/lit/ - Literature

Pence was at a play recently.

>>8753642
Also people will make fun of you absolutely anywhere other than /r/books if you call yourself a bibliophile.

>>8753642
We are in a mode of production that doesn't exactly produce consciousnesses who value 'book-learning'.

You don't need to be well-read to consume and produce.

>>8753642
Hillary Clinton is not an intellectual,

>>8753655
If you feel the need to label and identify yourself as a 'bibliophile', then you deserve all the ridicule you get

>he boasted that he could recite The Lovesong of J. Alfred Prufrock by memory

this is such a jerkoff thing to do

>>8753663
/r/books reading comprehension at its best.

>>8753650
A musical. lol

>>8753674
Hey, if you appreciate culture, and you're not a pretentious pseud, you're an intellectual to me.

Most Americans say they would not elect an atheist president.

I think that answers your question >:-)

>>8753650

Hamilton isn't good though.

>>8753683
>21st century atheism=concentrated autism

I don't like him, but people need to read more Nietzsche.

I've noticed people value "QI" style pointless trivia, rather than actual learning of any kind.

>>8753691
Nietzsche wasn't an atheist.

>>8753642
Democracy is babby's first socialism, except the "off with their heads!" cut-off point is much higher up the food chain.

Cultural elites are the despised class in wealthy democracies, industrial and commercial employers are despised in poor semi-socialist states like Venezuela, while peasant countries like Russia or China aimed their resentment much lower, and attacked moderately comfortable farmers and shopkeepers.

I'm sorry, Lisa Simpson. Politics is not a simple battle of smart, left-wing, allegedly classless people versus steak eating millionaires. In this case you are on the side of hereditary cultural property and aristocratic privilege, and I use the P-word in its proper sense.

>>8753693
Most people only understand that kind of knowledge. After all, everyone knows some bit of trivia.

>>8753642
One thing I've noticed about Americans is you're happy enough about politics up until it interferes with your ability to watch TV. Like even in a hypothetical sense, people will say shit like "yeah, local involvement in government would be great and all, but then I wouldn't be able to go home and watch TV", and while not everyone feels that way no one will go "that's a weird thing to say", like it's just accepted as a valid point.

Maybe that's the issue, they're worried these book people are going to stop them sitting in front of a box for several hours on some level.

I also have to point out that Bush's elections were some of the dodgiest elections ever, like you really can't go on about Putin being corrupt with some of the shit that went down there.

"branding" yourself as a "learned bibliophile" makes you look like a poser faggot, and no one wants a fucking poser faggot as president.

>>8753727
>no one wants a fucking poser faggot as president.

But orange conmen are ok?

>>8753727
I would rather have a pompous learned president than a fucking "common man" who fat mongoloids want to "have a beer with" or "get a firm handshake from." Ivory tower intellectuals make for the best leaders, there's a reason every prince in the history of absolute monarchies was educated on a wide variety of topics from birth until coronation.

>>8753733
a strong willed entrepreneur as opposed to a crooked as fuck career politician? yes, absolutely ok.

>>8753681
Might as well just approve of Harry Potter at that point.

>>8753659
She has probably read way more books than 90% of the population. Most of them are not literature but she is very intelligent, she has poor judgement though.

Isn't GWB actually a reader? I've heard he digs Tom Wolfe, and it made the news back in the day that he was reading The Stranger.

>>8753994
>who fat mongoloids want to "have a beer with" or "get a firm handshake from."
This shit just makes me feel bad for so many people. How lonely do you have to be that fantasizing about having a beer with some twat makes you want to vote them in for national leader?

>>8754021
Kek I remember this, there were national news stories on how Bush had his mind blown by The Stranger.

>>8753668
Kerry being a massive jerkoff is why he lost the election. Same with Romney.

>>8754039
They both had awful judgment sometimes. Yeah, being able to recite Prufrock is great, but how do you think that's a good thing to say when you need some morons in Florida to vote for you instead of thinking you're a huge fag.

>>8753998
>Entrepreneur

He inherited the family business. Him buying in Manhattan instead of Brooklyn makes that no less true.

>>8754050
>expands from real estate into casinos, hospitality, golf and resorting
(You)

>>8754025
It's just a euphemism for "likable guy" as opposed to "pretentious autistic cunt and probable homosexual".

>>8754055
Didn't the real estate go bust and had to be bailed out?
Didn't the casinos go bust?
Isn't golf and resorting under hospitality, and isn't his only golf course not open?

>>8754055
>Expands

Looks like we agree. He is not an entrepreneur.

>>8754060
>It's just a euphemism
I thought that at one point, but it's really not in most cases.

It's also not a euphemism, but I get what you mean and I can't remember the right word either.

>>8753681
I'm not sure if you're familiar with theatre but Hamilton is the most tourist pleb shit you could see on broadway

>>8753994
Not necessarily true, intellectuals can become absolute terrors when given any power because of their tendency to be obsessed with ideas of how the world works which write human dignity out of the equation. Just look at the early USSR. Yes, even Stalin was /lit/ as fuck. Some his anonymously published poetry is still studied in Georgian literature circles. He once used his literary connections to rob a fucking bank for the Bolsheviks.

>>8754048
what I don't understand is how the media keeps thinking that these fucking intellectual idiots like Gore/Kerry/Romney/Hillary are actually connecting with the American people. Obama's like them but at least he understands how to act human once in awhile.

>>8754076

It could have been Book of Mormon

>>8753642
yes. if you call yourself an intellectual, then any statement or argument you make can be waved away as being elitist nonsense. being educated means you don't know what real life is like.

>>8754077
I don't know if the media thinks they're connecting. I remember a lot of stories about how unlikable all 4 were. Their staffers and campaign managers surely made some grave miscalculations though.

No. The average person doesn't care about this stuff one way or the other, which is why most of the poor and working class, white or otherwise, don't vote, period. Gore, Kerry, and Hilary didn't turn off people because they were intellectuals. They turned people off because they came across as wooden and out of touch and weren't able to inspire their base and/or appeal to people outside that demographic. Liberals just like this narrative because it appeals to their sensibilities. As a rule, the average liberal is a bourgeois retard with crippling status anxiety who only reads Harry Potter, Game of Thrones, and hysterical Salon articles but feels a great sense of power by aping the views of our cultural elites and chimping out on anyone who doesn't conform to them to the letter.

