/lit/ - Literature

Veramente imbarazzante

>posts Dante
>who didn't even write in italian
Italian has no books. Go read your shitty Ecos and Calvinos

>>9300403
Does double-sided count? I get the general all idea of what's going on.

>>9300416
Any italian could read Dante without a dictionary.

Try better next time.

>>9300416
Hai la testa infestata di meme, cerchi romanzi postmoderni in Italia, cosa che non troverai mai perché l'Italia è sempre stata superiore a quella merda. Peccato.

>>9300418
Of course it counts! That's the way I do when reading german poetry.

>>9300424
Any non-italian could too

I'm so sorry your shit language is so poor in literature. Hey, at least architecture is good, right? As long as it's not being wrecked by earthquakes

I have been studying italian to the point where I feel comfortable reading newspapers in the language, and even messaging qts on interpals. But, why is it so fucking hard to find literature and contemporary music in italian that is not complete shit?

>>9300450
>Any non-italian could read Dante without a dictionary

ooh boy not gonna take this bait

>>9300465
>why is it so fucking hard to find literature and contemporary music in italian that is not complete shit?
Why does this nonsense opinion spread out all over? Tell me what genre do you like and I'll name a god-tier author for you, since you're not able to find them by yourself.

>>9300473
>Why does this nonsense opinion spread out all over?

People from /lit/ doesn't know nothing outside the english-spoken world. This is an english website after all.

>>9300465
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isgydm69YLE

watch Sorrentkino

>>9300473
Not this anon but
>early 20th philosophy
Pls

>>9300465
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zru3PakNEPE

>>9300477
I know, bro. But there's more to it than that. People from /lit/ has a weird fetish for postmodernism and autistic philosophy, which is exactly everything Italy has NEVER been. Italy is the homeland of poetry, theatre, short stories, folk tales and unsystematic philosophy.

>>9300484
Right-wing or left-wing?

ke berga

>>9300403
baka onestamente famiglia

>>9300491
There is Agamben. And it is a well now fact that /lit/ (in general) also doesn't know that much about poety, not to mention theatre. So either way we're fucked.

>>9300484
Gramsci, Gentile, Bobbio, Abbagnano and Preve.

In general Italy has a strong existentialist, traditional Marxist and, in a few cities (the most important being Turin), analytical tradition.

Also check out the big names of XX century poetry: Montale, Saba, Ungaretti and Uasimodo are fairly easy to understand while being absolutely Elder God-tier.

In general: stop being such a fucking retard. Do you really think that fucking Italy has no good literature? You miserable philistine

>>9300465
Have you even read Leopardi?
What about Calvino, Buzzati and Primo Levi? Or the political philosophy of Gramsci?

>>9300505
Indeed. Man I've been reading Italian poetry of the 20th century for the past 5 years and I'm still not satisfied, I really can't get enough. If they only knew.

>>9300511
>Buzzati

I'm pretty sure that Il Deserto dei Tartari could become a /lit/core book. Truly the ultimate existentialist novel.

>>9300416
>Italian has no bo-

>>9300525
It's good? If you convence me I buy it now.

>>9300508
>In general: stop being such a fucking retard. Do you really think that fucking Italy has no good literature? You miserable philistine
As I said, not this anon, but ty

>>9300525
It's one of the first european existential books. It doesn't use any of the classic existentialist stereotypes and topoi.
It is intense, crushing, deeply depressing and masterfully crafted. At the end of it you will know for sure what it feels like to have wasted a life. It's probably the best magnification of boredom, routine and alienation in the Italian language.

Give it a try, you probably can finish it in 6-7 hours.

Take a look at this list, kids

>>9300465
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTeObJmb7hQ

thank me later

>>9300576
just... why?

>平成29年
>日本語が読めない

I like Calasso's Essays, particularly his exposition of what he calls Absolute Literature, and have read all his books-- Kasch and Tiepolo being the ones I enjoyed most. And yet I see nothing on either the Italian lists or in the English commentary. What gives?

