/lit/ - Literature

>>6999783

It uses tired arguments that have been refuted centuries over.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtvXbEMkiCY

>Is this book any good?
Not really. I can't speak to his credentials as a sociologist (as per his qualifications) but he isn't much of a historian. Instead of seeking out evidence to support a conclusion, he starts out with a conclusion and looks for Biblical evidence to support it, ignoring or hand waving away anything that doesn't.

Also his hypothesis that Jesus as a peacemaker and advocate of love were later additions by the Christian community that succeeded Jesus relies on there being a vast conspiratorial network between all of Jesus' followers, when we know that a lot of them didn't know or speak to or even like each other that much.

>>6999803
Thanks for the video, really nice how he gave some suggestions at the end since thats kind of what im looking for

>>6999821
Yeah the guy in the video seems to agree, i forget his name.
I actually thought aslan was supposed to give a very endearing look of jesus, not some extremely secularizing view which seems kind of outrages.

>>6999915
>Thanks for the video, really nice how he gave some suggestions at the end since thats kind of what im looking for

yep, Barron is straight shooter and usually comes up with coherent arguments.

He also tip toes carefully with Universal Reconciliation, which is nice

Most actual scholars agree that it's a piece of fluff pop history book making a centuries old argument about the historical Jesus being some kind of political revolutionary which has been discredited and which hardly any scholar takes seriously any more

Sorry for being abit cheeky and off-topic on your thread Opie; can anyone recommend me a good history of the starts of Christianity and Christianity in the early middle ages? (eg 3bc - 1000 ad ish)

>>6999803
This guy doesn't have a very good argument against the book (pure ad populum) and is obviously biased. If you want a much more detailed rebuttal of Aslan's dubious thesis from a real scholar of Jesus, check out Bart Ehrman's blog

>>7000422

it's a 10m video, not an in depth dissertation

>>7000427
He argues for a supernatural event having occurred historically purely ad populum. Not worth taking seriously

>>7000432

>ad populum

You missed the point.
His critique of Aslan's book is not hinged on his personal explanation of Jesus' posthumous popularity. the question Aslan didn't address sufficiently is why Jesus's following persisted while all the followers of other messiahs vanished once their messiah died. There must've been something unique and different about Jesus and that requires an explanation...

>>6999803
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtvXbEMkiCY [Remove]

Although I think Aslan's book is shallowly researched, nevertheless, the arguments this guy makes in the video are absolutely ridiculous and absurd! A book on the JFK assassination written 40 years later in the 21th century is not the same as a book written on Jesus in the 1st century. What a weak fucking argument.

That said, Aslan is a Shi'ite Muslim that works as a creative writing instructor, in... I believe at the University of California Riverside. He hold a Religious Studies degree from UC Santa Barbara. As some of his former professors have admitted, he isn't the most strong researcher to ever come out of the department, but that doesn't mean everything that he brings forth in Zealot is to be dismissed, it's just sloppy research.

But this guy in the video, Robert Barron, his arguments are equally if not more ridiculous.

>>6999783
>asking a muslim about Jesus
boy you sure are going to get some unbiased research ;)

>>7000614
It's as unbiased as research done by Christians though.

>>7000586
It's a very good video, interesting claims. I'll look into the channel a bit more.

>>7000677
So you think his presentist argument (JFK) was good? It was equally as sloppy as Aslan, if not worse.

I don't think this guy knows what a fallacy is, because he would realize he is making them consistently.

>>6999783
>Is this book any good?
>Is it "well written"?
Yeah it's bretty gud.
>What does it contain that the new testemant narrative of christ and basic historical context doesnt?
You misunderstand- it uses historical context to make the narrative of Christ make sense (which is to say, it disrupts the narrative of Christ with historical context).

>>7000614
I hope you only read books about Islam that are by Muslims. Just kidding, we know you don't read.

>>7000685
It's a sane argument. Not perfect and to be taken with a grain of salt, but really 40 years isn't the death of all knowledge of a person and everything doesn't become a myth. Especially because of the part on Gospel of Mark being written by a person who was with Peter.

>>7000711

Okay, so should we also believe the supernatural claims we find in other religions too? What about the Mahabharata? The Avesta? Pahlavi scriptures? Muhammad rode a Buraq? The Rig Vedas? Coyote stories? Mormonism must be true because Joseph Smith had witnesses! All these supernatural events in ALL these religions must have some credibility, many claim witnesses just like Peter and Mark.

