blanc-bec flibutté le blanc bouc d’Isaac : pas encore, bien que tout soit affoire en Vanité, les doubles sœurs ne s’étaient colère avec Joe Nathan. Onc mais n’avaient Jhem ni Shem brassé de becquée le malte paternel sous l’arcastre solaire et l’on voyait la queue rugissante d’un arc-en-cil encerner le quai de Ringsend.
>La chute (bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerroonntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurn
uk !)

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:53:23 2010 No.1176392 >>1176379 Translating is never an exact science; you have to make choices, that's why there are lots and lots of different translations for the same poems

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:53:23 2010 No.1176393 >>They posted his resultant translation online. It's hilarious, and hilariously bad. Is there a link to this? I'd love to see it

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:54:23 2010 No.1176394 Finnegan's wake, another boring and failed experiment in "literature" Jesus, imagine Joyce applied his vocabulary to writing some interesting fiction, like Dune.

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:55:23 2010 No.1176396

>>1176379
I don't agree; sometimes you have to replace a cultural reference into one that makes more sense for the foreign reader. Translators can actually 'create' or 'invent' things in their translations. You may very well get rid of an English joke that wouldn't work in French and replace it with a typical French joke

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:56:23 2010 No.1176397 >>1176394 >Finnegan's Wake It's 'Finnegans Wake', at least get the title right

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:56:23 2010 No.1176398 >>1176379 He was also a computer scientist, not a literature professor.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:56:23 2010 No.1176399 >>1176394 "Only faggots try to troll /lit/ with that shitty material." - Oscar Wilde

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:56:23 2010 No.1176400 >>1176394 >Genre fiction Get out.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:57:23 2010 No.1176401 >>1176398 Almost none of the best literature was produced by literature professors Céline and Keats were physicians

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:57:23 2010 No.1176402 >>1176393 http://www.mediamatic.net/page/5855/en

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:58:23 2010 No.1176404

I consider myself a pretty adept reader at this point in my life (I'm a year away from a phd in literary criticism); I have read this book five times—each time approaching it in a different way—and every time I have picked something new and unrecognized from the previous times. It is a difficult book, even if you aren't attempting to comprehend anything.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:58:23 2010 No.1176405 >>1176398 You should read CP Snow's (scientist, novelist and politican) 'The Two Cultures' about the need to familiarize yourself with scientific knowledge as well as humanities

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 19:58:23 2010 No.1176406

Here's a great example of how this works. The original has the phrase:

>>tauftauf thuartpeatrick

Whereas the French translation has:

>>son micmac pour bêptiser Patrick

But of course to get from the one to the other you have to know that "tauftauf" is German for "baptize, baptize"---Joyce doesn't use the English word---but he suggests it with the German and the word "thuartpeatrick", which has the Irish peasant pun "peat-rick" (peat being the fuel you use to keep warm when you live in an Irish bog, the rick being what you dry it on) but also a pun on Christ's "tu es Petrus"--"thou art Peter"---and a pun on the baptism of St Patrick, who of course legendarily converted the Irish pagans to Christianity.

Since you can't catch ALL of that in French, the translator opts for the word jingle of "micmac" / "Patrick". (The "micmac" toying with Joyce's "mishe mishe" earlier, which is both onomatopoeia and messing around with Gaelic words).

Anonymous Sat Oct 2 20:01:23 2010 No.1176409

>>1176406
Of course you can't catch all the references into French, that's not what can be reasonably expected from any literary translator

Anyway the important thing in Finnegans Wake is more about getting the rythm and the 'orality' of the text rather than the actual 'meaning' (if any) of each word

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 11:25:23 2010 No.1177784 "It’s about as close to LSD on the page as you can get."

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 11:27:23 2010 No.1177788 >brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation >nous recourante via Vico par chaise percée de recirculation hmm.... hmmm... hmmm...

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 11:39:54 2010 No.1177814 File: 627 KB, 1064x1600, 1285995969004.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1174617 The fuck? Is he a time traveler or does he have clones?

