/lit/ - Literature

>writing some shitty books for neocon lizards
>taking/breaking lives of hundreds millions of people
Seems pretty same to me desu.

They say she had a really huge cock

>communism is bad
nice meme

>>9192090
Everything political is bad, just deal with it

You're giving her a lot of credit for being a fairly mediocre writer.
She just framed a feeling that was already all too common in the US.

I didn't know she was responsible for the death of 90 million people?
Or was it because of the other thing you think she's worse than?

>>9192090
>let me just disregard a hundred years of authoritarian regimes and endless suffering made possible through the forced implementation of communist ideas

>>9192267
>ascribing faults of implementations to underlying theory

>>9192267
b-b-b-b-ut that wasn't real communism xDD

>>9192285
>it wasn't real communism
>implementation isn't the same as theory
same difference

>>9192298
Yes and both of them are correct. Memeing like this >>9192288 is a sign of a retard who has no actual arguments. Communism is the final destination, probably unreachable due to human nature. Attempts to build it went sour, but their faults are not that of communism itself.

>>9192326
>communism is the final destination

Strong opinion, literally impossible to prove. Why do you believe this so strongly?

It's not enough to say Marx persuaded you. Where's the evidence for this incredible claim? Do we know of any other "final destinations" for other things in life?

I don't know about that. but communists tend to be brighter and have an dynamic interest in culture.....Rand fags tend to be bitter, insular-minded retards.

I'd have a beer with a communist anyday.

>>9192392
>communists tend to be brighter and have an dynamic interest in culture
those are the futurists to be honest

>>9192078
this but unironically

>>9192097
>falling for the ideology of post ideology

>>9192392
>dynamic interest in culture
>conservative 100 million dead in the last century under communist regime
I guess you are technically correct.

>>9192078
>lit consensus on Rand is that she is a zero regarded as a meme philosopher and a joke writer
>Caused more harm than Communism

Pick one

>>9192766
most of them were chinks so who cares

>>9192078
Right now she's single-handedly causing more harm to my eyes than than your stupid fucking post.

>>9192078

she was nothing more than a byproduct of communism herself. There's really nothing to Ayn Rand other than massive butthurt over the impact communism had on her childhood and some small amount of literary talent - on par perhaps with people like Steele or Clancy or Steven King, and that's being quite charitable.

It's a small minded, broken sort of person that reads her work and sees in it anything other than a wounded little girl lashing out at an eidetic misconception of communism which quite frankly exposes more about her own internal psycho social shortcomings than any actual political or social framework she portrayed herself as being in opposition to.

Thankfully, generation after generation, her idiot fans keep outing themselves by unironically and unashamedly disclosing their high praise for her work. They literally say things like, "reading Ayn Rand changed my view of the world!" It's like hearing an adult tell you that they've come to a clearer understanding of the world thanks to "The Little Engine That Could". Some of these people actually graduated from decent universities!
Zombies.

>>9192078
She's a bad writer whose thoughts aren't taken seriously. Nothing more.

>>9192078

Friends I never read Ayn Rand but I've read that she disliked homosexuals, whereas I find her so manly. Was she an inhibited lesbian ?

>>9192766
Yeah. But you can talk art, literature etc with a communist....not so with a rand fanatic.
I would still prefer to drink with a commie

>>9192078
No she's just a symptom

>>9192336
>Strong opinion
It's not an opinion, the aim of communiSTS is to achieve communISM. The idiot version: Communism (the philosophy) argues that all societies develop based on their economics and they argue that because capitalism unavoidably pits workers' interests against capitalists' interests that the workers will seize power and establish a new kind of economics called socialism (in which the workers, not capitalists, control society) which will LEAD to a future economy called communism (in which there are no class divisions). This is not a matter of prophecy but a matter of observation and history: the capitalist class did the same thing to the aristocracy, and so on all the way back to the beginnings of class societies. This is why you need to actually LEARN about things before opening your mouth / putting your fingers to the keyboard.

>>9192766
>MUH 100 MILLION LOLOLOLOL MOM I POSTED IT AGAIN GIB ME TENDIES

>>9192285
>not real communism
>not real capitalism
>not real aristocracy
>not real christianity
>not real islam
>not real feminism
>not real nihilism
die you fucking collectivist

>>9193482
Are you having an autism seizure?

>>9193482
>collectivist
>implying communism isn't the true individualist ideology

>>9192078

I'm convinced everyone hates Ayn Rand so much because they know she's right.