See this is the problem that the religiously minded can't fathom because of the basic concepts of faith. There are hundreds of religions, thousands across space and time that have all claimed supernatural events and experiences. To stake the claim that YOUR supernatural event is the right one and the only right one, puts you in a ridiculous place within a global context.

Just say its faith and be done with it, because trying to "prove" that resurrection occurred is just as silly as a Hindu proving the resurrection of Lord Krishna.

Again, just say you have faith and be done with it, because when put up against the global context, you look like every other religious person staking a supernatural claim.

https://youtu.be/Nz2zhh8-UPs

Reza is right.

>>7000614
wouldn't a researcher who thinks their subject is a divine being be more biased

>>7000898
The best kind of researcher on religion is the pure secularist.

>>6999783
No, it is extremely entry level into New Testament Scholarship, and he is not a biblical scholar, although a nice guy. Strongly recommend:

Burton Mack: The Lost Gospel
A Myth of Innocence: Mark and Christian Origins
And Bart Ehrman's Introduction to the New Testament (all the rest of his books are pretty much cash grabs, which i can respect).
And Elaine Pagel's Gnostic Gospels, which is extremely well respected in the field.

The Teaching company also has plenty of very good lectures on the matter by guys at the tip top of his field, and stanford open courses has a good lecture on historical jesus.

>>7000614
He does a very unbiased job, its just that his conclusions (Jesus as a social revolutionary) is not a very widely held one.

Historical Jesus (Yeshua) has been seen by most scholars as either an apocalyptic prophet, or a reformer of second temple judaisim who was heavily influenced by the essenes.

>>7000841
Untip your fedora and rephrase that into something that is trying to make a point.

>>7000906
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luke_Timothy_Johnson

Naw, because it depends on the type of research you are doing. Examining the gospels in a faith based context is perfectly reasonable, since you know, it has effected the faith of countless millions.

>>7000906
Or the worst, really, depending on your views.

>>7000934

When the fedora comment comes, it's a good sign that the religious are getting triggered.

>>7000942
You're right, you wouldn't want anyone to deconstruct anything you have faith in. Best to avoid the secularist scholar in that case.

>>7000948
>>7000954

im barely religious, but deeply into new testament. Whenever some sperglord comes into threads on deconstruction of the new testament and starts screaming spaghetti monster, it does trigger me, since even if you are like jefferson and cut out the magical parts of the bible with a razorblade, there is still a tremendous amount of moral and historical research to dedicate to a book that has changed history so massively that you are compelled to shitpost whenever it comes up

>>7000959
*new testament studies

>>7000936
Well then Muslim scholars examining their faith based research are okay too, as well as Jewish, Buddhist, and Hindu scholars. Totally reasonable.

>>7000422
>Bart Ehrman
the blog is behind a paywall, would you mind copy pasting it here?

>>7000963
No one rational is arguing against that, unless they are trying to subjectively disprove the supernatural events in one religious book using evidence from another, ie Jesus couldnt have been God's on because muh pure monotheism

>>7000959
>there is still a tremendous amount of moral and historical research to dedicate to a book that has changed history so massively

I agree with this completely anon. I don't doubt its historical impact on cultural or the inspiration it created in said cultures. Indeed, it is there. However that is not what I'm discussing is it? You are putting words in my mouth because you are not reading what I am writing. You are talking about something entirely different from my original argument.

>>7000495
Because it gives the people what they want. The meek shall inherit the earth, God loves the poor, material things don't matter because you're going to heaven. It preserves the established order but it also comforts the poor who are shafted by that order. It's not exactly difficult to understand.

>>7000968
You have to go to his criticism page

http://ehrmanblog.org/fundamental-problems-aslans-thesis-2/

>>7000979
I was responding to

>When the fedora comment comes, it's a good sign that the religious are getting triggered.

Im not the anon from your previous discussion

>>7000984
>2. He repeatedly makes historical assertions that lack credible basis. I just indicated that “the Romans would have deemed” the shutting down of the temple “a capital offense: sedition, punishable by crucifixion.” Where is the…
FOR THE REST OF THIS POST, go to the Members’ Site. If you don’t belong yet, YOU’RE ON THE OUTSIDE!!!

>>7000968
>>7000995

wtf, im actually a fan of ehrman, but this site is fucking ridiculous. I like how the one criticism that isnt on the member page is is defense against critics accusing him of just wanting to sell books.

Hes a fucking shcolar, make your work available

>>7000959
you really are projecting man.