>>9300651
>on either the Italian lists or in the English commentary
what do you mean?

Why I Neverland Gear people talking about Gozzano?
Help is top tier and l'esser known porta.

>>9300657
what did he mean by this?

Gozzano is great btw

>>9300656
What I mean is that I like Agamben (for instance) well enough (esp. his books of a religious cast) but ultimately he's an exceptionally dense (in a good way) plodding and super-autistic writer. Calasso, on the other hand, combines levity and depth-- is a writer-critic theotetically (in his use of theory) VERY MUCH like Harold Bloom in America, though beginning with a very different premise. Both, for instance, encourage classical reading, AND have designs on the future. Agamben, though not paraded IN THIS THREAD, is positively mentioned, and appears on the list of National authors supplied in one of the posts above, but I've yet to see even a mention of Calasso, other than my own. I think he's a wonderful author-- that's all I mean. What is his status in Italia? Curious.

>>9300486
>>9300576

>proceed to post examples of shitty italian music

Lol I mean, what the fuck? Is all contemporary music in italian pop? The only artists from italy i have on my ipod are articolo 31 and they are alright, and le orme, but it's more instrumental than anything. Other than that, I like 21 grammi by fedez, but nothing else, man.

Help me, for real, I want to find real nigga shit to bump in the car.

>>9300473
My favorite authors in english are Faulkner and O'Connor. I enjoy stories centered around the lives of marginalized groups of people. Other than that, I enjoy the tradition of latin americans from the mid 20th century, i.e. literature based on telling the gringos to eat a fucking dick and attempting to educate the masses on the evils of the yankee lifestyle.

>>9300477
I learned english three years ago, faggot. In spanish, you have a wide array of literature going from god-tier with cervantes to shit-tier with isabel allende. Also, every country has their literature scene dating back hundreds of years. This might be due to the fact that more people speak spanish then italian, but I thought that italy would be at least at the level of the french, which to be honest it is because dante wrote better than any other human in history, but only him.

>>9300483
I have watched all of his films.

>>9300788
Well if your mother tongue is a romance language than you have no excuse to be this dumb about italian literature. Go fucking read and extend your borders, faggot.

Portuguese speaker here.

>>9300788
You should include Petrarch with Dante, at least. And I'd even include others--

Mi fa male leggere certe cose desu

>>9300814
Like who, nigga? italo calvino? umberto ecco? I was told this is pretty advanced italian, I'm looking more for what italian students read in grade school.

Ho provato a leggere Il Principe e non ho capito niente.

t. imparando l'Italiano per due anni

>>9300569
All literal whos besides Agamben, Vattimo, Croce and a couple more

>chi è leopardi

lit non deludermi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>9300855
I don't know about prose but if you're into poetry (esp. 20th century) then italian poetry is really a joy to dig into. Only english/american poetry can match it.

>>9300450
>your shit language is so poor in literature
Nigga you fucking wot

>>9300876
Tell me poets, then, please.

>>9300511
>Gramsci

Why are Italian commies so based?

>Labriola
>Bordiga
>Damen
>Panzieri
>Tronti
>Negri
>Novatore
>Filippi
>Malatesta

>>9300858
>not even remembering Eco
Fucking pseuds

>>9300891

>goat tier
Ungaretti

>good tier
Pavese
Pasolini
Quasimodo
Montale
Saba
Cavalli
Gozzano
Rebora
Sbarbaro
Rosselli
Sereni
Caproni

and so on. I recommend you to buy a good anthology.

>>9300403
>>9300415
>>9300428
>>9300856
fuck you, just because I can't speak it doesn't mean I don't understand what you're saying

>>9300945
leggere means to read, imbecile.

>>9300855
>I'm looking more for what italian students read in grade school.
Anthologies of the stuff listed in Bloom's Western Canon, honest. Including these for the more recent poets: >>9300921

>>9300909
>Why are Italian commies so based?
Plenty of partisans fighting the fascists and nazis were communists (your pic very much related), the reds were a sizable influence on Italy becoming a republic, its new constitution, later Italy had the biggest communist party on "the Western side" of the Berlin Wall.

