/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.11176148]

Essential schizo core? I'm looking for fringe non-fiction/fiction books about mysticism, psychedelics, altered states of consciousness, conspiracy theories, transhumanism, space migration etc.
Stuff similar to the writings of Robert Anton Wilson, Timothy Leary, Terrance McKenna, Philip K. Dick.

[Anonymous No.11176153]

[Anonymous No.11176207]

>>11176148
Check out Apocalypse Culture

[Anonymous No.11176224]

>>11176148
> RAW spends his entire life devoted to explaining consciousness and rationality
>
> LOL SCHIZO core lol

you want the Chuck Tingle section of the bookstore, kid. either buy something or get out.

[Anonymous No.11176964]

>>11176224
Dude, relax. Said it jokingly. I described what kind of books I'm looking for and if I mentioned RAW you can guess I'm interested in him and appreciate his work.

[Anonymous No.11176966]

>>11176148
Unironically Deleuze

[Anonymous No.11176976]

>>11176148
The Rose of the World is just what you need

[Anonymous No.11176979]

>>11176976
>The Rose of the World
To clarify, Daniil Andreev's 'Roza Mira'

[Anonymous No.11178140]

>>11176148
Artaud and Schreber

[XoXoSparkle^~^BaarXoXo No.11178194]

My diary desu. Though you can't read it, as I write the words down they are broadcast directly into the minds of my chosen using the spiritual sciences.
Pray and I will hear you, I will answer your prayers with my followers, if you are worthy my words will find your spirit though you will never find me until the day I call upon my flock.

[Anonymous No.11178206]

>>11176148
Wilson was so youthful and energetic and boyish-looking even with gray hair. I wanna just drop acid with him and listen to him talk about psychedelics, Gurdjieff, the Kabbalah and Crowley.

[Anonymous No.11178213]

>>11176148
Anons, is it possible to be a RAW-style occultist without all the transhumanism? How does he not acknowledge the idea that Death is what delimits and drives the quest for meaning?

t. Brainlet, on my way to the library to get the prolegomena so I can work my way up to Heidegger.

[Anonymous No.11178252]

>>11176148
R.D. Laing and Gregory Bateson. also read the Cybernetic Brain by Andrew Pickering and from counterculture to cyberculture for a historical overview of cybernetics

[Anonymous No.11178294]

>>11178252
just b yrself bb

[Anonymous No.11178331]

RAW was a goofball. The type of guy to think every single mundane coincidence was proof of the supernatural. Too bad he died before Ancient Aliens broadcast, he would’ve made a nice addition to the interviewees

[Anonymous No.11178358]

>>11178331
is there anything more miraculous than Being?

>After some hours, the dogs, exhausted by running round, almost dead, their tongues hanging out, set upon one another and, not knowing what they are doing, tear one another into thousands of pieces with incredible rapidity. Yet they do not do this out of cruelty.

>One day, a glazed look in her eyes, my mother said to me: ‘When you are in bed and you hear the barking of the dogs in the countryside, hide beneath your blanket, but do not deride what they do: they have an insatiable thirst for the infinite, as you, and I, and all other pale, long-faced human beings do.’

>Since that time, I have respected the dead woman’s wish. Like those dogs I feel the need for the infinite. I cannot, cannot satisfy this need. I am the son of a man and a woman, from what I have been told.

>This astonishes me…I believed I was something more.”

....................................................................................................
>Poetry must be made by all and not by one.

[Anonymous No.11178399]

>>11176966
ding ding

[Anonymous No.11178407]

>>11178331
Nah, I think he’s underrated. If he’s telling the truth he also definitely did get in touch with some ESP powers with his psychedelic use and mystical practices.

[Anonymous No.11178421]

>>11176148
I can't stop thinking about manson. i'm unironically getting worried about my sanity. Keep trying to talk to girls. Manson. Big Test coming on. Manson. I wonder, is the universe trying to tell me something?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRH9Nf0-Bzw

[Anonymous No.11178466]

>>11178407
digital hypermedia=ESP. the system is based on cold war containment and security principles, it relies on the containment of the self and the limitation of creativity. take down the corporations and military industrial complex through creative schizophrenia. Western politics remains trapped in a literate framework, it's all about recognition for the literate individual, but what if I told you you can be MORE than an individual? we've been trapped inside ourselves

[Anonymous No.11178684]

>>11178331
>Mundane
> Witnesses ouija board predict the exact date of the end of WW2
>>11178358
hear, hear.

