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/lit/ - Literature


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11541425 No.11541425 [Reply] [Original]

"Mansplaining"
Dear sir, your air of authority
leaves me lost. Eases me from
a place of ease. Contracts with
my contradictions to take from me
a place. Autopilots my autobiography.
Frightens my fright. Sighs with
my breath. Wins at my race.
Your certainty has me curtained.
Your nerve has me nervous. Your
childhood has me childlike and
your nastiness nests in my belfry
like a hawk. You are beyond
and above my slice of sky, peach
as a pie, bourbon as its pit. You are
spit and vinegar while I sour
in my bowl. You bowl me over
while I tread lightly on
my feet. You walk on water
while I sink. You witness me,
fisherman, boat on the lake,
while I struggle and burble and brittle
and drop. You wink at me and
I must relate. I close my eyes
to erase you and you are written
in my lids. A litmus test. A form
of lair. God with three days
of facial growth and an old bouquet
for a face. Soap and water for
a brain. I have no handsome
answer. I have no pillar of salt
or shoulder to look over. I have
no feather to weigh. I have no
bubble to burst. I am less
to myself, a character in a drama,
a drumbeat, a benevolence, a
blight. All parts of me say shoot
on sight. Aim for an artery
or organ. Good night.

>> No.11541434

I don't believe this.
But I also don't want to find out that this is real.

>> No.11541440

And then the whole bus clapped.

>> No.11541446

>>11541434
https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/poems/147129/mansplaining

>> No.11541450

>>11541425
I went to a slam night at my uni but it was an insufferable circle jerk of leftists, faggots and feminists competing for the oppression Olympics.

Haven't bothered with poetry since

>> No.11541481

>>11541425.

Does anyone know the technical term for this kind of thing:

>Eases me from a place of ease.
>Your nerve has me nervous
>Your childhood has me childlike

Does it have one?

>> No.11541490

>>11541425

>14 instances of the word "me".
>11 instances of the word "my".

Oh me oh my.

>> No.11541492

No man is an island,
Entire of itself.
Each is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thine own
Or of thine friend's were.
Each man's death diminishes me,
For I am involved in mankind.
Therefore, send not to know
For whom the bell tolls,
It tolls for thee.

>> No.11541528

>>11541481
antanaclasis. the words are repeated or similar, but have different meanings. it's one of the forms of repetition used in rhetoric.

>> No.11541564

>>11541492
Ah, Donne sermon concluse versified. Yes. And?

>> No.11541615

>>11541528

Thanks anon.

>> No.11541648

>>11541450
Pop poetry has always been terrible. Actual poetry is good desu. Give it a shot.

>> No.11541687

>>11541450
Right-wingers participate in the oppression Olympics just as much as leftists do. They constantly whine about how “SJWs” deny them their right to free speech or how mass non-white immigration is equivalent to genocide.

>> No.11541688

>>11541425
>https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/poems/147129/mansplaining
I don't like the poem because it's shit, but what seems to trigger you morons isn't that its a shit poem but that it's written by someone whose perspective you don't share. Much like the insufferable circle jerk of leftists and feminists who compete for oppression Olympics, some of you lot need to do the exact same and stop being so personally affronted at points of view that aren't your own.

It's beyond common for poetry to be used to lampoon and critique others in society, so if the author wants to lampoon men who incessantly and loudly try to talk and explain things in public situations, that's fine. Just wish she was a better poet who was more clever in her language.

>> No.11541702

well what did you expect from a bunch of faggots trying to make each other feel good by rhyming words

>> No.11541703
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11541703

>tfw I submitted a poem to the Poetry Foundation

I didn't think I had very good chances of being accepted anyway, but this just makes me feel even worse.

>> No.11541726

>>11541687
>They constantly whine about how “SJWs” deny them their right to free speech
this is true though. ref: the various incidents where speakers have been "deplatformed" at universities etc because they make other students feel "unsafe"

>> No.11541767

>>11541726
jesus christ you moron. The right to free speech has to do with the State banning or censoring speech in public. We actually used to this as a country until censorship laws were struck down in the 1960's. It's not about literally getting to say whatever you want at whatever event you want whenever you want. If the state sends the FBI to arrest all the delicate snowflake rightwingers who think their free speech is being curtailed, I'll join you in the streets to protest. If you get fucking shut down from hosting an event at William & Mary College and whine like a bitch that your freedom of speech is being curtailed you're an idiot.