>>9300954
But they weren't run of the mill vanilla commies either. Even sellouts like Togliatti advanced some interesting new theories.

>>9300891
>2000
Valerio Magrelli
Elisa Biagini
>late 1900
Eugenio Morelli
Nanni Balestrini
Edoardo Sanguineti
Vittorio Sereni
Bartolo Cattafi
Silvio Ramat
Giovanni Giudici
>first 1900
Montale, Pavese, PPP, Zanzotto, Quasimodo, Ungaretti, Saba, D'Annunzio, Marinetti, Gozzano, etc. There are too many

>>9300788

Ok man, make yourself comfortable, I'm going to answer all your doubts.

1/2

>music
The second anon (>>9300576) was just memeing, because that is utter shit and I didn't even know it. But you can't be disappointed with >>9300486. Fabrizio De André is the greatest songwriter Italy has ever had, and since we're on a literary board, just know he's often regarded as a poet. You can compare him to Bob Dylan, with the only exception that De André was smarter. I'm not joking. David Byrne appreciated him a lot. He was able to bring up the tradition and assert it over the shitty pop/rock landscape of the 60s and 70s. That's why you heard religious chants in the song posted by the anon above. His lyrics are similar to folk tales, but smart and refined. He was an anarchist, he was based as fuck. Also, a beautiful and deep voice. Just close your eyes, listen to this album and indulge to the melancholy for its whole duration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HDYSxX7DvM

Another top-tier singer is Lucio Battisti. He's pop, yeah, but you won't regret it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FO2KD7CDFI
(it starts pretty meh, but wait for the refrain and focus on the melody insted of on the language)

If you don't like pop, anyway, tell me what you want to listen to.
>alternative rock?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3IjHsENad8&t=1203s
>progressive rock?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxGWvAhqsrM
(to be honest there are hundreds of Italian prog masterpieces out there, just dig)
>punk?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6Fw6q-no9k
>hardcore punk?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA8lR8YzJOI
>indie shit?
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h645t0hOc-Q&list=PLg4aSwO3XsLtVQYNYiT8qiCxN9sOW4rSh
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZ-b2PW8orc&t=1s
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXDCHxP7gec
(this last one even mentions DFW)
>weird stuff so you can act like a true patrician on /mu/?
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWhhtYSpCIY
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOjSS9s6MQQ
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlJRpbFu_Sg
(this last one is about a book by our great poet Edoardo Sanguineti)

>>9301024

2/2

>books
>stories centered around the lives of marginalized groups of people
You could try Giovanni Verga (I Malavoglia and Rosso Malpelo), Pier Vittorio Tondelli (Altri Libertini) or even some porn shit (but actually good) like Porci con le Ali by Rocco & Antonia

>poetry
>Dante, but only him
This is a cringe opinion, really. Have you ever read Petrarch? He's the greatest love poet of all times. Tasso, Ariosto, Boiardo? They're all amazing epic poets, if you like Homer or Virgil you should definitely check 'em out. And then Leopardi, Foscolo, Pascoli, Carducci, D'Annunzio? But let's even get over the canon. The second half of the 20th century is full of great Italian poets. Three names above all: Emilio Villa, Vittorio Sereni, Franco Fortini. You can easily find pdfs with their poems online.

>>9301024
>>9301009
>>9300921
BTFO
T
F
O

>>9300858
Along with Evola, Gramsci and Eco (that you CAN'T leave out) they're already more than six. More than six great philosophers in a century is not bad. Germany in the 20th century had like two or three great philosophers, not more.

>he hasn't read Zang Tumb Tumb
>>9300465
listen to opera, don't bother with popular music.
>>9300491
>People from /lit/ has a weird fetish for postmodernism [...] which is exactly everything Italy has never been
What about Eco and Calvino? Certainly less meme-y than DFW, but Se una notte d'inverno un viaggiatore is still very po-mo.
>>9300855
>I'm looking for what italian students read in grade school
Apparently it's just Dante and Manzoni. Don't fall for the meme of I Promessi Sposi, I think it may be one of the most boring novels I've ever read. There were a grand total of 3 chapters in it that were actually worth reading.

