/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.11565115]

Is there any truth to this book?

>But it is a forgery!
Protocols reproduce and paraphrase sentences and metaphors found in a short book written by a certain Maurice Joly during the period of Napoleon's Second Empire.

These parts constitute less than 1% of the text in question. Where did the rest 99% come from?

This argument is truly irrelevant: those who decry plagiarism should keep in mind that this is not a matter of a literary work or of copyright. For example, when a general writes a plan, he could employ previous materials and writings as long as they contain ideas fit for his purpose. This would be a case of plagiarism, but it would not affect at all the question of whether or not this plan has really been conceived and carried out.

>It is an anti-semitic hoax!
It is true that many Jews have been and still are among the promoters of modern disorder in its more radical cultural expressions, whether political or social. This, however, should not prevent a deeper analysis, capable of exposing forces that may have employed modern Judaism merely as an instrument. After all, despite the fact that many Jews are among the apostles of the main ideologies regarded by the Protocols as instruments of global subversion (i.e., liberalism, socialism, scientism, and rationalism), it is also evident that these ideas would have never arisen and triumphed without historical antecedents, such as the Reformation, Humanism, the naturalism and individualism of the Renaissance, and the philosophy of Descartes. Such phenomena cannot be attributed to Judaism, but rather point to a wider web of influences.

My question is: How this document was literally able to predict the future?
It talks of world wars (Before World Wars happened), fiat money (Before Federal Reserve), monopoly of the press and of the media in democratic countries.

[Anonymous No.11565982]

>>11565115
You're on a semitic board my friend. Take this to /pol/

[Anonymous No.11565988]

I love the Jewish people

[Anonymous No.11566312]

>>11565982
>>11565988

I made myself quite clear that I wanted to discuss the contents of this book.

Instead of blaming the Jews we should refer to a wider horizon of influences and to look elsewhere. It would be ridiculous to suppose that the leaders of the great conflicting powers like U.SA, Russia or China receive orders from an international cabal of Jews and Masons (which are to begin with almost nonexistent in China)

. The Protocols at times even encourage the spread of anti-Semitism, while in other cases mention is made of the secret monopoly of the press and of the media in democratic countries as well as the power to paralyze or destroy the most prestigious banks. This power concentrates the rootless, financial wealth in a few hands, and through it controls peoples, parties, and governments.

[Anonymous No.11566339]

>>11566312
Fuck off, moron

[Anonymous No.11566355]

>>11566339
Spotted the filthy kike! Why aren't you hooked nosed merchants able to engage me in a serious debate?

[Anonymous No.11566368]

It doesn't matter, I don't mind smarter people being in charge of world order

[Anonymous No.11566371]

>>11566355
we deserve white women, but the jews has made them into ape lovers, they belong to us,t hough

[Anonymous No.11566375]

>>11565982
>>>/gas/

[Anonymous No.11566380]

>>11565115

Nazis are retards. They want to switch bourgeoisie with jews because they believe it's impossible blood brothers would sell them for capitalistic profit.

[Anonymous No.11566382]

>>11565115
Either take the responibility or accept the chaotic nature of our societal structure. There's no one in charge, get over it

[Anonymous No.11566385]

>>11566380
try redpill holocaust fake white genocide praise kek

[Anonymous No.11566388]

>>11566385

Have you read Kropotkek?

[Anonymous No.11566398]

>>11566382
it's a dime a dozen literati thinks they're more in touch with the social substratum than the tacticians the tiny group of people who own all the wealth in the world can afford episode

[Anonymous No.11566400]

>>11566382
What are you talking about? Have you even read the Protocols?

It describes the very method of destabilization, monetary, political and media control. It even talks of Fiat Money before it even existed

>You are aware that the gold standard has been the ruin of the States which adopted it, for it has not been able to satisfy the demands for money, the more so that we have removed gold from circulation as far as possible.
-Protocol 20

>In our hands is the greatest power of our day—gold: in two days we can procure from our storehouses any quantity we may please.
-Protocol 22

How it was able to predict the future with such accuracy if the theory is founded on some chaotic nature of society and financial system?

To me it seems there is a clear method, cold calculating intelligence behind this madness.

