/lit/ - Literature

>>6694333
Checked.

Here's a letter Franklin wrote with his phonetic alphabet.

Showing phonetic languages on a scale.

>>6694333
>phonetic
Any reformation is going to be based on a nationalist and bourgeois attempt to force class dictions down the throat of the proletariat.

English's spelling is perfect in the sense that like Chinese it is anti-phonetic.

Pitman early learner's alphabet. Kind of pointless, but gives my OCD a rest

>>6694361
I hate it. I would rather read analytically and have to think about the sounds I'm reading and how they make sense. it would make you exercise your brain more.

International Phonetic Alphabet adapted to English.
Really fucking wierd...

1st article of the declaration of the rights of man in IPA

Now we start getting wierd.
After this I'm posting alternate alphabets. These are all phonetic.

>>6694377
According to sources, writing the Deseret Alphabet was rather difficult.

This is my personal favorite. I'm in the process of transcribing several books into the Shavian Alphabet.
It's incredibly easy to write and read and is all-around great. I learned it in a single day back when I was in highschool.

Article 1 declaration of the rights of man.
Shavian is incredibly pleasing to the eye.

>>6694392
just fuck my shit up

>>6694396
Shavian physically written gives me a boner. So easy to read and analyze. The only issue is that the difference in dialects can make reading some other anglophones writing difficult.

Now we have Tengwar. an Abjad created by JRR Tolkien for his constructed "Elvish" languages. Writing english with is can be clunky, however it's very pleasing to the eye and quick to write.

>>6694409
Tengwar used to write English phonetically.

I'm out of shit. Hope this spurs discussion.

>>6694417
dammit.

Enjoy

>>6694368
>I hate it. I would rather read analytically and have to think about the sounds I'm reading and how they make sense.

oora fakan con oora fakan sip con oo fakan basdad.

>it would make you exercise your brain more.

No it wouldn't it would split English into its sociolects immediately. English pronunciations cannot be reconciled in a single format.

>>6694333
>I'm going to reform the English language
>it's flaws
Go home.

>>6694338
It's like Dutch.

>>6694481
>This buttflustered over a punctuation error
>Doesn't contribute anything to thread or discussion
shiggy

>>6694498
Those were my thoughts too. Good thing I don't speak Dutch or I'd have throat cancer

>>6694361
Chinese is not anti-phonetic. Over 90% of Hanzi are phono-semantic compounds.

>>6694333
you forgot the english phonotypic alphabet. you might look to webster's reformation of american english spelling and draw similar hope, but limit this to spelling, and leave the standard latin alphabet alone. no one will cares enough about the problem to take up bullshit phonetic symbols and squiggle marks.

>>6694541
I've never heard of that. I like it very much, thanks for posting it

>>6694333
What are your thoughts on dialects? A strictly phonetic spelling of how an Australian speaks, would look quite different to a strictly phonetic spelling of how an American speaks. Thanks to rhoticity/non-rhoticity especially. Should dialects have their own spellings?

>>6694559
it was created in part by pitman and the us government adaopted its official use for a short while

>>6694586
Read, the man who devised the Shaw alphabet once commented that phonetic spelling should follow either Received Pronunciation or General American, so that spelling could be read regardless of dialect (much like English is today).
I suppose I agree with him.

>>6694516
And yet Hanzi are used in Japan, Korea, Cantonese and many other phonetically incompatible languages. You get more out of memorising a misremembrance of how some ancient bastard pronounced things, sure.

Enjoying that Francophone English over your lamb?

>>6694597
I really like this alphabet. Are there any works published in it?

>>6694619
And here's the bourgeois nationalist shit coming out of the imperialist anus that is OP.

>>6694641
>>>/marx/

If we had an actual phonetic alphabet it would be long as fuck. Thanks Great Vowel Shift

>>6694661
Everyone should write in the pronunciation of US TV or HRH? Fuck off.

>>6694641
>phonetic spelling should be regulated to a single dialect
>exactly like current english is
>somehow this is nationalist and imperialist
Thanks for your input but if you have actual discussion you'd like to interject (alas without revolutionary rhetoric) please feel obliged to.

>>6694672
It would only be around 40 characters. sounds like a lot, but phonetic alphabets are much easier to learn

>>6694675
English spelling is regulated to anglo saxon, anglo norman french, modern french, modern provincial, archaic and university latin and greek, hindi, chinese, japanese, popular colloquial.

English spelling isn't regulated by any one pronunciation, it is a democracy of archaisms which are biased against all.

Suck my fucken nuts.

>>6694361
>Any reformation is going to be based on a nationalist and bourgeois attempt to force class dictions down the throat of the proletariat.
he lives in 19th century

>>6694636
you can find physical copies from libaries or achives of its brief usage in government, but there is nothing much aside from large sections of the phontypic journal itself that were published using the alphabet, although several other languages adopted corresponding phonotypic alphabets which might have progressed further. during its prime, the journal was referenced much as ipa is today on wikipedia to provide a consistent source for pronunciation. it's possible to read, but the idea of reading something in the alphabet would probably be the same as reading something contemporary in ipa.