>>7000998
http://ehrmanblog.org/blog-two-clarifications-reza-aslans-zealot/

Here he says he does it because all proceeds go to charity and that motivates him to write it. Still lame

>>7001016
After i read Jesus, Interrupted, I realized that he has no interest past pop-history for people with faith issues. I want him to come out with a real monster history with 1/3 of it as citations.

>>7000954
A secularist is just as religious as a Christian. Just of a different religion.
It would best be to have an impartial, professional person do the research.
>>7000982
Quite sure he wasn't the first and isn't the last to say things like that. It's really nothing revolutionary in itself.

>>7001055
You're pretty ignorant of history here. Judaism and Christianity is extremely ahistorical because it can thrive and adapt while being conquered. Abrahamic monetheism is in fact vastly different than any other religion before it.

Read Anti-Christ lol

>>7001071
I'm not saying it isn't vastly different. I'm saying that the idea of the poor getting life eternal for x has been done after and probably before. I excluded that as the only reason Christianity is so spread out.

>>7001071
>Abrahamic monetheism is in fact vastly different than any other religion before it.

Never heard of Zoroastrianism, huh anon?

>>7001141
I didn't read the the previous replies, sorry.

>'m saying that the idea of the poor getting life eternal for x has been done after and probably before

no it hasn't, polytheisms after life is very different and the religion mostly dealt with your actions in this life. This is why Nietzsche calls Christianity life denying- you avoid pleasurable sins and improving your stature in this life because the after life is all that matters.This is what made Jesus (well, Paul's version) so radically different.

>sole reason
ofc not, but it was its primary allure, that its ok to oppressed because in the afterlife all will be well.

>>7001055
>It would best be to have an impartial, professional person do the research.

Like a professor of religious studies? You do realize that IS secular scholarship yes?

>>7001180
You didn't understand what I said, did you?

>>6999783
>wonders if a book is good
>doesn't read it
>instead asks a board of faggots who thinks aristotle and freud have merit

good on you, op. you truly are a faggot

>>6999783
It's muslim garbage.

>>7001232
>>>/pol/

You are boring, your memes are boring, and kill yourself tbh

>>7001160
You have, but think it predates Abraham, because you're an idiot.

Zoroastar read the tanakh the Jews took with them into Persian captivity, and believed it to be true.

Your sources for Zoroastar, the oldest known copies you rely on, are from the 13th century AD.

AD.

THOUSANDS OF YEARS LATER.

>>7001233
Very well.

As literature, it is muslim garbage.

Better?

>>7001215
I think you are not the sharpest tool in the shed. You have no idea what secular scholarship is. You want a "professional" (best kind of professional in this case is a Ph.d Professor who has been studying primary religious sources for 30+years and secondary published sources from various fields including anthropology, archaeology, theory, and theology.

Who (in your mind) is more qualified to give you an answer on religion than the Religious Studies Scholar?

Also, I don't think you even know what secularism is, to you, it seems like a bad word or something; a buzzword, which is kind of strange and pathetic.

>>7001246
Your appeal to authority in most cases might be well placed. When it comes to the bible, it is not. It is counter-intuitive, but I would rather take the general opinion of a born again christian to a secular scholar when it comes to the things of God.

The secular scholar has no foundation upon which to understand the things of God, whereas an adopted child does know the things of the Father.

Appealing to the authority of "experts" over the authority of the Word of God is exactly why the Roman Catholic Church is apostate.

>>7000984
Ehrman is a disingenuous liar. When he says the Greek transcripts of the New Testament have 400,000 translation errors, he is correct.

What he does not say is that about half of them are a movable "nu", which means absolutely nothing.

He also neglects to inform his readers that manuscripts copied over several thousand years would be expected to have millions, if not tens of millions, of translation errors, and the New Testament does not. There are tens of thousands of manuscript copies of the New Testament dating back to 115 AD that are 99.5% intact today.

Ehrman is a godless liar.

>>7001255
>mfw

>>7001235
First are you this anon >>7001255 ?

Because if you are there really is no need for us to communicate anymore, you won't believe secular scholarship on dating and periodization, so there is really no need to communicate further.

Judaism = 3000 years old
Zoroastrian = 3500 years old

Evidence? Herodotus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism

>The roots of Zoroastrianism are thought to have emerged from a common prehistoric Indo-Iranian religious system dating back to the early 2nd millennium BCE.[27] Although older, Zoroastrianism only enters recorded history in the mid-5th century BCE. Herodotus' The Histories (completed c. 440 BCE) includes a description of Greater Iranian society with what may be recognizably Zoroastrian features, including exposure of the dead.

