/lit/ - Literature

wat

>papyrus

>>730164
I guess I am Sandor

Papyrus = No.

MORE IMPACT FUCKER

Who is the Chaotic neutral guy i would really like a source.

>>730278
That would be Tyrion Lannister

If someone could list all of the names of the characters (and the works themselves), then I would give that person a delicious e-cookie. :)

Replace Sandor with Gregor
Ned instead of Sansa
Switch Theon and Tyrion

>>730297

They're all from a Song of Ice and Fire

>>730297
LG Sansa Stark
NG Jon Snow
CG Arya Stark
LN Danerys Targaryen
NN (guessing) Theeon Greyjoy
CN Tyrion Lannister
LE Cersei Lannister
NE Joffrey Baratheon (Lannister)
CE Sandor Clegane

How is Tyrion chaotic? He's lawful. He was the Hand of the King ffs. People who make these alignment charts are retarded.

>>730314
>>730337

. . . been planning on reading that series, never gotten around to doing it though.

>>730343
Making him Hand of an unlawful King doesn't make him lawful.

>>730343
He didn't even choose to be the Hand. And those of you who have read the end of Storm of Swords know that he's definitely not fucking lawful. Also, Gregor Clegane is the personification of pure evil. He demands to be CE. Here is his quote: "I killed her screaming whelp. Then I raped her. Then I smashed her fucking head in like this."

>>730164
I don't know who any of these people are, and I don't care.

>>730371
Well, since this board serves only YOU, then we must make a note to never again disinterest our liege.

>>730377
Good. Lesson learned, you are now free to fuck off.

>>730381
NOW CALL HIM A FAG, MILORD!

>>730377
>disinterest

Invest in a dictionary, and brush up on your parts of speech.

>>730418
verb (used with an object)
to divest of interest or concern.

Why hello, disorientated irregardless

>>730418
Thou mad? Also I'd probably have Robert as Chaotic Good and Gregor as Chaotic Evil.

>>730418
You may want to follow your own advice, Uncle Buck

>>730418
Not the first time some 17 year old walks in the room and proceeds to jam his foot directly into his throbbing maw.

>>730418

>>730439
Robert set a bounty on the heads of children across the sea.

>>730164
eh...maybe trade Littlefinger with Tyrion's place

>>730418
Oh Wow...

>>730457
He didn't want another Aerys to sit the throne. The Targaryens are crazy people and Robert was trying to secure the realm and protect it from another civil war in the event of Viserys's or Dany's return.

>>730446
>>730472
>>730444
>>730440
>>730433

Fuck all of you. I'm smart. Anyway at least I don't read fantasy bullshit and waste my time on Dungeons and Dragons charts like you pathetic ignoramuses.

>>730482

>>730482
>ignoramuses
you mean ignoramii

>>730482
Ah summer 4chan, you never cease to amuse me whilst simultaneously pushing the bile to the tip of my throat. I would venture to assume that you don't "waste your time" on any form of literature.

>>730491
LOL You don't know even what literature is. I've read Ulysses and Infinite Jest, and I even read half of the Bible last summer for a book report. Go read fucking Dancing with Dragons or whatever, ignoramus.

What makes Cersei lawful? She isn't the Queen or the Hand.

>>730498
Here, let me help you out. I think you forgot something.

>>730498
lol credentials!

arya is chaotic fucking evil.

>>730418

>>730510
Arya is one of my favorites. I think Meera should be Lawful Good

who is the neutral neutral guy? Don't remember who said that and he kinda looks generic.

>>730538
As previously stated, it is Theon Greyjoy.

>>730555
Could this possibly be Victarion? I just don't see Theon as Neutral anything.