>>6694516
我的黑鬼。

>>6694719
>>6694719
And we can see nobody in this thread has done any linguistic history. Language "reform" has been an attempt to impose french style academies onto living populations. 19th century nationalism was as much about obliterating provincial and local languages as it was about producing states.

Do bother to learn about the 19th century.

>>6694749
we receive what?

>>6694773
first two characters = 'my'

>>6694794
Not in Japanese.

>>6694768

>>6694799
不是日语。

>>6694799
>>6694819
他妈的被炸得支离破碎!

>>6694819
>不是日语。
内部の射精された喜び。

But most of them were Japanese characters.

>>6694819
Oh and by the way 黑鬼 isn't phonetically correct. It doesn't get the sense of nji per Boondock's authoritative pronunciation.

>>6694825
>他妈的被炸得支离破碎!
Not at all, I proved my point about hanzi being used across multiple languages with different phonetic uses of hanzi.

>>6694811
lol

but yeah I tried learning this for a time to use like as a shorthand sort of. I hated writing the dipthong characters and the K.

>>6694826
小日本,滚!

>>6694717
>>6694755
Edgy

>>6694852
k

you need to go faster

>>6694755
I don't really see the problem. Establishing strongly united empires has generally been hailed as a good thing throughout history. The french language has done pretty well for itself, even if it did wipe out many competing dialects in the process.

Besides, the ability to die gracefully allows for rebirth, and isn't that what life is? Forgetting and creating anew is the cornerstone of human existence, there's no reason this creative process shouldn't be part of nation building as well.

Finally, English language reform would probably split the English language into unique regionally specific languages. While lots of it will be obviously bourgeois, there's something to be said for the old blood and soil rhetoric. I know my corner of America (pacific northwest) has a huge amount of slang, jargon, loan words, grammatical shortcuts, and so on that don't exist in, say, the Midwest. If anything language reforms would be an emancipating reaction to english driven globalization.

>>6695074
>Establishing strongly united empires has generally been hailed as a good thing throughout history.

There are two problems with this. One is a blatant confirmation bias for your own normative perspective. The other is that >history has discovered numerous counter moralities. Consider, for example, the popular opposition to Henry VIII's closure of the monestaries; or, the popular opposition to English imperialism.

>Forgetting and creating anew
Seems to exclude empire.

>blood and soil
As opposed to the transcosmopolitanism of English as actually used by the international proletariat?

You don't really see the problem because you've not cultivated the capacity to transact academically outside of your normative frame. Do so. It'll make you more interesting.

>>6695146
>One is a blatant confirmation bias for your own normative perspective
I disagree. Strong empires have generally coincided with periods of economic and cultural prosperity, this follows naturally from the establishment of a linguae francae and secured trade roots.

>Seems to exclude empire
I'm borrowing most of my ideas about nations and state building from Gentile and the futurists here, so not really. States are organic organisms and should be examined as such. Languages, if seen as the the manifestation of the polis, would benefit from language reform by allowing civil society to hold a mirror to itself and become self reflective, while at the same time actively (as opposed to passively) shaping itself.
In our globally capitalist ru-ha-ha of a society, this meditated self reflection is especially important on a state level.

>As opposed to the transcosmopolitanism of English as actually used by the international proletariat?
Except the proletariat generally uses regional dialects and slang. Transcosmopolitanism is just consumerism in ethical disguise, and in my part of the globe radical left wing politics walk hand in hand with radical environmentalism and regionalism.

>Do so. It'll make you more interesting
Real mature m8

>>6694350
> German not highly regular
source?

>>6694368
> Chad
>>>/r9k/

>>6695951
German orthography is partially regular and partially very irregular. Here's an alphabet I devised which is almost 100% suited for German.

>>6695972
Sorry. Posting the updated version, now with macrons.

>>6694768
Why does shorthand exist? Couldn't we just adopt a modified Hieratic/Arabic/Persian script and throw in a few more letters along with striking out the dots and adbjad's? That seems much more efficient than practically anything else.

>>6694333
How does a spelling based on phonetics work in terms of accent and dialect?

>It doesn't
>literally wanting to go back in time

>>6694498
>>6694509
Please explain why it looks like dutch
Genuinely curious

>>6694350
Finnish truly is the most autistic language :D :D

>>6695951
>German
>highly regular

>>6696059
>How does a spelling based on phonetics work in terms of accent and dialect?
By not employing a standard spelling of words, but a standard system of spelling phonemes, so that different dialects use different spelling. The level of mutual intellegibility would be the same in written and spoken discourse.
Differences on phonemic and prosodic level would not influence the script, of course.
>>6696111
The newer an alphabet is, the more regular it usually is, as diachronical language change grows more prominent over time. Turkish is also highly regular, as are Czech, Polish and Hungarian to a lesser degree.

Why wouldn't we just use the runic alphabet?

>>6696260
Because it is not good

>>6696040
What you're replying to is a phonetic alphabet, meaning that there is a single letter for each individual sound in English.
Its incredibly efficient when writing. When I use semi-cursive quikscript, I usually write faster than words I can think of.
Also Arabic script has a steep learning curve, and is somewhat difficult to master

>>6696260
Inefficient for writing. I tried writing in Runes and it was so slow that I became frustrated and gave up