The Histories is a primary source of information on the early period of the Achaemenid era (648–330 BCE)

>>7000841
This is a really bad argument
I hope you are trolling

>>7000934
>>7001873
Confirmed for BLOWN THE FUCK OUT. See how the Christtard evades the issues, knowing they can not possible counter? This is its common survival tactic.

>>7001255
Backwoods christiuhn pls go

>>7001276
>648–330 BCE)

Yes, this is the period when the Jews were enslaved, and when Zoroastar basically became a Jew.

>>7001923
Keep stuffing that banana up your ass, dude. Maybe one day it will make you famous on the internet!

>>7001938
Or... when the Jews became monotheists.

>>7001989
God scared the Jews so much at Mt. Sinai 3500 years ago that they begged Moses to get God to stop talking to them, and just talk through Moses. That later was Moses and the prophets, and then the Son.

The oldest known copy of anything Zoroastrian is from the 13th century, which is thousands of years after the events took place.

The oldest known copy of the bible is from 20 years after it was written.

People who believe that Judaism/Christianity came from Zoroastrianism are literally retarded.

>>7002009

citation

"In the first place, the evidence actually indicates that Zoroaster wasn’t even born until about the time of the Babylonian Captivity. Kenneth Boa states that his dates are sometimes given as 628-551 B.C. (Cults, World Religions and the Occult [Illinois: Victor Books, 1990], 45). Other scholars give similar, though not identical, dates (e.g. Herzfeld, 570-500 B.C.; Jackson, 660-583 B.C – see W.S. Lasor, “Zoroastrianism,” in Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, ed. Walter Elwell [Michigan: Baker Book House, 1984], 1202). If these dates are even relatively accurate then it is quite possible that Judaism did not borrow from Zoroastrianism. Rather, it may actually have been Zoroaster who borrowed from the religion of the Jewish captives in Babylon."

>>7002009
Daily reminder that The Exodus narrative is a fiction, meaning it never happened.

>>7001160
Zoroaster was not a true monotheist anyway, but a polytheist. At most he was a dualist: “He exalted Ahura Mazda…as supreme among the gods…and viewed the world as an agelong struggle between Ahura Mazda and Angra Mainyu” (Ibid., 1202).

Confirmed for idiot.

>>7002021
It's historical fact. And it's absolutely ridiculous to say that the oldest known tradition celebrated faithfully every single year for the past 3,500 years is based on NOTHING.

You're literally a holocaust denier at this point.

Hell was made for people like you.

Enjoy!

>>7002028
>And it's absolutely ridiculous to say that the oldest known tradition celebrated faithfully every single year for the past 3,500 years is based on NOTHING
>B-but the oldest known copy of anything Zoroastrian is from the 13th century, which is thousands of years after the events took place

6/10, nigga you were on a roll. Be a bit more consistent next time

>>7002028
>It's historical fact.
There is literally no evidence that anything even like the Exodus event ever happened. None.

>You're literally a holocaust denier at this point.
Jesus Christ, you're desperate hack.

>>7002028
Even the Bible says that in Hebrew, Judaen and Israelite societies polytheism was a widespread practice. The Hebrew Bible is of course mostly a Priestly anthology of diatribe against non-Priest controlled religion. Rabbinical Judaism originates from the desire to make all the surviving Jewish books, no matter how contradictory, into one volume to preserve Jewish culture, and Rabbinical practice is of course very different from even Second Temple Judaism.

>>7002061
The Jews have been celebrating passover for 3500 years.

Judaism has nothing whatsoever to do with Zoroastrianism.

Do try to keep up.

>>7002070
There is an abundant amount of evidence, including a detailed historical account in the Word of God.

Biased much?

Never heard of the chariots at the bottom of the al Aqaba? Never heard of the Ipuwer Papyrus? Ever heard of the monument Solomon built on the Arabian side of the Sea?

No?

BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT THERE IS NO EVIDENCE!

Literally.

Retarded.

>>7002088
Yes, godless people worship many things that are not God, including the Jews when they went and worshiped foreign gods, and were punished.

You can carve a coconut and name it God and worship it, and to you, it is your god.

That does not make it God. It's just your god. You know, useless, deaf and powerless.