Obama came off as every bit of an intellectual as Hilary, Kerry, or Gore, but he still won two terms because he was able to inspire people, including many who voted for Trump, with a hopeful message. Although I wouldn't Trump as an intellectual type and he doesn't come across as particularly bookish, he does openly brag about having gone to the best schools and having "good genes" and "one of the highest IQs". This didn't even hurt him slightly. Being perceive as intelligent is good if you also don't come across as a sheltered lifeless stiff with barely concealed disdain for most of the people you're supposed to be governing.

>>8754077
This is true, the most intellectual president the US has had is probably Woodrow Wilson, he was a Princeton professor and University President. He was a terror for civil liberties, promoted eugenics, crushed opposition to WWI, etc. Academics tend to be really bad at compromise, something which is essential for the president.

>>8754077
Stalin did nothing wrong
>inb4 bureaucratic capitalist propaganda

>>8754073
Oh right a euphemism is just if it's offensive, right? Colloquialism perhaps?

I'm not a native english speaker.

>>8754124
Fuck off commie

>>8753642

G. W. read like 183 or so books during one year while he was in office.

>>8754148
Euphemism is if it makes it sound better than it is, as opposed to a dysphemism that makes it sound worse. So like powdering your nose or how's your father are euphemisms as they avoid mentioning toilets and wanking.

>>8753705
One thing I've noticed about non-Americans is that they tend to project their most disliked aspects of their own society onto the United States. For instance, even though Americans have some of the most theatrical and bitterly contested local politics in all of modern democracy, non-Americans will often make up highly elaborate imaginary scenarios wherein most Americans ignore local politics for the specific and expressed purpose of watching television, which they apparently plan every second of their life around.

Maybe the issue is that non-Americans feel resentful and inferior because their culture, economy, politics, media and society are controlled by another nation, so they cope with their subservience and insignificance by criticizing their betters.

>>8754194
>For instance, even though Americans have some of the most theatrical and bitterly contested local politics in all of modern democracy
There's a reason you have a two-party system, and it's the opposite of local politics being strong. I can't talk for everywhere (but neither can you), but a lot of local council meetings for example subsume a really very wide variety of issues that would be handled by separate meetings elsewhere. That has its good and bad points, but it's also a sign that local government is not all that overwhelmed by people wanting to be heard.

>non-Americans will often make up highly elaborate imaginary scenarios wherein most Americans ignore local politics for the specific and expressed purpose of watching television, which they apparently plan every second of their life around.
I've obviously touched a nerve here, it's suddenly gone from a fuzzy projection to every non-American saying what I've said in unison. You guys really really like your TV, that's not necessarily a bad thing, it's not even necessarily anti-politics (for example, I think the UK's Question Time is a very important part of democracy, and while there isn't anything similar in the US, television is still an important medium for news and such and hearing from politicians). So you know I'm right. It's not even the US that only has people that value the TV over other shit, but that that's just accepted as like normal. Elsewhere it'd be taken as a joke or something.

I also find it interesting that you've taken offense at the TV thing and not the anti-literature thing on the literature board.

>>8754192
Ok, I see.

What would "I'd like to have a beer with" be though?

>>8753642
>I read Proust in high school, too. But I had the decency to do it in the bathroom so everyone would just think I was jerking off."

What the hell.

Trump is literally a billionaire real estate tycoon.

But, trump also knows how to hang, you could picture trump in an alternate reality on some construction site talking with the other workers about how he grabbed some chicks pussy


The democratic party has become the party of the cosmopolitan elite, the smug moralizing upper class, the people who live in gentrified areas and gated communities.


This happened after the fall of the Berlin wall, capitalism decided to wear the lefts corpse as a skin suit and prance around the world demanding more "diversity" which is just a code word for slave labor.


So, after decades the supposed left lost touch with the working classes of their nation, replaced by diversity worship, neoliberlism douchy ivey leaguers, and celebrities.

So you have this world were some rich cunt is speaking down to a white working class person, some guy who lives pay check to pay check, had his job outsourced, is having his culture and country destroyed by mass immigration, is mocked on tv and every form of entertainment, so you have this guy, and you have some rich ivey leaguer telling him he is privileged, that he has white privilege!

and thats how we got trump


I leave you with this british classic all you libtards should listen to on repeat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4BNVD5v2EU

>>8753689
Neither is J. Alfred Prufrock

>>8753642
Americans can spot and smell pseuds from miles away

>>8754313
>There's a reason you have a two-party system,
Yeah there is, and you don't know what it is. You're masking and filling in your ignorance with arrogance and judgmental superiority complex nonsense.

>>8754385
This. There's a reason the working class no longer votes for worker's parties.

>>8754417
Wrong.

>>8754064
>>8754065
He literally made billions of dollars.

>>8754470
Good for him, what about all the people he didn't pay who did the actual work part of it?

>>8754475
He has employed thousands of people. I'm not even a Trump defender, but you sound like a moron with these arguments. LE BANKRUPT!

>>8754475
lol pathetic

>>8753642
i wonder if hillary likes middlemarch

>>8754509
What color is the cover of Middlemarch? If it's green I'll read it.

>>8754552
it's got some green in it.

>>8754578
I saw it and it's white, a satanic color. Only green books for me.

>>8753694
Wrong.

>>8753998

Let's face it, when people expressed doubts about Donald Trump's intelligence he responded by saying "I'm, like, a really smart person" during one of his rallies.

This behaviour suggests that rather than being strong willed, that he suffers from crippling insecurity. The fact that he has already abandoned many of the policies he campaigned on suggests he is either impetuous, or lacking in resolve.

It's one thing to have voted for Trump because you perceived him to be less corrupt than Clinton, but you would have to be a genuine imbecile to actually be taken in by him or his ideas.

>>8754667
>he is either impetuous, or lacking in resolve.
Heads you win, tails he loses. Have you considered applying for a position at CNN?

>>8754667
>This behaviour suggests that rather than being strong willed, that he suffers from crippling insecurity. The fact that he has already abandoned many of the policies he campaigned on suggests he is either impetuous, or lacking in resolve.

