/lit/ - Literature

Ted Kaczynski was right.

>>8286479
value is a bourgeois construct. Your hours in which you played games or read books will never be exchanged for anything and has no "worth".

>>8286479
100 hours of active reading is worth a whole lot more than perfecting your manual dexterity in some shitty game.

I love dark souls 1 and it's as close a video game comes to having literary merit, but it's totally outclassed even by second or third rate literature let alone Tolstoy.

/lit/'s value game is the faggiest shit ever. grow up

>>8286505
mate dark souls is an infinitely better experience than reading some author like martin. the game is much more aesthetically consistent in all of its elements

Maybe not as good as Tolstoy, but in some ways a lot better than low level literature.

Bloodborne is the best of all of them from a storytelling perspective. It did Lovecraft better than Lovecraft.

DS1 is what really drove the idea that video games could be art.

You shouldn't worry about value all the time, try to enjoy life.

Plus every large form of media has some sort of merit.

>>8286570
>DS1 is what really drove the idea that video games could be art.
for newfags, yes

>>8286570
>DS1 is what really drove the idea that video games could be art.

Braid did that mate.

>>8286525

Martin isn't even tenth rate literature

>>8286573
No one game other than DaS has ever made an experience where next to nothing (except some of those shitty platforming puzzles) feels superfluous asides from maybe the first Super Mario Bros.

>>8286577
>he unironically likes indieshit

>>8286577
Games were already art by the time MGS2 happened, and perhaps even before then.

Its just that people weren't stupid enough to make it such a big argument IF videogames were art or not.

>>8286585
Who the fuck is Martin

>>8286570
>DS1 is what really drove the idea that video games could be art.
I meant to write FOR ME.
Obviously it's subjective.

>>8286586
>No one game other than DaS has ever made an experience where next to nothing (except some of those shitty platforming puzzles) feels superfluous asides from maybe the first Super Mario Bros.
I take it you dont play many games, you dissing indie games says alot.

>>8286586
>he unironically likes indieshit

I don't like Braid but it was still the game that brought the conversation to prominence

>>8286587
I know but it was still the catalyst, if a negative one.

Why is that relevant? omg you need to be pragmatic because i said so holy shit its 2016 every moment of your life must be filled with intellectualism
>>8286505
Play more games, Vagrant Story was better in every way.

>>8286484
>Ted Kaczynski was right.
t. person who uses modern technology to enable his surrogate activity (shitposting on 4chan)

>>8286587
HAHAHAHA

MGS if objectively a mess of a game where Kojima tries to sound "deep" and only ends in having a shitload of plotholes

Also, games don't suddenly become art but rather their artistic potential is realized

>>8286594
>>8286597
I was shitposting mate. I usually play indie stuff

>>8286604
MGS2 has no real holes, and in all honesty its the best in the series.

>Kojima tries to sound deep
lol no, did you even play the game?

>Also, games don't suddenly become art but rather their artistic potential is realized
again, only by newfags. Anyone actually interested in games knew this a long time ago. Besides, if all you're examining is narrative in your idea of 'games being art' then fucking obviously they can be. Its not even a discussion among people who can actually think.

>>8286624
I never claimed that narrative makes video games as art. Its pretty obvious that games are chiefly defined by gameplay and thus should be made with that as a priority and not as an afterthought.

>>8286637
Cool. One game I think did that very well is Frozen Synapse, the game's plot readily acknowledges your role as an "operator" of a virtual team, and through all the different conflicts between the factions it didnt matter who won or lost. You, as Tactics, only exist to fight.

Its so fitting because the gameplay is fun as fuck too. Excited for the sequel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01ZnHgvSpK8

>>8286650
I've heard good things about it but have never tried it (not too big on turn-based) but I'll definitely add that to my backlog.

>>8286479
>meme souls
bitch ass nigga, this is motherfucking art

>>8286659
Cool art. Is there a way to play that? Been trying to play those damn old Lovecraft based games on my computer but I don't know how to make it work.

I'm not that into games besides playing the first Doom and GTA on old ass computers. Pic related though was my shit when I was into Lovecraft stuff in my teens. Very cinematic and underrated too.

>>8286802
If you can't play an old game on your computer normally, get an emulator. DOSbox, for example.

>>8286479
You may think this an obvious answer.
People like >>8286491 have the wrong idea.

It only benifits you to read Tolstoy if you enjoy Tolstoy.

There are plenty of pretentious lit fags who read Tolstoy so they could name drop to their stepdads, moms, and other Anons. They didn't even understand it, mostly.

>>8286604
You must have not played MGS2 because it has a surprising amount of depth, and is often considered a revolutionary example of postmodernism in gaming.

Don't get me wrong, Kojima isn't a master storyteller (MGS4 and 5 are terribly written pieces of shite) but MGS2 has plenty of artistic merit and discusses interesting themes while also exploring the nature of its medium.

>>8287059

Literally no one thinks this.

>>8286488
This. Glad to see fellow marxists (assuming).

playing Antichamber is probably better than reading for 5 hours
it's a structural masterwork

>>8287101
If you havent played MGS2, yes.

>>8286603
the feudal lord provides for his serfs.

Everyone should play Okami and Shadow of the Colossus.

>>8288222
>shadow of the colossus
mah nigga

team ico is my fav dev bar none

Manchildren fuck off.

>>8288633
yeah manchildren go back to reading your infinity jest. we'll be here exploring the aesthetic possibilities of one of the most interesting artforms to ever have graced this earth

>>8288672

This board is for literature now your baby toys. Fuck off.

>>8288694

Not. Whoops.

are there any games where the characters speak in blank verse?

Is 100 hours of solving crosswords worth as much as 100 hours of watching TV?

>>8288856
based on scientific studies it is

>>8286604
> plotholes
> he plays for plot
I bet you read for plot too don't you you massive shithead

>>8288902
gameplay is still shit too. there are much better stealth games out there

>>8288902
I never got this mentality, a plot is part of the book you're reading, why ignore it?

I never heard one good explanation for why having consideration for the plot is bad, its very vehicle through which themes are expressed.

>>8288922
/lit/ is fileld with formalists who believe that what is unique to the medium is what identifies it as an artistic form aka "the medium is the message". so for books, its how the writing is done rather than the content of the writing since that same content could theoretically be expressed in some other form with the same theme still being pushed across to the reader

>>8288943
That's just worshiping the golden calf. And there are many things done in books that cant be done in other mediums and vice-versa.

>>8286591
[Amis]
I assume

Depends too much on context to have a clear answer.

I have no shame or guilt to have spent hundreds of hours on the souls serie because it's literally the only video games I played in years and I have read enough books (700+) that I don't really "need" the maybe 15 I could have read meanwhile.

If you're a pleb without any culture and play video games in the dark all night instead of reading one of the books you promised yourself to read the last months yes you should give your playstation to someone.


Also to answer exactly the main question : it's extremely unlikely than in someone's life the 2 activities would have the same "worth".

>>8286488
Maybe not in the grand, GRAND, scheme of things, but in the short term I'm pretty sure 100 hours spent improving yourself or humanity in some way would be more constructive that 100 hours of playing video games.