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 13:36:23 2010 No.1178099 >>1177784 there is actually a mention of LSD in the book

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 13:47:23 2010 No.1178124
File: 157 KB, 480x603, jj.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1178099
i know... i'm dying to know if joyce really tripped. he must have though.

here's one:
>Flunkey Footle furloughed foul, writing off his phoney, but Conte Carme makes the melody that mints the money. Ad majorem l.s.d! Divi gloriam. A darkener of the threshold. Haru?

here's the other
>First and Last Only True Account all about the Honorary Mirsu Earwicker, L.S.D.

well, but here in ulysses... is lsd possibly something else?
p. 145 my edition. second page of lestrygonians

>A housekeeper of one of those fellows if you could pick it out of her. Never pick it out of her. like getting L. s. d. out of him.

here's more
>There are many good literary studies of Joyce, but the best introduction to _Finnegans Wake_ is probably Dr. Stanislaus Grof's _Realms of the Human Unconscious_, a study of the head spaces experienced under LSD. In particular, Grof's term 'coex systems' should be understood by everybody who writes about Joyce or tries to read him. A 'coex system' is a condensed experience montage, E.G., you are reexperiencing the birth process, remembering prebirth interuterine events, reliving ancestral or archaelogical crises of people/animals from whom you are descended, seeing the subatomic energy whorl from which Form appears, previsioning the Superhumanity of the future, and suffering horrible guilt over your unkindness to another child when you were four years old... all at once!

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 14:00:23 2010 No.1178144 >>1178124 LSD wasn't synthesized until 1938. I doubt Joyce even knew of its existence when the book was published in '39.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 14:01:23 2010 No.1178147

>>1178124

L.S.D. was first synthesized in 1938, ulysses was published in 1922. finnegans wake was published in 1939, but joyce had published most of the fragments of the book in other places before that. joyce liked to make up words, LSD didn't exist yet at the time he wrote some of those fragments that you reproduced there. i'm sure he tried other drugs, though.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 14:04:23 2010 No.1178151

>>1178147
>>1178144
>>1178099
>>1178124

OH FOR GODSAKE PEOPLE. James Joyce never tripped on acid. "L s d" is the old abbreviation for British fucking currency: POUNDS SHILLINGS PENCE. (Or "Libra", Latin for pound; shilling; and "denarius" which was a Roman small-sum coin)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound_sterling

>Prior to decimalisation, the pound was divided into 20 shillings and each shilling into 12 pence, making 240 pence to the pound. The symbol for the shilling was "s."—not from the first letter of the word, but from the Latin solidus. The symbol for the penny was "d.", from the French denier[citation needed], from the Latin denarius (the solidus and denarius were Roman coins). A mixed sum of shillings and pence such as 3 shillings and 6 pence was written as "3/6" or "3s. 6d." and spoken as "three and six". 5 shillings was written as "5s." or, more commonly, "5/-". The stroke (/) indicating shillings is also known as a solidus, and was originally an adaptation of the long s which represented that word.

Lrn2numismatics

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 14:05:23 2010 No.1178152

Sorry here's the money quote (as it were):

The pound sign derives from the black-letter "L", an abbreviation of Librae in Roman £sd units (librae, solidi, denarii) used for pounds, shillings and pence in the British pre-decimal duodecimal currency system.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 14:07:23 2010 No.1178158

And for the record, the general scholarly consensus on the "trippiness" of the book is that his daughter Lucia was already slipping into advanced schizophrenia as Joyce wrote FW, and that its "dream language" is like a fantasy attempt to communicate with her.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 15:54:23 2010 No.1178504

>>1178158
>the general scholarly consensus
No, that's a bunch of horse shit. No reputable scholars who studied Joyce and Joyce's life really believe that he spent 20 years writing this as an attempt to communicate with his daughter.

In his journals and conversations with his friends he made it very clear why he was writing Finnegans Wake. His motives were obvious to everyone who knew him.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:01:23 2010 No.1178518 >>1178504 Whether or not that's correct, you talk like writing Professor Casaubon's "Key to All Mythologies" is somehow a better, worthier, or more noble reason for writing a book than a father trying to communicate with a daughter that he loves.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:07:23 2010 No.1178534

>>1178504

Okay, so "Lucia Joyce: To Dance in the Wake" is not a work of reputable scholarship? Or Gordon's "Finnegans Wake: A Plot Summary" which states: "The Original Sin of Finnegans Wake is the act of intercourse which produced Lucia Joyce"?