There was an episode of Cum Town that I listened to recently which summed this up perfectly. Here we have these obnoxious shit stains who host one of the most well funded podcasts on Patreon, using public visibility, accessing the international banking system to receive their money, complaining that their freedom of speech was under attack.... while fucking monetizing their speech openly in an economic system supported by the state. The complete lack of awareness on all the free speech zombies that no one is fucking arresting them for their words is either because a) they really are that stupid or b) they want to PRETEND their freedom of speech is being curtailed so they can be aggrieved little snowflakes just like the SJW students who protest them. Both these groups ought to be rounded up and summarily executed.

>> No.11541778

>>11541688
They dislike the fact that a female equivalent or one that doesn't fit a popular liberal narrative would never be on that site.

>> No.11541800

>>11541778
>They dislike the fact that a female equivalent or one that doesn't fit a popular liberal narrative would never be on that site.
That's a complete lie you absolute tool. The OP was not about providing commentary on the full breadth, it was about posting one poem, with a stereotypical image of an angry female, and then every single reply until this one (>>11541703) had absolutely nothing to do with the discussion topic of the Poetry Foundation being too narrow in the scope of things they accept. What almost every single post before that was doing was being snarky at the mere posting of a (to be fair shite) poem because the poem was from the perspective of a SJW feminist. That's what drove this. Don't make up some bullshit about how there was an intellectually honest concern about diversity of views accepted, that's utter nonsense.

>> No.11541801

>>11541767
The social stigma is strong and real. I was in Berkeley at an event last year. I had rocks & glass thrown at me, m80's continually set off right next to me, etc.

2nd amendment is also the right to peaceably assemble. There's a push to ban 'fascism' from cities around me, where fascism is having a different opinion

>> No.11541819

>>11541801
>I was in Berkeley at an event last year. I had rocks & glass thrown at me, m80's continually set off right next to me, etc.
Yeah, we already have criminal statutes for that. The police should arrest everyone who is beating folks with bike locks, setting off m80's in public places, and whatever dumb shit the LARPing Antifa and Alt-right folks do. And desu the police did rightly arrest a lot of people. So what the fuck is this issue here? No one's freedom of speech was curtailed. Freedom of speech is about the state stopping you. It is not about suffocating social stigmas you moron. The bible belt town I grew up in would basically ostracize you if you used profanity in public or around others or, god forbid, advocated atheism. Were they abridging freedom of speech? No! because the police never came to stop me. Feeling that folks around you don't like what you're saying is not oppression and its not losing your freedom of speech. Grow up, stand up for yourself and stop providing excuses to pretend like you are aggrieved and an oppressed little snowflake.

>> No.11541820

>>11541800
Why are you so offended? That's a big part of the underlying argument against SJW culture. Both how pervasive and insular it is.
We're working with enough axioms that we can just be snarky about it at this point.

It's funny of you to pretend that this doesn't exist

>> No.11541827

>>11541767
>>11541800
>>11541819
i think you people drink too much coffee

>> No.11541834

>>11541800
I think the discussion is more focused on the quality of submissions they accept as characterized by this fucking abortion of quality.
>actually reads thread
Nevermind, this place needs to be nuked from orbit.

>> No.11541836

>>11541819
With the push to ban 'fascism' it is getting that way, but the argument against the regressive left is about more than laws. It's about this strong meme in our culture and how it's toxic to what are supposed to be shared intellectual values.

>> No.11541840

>>11541648

Are you certain?

>> No.11541842

>>11541827
Highly accurate but irrelevant

>> No.11541845

>>11541834
>Nevermind, this place needs to be nuked from orbit.
This twitter / reddit iteration of PC culture is something else.

>> No.11541850

>>11541820
>That's a big part of the underlying argument against SJW culture.
Then it's best not to emulate their worst fucking tendencies, isn't it?