>>8754644
Yes, you're wrong.

>>8754050
Honest fortunes are built over generations. Most guys that become billionaires overnight are crooks, and there are plenty of examples: George Soros (insider trading and collusion), Mark Cuban (pump and dump), Mark Zuckerberg (theft). Plenty of guys inherited big fortunes and saw them shrivel away under the next generation of leadership, too, like the Bronfman family's Seagrams fortune. Boom and bust is the nature of business. The power to build a family fortune that lasts for generations is the pinnacle of human achievement, which is why that is the nexus of political power since time immemorial, pleb.

>>8754667
>Let's face it, when people expressed doubts about Donald Trump's intelligence he responded by saying "I'm, like, a really smart person" during one of his rallies.

Why do you think "He's dumb" is more intelligent than "I'm smart"? They're just locking antlers. Guess who won?

>>8754704
All of those people you named still put in more effort and ingenuity into their shit than a guy who inherits a NYC real estate business in the 70s.

>Be a celebrated poet and playwright
>Ramble about the glories of the Roman empire and whatever's giving you an intellectual hard on at the instant to the plebs while waving your hands around
>Then punch your way out when those plebs crowd around you in adoration
>Fly a plane into a war zone so you can drop pretentious poetry and take pictures
>End up starting your own country and getting caviar from fucking Lenin

Why are Italians so based?

>>8753673
look who's talking mate

OP here. This thread was a mistake.

Please, focus on literature /w/r/t candidates for POTUS and not on Donald Trump's business acumen.

What a disaster.

>>8754667
>The fact that he has already abandoned many of the policies he campaigned on
"fact"

>>8754509
Apparently her favourite book is The Brothers Karamazov. She has probably read most of the meme chart already.

>>8754689
Not the person you're responding to, but these are not mutually exclusive terms.

>>8753683
Ooooooooh!! Very clever post ;)

>>8754475
>saved money by not paying workers
>become billionaire

Asshole? Sure, but stupid? Should we assume he was so air-headed he couldn't keep up with his checkbook?

George Bush was actually a constant reader. He would read Shakespeare on his vacations.

Liberals love pushing the meme that their opponents are philistines, but they are just as tuned in. They just have a greater sense of perspective.

>>8754475
He has said numerous times the people he didn't pay did a shit job. Welcome to being an adult you piece of shit SJW.

I own a small business and I withhold payments to people who didn't do what was agreed on.

>>8754064
>90% of businesses fail in the US within 5 years
>Out of Trumps many businesses he "failed" in 3
LOL non business people are hilarious.

>idiots think bankruptcy literally means you don't have money
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

>>8755082
thats fine. the problem becomes when someone does an amazing job and you claim it was shit just because you dont want to pay.

>>8755087
>prove it was an "amazing job"
Oh wait you can't.
I have a harder time believing a guy who has paid probably THOUSANDS of businesses in his years as a businessman stiffed a handful because he's greedy and a racist....or whatever you want to claim. Most likely they did shit work and he withheld payment. Or he would have the reputation of CONSTANTLY not paying people. Put your ego to the side and you will also come to this conclusion.

Your logic is like believing the one,1 star review on yelp, over the 600 4-5 stars.

>>8754011

>She has poor judgement though

False. She is a smart yet corrupt person. Every decision she has made was for her own benefit or the benefit of her friends. Don't expect politicians to ever change something for the good of the people.

>>8755085

>90% of businesses fail in the US within 5 years

It's the same in Canada, very sad actually. Sole proprietorships make up 87% of our economy, 87% fail within a year. Not that parliament cares.

>>8753642
>LOL non business people are hilarious.
t. wage cuck

>>8755108
She is very likely of average intelligence. Which after her many failures and the way she speaks, I would put her at BARELY above average. She isn't smart. She's a normie riding on the coat tails of her Husband and advisers.
>false
>saying false on a subjective feeling about someone
>being this much of a self centered faggot

>>8754787
>desperately tried to convince Mussolini not to enter into the Axis with Hitler, even tried to sabotage relations himself when he couldn't turn Mussolini around
>Mussolini allegedly admitted he made a mistake not following his advice in 1944 according to Wikipedia lol
;_____;

>>8754465
Yes, you're wrong.

>>8753668
American detected

>>8755085
You don't understand moral hazard. Hell, I don't think Trump understands it all that well or he'd have moved into hedge funds and shit instead of casinos. Saying he has expanded into something and listing businesses that are either no longer in existence or not running yet is dumb af tho.

>>8754385
That's how the rust states went red, which is what gave Trump his victory, but it in no way sums up the majority of Trump voters, or why Trump is popular

The population of red voters this election was only a little bit higher than the previous election. The same population of conservatives that have been living among us for decades and voting republican for decades is the population that contributed most of those votes. It isn't the emergence of some new silent voter bloc who is suddenly fed up with SJW's and switched parties. It is textbook republicans voting for textbook republican policies, and the meme loving alt-right fringe group is just The Tea Party with a different name and an internet microcosm

Nothing created Trump, he is just an opportunist who won the support of republicans who would have voted republican anyway, it's only slightly more significant of a pendulum swing than is normal in the American political establishment.
8 years democrat, 8 years republican, rinse and repeat ad nauseam as each side paints the other an increasingly vulgar monolith

>>8755390
Wrong

>>8754155
Only half of them were read right-side-up, mind you.

>>8754124
My god, a sensible opinion. Truly I think people are very aware of the utter disdain most representative politicians have for them, the awful way they are talked down to in desperate attempts to appeal to them. I'm sure even racists were irritated labour made mugs with 'BRING DOWN IMMIGRATION' written on them because they could tell they were being patronised.

>>8754322
He means they literally want to have a beer with their selected dear leader.

what does yeb! read?

>>8754385

The left deserves all the literal tears it gets in the next four years. When you love "diversity" so much that you start to hate white people, guess what you're a racist scumbag just like the KKK. Genteel starbucks racism is still racism, I don't care whatever hand-wavey definitions the left cooks up to justify its hatred of everything white and everything male.

I am in many respects a liberal and reasonable person, but I will never apologize for being white, and I will never put the interests of strangers above my own.