>>730164
Mirri Maz Duur as Lawful Evil

Won't do a whole list, but one's I'd find hard to argue with are;

Lawful Good: Ned Stark (always true to his word)
Lawful Neutral: Jon Snow (doesnt take sides with good or evil, nor with the factions, just in upholding the Wall)
Chaotic Evil: Gregor Clegane (one evil motherfucker)
Chaotic Neutral: Sandor Clegane (he shows some degree of compassion with Sansa, but once turfed out after the Blackwater he's pretty much just out to survive. Not actively evil, just embittered at the state of the world and disillusioned with knights and kings as he sees it)

>>730569
Eh, doubt it. Doesn't he use a great axe as his weapon or am I misremembering?

>>730580

A lot of characters are chaotic evil though. Circe, Gregor, Joffrey, etc. etc. One thing I know for certain, Circe in OP's list does not belong on lawful. She's broken nearly every law in the Seven Kingdoms.

>>730569
why? Theon is pictured as pretty neutral throughout the story so far. He can't be considered good because he was willing to sacrifice Bran and Rickon. He can't be considered evil though because he didn't want anything of that to happen. If you're evil, you enjoy those acts, he did what he thought he had to do.

LG: Ned (Man of law and honor)
NG: Sansa (Good, but sold daddy out)
CG: Robert (He wants Viserys and Dany dead but he has justifiable reasons)
LN: Can't argue with Dany
True Neutral: Tyrion (He doesn't take sides)
CN: Theon (Battle of Winterfell)
LE: Joffrey
NE: Sandor
CE: Gregor

Lawful Evil: Zombie Catelyn

>>730594
"Tolkien made the wrong choice when he brought Gandalf back. Screw Gandalf. He had a great death and the characters should have had to go on without him." -George R.R. Martin

Yeah okay buddy.

>>730593
>NG: Sansa (Good, but sold daddy out)

She thought she was upholding the law and that her father would be allowed to live. She didn't do anything unlawful. She was tricked by that cunt of a Lannister.

>>730593

I think you're messing up your alignments there. OP's had it pretty good, but I'd put Tyrion in True Neutral and leave Chaotic Neutral for Stannis.

>>730606
Her duty was first to her family. She disregarded that because she wanted to be a storybook princess. She's good, but her priorities are messed up

>>730610
If anything, Stannis is LG. He is the true heir to the throne and was the only one who defended the north while everyone else was busy usurping his kingdom.

>>730599
It's not the same. Catelyn was a useless, stupid and annoying whore, there was no emotional involvement in her death because most readers hated her anyway. Now if he brought back Robb or Eddard as an undead, ridiculously overpowered avenger, it would be compareable.

>>730588
You might be right. He does sieze Winterfell in the hopes of having the Iron Islands rule the North. He wasn't necessarily willing to kill Bran and Rickon, only capture them for show to the citizens of Winterfell. But he did threaten to hang Beth Cassel. I just see someone as Neutral Neutral more along the lines of Maester Aemon or Renly.

>>730620
I agree. The Starks were getting so annoying that I was actually cheering during the Red Wedding. However I think the quote was meant to imply that characters shouldn't be brought back because it cheapens the deaths of everyone else and leaves the reader wondering "Well why can't x be brought back too?" Also, Robb had little character besides boy having to fill his father's shoes.

>>730618
Really, I can't find fault with this reasoning but I just do not see him stepping aside for Danerys if she pops into the picture. An LG should do that, but I don't think Stannis would.

>>730618

I agree to that. I was too influenced by the damn Red Priestess (still gotta read ASOS).

Someone should really redo this in another font, it's distressing.

>>730633

..Fuck, now I'm confused.

I do agree that he's better off to insert than Theon, for tier sake.

>>730628
Catelyn annoyed me because she throws the whole kindom into fuckery several times. Kidnapping Tyrion, releasing Jamie, making Ned take handship by trusting her shitty sister Lysa, trusting Petyr, etc

>>730646
That and "Lol it's okay Robb! You can trust Roose Bolton!" How can Catelyn, Lysa, and Edmure be so fucking retarded and Blackfish be god-tier?

>>730343
"Thanks for savin' me bro, gimme a sec, I'm gonna go kill our dad real quick."

