/lit/ - Literature

Nothing! He knows nothing!

He'd say it's a poor imitation of the forms then seduce you into becoming his boipussy pupil

>>6920991
useless shit that can't make a statement that comes anywhere close to getting at truth

Like pretty much every greek, he wouldn't have liked it. He'd say somthing about how art it noble because it encoureges the man to wonder about the world around him. And also try to reach the highest beauty possible that could be derived from the world around us - get as close as possible to the platonic form of beauty. Therefore art that is detached from the world in which we exist isn't noble.

>These are wonderful Anon, but there is a question that is pestering me, what is art?

>>6921218

I love these pictures.

>>6920997
prolly this

>>6921212
these are your opinions, not Plato's

>>6920991
Nothing good, I'm sure.

On the other hand, I love Kandinsky.
I like Malevich too. Here's a Malevich composition called "White on White".

He would say that some of it is great at playing with geometry or color.

Then he would probably say that it's leaning more towards decoration than raw art. But that's not bad.

Then he would say any sexual bullshit was corrupting the youth and would ask why our society was letting people antagonize publicly.

>>6920991
maybe he'd recant his old views and say that some representation is capable of landing higher up on the divided line than he'd thought. or maybe nothing would change, images are always images, even reflections of the form of the good are still just reflections

>>6921250
It's absolute trash. It's the "video games are art" tier bad.

>>6921562

>>6921250

Plato's beef was with imitative art, and I think if he really thought about it he would come to an understanding that abstraction, while still merely representative of the forms, better evokes the forms.

That being said, I still don't think he'd want it in his ideal state.

>>6921217
Plato explicitly states in the Republic that imitative art is as far as you can get from the forms.

bump

>>6921246
His issue with art, specifically painting, is that it cannot adequately portray the essence of whatever the subject is. Abstract art is even worse than clear cut portraits in that its meaning is even more obscure and in many cases subjective. So what share in knowledge and understanding could it possibly have?

>>6921599
>I think if he really thought about it he would come to an understanding that abstraction, while still merely representative of the forms, better evokes the forms.

Try to remember that, in addition to being a philosopher, Plato was a man. As such many of his opinions on art in a time utterly unlike his own will probably disappoint you.

>>6920991
that's not even abstract--it looks exactly like moscow

>>6921605
It's been a while since I read The Republic, but how comes? What's the reason?

>>6920991
That isn't a Kandinsky

>>6923077
Using Plato's specific example, he says that art is an appearance of an imitation of an imitation. A portrait of a bed is simply an image of something a craftsman would make in the image of a bed's actual form; the portrait itself is also drawn from a particular angle, not fully encompassing the bed but giving us an appearance from the perspective of the artist. It ties into his divided line analogy by way of the fact that it's three levels away from true understanding of forms, a painting lies in the lowest level of reality, that of the image.

Can someone post a pic of Plato showing a middle finger

>>6923102
I see. It makes sense, but I didn't mean to say art was about creating the forms or things that are as close as possible to them. What I said, or at least meant to, is that creating art which derives from the physical world you explore the nature of things that exist as forms, in your head. By creating this imitation of an imitation you can get a better grasp of, for say, beauty - to exist in your mind. This can't (well, arguebly, but that's what Plato would probably say) be achieved with abstract art.

it's worthless since it isn't moral.

and it's worthless because it's just plain shit.

>>6923082
yes it is, kek.

>>6923115
Bumpin this pls I am desperate

Glaucon:
>Socrates, you say that abstract art is inherently better than figurative art. Can you prove this even if we compare the best of figurative to the worst of abstract art?

Socrates:
>of course Glaucon, it is very easy to demonstrate so. But before I get to that let me bore you to death with this 300 page description of a totalitarian city and let me get into detail about the sorts of music each of the different classes will need to listen to. By then you will hopefully have forgotten about your actual question.

>>6921562
pleb detected

>>6923330
Its deficiency in actually providing us true understanding of things that are is why Plato is skeptical of art. His point is that you CAN'T explore the nature of things by way of artistry. Only rigorous training in rational dialectics complimented by knowledge of certain skill sets can achieve that.

>>6923456
>unironically defending modern 'art'
shiggy

>>6921217
>Like pretty much every greek, he wouldn't have liked it. He'd say somthing about how art it noble

You have never read Plato.

Seriously, why people post on /lit/ when they have no fucking idea? You are the cancer of lit. You have many other board to shitpost. Stop fucking this board.

Kandinsky rules. However expressionism is superior: Munch, Kollowitz, Schiele are rad as fuck

>>6923521
not that guy but Plato literally said that he considers art the lowliest of forms in his theory of forms. Which is funny, because the theory of forms is one of the few things which is even more useless and masturbatory than abstract art.

>>6920996
If I pulled you out of the cave, would you die?