>>8753650
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvJzeIzgj2I

Pence is patrish

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_autobiographies_by_Presidents_of_the_United_States

Which President wrote the best book?

>>8755504

>implying any of them come close to the literary power level of The British Bulldog

Is this statement grammatically right, my friends?

"It takes brain and efforts to create a billion dollar empire from scratch."

>>8753659
>>8755135
clinton has a degree in law from Yale
she's a lot smarter than you

>>8754021
didn't dubya once list the very hungry caterpillar as his favourite book?
good choice tbqhwy

>>8754194
americans are always so painfully humourless

>>8755467
It's funny they don't understand why shitting on white people and working class people made white people and working class people vote against them

The bourgeois urban upper-middle class liberals just don't fucking get it, it will be funny when they run another Mondale/McGovern in 1972 and get BTFO

>>8755577
She's also more investment savvy than Trump, she turned 1000 dollars into 100000 over 10 months on the cattle futures market, and then went into shit like sugar futures.

>>8755599
The typical brexit voter was white and upper middle class, not working class. Mostly the retired or domestic business owner.

>>8755608
From what I've read though Brexit voters cut across typical party lines- a surprising number of labour working class voters broke ranks with the party to vote in favor of leave, while a certain number of tories voted for remain. So it was less of the typical partisanism.

There was something of a similar phenomenon in America- while Trump did get the bulk of the typical Republicans he ended up courting a certain percentage of Democrats which swung things in his favor.

Looking at upcoming elections in France where things are shaping up to be UMP (conservatives) versus FN (nationalists) it will be interesting to see where the lines are drawn when the left isn't a factor- historically the Bretons are socialists, but they really hate the muslims who have been steadily migrating into Brittany over the past few years.

There will be entire books written about 2016 and how it was a year of change like 1932.

>>8755619
At the time of the election I would have called that a fair assessment, but since then I've had the rising feeling that most of the "working class" people, but not all, were drawn from the ranks of small business owners and their families or retirees. The typical draw to brexit for the old school labour supporter was renationalization and protecting the NHS from further privatization and so forth, like there is traditionally a very big draw for state owned projects rather than further liberalization, and some were drawn to Brexit for those reasons.

You have to remember as well that Scotland which is heavily pro Labour is now SNP, and in part that's because they don't see common ground with the pro Tory England. And of course they voted remain. Same for London to some degree.

>>8755619
Oh, and don't forget that Brittany is going to be influenced by what happens with Ireland and Scotland. I honestly cannot see your typical Breton voting for evil National France though, as much as they may hate one or another group do not underestimate the bottomless hatred for """French values""" there. But you are right, we shall see.

>>8755390
Disagree. The reason why so many working class people voted for Nixon and Reagan is the same reason why so many of them voted for Trump. The SJW phenomenon isn't new, it's been around since the 1960's and was even worse back then. I don't believe the majority of Republican voters care much for ideological purity. Trump's success in the primaries exemplifies that. The Republican base recognizes the Left's disdain for Middle America and votes accordingly.

You should read Christopher Lasch.

>>8755085
You mean he failed to run a successful business he inherited.

>>8755477
>garfield is my most prized constituent
>his most valued possession is a hoosiers poster
>7 habits of highly effective people
>Tom Clancy novel

OP was right

>>8754064
famously his dad sent a lawyer to one of his failing casinos to buy millions worth of chips and then not play. Dumbass had to pay it back since thats an illegal loan, why not just put everything on red 5 times?

>>8753642
>the american voter most frequently votes for the person they believe to be most representative of them

What a fucking shocker that Americans wouldn't elect well-read person. Remember that Bill Clinton was the most formerly educated president, holding a Master's Degree.

You can't appear stupid, because that's unacceptable, but if you're too smart then you're just being an arrogant prick for having bothered to remember the compulsory education of K-12.

>>8755477
Haha look at this dunce trying to complete a full sentence.

>>8753642
It is well documented that GW Bush was the most prolific reader in his administration and it wasn't for lack of competition.

>>8755765
Cos he was sitting on his ass all day while Dick Cheney called all the shots, amirite

>>8755771
Dick would certainly like you to believe so.

>>8755727
What are you mad at, though?

>>8755675
what the left doesnt understand and what the right does, is that its called the silent MAJORITY for a reason.
Middle america and the working class vast out number the screaming rich cunts

The obama years were horrifying culturally, the rise of the sjw, trump winning was a psychological gut punch to those faggots, they finally lost, and no, not everyone gets a trophy

>>8754011
>reading makes you intelligent
>>8755577
>le generic ivy degree to bourgeoisie scum
>intelligent
Tip: being educated is not equivalent to being intelligent.

>>8755840
Clinton won the popular vote tho.

>>8755920
>being educated is not equivalent to being intelligent.

Surely, it is no bar.

>>8755958
Look buddy, those salt of the earth, working for their NEET bucks shitposters understand - their successful contemporaries that went and got degrees and good jobs aren't as smart. How can they be? The NEET has all day to doodle frogs and read tweets from other NEETs that like frogs.

>>8755135
Anyone who knows anything about the clintons knows its the other way around. Bill literally lost his job like what twice? Hillary had to come to his rescue both times

>>8755937
>this meme
That's like talking about the outcome of a basketball game and, instead of focusing on the actual score, saying things like "but this team passed the ball more" or "this team had a combined higher vertical". It's a nice stat to keep in mind but it doesn't mean much. We all know that in this election game it's the electoral votes that matter and the way in which candidates campaign is determined by that. People in solid blue or red states who support the opposition don't often waste their time.

But Bush was an avid reader. He held book-reading contests with his friends.

Donald, however, said that he reads a chapter or two and then puts the book down. As he is a notorious liar, that probably means he doesn't even read one page. One or two chapters was an exaggeration.

But there is no comparison to Donald either. He is the class bully going up unprepared against the top-grade student in three debates and losing big but then winning the contest anyway. Someone called him our first postmodern politician? I'd say he is bad influence to children all across the world. He is anti-intellectualism personified.

Or maybe Donald is just proof that a sharp toungue and self-confidence is what takes you somewhere in this world, not sitting at home reading books.