That's not very lawful anything to me.

Am I the only one who thinks of Sandor as Chaotic Neutral?

He did some evil, like in the way that he killed mercilessly and often just for the pleasure of it, but in a way he had his own system of morals.

He refused to hurt Sansa and even grew an attachment (albeit a moderately fucked up one) to her. He often killed for mercy and showed Arya how to as well, and took care of her in his own way.

Plus when he worked with the septs on the religious isle, the name of which escapes me, he was obviously humbled a bit by the injury in his leg.

He did bad things, but in a way he wasn't a bad person.

tl;dr Sandor=CN

>>730665
>My face when Sandor has been listed as CN by several people already

>>730652

Never have I seen a truth so truthful.

Can anyone provide me a picture of Stannis and someone better fit for CE? I'll remake this chart.

Sandor Clegane isn't fucking chaotic evil, Joffrey is. Make Mirri Maz Duur or Gregor Clegane neutral evil.

>>730628
it was always interesting how all the stark kids got their own POV chapters except robb. and you're right, his character is mostly developed through catelyn so we get a pretty one-dimensional view of him. my mind was definitely blown by the red wedding but as I looked back on it I started to see more and more how it was robb's fault, as shitty as it was. he abandons winterfell instead of staying to defend it, thus leaving it open to attack by theon. then he fucks up the alliance with the freys by sleeping with jayne or whatever her name was. compare all this to jon: when he first hears his dad died, he tries to run from the wall, knowing full well he'll be an outlaw for the rest of his life in doing so, but he comes to his senses and does his fucking duty. so badass.

>>730638
I'd redo it without so much emphasis on the Starks and Lannisters. Recently reformatted my computer and cant find my photoshop disk.

How about this.

LG Barristan Selmy

NG Ned Stark. Can't be LG because of his part Robert's Rebellion.

CG Beric Dondarrion. Only fights for the people

LN Danerys

NN Jaquen Hgar. Just doin a job.

CN Littlefinger. Mastermind of the war. Wins no matter what

LE Melissandre. Kills with shadowbabies to support the one she feels is King

NE Sandor. Once the King's dog, then masterless and almost fatherly to Arya, then repentant.

CE Joffrey. Cut open a pregnant cat to look at the babies.

>>730671
>implying that there is any shade of moral ambiguity to Gregor and that Miri wasn't just seeking revenge
Gregor is pure evil.

>>730670
Gregor Clegane and Joffrey Baratheon are the only true CE's.

I think the only lawful guys so far are Eddard, Stannis and the onion knight. Those are the only guys with principles they would never betray.

>>730677
Maybe Roose Bolton as NE. He seems to flip sides when he sees a winner.

>>730677
Perfect. LG could be Arthur Dane too though.

>>730677
see
>>730665

>>730685
What about Tywin? He seems pretty LE to me.

>>730685
I don't know that they would never betray their principles. Stannis flipped his god-allegiances to get supernatural help and participated in Robert's Rebellion, which in itself takes the Lawfulness out of Eddard also. Eddard may either have a bastard or be lying to everyone about it--shooting down his honor no matter how you look at it. And the Onion Knight wasn't lawful when he smuggled onions and fish to storm's end, but he may be the most "loyal" of the three.

>>730694
but he was the hand of aerys and betrayed him.

>>730693
I didn't really go for Clegane as being neutral in the manners that Dany, Jaquen, and Littlefinger are. Dany is becoming a politician, Jaquen would kill a King or a farmer if you paid him, and Littlefinger is a chessmaster. I see Sandor as being repentant at the end of AFFC, but having done no deed to absolve himself.

>>730677

Wonderful choice for NN. Didn't remember him.

I agree with pretty much all except Littlefinger, that guy just can't be anywhere near N in my opinion. With your description, he better fits NE. Sandor for CN, as already said.