>It's funny of you to pretend that this doesn't exist
It does exist, I never indicated it didn't. There is way too much of an SJW feminist takeover of lit circles, particularly in poetry. This is correct. Let's start a thread that actually attempts to talk about that real issue.

What is also pathetic, however, is for aggrieved shits on an opposite side to adopt similar selfish grievance-driven identity politics. The whole purpose of the OP was to gin up that exact sentiment. You were trying to deliver a more reasonable topic of discussion over it, as if to ignore the dumb identity-grievances that were *actually* driving the thread.

>> No.11541852

>>11541836
>It's about this strong meme in our culture and how it's toxic to what are supposed to be shared intellectual values.
Where is your outrage about deep south Christian fundamentalism pushing people out of communities for being openly atheist or gay? The free speech warriors are literally crybabies that are upset that people protest them.

>> No.11541858

>>11541827
as an owner of two (You)'s on here, I'll admit to having drank perhaps more espresso than normal this morning

>> No.11541897

>>11541836
>With the push to ban 'fascism' it is getting that way
The thing is, any time there is a strong anti-X sentiment, there will be someone pushing to ban X and then pro-X people can point to that to show how persecuted they are. Call me when it actually starts happening.
>how it's toxic to what are supposed to be shared intellectual values.
I don't think liberals and fascists share the same intellectual values.

>> No.11541932

>>11541850
I won't lie, I feel constantly bombarded with pop liberal bullshit going on virtually uncontested and I'm happy to see humor with a dose of sanity.
I live in the bay area. Multiple people just died from BART attacks. 2 victims were white with black attackers. One was the other way around.
She gets a march in her name, people calling racism even though there's nothing to suggest it was over race, and Anne Hathaway saying "All black people live in fear everyday"

There's something wrong here. Considering that, I'm happy to laugh at SJW's in some of the few places I still can. Though that seems to be changing too.

>>11541852
Where is this happening in 2018? I'd be plenty outraged if that were the narrative but even if it were a narrative, the prevailing bullshit in our society is of the SJW variety.

>> No.11541945

>>11541897
>liberals and fascists
Wow

Let's quit talking

>> No.11541948
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11541948

I want /leftypol/ to go and stay go.

>> No.11541988

>>11541932
>I live in the bay area
Listen, I'm the same anon you're replying to, and I get it. I came from a bible belt town, went to college in Boston, and personally find both conservatives and urban SJW's to be annoying and suffocating as fuck to be around. But they're not curtailing your rights. You should probably move to a different place. The Bay Area is pretty wild (as is Boston) with SJW's, and I totally get that they are fairly ridiculous to be around. But they have a right to create whatever batshit community values they want so long as they don't violate your constitutional rights, and they basically don't. So either move on, or accept being an outsider among them.

>Where is this happening in 2018?
Wow lad. I'll forgive you since you are in the Bay Area, but in non-coastal urban SJW land the deep south Christian fundamentalists are the same as the ever were. In fact even worse because they can weaponize supporting Trump to dismiss you just as they normally do with religion and heritage. Rural America has degenerated deeper into tribalist, identity politics in 2018 FAR worse than even the Bay Area, and I hold neither up as anything to admire.

>> No.11542006
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11542006

>>11541988
At least there are fewer niggers in rural America.

>> No.11542010

Why even continue with poetry when it's already reached its peak with this album?
https://youtu.be/vv9G3I1FkuI

>> No.11542101

>>11542006
lol you're trying to be "xD look at me I'm edgy!" offensive, but in reality the deep south is riddled with black people.

>> No.11542124
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11542124

>>11542101
>rural America=/=deep south
Are you even American?
Also there's nothing edgy about hating niggers. Its a time-honored tradition in America.

>> No.11542137

>>11542124
the post he quoted mentioned the deep south.

>Also there's nothing edgy about hating niggers. Its a time-honored tradition in America.
Doesn't mean it's not edgy. Hating niggers is definitely the heritage of America, taking the time to post a "xD DAE hate niggers?" post with a "i hate niggers" picture that you had to dig up from your "various photos that express my hatred of niggers" folder is what's edgy.