Does anyone actually believe Clinton was a good choice for President? They're both fundamentally liberal hucksters cut from the elite, but at least you can't smear Trump on his governance legacy of Neoliberal, GLobalist, warhawkery

I don't like Obama but he wrote a very thoughful letter to someone discussing TS Eliot, I can't imagine Clinton or Trump ever doing that

>>8756015
>I'd say he is bad influence to children all across the world.
To me it seemed more like a real life story of how you can as a lone wolf still beat the overpowerful system by being virtuous.

>>8755599
trips/dubs confimr sanders vs trump 2020

>>8756066
I'll bite.
How is Trump virtous?

>>8756071
virtuous*

>>8755504
Ulysses S. Grant

He wrote the best orders in the army too. Even his rise from "literal who?" loser (he was the equivalent of a Target store manager before the war) to supreme commander of the Union Army to POTUS is pretty literary. Some people are made for peace, Grant was made for war.

(Probably written by Mark Twain and dictated by Grant who was very ill)

>>8755998
Are you like an actual person typing this? If you make an appeal to the silent MAJORITY then it follows that you are appealing to the popular vote. Trump did not have the majority of votes.

>>8755998
If 100,000 people in key states (combined) voted for Clinton she would have won. The election was very close.

>>8756086
Also, the silent majority was .... silent. The majority of the country did not vote for either candidate.

>>8753642
note: I am not an American
You're comparing a Harvard Man to a Yale and Harvard man (Gore had a Bachelor's from Harvard, GWB a Bachelor's from Yale and a Master's from Harvard) and then a Yale man to a Yale man (Kerry also went to Yale).
The funny thing is, not only did GWB have a Master's v only Bachelor's, he went to a more academically rigorous prep school than the other two, he was in a 'scholarship focused' frat, and he *got better grades* than the other two.
GWB openly spoke, and often, of reading books all the time. In a competition with a staffer GWB read 95 books in 2006 while president - he also held sessions to discuss the books with his staff.
The idea that 'Conservatives are intellectually incurious/smart people can't win an election in the US' seems to be a fiction created as part of a narrative akin to arcanine's
>TFW too smart for a GF

>>8756109
I think it was said in this thread (maybe I read it) that Bush affected a rustic diction to appeal to more Americans. The argument is that he played dumb to get votes and it worked.

>>8756109
>he was in a 'scholarship focused' frat
Does that not mean test banks and shit though?

I suspect he had something like dyslexia tbhwy, like he just sucks at articulating in a grammatical way a lot of the time.

>>8753733
>Berlusconi was PM in four governments
>Europe cheered as neo-nazis overthrew the democratically-elected government of Ukraine
>Complain about Trump
I'm too busy trying to fix Europe to spend time staring over the ocean.

>>8756135
>Europe cheered as neo-nazis overthrew the democratically-elected government of Ukraine
It wasn't Nazis it was Clintonites (aka Reaganites). Rogue elements of the state department wanted revenge against Obama for extending an olive branch to Russia and Iran. The nazis, and european neoliberals, just benefited because east European Nazis (especially Ukrainian) hate Russians and neoliberals get to plunder Ukraine.

>>8756135
I'm trying to work out what your first point is.

Svoboda was installed by the US.

I'm not complaining about Trump, America being a bit shitter helps Europe out a fair amount.

>>8756123
Bush was also very open about being a born-again Christian, and around the second half of the 90s, fedora-tipping "hurr aren't Christians dumb and deluded" atheism was just starting to take off as a cultural force, especially amongst coastal liberals. I also think this made Bush seem more wholesome in contrast to the president who had just had his dick sucked by an intern in the White House.

>>8753642
yes
t. Adlai Stevenson.
people need a soldier, a general. not a profesor

>>8756158
The Christian thing was very big but by the end of his second term the fundamentalist Christians felt burned by Republicans so they weren't as supportive in 2008 and 2012. I was just listening to a journalist talk about the relationships Trump built with the Christian right during the Obama years and how they (the Christians) believe that he is going to deliver them back into power.

>>8756123
>Ivory tower intellectuals make for the best leaders
Yes, this appears to be true
>I did some research on American politics in college
The first time he ran GWB has a very 'American neutral' accent and he lost. He affected a modified Texan accent and won.

>>8756129
According to some biographers he detested public speaking and had to overcome severe stage fright to speak in public at all.
I am not a fan of his *policies* but to think a man who got average grades at Yale/Harvard in the '60's and '70's is somehow stupid is ridiculous. Especially if you are trying to compare him to men who went to those same institutions and got lower grades and less education!
Look at the Invasion of Iraq; immoral? Yes. Cold-blooded? Yes. But brilliant.
You heard me. Brilliant.
1) Americans that demanded 'something be done' are appeased, making re-election more likely
2) The tenor of the day forced the opposing party to *also* support the war, something that has crippled their ability to criticize military action to this very day
3) It was an excuse to begin 'war spending', artificially propping up the economy
4) It removed a hostile regime
5) It eliminated a source/potential source of WMDs
>Yes, thousands of tons of chemical weapons were found in Iraq after the invasion. Yes, they were - look it up
6) It ended any chance of terrorists thinking that there would not be consequences to their attacks that affected their own people and homes
and the really brilliant part
7) It moved the target for radicals from attacks on the US inside the US to attacks on US forces outside the US.
GWB basically exported Muslim extremist attacks largely to the Middle East. As policies changed and there was less activity in the Middle East Muslim extremist attacks began shifting back to inside the US

>>8756173
The Wars in the Middle East drained money from basic infrastructure though. Obama coming in and funding all that was a massive improvement.

>>8756087

They stopped with ads in the blue states that Trump won over, while pumping out many more in a state like Arizona.

They wanted to run up the score and go for a big win, had clearly no intention of talking to the working-class in their blue states, which they figured they would win anyway, and as a result they lost.

>>8756186
They could have thrown the ads in the trash and gone for Bernie too

>>8756173

And one million innocent people died. Iraq was better off before the invasion than after.

>>8756186
>They stopped with ads in the blue states that Trump won over
The decision to go all in with ads was stupid. Research and experience, like the Obama campaign, shows that door to door solicition gets the most bang for your buck. I read that she had about half the regional HQ's as the Obama campaign. The Clinton campaign was the perfect example of delusional technocrats living in a bubble and ending in disaster.