[Anonymous No.11178699]

>>11176148
Memoirs of my Nervous Illness
Anti-Oedipus
A Thousand Plateaus
Fanged Noumena
VALIS

[Anonymous No.11178711]

found this on google books

[Anonymous No.11178752]

>>11176148
This is somewhat unrelated but check out "Junkie" and others books by William S. Burroughs (not sure about spelling)

[Anonymous No.11178769]

>>11176148
"The Body of Myth: Mythology, Shamanic Trance, and the Sacred Geography of the Body" has all of that besides space migration. Also pretty formidable non-fiction historiography.

"Journey into the Bright World" is a 70s era inspiration for "Twin Peaks" made by the woman who tried to popularize both yoga pants and ketamine after becoming disillusioned by the low potency of LSD. Strongly recommended.

[Anonymous No.11178779]

>>11178769
Fanged noumena is "amphetamine psychosis"-core but actually shit, so I'm only mentioning it because it's the closest you can get to a Ca++ kindling cascade on paper after the beat generation.

[Anonymous No.11178794]

>>11178779
I am slowly becoming more and more convinced that the increased schizophrenia you see in Marxist thinkers with the passage of time is a product of them being unable to accept that there's nothing inhrently wrong with capitalism so they unconsciously conjure up increasingly complex systems so they don't have to deal with the reality.

[Anonymous No.11178847]

>>11178794
I really don't want to turn this beautiful thread into yet another capXcom debate, but here's something fundamentally wrong with capitalism:
The principle that when an individual pursues his self-interest he unintentionally promotes the good of society, aka The Invisible Hand, is an incomplete assertion. There are clearly many ways in which pursuing your self-interest can be harmful to others or to society at large. I could cite a million examples, but really the burden of proof rests with people who believe in this peculiar god.

[Anonymous No.11178881]

>>11176148
Uptake with the Blake

[Anonymous No.11179333]

>>11176148
I remember feeling like I was coming apart a bit mentally while reading Valis but I don't know how much of that had to do with the book itself. I even had to take a break from it for a while because it was getting too much

[Anonymous No.11179351]

>>11178847
>The principle that when an individual pursues his self-interest he unintentionally promotes the good of society
that sounds more like objectivism or libertarians which you don't have to take seriously (and in fact nobody does outside of maybe America). Think social democracy for example. I think even neoliberals recognize that there have to be some sort of limitations to what a capitalist can do.

[Anonymous No.11179919]

>>11176964
<stern> you didn't use the "joking" markup tags, so how can we tell if you're being serious or not?</stern>

[Anonymous No.11179931]

>>11179919
The fuck is this, reddit? Figure it out for yourself.

[Anonymous No.11180221]

[Anonymous No.11180658]

>>11180221
^^^^^^^^^^^^ Where it all began, also, Hakim Bey.

[Anonymous No.11180690]

Val Valerian

[Anonymous No.11180693]

>>11178421
lol hes got that sort of charisma.

[Anonymous No.11180698]

Might Is Right is a bit different from what you're looking for but could be up your alley (more right-wing and less mystical, but still pretty nuts),

L.A. Waddell's stuff is up there too. Lots of silly ideas about British people coming from Phoenicia and other stuff like that.

[Anonymous No.11180906]

>>11178358
Very powerful.

[Anonymous No.11180964]

>>11178358
>The part where he sharpens his fingernails and plunges them into a baby's heart

>>11178794
If you look outside the echo chamber of leftbook and the edginess of /lit/ there's actually a strong trend towards what's called "new pragmatism" - luc boltanski etc

[Anonymous No.11182509]

>>11178358
What translation would you recommend?

[Anonymous No.11183821]

>>11176148
Ouspensky/Gurdjieff were big influences for the first two, at least slight influences on McKenna (who notes Gurdjieff’s ideas/existence in a lecture), and strangely enough fit with much of PKD’s exegesis although he never mentioned having read them (a letter from a friend to Dick reported in the exegesis suggests he reads Ouspensky, though).

[Anonymous No.11183827]

>>11176148

My diary desu

[Anonymous No.11183918]

Bob Shea´s Shaman

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/123645.Shaman

[Anonymous No.11183951]

Carlos Casteneda

[Anonymous No.11184003]

>>11178213
>Anons, is it possible to be a RAW-style occultist without all the transhumanism?

Most people start out that way and never come to accept transhumanism because it's too scurry. However extensive experience in religion and the occult should make you realize that transhumanism is in fact the answer.

[Anonymous No.11185212]

>>11176966
land desu

[Anonymous No.11185430]

>>11180658
i don't want to read that in case the NSA figure me for a pedo.

