Anti-Oedipus Reading Group

[Anonymous No.11708597]

This is the reading group for Deleuze and Guattari's Anti-Oedipus: Capitalism and Schizophrenia. It will be going on from now until mid November. We will be going through page per page and expressing our opinions on it.


We are at Foucault's Preface. The reading pace will be decided rhizomatically and happen real time.

Link to the book:
https://libcom.org/files/Anti-Oedipus.pdf
http://b-ok.xyz/book/768020/802fa1

[Anonymous No.11708607]

>not even done with the preface

So this is the power of /lit/....

[Anonymous No.11708611]

>>11708607
To page 10

[Anonymous No.11708639]

>>11708607
It's a difficult book.

[Anonymous No.11708660]

This is page 1.

[Anonymous No.11708836]

>>11708660
Freud btfo

[Anonymous No.11708970]

Has someone finally (please) made a flowchart of texts to read before this?

[Anonymous No.11709766]

I'm not in the group but this channel might be helpful

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3rYa6vJ4KonU2O01liymQ

[Anonymous No.11709770]

>>11708970
Just read it dude. We are already on page 4

[Anonymous No.11709787]

Will Schizochan be joining us?

[Anonymous No.11709985]

Is there an epub that can be read on an ereader?

[Anonymous No.11710074]

>>11708970
if you download the pdf and go to the last page you can see every person referenced in the book. The ones most referenced are marx, nietzsche, freud and lacan. That gives you an idea both of what to read and of how gigantic that list would be

>>11709985
in b-ok.org there are 3 pdfs available, two are shite, there is one that is good (pictured), download it and convert to .mobi or .epub and you're set

[Anonymous No.11710083]

>>11709787
Yo can we not harass the girl with actual schizophrenia like I feel that's a little too far

[Anonymous No.11711236]

>>11708597
Every time one of these pops up, I have to note that A-O and ATP are not books you want to read in a group. They are more books that you slowly burn through, researching everything that they mention. Comparing notes is cool, but having any forced pace or structure to reading A-O is completely antithetical to the book itself.

[Anonymous No.11711244]

>>11708970
Seconding this. Need for a Deleuze chart on here is great sense he has become part of the meme canon.

[Anonymous No.11711252]

>>11708597
I'm amused by how much Henry Miller is referenced.

[Anonymous No.11711255]

>>11710083
I'm gonna send her a death threat now just out of spite.

[Anonymous No.11711271]

>>11708597
Having never read D&G before, the first 15 pages of this basically come across as William Burroughs-cum-Henry Miller novel. I mean, I enjoy both those authors, but this isn't really what I expected from "philosophy". By that I mean, I'm already having doubts that this offers anything more substantial than the slipstream literary insights of fiction authors from that time.

[Anonymous No.11711467]

>>11708597
Just skip the preface discussion, we're not here to read Foucault. I need a smartfag to explain to me why he is talking so much about production in section 1 and why the schizophrenics are so relevant.

[Anonymous No.11711930]

>>11708597
Should I read the book before reading the manga, before watching the anime?

[Anonymous No.11712426]

>>11711236
>They are more books that you slowly burn through
this is the second thread, the first one lasted for days, and they are still on the 5 pages preface. Can't get slower than that

[Anonymous No.11712475]

>>11711930
Just so you know, the official anime adaptation of AO is Lain

[Anonymous No.11712607]

>>11708970
>>11711244
Freud - The Interpretation of Dreams
Marxist terminology
Wikipedia - Oedipus Complex

[Anonymous No.11713197]

>>11711930
Wait is this image also Lain?
>>11712607
Thanks for at least giving people an idea of what a Deleuze chart might look like.

[Anonymous No.11713213]

>>11713197
No, that image is not Lain.

[Anonymous No.11713530]

>>11713213
Then what is it from?

[Anonymous No.11714072]

>>11708970
be familiar with: Spinoza, Kant, Marx, Neech, Freud, Lacan, Bataille, Artaud; you should manage

[Anonymous No.11714094]

>In their account of capitalism, surely the most impressive since Marx's, Deleuze and Guattari describe capitalism as a kind of dark potentiality which haunted all previous social systems. Capital, they argue, is the 'unnamable Thing', the abomination, which primitive and feudal societies 'warded off in advance'. When it actually arrives, capitalism brings with it a massive desacralization of culture. It is a system which is no longer governed by any transcendent Law; on the contrary, it dismantles all such codes, only to re-install them on an ad hoc basis. The limits of capitalism are not fixed by fiat, but defined (and redefined) pragmatically and improvisationally. This makes capitalism very much like the Thing in John Carpenter's film of the same name: a monstrous, infinitely plastic entity, capable of metabolizing and absorbing anything with which it comes into contact. Capital, Deleuze and Guattari says, is a 'motley painting of everything that ever was'; a strange hybrid of the ultra-modern and the archaic. In the years since Deleuze and Guattari wrote the two volumes of their Capitalism And Schizophrenia, it has seemed as if the deterritorializing impulses of capitalism have been confined to finance, leaving culture presided over by the forces of reterritorialization.