>>9300576
You do know that he is Romanian right? Here are some more classics if you're interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iUGfURqyhs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=US-oBklKyy8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXO2QtjixaM

>>9301072
>What about Eco and Calvino? Certainly less meme-y than DFW, but Se una notte d'inverno un viaggiatore is still very po-mo
True, but they were exceptions.

I remember a post I wrote a week ago in which I was replying to an anon who asked me something about 20th century's literary movements in Italy. Do you mind if I post it, since I saved it on notepad?

>>9301118
Why are you asking me lmao, go for it my man

>>9301118
Well, Dadaism and Surrealism, along with Futurism, Simbolism and OuLiPo, are usually described as Avant-garde movements, especially confined to the first half of the 20th century, and they're characterised by the presence of a specific manifesto under which writers were grouped together. Movements of the second half of the 20th century are not that strictly defined and well organized, and sure as Jesus they're not ideological. That said, take Italy for example (since I'm Italian and I'll speak for my country): Neorealism is widely known as a film movement, the best of Italian cinema, but that's incomplete. Few people know that Neorealism was primarily a literary movement risen from the scenery and the living conditions of the post-war period, which, in Italy in particular, was devastating and unprecedented. This historical moment, following the madness of Fascism, Futurism, and the experimental vitality of their art, spawned a new drift towards realism - so, I would say, the opposite direction of Postmodernism. The vast majority of Italian novelists from the last century were related to Neorealism, and Calvino, later to become close to the postmodern experiences, was at first one of them. Pasolini, possibly the biggest literary genius of the Italian 20th century (and totally neglected overseas except for his movies) was a realist writer. He developed a personal thought throughout the political scenery of the 60s and 70s, criticising the shift from a fascist power to an even worst capitalist power; he wrote about the language of advertising, of television and youth trends. His novel Petrolio (Gasoline) is probably somehow postmodern, but still very different, in the approach and in the form, than the American novels of the same period. Other authors wrote monumental and winding books that could stay on an equal footing with tomes like Infinite Jest and Gravity's Rainbow - I'm thinking about Arbasino and D'Arrigo in particular, which, unfortunately, have not been translated into English yet, due to the huge volume of their work - but their intentions were quite divergent from those of Wallace or Pynchon (i.e.: more actual and current reality, less mental masturbation). And then you have poetry. Montale is the closest one to the modernist idea of poetry (he's often matched with Eliot for his use of the objective correlative), but otherwise you see completely different tendencies, compared to other countries: Italy had Ermetism (similar to Minimalism but better), Crepuscolarism, Expressionism, Gruppo 63 (also known as Neoavanguardia, literally "new vanguard") and so on. A lot of stuff still to be discovered and treated.

>>9301024
>stato sociale
DROPPED
D
R
O
P
P
E
D

>>9301133
WTF

WHY DID YOU SAVE IT

>>9301142
What are you talking m8? I saved because it is a well written post.

>>9301136
Yeah it's pretty cringe but they had some talent at the beginning

>>9301146
t-thanks, I'm impressed

>>9301147
btw have some patrician italian prog
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bufPR-Up7hs

>>9301133
neorealism as a postwar cinematic movement in response to fascism is a bit of a meme anyway, you can watch plenty of films from the 30s which, if you didn't know when they were made, you would say were neorealist.

>>9301072
Zang Tumb Tumb is ante-litteram shitposting

>>9301167
True, but that's because Italy itself is "neorealist" in some sense of the word. The proximity to everyday life, to the actual experience of the world is never absent in Italian literature, even when it comes to philosophy.

>>9301158
Nice, thank you

>>9301133
Why is Pasolini a friend of Pound anyway? That fucking facist

>>9301187
>is
I meant 'was' ofc.