[Anonymous No.11566402]

>>11566388
infographics proofs on the jews and their lying try culture of critique judeo-bolshevik feminism degenerate society

[Anonymous No.11566414]

>>11566400
>To me it seems there is a clear method, cold calculating intelligence behind this madness.
Seek help

"Protocols" is a propaganda that took existing social issues and clear prospects of them and pinned them as an evil jewish masterplan to avoid government responsibilty of fixing them

[Anonymous No.11566422]

>>11566402

I am proud of being jewish and ushering the new era of everyone being an uprooted jew at heart.

[Anonymous No.11566445]

always confused me as a jew why dumb idiot goyim animals like OP would think we would allow something that actually details our survival strategy to be published like this book

our parasitic nature is encoded into our culture, probably also at the genetic level desu

[Anonymous No.11566453]

>>11566414
Propaganda and anti-semitism is secondary characteristic of the document in question. You are the one here who is obsessed about Jews, not me.

What is the most striking characteristic of the Protocols? The answer is knowledge of a rare kind, embracing the widest field. If it were employed for only purposes of propaganda and to agitate anti-semitism: why go for such universal themes and lengths?

. Their attribution to Jewish “Elders” is unsupported and should be rejected, without prejudice to any other evidence about Jewish leadership of the world-revolution as such. The Jewish attack on them was bent, not on exculpating Jewry, but on stopping the publication on the plea that it was “agitating the public mind without occasion or justification.” The arguments advanced were bogus; they were that the Protocols closely resembled several earlier publications and thus were “plagiaries” or “forgeries,” whereas what this in truth showed was the obvious thing: that they were part of the continuing literature of the conspiracy. They might equally well be the product of non-Jewish or of anti-Jewish revolutionaries, and that is of secondary importance. What they proved is that the organization first revealed by Weishaupt's documents was in existence 120 years later, and was still using the methods and pursuing the aim then exposed; and when they were published in English the Bolshevik revolution had given the proof.

[Anonymous No.11566456]

>>11566445
Forget about the Jews you fucking brainlet, I made this more than 10x clear in my previous posts

>>11566445

[Anonymous No.11566471]

>>11566456
what do you mean forget about them? i am them and im telling you the reason we are found everywhere and in key positions is because this is the survival strategy our tribe developed after being removed from our ancestral homeland, and in exile being always seen as the Other

[Anonymous No.11566478]

>>11566453
The point still stands, with our without antisemitic sentiment.
It's a piece of propaganda that placed the blame on systematic societal issues on malevolent conspiracy, because it's much harder to accept that governments and exisiting systems (or humans in general) are really shitty at adressing and fixing them even if they are apparent and predictable.
Control is an illusion and it's much harder to accept it than to believe that this is deliberate sabotage

[Anonymous No.11566489]

>>11565115
Nice sources. Anyway why even have arguments when you can just call someone a Jew and automatically win?

[Anonymous No.11566499]

>>11566478
Piece of propaganda? Against whom if we disregard the obvious attribution of the Protocols to solely Jewish authorship?

The Protocols repeatedly lay emphasis on the incitement of “the mob” against the ruling class as the most effective means of destroying States and nations and achieving world dominion.

The Protocols say:
>“The aristocracy of the peoples, as a political force, is dead … but as landed proprietors they can still be harmful to us from the fact that they are self-sufficing in the resources upon which they live. It is essential therefore for us at whatever cost to deprive them of their land … At the same time we must intensively patronize trade and industry … what we want is that industry should drain off from the land both labour and capital and by means of speculation transfer into our hands all the money of the world.

Karl Marx in his Communist Manifesto exactly echoes this very same idea.

If you are to regard this as a piece of propaganda: against whom it was aimed at and for what purpose? Don´t you see irony in this statement?

[Anonymous No.11566501]

>>11566489
I have in every post of mine asked to disregard the apparent Jewish authorship. Go to /pol/ if you want to discuss antisemitism.

[Anonymous No.11566509]

Fitting for this thread.

[Anonymous No.11566521]

>>11566499
Using an elusive enemy figure has been a staple of pro-government agitprop since forever. It's not important who is the enemy, it's about how's this "enemy" is always worse than what people get under current regime

[Anonymous No.11566528]

>>11566509
This passage may interest you: Keep in mind it was written before 1905, in a time where Antisemitism was not a taboo or even politically incorrect as it is now (for obvious reasons)

>“Nowadays if any States raise a protest against us, it is only proforma at our discretion and by our direction, for their anti-semitism is indispensable to us for the management of our lesser brethren.”