>> No.11542165

>>11541687
fuck off brainlet

>> No.11542171

>>11541767
>The right to free speech has to do with the State banning or censoring speech in public

Wrong, free speech as a concept has little to do with the first amendment (what you are thinking of) when it comes to non-state actors

>> No.11542290
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11542290

>>11541528
>tfw I learned a new word today

>> No.11542313

>>11542171
>free speech as a concept has little to do with the first amendment (what you are thinking of) when it comes to non-state actors
You don't have the right to force private actors to lose control of their private property and succumb to any stupid free speech act you like. That's retarded. Private property matters.

>> No.11542366

>>11542171
>free speech as a concept has little to do with the first amendment
you can't be this stupid. Free speech is a liberal concept that has to do with state power onto citizens (technically what the 1st amendment of the US constitution). Whatever dumb ass definition you think it has is wrong.

>> No.11542400
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11542400

>>11542171
>my free speech is different from everyone's free speech
Wew lads... Who ever ran with the idea of the need to "listen to every disagreements"?

>> No.11542577
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11542577

>>11541948
>start an obnoxious bait thread that only exists so you and those who think like you can bitch about women and minorities
>people realize your thread is a bait thread and criticize you for it
>claim anyone who disagrees with you comes from /leftypol/, absolving yourself of blame

>> No.11542800

>>11541425
This being points up the sky because a woman is always below a man.

>> No.11542854

What I don't understand is this implication that men are always completely certain and confident in their opinions to the point of being obnoxious when in actuality men seem to be the most likely to qualify every statement with "I'm not sure" or "I could be wrong."

>> No.11542961

Imagine making a thread about literature because you're genuinely interested in discussing it, instead of being baited by the most mundane and uninteresting contentions all the time, in effect using literature as nothing but a vehicle to be butthurt about identity politics on an anonymous internet board as your prime, your youth, a time that should be filled with laughter and love, dwindles away, day by day, bringing you nothing but an increase in bitterness and resentment.

Imagine they're right about what happens when you die, and your life flashes before your eyes, imagine the last experience of your life having to be sitting through your personal cinema of despair, seeing the thousands of "HURR WOMEN ARE STOOPID, LITERATURE IS FOR MENZ" threads you've made and participated in, laboriously typing out each toxic, uninteresting and resent-filled comment, your outrage not stemming from any genuine love of literature, but from the anger caused by the suppressed realization that women have chosen that your genetic lineage dies with you, a choice on their part that you are too narcissistic to realize is coming from a place of mercy towards your potential offspring.

Imagine unironically sharing any /pol/ sentiment, imagine believing that cultures should stay homogenous while simultaneously shitting up every other board with /pol/ culture, imagine how easily the resentful young /pol/fag whose life is passing him by will ignore this post by replying "found the roastie" and continue his ill-fated consumption of poison, imagine making a thread that ostensibly comes from a place of loving the classics but in actuality is killing a board that used to love discussing them because it is nothing but another terrible, predictable thread about american identity politics.

Imagine being a giant fucking faggot OP.

>> No.11542989

>>11542961
>imagine believing that cultures should stay homogenous
Wow, I guess the Japanese and anyone else who doesn't want every culture to be assimilated into one global capitalist mass of grey is a nazi

>> No.11543049

>>11542989

>fails to read the next 10 words in that sentence

I realize that attention span of the /pol/ack mind suffers from being fed nothing but youtube videos, but at least try a little harder.

>> No.11543071

>>11542961
Imagine writing all this.

>> No.11543082

>>11543071

It's pasta. Funnily enough, you unimaginative response is always there. It's this really lame attempt at rhetoric, always gay and uninteresting, much like the people that the pasta is directed towards.

>> No.11543100

>>11541688
What's aggrieving is not whether the poem's message is sound, but that the poem, which is a pastiche of trite, feminist cliches, exists at all.

>> No.11543110

>>11543082
Copying and pasting a retarded scrawl is hardly much better than writing a retarded scrawl from scratch. In fact, it's probably more retarded.

>> No.11543135

>>11543110
>Copying and pasting a retarded scrawl is hardly much better than writing a retarded scrawl from scratch.

>> No.11543150

>>11543135
Nice quote.

>> No.11543154

>>11541490
"Oh me oh my ain't that perfection"
Ain't She Sweet - The Beatles.