>>730700
I think people are forgetting that Aerys was batshit insane and that it would have been irresponsible not to take him down. Eddard and Stannis's duty was first to their subjects to protect them and Aerys threatened everyone's safety with his nonsense.

>>730703
Hmm...LE maybe. He betrayed Aerys only after he KNEW the Baratheons were going to win. He seems more prideful of his family to me, so I don't know where that would put him. Didn't he get pissed when aerys turned down Tywin's proposition that Rheagar marry Cersei? He got mad at his king for pointing out that his house is one of servants to the King.

varys fits NN pretty good.

>>730716
I didn't forget that he was insane, but they still had a duty to listen to the King. Robert was more upset that Rhaegar took Lyanna than he was that Aerys was crazy. Robert's Rebellion was almost completely out of revenge for that.

>>730720
Yes. Don't forget, Varys also has a hand in what is going on over in the Eastern Continent with Illyrio.

So who can remake the chart with a better positioning list?

>>730711
He gave up all freedom to go be a lowly servant of the monastery.

I think considering that he had to go and serve them the food with other children, that he had to take a vow of silence and listen to men that he would've killed without a second glance before, that he was pretty decently repentant. If you pay attention to the writing of his body language in AFFC he's meek compared to his former self. The head sept also makes reference to Sandor being "at rest" and the Hound being dead, meaning that he more than likely gave up his old ways.

>>730731
I think Varys would make an awesome NG. He served only the kingdom and did whatever it took to ensure the betterment of the people, no matter who he was serving, even though his methods were questionable.

>>730728
Brandon Stark went to King's Landing after Lyanna was kidnapped and wanted Rhaegar to die. Aerys imprisoned Brandon and lured his father, Rickard, to King's Landing under pretense of answering his son's treason. Aerys had them and two hundred Stark soldiers killed.

Then he pulled the same crap with other sons and their fathers (Jeffory Mallister, Kyle Royce, and Elbert Arryn and their fathers were killed)

Aerys then wanted Jon Arryn to give him Robert and Ned but he went to war against his king instead. Long story short, Aerys was a son of a bitch and Ned and Robert were fighting for their lives.

>>730735
I do understand that. Again, simply repenting isn't enough to take away from who he once was. Now if he delivered the head of Cersei Lannister to Zombie Cat, that might score some charisma and alignment points lol

>>730745
LIke I said, he's neutral, not good. He's not going for a complete turn around here. He's also easily one of the most complex characters, appearances aside. you could make a decent argument for a lot of different alignments.

I see Vargo Hoat being more CE than Gregor. Sure Gregor does some bad shit, but he was always working on command. Hoat just wants feet and hands.

Would Qyburn be NE? He is just experimenting with shit?

>>730735
wait WHAT?? I haven't finished AFFC, Sandor fucking Clegaine joins a monastery? And his intention is not to slaughter and rob everyone? You shitting me?

>>730754
I'm quite sure that Gregor wasn't ordered to rape and kill Elia and kill her son. Nor was he ordered to dangle Sandor over a brazier for taking a secondhand toy. Also, I doubt he was ordered to his own horse during the tournament, try to kill Loras, and kill a stableboy in the process.

>>730758
He may yet have a purpose. His horse Stranger represents much about him and I don't think he can stay at that place for long.

>>730767
No, but he wasn't punished either.

>>730767
Addendum / Fun Fact: Gregor also tortures and kills people regardless of gender, age, or innocence.

>>730758
The "Hound" that they say is killing up and down the Eastern seaboard is revealed to be Rorge who found Sandor's helm after he found it abandoned on the ground when Sandor was left by Arya, half dead.

A monk found Sandor, dying from a poisoned wound and begging for death. Characters looking for the Hound later seek info about him on the monastery and while the monk never officially says he's there there's a large character who keeps his face hidden, limps on the same leg that Sandor was injured on, and it's incredibly hinted at.

So, yeah, Sandor joins a monastery and finds repentance and shit. Oh, spoilers.