>>9301187
I always wondered the same to be honest

>>9301178
I think a sizeable portion of Marinetti's life was dedicated to sophisticated shitposting.

>>9301181
I find this to be very true. It's a trait of italian literature. Even Dante's Inferno is very plastic and material in its descriptions and situations

>>9301207
Exactly

>>9301207
>Even Dante's Inferno is very plastic and material in its descriptions and situations

but he needs to. its one of the seven (or five, I don't remember exactly lmao) rules of mnemonics.

>>9301009
Balestrini was one of the first "electronic" poets of the world. Cool, isn't it?

>>9301187
Beucase Pasolini is an hack. Like every other writer of the time, he is just surfing with the prestige he gets from the world war sufferings.

>>9301187
>>9301198

He was living an artist's life. His books and plays were often political, his life wasn't.
He was more concerned about hanging out with the most interesting personalities he could find rather than getting stuck in a left-wing echo chamber.
By the way the same applies with most intellectuals of the past century, especially the ones who lived in Rome, Milan and Turin. I guess that the need of being a socialyte is encoded in the italian spirit, very few of our greater artists and writers were loners.

>>9301235
>very few of our greater artists and writers were loners.

Name a few that were.

>>9301235
>very few of our greater artists and writers were loners
Tommaso Landolfi and Guido Morselli are two names that come to my mind
They'd be /lit/core if they were translated

>>9301240
Petrarch, Tasso, Leopardi, Saba.

>>9301233
Pasolini's fame peaked between the '60s and the '70s. Those were serene if not prosperous years for Italy, there wasn't that much suffering going on.

Also I wouldn't say that he was a hack: his output was extremely original, his craft was excellent (especially in his theatrical works) and (but this is just my opinion) one could say that he has always been sincere, both in his public life and in his books/plays.

You may not like him, but he does not deserve your hate.

>>9301240
Foscolo maybe? Even Leopardi had friends when he managed to get away from his oppressive homelife

>>9301240
>>9301252

>>9301266
What did Foscolo do all his life? He was great but he left few works. Did he read all the time?

>>9301024
>weird stuff so you can act like a true patrician on /mu/?
Literally where the fuck is Gruppo di Improvvisazione Nuova Consonanza?

>>9301282
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ob_fgO_hJk

>>9301231
What do you mean with electronic?

>>9301266
Leopardi had only 2 friends (and both of them talked shit about him behind his back). There have been bery few writers in history that have been as lonely as Giacomo. Also he certainly was bipolar. In certain letters to his father he describes to a great extent his symptoms, one hundread years before the first formalization of the illness. He described the manic and depressive phases as waves of despair.
>tfw

Foscolo lived a intense social life in his youth, retreating in absolute isolation in past his 30s. Unlike Leopardi his choice was deliberate: he was probably clinically depressed.

An American living in northern Italy here...for the past six years. A record shop owner from Istanbul turned me on to the cramps label. I'm hooked to say the least...great thread. Here's my contribution:
Andrea Tich:
https://youtu.be/kixquGybTmg

And writer:
Vitaliano Trevisan
I quindicimila passi. Un resoconto

>>9301235
>His books and plays were often political, his life wasn't.

i.e. hack.

is Giovanni Lindo Ferretti the most /lit/ musician?

>>9301287
Thanks.

>>9301288
He used a prehistoric software to write Tape Mark, which is basically a collection of poems written by said software using different combinations of a few groups of words

>>9301263
Every italian writer of the post-war surfed on the second world war thing m8. Maybe not here, but in the rest of the world yes, absolutely.

>>9301299
>tfw you will never play chess with Morricone

>>9301307
>tfw you'll never learn how to quote properly

I'm going to florence for art school this fall, can i ask my italiabros about the state of art in italy at the moment?

Is there any strong culture surrounding art still aside from museums and practically every major historical building or is it a thing of the past?

>>9301314
>how so?