>> No.11543171
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11543171

>people ITT think that a poem can't be bad because of shitty ideation as much as it can be bad because of shitty construction.

I can't believe people think this is a "smart" board.

>> No.11543257

>>11542961
Why would you rephrase the classics?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGL1x40p46s

>> No.11543293

>>11541425
>being this insecure
>writing a poem about being corrected by a man and having a mental breakdown about it
>men pat her on the back and give her brownie points for it

At least it's reassuring that gender relations never really change

>> No.11543314

>>11541687
Imagine being this bluepilled and non-based, dare I say, unfounded.

>> No.11543334

>>11541425
So it's about exuding masculinity and the confusing self loathing because of the attraction felt.

>> No.11543351

Please don't...
>correct a woman
>sit comfortably
>be confident
>offend anyone who doesn't look like you
>hire people who are best for the job
>be attracted to attractive women

>> No.11543371
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11543371

>>11543351
…and so on, and so on, and so forth. *sniff*

>> No.11543374

>>11541767
The government is just one actor here and it's virtually meaningless when corporations and social media have almost limitless reach. I agree with you though that alt-light "muh freedumbs" niggers are annoying as hell though. You can pretty much get away with anything outside of legitimate sexual harassment and antisemitism as long as you 1. have a wanted skill and 2. refuse to play into their games by ever apologizing or acknowledging wrong doing.

In STEM especially it isn't really that bad. You guys are fucked though since social pressure is dominated by whoever holds the most power, and unfortunately for you guys, you picked one of the only possible fields where women are able to gain influence.

>> No.11543465

Burgers probably think that even the laws of physics are defined by some amendment to their precious constitution.

>> No.11543479

>>11541688
Where did you gather that?

>> No.11544575

>>11541490
I assume it was written by a woman.

>> No.11544587

>>11541767
In the UK you can be arrested for speaking your mind. Admittedly though we don't have a constitution which entitles citizens to freedom of speech.

>> No.11544838

>>11541767
Whether or not you think legal precedent is on my side, I think that it should be obvious that a part of free speech would be that a government-funded entity which facilitates speakers and assemblies should not be allowed to deny people the right to use its service without very very good reason (literal threats of violence). If they would like to allow the speakers/assemblies but there is a mob of people threatening violence against any who would enter, this is clearly something that impedes upon the rights of citizens to use public services equally.

>> No.11544870

>>11544838
First off, when public universities deny speakers incorrectly they are taken to court and usually lose (ironically it's the SJW filled ACLU who does this, although who knows if they will continue).

>but there is a mob of people threatening violence against any who would enter
Alt right events invite LARPers on both sides who commit violence. People bring weapons, people run their cars over people, folks live stream hoping to catch violence, etc. Entities are perfectly right to look at, say, a Richard Spencer event and be concerned that violence could break out from Spencer's fans as well as antifa opponents

In any case, the discussion is off the rails because now we have watered down the whole "muh free speech" oppression Olympics to only fit the couple phantom cases at public universities in which there were several layers of courts people could go through to assert their rights anyways. There's no way such trivial individual cases amount to some major curtailment of rights. Unless you want to play grievance politics, that is, in which case any single case you can find ever will assuage your sense of aggrievement.

>> No.11544911

>>11544870
>First off, when public universities deny speakers incorrectly they are taken to court and usually lose
This is true and I'm glad for it. Although this doesn't mean college don't still get away with it because people don't want to deal with taking things to court.
>Alt right events invite LARPers on both sides who commit violence.
I'm not playing advocate for any one particular side in a situation like that, but obviously showing up to someone's planned event that would just be a peaceful speech (and I'm emphasising cases where it's not alt-righters) and threatening violence, something that happens all the time to more moderate conservatives, is a problem that impedes upon the right of assembly of peaceful citizens. Is that illegal? I don't know exactly, but you would think they would therefore be denying right of speech and assembly, specifically in an instance which was granted through proper channels. Are people allowed to follow you around and molest you while you're trying to have a conversation with your friends? That would be grounds to take out a restraining order.

