/lit/ - Literature

Yes.

>>6927443
Yes. Started really studying it in 2007 after years of merely dallying with it.

>>6927443
You're retarded. We're all sorry about it, but just stop flaunting it in our face making us feel all conflicted and shit.

Schopenhauer literally *proved* you don't need to go to uni for philosophy.

>>6927443
no, you have to have it written down on paper or else it doesn't count

Yes, but it will take 10 times the time. But you will probably stuck with a bunch of undergrad ideas for years and never progress in abstraction to the advanced, graduate-level stuff, since you wouldn't have the resources and proper guide available to you.

not only possible but necessary.

oh dont go to those boring lectures anon, theyre a silly language misunderstanding anyway... rather come see my chilled monologue, we go for an movie after that and the rest is surprise (in my bedroom)

Yes, you have all the internet books at your disposal, and there are many sites dedicated to people who want to study philosophy.

>>6927771

Babes

>>6927443

If academia is necessary for understanding philosophy, then this implies that true philosophy was impossible before the advent of the modern university system

Can I get a shitty low GPA second rate STEM degree, then a graduates degree in philosophy when I'm older

>>6927443
Of courshe, just look at those greeks.

I respect an autodidact much more than some spoiled kid who had his hand held through the process of learning

Of course it's possible, but you need the discipline to be good at and in order to understand it.

For better or for worse the sheer drudgery of writing an endless stream of papers does manage to drill into your head how to think with some discipline.

>>6927843
someone please answer this

>>6927443
it's possible to understand anything without studying at uni, but it's also much more difficult and you don't get credentials for it

>>6927443
Daily reminder that philosophy can be studied at home, and a degree in it; is not important and useless.

>>6928707

Thank you. It really means something.

>>6927857

Actually, most of the famous Greeks (as well as most eminent scholars throughout history) were tutored. When I here someone talk about how many languages Jefferson could speak or whatever, I have to point out, anyone could learn anything with a dedicated tutor. And I don't mean the half hour of free tutorial the school gives, I mean a dedicated tutor who will actually answer all of your questions without chafing at the notion.

My calc tutor hated me because I would always ask why. But if I had someone who was willing to explain why, I'd be much better informed, and that's actually what mathematicians do, they ask why. I learned long ago that the only person who is willing to answer the questions I wish to ask, is myself. Once I realized that, I stopped giving a fuck at school. It reminds me of Foucault's critique of modern science, in that it presents a certain favored sphere of knowledge at the expense of disfavored spheres, even if it leaves out important information. I would always ask about the omitted variables. I would calculate wind resistance, spin, gravitational effects of the moon, when the teacher wanted simple velocity. I'd get marked wrong because it didn't fit the rubric. But, I feel much more informed than I would otherwise. I feel conversant in the subject in a way that A students never will be. Isn't that what it's all about?

>>6928946

>when I here

well fuck me sideways with a lunchbox

>>6928899
>>6928707
>implying autodidacts care shit about respect

that sounds like the logic of a frustrated academic who is jealous of those who achieved to be academics

Just because you attend university doesn't mean that you are educated.

>>6928954

>suggesting autodidacts must reject their base nature

Why would an autodidact conform to your idiosyncratic standard? By definition they would have autonomy over those valuations.

>>6927443
No.

Autodidacts have no frame of reference (in contrast to the University professor who guides you) as to what to read and where to look for the stuff that will advance their knowledge. That's the biggest problem of all. If you can somehow manage to resolve this problem, then the world is your oyster.

>>6928999

But, true academic values are sacrificed by universities in the favor of their own self interest and profitability.

As Aquinas would say, if one has received inspiration, it is actually sinful to ignore it. I find little in academia today.

>>6928994
then whats the point of giving "them" a name if nothing unifies them other than the fact that there is nothing to unify them? why give judgment a value about "them" if there is no them?

>>6927843
If you're asking if you need a philosophy bachelor's degree to get a masters/Ph.D. then the answer is no.

>>6929159
Or rather, the answer to your actual question is yes, you can.

>>6929103

Because the plural form of singular beings is 'they.' They are indeed united, de rigor, and ideology has nothing to do with accomplished facts.

>>6927843
>>6929159
Might do this, except I'm currently doing a god tier (CV-wise) STEM degree.

>MPhys, Oxon
>DPhil, Oxon

Jealous, /lit/?

>>6929226
>>6929226
If I get a ~3.4 in Forestry and a Master's in Philosophy I would be a happy man, although I'd invest my life into getting a Doctorate if the siituation in the future allowed me to do so.