>>8756149
>>8756152
>Just agreeing with me

>>8756185
>>8756195
There's a great analysis of voting patterns called Bread and Peace. It looks like not only do Americans not like it if you start wars that kill American troops, they really hate it if it also takes money from infrastructure.

>>8756185
>Obama
>funding actual infrastructure
Pick one
When feminists whined that there were too many jobs for men that money largely went to universities

>>8756195
Like I said - cold-blooded and immoral.

>>8756207
You had a road/bridge/even electrical power system on the brink of collapse. There was also some money put into Alaska tho I guess that got a bit fucked.

>>8756060
>Does anyone actually believe Clinton was a good choice for President?
millennials who get their political information (and knowledge in general) from facebook memes and buzzfeed

>>8756173
>It ended any chance of terrorists thinking that there would not be consequences to their attacks that affected their own people and homes
>It moved the target for radicals from attacks on the US inside the US to attacks on US forces outside the US.

I agreed with you until these two points.
you went full retard.

>>8753642
>Is being an intellectual or reader anathema to American voters?
No, but broadcasting to everyone just how much of an intellectual you are is.
Just take Kerry for example
>he boasted that he could recite The Lovesong of J. Alfred Prufrock by memory.
Sounds like a pretentious cunt, meanwhile Dubya was prentending to be a fucking retard, guess who people identified with more?
Don't get me wrong, if you want to be a pretentious cunt you can be, but if you are trying to get elected, you probably should try to connect with the common man, not put yourselve above him, because that is bound to create resentment, pleople want to feel represented, not to be lead by competent people, that is secondary.

>>8756238
She got 54% of the Millenial vote. I wouldn't call that a ringing endorsement considering Obama got 60%. She also got less support from Millenial women than men.In Iowa the Millenial vote was actually split between Trump and Clinton.

A lot of support from Clinton was from older people.

>>8756167
I would attribute the decline of the Christian right, who had a significant say in the country's politics during the Carter-Reagan-Bush era, to general changes in the zeitgeist over the past 15-20 years, specifically in regards to gay rights and abortion, although the latter is certainly less significant. You're probably right that they blamed the Republicans, although I doubt that the Republicans could have really done anything about it. I knew kids in college (I was 2008-2012) who were Republican in most senses, except on gay rights, along with dude weed lmao, which they considered that to be a crucial political issue of our times, and likely voted accordingly. There has been a slow but steady march in the area of gay rights over that time, and it really culminated in Obama's second term; remember that Obama only changed his stance on gay marriage in the year before the 2012 election, before that he was resolute in his support for traditional marriage. Now, with the level of backlash the transgender issue is engendering, we may be seeing a steady shift towards a cultural conservatism over the next 5-10 years.

>>8756275
>I doubt that the Republicans could have really done anything about it
You're right but that is not the way the Christian Right sees it. It should also be noted that while they may have been dwindling in number they have been one of the most effective mobilizers of voters which allows them to wield outsized political power.

This has been a huge problem for progressives, they fail to effectively coordinate their political actions to achieve effective results. My mind jumps to the post Mubarak elections where a fundamentalist religious minority group swept the elections because they had been building their electoral infrastructure for years.

In America union participation (which used to tell working people when and who to vote for) has been on the decline, voter suppression laws are rising, and where unions are large their leaders have sold them out to people like the Clintons (see Buffenbarger during the primary). The left in America is large but a disorganized mess. I remember during one of those fights over transgender bathrooms a parent (a black woman if it matters) made the comment "Why is this an issue when our children are not getting the education they deserve?".

>>8756263
Last gasp of the Boomers, maybe

>>8756275
But "gay rights" had to be forced over votes by the courts and there is a lot of simmering resentment over it.

>>8756344
>Last Gasp
Boomers are eternal. Peter Thiel is already working to develop a fountain of youth that uses the blood of migrant (and undocumented) workers.

>>8756327
Can't say I disagree with almost anything you said, except for that I think the gay rights activist groups were very strong in organizational tactics. Now that their overwhelming goal has been achieved, that alliance is fracturing, there's a ton of gay dudes who have /pol/-like views on transgender people. BLM is a fucking wreck; what have they achieved, realistically, aside from getting more police officers to wear body cams and applying pressure to get a few indictments in particularly egregious cases of police shootings? Even liberal people are fatigued by seemingly every police shooting of a black guy becoming national news.

Also agreed on your point about labor and unions, the Democrats and people like Obama and the Clintons have essentially given labor nothing but token gestures in favor of focusing their time and efforts on stuff like the bathroom issue. Part of me wonders, does the Department of Labor do anything anymore?

>>8756400
>the gay rights activist groups were very strong in organizational tactics
That's a good point. This is an essay comparing responses to the AIDS epidemic to the current opiate epidemic. Working class Americans who are suffering have no real organization to turn to.
https://morecrows.wordpress.com/2016/05/10/unnecessariat/
>BLM is a fucking wreck; what have they achieved, realistically, aside from getting more police officers to wear body cams and applying pressure to get a few indictments in particularly egregious cases of police shootings?
The indictments of those officers was a tangible result that is progress, but you're right that there has been no lasting precedent established other than "Just get these guys out of here and you can keep beating Black people, just don't kill them".

The Democrat primary should have been the canary in the coal mine for liberals, but they thought they could squeeze another 4-8 years of lucre out of the country before things went bad. These arguments about breaking the glass ceiling can be reduced to "It's our turn to hold the whip" and enough people saw it to be turned off. Combine this with the idea that women are damsels in distress that these hipsters need to rescue (you can also draw connections to conservatives who want to kill the whore and rescue the madonna) and you get modern liberals.

>>8756358
You jest, but older animals can use blood circulation with younger animals to restore youth,

>>8756537
I'm not joking. Everything I said was factual. Thiel is working on the method and the majority of blood is supplied by migrants looking for extra cash.

>>8756613
Oh wow it is real. If he wants to just inject himself with young people blood it won't do shit though, you have to connect the circulatory systems together.