>>9301263
>Petrarch
wut?
>Tasso
wut?
>Leopardi
right on that
>Saba
dunno, tell me more about it

>>9301280
I think he thought he would get more done by directly acting than by writing about it. So when he wanted to unite the peninsula, instead of writing some books and leaving it at that, he agitated politically amongst students and then went off to fight for Napoleon (not that it worked out well for him though). Then he went off to England and slowly wasted away

>>9301316
Italy is part of the globalized world, so I don't see how it should be culturally different from any other western country

Anyway Fuksas built this crazy thing in Rome recently

>>9301302
Cool

what r sum good italian universities and cities

>>9301298
Why? To not be a hack you have to hand out with people who think exactly what you're already thinking for the rest of your life? Pasolini was very vocal about certain issues, but that has nothing to do with who his friends should be.

>>9301304
Well, Pasolini was fairly young when the world ended, and even then he was detatched from that whole mess. It scarred him to a certain extent, but in the '60s there was no reason to keep being desperate about that horror. It was something of the past, and most people in Italy were living the good life.
The social landscape was very similar to the US one: strong social nets, a minimum wage that could cover everything (from education to buying houses) and (in the italian case) an almost complete detatchment from the Cold War (the Italian government was clearly allied with the US, yet we had the strongest Communist party in Europe, so most Italians were not concerned with future retaliations and atomic war).

Pasolini's behaviour was coherent.

>>9301316
In Florence art is everywhere, you don't have to search for it. Also the surrounding villages are filled with beautiful ancient churches and breath-taking castles.

>>9301329
>Petrarch
Most of his social interactions were epistulary. In the first part of his life he traveled a lot, but it was more about academia than friendships. In his later years he was living in almost absolute isolation.

>Tasso
In his youth he was extremely anxious. In his first adulthood he could not manage any sort of social relationship (which were required since he worked in a court) and ended up being jailed for a ungodly amount of time. Here he will become crazy and live most of the rest of his life in absolute isolation.

>Saba
He wasn't extremely lonely, but unlike most of his contemporary fellow intellectuals he lived a very private life. Also WWII left him scarred, past that he mostly cared about reviews, articles and books of his.

>>9300483
The Young Pope is the worst thing Sorrentino ever produced. If you want something truly /lit/ watch Il Divo.

>>9301316
I did a year at an Italian uni and whilst it was fun, the Italian uni system seems like a complete mess organisationally. Depending on where you're coming from and whether "art school" is like the unis, it might be similar

>>9301358
It depends on what you're studying.

>>9301368
It was meant as a response to >>9301352

>>9300949
I said I could read it, dilettante

>>9301314
>>9301325
oops I just realized I quoted Ferretti post

>>9301358
>worst thing
That honour belongs to "This must be the place"
And Young Pope is definitely better than Youth, I'd say that it's best English-language thing Sorrentino has done. Il Divo is very stylish (and is one of my favourite films) but it does suffer from a sort of multiple-personality thing where Sorrentino can't seem to decide exactly what "type" of film it is meant to be.

>>9300921
>goat tier

>>9301427
he was so cute :')

>>9301340

Yes this is almost a disappointing part of life now that I think to myself the most culturally relevant place for art where things are "happening" would probably be somewhere like New york or London not for any specific reason culturally but being a modern art mecca with some leftover art fervor in the air from the late mid to late 20th century.


>>9301358

Yes it's one of the reasons i want to escape Los angeles, I don't feel drawn to these urban locations with hip bars and clothing stores on every corner and nothing inbetween. I know everyone in the 16th, 17th century would go to Italy to study art including the dutch and germans and so on so I was curious what the environment was like.

>>9301367

I never really went to school in the USA so I don't know what to expect. I like the more realist/classical approach that the europeans still follow in some places compared to Americas artistic wasteland (in my opinion)

>>9301382
So whats your point dumbass? If you could it then enjoy being with the lads.

>>9301358
Go to bed, Pier. Ezra is wainting you for a reading tomorrow.