>>9193526
Good luck with that

>>9193525
labelled ideology is collectivizing and is the cancer of the modern world

doesn't matter if you spin the fact that it is or isn't, ideology is collective

>>9193556
>doesnt matter what the words actually mean
>i will use them however i wish and be aggressively autistic about it
kys yourself

>>9193563
>le strawman

>>9193525
Very true. It's interesting how people confuse communal economics with uniformity when it's the most free kind of society possible. Especially interesting when the "traditionalists" claim this when individuals in primitive societies were gifted with large quantities of leisure time and even feudal peasantry had much of the calendar year covered with holidays.

>>9193568
>>9193563

>>9193526
Zizek pretty much believes this too.

>communism was spearheaded by Jews
>but individualism was also spearheaded by Jews
Really makes you think

>>9193429
Thats a semi-amazing title.

>>9193526
>My bitch is sleeping around with another dude
>It's completely ok though because he has more money and a bigger dick and ego than i do
Rand was the original numale cuck philosopher that's why you love her so much

>>9193634
I liked it, but mostly it's a very good book.

>More damage
>Inspired the bump in the road called Reaganomics and Thatcherism in the 80s and early 90s
>Was fixed soon after and implemented better than last time

Pretty sure Communism killed atleast a 100+ million people while objectivism was never fully implemented, except as an inspiration for Libertarian-like policies.

>>9193716
Thatcher saved Briton from becoming the modern day Greece.

>>9193720
Exactly what happens if you roll back on Keynesianism and government control by privatizing everything, happened under Thatcherism.Social upheaval became bigger, inflation, unemployment, rising interest rates, etc.

Most countries have adopted some form of Keynesian economics for a reason, are you trying to tell me you know better?

>>9193716
>Stalin personally shot 100 million people...
top meme my mang

>>9193761
That's not what I said, but if you want me to elaborate.

100+ million people died due to an unsuccessful practice and process of Communism in mass famines, labor camps, or simply perished because of the regime.

>>9193771
>100+ million people died due to an unsuccessful practice and process of capitalism in mass famines, poverty, or simply perished because of the regime.

>>9193753
>inflation became bigger under Thatcherism
>are you trying to tell me you know better?
Hmmm.

>>9193782
What kind of Capitalism are we talking, Chinese-style Capitalism, 1800s Capitalism, 1900s Capitalism, Dutch Capitalism?

Keynesian-Capitalism, Classic-Liberal Capitalism, responsible Capitalism, popular Capitalism, advanced Capitalism, etc.

Do you consider pre-Capitalist societies that committed genocides, and then became Capitalist to be the fault of Capitalism?

>>9193810
>Trying to argue Mercantilism and Georgism fit the modern definition of Capitalism
Get back into your time machine Marx.

>>9193810
>What kind of communism are we talking, Yugoslavian communism, 1930s communism, 1970s communism, Vietnamese communism?
>Maoism, Stalinism, Trotskism, Marxism-Leninism, goulash communism, etc.
>Do you consider pre-communist societies that committed genocides, and then became communist to be the fault of communism?

>>9193845
We were talking specifically about Russian Communism, now you.

>>9193848
>Russian communism is responsible for 100+ millions of deaths
Kek. Your Americuck education is showing. It was a horrible inhumane regime, but even the Stalinist terror counts about 4 million victims at most. Even if you add literally all the perished in WW2 by the highest estimates that's 15 million. You can fuck off now, фaмaлaм.

Atlas shrugged is my favorite book.

Stop defending communism.

>>9193878
You look like you could use a vacation, senpai.

>>9193862
>4 million victims

This is straight up Holocaust denial tier

>>9192078
(((Ayn))) (((Rand)))
Filth.

>>9193891
>100+ millions
This is straight up clueless retard tier.

>>9193912
>Le every problem can be traced back to one particular group face

Like Nietzsche says, "fear is the mother of morality."

Daily reminder that communists have still not confronted how retarded their failed ideology is.

>>9193930
>Le neet-shoe quote

Like Jesus says, "fuck off you obnoxious cunt".

>>9193943
They did, it's called Neo-Marxism.

>>9193930
Except Rand was a Jew.

>>9193878
Ne, psa

>>9193887
Nice

>>9193947
Shouldn't you be on /pol/ right now, pledging full allegiance to an arbitrary, subjectively created idea of cultural and racial identity that nobody but /pol/ agrees to, and is also just as susceptible to change?

Or are you going to stay here for a while and shit up this board, and then leave when you realize you have the brain capacity of a ground squirrel, and really should go back to your blue-collar group of Libertarian and Conservative playful Fascists pretend-playing with actual Fascists because it's taboo comedy?

