/lit/ - Literature

>>9934046

Spinoza's Ethics

>>9934046

>>9934051
Can the common man understand this or is this reserved for the philosopher and academic?

>>9934048
>written by an atheist

dropped

>>9934053
>written by a known charlatan

dropped

Also: what is it about this book that makes it superior to others? I notice many errors in it, including the belief that human beings will one day be gods themselves, over their own worlds. This seems antithetical to monotheism.

>>9934046
The teachings of Buda.

>>9934060
You just need a little secondary literature. It might be easier going in fresh. A lot of my difficulties stemmed from him using Aristotelian language in non-Aristotelian ways.

>>9934046
Anything not written by a murderous pedophile.

>>9934064
>being this retarded

>>9934078
Does Buddhism emphasize God or does it emphasize the detachment of desire / attainment of nirvana?

>>9934083
Yeah, it might be okay for some of us to read it, but for the really uneducated or dumb, it's very impractical to use this book as a guidance towards God. The Qur'an is much more universally understood.

>>9934087
The Qur'an wasn't written by Muhammad (pbuh) and Muhammad wasn't a pedophile. The concept of "pedophilia" was completely unknown in 7th century Arabia.

>>9934128
>pedophilia wasn't stigmatized so that makes it okay and justified
>if murder and rape were not stigmatized those would be okay too

>>9934097
Do you also take healthy eating advice from morbidly obese people?

How can a known-atheist be better at writing a religious book than someone who actually does believe?

>>9934138
Do you not look at what morbidly obese people are doing wrong and take lessons from that?

Why didn't jesus write anything

>>9934135
The age of consent varies throughout the world. In Mexico, it's 14. In some states in the US, the age of consent is 16. Sometimes girls develop really early.

In societies where there is no higher education or careers to pursue, girls have sex at very young ages.

Different societies have had different cultural norms. In 7th century Arabia, it wasn't abnormal to take a young wife. We shouldn't use our modern-day morality and impose it on a very ancient culture.

Abu Bakr, the father of Aisha asked Muhammad to marry her. Decades after Muhammad had died, Aisha never once complained about having been married to Muhammad.

>>9934124
I didn't realize you were grouping subhumans in with "humankind".

The Quran is fan fiction that is the result of teachings by an ancient merchant/warlord who had a hallucination, and proceeded to deceive the local population using tones of nationalistic fervor to go about it.

>>9934157
What you're effectively saying is pedophilia was ok then because of the difference in cultural norms. For a religion that emphasized an absolute morality, it would render their final prophet a pedophile degenerate.

>>9934046

>Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent.

>>9934135
Yes, exactly

>>9934242
>nationalistic fervor
>12 centuries before the rise of nationalism
>in a tribal society

You don't know what you're talking about.and you've never read the Qur'an in full. It purposely has a lot of the same themes and symbols as the Bible / Torah because it's supposed to be a continuation of the prophetic message sent by God to humanity throughout the ages, to all peoples.

>>9934248
What I'm saying is that the hadiths aren't always a reliable source of information. We don't know for certain what Aisha's age might have been. It certainly wasn't young enough to cause controversy in Muhammad's age. If he did anything wrong according to our current morality, it definitely wasn't wrong in his own time. Think about modern-day things we do that might be seen as immoral in the future. In the modern day we pollute and eat meat. If in the future, pollution and meat consumption become immoral, we people that lived in the 21st century would be seen as "evil."

Ethics in Islam are very circumstantial. Actions are judged by intentions. It isn't the same thing to murder someone for fun as it is to murder someone out of self-defense. Likewise, it isn't the same thing for a lustful pedophile to marry a child as it is for the most saintly of prophets to marry a child (with her parent's permission).

>>9934070
>I notice many errors in it, including the belief that human beings will one day be gods themselves, over their own worlds
That's not in the Book of Mormon, you didn't "notice" it, you read about it somewhere else. Lying is a sin.

Those retarded beliefs are from Doctrines & Covenants and Pearl of Great Price.

>>9934309
Then that doesn't speak well of the morals of your charlatan prophet does it?

>>9934350
Morality isn't absolute. Oftentimes, you must forsake one rule to follow another greater one. God understands our circumstantial conditions and judges us by the intentions of our actions.

>>9934046

The Bhagavad-Gita

>>9934377
>Morality isn't absolute.
Is that what they teach you in your death cult? Burn in hell with your false prophet.

>>9934046

>>9934347
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3BqLZ8UoZk

>>9934383
What do you do if the Gestapo knocks on your door and asks if there are jews in the house? Do you LIE and say there are none, or do you say the truth and become an accomplice to genocide?

Islam understands that these moral questions can't be answered dogmatically. Rather, God's community must use the science of sharia and the scholarly interpretations of jurisprudence to accurately discover what the best action is for this particular circumstance.

God judges by our intentions--by what is in the depths of our souls, not by the unintended results of our actions.

