/lit/ - Literature

> when you realize feminism only exists because of fossil fuels

>>9260720
Call her a dumb bitch and say that her apparent untainted movement of feminism is a direct result of capitalism. Tell her to read mein kampf

>asking others what "movement" you should join NEXT

dude, just no

the only way

>Needing to attach yourself to a philosophical/political movement
How shallow is your gf's self-identity?

Why are you going out with this pleb?

>>9260720
Tell her women are incapable of deep intellectual thought and that the only books she should read are cooking and housecleaning books.

>>9260767
le edge

>>9260780
He's not wrong tho

Bimbofication is unironically the most suitable movement your gf should engage

>>9260767
this is generally the alt right position. if that's what you're leaning into.

hope she's cool with being a second class citizen. if not, punch her in the face so she gets an idea of her future.

>>9260720
What she is referring to is "white feminism". She needs to get involved with the more Commie strands of it.

>>9260720
>"feminism has been co-opted by people who just wear it as badge"
>"Hey, what political movement should I attach to my personality and wear like a badge next?"

>>9260780
Or merely pointing out where she would be without feminism. Renouncing feminism because of contemporary co-optation is like renouncing Darwinism because we are currently finding a lot of species whose evolution was convergent.

>>9260767
unironically this.

>>9260806
>everyone must be a member of this ideology because it's the One Truth

How about you go fuck yourself?

>>9260804
>??? ???
she's a woman.

women are an ideology

>>9260720
>>9260804
lmao
women, not even once

>>9260804
OP here. It was more like "What should I discover about next," rather than what can I attach myself to, as in the historical sense, as in specifically using the words "learn about"

Your misogyny is showing.

>>9260828
>your misogyny is showing
>anyone that isn't a proud male feminist like me is an EVIL MISOGYNIST
kill yourself braindead cuck.

>>9260831
calm your udders anon

>>9260828
What she's actually saying is

>"now that even my grandma call herself a feminist I don't find it cool or rebellious anymore. what other edgy ideology can I attach myself to and constantly shove in other people's faces?"

>>9260831
>anyone that isn't an insecure virgin autist is le numale feminist cuck

>>9260804
>people
I wonder why you neglected to include key points of her argument

>>9260838
this

>>9260828
Literally tell her to start with the greeks. Plato's 5 dialogues.

I'm in law school right now and I realized that I have spent more time studying the law then I have any of the radical political ideology I casually talk about. Can I really explain Anarcho-syndicalism in a detailed manner or am I just a poser? On the realist level I can talk about and address issues of local politics and reasons why or why not to choose city council members, but can I truely articulate a more broad line of reasoning and motivation to cause other people to critically think about the world around them?


I do not think I can. So I have been learning about learning, as well as starting with Plato. I think she needs to take a step back before diving back into the shouting void.

>>9260838

Lmao this

>>9260838
It's not cool or rebellious when people can buy 'this is what a feminist looks like' t-shirts made in offshore sweatshops. Capitalist hierarchism and emancipatory feminism kind of cancel each other out.

>>9260838
Considering she's a shy misanthrope that barely socialises, is adverse to conflict, and barely uses social media, I don't think your analysis holds up. I'm pretty sure I'm like the only person she even talks to about feminism.

>>9260850
>>9260743

So far these are the two best suggestions. Thanks guys. She'll be a sweet little fascist piece of cookware in no time.

How about she concentrates on being a good wife and mother instead?

>>9260868
this statement is derogatory towards women.

DELET THIS

>>9260866
>is adverse to conflict

Sound's like she needs some public speaking and introductory interpersonal communication books. Teach her how to be a person first, then she will find out why she needs to be a radical.

>>9260850
>Literally tell her to start with the greeks. Plato's 5 dialogues

Did you forget that we're talking about a woman here?

>>9260850
>tell HER to START WITH THE GREEKS
>women
>philosophy

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH.

>>9260895
>>9260903
>a slight biological difference stops a person from participating in philosophy


Oh Socrates, you are so wise!

