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/lit/ - Literature


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11007014 No.11007014 [Reply] [Original]

Remember men
They can never take your honour away

>> No.11007019

>>11007014
>be spergler
>constantly glorify heroicism
>live your life sitting on a chair, reading books
what did spergler mean by this?

>> No.11007020

>>11007014
What a load of bullshit

>> No.11007040

>>11007019
He fulfilled the Nietzschean goal of being yourself.

>> No.11007042

Isn't This quote from evola?

>> No.11007053
File: 334 KB, 1280x720, 1523538980352.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11007053

>>11007014
>being an unthinking and obedient sheep who dies for arbitrary reasons wholly indifferent of him is greatness and honor
Well that explains it! Tfw literally too intelligent to be honorable or great.

>> No.11007080

I somewhat agree. There is a courage in facing an inevitable fate with dignity. The problem is the assumption that such a fate exists in the first place.

>> No.11007082

>>11007053
Surrendering yourself to the highest in the hierarchy (A person or a value) is the best feeling in the world. But it makes little sense in our modern society (Because of the structures), so contemporary authoritarians are kind of retarded. The closest you get is surrenderinig yourself to love, anon.

>> No.11007089

>>11007042

Evola translated Spengler's magnum opus into Italian. Pretty cool.

>> No.11007097
File: 539 KB, 1649x1200, Da2jLU6X4Acs5aO.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11007097

Related?
Quotation is from George Patton.

>> No.11007098
File: 18 KB, 220x366, Oswald_Spengler_2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11007098

>The Great Challenge Facing the West

>Today more or less everywhere -- in the Far East, India, South America, South Africa -- industrial regions are in being, or coming into being, which, owing to their low scales of wages, confront us with a deadly competition. The unassailable privileges of the white nations have been thrown away, squandered, betrayed. The others have caught up with their instructors. Possibly -- with the cunning of the colored races and the over-ripe intelligence of their ancient civilizations -- they have surpassed them.

>Where there is coal, petroleum or water-power, there a new weapon can be forged against the heart of Faustian [Western] civilization. The exploited world is beginning to take its revenge on its masters. The countless hands of the colored races -- at least as clever, and far less demanding -- will shatter the economic organization of the whites at its foundation. The accustomed luxury of the white worker, in contrast to that of the coolie, will be his doom. The labor of the white is itself becoming superfluous. The huge masses of men centered in the Northern coal areas, the great industrial works, the capital invested in them, whole cities and districts, threaten to succumb to the competition. The center of gravity of production is steadily shifting away from them, especially given that even the colored races' respect for the whites came to an end with the [First] World War. This is the real and final basis of the unemployment that prevails in the white countries. It is no mere crisis, but the beginning of a catastrophe...

>> No.11007103
File: 15 KB, 220x298, Oswald_Spengler_3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11007103

>>11007098
>Faced as we are with this destiny, there is only one world-outlook that is worthy of us, that which has already been mentioned as the Choice of Achilles -- better a short life, full of deeds and glory, than a long life without content. Already the danger is so great, for every individual, every class, every nation, that to cherish any illusion whatever is deplorable. The march of time cannot be halted; there is no question of prudent retreat or clever renunciation. Only dreamers believe there is a way out. Optimism is cowardice.

>We are born into this time and must bravely follow the path to the destined end. There is no other way. Our duty is to hold on to the lost position, without hope, without rescue, like that Roman soldier whose bones were found in front of a door in Pompeii, who died at his post during the eruption of Vesuvius because someone forgot to relieve him. That is greatness. That is what it means to be a thoroughbred. The honorable end is the one that can not be taken from a man.

>-- Oswald Spengler, Der Mensch und die Technik (Munich: C.H. Beck: 1931), pages 86-89.

>> No.11007112
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11007112

>Oh shit they forgot to tell me I can go, I guess i'll just stay here and die lol

>> No.11007122
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11007122

>> No.11007138

>>11007122
Not appropriate for Spengler. He chose his values out of his own will. Stirnerian egoism =/= spooks are bad.