[Anonymous No.11185464]

>>11176148
why read schizo when you can be schizo? just a few dozen tabs or a coke overdose away OP

[Anonymous No.11186031]

>>11184003
Basically this. But with psychedelics thrown in too ( I only mention them specifically because they aren’t mentioned much in occult literature, but were used all over the world in esoteric and mystical/magickal experiences for thousands of years, and still are).

[Anonymous No.11186065]

RAW - all
Leary - all
McKenna - all
PKD - VALIS Trilogy
Deleuze - Capitalism and Schizophrenia
Judge Schreber - Memoirs of my Nervous Illness
William Leonard Pickard - The Rose of Paracelsus
Alesiter Crowley - Liber ABA, Magick Without Tears
Robert Graves - The White Goddess
Austin Osman Spare - Book of Pleasure
Kenneth Grant - The Magickal Revival, Zos Speaks!
Nick Land - Fanged Noumena

[Anonymous No.11186067]

>>11186031
Related, mushroom coming entities that people come across

[Anonymous No.11186071]

>>11186067

[Anonymous No.11186099]

These two book are great

[Anonymous No.11186130]

>>11176153
This is actually fascinating anon.
>The author suggests dropping out of society and expanding the skull like past cultures have done in order to relieve pressure of the brain and regain your lost psychic abilities

[Anonymous No.11186136]

>>11176153
>through cannibalism - intelligence can be eaten

oh god this will be the next fad diet in silicon valley

[Anonymous No.11186268]

Can someone make a chart or list? I'm very interested in this.

[Anonymous No.11186277]

Michael Collins Piper is perfect for this if you don't mind him rambling about the Jews. He does make a good point about Mossad being involved in JFK

[Anonymous No.11186279]

>No J.G. Ballard

[Anonymous No.11186299]

True Light: A, superior, take, unto, the, premier, haloing, of, tenuation. Readily, available, True Light, provides, resource, into, time's, motifed, and, vestuved, authenticate, revelation

By Lark Voorhies

[Anonymous No.11186722]

>>11176964
You sound like an insufferable cunt. Like one of those numales, who put the word pill in everything.
*Teleports behind you and slaps you on the head*

[Anonymous No.11187325]

>>11178421
>>11180693
I've tried to understand his appeal but I can't. I'm not getting his supposed charisma at all. And the more I read or listen to what he actually says, the more it is not only deluded babble, but incredibly dull babble at that. He and the things he says are completely uninteresting. He knew or understood nothing and talked a whole lot about it. Guess that tends to pull some people along.

[Anonymous No.11187337]

>>11178358
This, a million times this.

Je te salue, vieil océan !

[Anonymous No.11187361]

Le monde est ma représentation.

[Anonymous No.11188415]

>>11176148
>schizo core
non-dual spiritual texts
spacing out and focusing on the eternal now
akashic records
malkavian bible
pic related

t. diagnosed schizo (but i'm not really, trust me)

[Anonymous No.11188565]

>Francis E Dec
>Eat it up, you heretics of Astrocism
http://www.bentoandstarchky.com/dec/rants.htm

[Anonymous No.11188779]

[Anonymous No.11189959]

>>11188779
> no gnostic shit
> go look for the first thing on the list
> first result: http://www.gnostic.org/kybalionhtm/kybalion.htm
lel.
are you the poster in the pic?

[Anonymous No.11190500]

>>11188779
>all this stuff is garbage I don't even need to argue why just trust me I read hundred greenpill books lol

[Anonymous No.11190736]

>>11188779
The Kybalion and Bardon are trash and nothing to do with real Hermeticism. Nearly everything you can come across written in the past century is tainted with theosophical delusions.

Real esoterism is an elaboration on and intellectual hermeneutic of so-called exoteric forms, a previous revelation. The "esoteric" traditions are creative exegeses of venerable writings, forms, and rites. The best way to understand esoterism is to study some of the latest scholarship being done on the Neoplatonists and theurgy, who peculiarly established a so-called school of thought by using Plato's writings as a kind of Quran or Veda.

For anyone else looking for "schizocore," keep in mind it's a recreational frivolity and not to be mistaken as genuine mysticism or knowledge. Not even the so-called ancestors of theosophical occultism believed fantasies had anything to do with genuine metaphysics. Though in certain practices visions and hallucinogens appeared, they were always culturally and socially determined or "impurities" of the soul, the seat of the senses; and they merely served as a departure for an intellectual conception, a rising to universal and true knowledge, as all symbols serve to do. In other words, the biggest obstacle for the mystic is that he relies totally on his institutions and his sentimentality, that are his supports, and not his knowledge, to guide him. But if those institutions are decayed and insipid, and if he has only been exposed to falsity and error, would not his corresponding visions will be deformed and in error? And this could only merely lead to a psychotic complex, delusions, and all sorts of detestable conditions.