I think Fritz Senn counts by anybody's standard as a reputable Joyce scholar, and here's what he says (in an interview):

>Do you think that Lucia's madness affected Joyce's writing?
>It most likely did.
>Do you think Joyce had writer's block before, during or at all writing FW? If Joyce had writer's block, was it caused by Lucia's sickness?
>I can't tell. Obviously there were long periods when he did not work on the Wake, because of problems, eyes, Lucia, lack of inspiration, maybe writer's block. (This is not my area).
>Do you suppose Lucia could read FW? If so, do you think she could understand it better than others?
>No idea. If she had read it, or ever could, she might well have picked out meanings that are hidden from us.

I think it's sheer jackassery to suggest that 20 years' labor on a work of art has NO autobiographical component. He did select the date for Bloomsday to commemorate his first date (and handjob) with Nora Barnacle, didn't he?

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:08:23 2010 No.1178539

>>1178518
Spouting quasi-nonsense to a woman with schizophrenia is not a great way to relate to to her.

Aside from that, Joyce believed in cyclical time, as he learned from Vico. Nothing seemed too urgent to him after that. He knew he had spent plenty of time speaking with his daughter before and would have plenty of time to speak with her again.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:10:23 2010 No.1178547

>>1178539

Believing in Viconian cyclical time is NOT the same thing as believing in metempsychosis.

Are you suggesting Joyce believed in both? Despite his early enthusiasm for Giordano Bruno, I don't recall anything that suggests Joyce actually believed he was going to be reincarnated.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:15:23 2010 No.1178569

>>1178534
He says, write there in the excerpt, that Joyce's writing process during the Wake is "not [his] area." What are you trying to show?

Obviously his daughter's mind falling apart had a strong effect on him. I just don't think that her having schizophrenia led to him thinking, "Gee, if I smush together words from over forty languages and create puns from them, me and my daughter will be able to converse lucidly." What? How does that even follow?

Finnegans Wake is everyone's autobiography. He wrote it to tell every person's story, ever. It deals with every element of his life, and every element of your life, and my life, and Lucia's life, and Nora's and Rameses and Barack Obama's and Abraham Lincoln's and every other person who has ever lived. That's what he was aiming to do.

Of course you can look through it and find references to a sick daughter. You can find everything in the Wake. That's what makes it special, important, and one of the most important collections of words ever made into a book.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:19:23 2010 No.1178587

finnegans wake geats a bed raep briceuse it ettricks a lot of pseuds and surds, but I /b/lives that it pearfucktly verses the cumplots of a rousing nimber of unded hodcarriers like selfsame hodcurrier Tim Finnegan that simply don't fat into the grave, are dizzychanted with the (oy!) weh things are, and it gets their fucking oirish up.

We're given countdraculess raisins why our opunions are unvalid, besofore them all is all the state meant "you may be alive now, Tim, but when you wake up tomorrow you'll find yerself dead," but this book lividates the fooling that mare cumplacent hiberniation while gut for the gander is not the (sacer) anser.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:21:23 2010 No.1178592

>>1178547
It's not reincarnation. I think he believed in a world in which everything was a mishmash of all moments happening at once, like you read in the wake. He wasn't afraid of death or the changes that would come. He understood that he would be immortal, with his books or without them.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:26:23 2010 No.1178605

>>I think he believed in a world in which everything was a mishmash of all moments happening at once

Then why was Parnell's attempt to get Home Rule for Ireland such a pivotal experience for him? His first published work was a political poem (now lost) about the downfall of Parnell, entitled "Et Tu, Healy". And certainly Parnell is a major presence in Dubliners (Ivy Day), in Portrait (Parnell being the proof that Ireland is the old sow that eats her farrow), in Ulysses (where Parnell's brother is a character, and I suspect Parnell Himself is the man in the macintosh) and moreover in Finnegans Wake.

I don't see how Joyce could actually *believe* in this kind of Philip K Dick quasi-eternal-recurrence stuff, and ALSO have had profound opinions about Ireland, the Irish, and the Brutish Vempire which oppressed it them and himself for 800 long years.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:39:23 2010 No.1178634

>>1178605
Parnell was dead before Joyce was 10 years old. Joyce was an Irishman who spent the majority of his life outside of Ireland - once he started writing did he ever even return once?