>> No.11007160

>>11007014
>like the Roman soldier whose bones were found in front of a door in Pompeii, who, during the eruption of Vesuvius, died at his post
>the honorable end is the one thing that can not be taken from a man
Yeah, but...
how if honour prick me off when I
come on? how then? Can honour set to a leg? no: or an arm? no: or take away the grief of a wound? no.
Honour hath no skill in surgery, then? no. What is honour? a word. What is in that word honour? what is that honour? air. A trim reckoning! Who hath it? he that died o’ Wednesday. Doth he feel it? no. Doth he hear it? no. ‘Tis insensible, then. Yea, to the dead. But will it not live with the living? no. Why? detraction will not suffer it. Therefore I’ll none of it.

>> No.11007170

>>11007053
>arbitrary reasons
There are no arbitrary reasons.

>> No.11007178

>>11007138
Maybe so but that example of a soldier dying for "honour" seemed pretty spooklike.

>> No.11007179
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11007179

>The West is doomed
That's where you're wrong, kid

>> No.11007181

>>11007178
Aren't lures the antispooks? He was obviously enamored with the idea.

>> No.11007188
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11007188

>>11007179

This just came out.
I wonder if its any good.

I enjoyed Dreamer of the Day a lot when I read it years ago. I wonder how the two stack up.

>> No.11007193
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11007193

>>11007178

Embracing an honourable end can be spooky, but it's worth it.

>> No.11007195

>>11007170
Wrong.

>> No.11007201

>>11007188
No idea, I have had Dreamer of the Day recommended to me though. I've been meaning to check it out.

>> No.11007202

>>11007193
Refer to >>11007160
You won't know or feel its worth, therefore it actually holds no worth at all.

>> No.11007221

The West needs another war. Not a war that is declared on the pretext of political posturing like Vietnam, Irag, or the Gulf War, but a real war like both World Wars. A war that is all-or-nothing, which strikes terror in the hearts of citizens in all nations who are fighting in it, and will determine the course of history for all. A war that forces boys to turn into Men on the initiatic battlefield. We need Men forged through the crucible of war to save the West now more than ever.

>> No.11007235

>>11007019
>>11007040
When it comes down to it, the majority of the intellectualising types are just escapist idealists.

>> No.11007236

>>11007221
t. caesar

>> No.11007238

>>11007221
>we need an atomic warfare to save the west
stop living in a videogame you manchild

>> No.11007244

>>11007201

Dreamer of the Day is a pretty beefy tome. What made it interesting to me is how wide-ranging it was--surveying as it were the whole of post WWII 'fascism'.

This other book might be a more pointed effort. I haven't looked into it yet.

>> No.11007268

>>11007202
>You won't know or feel its worth, therefore it actually holds no worth at all.

Worth comes about from how you value a thing.
You can highly value a future end with honour without delving into specifics.

>> No.11007330

>>11007082
>Surrendering yourself to the highest in the hierarchy (A person or a value) is the best feeling in the world. But it makes little sense in our modern society (Because of the structures)
Oh please anon, the ruling class and ideology of the past wasn't any nobler or more genuine than today'. Soldiers of old were dying for inbred sodomites and thieves who'd convinced them and their society that this was the correct thing to do.

>> No.11007352

>>11007221
I'd rather just have an iceage

>> No.11007365

>>11007082
I highly, highly, highly disagree. Unless, by the highest in the hierarchy, you're referring to yourself or someone in your immediate family.
>>11007181
This anon >>11007178 is right. It is a spook.
>>11007193
>but it's worth it
Why? Because you say so?
>>11007268
The Stirner argument generally boils down to that it's not you that actually values it. That the idea of "something" like that has replaced your genuine inner self.

>> No.11007370

>>11007221
You just need dedication and duty and the west is fixed by itself.

>> No.11007383

>>11007330
The ruling class can go to hell, I'm sincerely talking about one person or value.

>> No.11007384

>>11007221
No. You just need to not be such a pussy in your daily life. Then go be anonymous tough guy on the internet and think you're making up for it.