[Anonymous No.11190766]

>>11179919
fuckin hell mate, just kill yourself. stop posting.

[Anonymous No.11191153]

>>11176224
I'm schizophrenic and hopefully any other schizos know what I mean when I say that there is nothing quite like reading RAW during a full blown psychotic episode. His books are heavier than an acid trip in the right state of mind, and he is the only one I can read in severe psychosis.

Any other schizos know this feel of "magical books"?

[Anonymous No.11192242]

Thanks for the suggestions all xx

[Anonymous No.11192666]

>>11191153
The Diary of Vaslav Nijinsky

Legendary Russian ballet dancer who documented his schizophrenic break in a diary.

[Anonymous No.11193855]

bump

[Anonymous No.11193878]

>>11191153
I felt like everything was an alien language hieroglyph that spoke directly to my brain and informed my thoughts when I was schizo.

Really enjoyed Kenneth Grant's The Magickal Revival at that time. Though it probably fucked me up worse.

[Anonymous No.11193891]

>>11193878
Also, check out Ecpyrosis. It's a compilation of Starfire Essays which are all really excellent if you practice occultism.

[Anonymous No.11193930]

>>11192666
I believe this was mentioned in the Outsider by Colin Wilson. Good book as well.

[Anonymous No.11193938]

>>11186722
>angry incel

[Anonymous No.11194229]

>>11180658

that shit both ruined & changed my life when i read it at 17

[Anonymous No.11194510]

[Anonymous No.11194574]

>>11185464
cocaine doesn’t cause schizophrenia, even in large doses t causes “stim psychosis” which is v diff from acid induced schiz
>>11186065
should probably also giv them daodejing and lovecraft
>>11186130
yes its from frogtwitter
>>11190736
Bardon is Hermeticism and Visions are the basis for all art and mystical traditions, there would be no Tibetan book of the Dead, book of changes, Genesis, Kabbalah, Vedas or Zen without altered states. Blake would not have happened, no Milton, no Böhme, no Dionysius, no Eleusinian Mysteries, no Oracle at Delphi. i have no idea why people think you can just repeat words and “hold” beliefs and be a mystic. if you aren’t seeing things and having out of body experiences, expansive or contractive, you aren’t with-it

even Judge and Blavatsky who loathed the idea of “states” described meditative visions and higher perception of reality, Evola wrote at least 2 books about this and i don’t know about Guenon but Socrates had a Daemon he communed with, Parmenides saw his metaphysics in a dream, Heraclitus spoke in parables, Chris and all the Biblical prophets had visions, Daniel and John had esoteric visions filled with occult metaphor, Appolonius of Tyre had visions, Bruno had visions, Samuel Falk a famous rabbinical freemason had visions, all the Tibetan Lamas had visions and Tibetan art is totally predicated on noetic and ecstatic visions, Yoga is predicated on visions or alterations of consciousness, Samadhi in Theravada is predicated on visions, Muhammad had visions, the Suffi mystics had visions and visual meditation, Orphics had visions, all the Gnostic tradition was based on visions and ecstatic states, cult of Zurvanism was based on diabolic visions, Homer had visions which was how he produced his stories, the early greeks had visions, hence centaurs and nymphs, Alexander had visions and relied on seers, Hitler and Himmler had visions (Himmler thought he was in contact with a dead Eastern german king who conquered the Slavs), most Zen masters had visions, some of them had premonitions (which are frequent in that literature), Shamans of the steppe and himalayas have visions, American shamans have visions, African sorcerers have visions and go into altered states. You’re basically lying because your religious beliefs (which are exoteric) forbid altered states of consciousness and so you anarchonistically apply morals for the public to the spiritual elite (as opposed to the management classes who have taken up the name of elite).

[Anonymous No.11194582]

>>11193878
you never stop being schizo lol >>11193938
LEAVE THEM ALONE

[Anonymous No.11194673]

>>11176148
pretty sure psychedelics are traps set by satan, i dropped acid recently and my trip was so intense that when i came back to reality my muscles were out of my control and were tensing and constricting my body and i started having really horrible and intense anxiety that would just not go away, this lasted for 2 weeks, i really came close to just snapping and going insane, i thought my life was over, its like i got possessed by demons.

if you're a normal healthy person please don't take your life in vain and desecrate it with psychedelics, don't fall for the 'its harmless' meme, when you start researching into the people who have been trying to normalise it you'll find a lot of them have connections to the occult and other sinister malicious things

[Anonymous No.11194731]

>>11194574
Wrong. Visions are not the basis of all true traditions, Balavatsky was a fraud, and altered states are entirely secondary to principles. True esoterism is the intellectual penetration of the forms of a tradition.

