/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.11680674]

"Rage--Goddess, sing the rage of Peleus' son Achilles,
Murderous, doomed, that cost the Achaeans countless losses,
hurling down to the House of Death so many souls,
great fighters' souls. But made their bodies carrion,
feasts for dogs and birds,
and the will of Zeus was moving towards its end.
Begin, Muse, when the two first broke and clashed,
Agamemnon lord of men and brilliant Achilles."
-Translated by Robert Fagles, 1990

"Sing, O Goddess, the anger of Achilles, son of Peleus, that brought countless ills upon the Achaeans. Many a brave soul did it send hurrying down to Hades, and many a heroes did it yield a prey to dogs and vultures for so were the counsels of Zeus fulfilled from the day on which the son of Atreus, king of men, and great Achilles first fell out with one another."
-Translated by Samuel Butler, 1888

"Rage:
Sing, Goddess, Achilles' rage,
Black and murderous, that cost the Greeks
Incalculable pain pitched countless souls
Of heroes into Hades' dark,
And let their bodies rot as feasts
For dogs and birds, as Zeus' will was done.
Begin with the clash between Agamemnon--
The Greek Warlord--and godlike Achilles."
-Translated by Stanley Lombardo, 1997

"Anger be now your song, immortal one,
Akhilleus' anger, doomed and ruinous,
that caused the Akhaians loss on bitter loss
and crowded brave souls into the undergloom,
leaving so many dead men--carrion
for dogs and birds; and the will of Zeus was done.
Begin it when the two men first contending
broke with one another--
the Lord Marshal Agamémnon, Atreus' son, and Prince Akhilleus."
-Translated by Translated by Robert Fitzgerald, 1963

"Sing, goddess, the anger of Peleus' son of Achilleus and its devastation, which puts pains thousandfold upon the Achains,
hurled in the multitudes to the house of Hades strong souls of heroes, but gave their bodies to be the delicate feasting of dogs, of all birds, and the will of Zeus was accomplished since that time when first there stood the division of conflict Atrecus' son the lord of men and brilliant Achilleus."
-Translated by Richmond Lattimore, 1951

cont:

[Anonymous No.11680675]

"Sing, goddess, of Peleus' son Achilles' anger, ruinous, that caused the Greeks untold ordeals, consigned to Hades countless valiant souls, heroes, and left their bodies prey for dogs or feast for vultures. Zeus's will was done from when those two first quarreled and split apart, the king, Agamemnon, and matchless Achilles."
-Translated by Herbert Jordan, 2008

"An angry man-there is my story: the bitter rancor of Achillês, prince of the house of Peleus, which brought a thousand troubles upon the Achaian host. Many a strong soul it sent down to Hadês, and left the heroes themselves a prey to the dogs and carrion birds, while the will of God moved on to fulfillment."
-Translated and transliterated by W.H.D. Rouse, 1950

"Achilles' wrath, to Greece the direful spring
Of woes unnumber'd, heavenly goddess, sing!
That wrath which hurl'd to Pluto's gloomy reign
The souls of mighty chiefs untimely slain;
Whose limbs unburied on the naked shore,
Devouring dogs and hungry vultures tore.
Since great Achilles and Atrides strove,
Such was the sovereign doom,
and such the will of Jove!"
-Translated by Alexander Pope, 1720

"Achilles sing, O Goddess! Peleus' son;
His wrath pernicious, who ten thousand woes
Caused to Achaia's host, sent many a soul
Illustrious into Ades premature,
And Heroes gave (so stood the will of Jove)
To dogs and to all ravening fowls a prey,
When fierce dispute had separated once
The noble Chief Achilles from the son
Of Atreus, Agamemnon, King of men."
-Translated by William Cowper, London 1791