>>9934397
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46PXaJxzuDE

>>9934418
>God judges by our intentions--by what is in the depths of our souls, not by the unintended results of our actions.

t. Beheading westerners is a-ok, because Imam said God wills it.

>>9934435
This is absurd. The Qur'an says there is no compulsion in religion and that one must allow people who don't believe to their own belief. It says that truth distinguishes itself from falsehood without any violence needed.

Imams have no supreme authority. You can (and should) question what an imam says.

There are many Western Muslims, you know? Even if we were trying to kill all non-Muslims (which we aren't!), it wouldn't make sense to target Westerners, because many Western people are fellow Muslims.

>>9934387
for me, it's plato. however, aquinas does such a good job at structuring his investigations that even a bum-legged, one-eyed goatfucker could be led to god.

so i'll say the summae

>>9934046
Kys before you kill others.

>>9934448
Since you're here, do you know of any decent English translations of Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim? Hard copies cost a ton, and online versions all seem to be anonymously translated by god-knows-who.

>>9934128
>you don't understand (morally egregious act) was okay back then

Abrahamics are nutty

>>9934448
That's nigh a myth honestly, in practice. I am not inclined to believe it, not because I question the veracity of the Quran but because Islam has left that particular statement behind.
Social pressures to believe and to convert are also very strong. There is no compulsion is a pithy statement.

>>9934155
Maybe he did, but those who came after him covered it up and attributed different teachings to him.

>>9934248
>He fell for the objective morality meme!

>>9934048
Yeah, a book that tells people "God is dead" will definitely lead people to God.

>>9935313
>he doesn't know neet-zsche was a christian

>>9935347
Have you even read Thus Spoke Zarathustra? He definitely wasn't a Christian when writing it. Maybe after he went crazy he may have changed his mind. In Thus Spoke Zarathustra, he takes quotes from the Bible and argues against them. I understand that there is a passage where Zarathustra talks about how he admires Jesus, but he still notes that he thinks Jesus was wrong, and needed to spend more time to get things right.

>>9934448
>This is absurd.

"I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip."

Strike the neck. God's command is clear.

>>9934503
>so i'll say the summae
Agreed. Or the philokalia,but the mudshits probably wouldn't get it.

>>9935313
that's not even the book that's in, retard

>>9934448
>and that one must allow people who don't believe to their own belief.
Wrong. Non-muslims gets three choices;
1) Convert
2) Pay dhimmi-taxes
3) Die

And in reality, this was meant for christians and jews only. Non-abrahamic religions was (and still is) suppressed far harder, with option 3 as the only choice, almost exclusively.

>>9935492
You may be right. I think it never says exactly "God is dead" in the book, but God is still described as dead a few times in the book, and God's death is discussed a bit too.

>>9934046
The collected Old Norse texts.

Odin will condemn all you heretics to Hel! Oh, and friendly reminder: the only cum he'd possibly "drink" is his own after he fucks your mothers and it shoots through their bodies and sprays out their mouths.

Say it with me: RADICAL. VALHALLA. TERRORISM.

https://youtu.be/_qYvtDaVEYM

>>9935492
>>9935508
It is though. Zaratustra explicitly says the ugliest man in the world killed god

>>9934046
THe cloud of unknowing

Its a book that isnt even compiled in a chronological order which given that it has a principle of abrogation makes it very difficult for the lay person to understand Gods will via the Koran .

Likewise it also has an extremely lengthy and often contradictory collection of oral tradition to make it workable.

Furthermore its written in a complicated language thats difficult to be learn (and some parts still are unknown) and was only known by a small group of people - not only that but its a work whose beauty is limited wholly to that one language which is a big problem when its beauty is meant to be a proof of its divine origin.

Once you get past the book to its prophet you find a very brutal man who engaged in war rape, banditry and had numerous revelations that benefited him over all other members (Such as Muhammad being allowed to have over twice as many wives than this followers who were capped). Unlike all of the Apostles and Jesus, Muhammad also benefited greatly in worldly affairs from his prophethood. Just like Joseph Smith it earned him great amounts of political power and sexual partners.

>>9934448
What is the principle of abrogation?

>>9936028
I picked up this book at my library and the whole preface/intro thing was like "if you aren't super devoted as a follower of Christ already, then don't even attempt this" so I just returned it.

>>9936100
Thats more a reference to the actual exercises than the discussion contained within the book itself.

It taps into that understandable problem that meditation can trigger feelings and sensations that can lead people into trouble. That said as far as christian meditation goes it isnt particulary dangerous

>>9934046
The Rule of Saint Benedict

>>9934046
>implying the answer isn't music
https://youtu.be/wQZrXi9huZk?t=32m35s

>implying The Book of the New Sun isn't the best, most consciousness-expanding cover version of The Bible yet written

ok

>quran

>>9934418
Lol good shitpost. Implying the gestapo were part of some genocide. Take your conspiracy theories to pol.

