/lit/ - Literature

Mel Gibson? I thought you were in rehab or something.

Emil Maurice

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5Gv32YfXDE

Was Hitler's most trusted companion. He was the SS Member #2 (Hitler was SS Member #2) and had Jewish blood. Dispite his Jewish blood and brief relationship with Hitler's niece, Maurice and his brother were allowed to stay in the SS.

>>929195


Actually only an extreme few fanatics wanted to kill off all Jews. Everyone wanted them out of Germany. Himmler worked with Zionists to get Jews to Israel.

>Hitler himself never knew what went on in the concentration camps
Hello, David Irving. How are you?

>>929225

You say that because you didn't READ.

The True National Socialism
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMaL5Fy47xY
Hitler's first companion SS member number 2 was Jewish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5Gv32YfXDE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehi_%28group%29#Contact_with_Nazi_authorities

Its the truth.

>>929236

I agree with you.

>hate groups of people
>attempt to efface groups of people from history
>fail
>didn't happen anyway, it was just a jewish communist lie, but give the chance we'd do it [again]

Yeah

>>929236
>Its the truth.
>because I saw it on youtube.

Ridiculous, saged, and hidden

>>929249
whoa, wait. you can hide threads? i must know how to do this.

>>929251

Download the 4chan toolbar or whatever.

>Its been shown in studies that minority groups tend to support left wing political groups

Gee I wonder why.

>>929236
Why would I read anything by a man who was tried and found guilty of fabricating information to support his revisionist view of Nazi history? Do you read anything by blatant liars? Well, you obviously do.

>>929249

What's the matter? Scared of the truth?

Here's another little gem: Germany was allied to China till 1941 (Pearl Harbor). After that they recognized the Japanese puppet China.

Many Jews lived in Germany and were German nationalist.
French and Russian collaborated with Nazis because they either agreed with the ideology or they wanted to free there country (such as the Russians)

>>929265


Um, a little backup? Leftists and the Jewish-liberal media have a tendency to smear their enemies.

Just look in youtube for subbed german newsreels. The germans viewed the war against stalin as a united european effort, not just german

movies and highschool only show you the american/british publicity

Also:

Black - Germany
Red - Countries that singed non-aggression packs, military pacts, or sent troops to Germany.

Nazism is actually encompassed a diverse group of nationalities and religions. More diverse than the Anglosphere.

>>929266

People are complicated regardless of ethnicity or political alignments. Welcome to the world beyond the internet.

LOL hey guys. I fucking HATE niggers. Niggers destroyed this country. I think we should take all their property, and send them back to Africa. The ones that start shit we need to round up and put them into forced labor camp. They need their rights curtailed, and I will spit at them in the street. If they so much as raise an eyebrow at the anti-nigger film I am showing, I will beat them in the streets while the police watch on and cheer. FUCKING NIGGERS

But I don't want to kill them, so I'm not a racist. Yeah... only a couple of people want to do that. Those racist assholes. How dare they.

http://migs.concordia.ca/document/HeinsohnHitlerandtheJewishPeopleJGR.pdf

“We use the term Jewish race merely for reasons of linguistic convenience, for in the real sense of the word, and from a genetic point of view, there is no Jewish race. [...] The Jewish race is above all a community of the spirit. Spiritual race is of a more solid and more durable kind than natural race.”

>>929294


Fuck you.


Germans were nationalists. They viewed Jews as non-Germans. So they wanted them out of Germany but there were Jews how served in the Germany army and Zionist that worked with the Nazis.
>On 11 January 1941, a letter that would be later referred to as the Ankara document was sent from Vice Admiral Ralf von der Marwitz, the German Naval attaché in Ankara, depicting an offer by Lehi to "actively take part in the war on Germany's side" in return for German support for "the establishment of the historic Jewish state on a national and totalitarian basis, bound by a treaty with the German Reich."

Read My Struggle by Adolf Hitler, understand him before repeating allied propaganda.

>>929311

You mean the part where he blames Jews and communists for various international catastrophes?