If you're interested in "visions" for the sake of them, you're another delusional fool, if not a blatant drug addict, that has fallen into idolatry (eidololatria), in the sense that you've mistaken impressions (eidolon) and fantasies (phantasiai) of the imagination (phantasia) for truth.

>Evola and Guenon
You're citing people you haven't even read.

>"Some even go so far as to claim they have had 'metaphysical experiences' without realizing that the juncture of these two words constitutes a pure and simple 'non sense'. (Guenon, Miscellanea, 171n72)"

>"Errors more subtle, and so the more to be feared, sometimes arise when a ‘communication’ with superior states or ‘spiritual worlds’ is mentioned in connection with initiation, for this involves the all too frequent illusion that something is ‘superior’ simply because it appears to be in some way extraordinary or ‘abnormal’. We will recall here what we have said elsewhere about the confusion of the psychic with the spiritual, which is the error most often committed in this regard, for the psychic states in fact have nothing ‘superior’ or ‘transcendent’ about them[.] (Guenon, Perspectives, 18)"

>"There has been occasion elsewhere to call attention to the initiatic symbolism of a 'navigation' across the ocean (representing the psychic domain), which must be crossed while avoiding all its dangers in order to reach the goal; but what is to be said of someone who flings himself into the ocean and has no aspiration but to drown in it . . . with no suspicion that they are mistaking for a fullness of 'life' something that is in truth the realm of death and of a dissolution without hope of return. (Guenon, Reign of Quantity, 239-240)"

>"[T]he psychic domain is indeed in all respects the privileged sphere of influence of 'Satan' in the human order and even in the cosmic order[.] (Guenon, Reign of Quantity, 242)"

>"This means that the operation must connect its activity, beginning with the [intellectual principle of man], for the empowerment, in some external fashion to the substances used and to maintain a connection to the end . . . we say that the preliminary condition is the [Nous]. In all other cases, that is, in the case of a passive experience, the sole result will be the phenomenology, utterly devoid of any interest to us, of "artificial paradises" and of those who abuse alcohol or drugs. (Evola, Hermetic Tradition, 137)

>"The intellectual principle that is the form of man (in the Aristotelian sense) [Nous], "is the beginning and end of the preparations." (Hermetic Tradition, 200)"

[Anonymous No.11194808]

>>11194731
but someone had to have a vision first or they wouldn’t know how to describe an otherworldly or supersensory experience. People weren’t just deriving principles from psychotechnical operations they had noetic and ecstatic states. For instance both hermes and Tat have visions, in fact the first book of the Corpus is a vision, its explicitly a vision because the narrator describes it as such. There are multiple instances of these. Genesis had to have come from a vision, there is no evidence at all that its literal and there is extremely little in the way of a derivation of principles.
>Blavatsky was a fraud
so were Evola and Guenon, technically all religionists are fraudulent by talking about the Absolute using conditioned language. Dionysius said this and so did the Zen masters.
>Noesis
has to come from a vision, the knowledge has a correlate. Socrates describes SEEING a daemon and HEARING a voice, the Oracle HEARD from Apollo Socrates was the wisest man alive. The eleusinians and orphics would take psychotropics and work themselves into out-of-body states. Dionysian rites involved ecstatic frenzy. Gnosticism was based in visions, the entire Pistis Sophia is a series of abstract visions.

The Tibetan Book of the Dead is all based in visions of the after life from Lamas and the Atiyoga tradition is based in causing visions. Shamanism is visionary through and through. Then there’s Swedenborg, Gurdjeff, Jung, Blake all who had visions to form their theo-architectonics.
>intellect is everything
then what is the point of religion and why is there all the allusion, metaphor and artwork? why is there simile and analogy? why is the Chandogya upanishad using abstract depictions of the universe and GEOMETRIC understandings to determine the nature of the Udghita? Also curious for Guenon, he said he was geometrically inclined in his metaphysics (also i have read Evola and he talks about altered states of perception in Yoga of Power), as was Plato. My serious quesion is: do they expect the mind’s eye to be empty, do they not heed signs, do they understand that the intellect goes with intuition, do they understand that religion is not rational? im seriously considering stopping all my studies of Evola if they believed that talking to yourself monologically and holding a belief was some type of height for spirituality. “knowing” something you don’t SEE, again Yoga of Power (every single chance he gets), seems like its lying to yourself. Intellectual understanding seems hollow especially if its like my understanding of 2+2 That’s totally languid and dessicated. That’s it? Why the fuck would anyone care?