>>9260908

Name one (1) notable female philosopher.

>>9260866
>Considering she's a shy misanthrope that barely socialises
that just proves anon's point

>>9260911
notable*

>>9260911
This is a bad example both because a simple google search answers your question and also because it's simply attaching a descriptor to philosopher. Why would one ask for the best blind, black, or Mongolian philosopher? There is no reason to need an arbitrary attach descriptors like that.

>>9260911
hannah arendt

>>9260720
/lit/ is especially retarded tonight.

Your gf sounds pretty based anon however the fact that you couldn't recommend her any lit following her revelation proves she's already surpassed you.

Probably sucking off some ambiguously brown marxist chad as we speak.

>>9260911
Hypatia of Alexandria

>>9260720
For helping your girlfriend:

Well, my girlfriend is a bit younger than me, so she sort of looks up to me as her intellectual mentor a little bit. I give off the vibe like:

>oh if only I'd had someone like me when I was your age for suggestions and guidance.

But I actually have no idea. So I just ask /lit/, not outright, but I ask for suggestions for myself and then give them to her. She thinks I'm really smart.

But before I did that, I had a more elaborate system: I would come to /lit/, go to the catalogue, and count 15 topics in. And from there I would go back until I reached a topic of the type: "Recommend me.." or "Where should I start with..." and I would then open that thread, and then I would take the third serious suggestion and give it to her.

That is how the first philosophy book my girlfriend read came to be Martin Heidegger's "Being and Time" and the second philosopher she read, straight after, was Confucius.

She then moved on to Stirner.

Maybe you should try something like that.

Why does she need to join some political movement? She seems autistic. It's way better to be noncommittal so you can mock ideologues while being evasive

>>9260911
Elizabeth Anscombe


Get fucked.

>>9260944
Not notable
>>9260954
Not notable, none of her works survived and she was merely an educator and not a philosopher
>>9260960
Not notable

>falling for the woman meme
woman have no beliefs, they will do anything they can for attention

>>9260958
Kys yourself, normie psued

>>9260944
the leading thinker in totalitarian studies is not notable? okay nerd.

>>9260967
Susanne Langers

QED

>>9260967
The fuck does 'notable' mean to you fussypants?

>>9260958
>starting with Heidegger
I feel sorry for her

>>9260974
>WAAH FUCK NAZIS AND SHIT
woah...
>>9260975
Not notable, only known because she's a woman
>>9260980
I mean someone who truly brought something innovative to philosophy. The Kants and Nietzsches.

>>9260911
Simone de Beauvoir

>feminism "has been co-opted by capitalist opportunists like beyonce and [some other celebrity] and media outlets and others" who "wear feminism like a badge," and "to many it's just an accessory or a talking point wrapped up in identity politics."

How does this devalue the philosophy behind feminism though?
Did your girlfriend seriously renounce her way of viewing the world because too many people bought into it- because it got too popular?
Or does she actually believe that if people exploit a philosophy, the philosophy itself literally stops being worthwhile?
Because if that's how it is I'd recommend you to punch your gf in the ovaries and forbid her from ever touching a book again.

>>9260911
Butler.

>>9260967
I hate Hannah Arendt but to say she is not notable just proves your a pleb

>>9260989
Anscombe made insanely important contributions to the philosophy of action. It is not her fault that you are not educated enough to know of her groundbreaking work.

>>9260992
Feminism doesn't have any worthwhile philosophy though. It's just an edgy trend for teenage girls to grow out of.

>>9260720
Don't let her become a radfem please, then she'll leave you and become a political lesbian.

>>9260997
Whether or not feminism is worthwhile is irrelevant. The point I was making was that OPs gf renounced it for literally the most vapid reason imaginable and that she's a stupid cow for it.

>>9260992
>Did your girlfriend seriously renounce her way of viewing the world because too many people bought into it- because it got too popular?
>Or does she actually believe that if people exploit a philosophy, the philosophy itself literally stops being worthwhile?