>>9934418
>God judges by our intentions--by what is in the depths of our souls, not by the unintended results of our actions.
Typically the type of shit you DO NOT find in the Quran. You fucking goatfucker, I despise people who refer themselves to the Hadiths and think the idea of our Prophet being a pedophile is totally okay because "hey, it was a different time". Hadiths are satanic commandments and they destroy values preached by our religion.

bump

Why would an ethnocentric screed cobbled together by Abd al Malick from random bits of shit other people wrote hundreds of years prior be a reliable guide towards God? The Quran wasn't even canonised until 1924 for fucks sake, Muslims are clueless morons.

>>9934128
Indeed, the Qur'an was written by multiple people long after Muhammad died.

>>9934046

>>9935437
A "kafir" isn't someone who just disbelieves. It's someone who knowingly rejects and conceals the truth. It's someone who is at their essence of their soul, evil and beyond saving. They murder innocents and can think only of themselves. They hate any higher power than themselves or have convinced themselves it doesn't exist.

In a context of war with the Kafirs, striking them on their necks is merciful. It was the quickest, most painless death there could be for them. It doesn't say to set them on fire or to skin them alive. The punishment for their murders is to be murdered.

They can say they disbelieve all they want. The verse is taken out of context and refers to a situation of persecution and defensive war.

>>9935498
After the Nazis lost the war, what did we do to the top Nazi leaders and to the German people? We had the Nuremberg trials, executed many Nazi leaders and officers, and had a massive propaganda effort in Germany to stop the Nazi ideology. Germans had to pay more taxes. They had to convert or die, convert or be imprisoned.

The early Islamic community was far more homogeneously Muslim. It made far more sense for the losing side to either leave the country or pay slightly higher taxes for what they did during the war.

>>9936075
It's a thing a few theologians came up with centuries after Muhammad's revelations. It isn't something the entire Islamic community ever agreed upon.

>>9937568
No, by a single God.

>>9937429
Boy are you clueless. The 1924 edition simply canonizes the tone which should be used when reciting the Qur'an. It's like choosing the British vs American accent when reading the Bible. Totally insignificant to the meaning of the words themselves.

Ethnocentric? No. Have you read the Qur'an? It says God sends a prophet to every nation. It certainly isn't about maintaining Arabian morals or traditions--it in fact rejects many traditional Arabian traditions (tribalism, vengeful murder, abandoning of infant girls, sexism, racism, etc.) in favor of new, Islamic rulings and teachings.

>>9937646
God is genderless.

>>9937064
No I'm not saying pedophilia was ever okay, I'm saying that any action done at the time should be contextualized. It was a tribal society in 7th century Arabia. Are we going to get mad at them for not washing their hands properly? No. They had no knowledge of microbes. A different standard must be set for a different time and place, right?

And yeah, that's only IF Aisha was the age that one particular hadith says she was. I agree with you that she wasn't that age when she married the Prophet (pbuh).

>>9937048
Which verse do you oppose? I'd be happy to explain it.

>>9938782
That's a clever trick question. I do not oppose any specific verse, because like the bible, I assume the lines are not to be taken literally. What I do oppose is Bolsheviks supporting genocide of other groups in the name of their prophet and subverting other cultures for money and power. Kys.

I read the cliffs notes.

>>9935313
How fucking uneducated do you have to be to make a post like this?

Like, one, this isn't even the book that quote is from; two, "God is dead" is not Nietzsche's triumphant victory cry, it's an edgy condensed statement evoking a sense of how human civilization has strayed from the lessons of classic morality.

>>9938729
>When We substitute one revelation for another, – and Allah knows best what He reveals (in stages),– they say, "Thou art but a forger": but most of them understand not.

Its a key part of the Faith and why there are less problems when it comes to verses and practices that would otherwise contradict one another.

Hence the whole 5 necessary prayers per day and not 3

>>9934046
god is a spook

>>9934046
>a book predicated on the goal of controlling the people to facilitate the socioeconomic and geopolitical goals of the the one(s) who germinated the whole scheme.

Definitely will bring us closer to God. Nice job OP.

>>9939054

Funny how you ignored this one

>>9936064

>>9934046
Πλάτωνος ἅπαντα.

>>9939260
Almost like the Pentateuch, eh?

>>9934148
checkmate theists

>>9934387
>reading a translation

>>9936357
I keep seeing this meme'd
what is it and why does it have some shit anime on the cover

>>9934046
God is Satan

>>9939115
See >>9935949
Also, Zarathustra laughs to himself in the beginning after talking to the hermit and says something along the lines of "He doesn't know that God died."

>"God is dead" is not Nietzsche's triumphant victory cry
I never said it was, you fuck. Nietzsche doesn't attempt to bring God back to life. He realizes that God being dead is a problem for mankind, but his solution to it isn't bringing God back to life or guiding people back to God.

Maybe he attempts some of these things in his other works, but he definitely doesn't in Thus Spoke Zarathustra.