How not to be derivative

[Anonymous No.11183136]

Guys, I'm fucked. I just realized that my prose is a knockoff of DFW. The novel I'm working on has (what seem to me) pretty glaring plot similarities with Infinite Jest. I don't even like Infinite Jest that much. I read it like two years ago and haven't touched it since. I knew he had influenced my writing somewhat but I didn't realize it was this bad. Why does everything I write sound like this guy? What do I do to fix it? I read lots of disparate works so it's not like I'm lacking for influences. What's the fucking deal?

[Anonymous No.11183296]

You are fucked. If it was almost any other author, you could salvage it. But being a fraud of a fraud... You need to change your life.

[Anonymous No.11183334]

>>11183136
can you post an excerpt from your diary?

[Anonymous No.11183343]

>>11183136
>I just realized that my prose is a knockoff of DFW
When I saw the Joyce pic I thought "at least he's copying a good author"

[Anonymous No.11183362]

Here is an excerpt. How bad is it?
Now the big ol’ Coca Cola (enjoy) scoreboard ticks and hummms the seconds down toward twin naughts, numerals illuminated in red-orange on top of a series of dim digital 8’s or topways infinities as in the bleachers Coach Roland alias during play Roach Coland espies the parabolic arc of an ill-aimed basketball and attempts to calculate on the fly the area under the curve. Across the court the 2nd Baptist Eagles’ enormous buzzcut coach foams in inchoate rage. Down-bleacher from Boss Roach Jordie lounges in dollar store Wayfarers with crossed ankles stretched slightly over the sideline and sipping gin out of a Gatorade bottle. Beside him Ernmeyer collapses onto the bench—tugs at his tube socks gasping and sweating so profusely that he has saturated already three full-sized bath towels. Jordie arches an eyebrow at him; he does not acknowledge.
(Here see: the Spongebob towel, fun meta-irony of Bob as simulacra of Sponge threaded into towel acting in a similar moisture-wicking capacity as Sponge but thereby undercutting its very Towel-ness by juxtaposition with Sponge so that it becomes less than Towel, and yet less than Sponge. Also it’s threadbare to the point of hole-y-ness further solidifying the comparison. The pillowy and wholly non-absorbent white towel, reserved usually for guests and decorative qualities, by subterfuge and haste snatched and smuggled in gym bag, itself a symbol of Towel without the abilities or use of towel. A whitewashed sepulcher. A Renaissance marble. A false idol. Third towel simply follows rule of threes and features duckies.)
Midflight Roach C. determines with some effort that for the parabola created by basketball en route to basket approximating the distance between launch and target at ~8m with apex of arc at ~5m a function may be defined f(x)=-516x2+52x and from this point utilizing his trusty Newtonian (Leibnizian!) tricks an integral may be calculated defined 08f(x) dxleading through some LCD fun to the conclusion Area Under Curve=26.666 m2as ponk! It misses entirely, passes through the fire doors and out into the hallway, crashing against lockers and display cases and denting the Eagles’ favored bubbler and ultimately resulting in a burst eye vessel for 2nd Baptist’s roidy coach. Downbench Jordie belches mightily as Ernmeyer sucks huge heaving gulps from a gallon jug of water.

[Anonymous No.11183378]

>>11183362
This is from a section that seems to be the most egregious to me. Most of it has nothing to do with sports, it's just set in a school and has a basketball scene or two. It's set in a christian high school in Tennessee.

[Anonymous No.11183414]

>>11183362
Throw it in fire

[Anonymous No.11183430]

>>11183136
Imitation is the first step to developing your own unique style. In this particular case it seems that your unique style will be absolute dogshit. Try finding another author that you would prefer to imitate.

[Anonymous No.11183455]

>>11183362
>Now the big ol’
stopped reading here

[Anonymous No.11183457]

>>11183362
well, that is not the worst bait I have ever seen, even if not the best one. I smirked.

[Anonymous No.11183463]

>>11183362
I like it. take out all the retarded parentheticals.