Perhaps she believes only in the old meaning of feminism but realises that it has come to mean something completely ill defined at best, and at worst, a divisive ideology, and so is rejecting the term? Or perhaps she believes that the feminist goal has been satisfied, and that the remainers are either overly dogmatic professional victims, or they are vain narcissists who only want to seem hip.I don't know.

Rejecting modern feminism doesn't necessarily mean rejecting gender equality and anti-discrimination.

>>9260720

>Then she asked me something like "What do you think the next philosophy/political movement I get into should be?"

Of course she did.

The fact that people are buying this fucking bullshit is beyond me.

>>9261006
Rejecting the modern incarnation of the term doesn't mean rejecting its ideas.

>sup guys meet my mouthpie- er-- my gf

Congrats that's a very smart girlfriend

>>9260754
this desu

>>9261004
I think it's a good reason to renounce something. If something has been co-opted and warped into something bad, then you can renounce it in good conscience. Isn't vapid.

>>9260989
>truly
>innovative

At some point you'll reveal criteria that are independently verifiable.

>>9260838
>is a stinerposter
>calls others vacuous and edgy

>>9260989
do you have a few extra chromosomes? her case study was the nazis but her diagnostics are used in every regime from tito to amin.

>>9260720
The modern left's unyielding focus on racial and gender politics is borne out of a feeling of political incompetence fruit of the embracement of modern liberal capitalist values and the failure of social democracy.

>>9260908
>a slight biological difference
>SLIGHT
never go full retard. men and women are different species. till you open your eyes to this reality, enjoy being a cuck.

>>9260720
tell her that the fact that capitalist institutions openly deride men's rights activists just shows that it's the logical anti-capitalist movement

>>9260993
Psuedo shit anon

>>9260908

It sure doesn't stop them from trying, just look at you participating in the discussion with your extra chromosome.

>>9260980

That the philosopher in question has (1) a penis and (2) identifies as male.

tell her she must burn the capitalist state. write a novel about what happens.

Tell her to read "on women" by schopenhauer

>>9260720
brake up with her

>>9260720
Burkean conservatism

>>9260720
>>9260804
I bet she doesn't even see the irony, living without any self-awareness must be a blissful ignorance.

>>9260813
You absolutely, completely missed the point of the post you quoted, congrats

>>9260767
I laughed. Bunch of humorless queens around here.

>>9260720

Feminism wasn't co-opted by capitalists, it was co-opted by Marxists in order to push for increased non-white immigration into the West. Feminism is now a completely anti-white institution. She has it totally backwards.

>>9260828
>Your misogyny is showing

So that screencap of SJW's on reddit plotting to "infiltrate 4chan thru /lit/ and a few other slow moving boards because they're more liberal" was legit? Fascinating.

This >>9260969

>>9260785
>>9260810

kill yourself

>>9262826

>actually believing this

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>9260720
>Feminist rejects feminism because it's popular
>Not because it's wrong and harmful to society
>Asks a man what she should do next
Delicious, delicious irony

>criticizes other women for "wearing feminism like a badge"
>unironically asks "What do you think the next philosophy/political movement I get into should be?"

>>9262548
>"on women" by schopenhauer

Wow, I just read this and had no idea Schopenhauer was such a neckbeard. This is total trash, I'm like laughing at how bad this is. He really was full of himself, wasn't he?

>>9264587
>Reading it now
I dunno anon, seems pretty good so far.

>>9264587
I'm reading it right now, and honestly, I can't help but agree with him on most of what he says. I wish I didn't, honestly. I wish I could fall back into believing women have equal capacity for intellectual and spiritual growth and maturity, but I honestly can't anymore. Even the smartest most well-read women who I've regarded as complete equals and worthy of admiration I inevitably come to realize only took up intellectual pursuits as a fashion trend to suit their "unconventional" image of themselves and thus have an extremely shallow understanding of and respect for the ideas they show off like a new purse.

Is there any literature that can legitimately make me believe in the equal potential of women again?