>>9193999
>idea of cultural and racial identity that was held as a truism for centuries
Fixed.
>and is also just as susceptible to change
But only change that agrees with your politics, I take it?

>>9193999
>point out he's being obnoxious
>le pol retard kek nobody but pol go back to pol shit up this board pol brain capacity pol fascism pol pol pol
Are you alright there, lad?

>>9193999
Don't argue with him. He's a fat little lump of dipshit who could never be taken seriously in a room full of people with an adult-level ability to scrutinize ideas and information.

>>9194054
No they weren't, every single culture is transferred to a new generation that has different interpretations, different ideas, and different directions.

You want to stop that dynamic process, which kills the individual and leaves a country susceptible to political ideology because you don't need different political parties when you hold the idea that everyone experiences culture the same way and should subscribe to the same identity.

i can't wait to see who finally wins in the capitalism vs communsim debate, join me next week to see the same five people argue and troll each other thread after thread for the rest of your lives!!!!

>>9194094
>brainlet unable to argue
>huh you're dumb guise

>>9194105
yes I'm dumb for not arguing the same tired topic to death ad nauseum with internet strangers on a mongolian cattle herding board.

>>9194093
>every single culture is transferred to a new generation that has different interpretations, different ideas, and different directions.

So when there is centuries of writing and culture that paints Great Britain as an Island Nation separate from Europe by the sea 'as a moat defensive of a house' what they really meant is that it was part of Europe?

And a nation should have a shared identity, or what's the point in a nation? I already know the answer to that, so you don't need to say anything, I know where you stand. Your intense love of change and revisionism is what will leave the West open to attack from cultures who were not so willing to wash it all down the drain for a Utopian vision of cosmopolitanism.

>>9193613
It's all a big JEWSPIRACY!

>>9194120
>le funny asian forum Ieddit maymay
fuck OFF >>>/r/4chan

>>9192078

So hot though

>>9194093
>every single culture is transferred to a new generation that has different interpretations, different ideas, and different directions

In the olden days the new generation didn't have nothing in common culturally or ethnically with the old generation. And there were certain basic ideas which never changed throughout the ages

>>9193999
You tried. What a waste of trips

>>9194156
We were talking about culture and identity, not borders, but even borders change all the time.
Even among friendly neighbours, border disputes are often resolved by giving and taking. It's only the 90s that many new countries were created and border were re-drawn after the fall of Communism.

And nations have a shared identity and language, I never said we shouldn't have those either, I'm saying that it isn't healthy to demand that neither of these things change, or forcing a return to an era that has nothing to do with the current political and social climate.

>You just want us invaded by ebil Muslims!
How are you going to defend a singular national identity and culture when there are so many different identities and cultures, even within the most homogeneous societies?

Read some criticisms of your own political ideas for fucks sake.

>>9194188
Ofcourse there are certain basic ideas, but even the most basic ideas of any culture have had very different interpretations throughout history. Take the Bible for example, we have an entirely different idea based on our current culture, social climate, and thousands of other factors that all modify the way we look at the bible.

>>9194259
I don't see how the fact that nations aren't monolithic is an argument in favour of the mass immigration of aliens

>>9194337
It means that there is no clear and definitive culture and identity and that there never was a homogeneous society. The mobility of humans, ideas, and cultural products promotes cultural confrontation. Cultural confrontation is good because it promotes a better understanding of different cultures, while too much confrontation is wrong, and the question of how much confrontation you want to allow is a very hard question that depends on a variety of other causes.

>>9194259
>>9194370
So you admit that the monolithic culture of Islam has already won?

>>9194370
There may never have been a totally homogeneous society, but there was a society far more homogeneous than ours is today.

>Cultural confrontation is good because it promotes a better understanding of different cultures

Why is it necessary or useful for people to be personally acquainted with foreign cultures?

>>9194370
>Cultural confrontation is good because it promotes a better understanding of different cultures,

History says that cultural confrontation results in one of them being either marginalised or distinguished.

>more damage than communism

1 5 0 M I L L I O N

>>9194397
>Why is it necessary or useful for people to be personally acquainted with foreign cultures?

Because I'm middle class and it's fun! *tee hee*

>>9194397
Multiculturalism and multiracialism also has been shown to lower social cohesion.

>>9194410
all kulaks, don't worry about it comrade )))))))))))))))))))))))

>>9193761
>>9193891
>hitler personally gassed 6 million jews

>>9194120
>Same tired topic to death ad nauseam
You strike me as someone who's heard the same three soundbytes for the past five years and chalks this up to a nuanced umderstanding of the "subject," which you've conveniently reduced to a single "tired topic" for the sake of not having to think any further

>>9194530
>implying any substantially new thought has appeared on this topic in the last 20 years
At least you found a way to be condescending.