>>929319
>implying communism wasn't an international catastrophe to rival the black plague

>>929319

That sentiment was very common around the world, including the anglosphere.


Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haavara_Agreement

Hitler and most Germans wanted Jews out, not dead.

In b4 hurr durr this is all a lie there were no ties between the Nazis and Zionists

>>929326

>implying capitalism hasn't resulted in many tens of millions of deaths since the turn of the 20th century.

>>929330

Yes, very common (hence the civil war in Russia). That sentiment found its political apex in the Nazi party.

>>929330

>Haavara agreement: While it helped Jews emigrate, it forced them to give up most of their possessions to Germany before departing. Those assets could later be obtained by transferring them to Palestine as German export goods.

Yeah good deal: "get the fuck out. We'll sell your shit back to your when you get there".

>>929333
I'll use you as a forced labourer TO DEATH WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT!
versus
I'll employ you TILL RETIREMENT IF THAT'S OKAY WITH YOU!

>>929358

It's rough, but it no worse than what went down in 1917, or Japanese Interment camps, or the shit the British pulled in India and China.

>>929384

>>Implying capitalism is not capable of outright coercion.

>>929384

I guess you weren't aware that communism never existed in reality; merely a worker's state which fell under the control of a Stalinist bureaucracy which at a late stage felt compelled to accelerate national productivity (thus forced labour). Of course it wouldn't occur to you either that Soviet Russia had come out of a destructive world war overseen by bourgeois capitalists and a subsequent civil war. Dickhead.

Also, no worker retires at their desired age. Neither a century ago nor now.

>>929384

>implying labour camps are exclusive to 'communism'.
>implying what you said actually means anything

nazis are garbage. they have a scewed up ideology. the fact that they were able to momentarily and conveniently convince the worst dregs of some colonial backwaters that they weren't out to revert the bulk of ythe world to abject degeneracy and servitude means nothing.

>>929420
>"merely" a worker's state

I might bracket that.

>>929423

> Americans are garbage. they have a scewed up ideology. the fact that they were able to momentarily and conveniently convince the worst dregs of some colonial backwaters that they weren't out to revert the bulk of ythe world to abject degeneracy and servitude means nothing.

I suggest everyone here read the Allegory of the Cave.

Stop staring at shadows and open your minds, people.

>>929431
>Allegory of the cave

Favourite catchphrase of idiots who'd like to think Plato was describing - exclusively - their own particular enemy.

>>929236

Fuck off, david Irving. Your perversion of historical sources is well-known.

ITT:

>Nazi revisionism
>revision
>not revisionism when its the truth....

Wait...
do people ITT actually think they will change someone's opinion? THIS IS THE INTERNET. MORE SPECIFICALLY, 4CHAN. Nobody's going to listen to your best-laid arguments, especially about topics full of extremists.

>>929440

OP's arguments are fairly tame.

In reality, there were never any gas chambers. The only 'gas chamber' in existence was a Stalinist 'reconstruction' of one.

>>929431

WTF? It's not a matter of us "opening up our minds," it's a matter of you willfully ignoring historical documentation for a political purpose.

There is no debate here. OP is just a faggot.

Good day to you.

>>929439

Soooo...

You refuse to hear other people's arguments... because they don't agree with you and therefore are stupid?

Anti-intellectualism often rears its head when traditional dogma is challenged, I guess /lit/ is no exception.

>>929431
Everyone has read Plato, congrats on just discovering him. When you fully develop your critical thinking skills, it happens from age 20-22, maybe you will have something interesting.

>>929454

I provided quite a few neutral sources. I suggest you at least read them before cutting and running.

>>929463

reading and understanding are different things, bro

>>929463

No, you're pretending Plato's Cave wasn't exactly the case in Germany throughout the 1930s through to (roughly) the end of WWII. Congratulations.

>>929478

I misquoted, erp. See idiot here:

>>929458

>>929482

>>I'm going to do the same thing I accused the Nazis of doing.