"Achilles' baneful wrath - resound, O goddess - that impos'd
Infinite sorrow on the Greeks, and the brave souls loos'd
From beasts heroic; sent them far, to that invisible cave*
That no light comforts; and their limbs to dogs and vultures gave:
To all which Jove's will give effect; from whom the first strife begun
Betwixt Atrides, king of men, and Thetis' godlike son*"
-Translated by George Chapman, 1616

"The Rage of Achilles--sing it now, goddess, sing through me
the deadly rage that caused the Achaeans such grief
and hurled down to Hades the souls of so many fighters,
leaving their naked flesh to be eaten by dogs
and carrion birds, as the will of Zeus was accomplished.
Begin at the time when bitter words first divided
that king of men, Agamemnon, and godlike Achilles."
-Translated by Stephen Mitchell


"Sing now, goddess, the wrath of Achilles the scion of Peleus,
ruinous rage which brought the Achaians uncounted afflictions;
many of the powerful souls it sent to the dwelling of Hades,
those of the heroes, and spoil for the dogs it made it their bodies,
plunder for the birds, and the purpose of Zeus was accomplished__"
-Translated by Rodney Merrill

choose your favorite

[Anonymous No.11680699]

Pope.

[Anonymous No.11680703]

>>11680675
>"An angry man-there is my story
yikes

[Anonymous No.11680706]

Pope

[Anonymous No.11680707]

fucking hell the iliad is amazing

[Anonymous No.11680711]

Lattimore and Merrill are the only acceptable choices.

[Anonymous No.11680723]

Listen aloud before making your judgement.

http://blogs.dickinson.edu/latin-poetry-podcast/files/2013/01/Iliad-1.1-8.mp3

Homer is meant to be listened to.

[Anonymous No.11680752]

Lombardo

>>11680699
Pope's (perhaps contending with Cowper's) is the best purely by poetic qualities, but judged as a translation rather than a standalone work it isn't up to par, as it changes Homer's actual verses quite a lot for the sake of aesthetic.

[Anonymous No.11680778]

>>11680752
Even the best, most accurate translation has to change things of the original work. You may as well cut loose and change as much as you need to make something pretty great even in the new language.

No point in half-measures.

[Anonymous No.11680789]

I like the RAGE at the beginning of Fagles

[Anonymous No.11680882]

>>11680699
>>11680706
>>11680752
Of these Pope is tied with a few as the worst
it takes away all the gravitas and vital energy and turns it into a poofty fairy ballerina dancing queerly (gaily gayly) singsong broadway waving a wand

[Anonymous No.11680978]

How did Peleus father such a chad?

[Anonymous No.11681061]

>>11680674
>>11680675
Forgetting someone, OP?

[Anonymous No.11681070]

FUCK YOU OP IM AT WORK AND I WANNA GET BACK TO IT RIGHT NOW

[Anonymous No.11681149]

But my favourite is the E. V. Rieu and no one on /lit/ seems to ever acknowledge its existence.

[Anonymous No.11681181]

>>11681061
Is this the "a complicated man" thot?

[Anonymous No.11681356]

>>11680789
Same, as someone whose reading Latti, Fagles is underrated (I see him get shit on a lot). Lombardo and Merrill's are good too. Pope's and Chapman's are low tier, dont get the people who always shill them

[Anonymous No.11681376]

>>11681061
How is her translation?

[Anonymous No.11681490]

>>11681376
both laughable and painfully disgusting

[Anonymous No.11681522]

>>11681356
I haven't read his Iliad but his Odyssey translation has a few moments where the tone is completely ruined by modern coloquialisms that seem very out of place.