>>9193782

that's a big number.

>>9194410
This number keeps getting bigger but it will never surpass the 600 quadrillion

>>9194488
He did plan and order the action. This contrasts with the """""Holodomor"""""" and GLF famine deaths which were caused by natural problems (floods, droughts) and only exacerbated by human accident (necessary crop exporting, experimenting with unproven agricultural science). Of course even the trillion gorillion bajillion dead from these events are actually unaccounted for in both the USSR and China, with actual deaths in the latter especially being far below what is claimed.

>>9193930

hnng

>>9193999

btfo

>>9194548
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOnIp69r6vg

>captcha: moor jose

>>9194548
>>9194574
>genocide apologists

POL POT
JOSEPH STALIN
MAO ZEDONG

All butchers because of their totalitarian ideology.

>>9194587
Where were you when Mao personally strangled 16 billion Chinese farmers?

I'm not even American but I know of her. Isn't Atlas Shrugged a common book to read in programs of US schools?

>>9194599
I was there, it was so real in my mind. Just like Jung Chang and the misty poets all said. O' I cry erry time.

>>9194687
No, although it should be. If black inner city kids read her, and applied objectivism to their lives, there would be no more poverty in the ghettos

>>9192078

Did anyone kill 78 million people in her name? Cause that's what Mao did in name of communism! :D

>>9194687
>1200 pages

Somehow I doubt it.

Additionally,

https://www.fraserinstitute.org/sites/default/files/economic-freedom-of-the-world-2016.pdf

Scroll down to page ~26 for some neat graphs indicating the devastating effect of economic control on human productivity, happiness and wealth.

She's not even relevant outside of clapistan

>>9194761
They'd move out from shooting people in the ghettos straight to shooting classmates in college like their white counterparts.

>>9192078
idk i feel like blaming philosophy is a lil silly like the most philosophy can do is highlight preexisting forms of thinking imo. rand just gave a word towards what disgusting people think.

i've always maintained that even though rand was a hack writer and over all repulsive human being her books are a really good case study on a person who is the product of communism and how they might cope with it

but again ayn rand deserved to be skinned alive

>>9192078
Today, on "Moments with OP," Delusion: The Thread.

What are your thoughts on OP's delusions? Will he survive? Do you share them? Is he a brainlet (Yes, he is.)?

>>9192078
>more harm to the world than Communism

Is that possible?

>>9192078
>dang it why cant i get a better job than a barista with my liberal arts degree
>id be so much better off under mao
>better blow off steam on /lit/ under the guise of philosophical discussion

>>9192078
she writes like I think,
I can't help it that you're a pleb

>>9193526
The thing isn't that she's right, but that she was right and then idealized it.
Everything about Ayn Rand makes sense once you realize she idealized master morality from the ground up. People hate her because real life isn't idealistic. She took everything that can be considered to be Apollonian and idealized it to the point where her heroes are perfect gods that know everything objectively, make no mistake, live for their own sake, never abuse others or seek power over others.
Once you strip that layer of idealization, you noticed that she was right but that it was horribly flawed. Even her own downfall was caused by the weight of emotional value over rational values.

>>9193602
And he's right.
I still remember that 2007-2008 economical crash where Zizek had an article along the lines of ''this was all done because of John Galt''.
He understands that everything he stands for is the opposite of Ayn Rand.

>>9194846
>writing books is deserving of being skinned alive
How edgy.

>>9192090
>stave millions because you can't even get supply a demand right

>>9196322
The fact that the Soviet Union didn't invent a weather machine shows the failure of communism.

>>9196334
They did send someone in space though.

>>9196297
>Having such terrible reading comprehension on the literature board

>>9192090
All governments is bad if you're a generally thoughtful person XD

>>9196357
Only to show off to the Capitalist Pigs to see if they'll notice them.

>>9193862
> Has clearly never read the Gulag archipelago

100 milliion is Stalin + Mao.

Holodomor alone is about more then 4.

Great purge is not the only purge, kulaks for starters, ethnic cleansing and the like.

https://archive.org/details/TheGulagArchipelago-Threevolumes

Read Volume 1 Ch. 2.

Highest good estimate for Stalin's kill count I've seen is 40 mil most accurate was around 20.

WW2 Russia lost 24 mil not 15 mil idiot.

There is so much wrong with your comment.

>>9194561
....
> Human accident
> Natural problems.

The Holodomor was almost entirely manmade.

>>9198224
>Holodomor
>believing Goebbels
Sad!