Yeah... Anything to ignore historical facts and cling to partisan historical revisionism.

>>929464

>Appeal to anti-imperial tendencies in far-off backward lands.
>Brown people are Nazis too. It's true!

>>929488

I never denied for one moment that Plato's Cave isn't widely applicable. Good for you, you're losing a philosophical argument.

>>929488

What "historical facts"? That military needs meant that the Nazis had some brown soldiers doing guard duty? That less than a hundred thousand jews were sent to Palestine through a "government program?" What the FUCK ARE YOU TRYING TO ARGUE, faggot?

>>929490

That's a red herring. I never implied that.

Also

>>Implying allied forced didn't do the same thing.

>>929499

>>Never acknowledge facts that go against dogma.
>>Claim victory.

And let me guess, you think America is the freest place on earth and "DA ALLIES" were god-sent forces of good?

>>929191
>their

SIE STUECK SHEISSE

>THIS THREAD

>>929516

"Da allies" were vastly out of step with their timing, including the Germany communists who should have stepped in much earlier the Nazi ascension. But yes, what they participated in was overall beneficial to the health of mankind.

>>929524

LOGH rocks so hard.

>>929513

Brainwashed idiot is brainwashed.

You're either trolling or dense. Since I'm feeling generous today, I'm going towards the first.

Also, Rommel > Eisenhower > you ;3

>>929525

I've been drinking.

>including the German* communists who should have stepped in much earlier [against] the Nazi ascension.

>>929191
'sup OP, I'd watch your videos but I am listening to Black Sabbath right now so, sorry

>51 posts and 9 image replies omitted. Click Reply to view.

>>929529

Seriously, faggot, you haven't provided any argument or pointed out what your "historical facts" are "proving." Don't just say people who don't "agree" with you (about what?) are "brainwashed." Man up and talk back to them, or else you really are the idiot. Get it? Do you understand that, or are you just dense?

>>929553
Brainwashed servant of the Jews detected!

>>929529

Rommel committed suicide; Eisenhower became president of the free world. Guess someone won in the end, right?

>>929553

Simmer down tough guy, I don't want you gassing anyone XP.

All I'm suggesting is that the Axis are demonized by the former allies and provided evidence to the contrary.

I never knew /lit/ is do dogmatic and defensive.

>>929333
did you know that 100% of people that perform manual labor DIE

OH GOD, FREE THE PROLETARIAT!

>>929578
yeah of course they were demonized. We were at war with them 70 odd years ago. This doesn't change the fact that 12 million people were murdered by the Nazi regime.

Starting a war that resulted in the deaths of millions of people is usually a good reason to demonize a group.

If you can't get past that, there's little else to say.

>>929581

Through the exploitation of unfair or nonexistent labour practices, many people throughout history have died, yes.

>>929591
>practices

Meaning standards, laws, etc..

>>929578


I think /lit/ just doesn't suffer idiots (i.e. you) well.

>>929591
so, when people exploited unfair labor practices, they died.

>>929607

Yes? Hence the sarcastic (and thus seemingly retarded)

>OH GOD, FREE THE PROLETARIAT!

>>929584

Belzec and Treblinka might not have happened. That brings the death toll down to 4.5 million. The rest definitely happened. The exact figure doesn't matter for any practical purposes.

Keep in mind that commies the likes of Mao and Stalin and American intervention caused MUCH MORE death than the Nazis. And yet people still revile the Nazis while hatred of socialists and imperialism is seen as an overreaction and unpatriotic.

>>929567

Rommel died honorably, Eisenhower precoded over a outright racist and degenerate nation, had generals who were willing to nuke their former alles over economic differences, and built up an imperial military industrial complex that he himself denounced.

Rommel > Eisenhower

>>929604

*facepalm*

Sure is leftist fail here.

>>929524

>Yes.

>>929628

There's enough hatred to go around. The Nazis were especially good at earning their own odium. Let's not take that way from them now, son.

>>929628
At Belzec 434,508 Jews died

At Treblinka around 850,000 people died.

that leaves 10,715,492

>>929648

What did you expect with your KAWAII faces and "facepalms?" Go back to stormfront, k?

