/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.10334329]

wtf I hate democracy now

[Anonymous No.10334380]

Good. Now you can start with Neocameralism
http://www.thedarkenlightenment.com/the-dark-enlightenment-by-nick-land/

[Anonymous No.10334419]

Absolute Pagan Monarchy w/ Edict of Expulsion when?

[Anonymous No.10334700]

>>10334329
>yfw you realize that Thucydides - a failed commander - wrote nice things about the incompetent Nicias while he besmirched the reputation of the actually capable and effective Cleon

Classism runs deep in Thucydides.

[Anonymous No.10334710]

*proves that monarchies are generally freer than democracies*

[Anonymous No.10334730]

>>10334710
That's a rare Hoppe

[Anonymous No.10334741]

>>10334419
>macron
>pagan
What?

[Anonymous No.10334756]

Welcome to the dark side.

[Anonymous No.10334761]

Reminder that abandoning democracy does not necessarily mean you have to become a full-fledged monarchist. There are many instances of non-democratic states without ruling families. Venice is my favorite example. Aristocratic republics are fine too.

[Anonymous No.10334770]

>tfw the Sicilian expedition

[Anonymous No.10334814]

Can you explain what's wrong with democracy? I've just started reading book IV and so far democracy seems to work just fine in the book. They even managed to save mytilene from slaughter and instead utilized it. That would not have happened without a second assembly

[Anonymous No.10334819]

>>10334814
Keep reading. Don't want to spoil things, but eventually Athens loses. Also, the Melians don't fare as well as the Mytilenes.

[Anonymous No.10334830]

>>10334329
>grow up not knowing that much about the Greeks
>still think of Athenians as noble philosophers and promoters of equality, while Spartans are braindead warriors
>finally decide to stop being a pleb
>read all of the preliminary works on mythology and Homer
>decide to take a class on Greek history before getting into the philosophers as my school offers one that runs straight to 404 BC which is basically perfect
>finally read Thucydides
wtf the Athenians are the bad guys? I feel like I've been lied to all of these years

[Anonymous No.10334838]

>>10334830
I wouldn't go so far as to call them the bad guys. Keep in mind that the Athenians were the first to stand up to the Persian armies at Marathon. Later during the invasion if it hadn't been for the Athenians Greece would have ended up Medizing at least down to Corinth, and without the Athenian naval forces forcing a battle at Salamis the Persians probably would have been able to eventually get past the isthmus of Corinth and down into Arcadia, Laconia, Messenia, etc.

Also keep in mind how quickly Athens was able to rebound from so many of its defeats during the Peloponnesian Wars - it rebounded time and time again, and if Alcibiades hadn't left the Athenian fleet in the hands of his buddy while he went off galavanting around elsewhere, Athens probably could have forced an eventual treaty with Sparta.

That said, the Athenian assembly was ultimately too mercurical for its own good. It still accomplished an amazing amount, though.

[Anonymous No.10335256]

It's sad to think about the potential and possibilities of a unified Hellas. The constant power struggles between Athens, Sparta and the other big poleis ultimately just made them all Persias bitch.

[Anonymous No.10335287]

Do you need to read Herodotus before Thucydides?

[Anonymous No.10335846]

>>10335256
Don't you mean Macedonia's bitch?

[Anonymous No.10335971]

You don't 'need' to, but I don't see what you wouldn't

[Anonymous No.10335976]

>>10334814
They lost the war so therefore democracy is bad or something.
I guess the grimdark edgelords just ignore the philosophical, artistic, and cultural legacy that has lasted for thousands of years

[Anonymous No.10336004]

>>10334329
Democracy is terrible. Read the writings of Solon. A republic is supposed to keep the worst of democracy at bay but eventually democracy takes hold and ruins everything.