I would be very surprised to see if any of the people who answered yes had the same kind of understanding of philosophy as a regular BA-degree holder. I would agree with what tripmaster >>6928999 pointed out, that autodidacts lack a frame of reference. I just think that a lot of these autodidacts think that they have a good grasp on philosophy, but I have never met one that has a convincing understanding for any topic that they've studied. The best teachers helped me avoid major pitfalls and incorrect readings, which I see autodidacts fall into almost 100% of the time. Certainly it is possible to study philosophy by yourself, but philosophy has many invisible problems. If I don't know how to calculate differentials, I KNOW that I don't know how to calculate differentials. Philosophy's problems are much more difficult to spot, often impossible without proper instruction. Autodidacts just succumb to so many of these invisible problems and get sucked into shitty readings or bad interpretations. But because they have no frame of reference, they have don't even know that they are just compounding problem after problem.

>>6929255
I have no idea what a 3.4 is.
Is it American?
>Oxon is ~4x older than your non-nation

>>6929266
3.4 out of 4.0

I dropped out and failed multiple classes from not showing up. It would be a good grade for me.

>>6929266
Yes, American Unis are easy, so I'm hoping this could be my ticket to still getting a formal education.

>>6929291
Well 3.4 out of 4 sounds pretty decent.
Do you chaps over there not deal in 1st, 2:1, 2:2, 3rd?

>>6929302
Grades are A, B, C, D, & F but the cumulative of your whole stint, whether a semester or a degree is on a scale from 0.0 to 4.0 with something like 2.0 or 2.5 usually being the bare minimum, even absolute luddites can pass, tier.

>>6929255
>Forestry and Philosophy
Get the hell out. Where do you go to school? Im doing the exact same thing at Northern Arizona Uni

>>6929291
Dont be too hard on yourself, a 3.4 is good for anyone. Especially a Dual Major

>>6929320
I don't really get the impression that America has many real universities.
Also, what's up with 'colleges'? Are they just what you call all the non-god tier unis?

>>6929336
A University offers 4 year Bachelors degress along with Masters and Doctorate Degrees
A College usually just offers Associates degrees (2 years)

>>6929345
Why does it take you 4 years to do a Bachelors? Are you retarded? I'll have a BA and a MPhys after my 4th year.
Sounds like you should abolish the Colleges, I'm pushing for a similar policy over here for all our shit unis.

>>6927843
>>6928845
>low GPA
No, the cutoff for most serious graduate programs is officially 3.0, and your application is unlikely to be taken seriously without a significantly higher GPA or amazing GRE scores.

This is not to mention that you won't be accepted even with perfect scores if you don't have anything interesting to say about philosophy in your writing sample.

>>6929362
Because thats what the Universities schedule us for.
Also, many people in Uni work part time to afford school; our education isnt free.

>>6929448
This is the answer I wanted to hear. Would a place like Oregon accept with the terrible grades IF I did say something interesting in the writing sample?

>>6929266
Sometimes I feel very depressed about life, but then I think, at least I'm not so pathetic as to make not just one, but TWO posts on 4chan bragging about going to Oxford. Thank you for that. Sincerely hoping that you're trolling here for your sake.

Obviously that is doable, but you won't ever be taken seriously and it's very unlikely that you will be able to make contributions to the field. I mean, if by philosophy you simply mean reading Foucault and Heidegger, by all means don't go to university. If you want to study logic, for example, it's very unlikely that you will go very far without dedicating your life to it.

>>6929327
It's not a dual major and I'm on academic probation at the moment, so I have recently been very hard on myself.

>>6929471
Again, "terrible grades" are relative. A 3.5 is a terrible GPA if you want to go to an Ivy/Stanford/Berkeley. A place like Oregon will be less judgmental about that, but 3.0 is absolutely the minimum cutoff for any decent school, and this is mandated by the Graduate School, not the department. That means your application won't even be considered if it's lower.

I have seen some graduate schools that lower their minimum to 2.75. I don't think these are the kind of schools that you want to attend.

And your GREs would be an important factor as well.

>>6929362
>Why does it take you 4 years to do a Bachelors? Are you retarded?
yea a whole country is retarded. You are so intelligent.

Question for those with more experience than I have. I was on track to graduate high school with an associate's degree and had a 5.0 GPA due to honors classes having extra weight in my state. I eventually moved, and a combination of credit transfer mishaps and missing a semester of school fucked my grades up beyond repair. I had to do my sophomore year and junior year all in one school year, and long story short even after getting a 4.0 both years and finishing up my senior year I'm left with something like a 2.8 GPA due to the complications from moving and technically failing a year of school with a 0 due to them.

My question is, if I take two years at a local college and receive honors and all that and then look at transfer to a university, do I have a chance at getting accepted into any decent schools? I have credentials beyond my grades; I was president of two school clubs, played varsity baseball all four years, did community service, etc. If I explain my situation in a cover letter or something of the sort and leave this shitty college with honors and top marks is my education still salvageable?