>>730770
Would the Lannisters punish perhaps their greatest tool? I know that if I had a eight foot tall killing machine at my command I damn well wouldn't do anything to lose him unless it was completely necessary or until he outlived his purpose.

>>730787
Damn that sucks, he has been my favorite char throughout the series. I sure hope that's only temporary, otherwise it would be just as killing him off.

>>730758

Stop fishing for unspoilered spoilers, damnit.

>>730788
I can't wait to see whatever the fuck the monster Qyburn makes out of him in the fifth or sixth book.

>>730799
see
>>730787

>>730796
Yeah, like
>>730768
says it's probably just a temporary plotline. Personally, I think he's going to join the fighting Faith or something resembling that. It seems like a logical outcome. Or he might just abscond, but I doubt it's within his personality to make a complete religious turnaround. I'd totally an hero.
I also hope to see him with Sansa, if only for the angsty sex that is sure to follow.

Gregor should never have won against Oberyn. It was just such a good ending for him, getting killed by an even more badass, more ruthless person. But no, GRRM had to make him out to be some superhuman hulk.

>>730811
more like the brutal sex that will ensue when a 18 yo faceless men Arya comes back to westeros to work down her list.

>>730804

No shit.

>>730815

Fuck, I miss Oberyn. Badass of the year, all years.

>>730824
sucks that Sandor was off her list. That would've been interesting.

Could the Reeds be Neutral Good? They don't want Bran to head south to his family but to ignore the wars and head north to the 3 eyed Crow for his own benefit.

>>730917
Not sure. Bran's chapters were so boring that I skipped them. One can only take so much HODOR HODOR HODOR and loopy dream bullshit before they call it quits.

>>730917
I believe so. Probably more so than Eddard or Jon because they are more altruistic and they do not suffer the inner conflict when breaking a rule.

>>730932
You missed some good stuff...

>>730932
Am I the only person who liked the Bran chapters? His last chapter in Clash of Kings was great. And I like how his story delves into the mystical side of the world.

I'd like to know what happened to Osha and Rickon though.

>>730962
I love Bran chapters. There's a lot of interesting things happening there that are going to be important later.

>>730962
They just seem so out of place with the erection-inducing Tyrion, Jaime, Jon, and Davos chapters.

>>730970
you assume they will be important. this is based on 2 assumptions

1. the last book will be published
2. Martin isn't just trolling you with reading hundreds of pages of a whiny crippled boy with a retard.

>>730978
Oh you

>>730998
name 7 interesting things from those chapters that you think will be important to the complete story of the series.

>>731010
How about you shut the fuck up and keep reading, every character has a purpose.

>>731026
Bran has had no visible purpose since the beginning of Game of Thrones. Martin should have killed him.

>>731031
damn you Jaime! should have finished the job..

>>731026
can't do 7 huh? how about 3?

>>731039
I was terribly disappointed when Bran didn't name his wolf Raisin. Also, HODOR HODOR HODOR = good chapters. Amirite, Martin?

>>731031
>>731039
Okay then, if Bran has no purpose, for what reason does he exist? Like you said, why DIDN'T he die?

>>731010

>>731010
1. Bran sees his family in a dream, including a telling line about a large stone giant which looms over all

2. In 2 AGOT chapters, it is mentioned that the weirwoods cannot look over those in the south because the weirwoods were chopped down--except on the Isle of Faces.

3. Jojen Green-dreams that the Wolves will come again

4. Jojen mentions to Bran that he has powers greater than Green-Dreams

5. Bran warged into a human (Hodor)

6. Bran is the next Stark male in line to rule over Winterfell

7. Bran appears in dreams Jon is having. He appears as a weirwood and encourages Jon to warg


I particularly liked the Knight of the Laughing Tree story that was told to him. It might not effect the coutcome of the War of the 5 Kings story, but it paints the background picture of what came before.