>>6920991

>spend decades saying there is no objective beauty
>complain when even the commonest of pleb says your stuff is shit


Can't have your cake and eat it too

>>6920991
Well Plato did not like imtitative art and in sentence or two in Republic he mentions the pleasure of viewing pure geometric forms as good thing.

>>6923536
For some reason impressionism always felt more "expressive" than expressionism to me. Surrealism too, though it's less guttural than impressionism to me.

Why is that?

>>6923570
>spend decades saying there is no objective beauty
What?

>>6923596
Because it demands less finish than other movements, and the work itself is often shorter - which means the work is alot more intuitive

it's shit. and i don't know what plato would have said

>>6920991
Does abstract art inspire any kind of catharsis in a person? yes

Should it therefore be banned? See spoiler above

>>6923570
Kandinsky didn't say anything like that you massive faggot.

>>6923568
Plato was a big guy…

>>6923825
that isnt francis bacons face

>>6920991
Did /lit/ fall for the 'pollack is good meme'?

There is good modern art, but his is not.

>>6923521
>He'd say somthing about how art it noble because it encoureges the man to wonder about the world around him

This reminds me of the "good ol' pluto" screencap where someone learns about how important democracy is from Plato.

>>6921562
>It's the "video games are art" tier bad.

>implying they aren't

Iamthatwhatwashisnameoftheedgyphilosopherthattrolledthefuckoutofeveryone greek philosopher's previous incarnation (that is, after I die I'll incarnate into him in the next life) and I say it's shit.

>>6920991
He'd say it was imitating the Form of Pure Shit.

>>6923521
simmer down you sperglord plato says art is okay if it promotes virtue

>>6920991
He'd no doubt say "HOLY FUCK WHY AM I IN THE FUTURE" albeit in Greek

>>6923958
For Nous

>>6920991

Kandinsky is the MAN

He's one of my greatest influences as an artist, i can look at his art all day but this piece in particular is my favorite. People like to say that "abstract art has no meaning" and that it's "pointless" but i find that it's more interesting on a basic level. I like looking at it. This picture moves me, the geometric forms and colors, and the use of space is superb.

To me abstract expressionism is all about breaking down the societal constructs of "proper art" and socially accepted meaning. It's one of the few forms that i find truly rebellious and interesting. It's the "question everything" of the art world. That, and Dada

Anyway i think Plato would find it obnoxious and thought provoking, but not necessarily in a pleasant way. Then he would shrug and go find some young boys to fuck

didn't Nietzsche call him Apollonian? I think abstract art is on the opposite spectrum, he probably wouldn't like it.

>>6924708
>Kandinsky
I don't know who this guy is, but that pictured triggered an acid flashback. Thanks for a minute of giggles, anon.

>>6924838

no sweat bruh that picture is by Lauren Wright, Kandinsky did the painting in the OP pic.

http://laurenwright.ca/#/new-gallery/

Her style is a great example of contemporary abstract expressionism, a 2015 take on the shit that kandinsky started with less of an emphasis on geometric form and more on movement, color, and defined space

Shit looks rad on acid i'm glad you enjoyed. Have another one, this one is a drop of MDMA on a microscope slide

>>6921562
More than anything, comments like these sadden me.

I don't feel offended, I don't feel the urge to provide counterpoint, but I feel I gain a glimpse into the uncanny insularity that persists on this board, one which, given the (relative) frequency of intellectual debate, should really not exist.

The sheer existence of ample visual art threads suggests multidisciplinary interests in its members, yet the inflexibility of its contributors summons the image of an imitative, naive, unconscious elitist gifted with will but incapable of self-actualization.

>>6924941
Oh I see, thanks for clearing that up! I'm really intrigued by her art. Thanks for posting!

>>6924708
this is so fucking good

>>6921217
It's a caricature for the truth. For what is absolute or tangiable in the world

It's a representation of hyperdimensional objects, I think he could get it. But most people misunderstand his views on art, it was a period where Greek plays were finally starting to wind down, becoming a decadent art and losing their Dionysian element, finally killed off by Plato as a failed playwright who was creating myths as mere tools for philosophical thought. The Dionysian element and in some cases outright cult element is reintroduced with modern and contemporary art.

>>6926002
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6iqI2GIllI

>>6926006
>>6925975

thoughts?

>>6921562
>i can't comprehend anything that's not pretty flowers

>>6925207
It's unrelated to all of that. It's just the fact that the piece you provided is pretentious shite.

>>6926113
Dunno, Herman Bolle was quite interesting.

>all these plebs who just don't get post-modern art
Seriously just go back to your elitist, pretentious romantic art you fucking fools.

Art is already thrice removed from the truth, abstract art is just a spook however

>>6926147
It's not pretentious shite. You just don't get because... *ah* you're a foolish pleb. I doubt you could even begin to comprehend how avant-garde that beautiful piece was. Now run along pleb.

>>6926180
/thread

>>6921562
Video games can be art

>>6923596
only this is not impressionism, but cheap imitation of it