>>9264621
Personal experience will always trump some literature. The proof is in the pudding, as they say.

>>9260720
Tell her to start with the Greeks.

>>9260838
this x10000000

>>9264601
By the last paragraph, he starts arguing that only men should inherit property relations and that men are the only ones capable of "non-material advantages, such as intellect, learning, courage, and the like."

>That the property which men have with difficulty acquired by long-continued struggling and hard work should afterwards come into the hands of women, who, in their want of reason, either squander it within a short time or otherwise waste it, is an injustice as great as it is common, and it should be prevented by limiting the right of women to inherit. It seems to me that it would be a better arrangement if women, be they widows or daughters, only inherited the money for life secured by mortgage, but not the property itself or the capital, unless there lacked male descendants. It is men who make the money, and not women; therefore women are neither justified in having unconditional possession of it nor capable of administrating it. Women should never have the free disposition of wealth, strictly so-called, which they may inherit, such as capital, houses, and estates. They need a guardian always; therefore they should not have the guardianship of their children under any circumstances whatever.

This is so painfully outdated it almost reads like some crazy man's delusion.

>May it not be that the influence of women in France, which has been increasing since Louis XIII.‘s time, was to blame for that gradual corruption of the court and government which led to the first Revolution, of which all subsequent disturbances have been the result?

>not realizing that it was women that sparked the French Revolution
>not realizing that the Revolution was actually good and the entire royal family should have been massacred ten times over

Everyone should read The Origin of the Family, Private Property and the State by Engels.

>>9264621
yeah, talk to my girlfriend or a few of my female professors

>>9260720
Tell her that she should not be interested in politics or philosophy and that she should try knitting instead.

>>9260720
I'd tell her to go outside and go for a walk, volunteer at a homeless shelter, work in an orphanage
you don't need to follow some ideology that you poorly understand in order to be a good person

>>9260720
Essential edgelord core!

>>9260720
Nihilism is the new feminism

>>9264621
>only took up intellectual pursuits as a fashion trend to suit their "unconventional" image of themselves and thus have an extremely shallow understanding of and respect for the ideas they show off like a new purse.

You do realize where you are, right?

>>9264632
That's definitely true, but that's part of the issue. I've never read any literature that made me disregard women as equals, it's purely through personal experience. Through treating them as equals and eventually realizing they simply don't engage with the world with the same depth that men do, I simply can't take them seriously anymore, as much as I wish I could.

The only thing I hold out for is that it's more an age thing (early 20s), and women just take longer to mature mentally/spiritually than men.

>>9264638
>painfully outdated
>crazy man's delusion
Can you not even consider the possibility that you have been deluded into accepting that egalitarianism is the proper way a society should evolve?

>>9264675
>age
Ehh, I'm 27 and work with older women. Don't wanna get you down bro, but it's grim.

>>9260720
Catholicism and the Bible.

>>9264621
>Even the smartest most well-read women who I've regarded as complete equals and worthy of admiration I inevitably come to realize only took up intellectual pursuits as a fashion trend to suit their "unconventional" image of themselves

This is everyone you've ever known get over yourself. No one acts outside of social egotism.

>>9264702

>Can you not even consider the possibility that you have been deluded into accepting that egalitarianism is the proper way a society should evolve?

>Can you not even consider the possibility that you have been deluded into thinking there is a delusion into accepting that egalitarianism is the proper way a society should evolve?

>Can you not even consider the possibility that you have been deluded into thinking there is a delusion of a delusion into accepting that egalitarianism is the proper way a society should evolve?

Have you ever considered that maybe you thinking I have a delusion is a delusion on your part and we are all part of this greater delusion of late capitalism, of which we delusionally think we have any control over and that the way gender and its relations constructs itself is a product of the march of history and the material forces that drive it?

Pretty delusional bro.

>>9264675
>>9264621
Yeah, keep thinking on it. If you're smart, you'll change your mind

>>9260754
The only thing worse is him coming here to ask us what to tell her.