>>7001946
What

>>7002028
>It's historical fact.
Where are the jars, bodies, clothing, animal bones, anything at all that points to the wandering in the wilderness? Where is all the evidence of these people living in Egypt, for that matter? Why is there no mention of the horrific plagues that nearly wiped out Egypt in Egyptian records? Why is there no mention of a Jewish adopted prince in Egyptian records? Why is there no mention of time in Egypt where there was a slave population equaling roughly 2/3rds of the non-slave population that suddenly left after a disastrous series of plagues? Why is the only item that contains any of this information a book written by Judeans nationals that couldn't even name the Pharaoh that supposedly oversaw all of this?

>>7002102
read
>>7002117

>>7002108
>Yes, godless people worship many things that are not God, including the Jews when they went and worshiped foreign gods, and were punished.
>>7002028
>the oldest known tradition celebrated faithfully every single year for the past 3,500 years

>>7002117
People whose clothes did not rot, whose sandals did not fall apart, whose hair did not fall out, and who collected each day, and twice on Fridays, all of the food that they would need to eat. And not 1 of them died.

You are asking where all the evidence of THEIR passing is.

You are LITERALLY RETARDED.

>>7002102
>Chariots at the bottom of the al Aqaba
Only source I can find is evangelical sites and writers on conservative sites. >what are shipwrecks

>Ipuwer Papyrus
>"The association of the Ipuwer Papyrus with the Exodus as describing the same event is generally rejected by Egyptologists."
From the wiki.
Proof that there were some Jews living in Ancienty Egypt =/= Exodus is real

>Solomon monument
What does this even have to do with Exodus? Again, only sources I can find for this are from evangelical websites

It's obvious you're the same faggot who >>7001246 was addressing. Honestly I feel ashamed for biting, fuck off back to /pol/ or even /x/!

>>7002128
You do /lit/ proud. Great contribution. Stunning and witty and insightful. Pithy even.

>>7002102
>chariots at the bottom of the al Aqaba
http://www.snopes.com/religion/redsea.asp
>Ipuwer Papyrus
A political document about the Egyptian Mandate of Heaven- no mention of anything remotely related to Exodus.
>Ever heard of the monument Solomon built on the Arabian side of the Sea?
kekek

>>6999803
>Bishop-elect Robert Barron

oh man, I hope he becomes a pope

>>7002156
>Only source I can find is evangelical sites and writers on conservative sites.
> only sources I can find for this are from evangelical websites
not him, but do you have any reasonable reason for this a priori rejection?

>>7002023
>Angra Mainyu”

Angra Mainyu is your satan character anon.

>>7002610
Because they aren't credible sources.

>>7002158
Thanks anon :^)

>>7000633
>>7000690
>>7000898
>>7000928
>implying you can be unbiased about a 2000 year old highly influential religion
muslims and atheists reject a priori any divinity, Christians accept a priori divinity, guess who's the unbiased one?
it's Christians, because rejecting a priori anything is pretty fucking unscientific

>>7002647
why not?

>>7000928
>He does a very unbiased job,
my sides, he literally starts with his premise and then shoehorns everything else

>>7002673
They have an inherent interest in pushing one conclusion over the other, making them suspect to begin with, but they also do not use scientific, peer-reviewed methods to investigate these claims that are good for them to the contrary. This is very simple, anon.

>>7002691
>They have an inherent interest in pushing one conclusion over the other
this sounds pretty fucking spooky, anon

>>7002668

>>7002694
Which is why we should avoid such sources, anon-kun.

>>7002668
But no one rejects divinity a priori. Christians have had some 2000 years to bring something empirical concerning divinity to the table so at this point it's safe to treat it as a null hypothesis. Accepting something a priori contrary to any and all availble evidence is unscientific, not the other way around.
>I took the b8

>>7002710
spooky from your point of view
>what, we cant trust him, he's X
pretty sure that's a fallacy

>>7002722
i fail to see how the truth value of something rests on it being empirical

>>7002728
That's why you're a christian. Why don't you jump down a 30+ feet high building for laughs, surely you can't trust something empirical as gravitation?

>>7002728
kek

>>7002743
who said i didnt trust the empirical, i just said they arent the only valid form of knowledge

>>7002723
Ad hominem/genetic fallacy is not that if the character of x is directly relevant to the probability of said x being a reliable source of objective truth.

>>7002762
but the only reason for your rejection was because they were christian site

>>7002756
>they arent the only valid form of knowledge

kek, I'm going to bite now too, what are these "other" forms of knowledge?

>inb4 untestable response

>>7002756
Concerning how the world actually lays, yes it is. Newton, Maxwell, Einstein, Darwin, Tesla and co didn't infer their (more or less true) results out of thin air. Absense of evidence when it should present itself under scrutiny is evidence of absense.