>>929628

You must be referring to the point at which Russia was trying to keep the Germans (and their various roaming death squads) out of Russia.

Or maybe you're just saying that a militant, nationalist and expansionist Germany had the right to (necessarily) overspill into neighbouring countries.

>>929648

I never realized that the Tea Party/GOP was now the party of Nazi sympathy. Color me surprised.

How is this even fucking related to literature
OP is a dipshit, they fought a whole fucking war over this shit, Hitler blew his brains out for a good reason (1. because he was a pussy bitch and 2. he knew literally the world was after his head)

>>929684

this

>>929679

I never said that. But now that's up, does anyone here remember Manifest Destiny, the oppression of the Irish, or British brutality in India?

It seems that people hate expansionism and imperialism only when the Anglosphere is not doing it.

>>929680

>>Providing historical evidence
>>Nazi sympathy

Butthurt much?

Gee, let me guess. Opposing Israeli abuse of Palestinians make me a terrorist too, right? Fuck off you hypocritical imperialist piece of shit.

God, trolling a board like /lit/ on a Sunday night. How goddamn tragic is this?

>>929684

He took millions of Russians, Americans, and Britons with him, so it's a wash lol

>>929684

Read My Struggle, it's literature.

Ten out of ten.

>>929733
You know why no one gets up in arms about the evils of the "anglosphere"? Because no one knows about them. You know why no one knows about them? Because these people live in the "anglosphere." Propaganda's a bitch.

You're implying that simply because America and the British and so forth also did awful, awful things, this means that the Nazis were alright because they opposed the Americans and the British and so forth.

I would bet 5 weeks of lunch money that you're some stupid pseudo-teabagger who is just doing this to make the teabaggers look bad. This is alright with me. JUST PLEASE FOR GOD'S SAKE DON'T DO IT HERE

>>929733

Dude, but you haven't provided any "historical evidence" of anything. Also, stop assuming that people here approve of Anglo-imperialism. In any case, I starting to get the feeling that you don't give a fuck about the victims of English/American nastiness. You just want the Nazis to looks less bad. Amirite?

>>929733
>I never said that. But now that's up, does anyone here remember Manifest Destiny, the oppression of the Irish, or British brutality in India?

You imply that Nazi Germany wasn't the (degenerative) culmination of such things. You also mentioned Stalin in relation to WWII, as if he wasn't expected to drive all of Russia's resources (including lives) against an aggressive anti-communist force like the Third Reich.

"Hey, did you hear about that time when the SS guard didn't beat the Jew to death, and instead shot and killed him instantly? That means the Nazis were okay."

>>929756

I never said anything like that, nor did I bring the TP into the discussion.

Sad attempt at deflection is sad, lol.

>>929763

Read my posts and links, maybe you'll learn something.

>>929765

Um, what? I never said , or implied such thing. It's late, maybe you should go to sleep and let the adults talk, mmkay? ;)

>Hitler himself never knew what went on in the concentration camps.
No educated individual should continue reading past this. At best, this is revisionist nonsense. At worse, its Nazi apologetics.

>>929794

Nope, read your posts, read/listened to your links. What else ya got, besides saying that I'm brainwashed, a leftist, a Jew, etc...

>>929810

Something wrong, left-bagger?

>>929819

ummm, all of the above? I have never seen so much pride in willful ignorance since I eant to the Boston TP demonstration.

>>929794
>herp derp, i never said, derp

>It seems that people hate expansionism and imperialism only when the Anglosphere is not doing it.

>anon replies that the Nazis were exactly that, and are rightly hated; and for the same reason the British, French et al lost their last traces of empire.

>>929819
no you see the nazis loved jews

>>929845

>>Implying implications which may or may not be implied.

Ha ha ha ha, epic fail.

>>929843

Yes, "all of the above." Was the concept too hard to understand? Are you trying to state that the Nazis weren't so bad? That seems wrong. Are you trying to justify what the Nazis did because the Allies did the same/worse? The answer to that: so?