Those who wish to make "Protocols" anti-semitic document of propaganda to incite hatred against the Jews are wrong: for the very protocols propose of using the Jews as mere scapegoat for a much wider scheme of things and using anti-semitism for their own Ends and Means.

[Anonymous No.11566537]

>>11566501
>Disregard the attributed Jewish authorship of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion
Fucking lol. "I'm just asking honest questions about a pamphlet with Zion in the name, used as anti-semitic propaganda, just ignore the anti-semitism, don't you think it's totally not a forgery though? It's perfectly accurate about a certain group controlling society, I'm not saying it's the jews but it's totally the jews."

[Anonymous No.11566556]

>>11566537
Regardless of the role played by Jews and Masonry in the modern subversion that the Protocols at first glance seems to purport, it is necessary to recognize clearly the real historical context of their influence, as well as the limit beyond which they are destined to develop by employing forces that not only are no longer those of Judaism and of Masonry, but that could even totally turn against them.

I quote Julius Evola, "Revolt Against Modern world:
>When we reflect carefully on things, modern Judaism as a power (quite apart from the concomitant, widespread, and instinctive action of individual Jewish thinkers and writers) is inseparable from capitalism and finance, which fall within the civilization of the Third Estate. The same applies to modern Masonry, which prepared ideologically for and supported the advent of the Third Estate. Masonry still presents itself today as the custodian of the principles of the Enlightenment and the French Revolution, its doctrines acting as a kind of secular religion of modern democracy; its militant action has revealed and continues to reveal itself along this line, openly or in semisecret ways. All this falls within the penultimate phase; this phase, the overall cycle of democratic and capitalist civilization of the Third Estate, will eventually usher in the last collectivist phase, to which it has inadvertently opened the way. It is therefore logical that the role of a central guiding force of global subversion in this last period will no longer be played by Judaism or Masonry and that the main current may turn against both of these groups, as if they were residues to be liquidated once and for all; after all, this can be seen in countries in which regimes controlled by the Fourth Estate (i.e., Marxist regimes) are beginning to be consolidated, even though Jews and Masons contributed to their advent.

[Anonymous No.11566622]

>>11566414
So what is your stance on Adam Weishaupt´s Illuminati? The Bavarian Government seemed to take them seriously, considering Bavarian Government seized their documents in 1786 and published them in 1787.

The publication of the Weishaupt documents included protocols as:
>“Princes and nations will disappear Reason will be the only code of man.”

Weishaupt's papers also included a diagram illustrating the way in which he exercised control over his organization. It is the product of an intelligence of the highest kind The secret is that damage to such a structure cannot be more than local, the main fabric remaining always unimpaired and capable of repair. If a few links, or cells, are destroyed these can be made good in due time, and meanwhile the organization continues, substantially unharmed.

At the centre of this web sat Weishaupt, and held all threads in his hands. One quote reads:
>“One must show how easy it would be for one clever head to direct hundreds and thousands of men,” he wrote above the diagram, and below it he added
>“I have two immediately below me into whom I breathe my whole spirit, and each of these two has again two others, and so on. In this way I can set a thousand men in motion and on fire in the simplest manner, and in this way one must impart orders and operate on politics.

The Weishaupt documents are incontestably authentic; the Bavarian Government unwittingly forestalled any attempt to cry “Forgery” by inviting any who were interested to inspect the original documents in the Archives at Munich.

Why cannot we in modern times view Protocols in the same way? What makes "Protocols" any less authentic for they both propose the same kind of control, planning and execution of said methods?

[Anonymous No.11566662]

The correct chain of causation:
Maurice Joly -> Jewish Elders -> Protocols.

Maurice Joly wrote a political dialogue that inspired the political thoughts of malcontents that would be repeated in the political thinking of the Elders. Nobody would call a political work a forgery because it contained lines from Aristotle's Politics or Machiavelli's Prince, everyone draws from wells of inspiration in their field. Joly wrote a work on how to be a deceitful political revolutionary, of course he inspired those seeking deceitful underhanded revolutions in politics.

[Anonymous No.11566664]

>>11566400
Probably because the protocols are a pretty intelligent work. Whether or not they are of Semitic origin, I would reckon that rich people (including many Jews) would come together and say “Let’s try this out so that we can rule the world and become infinitely more rich.”
I mean, if I were rich I would probably do it too.