[Anonymous No.11194815]

>>11194731
>just read books to become enlightened
Doesn't work that way bugboi

[Anonymous No.11194829]

>>11194731
Also:

Socrates describes seeing shapes with your mind’s eye, Plato calls the world made of elements (implying they can be seen) and describes a geometry of reality (again a vision is induced, a person is seeing an object of subtle perception); then you have Bohme and Kircher, Fludd and Swedenborg, unless you are suggesting that all Christian Mysticism is garbage (which would be specious) then we have a problem because they had visions constantly; John Dee had visions, invented Enochian magic; then you have The Yogis, i seriously doubt Pantanjali didn’t have visions and Samadhi states are explicitly supersensory and visionary; the Jhanas are described in the Nikayas as being visionary, though with an accompanying intellectual apperception of unreality. it seems like you’re lying. then of course the Egyptian priests who had visions and could commune with gods, see them, see spirits, see the metaphysical geometry. very suspect if this is what guenon believed

[Anonymous No.11194855]

>>11194808
>religionist
Thank you for reading Hanegraaff. You're a good man, anon.

[Anonymous No.11195019]

>>11194808
So much rambling, I don't even know where to begin.

>then what is the point of religion and why is there all the allusion, metaphor and artwork? why is there simile and analogy?
Because nothing can be expressed without symbols. I can't even tell you I have understood or saw or heard what you are saying without employing sensible analogy. Everything you see on your screen currently is a mere symbol, a point of departure for your intellection. The reasons of things (logoi) are illuminated to us by the Nous. This is attested by all the roots of so-called occult tradition; the latter thinks it can lift incongruous parts from them all and attain wisdom by a touch of delusion and fantasy.

>"Reasonable speech is the servant of Nous. For what Nous wants, speech in turns interprets. Nous sees everything, and eyes all corporeal things. And yet Nous does not become an observer for the eyes, but the eyes for Nous. (The Definitions of Hermes Trismegistus to Asclepius 5.1)"
>"Who does not understand speech has no Nous, who talks without Nous says nothing: since he understands nothing, he has no Nous and he talks, for his talk is a crowd and a crowd has neither Nous nor reasonable speech. Speech endowed with Nous is a gift of God; speech without Nous is a finding of man. Nobody sees heaven and what is therein, but only man. Only man has Nous and speech. (ibid. 5.3)"

Where else to go to? The Plotinian "flight of the alone to the alone" was initially an Egyptian hermeneutical procedure performed by priests walking through a temple and contemplating the signs there, that are physically meaningless; the so-called Absolute was reached by a dialectical ladder, not even requiring trance-like conditions. Socrates' daemon is a guiding principle, don't mistake mythological figures for the true forms. The etymology of Apollo literally means "non-dual." Have fun trying to describe how to have a sensuous experience of something non-dual, as sensation by its nature is correlated with an object. Or perhaps you're ready to admit exoterism itself is symbol.

>im seriously considering stopping all my studies of Evola
You're not fooling anyone with "studies." And "whaat it's too dry for me dude, what do you mean knowledggee" is an admission of a tendency for escapism, not metaphysics. You can look at numbers forever and never understand their operations without a direct intuition of the principles that impose themselves on reasoning.

Just wait until you discover the true faculty of intellectual intuition is faith!

The fact is the mind struggles to conceive pure principles without forms and impressions in the imagination. All of the purification underwent is precisely to neutralize the fallibility and illusory nature of the imagination or passive intellect.

And Jung and Gurdijeff were also frauds

Since you have so much affinity for taking the symbol for the reality symbolized, I suggest you carefully read Plato's myth of the cave.

[Anonymous No.11195041]

>>11180658
My local shop was selling this for 5$ I was willing to buy it just because of how out there it seems

[Anonymous No.11195067]

>>11194815
Let me guess, the difference between you and me is that my theoretical preparations are truthful and just; yours are illusory and false, a faggot for Satan to imbue his ember unto.

[Anonymous No.11195070]

>>11194815
this so much, holy fuck.
That dude is clearly obsessed with a certain aesthetic of enlightenment, the image of the recluse Isaac Newton perhaps, sitting quietly in his study just being better than everybody else.
>>11194731
You gotta have the experiences buddy. You can't disprove phenomenological truths with theory. They're incompatible.