>>9301435
>everyone in the 16th, 17th century would go to Italy to study art
Also in the 18th and 19th century ;)
You still find art everywhere, despite war and shitty globalization. Even a village with 200 inhabitants has his own castle or medieval basilica with old paintings inside. I live in a boring provincial town with nothing to do and yet the church is absolutely god-tier. What exactly are you going to study in art school? Schools of restoration are very good in Italy, for example.

I'm thinking about travelling to California, btw. How is it, outside of the big cities? Why are you trying to escape?

>>9300465
I've thought about this a lot and i have no idea, but to me the fact the artistic output of our time seems sub par when compared to past decades is more of a global thing, not an italian exclusive.

>>9301488
I think you're quite right. People stopped dreaming and thinking big. Have we definitively entered a new Medioevo?

By the way, speaking about good italian movies, i would recommend "Non essere cattivo" by Caligari.

>>9301435
>I like the more realist/classical approach that the europeans still follow in some places
Like what places?
Leipzig?

>>9301358
Where did you get all that stuff about the poets lifes? Just searching on wikipedia?

>>9301484

Yes that too, my art history is shoddy, I know paris started becoming a popular place to go as well but that was probably in line with them becoming more artistically relevant.

I've gone to france and it's lovely but I felt a sense of isolation outside of major cities, probably in line with me not knowing the language or culture and feeling like an outsider. Friendly people everywhere but it felt so vast and wild in a way. Never to italy yet though.

I know while art can be in the land all around you and the air you breathe certain places are more powerful then others, it's no coincidence all the great artists before the mid 20th century were either dutch, flemish, german, french, italian or english.

So i'm going over to study fine art in the hopes of capturing some of that essence and also getting closer to nature if possible and people.

Outside the big cities can be hit or miss, I've lived along the coast for 10 years now, and spend half my time in LA and half my time near the beach. California has its share of beautiful cities but all these suburban areas, and even the big cities i have no interest for anymore. I'm trying to find culture like i said, for art the training in america is largely watered down if you're going for classical from what i know.

I hope spiritually as well to possibly come closer to the world, maybe it's all a romantic fantasy, but I want to follow in the path of a lot of greats. I'm not even that good at drawing, so it's a big revival for me. I was interested in stocks and finance before.

/end blog.

>>9301533

I know that paris still has strong classical studies, also more then a few schools in Italy.

Russia as well has a very prestigious university, but specifically I do mean the stronger tradition europe has for more realistic art.

>>9301510
Eh, i really don't know. I wouldn't call it a "new Medioevo", i think it has more to do with how the internet changed how we think and how we make/distribute/experience art.

>>9301567
Okay cool, but... are you looking for new and contemporary tendencies in art/architecture or just the past European "spirit"?
Because I still don't get this line:
>I like the more realist/classical approach that the europeans still follow in some places

>>9301574
>how the internet changed how we think and how we make/distribute/experience art
How should we change our perspective or our "modus operandi" according to that?

>>9301611

I'm looking for the past european spirit. Also I'm saying that compared to what is taught in America. The standards when it comes to art are completely different. Of course i asked initially curious if there even were contemporary art trends that were strong in italy.

Italian is literally just ghetto gutter slang latin.

>>9301624
This is the case for virtually every major European language.

>>9301616
Again, i don't know. It's really hard to figure how we are changing our perspective, yet alone how to "adapt" to these changes.

>>9301624
no u

>>9301621
If you want some contemporary good shit just go to Milan. Or Rome in the EUR district.

For the past European spirit, everywhere you go you're fine. Just be informed on the differences between the Italian regions, because each one has its own aesthetic standards. Tuscany is the homeland of Renaissance, Umbria and Marche is where you'll find the most breathtaking medieval villages, Lazio is the right place either for Roman ruins and fascist architecture, Apulia and Sicily are baroque, Piedmont is neoclassical and regal, Basilicata is wild nature, and so on. You must know what you're seeking. Also, always ask the locals to carry you around if you want to discover the best (hidden) gems.