[Anonymous No.11566681]

>>11566664

Go back to sleep, prolétaire!

[Anonymous No.11566686]

>>11566681
I’m just pointing out that the human condition is perpetually wanting more. More money, fame, comfort, knowledge, power, etc. depending on the person. It comes to no surprise that rich people, the ones who can get more shit as easy as possible, would do anything they could to get it.

[Anonymous No.11566690]

>>11566662
>The correct chain of causation:
Maurice Joly -> Jewish Elders -> Protocols.

Maurice Joly published an attack on Napoleon III, to whom he attributed the identical methods of corrupting and ruining the social system in allegorical form. This was released in 1862

1868 the German Goedsche reproduced the same ideas in the form of an attack on Jewish leadership of the revolution, and in 1869 the French Catholic and Royalist Gougenot Des Mousseaux took up the same theme. Bakunin also published his Polemic "Against The Jews" in 1869

In all these works, in one form or another, the continuity of the basic idea first revealed by Weishaupt's Illuminati documents appears: Destruction of all legitimate government, religion and nationhood and setting up a universal despotism to rule the enslaved masses by terror and violence and propaganda.

Some of them assailed the Jewish.

First appearance of this conspiracy literature of first disclosed in 1787 by Bavarian government publishing the infamous Illuminati documments of Adam Weishaupt´s order.

In 1905 Professor Sergyei Nilus, an official in Department of Foreign Religions at Moscow, published a book, of which the British Museum in London has a copy bearing its date-stamp, August 10, 1906.

When the Protocols appeared in English the minor point, who was the author of this particular document, was given a false semblance of major importance by the enraged Jewish attack on the document itself.

In this case the allegation about a specific meeting of Jewish leaders of the conspiracy was unsupported and could have been ignored (in 1913 a somewhat similar publication accused the Jesuits of instigating a world-conspiracy resembling that depicted alike in the Protocols and in Weishaupt's papers; the Jesuits quietly remarked that this was false and the matter was forgotten).

The response of official Jewry in 1920 and afterwards was different. It was aimed, with fury, at the entire substance of the Protocols; it did not stop at denying a Jewish plot, but denied that there was any plot, which was demonstrably untrue.

>"Nothing to see here Folks!"

[Anonymous No.11566732]

>>11565115
I'd love to take part in the debate but am too busy producing beautiful art and literature, sorry about that.
t. a proud Jew

[Anonymous No.11566770]

>>11566732
>producing beautiful art and literature
evidence?

[Anonymous No.11566858]

[Anonymous No.11566879]

anyone else /hatepol/ here?

[Anonymous No.11566926]

I am not a jew but will say I am to piss you off.

[Anonymous No.11566938]

>>11566732
racemixing propaganda and cuck porn is not beautiful art

[Anonymous No.11566942]

Lotta semetic sweating in here. Its ok the bougiescum is evil unless theyre jewish. They clearly deserve their spot. They are just smarter and better than everyone else

[Anonymous No.11566987]

>>11566942
Unironically you should believe this if you are a /pol/tard, which it sounds like you are.

[Anonymous No.11567012]

>>11565115
Partially. The Protocols of the Elders of Zion is hoax created by Jews for disinformation. They inserted more lurid, over the top material in the book so when they refute those, the implication is that they refute the real plans in there as well. It's really insidious.

[Anonymous No.11567276]

>>11567012
Protocols attribution to Jewish “Elders” is unsupported and should be rejected, without prejudice to any other evidence about Jewish leadership of the world-revolution as such or Jewish connection to rise of Marxism, Communist revolutions etc.

The Jewish attack on them was not concerned on exculpating Jewry, but on stopping the publication on the plea that it was “agitating the public mind without occasion or justification”
The arguments advanced were false; they claimed that the Protocols closely resembled several earlier publications and thus were “plagiaries” or “forgeries,” whereas what this in truth showed was the obvious thing: that they were part of the continuing literature of the conspiracy.

They might equally well be the product of non-Jewish or of anti-Jewish revolutionaries, and that is of secondary importance. What they prove is that the organization first revealed by Weishaupt's documents seized by Bavarian government was still in existence 120 years later, and was still using the very same methods and pursuing the aim which was then exposed; and when they were published in English the Bolshevik revolution had given the proof of such plans being advanced.