>>731060
It's Martin's story, he can do whatever the hell he wants with it. If he's building towards something magnificent then fine. However, if I were writing I would have killed Bran and given the audience someone way more interesting to read instead of stringing them along through 5 or so books worth of god-awful chapters.

so when the fuck is the last book coming out? im not going to remember a damn thing about this series by the time it comes out.

catelyn's chapters = some of the most painful, drab, boring and laborious reading Ive EVER done, and I've most of ayn rand's oeuvre

arya chapters = god tier

>>731108
Arya (and Sansa) with Sandor is god-tier. I found Arya in AFFC to be awful. I agree with Catelyn being a chore. I was cheering - and may have even shed a tear of joy - during the Red Wedding. Fucking Martin had to take that away with the epilogue though. It was the work of a master troll.

so did anyone besides me get a boner when they read the sexually graphic passages? when jon was having sex in a cave with the wildling bitch and the writing was getting descriptive I honestly rubbed my erection

>>731116
Disliked zombie catelyn, but it's kind of okay since that other guy gave her the kiss of life and died because of it. makes it somehow less lame...despite still being lame

>>731177
I liked Beric more than Catelyn and I have no idea why he would sacrifice himself for a woman who's lost everything. Seems like a really cruel thing to do.

>>731341
That's a really bad quote to use for Barristan if you want to classify him as LG. That's more of a NE - maybe even CE - quote.

>>731349
Any direct quotes you can suggest?

>>731349
Quotes seem to mess up these charts alignment things all the time.

>>731341
Neutral Evil

Neutral Evil is called the "Malefactor" alignment. Characters of this alignment are typically selfish and have no qualms about turning on their allies-of-the-moment. They have no compunctions about harming others to get what they want, but neither will they go out of their way to cause carnage or mayhem when they see no direct benefit to it. They abide by laws for only as long as it is convenient for them. A villain of this alignment can be more dangerous than either Lawful or Chaotic Evil characters, since he is neither bound by any sort of honor or tradition nor disorganized and pointlessly violent.

Examples are an assassin who has little regard for formal laws but does not needlessly kill, a henchman who plots behind his superior's back, or a mercenary who switches sides if made a better offer.

OK I can buy that

I wish Daenerys would hurry up and die

>>731341
Fixed (Dany)

>>731407
I don't see a difference

>>731409
First had Dany as Neutral Good

>>731407
So nobody in ASOIAF is more CE than Gregor?

>>731478
I dunno, Aerys maybe, Rorge? Gregor is by far the most heartless, barbaric guy so far in the books, so he fits CE the best.

>>731478
I think Ramsay Bolton comes pretty damn close

>>730164
Where would Craster fall? Neutral Neutral?

Where do you people get the character's pictures for these?

>>730164
Some from here, I think
http://www.komarckart.com/ccg_agot01.html

And I think these are licensed works
http://www.rankopedia.com/312/Best-Characters-from-George-R.R.-Martin's-'A-Song-of-Ice-And-Fire'/Ste
p1/14381.htm

>>731649
I always thought this guy did a good job

http://en.amokanet.ru/gallery/martin/martin.html

Hey guys you think well ever here moar about the children of the forest or whatever?
Also what about those people that live in the swamp i want someone to go there in the next book...

>>731739
Maege Mormont and some Glover were sent to take a message from Robb to Greywater Watch just before the Red Wedding

>>731751
oh...yeah I do remember that now.
I need the next book.....right now.

>>731763
That event happened in A Storm of Swords. The next book, A Feast for Crows has been out for years.

>>730164
Craster would be Lawful Good

>>731840
oh..well...i read them all about two years ago.
i meant i need dance with dragons.

http://winter-is-coming.net/2010/03/first-promo-image-from-thrones/

>>731906

>>731407
This looks like a vast improvement on the original. Good work.

>>732474
I'd like to see Sandor moved out of the chart simply to not double up on one family, considering that Gregor is universally looked upon as the CE of the series.

>>730164
This thread is a good start to my day