>>9300403
>tfw when spic
>tfw can read dagospeak and huehue by default

Who else latin /master race/ here?

>>9300530
Go back to /pol/ and stop trying to force this meme here.

>>9301024
>>9301031
Grazie, bello.

>>9302090

>MMXVII
>Non potest legere Latinam

>>9301947
Verus optimus gens sum.

>>9303234

>Latinam
>neque "linguam Latinam" neque "legere Latine"
Tu quoque disciturus Latine legere atque scribere. "Latinus" (an "Latinum" an quidem "Latinam") sicut substantivus non solam linguam Romanorum sed totum quod est Latii Romanorumve declarat (id est, "the Latin"). Recte dicis tamen tenebram hodie linguae Latinae esse barbarissimam. Impossibile est linguae Europaeae dictori propriam linguam vere scire sine Latinitate. Etiam phonologice est superior aliis totis linguis, atque sine ea magna species amittitur. O tempora! O mores!

>>9303304
AD ALTITUDINE RUPTUS EST

Se fossi un figliol prodigo
Avrei un vitello grasso
Mi sono perso ad Istanbul
E non mi trovano più
Dovrebbero seguire le mie voglie
La sera appena alzato o tardi la mattina
Dopo la colazione prima d'addormentarmi
Chiudi un po' la finestra
Mezzogiorno in penombra
Sfondo bianco e pulito
Sfondo bianco e pulito

italian truly is a beautiful language

>>9300525
>tfw no Vittorini and Pavese worshippers on /lit/

HOW IS IT POSSIBLE. THEY'RE LITERALLY US

>>9301067
>Germany in the 20th century had like two or three great philosophers, not more.
Hahahaa what?

>Husserl
>Heidegger
>Adorno
>Habermas
>Benjamin
>Arendt
>Weber

Off the top of my head, and some of these are the most relevant philosophers of the century.

>>9304088
only good ones are heidegger and benjamin, and maybe weber being important

so hes pretty much correct

>>9304134
These along with Husserl and Adorno are a lot more influential than the 6 great italian philosophers he named. I don't like Arendt but you could also make the case for her.

Italians have GOAT poetry and lit tho, if you want to get into a dickwaving contest with the Germans at least don't choose the area where they excel the most.

>>9304266
That's true man, we're conscious that philosophy is not our field.

t. Italian

>>9304266
german philosophy might be influential but its wrong

heidegger = derrida, so thank you, "influential german philosophy"

>>9300416
Ma dante scriveva in italiano per quale motivo menti

>>9304413
Ok kid

>>9304493
> can't use a comma properly
> accuses others of immaturity

back to youtube

>>9303304
True.

>>9300477
>People from /lit/ doesn't know nothing
English isn't your cup of tea either huh?

Ragazzi, mi sono appena trasferito a Genova (belga, di origini italiane). Quali sono le librerie migliori? Mi perdo sempre nei vicoli. ;_;
(però, la città è fighissima)

Based Sanguineti
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cmEbkYYPxs

>>9305308
Ok, kid,

>>9300465
For Contemporary Music there are Luigi Nono, Luciano Berio and Bruno Maderna just to name a few.
If you meant "contemporary" as in moden music it's pretty much >>9300473 with some exceptions

Colpo di fortuna. Giusto avevo finito un libro di astrologia per un tale Ciro Discepolo. Fu stata la prima volta que probo a leggere un testo completo; lento da leggere, ma comunque gratificante

Are there any good conservitives running for Office in Italy?

>>9305985
based beppe grillo

>>9305985
make italy grande again

>>9302090
I think you should get off 4chan.

We are at war with Islam.

How many Terrorist attacks did Erdegon do last week.

Russia 6 dead.

Putin would be retarded to loan him money and give him any weapons let alone S-300+

>>9305985
Well, Alessandra Mussolini is (or was, last I checked) a member of Parliament. Not intelligent or attractive enough to ever rise higher, but still.

>>9305755
Sure m8. If it makes you feel better..

Ma io sto imparando