>> No.11007387

>>11007370
>Just fix it and it won't be broke anymore
Pure genius

>> No.11007388

>>11007014
>you should all aspire to be like this retard who let himself get burned to death because he couldn't rub two brain cells together to literally save his life
yeah no thanks

>> No.11007392
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11007392

>>11007383

>> No.11007394
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11007394

>>11007388
>>>11007014 (OP)
>>you should all aspire to be like this retard who let himself get burned to death because he couldn't rub two brain cells together to literally save his life
>yeah no thanks

>> No.11007410

>>11007383
And from where do you think your conception of values is derived? The ruling ideas of your time, in turn a consequence of the upper classes.

>> No.11007430

>>11007384
>You just need to not be such a pussy in your daily life.
And how exactly do you go about that when gen y and z are soyboys who consume garbage media that reinforces the soy conditioning while demonizing and suppressing masculinity, and telling them to cut their dicks off and take estrogen to give themselves titties?

>> No.11007432
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11007432

>>11007388
>>11007394
why is this so funny

>> No.11007441

>>11007430
>And how exactly do you go about that when gen y and z are soyboys who consume garbage media that reinforces the soy conditioning while demonizing and suppressing masculinity, and telling them to cut their dicks off and take estrogen to give themselves titties?
Be a man and tell them that's retarded.

>> No.11007444

>>11007432
Brainlet wojaks seem to be on the way out so now instead of brainlets I just post pictures of animal butts when I see someone say something stupid. Baboons work best.

>> No.11007501

>>11007441
>See people all around you consuming the digital jew and unquestioningly absorbing cultural marxist brainwashing by the liberal intelligentsia
>Just tell them "dude, just stop lol"
I'm sure that will totally work. Do you have anymore great plans?

>> No.11007523
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11007523

>>11007330
>'. Soldiers of old were dying for inbred sodomites and thieves

The good ones were dying for themselves.

>> No.11007527

>>11007501
>Do you have anymore great plans?
try finding a cliff and jumping off

>> No.11007535

>>11007053
>being a postmodernist hack

>> No.11007579

>>11007410
Not that anon, but current time's values are utter shit. The ruling class is fucking up, man.

>> No.11007587

>>11007501
>>See people all around you consuming the digital jew and unquestioningly absorbing cultural marxist brainwashing by the liberal intelligentsia
>>Just tell them "dude, just stop lol"
>I'm sure that will totally work. Do you have anymore great plans?
Why not? Have you tried it?

>> No.11007601

>>11007523
>implying Seneca wasn't simply throwing a tantrum out of indoctrination and defeat
lol

>> No.11007609

Spengler is incredible

>> No.11007621

>>11007609
Spengler is shit

>> No.11007627

>>11007621
You fucking moron

You've never even read his work

>> No.11007630

>>11007221
yeah because the last two world wars that directly caused the deaths of over a hundred million white people really helped the west out you're a fucking genius buddy

>> No.11007641

>>11007627
My left nutsack knows more about Spengler than you've learned on YouTube in these last few weeks after you discovered 4chan.

>> No.11007645

>>11007014
Can't take what most of you never had

>> No.11007651

>>11007410
ideally, yes. Current system is culture flows from bottom up, mainly b/c aristocratic culture no longer exists and the formless bourgeois are our upper class. Anyone whose gone to a good uni knows the uniform of those people, weed smoke and college kid hip hop.

>> No.11007661

>>11007641
No, it doesn't, you moron. You've never read his work.

>> No.11007663

>>11007097
Pretty badass to inspire so much devotion that death is less scary than disappointing your general. There was chinese general that ordered his frontline to all slit their throats before the battle (while the armies faced each other). I don't know how you could believe in someone that much.

>> No.11007685

>>11007651
Spoken like a true peasant.

>> No.11007718

>>11007587
I don't have to. People are naturally averse to the truth when the hear it because, they already know deep deep down it is true. They are scared to take some serious inventory, realize they fucked up, and take responsibility.

>> No.11007725

>>11007661
>You've never read his work.
Prove it.

>> No.11007730
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11007730

>>11007014

>> No.11007733

>>11007718
So you would rather work in the shadows? Scheme, plot, and ploy behind their back in order to convince them, "No, it's THEM that are lying to you." Why not just try honesty? Be a man. Tell them how you feel.

>> No.11007740

>>11007097
He works for UPS. You're not allowed to stop.