He grew up hearing about and experiencing the struggle between Ireland and the British. The Irish-language movement was strong and vehement when he was young. The archetype of the oppressor and oppressed were important to him. Besides, there's no reason he can't have a strong identity.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:53:23 2010 No.1178665

FW begins in a sentence fragment and ends in a sentence fragment which, if joined together (the end to the beginning) makes the following sentence:

"A way a lone a last a loved a long the riverrun, past Eve and Adam's from swerve of shore to bend of bay, brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs."

That makes many different kinds of sense to me all at once. If the stream of consciousness of a man asleep ('Finn is again awake' is how I usually get the title) were to manifest a concrete object in this reality, I think this book would look a lot like it.

I have purposely avoided the skeleton key until I hit fifty (long way to go) so I can continue to enjoy making up what it means but one thing I am sure of:

This book is one big infinite loop. It can be read anyway you like it except upside down.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 16:56:23 2010 No.1178675 Line from FW selected at random: ---Which moral turpitude would you select of the two, for choice, if you had your way? Playing bull before shebears or the hindlegs off a clotheshorse? If that's not /b/ I don't know what is.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 17:00:23 2010 No.1178683 >>1178675 That's a shockingly lucid sentence. You got lucky with that one. Keep searching through the book and prepare for a mindgasm.

>>	syd !.BaRRetTCM Sun Oct 3 17:06:23 2010 No.1178695 File: 486 KB, 900x696, fw.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 17:09:23 2010 No.1178700 >>1172962 i've read it from cover to cover, but i went along the outsides

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 17:09:23 2010 No.1178701
File: 53 KB, 531x591, grom10.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1178675

That's p. 522 in my edition.

As for mindgasms, I read daily, early and often. This is the only book makes me physically dizzy. Love it or hate it but Joyce built something wonderful and fun so long as it isn't taken too seriously.

If English words were lego bricks, FW would be Legoland.

pic unrelated

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 17:11:23 2010 No.1178703

>>Parnell was dead before Joyce was 10 years old.

Yes. Nonetheless Joyce's first published work--at the age of 9--was a poem about the fall of Parnell.

http://www.bookride.com/2007/03/et-tu-healy-james-joyce-1891.html

>>Joyce was an Irishman who spent the majority of his life outside of Ireland - once he started writing did he ever even return once?

Well yes, when he went back for visits in 1909 and 1912. But most people think of exile as being a deliberate choice that says more about where one is leaving, by choice, than where one ends up living. There's a reason we don't consider Joyce alongside Robert Musil as a "novelist of the late Austro-Hungarian Empire", despite the fact that he lived in Trieste.

>>He grew up hearing about and experiencing the struggle between Ireland and the British.

And also writing about it, I daresay.

>>The Irish-language movement was strong and vehement when he was young.

Yes, and Joyce took Gaelic lessons for 2 years from Padriac Pearse himself, who would later start the 1916 Easter Rebellion against the British. And while Joyce didn't like Pearse much, I think it's pretty obvious to everybody that the constant iterations of "Pearsse O'Reilly" in FW is, in part, a reference to Pearse.

I'm just saying.....just because Joyce was a great genius and all that doesn't mean that his work ignored real-world concerns and didn't have any political content.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 17:28:23 2010 No.1178733 >>1178703 >And also writing about it, I daresay. How dare you?!

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 18:35:23 2010 No.1178915

>This is the only book makes me physically dizzy. Love it or hate it but Joyce built something wonderful and fun so long as it isn't taken too seriously.

I got halfway through the first page and was so physically dizzy/enraged that I nearly threw it against the wall.

FYI, congratulations /lit/, this thread is the only fucking reason I'm going back and finishing it. I just want to see what the hell it is you all are fapping over.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:17:23 2010 No.1179019 >>1178701 lol @ "in your edition"... all copies of FW have identical pagination.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:20:23 2010 No.1179025

Joyce references good old Parnell quite a few times in FW.