This isn't about me being "ignorant." I'm honestly trying to get at what you're attempting to say. Insulting me isn't helping your cause, dude.

>>929843

>insulting tea baggers so we won't think OP is one

>>929877

He's trying to say that the Third Reich should have been given a chance at European domination.

>>929877

Is that all you can come up with? Read my posts, if you want me explain basic reading skill too, tell me , lulz

>>929897
yeah, then my dad wouldn't have lost his job to the damn jews

stupid jews

>>929903

Thanks, troll. I get it now. Herp.

>>929889

>>LOL america deserved 9-11, LOL

How about rooting for our side for a change, you leftist moron?

>>929903

Did you lose your job to a Jew, OP?

>>929923

Wut? You're all over the place here, OP.

>>929923

But American did deserve 9-11. LOL.

>>929924
>>929934

itt: SAMEAFAGGOTRY

AND YES, i DID LOSE A JOB TO A JEW-NADO

/s

BUMP

>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehi_%28group%29#Contact_with_Nazi_authorities

It's interesting to note in light of this that whatever silliness is going on in this thread, the holocaust probably wasn't planned until quite late in the war. The 'Madagascar Plan' to establish a Jewish colony in Africa was still on the table in 1940. That's why in 1941 they're still contemplating support of a Zionist group.

Just so, if you look at the wikipedia page for 'Final Solution', you see wikiprose saying "Hitler seems to have known about the Holocaust" and backing it up with quotes from other Nazis quoting Hitler's 1938 speech. Now, far be it from me to suggest that Hitler generally didn't know about the Holocaust. Considering his position, and the testimony of his secretary, he probably did. Or at least - since the Germans were later so keen to dismantle the camps and hide what had been done there - it's extremely plausible that Hitler knew but deliberately distanced himself from the act. They knew what they were doing and knew they might be called to account.

I so lost, so should we kill all the jews or not?

Nevertheless, the way the plan came together, and the constant obsequious (but potentially disingenuous) reference to Hitler's 1938 speech, suggest a theory proposed by Ian Kershaw: 'cumulative radicalisation'. Before he was a historian of Nazi Germany, Kershaw was a medievalist. He analysed the Nazi government in almost feudal terms, as a group of viciously competing bureaucratic agencies circling around the figurehead of Hitler. His lifestyle during his later years - staying up all night to watch movies, sleeping in the day, lounging in ill-health in a Bavarian villa - suggests a fairly supine role. His ministers were constantly competing against each other to gain his approval and further their own power. His job, after a while, seems to have become limited to inspiring the people and saying "yes" to every proposal brought to him.

This is actually how the T4 Action (forced euthenasia) came into being. A guy with a deformed son wrote to a minister who brought his concern to Hitler (or perhaps the minister sought out the guy and encouraged him to write to the Fuhrer). Someone found it useful to gain favour with the leader and the leader said yes. Let those making an argument against Hitler’s “blame” take pause here. He (probably) said yes to genocide.

The Holocaust was ultimately a pragmatic decision – towards very warped goals and within very weird standards, true – but pragmatic. It grew out of the mass extrajudicial killings by the Einsatzgruppen on the Eastern Front, but these were just one method among many of getting rid of Jews. Madagascar might have done, or east of the Urals, or even Zion. But as the Nazi state's strength failed and the Russians began to push back, it was those that proposed extermination that won the argument and answered the jewish question.

What exactly does any of this shit have to do with /lit/ exactly? Other than the weak attempt to make it acceptable by bringing up Hitler's writings, oh right, none of it. So you know what, reported, which is what the rest of you should have done from the start. About the only place for this is, well, /b/(where it belongs) or....yeah, just /b/.

Not even going to bother arguing cause, I'm right, and OP, your wrong.

>>930047


>Not even going to bother arguing cause, I'm right, and OP, your wrong.
>I'm right, and OP, your wrong
>I'm right your wrong
>your wrong
>your