>> No.11007760

>>11007733
I would rather succeed. Being a man is understanding the world is flawed and sometimes a removal from the straight and narrow is required.

>> No.11007765

>>11007730

He has the old blood.

>> No.11007780

>>11007760
So you think you'll save the West based on lies rather than the search for truth?

wew lad...you've got some learnin' to do...

>> No.11007786

>>11007014
A situation that leaves you no choice is absolutely irrelevant example.

>> No.11007790

>>11007042
no it's from man and technics

>> No.11007792

>>11007733
I prefer to have a dialogue with them and pick apart their argument via Socratic method, instead of revealing my hand by saying "IT'S THE JEWS!!!" Sure, anybody can say it, but it's far more effective to plant the seed of doubt, have them question their misguided beliefs, and come to the realization themselves.

>> No.11007809

>>11007780
The west cannot be saved, but westerners can. That's realism.

>> No.11007826

>>11007792
But the only reason any type of boogeyman, be it "da joos" or whoever, has been allowed to continue this way is because you're too much of a pussy to stand up and say anything. You could start by saying, "No," to your children. If you don't have children, you can start by telling your friends. Be a man.

>> No.11007830

>>11007730
OP picture is the worst of him, everytime I see this instead and imagine Spengler tracking down meth labs in Weimar Germany

>> No.11007832

>>11007809
>The west cannot be saved, but westerners can. That's realism.
I disagree. That's also realism.

>> No.11007842

>>11007792
>I prefer to have a dialogue with them and pick apart their argument via Socratic method
nice power fantasy

>> No.11007849

>>11007786

Choice or no choice, it is the same.
He could have cowered in a corner, but he died on his feet.

>> No.11007851

>>11007832
>>11007809
the West is doomed, the only thing that can happen now is a return to sender of the Nordo-Atlantic spirit as such contained in the Aesir, the Tuatha, and the Knights of the Round Table. There is no other way, it cannot be in the mere political historical way of Spengler, nor will it be prosperous through degradation of the spirit

>> No.11007853

>>11007826
...and getting killed by that boogeyman by saying anything, changing nothing.
Yeah, really good idea.

>> No.11007854

>>11007809
I feel the West will fall to Islam because, the key difference between us and them is we lack conviction while they do not.
>>11007826
I'm talking about my peers and tax paying citizens in general, not kids.

>> No.11007861

>>11007854
>I feel the West will fall to Islam because, the key difference between us and them is we lack conviction while they do not.

All will split apart before the approaching abyss. Some of the splinters will have conviction. Make sure you're in the escape pod my friend.

>> No.11007863

>>11007853
>...and getting killed by that boogeyman by saying anything, changing nothing.
>Yeah, really good idea.
Spoken like a true pussy.

>> No.11007866

>>11007854
>I'm talking about my peers and tax paying citizens in general, not kids.
What do you think you or someone are just going to be able to snap their fingers and just wake everybody up or something? Don't think like a terrorist faggot.

>> No.11007950

there is no one who realises this line of thinking and I'm fairly certain that I'm being followed online by intelligence agencies

>> No.11007958

>>11007685
>he went to public school

>> No.11007977

>>11007685
>>11007958
to give you an idea of who I'm talking about, my roomate freshman year of uni was the son of the VP of Goldman Sachs south american division. My roomate sophmore year was the son of a high ranking official of the chinese communist party.

I might fall under your classification of peasant since my family is lower middle class but the people I know are not

>> No.11007985

>>11007977
>My roomate sophmore year was the son of a high ranking official of the chinese communist party.
this is just an average experience at a normal Australian university

>> No.11007990

>>11007849
Pfft.

A conscious act is possible when there's a choice (multiple choices). Then the moral defines which one is right (and, most likely, it will be the one that contradicts the *expected* behavior). Death can be a tragedy, or someone else's fault, but that's different from man's own choice to put his life at stake.

You praise not the person, but his submission to a primitive faceless role (that even lost all its practical sense in that situation). That's a transient and false kind of honour.

>> No.11007997

>>11007985
true, not an American one though

>> No.11008016
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11008016

dude historical determinism

>> No.11008039

>>11007977
Just because they are wealthy doesn't mean they aren't peasantry, anon. That's an even sillier thing to suggest in new wealth, too.