[Anonymous No.11183622]

>>11183455
>>11183430
>>11183414
Guess I'm definitely fucked then. I was actually entertaining the idea that I was a decent writer. Maybe I'll take some time off or something. Probably best to let go of any dreams of publishing in the meantime.

[Anonymous No.11183640]

You get good at writing by writing, nimrod. Taking a break won’t fix your shit. Keep churning out that awful prose no matter how badly it hurts.

[Anonymous No.11183653]

>>11183622
its not so bad, your voice is ugly, the subject is self-indulgent and lecturing people about calc in your writing is pedantic faggotry, but ive seen much worse on /lit/

[Anonymous No.11183691]

yeah it was pretty bad. I agree with the guy who said remove the parentheticals. I stopped reading at your annoying overlong dissection of the spongebob towel. why don’t you just write in your own voice and stop trying so hard? write the way you talk. also I’ve never read DFW but if he writes like that then I’ll have to steer clear of him

[Anonymous No.11183692]

Postmodernism was a mistake.

[Anonymous No.11183722]

>>11183362
don't put calculus in fiction, ffs, yeah, wallace contaminated your writing. read cormac mccarthy or some other writer diametrically opposite to wallace.

[Anonymous No.11183731]

>>11183722
to de-wallace your head, I mean, not saying mccarthy is better.

[Anonymous No.11183764]

>>11183362
this is bad but it's better than 90% of content on this board. Take out the parenthesis and the SpongeBob thing

[Anonymous No.11183776]

Here's another bit from later that I think is better. Thoughts?

Under the wide black Sollum skies Jordie pisses against the civic center wall and mumbles, rounding the syllables into soft warm monads floating out like liquor bubbles in the manner of that scene in Dumbo that’s much more akin to a bad DMT trip and had those guys ever even been drunk? Pearly pink pustules of languorous language, floating like flotsam to the big bleak black sky—very clever—here he goes:
“There once was a lady from Scrum
Who prefered to take it up the bum
So by men well-endowed
Her back door was oft plowed
That dirty ol’ Ernmeyer’s mum.”
No one is impressed, least of all the author. And he’d thought that one up three weeks prior and it was getting pretty stale and even Ernie himself didn’t seem to be as pissed off about it anymore. And aw shit he can’t think of anything now what with gin and fuck me pissing still it's a diuretic, that ethanol. Told Anne it was a diuretic and she said she snuck her daddy’s beer once and like to puked. Jordie thinks maybe he’s like to puke, but the salient point is she just didn’t get it, maaan. That it’s a diuretic. Leeches the water from your very living flesh--sluuuuuuurp! Like an oil man on adjacent land. Friend and foe. Frond. Got those out on the west coast with all those educated girls who are probably like, awakened and watch porn and will do whatever you want. Sexually, that is. Even the shit he wouldn’t brag about to Ernmeyer, or Obie. Hangovers primarily a result of dehydration and regret as like a psychosomatic infiltration of the muscles and skin, mind over matter. That’s God. Nous. There once was a noose from Toulouse, who dreamed he was eating his… Shoese.
Something stirring in the corner of his vision brings him round still pissing to see distended shadow of figure exiting door coming smushfoot toward his corner. Soon round it. Sneakers. Female gait. Gonna see muh dick. Will she wanna? Not quite that drunk he clamps off peeflow painfully and zips up, leans against the cold cinder block with crossed arms, ankles, eyes. Cool as a cucumber. It’s Lou-Anne Brisket.
“Jordan?”
“Jordanze.”
She smiles.
“Whatever, moron. I saw you walk out and you looked sort of sad, so I figured maybe you want some company. Do you want part of my Milky Way?”
“Whose face is that? On the wrapper.”
“I think it’s Billy Joel.”
“I don’t listen to secular music, Brisket.”
Lou-Anne smiles with chocolatey teeth at which Jordie grimaces, but in the dark the grimace looks like he’s smiling back. He takes a bite of the Milky way. A faint strawberry flavor from her lip gloss has mingled with the chocolate.
1/2