>> No.11544961

>>11544911
there's Trump fanclubs meeting in every other county in America pretty much. Conservatives are not oppressed, they control all three branches of government and the vast majority of state legislatures and local town councils. This is insane the level of oppression Olympics you are having to jump through to feel aggrieved and oppressed. There are some cases at universities where some antifa kids make it difficult to host conservative events, sure; it's literally a handful of cases, and the courts usually can step in anyway. There's no sane reason to feel aggrieved about conservatives due to a trivially small amount of cases, when the country is mostly controlled by conservatives at all levels of State.

>> No.11545069

>>11544961
Don't put words in my mouth. I'm not playing any "oppression olympics." I don't feel that conservatives are oppressed, nor do I think liberals are oppressed. There are clearly places (big colleges, left-wing cities) where social pressures have leaked into the administration and cause certain people, many of whom are moderate, to experience impediments to their free speech. I'm addressing a pretty technical problem, not playing an emotional game. You say it's a handful of cases, and while I think you're underestimating it (a lot of speakers have come to expect disruptions regularly), I agree to your point that it's not so obstructive that it's a seriously damaging problem. It is, however, indicative of a deeper ideological problem that there is a growing group of people interested in using threatening tactics to try to harass people when they're acting on their free right of assembly. Laughing the problem away because 'it's not hardcore oppression or something' is a great way to let the problem grow larger until it's unmanageable.

>> No.11545097

>>11545069
>Don't put words in my mouth. I'm not playing any "oppression olympics."
You've now moved to a much much narrower and niche issue that is worth discussing, but you (or rather the chain of anons since idk if it's all the same person) started with a reply to this comment (>>11541687), which was specifically about right wingers also playing in the oppression Olympics. The whole reason oppression Olympics is used as a pejorative is to mock the tendency for people to cherrypick specific cases to argue grand cultural narratives that are oppressing them. By starting off justifying the overblown sense of grievance from right wingers, and then end with narrowly defining a small set of questionable cases is *exactly* what the term is mocking lol.

>> No.11545147

>>11545097
I'll clarify for you, my first post was
>>11544838
and the rest has been a chain since then. I think right wingers participate in oppression olympics, just like all people do to some extent, because people love being whiny babies. I jumped in when I did though because there is a serious problem, that I experience in my own life, with people being denied assembly when they legally and imo morally deserve it. While I think it's fair to make fun of people for being whiny babies to try to gain political points, I don't think it's fair to minimise these very tangible problems. These problems are more serious than you make them out to be. Sure, there are hardly any speakers in the US (or even the UK) who don't have a way to have an internet platform that gets millions of listens, but it's not okay if the minute some of those people try to enter meatspace they have their rights ignored by government systems which are supposed to act fairly. And these phenomena are a common occurrence that seem to have a negative effect on the society in general.

>> No.11545903

Free Speech is a principle. The problem is that most people don't seem to agree with the principle anymore. Whether or not something is legal or not is not really the issue.

The first amendment enables us to have a free marketplace of ideas without government interference. That is pretty useless though if nobody actually wants to have a free marketplace of ideas.

>> No.11545945

>>11545903
we are literally living in the most free speech era of human history. You are posting on a board in which human beings are gathering together to write all manner of absolutely retarded shit that comes to their mind with no fear of punishment or retribution. Never before in human history could you find such large and active marketplaces to exchange ideas freely.

>> No.11545975

Is there any contemporary epic poetry?

What is the sequel to Keat's Endymion, is anyone trying to emulate Milton?

>> No.11545982

>>11541425
>don’t tell me why I’m wrong because it makes me feel dumb and that’s your fault so you should die
GENIUS

>> No.11545987
File: 137 KB, 500x437, cd9281f613ad3cf5ace8b06cf6e8677e76843825a647cdb3b5617094a13bf0ea.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11545987

>>11545903
>>11545945
If anything the fact that fascists can post with no fear is the biggest proof of the 'marketplace of ideas'

>> No.11546002

>>11542854
Embarrassing post.
Why do women even exists anymore

>> No.11546324

>>11545945
>>11545987
The internet with it's wild west style lack of regulation in its inception greatly enabled free speech, but that is rapidly disappearing. Exactly because people think this is actually a bad thing to exist.