>> No.11008045

>>11007977
Goldman Sachs has 12,000 people who hold the title of Vice President. The Chinese Communist Party has over 82 million members. At its highest level there are over 2,250 delegates.

Very low class.

>> No.11008050

>>11007990
>utilitarian noise
yawn

>> No.11008070

>>11008050
There was nothing utilitarian in my point.

>> No.11008078

>>11008039
What I'm saying is that they are the upper class. There is no aristocratic class of any importance. The current upper class enjoys lower class forms of culture modified slightly for their consumption.

>> No.11008386

>>11008070
>You praise not the person, but his submission to a primitive faceless role (that even lost all its practical sense in that situation). That's a transient and false kind of honour.
?

>>11008078
>There is no aristocratic class of any importance.
lol

>> No.11008413

wait a second....is everyone on this board retarded and only pretending to be well read and the real redpill is that I shouldn't listen to anyone on 4chan? wow amazing. feels good to learn

>> No.11008421
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11008421

>>11008386
lolzorzwelb me say unexpected thing that go against common wisdom and no need prooffies

>> No.11008468

>>11008386
As many other authoritarians who never reflected on their ideals, you don't really care about individual making the moral choice, you care about a nice picture and a simple scheme of things in which a person is just a cog. That's the opposite of humanism and praise of personal virtues.

>> No.11008784

>>11008468
Choice doesn't exist for 99.9% of people.

>> No.11008806

>>11008784
choice of what

>> No.11008832

So you die for someone so that person can die for someone and so on and so on forever?
Seems a little silly.

>> No.11009140

>>11008832
What do you think life essentially is?
We are here, we are preceded by our ancestors who sacrificed to reproduce and survive, and we in turn will be expected to do the same or allow ourselves and our lineages to die out.
It's a very simple concept.

>> No.11009189

>>11009140
>implying existence is normative rather than descriptive
life is what life is you dumb fag there's no reason to discriminate between continuation of it or not

>> No.11009319

Jesus fuck /lit/
Stop being fags And enjoy a good author.
At least pretend to have read him And discuss his views on math And different kinds of civilizations

>> No.11009356

>life struggles not with death, spirit not with spiritlessness; spirit struggles with spirit, life with life
Fuck Liberals

>> No.11009376

bit gay

>> No.11009495

>>11007014
>MUH HONOUR

What a gigafaggot

>> No.11011008

>>11009189
What has he said that's wrong? If you refuse to continue life, you won't have life anymore. Someone who chooses not to continue life will not have life within a generation. The fact that you fail to recognize such a claim as normative is exactly why the West is in "decline". This is one of the most basic normative judgement calls a society needs to survive.

>> No.11011540

Damn... a badass line from a badass guy.......

Unrelated: Is self awareness a recent discovery?

>> No.11012198

>>11007330
>Oh please anon, the ruling class and ideology of the past wasn't any nobler or more genuine than today'. Soldiers of old were dying for inbred sodomites and thieves who'd convinced them and their society that this was the correct thing to do.

I'll take "What is Caesar's Legion" for 1000

>> No.11012220

>>11007014
>greatness is voluntarily becoming incinerated alive by pyroclastic flow for absolutely no conceivable purpose

what a fucking moron. no wonder /pol/ lionizes this guy

>> No.11012225

>>11007854
Spengler placed Islam as already having further declined than the West, and despite any illusions you may see today, Islam is already dead. Not in terms of quanitity, but in terms of there being no cultural developments possible any longer. It's why Islam is slowly succumbing to western values and technology.

>> No.11012235

>>11008468
Humanism and utilitarianism can suck a dick

>> No.11012258

>>11012220
The point is that the soldier had no hope of ever escaping the eruption, and so he just did what he supposed to do instead. So too should we, according to Spengler, do what we ought to do, because we also have no escape from Western civilization.

People who say "just run away senpai" miss the point of that quote entirely, and i'm pretty sure they're all Anglos.