[Anonymous No.11681532]

>>11680723

BROOOOOOOOOOPPP

[Anonymous No.11681559]

>>11681181
Ye

[Anonymous No.11681769]

>>11680723
>Homer is meant to be listened to.
>nobody actually listened to him since his poems were written down, around two and a half millennia ago
ok

>>11680778
>Even the best, most accurate translation has to change things of the original work
Yeah, but to a practically irrelevant degree. Two different translations, if good, shouldn't produce different interpretations of a text. It's pretty cringy to see comments about translating such as yours, that come from a likely monoglot whose only knowledge of translatology comes from /lit/ memes.
Yeah, Pope does produce a good text, but its goodness comes from traits completely different from the original Homeric ones. He turns a raw and direct product of oral art into a stylized, pretty rhyming poem of the 18th century England, with some completely made-up nice verses (not to mention countless smaller semantic deviations, additions and omissions) sprinkled in just because he felt like it. Why even read Homer in that format, it barely resembles the original aesthetics? Just read some other 18th century frilly romantic stuff instead, Ossian or something.

[Anonymous No.11681774]

>>11680978
Thetis.

There is a prophecy surrounding her that Zeus didn't know about, but Prometheus did. After some time chained to the rock getting his liver eaten, Prometheus revealed that whoever Thetis sleeps with will make her birth a son greater than the father.

Zeus, of course, wanting to fuck Thetis, could not have this at all, fearing that he would be deposed (like he did Kronos, like Kronos did Ouranos, like Marduk did Tiamat, and so on and so forth), so he married her off to a mortal.

[Anonymous No.11681890]

>>11680674
Butler

[Anonymous No.11682651]

>Since great Achilles and Atrides strove,
>Such was the sovereign doom,
>and such the will of Jove!" - Pope

>Rhyming strove with Jove

YIKES

[Anonymous No.11682771]

>>11682651
I know you're joking subtly pretending to be an idiot as a transcendent form of meta humor but for any anons that might see this and are so tricked as to think you are serious:

"General rhymes[edit]
In the general sense, general rhyme can refer to various kinds of phonetic similarity between words, and to the use of such similar-sounding words in organizing verse. Rhymes in this general sense are classified according to the degree and manner of the phonetic similarity:

syllabic: a rhyme in which the last syllable of each word sounds the same but does not necessarily contain stressed vowels. (cleaver, silver, or pitter, patter; the final syllable of the words bottle and fiddle are /l/, a liquid consonant.)
imperfect (or near): a rhyme between a stressed and an unstressed syllable. (wing, caring)
weak (or unaccented): a rhyme between two sets of one or more unstressed syllables. (hammer, carpenter)
semirhyme: a rhyme with an extra syllable on one word. (bend, ending)
forced (or oblique): a rhyme with an imperfect match in sound. (green, fiend; one, thumb)
assonance: matching vowels. (shake, hate) Assonance is sometimes referred to as slant rhymes, along with consonance.
consonance: matching consonants. (rabies, robbers)
half rhyme (or slant rhyme): matching final consonants. (Roxie', Lexie)
pararhyme: all consonants match. (tell, tall)
alliteration (or head rhyme): matching initial consonants. (ship, short)"

[Anonymous No.11682816]

>>11681376
It's not that bad-- not as good as Fagles', but I think it's worth reading.

[Anonymous No.11683094]

>>11682771

I have no idea what point you're trying to make, I would assume everyone in this thread knows what a rhyme is. MY point was that "Jove" shouldn't be pronounced that way. It's a Latin word and should be pronounced as such; anglicizing it is deplorable.

[Anonymous No.11683174]

>>11683094
how is it supposed to be pronounced?

What you are saying is like saying none of these english word should be pronounced as such because its a greek text. Foreign words were translated into english, so english speakers can read, I have heard people say 'by jove' and such, all my life. Your opinion doesnt matter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYZHnf9OsFI

[Anonymous No.11683407]

>>11683094
>MY point was that "Jove" shouldn't be pronounced that way.
Brainlet here, isn't it d-rove or rove-r?

[Anonymous No.11684549]

Lattimore ftw

[Anonymous No.11685647]

>>11683094
>It's a Latin word and should be pronounced as such; anglicizing it is deplorable.
So half the words in the English language should just be pronounced as the root languages the word was taken from? Where do you draw the line?