>>8754050
>turns 1 million burgerbucks into several billions
>inherited it

You realize a million dollars doesnt even qualify as "chump change" in non-residential real estate, right?
When will the "le cheetoman dindu no work" meme die?

>>8756627
Different anon but curious on the source for that or any research done about it

>>8756639
What his net worth actually is is very difficult to pin down. Forbes estimates at 3B USD, but that's a figure arrived at with Trump trying his hardest to get the absolute highest number he can. So it may well be lower than that depending on whether Trump has hidden liabilities.

Trump was also gifted a tremendous amount of money by his father, I think a safe estimate is around 40M in gifts and 40M in inheritance, and that equates to roughly .5B in today's money. So he'd have more than .5B just sticking it in a savings account. If we take his net worth in 1982 of 200M I think, he hasn't outperformed the stock market either.

Kudos to him for having some money left tho, not everyone manages that.

>>8756667
I haven't got the slides for that on this PC, but it's the set of experiments that started the whole GDF11 thing. They connected up old and youg mice via the circulatory system and found that the older mice got younger looking hearts and livers, while the younger mouse livers took a hit.

Whether this is actually down to GDF11 has been a matter of serious debate recently though. And just getting an acute dose won't do anything.

>>8753642
GWB was actually very intelligent and well read himself, it's not about how smart you are, it's about how dumb you make yourself look to become relatable to the average American.

>>8756453
What's wrong with wanting to "kill the whore"? Moral indecency is a cancer.

>>8753642
>literally to intelligent to be president

>>8756667
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v433/n7027/abs/nature03260.html

>>8756721
It's the ideology that women are objects and can either be whores or madonnas and not free agents. Whores seduce men and and render them powerless, killing the whore is rebellion against the sexual dominance that men feel women have over them while the madonna is benevolent and nurtures the man.

It is a rebellion against puberty.

>>8755268
>trusting a ducking journalist to do a novelist's job

>>8754124
Just wanted to say good post anon. I think you nailed it.

>>8756802
I found the book I was looking for when I wrote this.
Male Fantasies, Vol. 1: Women, Floods, Bodies, History

It examines the mentality of young men in the Freikorps, people who felt the Weimar republic sold them out and later became the first Nazis, specifically their views of women based on letters they wrote. I've only read summaries which indicate that it is a very good, and incredibly tedious, analysis of why young men from conservative backgrounds join these radical groups like Nazi parties and ISIS.

If anyone is interested in psychology and is more patient than me check it out.

>>8755965
>projecting this hard

>>8756896
Do you know what projecting means?

>>8756915
Yes, and you are projecting 'le frog meme xDDD' onto me.

>>8755675
I basically agree with you, back then it was hippies, now it's hipsters and numales, but republicans haven't changed much. That's what I was getting at

>>8756945
>republicans haven't changed much
My... sides... oh god...

Really the entire political landscape is unrecognizable from the 60s.

>>8756836
Pure ideology

Ever read Ernst von Salmon? Revolutionary conservative who Wrote perhaps the most acclaimed freikorp memoir ever and never succumbed to blind nazism or mra bs. The reality is weimar fell not because of violent nazis as you simplistically implybut because it was never equiped to protect and nurture it's people from the depression and exploitation inherent in the system

>>8756135
What comes to Berlusconi, Southern Europeans in general seem to have more populist political culture

>>8756992
>The reality is weimar fell not because of violent nazis as you simplistically implybut because it was never equiped to protect and nurture it's people from the depression and exploitation inherent in the system

That's not what I was arguing, although I probably should not have added that because it is wrong and confuses my point. I understand that the collapse of the Weimar was largely due to economic concerns but that wasn't the point of including it.

What I was getting at is that people who join these radical groups that attempt to violently resist social change have a similar mindset to the people in the Freikorps and that by examining their views we can extrapolate to young radicals in other movements.

>>8755477
but can he be prison mike?

>>8755603
>she turned 1000 dollars into 100000 over 10 months on the cattle futures market

Why cant everyone do that? Everyone give 1000 dollars to the person that did that for her? The burger demand is always rising right?

>>8755577

>lost the election to trump
>smart
>wrong.png

>>8757304
This whole thread is about how being smart costs you the presidency.

>>8753642
Reading is for nerds,
Do you want to be a nerd?

>>8755603

>>8757286

\
That's just how futures markets work. They're high risk high reward type deals.

>>8758465
But we assume 1000 was given to a guy, or a company of guys, who did x (y,z), if every person with 1000 dollars gave that guy, or that company of guys, who did x (y,z), to do x (y,z) what would have happened?

>>8758537

Because if it was easily predictable someone would already have done it, already made the profit, the classical assumption is that the market cannot be beaten.

>>8756015
lol. Hillary received some of the questions before hand and cheated. By default, Trump's the winner.

>>8755577
>clinton has a degree in law from Yale
Yeah, over 40 years ago. Her repeated strokes have probably reduced her IQ by at least 20 points.

>>8758604
Are you talking about the CNN moderator tell her there would be a question on drinking water at the debate in Flint Michigan? That was during the primary and Trump was not involved.

>>8758604
>>8758613
Go to bed Mom, I don't want to read any more Facebook posts before Thanksgiving.

>>8758569
That doesnt answer my question.

It was proven possible, to turn 1,000 to 100,000, via a particular process during a particular time performed by particular person/s.

If instead of 1,000 from one person plugged into the start of that equation which proved to greatly multiply via person/s functional activity:

1,000 x (A) (A = everyone in America who spared 1,000 to this hypothetical project).

person/s took 1,000, did function x, y, z and equalled 100,000

What if person/s took 1,000 (x A), did function x, y, z : = ????????

>>8758658

I didn't answer your question because you sound like westley willis on crack.

>people actually fell for the "GWB is fucking stupid" meme
kek. literal sheeple

>>8755115
This is a constant in the whole developed world, weeb. starting a successful business is fucking difficult

>>8753642
according to Karl Rove, W reads a lot more books than you do.

also, any jerkoff can memorize a t s eliot poem and pretend to be cultured

>>8758666
Rock on, Chicago.

>>8755577
>smarter
Bush had a degree from Harvard and a Masters from Yale does that mean he is much much smarter than Gore who only had one undergraduate degree from Harvard?