OP should dump her for being such a fucking pseud, on par with those celebs she suddenly detests (probably because of coming across some website like alternet that had an article calling them out), then neck himself for being even fucking dumber than her.

>>9260845
Oh great Frog. Your Royal Steed, the Eternal Frog Poster. Saving me from spending time contributing fully autistic first grade poetry, arguing that Sam Harris is indeed a mega fag (so is Jordan Peterson holy shit), and whatever the fuck it is i do in this shit virtual watering hole. The Frog Poster is here.

Classic Pepe. Never Gets Old, Giggle.

Pepe

[[[Pepe With Beard]Lvl. 9001]Murders Families Whole]
Damn that is indeed a rare Pepe watch yourself there Anon FrawgPawsta

tell her to become a MRA

>>9260767
>>9262820

I laughed too, but entirely seriously this man is right.

Your girlfriend has already displayed herself incapable of conviction or original thought, OP. Just like all things, as a woman, she only wants attention.

>>9266238


I looked, and there before me was a rare pepe! Its handler was named anon, and Kek was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by shitposts, postmodern irony and tumblr hashtags, and with the memes of the earth.

>>9260720
Your girlfriend is dumb. Why would you renounce feminism just because you are unhappy with misapplications or misperceptions of it? Just make sure you live your life so as to provide a counter example.

>>9260827
thank god men don't do this amirite

>>9260831
>cuck

so many virgin neets have become obsessed with cucks because their one of the few groups who are on part with their loneliness.

>>9267112

It would be better to never get laid at all than to let a woman shit all over you at every opportunity and degrade yourself for her in an attempt to get laid.

Anybody who has been laid at least once ever can see that.

>>9260720
>"What do you think the next philosophy/political movement I get into should be?"

>>9264739
>If you are a wise and intelligent man like myself, surely you will come to see the error of your ways and come over to MY side, or what is more commonly known as the right side.
FTFY

>>9260720
>"to many it's just an accessory or a talking point wrapped up in identity politics."
>Then she asked me something like "What do you think the next philosophy/political movement I get into should be?"

>>9260720
This is the kind of person who goes to church because they like the traditions and the warm fuzzy feeling it gives them
Dump her and find a girlfriend with a modicum of self-awareness

>>9267197
>a girlfriend with a modicum of self-awareness
Where do they keep those anyways?

>>9260800
As yes, Karl Marx's greatest invention, intersectional feminism! Obviously not a tool of the elites to propagate atomization of large groups otherwise capable of political action...

>>9264738
>I know you are but what am I?

>>9267256
Idk, but I've met a couple women who were genuinely intelligent, virtuous people. It's kept me from becoming like >>9264621
They're rare, though. If you find one keep her.

>>9260720
The fact that people on 4chan just don't ask and go with the flow or against it tells you a lot about the hypocrisy here

>>9267197
Does going to the church out of love for the tradition and the fuzzy feeling it gives you make your motivation less worthy than someome who chastises himself while reciting Bible verses?
Why do people always get so elitist about living life? Does it give you pleasure knowing that these people aren't real Christians? Would Jesus have judged them for wanting to live their life with faith and participation in the Holy Service?

I don't understand you, it's like you're looking for reasons to hate yourself and others. Oh wait, right, this is 4chan.

>>9260767
This is the correct answer

>>9260890
Recc me some?

>>9267871
wew lad, that's a heavy misreading of what I just said.
>someone who chastises himself while reciting Bible verses
How about someone who actually believes in and worships God, rather than turning their brain off for an hour?
>Why do people always get so elitist about living life?
If St. Paul thought like you the church would have died out before the third century. It is concern with how other people live their lives that motivates us to try to help them improve. I don't hate any human being regardless of their sin thanks to an acute awareness of my own failings, but I certainly hate the self-centered and borderline Satanic impulse some branches of the church have to water down the Gospel and the responsibility that all people bear in light of it.

>>9267428
I am but what i know, are you?

>>9260804
"women, shit."

Hemingway

>>9269080
fuck that was faulkner