But I think its the broader story of Parnell that struck Joyce. It's truly tragic -- Ireland's potential leader, betrayed by the church, the clergy's sadistic pleasure in stamping out freedom in their own country... The specific politics of the year or the day or home rule are irrelevant to Joyce.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:24:23 2010 No.1179035 >>1179025 Dubliners' Ivy Day in the Committee Room ended with a poem for Parnell. I had no idea why. Was it all about how much Joyce loved Parnell's story?

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:25:23 2010 No.1179037

>>1178915

awesome. that's all i want anyone to do, is pick it up and read it. for me, the hardest part was finishing chapter 1 -- 30 pages -- and then i couldn't stop. readers of FW are called by Roland McHugh "exegetes," because while a full exegesis of the text is impossible, the active reader confronting the text will extract and create meanings. every person who reads it sees different things.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:38:23 2010 No.1179073
File: 30 KB, 1043x261, lucias.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>pic: 3yo->6yo->11yo->17yo->19yo->19yo

there are letters by lucia that sound as though she is an author of the text. discussing the mookse and the gripes, speaking more intelligibly than her father. i've even heard that after he was dead she told doctors she was still working on FW.

The mystery of HCE's fall is theorized by some to be Lucia seeing joyce's erect penis for the first time, at age one. Reference in notebooks:

Dec 1922 notebook VI.B.10 p80 "incest made crime 1908"

whatever the hell that means (b. 1907 d. 1982 after being in a hospital for 40 years.

you all also know the theories that joyce raped her? some feminist idiots have also suggested that giorgio and sam beckett both raped her too, in some sort of roiling sexual abuse arrangement, and that they all conspired to institutionalize her and keep it all a secret. the evidence for this: destruction of lucia's correspondence. we don't know what it said; but joyce in one of his own letters said that her letters were the most important he ever received.

apparently lucia spent a lot of time with joyce working, as well. but really, i think the story gets over-hyped and treated as more tragic than it is. the children both grew up under fw. Giorgio only wanted his father's love, so tried to be him, but he could never be as loved as much as JJ loved his work, and so turned to drink and a stupid wife. Lucia understood this better and she tried to join JJ in his work, worshipping FW as well, but then she went bonkers. sigh... typing too much

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:43:23 2010 No.1179086

>>1179025
>>1179035

I think the downfall of Parnell was so crucial for Joyce because it illustrated exactly what he thought about Ireland, "the old sow that eats her farrow". The best quote about Parnell is from Joyce's really savage satiric poem "Gas from a Burner", where he says:

'Twas Irish humour, wet and dry,
Flung quicklime into Parnell's eye.
O Ireland! My first and only love,
Where Christ and Caesar are hand in glove!

In other words, the combination of Roman Catholic religious (and sexual) hypocrisy and British Imperial hypocrisy were perfectly combined in the destruction of Parnell.

Anonymous Sun Oct 3 19:48:23 2010 No.1179101

>>1179073

I didn't know she claimed to be continuing work on Finnegans Wake! That's fascinating. Also, I'd never heard the theory that Joyce raped Lucia, which sounds like the most ghoulish kind of excesses of pseudo-feminist criticism, and strikes me as really unlikely. If he raped her, why would he then bring her to CJ Jung for psychological help? Unless you think that Jung's association with Freud means that there was a vast global conspiracy to cover up child abuse (which, to be fair, is what a fair number of pseudo-feminists were actually saying in the 80s and 90s).

I know Ellmann talks about how Joyce tried to pressure Beckett into marrying Lucia, which must have been unbelievably awkward, but also sort of understandable.

The whole situation was tragic, really, which is why I always reckoned the sort of mad laughter of Finnegans Wake clearly had something to do with Lucia sliding deeper into schizophrenia.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 04:15:23 2010 No.1180263 >>1179073 I know aout the farts thing but I don't think Joyce is quite THAT creepy

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:04:23 2010 No.1180562 >>1179019 My bad, I thought, given the torturous publishing history of FW, someone might have a copy that differed from mine, I guess the one "including all the author's corrections" is the one most available now.

Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:08:23 2010 No.1180568

>>1179073

The awful thing is, I believe you. It makes perfect sense that militant feminists would accuse Joyce of rape, in the same way as any man who achieves something is somehow adjudged to be oppressing any woman he knows who hasn't done anything on the same scale.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:11:23 2010 No.1180571 >>1176238 But Star Wars is a worse crime than the Holocaust. I love Joyce and you've actually made me feel worse about the Wake.

Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:20:23 2010 No.1180582

>>1180571
>But Star Wars is a worse crime than the Holocaust.

jesus fucking christ, dude. just... you are a fucking disgusting example of a human being. you're so devoted to your little nerd superiority that you're going to compare shit to the fucking holocaust (even in jest)? have you no human decency?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:23:23 2010 No.1180586 >>1180582 There we go, populist piece-of-shit detected. Don't thank me, /lit/, thank nature. I have a resolute sense of human decency, and that's why I call evil what it is.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:25:23 2010 No.1180589 >>1180582 Star Wars caused the election of Reagan and the Gulf War, so he may have a point.

The Sound and the Fury !!KlYr/MIPjaz Mon Oct 4 11:29:23 2010 No.1180593

Again, I read it from cover to cover. I think it's the worse piece of shit that was classified as literature. That hasn't changed even with the interlingual puns I got and the Japanese allusions. I finished it, so that I could raise my middle finger at 'academics' who think it's the greatest novel ever.

Even my professors agreed Joyce was on the brink of madness, and they didn't finish the work. I did, just to prove to myself that this crap is irredeemably worse than just shit. It's that sticky, smelly turd you just can't remove from your shoes even after rubbing it on the pavement and washing it with water. It's just that fucking bad. Ugh.

The Sound and the Fury !!KlYr/MIPjaz Mon Oct 4 11:30:23 2010 No.1180598

>>1180593
And don't give me stuff about you don't appreciate Joyce. I disliked Ulysses, but that was OK. Dubliners, Portrait and Stephen Hero were great works of literature, but FW was just one long mental wanking by a man flirting with insanity.

Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:31:23 2010 No.1180600

>>1180586
I am not even defending Star Wars at this point. No piece of popular literature is dire enough to be compared to the Holocaust. That statement is absurd, and lacks all sense of human decency or proportion. No matter how devoted you are to some ideal of elitism or art or pissing nerds off, there's a fucking line.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:31:23 2010 No.1180601 >>1180593 But tripfaggotry is a worse crime than the Holocaust.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:33:23 2010 No.1180604 >>1180600 As a Star Wars fan, you forfeit the right to comment on questions of human decency.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:33:23 2010 No.1180606 >>1180600 Obvious Jew. Needs to chill out.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:33:23 2010 No.1180607 >>1180593 Chill I think FW is shit, too. Don't worry, most people do.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:34:23 2010 No.1180608 File: 146 KB, 834x677, Egg Fu.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1180606

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:34:23 2010 No.1180610 >>1180606 majority of people killed in the holocaust were not jews (it is the worst event in human history, with the exception of maybe the stalinist purges) (pee pee doo doo)

>>	The Sound and the Fury !!KlYr/MIPjaz Mon Oct 4 11:35:23 2010 No.1180613 >>1180601 I wasn't comparing it to the Holocaust. But hey ...

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:35:23 2010 No.1180615 >>1180613 What? It's an in-joke.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:37:23 2010 No.1180618 >>1180610 Don't tell the Star Wars fan, he'll stop pretending to give a fuck.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:37:23 2010 No.1180619 >>1180618 what are you i don't even that was the guy you're calling a star wars fan. it was the same guy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:39:23 2010 No.1180623 >>1180619 How do you know? Is it because it was you? If so, why are you writing like it wasn't?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:42:05 2010 No.1180629 File: 7 KB, 274x184, 2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1180619 >>1180618 >mfw when someone makes fun of Star Wars on 4chan.

Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:42:23 2010 No.1180630

FW is not intended seriously, Joyce himself said once he was trying to destroy the English language. FW is unreadable in any conventional sense, early on, I found myself looking at the words rather than reading them. Every writer I know has written highly personal, highly pretentious anti-nonsense with references so gnomic as to be inscrutable to anyone else. All of us have the sense to keep that stuff to ourselves. That said, I'm glad Joyce didn't. He drew a line in the literary sand saying "this is what I got away with, can you get away with more?"