>>8754644
he said Christianity was a fucking sham of people posturing their cowardice as a virtue and that modern rationality had rendered god dead. How the fuck was he not an athetist? Just because he saw value in religion, and wasn't a fucking fedora tipper doesn't mean he actually believed in it.

>>8755390
I don't think you know what microcosm means.

Love,

/lit/

>>8754011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqq5q11uK0M&ab_channel=TeaPartier

She doesn't seem to have a background in economics though

>>8759633
They have limited time, he is trying to make it seem like she doesn't know her political position. Fine answer tbqh, shit interview

>>8758893
Not all degrees are equal. A masters in women's studies isn't even worth an associate's degree

>>8759646
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slQYhlg9tOA

>>8753642
Let's not forget that the fact that he could speak French was used as a genuine argument AGAINST Kerry.

>>8759983
There was also Jon Hunstman who was the ambassador to China and ran for the GOP nomination in 2008. He spoke Mandarin during a debate and the crowd was not amused. He lost for different reasons though.

>>8753994
I just want you to know that your comment was literally the stupidest comment that I will read all day.

Your pseudo-intellectual "philosopher king" ideology died when Plato got his way and fucked everything up

>>8755477
>"Mike Pence" on plaque
>"Mike Pence" on diploma

I'd think these are times when you should spell out your whole name. Also, a popcorn machine in an office is tacky af. Probably smells gross after awhile.

>>8760021
>I called him a pseud so I must be right!

But sure, keep on voting for bullshit con artists. Reject the most qualified candidates, contribute to the dumbing down of mainstream culture :^)

>>8753994
sounds pretty elitist desu
i want someone in office i could have a beer with
they cannot be corrupt or wrongly influenced if I can picture having a beer with em'
and it probably means they can run a country too

>>8759983
Look buddy, you can either speak French, or you can speak Freedom, but you can't speak both.

>>8753642
As a foreigner what impressed me most about the Bush Son reelection was how Americans disliked so intensively the windsurfing hobby of Kerry.
They want their presidents to be very relatable all American normies with whom they could have a barbecue in their backyard, and windsurfing is worse than invading a country falsely claiming it had weapons of mass destruction.

>>8755998
This totalitarian. Why does in burger land the one with almost two million more votes lose the elections? Why is your 'democracy' retarded? This isn't the will from the majority. The US is a totalitarian state, that's clear.

>>8756165
The army needs a general, the army needs a soldier.
Society needs a leader who is reasonable and tries to find a reasonable way to ensure that living is comfortable and decent for everyone.

>>8756173
Brilliant killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people, setting the grounds for later insurgent groups that reign terror attacks all over the world. Brilliant foreign policy ladies and gentlemen. Burgers lol. Stay in your cave.

>>8753642
pic very related

>>8753642
i recall Bill Clinton often citing Faulkner as his favorite writer, if that adds anything to the debate. i got a kick hearing Kaine giving him a shout out to close his concession speech.

i do tend to agree with you, though. think of the terms often used to describe candidates: go-getter, maverick, anti-establishment, the people's candidate, etc. rarely are qualification at the forefront of a debate. one of the perils of this two-party system is placing an unqualified (uneducated, inexperienced) candidate on the same pedestal as a qualified one (educated, experienced) and simply hope for the best. the media should take partial blame for not calling this out, too, every chance they can.

>>8754194
One thing I have to say though, isn't the entire point of setting up a government and participating, so you don't have to micromanage every action your nation takes?

I mean, the end goal of government participation is to ensure you're free to pursue whatever you want, be it sitting in front of the tube for hours, reading books, or whatever. When you're denied the freedom to do what you wish, that's when you step in and attempt to change things to allow you to do what you want again. Unhappy people are very much the agents of change, no one seeks to bring about violent revolution because they're allowed to do what they love.

>>8761621
The US is a republic, not a democracy. The electoral college ensures that rural and urban areas get a fair chance against each other.

>>8760021
>when Plato got his way and fucked everything up
I don't remeber this and I'm super interested. Are you talkingn about Alexander or something?

>>8753642
>tfw too intelligent to vote for Shillary
>>8759983
They tried it with Yeb! too earlier this year. I've never understood why this argument held any merit in anyone's eyes. I get that people are stupid, but how can being able to speak another language be a bad thing?

>>8762079
Punished Jeb! did nothing wrong.

>>8762097
What could have been, Anon...

>>8761797
Look up Plato and Syracuse

>>8753705
>like you really can't go on about Putin being corrupt

The hillarity (purposeful typo) in that is that Putin would still easily win without voting fraud simply because nobody of any worth is running against him, there's Putin, Medvedev followed by a vacuum.

The reason we saw that obvious voting fraud is not to get votes it's to show the people of Russia he has the power to do so.

>>8754011
>but she is very intelligent
this meme again... seems like you have bad judgment too, anon...

>>8759643
>excuses, excuses, excuses
Do you know what those are...? Excuses!

>>8753642
>Is being an intellectual anathema to American voters?
Well, given how *anti*-intellect most intellectuals are, maybe.

>>8755467
>>8755599
>tfw just came across this article that tries to rationalize this insane leftis attitude
http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-helpful-answers-to-societys-most-uncomfortable-questions/

leftist delusion has really no limits

>>8761761
Thus not every vote is equal. Consequently, the US is a totalitarian state. Republic? Nah, only in your imagination.

>>8754385
Pretty much.
After the end of the Cold War the left has lost decisively. There was no way to push the communism agenda any longer, capitalism has proven to be invincible and undeniably superior in every way. So the left has given. up.
All the diverstiy worshipping, feminism pushing, virtue signaling SJW identity politics bullshit is basicly the left's carcass posing as if it were still alive, while in reality this is a zombieleft, nothing more. They just accepted capitalism as an unchangeble fact, given up on class struggle are started to project their hate through the perceived upper class of white males through minorities, demanding the right for women, coloured people and homosexuals to be also incorporated in the capitalist oppressor class.

>>8762674
>There was no way to push the communism agenda any longer, capitalism has proven to be invincible and undeniably superior in every way.
Do you actually think the fact that an idealized form of our economic system is superior to an idealized form of the Soviet Union's economic model is the reason the western nations won the Cold War?