[Anonymous No.11195106]

>>11195070
I feel like Eirenaeus Philalethes with his fire that the darkness comprehended not.

Take heed: >>11195067

[Anonymous No.11195142]

>>11195106
christian mumbo-jumbo aside, what am I supposed to "take heed" of?
> I'm right and you are wrong.
great argumentative skills, my dude

[Anonymous No.11195188]

>>11195019
you’re an idiot and lying blatantly. im not going to correct anything you said you haven’t read the Corpus Hermeticum or the Socratic dialogues or Zen texts or the Nikayas or Daodejing or Mahayana Canon and i honestly doubt you’ve read the Agamas or anything about Shamanism. Embarassing spiteful crab
>dude the dialectic
wat does that mean? for soc that was usually linguistic so language is the way?
>no visions necessary
i strongly doubt egyptian priests didn’t have visions since they wrote a whole book about the afterlife with visuals, colors and sounds
>apollo is non-dual
apollo also speaks to oracles, heroes and politicians and we know this because they constantly claimed this was the case

ignored parmenides, ignored atiyoga and pantanjali, ignored the visuals in chandogya upanishad, ignoring shamanism

lol have fun with your books

[Anonymous No.11195273]

>>11190736
>neoplatonists somehow have a better grasp of hermeticism
>doesn't mention corpus hermetica at all

[Anonymous No.11195381]

>>11195273
The Platonists studied under Egyptian priests. In fact, most of the Greek philosophers did. Even then, I cited Hermes Trismegistus' Definitions to Asclepius here >>11195019


>>11195188
"It is plain that the One is unborn and not imagined [sic!] and it is unmanifest, but it appears as all kinds of images, through all and in all and chiefly to those to whom it wishes to appear. . . . Pray that through grace you will be able to perceive God as so great that even just one ray of Him may shine in your mind. For pure perception perceives the unmanifest, as it is itself also unmanifest. If you are strong enough, He will appear to the eye of Nous, O Tat. . . . This is God, greater than a name. He is unmanifest, yet He is most manifest; He can be perceived by Nous; He can be seen by the eyes. . . . You are Nous, and what is apprehended by Nous. (Corpus Hermeticum 5.2-11)"

Really makes you think...

[Anonymous No.11195430]

>>11195381
So basically the notion of vision is an esoteric means of conveying metaphysics that are actually intellectually derived in a primal or basic manner and not from hallucinogenic states? Sounds interesting... but why lie about where it comes from? Is Guenon the Nietzsche of the East?

[Anonymous No.11195498]

>>11195430
The reason they call metaphysical knowledge a vision is because it has more to do with a perceiving than a deriving. Aristotle wrote in Posterior Analytics that all demonstration eventually requires premises that are indemonstrable, simple (adiaireton, in the sense that it is indivisible and non-analytical or discursive, diairesis being synonymous with analysis), and infallible. An example of such principle is that of the excluded middle. Such knowledge imposes itself, so to speak, on reasoning. If these principles cannot be demonstrated, whence do they derive their authority? It can only be obtained from a faculty that is one with its object and that is infallible. Often this faculty is regarded as synonymous with faith in the mysteriosophic literature. You can see how far and removed this is from faith as a weak longing or hope of a better world.

Initiatic knowledge is, so to speak, an exaltation of that faculty. The sacred sciences are all applications of the principles derived from this faculty; with the proper intellect, what would conventionally be an aesthetic experience of the products of those sciences or arts that excites the emotions becomes a rhetorical experience that is one of knowledge. The same metaphysic applies to visions and dreams, no doubt. But that is the only justification they have. The One is revealed, in a sense, in all images and symbols, but intellectually concealed. Penetrating the latter is the concern of all the primordial traditions.

>why lie about where it comes from?
Who has lied? And what about?

[Anonymous No.11195508]

>>11195498
So noesis is a sense that is infallible? I must disagree as a schizophrenic, and man has viewed the great varieties of faith in his fellows...
>why lie?
Why describe a meditative visionary state when all is necessary is first principles and logic?