[Anonymous No.11183783]

>>11183776
“I’m composing poetry,” Jordie burps. “Wanna hear some?”
Lou-Anne has known all this time that under the bay-boy veneer Jordan has the tender soul of an artist à la young Leo Dicaprio or Bob Dylan maybe. He drinks to deal with the weight of deep understanding and accompanying tortures. Though his eyes are ringed with dark sleeplessness they are below the troubled surface deep celadon pools that a young girl may float down into and find within a tender lover who with chaste kisses and strong young arms will enfold her. There she will soothe his vexations and he will lead her to a fully realized self-concept and acceptable framework for her disparate pop-culture tastes. They will wander only far enough from the faith so that maybe she sucks his dick (in a very loving non-Lou-Anne-objectifying way) and he fingers her to climax at the movies (hokey sci-fi or arthouse or chick-flick), but then they’ll get married and move into the rent house next to her Noonaw and Poopaw’s and be very devout, faithfully attending sunday school, producing seven children and—
Although Jordie is occupied squinting through a carefully controlled soundless fart, Lou-Anne sees nothing but his pouting lips, which she latches onto with a sudden violence that almost knocks them both over. She is not good, having little experience: it’s almost all tongue. Jordie is worse, just sorta letting his jaw droop while Ms. Brisket probes between his lower lip and mandibular incisors. She proceeds to slam him against the wall, knocking the wind out of him so that he coughs into her mouth. Though this is off-putting and thoroughly boozy, Lou-Anne is undeterred. Jordie begins kneading her ass as they continue, more out of lizard brain instinctual autopilot than any real passion. Abruptly he breaks off, eyes glimmering oracular and recites:
“There once was a lass lived on Broadway
With a penchant for well-hung compadres.
He’s opposed to the thought
But only big cocks
Can satisfy Ernmeyer’s madre!”
Lou-Anne stares at him, strawberry lip gloss smeared everywhere, teeth still chocolatey.
“It came all at once--a flash of inspiration. It’s the muse, Brisket. She came to me to give me this gift, which I will deploy against Ernmeyer in Biology. You can bear witness. Cal--Calliope. That’s the one. Are you like, channeling? Come on, let’s go again.”
“Fuck you.”
2/2

[Anonymous No.11183796]

>>11183362
The math bit reminds me of that autistic writer and solo indie videogame developer who was obsessed with categorically logging how exactly fast superheroes were flying, and using hex to descibe exactly what color things were - Ulillillia

[Anonymous No.11183802]

>>11183136
fwiw OP, reading Updike helped me

[Anonymous No.11183964]

>>11183776
>>11183783
you need to learn to self edit because your stream of consciousness is getting in the way of plot progression. this was better than the previous excerpt but it still came off a bit too self indulgent. I almost stopped reading at the part about ethanol being diuretic because that paragraph was like twice the length it should have been.

that’s just my opinion. normally I wouldn’t give myself the right to critique someone so harshly but nobody else responded

[Anonymous No.11184021]

>>11183653
>I’ve seen much worse on /lit/

That’s a pretty high bar to clear

[Anonymous No.11184027]

>>11183796
Now this I must see

[Anonymous No.11184042]

>>11183362
It's a chore to read, much like DFW, with little going for it and little pathos. It's well described, pungent even, just lacks all momentum.

[Anonymous No.11184055]

>>11183964
>>11183796
>>11183764
>>11183691
>>11183653
Thanks for the feedback, fellas. Self-indulgent seems to be a consensus. Do you guys think it reads too much like DFW or am I just overthinking it? Other people have said it reminds them more of Joyce and Pynchon, but I don't know. Either way I want it to be unique and distinct.

[Anonymous No.11184067]

>>11183776
reminds me of that Sean Penn novel that people were memeing awhile back. You should stop hotdogging so much and try to make your writing simply enjoyable to read.