>> No.11012348
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11012348

>>11007221
>all these limp-wristed faggots who don't understand the real purpose of war

>> No.11012404

>>11012198
>I'll take "What is Caesar's Legion" for 1000
>Caesar
>not a thieving sodomite inbred

>> No.11012410

>>11007020
Good fucking argument faggot

>> No.11012432

>>11007103
Thx for that

>> No.11012656

>>11007188
It's good, buy it.

>> No.11012822

>>11007019
This is exactly why I'm /fitlit/, taking up boxing, powerlifting, and trying to actually live life while also reading books.

>> No.11012855

>>11007112
>this soldier is immortalized by history while you will be forgotten as soon as this thread 404s

>> No.11012870

>>11007221
Fine, you go to the front line then.

>> No.11012887

All you war-loving faggots need to watch "The Greatest Generation" by Murdoch Murdoch right now.

>> No.11013699

>>11012258
The soldier likely didn't even know what was happening much less whether or not he had a chance at survival, these are people who thought natural disasters were the work of gods and didn't understand them.
>B-but you have no chance of survival you ought to die honorably
Fuck you I'd rather die fighting or running or whatever the situation requires, you never know with certainty that you can't make it until you're gone.

>> No.11013704

>>11012822
>Powerlifting
>Boxing
>Heroicism
???

>> No.11013717
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11013717

>fighting for a lost cause is noble

dutycucks are such good goys

>> No.11013719

>>11012822
as if spending your time in a gym is any more meaningful/heroic lmao

>> No.11013737

>>11012822
>it's a /fit/ pretends their vanity routine in an air conditioned gym equates them to the spartans episode

>> No.11013997

>>11013737
Well they do suck enormous amounts of dick.

>> No.11014338

>>11013717
Having something to fight for is better than nothing, le spooky meme thinker.

>> No.11014341

>>11014338
And what are you fighting for on a Gabonese Monkey Raping Forum?

>> No.11014361
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11014361

>>11007221
I know that feel

>> No.11014373

>>11014341
Accelerating the saturation and metamorphosis of the unreal after its usurpation of the real, from hyper-reality to hyper-unreality, through means of my shitposts.

>> No.11014375
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11014375

>>11011008
>western civilization didn't exist for nearly 13 billion years
>hydron, carbon, and oxygen atoms exist in a certain formation some like to call 'western civilization' begins to exist on patch of a single planet for a fraction of a percent of the universe's age
>this thing must continue to exist forever

>> No.11014377

>>11014361
Forgot to add
ignore the utilitarian's and humanist

>> No.11014385
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11014385

>>11014375
>filename

>> No.11014405
File: 89 KB, 232x275, AbstractKindOfFeel.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11014405

>>11014375
>>this thing should cease to exist because it did not at one point of time and does not matter to an abstract practicle entiity which was created by the thing that should not exist which according to the the should not exist fabrication should not exist.

>> No.11014406

>>11014361
>Long periods of peace facilitate the formation of some optical illusions. Among them, the belief that the inviolability of one's own house is based on and defended by the constitution. In reality such inviolability is founded upon the head of the house who, surrounded by his sons, stands on the porch of his house, brandishing an axe.

How can a single man be so based

>> No.11014409

>>11014405
*the thing that should not exist fabrication should not exist

>> No.11014423

>>11012822
1. If you actually pursue boxing you won't be reading any books soon
2. Gym makes you a worse martial artist

>> No.11014448

>>11014406
If you want a legal perspective on that idea I would recommend the works of Carl Schmitt.

>> No.11014453

>>11014448
Patrician recommendation but needless.

>> No.11014464
File: 7 KB, 268x188, 1239480923.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11014464

>>11014375
>duuuuuuude if the history of the universe was a football field than our time here would only be one blade of grass lol so who cares!

>> No.11014521

>>11014375
As far as we know, humans are the only intelligent species to build great cultural and intellectual works, as well as fully master its environment. Until we meet the aliens for the first time, if there are any, you can fuck off.

>> No.11014536
File: 31 KB, 306x387, C2CA35F9-25DD-440C-B2A7-1A69422DE8EA.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11014536

>>11014464

>> No.11014546

>>11007014
>"They're not rocks, they're minerals marie!"

>> No.11014820

>>11014375
Reddit post of the year
kys