[Anonymous No.11714177]

>>11714094
literally right about everything

[Anonymous No.11714254]

>>11713530
Ghost in the Shell

[Anonymous No.11714309]

>>11708970
Capitalism and Schizophrenia is supposed to be the best entry point according to Deleze himself. I suppose What is Philosophy? might be a little easier so try that too (Also by G as well). Feel free to read Capitalism and Schizophrenia in any order. Flip through randomly. Do bibliomancy. Look for chapters that appeal. Read and re-read. The concluding chapters are where some people even start.

For secondary literature, you might check out Brian Massumi's A User's Guide to Capitalism and Schizophrenia. He wrote the English translation of A Thousand Plateaus so it's a good start.

If you want to go deep into Deleuze I would suggest reading his books on the history of philosophy:
>Empiricism and Subjectivity
>Kant's Critical Philosophy
>Nietzsche and Philosophy
>Spinoza: Practical Philosophy
>Bergsonism
>The Fold

Then you might wish to view his philosophical magna opera:
>Difference and Repetition
AND:
>Logic of Sense


He also has some books on literature and film but I have not read them.

[Anonymous No.11714320]

>>11714094
based Fisher

[Anonymous No.11714331]

...Anonymous
08/30/18(Thu)13:47:46 No.11708145
Me and Nick land are among the few individuals to fully understand the implications of Deleuzean thought and achieve the BwO. It is no coincidence that we both went insane soon after. Six visits to the psych ward later after deterritorializing myself with hardcore psychedelics, I have now returned to the fold of Platonism. The ethics of difference, it would seem, end only in a padded cell or a coffin. For my mother's sake, I now adhere to virtue ethics. Kinda miss fucking bipolar scene sluts but then again that's probably how I ended up with HIV. I only hope my future wife can forgive me my immature philosophical infatuation.

[Anonymous No.11714333]

>>11714094
Does anyone have the suicide note that he posted on his blog? Can't find it anywhere.

[Anonymous No.11714334]

Anonymous 08/31/18(Fri)14:14:18 No.11714331

...Anonymous
08/30/18(Thu)13:47:46 No.11708145
Me and Nick land are among the few individuals to fully understand the implications of Deleuzean thought and achieve the BwO. It is no coincidence that we both went insane soon after. Six visits to the psych ward later after deterritorializing myself with hardcore psychedelics, I have now returned to the fold of Platonism. The ethics of difference, it would seem, end only in a padded cell or a coffin. For my mother's sake, I now adhere to virtue ethics. Kinda miss fucking bipolar scene sluts but then again that's probably how I ended up with HIV. I only hope my future wife can forgive me my immature philosophical infatuation.

[Anonymous No.11714345]

>>11708597
>>11711244
Read up on RD Laing and the antipsychiatry movement of the 60s and 70s. Laing's booklet on The Politics of Experience is quoted from extensively in Chapter 2. psychosis as a transformative experience. The divided self is another short work of his this time dealing with schizoid and schizophrenic symptoms.
http://centrebombe.org/Ronald.D.Laing-The.Divided.Self.(1960).pdf

For a contrasting, or maybe complementary, perspective, check out the works of Christopher Lasch, he was a psychoanalytically oriented cultural critic on the mold of the frankfurt school who focused on the destructive aspects of the 'culture of narcissism' that resulted from the breakdown of 19th century values and familialism.

Adam Curtis' documentary the century of the self deals with the political history of psychoanalysis, from Freud and Bernays to the neoliberal recuperation of antipsychiatric ideas( D&G aren't in the film, neither is Lasch, but RD Laing and Ms. Thatcher do make an appearance, though)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJ3RzGoQC4s

Norman O. Brown's Life Against Death on the Psychoanalytical meaning of History, foreword is by Lasch.
http://anarchiveforemotions.com/files/DisOrder_uploads/texts_pdf/Norman%20O%20%20Brown-Life%20Against%20Death_%20The%20Psychoanalytical%20Meaning%20of%20History-Wesleyan%20(1985).pdf

[Anonymous No.11714394]

>>11714333
Nah m8, me too but I'm not sure it exists anymore

[Anonymous No.11714437]

>>11714345
http://thezeitgeistmovement.se/files/Lasch_Christopher_The_Culture_of_Narcissism.pdf

[Anonymous No.11714689]

So why do they refer to things as machines, desiring machines, productions of production?

[Anonymous No.11714732]

>>11714689
because everything facilitates and inhibits flows of desire; machines are those things which facilitate and inhibit flows.