[Anonymous No.11184073]

>>11183362
Please tell me you're joking.

[Anonymous No.11184096]

>>11184055
>Reminds of Joyce, Pynchon and DFW
You're literally the average /lit/ poster

[Anonymous No.11184100]

>How to not be derivative
It's painfully obvious, idiot. Don't read the works of other authors.

I'm probably one of the few people who's written more books than he's read. My every paragraph exudes originality.

[Anonymous No.11184111]

>>11184096
I know. It's extremely depressing. The only one of those that I even fucking like is Joyce. I dropped GR halfway through and shouldn't have wasted the time I did reading Infinite Jest. I don't know why they've influenced me at all.

[Anonymous No.11184113]

>>11184055
Try reading Orwell to compensate. Also, as an exercise, try writing something as clearly and succinctly as possible, using the fewest number of words while having the greatest possible meaning.

[Anonymous No.11184116]

>>11184055
your problem is you’re copying authors whose prose is good enough to warrant their verbositity

[Anonymous No.11184119]

>>11184055
It's not good enough to read like DFW

That's not to say it's bad. You are too verbose and the stream of consciousness is overkill, but you don't have the same problem most people have on this board which is using complex language incorrectly. Your usage is essentially correct, just excessive, and I think you could write genuinely well if you calmed down a bit

[Anonymous No.11184130]

>>11183776
Would you mind explaining why you decided to write what you wrote?

[Anonymous No.11184153]

Worrying about being derivative is a young writer's problem. If you keep writing and keep experimenting you'll find your own voice eventually.

[Anonymous No.11184163]

>>11184130
>>11184119
The stream of consciousness stuff doesn't show up very often in my other writing. I'm not sure why it popped up here. I agree that it doesn't do much and probably needs to be axed.

[Anonymous No.11184169]

>>11184163
Well, think hard about why it showed up this time, and try to avoid it in the future. Stream of consciousness is fine if you're trying to say something significant, but here it looks like you did it for the sake of having it in there.

[Anonymous No.11184475]

>>11183430
Good point. Imitation is the first step. Even the greats often felt that they were derivative or didn't hold up to their heroes' work.

[Anonymous No.11184486]

>>11183136
Read the anxiety of influence OP

[Anonymous No.11184853]

>>11183783
>>11183776
>>11183362
why? pls don't do this

[Anonymous No.11184857]

>>11184853
>actually reading longwindposters

shig to the motha fuckin dig homeboy

[Anonymous No.11184877]

>>11184857
i didn't read all of it, just enough
no matter how many layers of irony OP is working on, i don't like it

[Anonymous No.11185382]

>>11184055
Joyce has a certain grace in his prose that you're lacking, for him it seems effortless but like the other posters said it comes across like you're trying very hard to be smart and write in a certain way, rather than letting the word flow as they will

[Anonymous No.11186525]

>>11183136
You may have read other works but DFW stuck with you the most. You have to make other things stick more. Read and reread books or read one writers entire bibliography. The reality is that once you start reading a lot, you realize no one has attained a perfect style, and the perfect style is likely to be an amalgamation of the greatest 20-30 writers of all time, which, in essence, becomes your own style because you have a wide influence.

Try someone like Joyce, Faulkner, Fitzgerald, Hemingway, or Tolstoy. All have a great style to them.

[Anonymous No.11186550]

>>11183796
The difference was that The Legend of the Ten Elemental Masters was actually a unique piece of fiction unlike OP's work.

[Anonymous No.11186567]

>How not to be derivative
Integrate

[Anonymous No.11186733]

>>11183362
You actually read incredibly similar to Sean Penn's new book and not so much DFW

[Anonymous No.11188172]

>>11183362
This is a joke right? Right?

[Anonymous No.11188180]

>>11183136
Just roll with it. Name it 'Limited Jest' or something like that.
who gives a fuck

[Anonymous No.11188190]

>>11183776
This is more like Pynchon now.