>>7002771
>>7002691

>>7002786
math, deduction, etc
>>7002794
>didn't infer their (more or less true) results out of thin air
so is the Law of Inertia empirically verifiable?

>>7002813
>math, deduction, etc

How is math not empirical?

>>7002824
Math is cold powerful calculation, the heart of economics. If you Marxist frauds can't see the truth of that, there's no helping you.

>>7002824
most of it is deduction from empirical abstractions

>>7002813
If worded as a tendency and not an all-emcompassing timeless law, yes. More importantly, we now know there is no such thing but Newtoniam mechanics' results at the macro level can be derived from QM.

>>7002882
>If worded as a tendency
how the fuck is it a tendency?

>>7000841

worst post in this thread, tbh

>>7003035
Post more Christ-chan.

>>7002117
>Where are the jars, bodies, clothing, animal bones, anything at all that points to the wandering in the wilderness? Where is all the evidence of these people living in Egypt, for that matter? Why is there no mention of the horrific plagues that nearly wiped out Egypt in Egyptian records? Why is there no mention of a Jewish adopted prince in Egyptian records? Why is there no mention of time in Egypt where there was a slave population equaling roughly 2/3rds of the non-slave population that suddenly left after a disastrous series of plagues? Why is the only item that contains any of this information a book written by Judeans nationals that couldn't even name the Pharaoh that supposedly oversaw all of this?
Why can't Judeo/Christfags refute this?

>>7003391
I dunno has anyone seen it?

http://www.patternsofevidence.com/en/

lol you christfags trigger easily. Maybe pray for some more forbearance next sunday

>>7003391

>why aren't there sandal footprints of all the jews wandering in the desert 4000 years ago

>wow guys think about it!!

are you serious? lack of evidence is not proof of absence.

Egyptians didn't record embarrassing shit or minor shit, like some slaves running away

>>7003120

Christfags are the fucking worse.
Fucking hundreds of religions around the world, but they got the right one. Give me a fucking break.

>>7003451
the number of possibly correct religions is gets pretty limited once you accept an immutable, omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent prime mover.

>>7003451
there are three main monotheisms to pick out from bro, it's not hard

>>7003451
>>7003434

>>7003434
>watch this movie with brother
>brother
>atheist
>gamer fag
>gets pissed the entire way through
>me
>athiest
>i have a giggle every now and then
>try to understand the directors vision
why cant more people just take a film and analyze it calmly? why do people get pissed at different opinions so quickly?

>>7002854
What the fuck are you talking about were talking about religion. You /pol/sters and your commie witch hunts go read a book you catamite

>>7003442
>Egyptians didn't record embarrassing shit or minor shit, like some slaves running away
According to Exodus it was around 2 million, and the Egyptians kept records of much embarrassing history, including the inventor of Monotheism, Akhenaten. We know of minor legal and labor disputes as well as every major event in Egyptian history. It's not a case of "absence of evidence", it's a case of someone claiming something happened that's irreconcilable with the historical record, it can't be plugged in. This is like saying at some point in US history 10 million rednecks migrated from Kentucky to Oaxaca. Okay, so where's the evidence of this gigantic migration? The Exodus plagues would have been the largest scale even ever, definitely not "minor shit". I like how you play down your beliefs when you need to. No one's asking for footprints, we just want clothing, jars, things that preserve in the earth. The settlements mentioned in the Exodus are known, but no evidence of this mass migration anywhere.

>>7003874
Akhenatan was Moses.
Make sense now?

>>7003898
>believing Freud's incoherent ramblings
>two thousand plus five and ten anno domini

>>7003905
>that theory solely belonged to Freud

>>7003898
It doesn't, because Akhenaten never led a population of +2 million Hebrews to Canaan.

>>7003928
>the bible should be interpeted literally word for word

>>7003928
So Exodus didn't happen and the entire foundation of Judaism and Christianity is non-existent. Glad we could sort that out.

>>7001255

It amazes me how retarded protestants are.

>>7004180
Fuck off Catholico-Marxist dipshit

>reza azlan

how is this sub-par rhetorician respected as a scholar?

>>7003874
>we just want clothing, jars, things that preserve in the earth.

those don't preserve in the desert for thousands of years, and even when we do find artefacts how do we know who they belong to? your requirement is just goofy

>>7004292
>let me pretend that archaeology doesn't exist, tahnk you jesus

This thread was a mistake