If Joyce tried to publish FW today, who here thinks he'd have succeeded?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:42:23 2010 No.1180632 Star Wars is better than the Holocaust, not worse. The Holocaust is mostly black-and-white. Sucks ass.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:44:23 2010 No.1180635 >>1180610 I'm aware most victims of 'the' 'H'olocaust were not Jews, but Jews are the ones most apt to get bent out of shape about it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:44:23 2010 No.1180636 >>1180632 Start a new thread, let's keep this on topic.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:45:05 2010 No.1180640 File: 4 KB, 210x168, 1277704217105.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1180629 > mfw 6 million

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:47:23 2010 No.1180645 >>1180630 YOU'RE MEANT TO READ IT IN AN UNCONVENTIONAL SENSE YOU PIECE OF FUCKING SHIT! GOD, GOOOOOOOOD THESE FUCKING IDIOTS!! Yes, it would be published today, because it was never published by a commercial house to begin with.

Anonymous Mon Oct 4 11:52:23 2010 No.1180656

>>1180635

the lesson we're taking from all this is we want nukes
o rly?
yeah.
hey guise, we're gypsies we want land and nukes too.
shut the fuck up gypsies you don't own banks no-one gives a shit about you.
hey guise, we're queers we'd like no more persecution.
oh hey faggots, we hate you more than hitler did, have more beatings and imprisonments. also we'll give you tits with hormone injections because... well, we'll think of a reason.
hey guise I'm a communist, glad you got here.
yeah we'll fucken execute you communist, we hate you worse than hitler.
hey guise what about those sandniggers in palestine already?
who gives a fuck, they ain't got nukes. we're too legit to quit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:00:23 2010 No.1180674 >>1180656 >wtf am I reading?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:00:23 2010 No.1180675 is waking day over?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:02:23 2010 No.1180679 >>1180674 a short dramatization of an imagined 1945 conversation

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:10:23 2010 No.1180704 File: 17 KB, 537x513, forevershalom.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:12:23 2010 No.1180708 >>1180674 It's 4chan jargon that will be incredibly stupid and hard to understand in half a century, and therefore be considered a masterpiece of deep insight into language

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:12:23 2010 No.1180710 >>1180679 Wat.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:18:23 2010 No.1180726 OP here, Star Wars is gay

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:24:23 2010 No.1180752 >>1180635 Yeah, Jews should treat it like a competition, and just hit the showers. Losers. Russians win! Yay!

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:25:23 2010 No.1180756 >>1180610 >>1180656 >>1180679 >>1180752 Samefag of epic proportions.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 4 12:34:23 2010 No.1180780 >>1180756 No, I wrote the weird uncapitalized text, and I wasn't 'I think you'll find' guy.

Anonymous Tue Oct 5 00:12:23 2010 No.1182162

finnegans wake geats a bed raep briceuse it ettricks a lot of pseuds and surds, but I /b/lives that it pearfucktly verses the cumplots of a rousing nimber of unded hodcarriers like selfsame hodcurrier Tim Finnegan that simply don't fat into the grave, are dizzychanted with the (oy!) weh things are, and it gets their fucking oirish up.

We're given countdraculess raisins why our opunions are unvalid, besofore them all is all the state meant "you may be alive now, Tim, but when you wake up tomorrow you'll find yerself dead," but this book lividates the fooling that mare cumplacent hiberniation while gut for the gander is not the (sacer) anser.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 5 03:50:23 2010 No.1182403 >>1182162 you already posted that dude, and it isn't any funnier know than it was before

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 5 05:51:23 2010 No.1182505 >>1182403 >you already posted that dude, and it isn't any funnier know than it was before I no it isn't. So why did you bump it?

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 5 06:12:23 2010 No.1182531 >>1182505 Because it's MY thread, and I can BUMP it whenever I WANT.

Anonymous Tue Oct 5 15:59:23 2010 No.1183246

>>1180645

I agree with you Caps Man. I'm the shit that said it isn't meant to be read in a conventional sense, I believed the implicaton that it IS meant to be read in an unconventional sense was clear. I hope it is now. For the record, I enjoy FW and have for years.

p.s. Today, I claim even a small press would be wary of publishing something as expensive to produce as FW. Who knows? Maybe it would get published today. If not, I wish I lived in a world where it might.

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/lit/ - Literature