[Anonymous No.11195592]

>>11195508
>noesis is a sense that is infallible?
>"The intellect alone is capable of grasping an intelligible essence certainly and perfectly. . . . Nor does an impression drawn in the dust by a geometrician comprehend it. For this is merely one of the copies multiplying it, not first known by reasoning but by sense and imagination. Nor yet the definition, which does indeed circle around its essential nature; but [the definition] is complex and composite and so cannot seize upon the simplicity of the essence. Nor does the theory of it grasp it, even if it meditates a thousand times things that themselves belong accidentally to the circle, and one might as well call it knowledge of these other things. All these are about it but are not itself. But the intellect and intellectual knowledge knows the essence itself and comprehends the Form itself even by simple intuition. So it alone is capable of knowing the circle." From Proclus In Parm. 7.39-76

The intellect apprehends its object intuitively and therefore infallibly, as if it did not there could never be a definition or articulation of the pure idea. It is only in expression that fallibility comes about: but if we did not *see* what we were talking about, from what measure or unit could we appeal to see if our analyses are adequate? In fact, we would have no recourse to a measure; and it is in fact the element of the One or hyparxis in intelligibles that acts as this measure in them and renders them accessible to the intellect, to which all definition and imitation have their recourse.

>Why describe a meditative visionary state when all is necessary is first principles and logic?

It goes back to what I laid out earlier: all means of expression are symbolical, including images and our own world. If I say there is a hierarchy of being, what I am really saying is that there is a logical succession of being. What I really mean then again is that there are certain modes or measures of being that come prior or posterior to others. But modus means a state or abode (sthana, stasis) and thus I've fallen into symbolism again both spatial and temporal. And you'll notice no matter how I wrestle, I can never get around appealing to the conditions of *this* world to describe *that* world. I can't even talk of logical succession without appealing to temporal symbolism itself.

In other words, if it is not in principle true that symbols and contingent things are required for knowledge of the absolute and unconditioned, nevertheless in fact it is nearly impossible to arrive at knowledge without supports. Due to the fact language itself is a symbolical tool, man is naturally a symbolical animal (cf. rational animal). The danger in visionary experiences is not that it cannot lead to knowledge: it is that visions always occur in particular ways to particular people depending on their culture and experiences, as all symbols. If they have received false teachings, false visions will follow suit: >>11190736

[Anonymous No.11195614]

>>11195592
>false teachings
Still haven't prescribed any objective measure of that true teaching besides Guenon and Sankara and Evola said so.

[Anonymous No.11195635]

>>11195614
You've said lots of things, and I've understood them all

[Anonymous No.11195731]

>>11195635
Idk. I guess I have a good life and get laid a lot and just like women's liberation and don't care if fags marry and enjoy easy access to esoteric texts via internet and porn and birth control and marijuana and alcohol and capitalism so idk why I gotta follow old shit ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Anonymous No.11196497]

>>11194229
Can you elaborate?

[Anonymous No.11196617]

>>11194673
Don't you have some pokemon cards to burn

[Anonymous No.11196937]

>>11194673
No details of what was your source, the dose, the setting, your mindset and intention, you probably didn't even consider all that and you also sound like a crazy christian

[Anonymous No.11196969]

>>11196497
Got him put on a watchlist for buying the works of a known pedophile.

[Anonymous No.11197038]

>>11195592
>In other words, if it is not in principle true that symbols and contingent things are required for knowledge of the absolute and unconditioned, nevertheless in fact it is nearly impossible to arrive at knowledge without supports
seeing isn't knowledge its just seeing. there is no knowledge because there is nothing to contain knowledge anymore when there is just Seeing. you haven't attained to any of these states you're just a bug nerd
>Due to the fact language itself is a symbolical tool, man is naturally a symbolical animal (cf. rational animal). The danger in visionary experiences is not that it cannot lead to knowledge: it is that visions always occur in particular ways to particular people depending on their culture and experiences, as all symbols
Which means I don't have to take anything you or Guenon said seriously and I could still reach the end without any instruction since all instruction is symbolical and its all OUT THERE as you imply by saying it has to be seen, implying an outside to see into.
>f they have received false teachings, false visions will follow suit
there is no reason at all to believe that Advaita and Suffism are true visions.

[Anonymous No.11197084]

>>11193878
Whenever I read something when I worked at the pool I would see whatever I read be reenacted by all the people at the pool. They would all comment on the passage I was reading and the clouds would form images from the books.

Best books: Illuminatus Trilogy and Prometheus Rising by RAW and Robert Shea

I pity the fool that never read a book that was describing their own life story as it was happening

[Anonymous No.11197391]

Anyone read Michael Muhammad Knight? Pic related sounds interesting

[Anonymous No.11198210]

>>11178684
Eventsare really easy to synchronize. It is not that unusual.

[Anonymous No.11198235]

>>11178794
Capitalism is and conduces toward social Marxism; liberation of the peripheral other and the entropy incurred from it bodes well for firms and the market at large. See: the entirety of history from early modernity until WW1. dont be a fucking idiot