[Anonymous No.11714734]

>>11714689
it was cool back then

[Anonymous No.11714752]

>>11714689
Deleuze and Guattari's notion of the unconscious is explicitly radical and political. Their goal was to produce revolutionary change through an enhancement of the unconscious' creative potentialities, a refusal to contain these creative energies within either Freud's oedipus complex(what you really want is to fuck your mother and kill your father) or orthodox marxist teleology. In France, radical politics and avant garde art go a long way back. From Dada to Breton's surrealist international, to the lettrists and situationists, the dissident leftists and utopians of the Front Populaire 30s, writers such as Bataille and Benjamin. Lacan, too, was involved with the surrealists at some point, his concept of the unconscious as social proved influential with D&G as did Jung's.

[Anonymous No.11714778]

>>11714752
Acephale, 1935

[Anonymous No.11714814]

>>11714752
That was also the objective of the Frankfurt School, the use of weaponized freudian psychology in order to collapse the western socio-religio superstructure.

[Anonymous No.11715831]

bump

[Anonymous No.11716039]

>>11714814
truth be told, Edward Bernays and Madison Ave were the ones who really excelled when it came to weaponizing freudian psychology and collapsing the western socio-religious superstructure. rightists typically assume its a question of the alien interloper subverting an otherwise harmonious 'natural' unity, when it is really capital itself that acts as the universal solvent, decoding all flows.

[Anonymous No.11717310]

Who's made it to page 10? I feel like a fictional character.

[Anonymous No.11718884]

Don't let the thread die again, faggots.

[Anonymous No.11720438]

>>11718884
Yes sir!

[Anonymous No.11720456]

Page 2

This is tripping me out.

[Anonymous No.11720469]

>>11718884
Calling people faggots is fascist, bro

[Anonymous No.11720671]

What am I even reading?

[Anonymous No.11720678]

What page should we have read to by now?

[Anonymous No.11720698]

>>11720469
whats wrong with fascism?

[Anonymous No.11720710]

>>11720698
Muh sixty gorillion

[Anonymous No.11721482]

>>11720698
Nothing. But Germany and it's autistic manchild of a "leader" made it taboo

[Anonymous No.11721838]

>>11720698
Read the book to find out

[Anonymous No.11721925]

So, in the first section, are they trying to say that desire is a sort of fuel that we have to supply to the "machines" that compose us?
I've been thinking about this myself. The way sex is never as good as to warrant the ridiculous obsession we have with it. It is not sex itself that makes humanity go forward, but the desire thereof. So maybe this extends to everything else that we do, so that desire itself is what gives us the energy to do what we are doing.

[Anonymous No.11722036]

>>11714094
i wish he was still here with us

[Anonymous No.11722052]

>>11714333
if you find it post it here please, anon

[Anonymous No.11722758]

Don't forget the sunbeams iirc

[Anonymous No.11723903]

>>11720698
Nothing

[Anonymous No.11724942]

>>11723903
Leave

[Anonymous No.11725117]

>>11708660
>it breathes, it heats, it eats. it shits and fucks
stop reading here

[Anonymous No.11725672]

>>11725117
Ok Grandpa.

[Anonymous No.11725739]

>>11721925
machines aren't only what makes us up though. we attach ourselves to all sorts of machines, when you take a stroll in the mountains you attach yourself to an alpine-machine. the real question is, where do desiring-machines exist? do they only exist in the human?

[Anonymous No.11725896]

[Anonymous No.11726011]

>>11708660
what's so bad about this

[Anonymous No.11726035]

>>11714331
>>11714334
makes you ponder

[Anonymous No.11726444]

The introduction seemed masturbatory and politicized

[Anonymous No.11726516]

>>11726444
what else were you expecting? the whole book is about jerking off revolutionary desires.

[Anonymous No.11727360]

What page should we have read to by now?

[Anonymous No.11727389]

I want to take part
so we read and talk about it here?

[Anonymous No.11727476]

Reading Introduction
What bothers me is the insistence on the schizophrenic as a central point of reference.
It is in contrast with the generalizing DSM term 'disorganized speech', 'disorganized behavior', ie. if a clinician calls a behavior disorganized, it doesn't really matter what its content and its associations are, as the patient will be prescribed antipsychotics and CBT in psychosis is a no no.

[Anonymous No.11727486]

Each week we read 30 pages

If you have any questions at all ask one of the high level Deleuzians in this thread.

[Anonymous No.11727532]

>>11727476
they don't give a fuck about the DSM dude

[Anonymous No.11727551]

>>11727532
I understand that. But I think DSM is not just big pharma being positivist.
I don't mean to be confrontational, I just have a lot of questions.
'A schizophrenic out for a walk is a better model than a neurotic lying on the
analyst's couch'. a model for what?
I think they presuppose that schizophrenia incidence coincides with the capitalist mode of production and society, which is not really obvious.