>>6929608
Yes, almost every state has a pipeline set up for transfers between their community colleges and their 4-year institutions. You don't even need a perfect 4.0 to do this. Don't worry, you're not in a bad situation.

>>6929608

Your last two years are all they care about really. Actually, only Junior year counts.

>>6929608
Max Fischer get out

>>6929634
It's good to hear, and I'm aware of the transfer programs for most states, and mine (Virginia) does have them, but my fear is that I won't go to a university that I can actually feel good about going to. I live in Virginia, after all.

>>6929649
>only Junior year counts
I've heard this a few times, or that at the very least it's the most important. Why is this?

>>6929753
But I care about academics way more than extracurriculars :(

>>6927443
It's probably better if studied it outside of university in all honesty.

In this manner you are exposed to ideas without any preconceived or guided notions of the material. Philosophy can be learned, but it doesn't need to be taught.

>>6929778
>my fear is that I won't go to a university that I can actually feel good about going to
It's the same thing as when people feel that they're too good for jobs like McDonalds: you take the best option that you can get, and you should be thankful for the opportunity. You should feel good about going to university, period, unless it's a for-profit school. It's easy to live in a bubble, especially on 4chan, and convince yourself that the elite schools of the world are the only ones worth going to or feeling good about, but the reality is that it's worth it to go to university even if it's an average school. The grass is always greener, anyway. Even some people who go to Harvard wish they'd gone to MIT or Princeton.

>Why is junior year important?
The person telling you this is wrong. All four years matter, and that's the end of the story.

It's not possible to comprehend any field without a structured education in it, with evaluations. Self-pedagogy is like pretending your 20 year old used car is a space shuttle.

>>6930176
Not the kid, but
>having high hopes and goals is living in a bubble and you should just settle
Come on.

>>6930282
I'm not saying that at all. Shoot the moon. What I am saying is that there's no shame in going to an average university that doesn't impress anyone. The implication of the original comment was that pipelining from a community college to a four-year institution might not land him at a university "he could actually feel good about going to" - going to ANY university is something you should feel good about.

So many people on /lit/ will say "Accepted to Bumfuck State? lol don't go, shit school, waste of money, enjoy your fourth-rate education." That's totally disconnected from reality. If anyone actually believes that, they're very entitled - much like those people who feel that they're above fast-food work even though they have no other job prospects.

>>6929778
typically people take the SAT and ACT their junior year which is why it's considered so important, another reason might be that most places that aren't specifically designed for talented students begin offering college credits to juniors and seniors. Your performance in prerequisite courses your junior year will be important for determining whether or not you can take course that give university credit your senior year, again, if your school offers programs like that.

Honestly if you don't have a professor, you can't learn philosophy, not even basic stuff. How do you know that you're reading is the correct reading aka the professors reading? I've actually had autodidacts say to me that they think Hegels Dialectic isn't Thesis and Antithesis makes Synthesis, which is what my professor and many other scholars believe. You can try to learn it, but you'll never have the objective reading unless you have a professor.

>>6930462
>tfw when I'm a Neo-Hegelian
>tfw never read a single word of any of Hegels books
>tfw discovered the one true faith through reason alone

>>6930462
And how did those professors learn that?

>>6930489
Is it your professor's reasoning? Otherwise I highly doubt it's good reasoning.

>>6930500
Through other professors/scholars?

>>6930506
And those professors? You realize someone somewhere had to read it on their own at some point, right? Don't be a retard.

>>6930519
I'm hardly being a 'retard'. I'm just say autodidactism is bad because it encourages you to have your own thoughts, even though they may be the wrong thoughts.

>>6929345

This post is half wrong. I'm pretty sure universities are schools with a multitude of different colleges in one place. Regular 'colleges' are typically limited to a specific set of skills, like a college of liberal arts. You can do engineering, pre-med, and pre-law at a university; at a liberal arts college, you won't find anything outside of liberal arts, because that is the whole school: a college teaching liberal arts. Both offer bachelor degrees at least.

Community colleges are the ones that give 2-year degrees.

>>6930501
I don't have a professor. I discovered all I know about philosophy through argument.

>>6930578
Well it's wrong if you don't have a professor to confirm it's good.

>>6930462
>>6930501
>>6930580

Please stop with the uninspired bait. You're forcing it.

>>6930587
No seriously, how can you understand philosophy without some sort of authority? It's like saying you can learn classical mechanics on your own without a professor to make sure you're not making any mistakes.

>>6930462
Is this true guys? Don't wanna think ive got somewhere then realise I got it wrong