/lit/ - Literature

>>6689659
Should Paradise Lost represent Protestantism.

>>6689659
I hope this will help you: The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism by le nigger Max Weber

>>6689671
This guy gets it.

I want an overview of the history of christianity. Any recs, /lit/

>>6690241
The Confessions of St. Augustine

>>6689708
That shit has been deconstructed more times than I can count. Weber, at this point, is just an academic punching bag for postmodernists.

>>6690241
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDIpgAH6Tvc

>>6690241
"A History of Christianity", Diarmaid MacCulloch

>>6689671

Wouldn't A Pilgrim's Progress be more appropriate for Protestantism in relation to The Brothers Karamazov and The Divine Comedy?

I thought these comparisons belonged in /pol. Osteen is a joke and only the weakest Protestants pay any attention to him. Have some self-respect for your own argument.

All the more progressive off-shoots off religion are just getting closer and closer to atheism. You people yourselves don't really want to be religious in the first place.

>>6690378
Osteen is the richest pastor alive and in charge of the largest Protestant congregation in the world. He's the biggest thing to happen to Protestantism since Billy Graham.

>>6690384
tell me more oh enlightened atheist

>>6690396
John Milbank says the same thing, that's why he says liberalism is losing relevance in Christian theology and debate, which is why it is time for orthodoxy to step up to the plate and take its place in the conflict with fundamentalism.

>>6690384

You've clearly never heard of the Charismatics or Pentecostals.

>>6690419
Those are the fundamentalist wing, not the liberal wing. They aren't "progressive"

>>6689671
Also Paradise Lost >>>>>>>> The Brothers Karamazov

Joel Osteen is not Protestant, hes non denominational. I doubt he even knows what Calvinism is.

>>6690241
covers all the abrahamic religions from inception to the 1960s

>>6690241
Gospels and book of Acts

>>6690475
Non-denominational is just baptists who think being a baptist is default for a Christian.

>>6689671
Why?

>>6690241

From what perspective? Do you only want to read about Orthodox Christianity, or are you interested in learning about all the various heresies that popped up in the first few hundred years - Marcionism, Gnosticism, Arianism, etc.?

>>6690490
No it isn't
Non denominational means non denominational

>>6690502
Non-denominational still has a credo as proclaimed by the pastor of the congregation, and it's almost always baptist. I doubt there is a single non-denominational congregation which does infant baptisms.

>>6690313

most def.

>>6690518
So? Non denominational still simply means non denominational. Doesn't matter if pastors misrepresent it
Regardless, Joel Osteen's teachings don't reflect any particular denomination anyway. Other than prosperity of course

>>6690384
>catholicism
>eastern orthodoxy
>progressive

>>6690502
I just came from some non-denominational service. Lots of singing, dancing, getting in the spirit. Crying with hands up. Pretty Baptist imo.

No central "minister" to speak of. More like a group of people who were just hyping a crowd up like a typical rock/hip-hop concert but all the marks of baptism is definitely there.

>>6690535
>every single non-denominational congregation follows baptist doctrine
>but it doesn't matter, the term still means they don't have a denomination
It's just a bullshit term invented to make them seem like truer Christians. There is no such thing as "non-denominational" congregations apart from Quakers, and even many of them are denominational.

>>6690564
>>every single non-denominational congregation follows baptist doctrine
>You've met every single non-denom pastor

>>6689659
Stay mad Roman.

This is now a Protestantism thread.

>>6690573
Show me a single non-denominational, U.S. congregation that allows infant baptism. A link would be fine.

>>6690578
>he literally stayed in the religion he was born into

>>6689659
I hate Protestantism, but Paradise Lost is my favorite piece of literature.

Everything about it is so overwhelmingly wonderful.
>>6690384
Hence why you avoid progressive Christianity.

>>6690578
The Church of Denmark is, or was, practically Catholic, just without the Pope. Even John Milbank considers Kierkegaard a generally orthodox thinker and the throwback to pre-Scholastic theology.

>>6690578
ABRAHAM LMAO

>>6690581
What would that one topic prove? infant baptism isn't even hinted in the bible, of course any pastor worth his weight isn't going to preach it

How about you show me a single congregation that on the record adheres to every single aspect of baptist doctrine? You say every single one, so should be easy for you

> Sola Scriptura

>>6690607
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_solae

>>6690582
>he literally rejects his own culture

>>6690602
Any pastor worth his weight knows that New Testament was a product of the Church and Scared Tradition, not the other way around.

Lakewood Church adheres to literally every single consistent Baptist doctrine.

>>6690602
>What would that one topic prove? infant baptism isn't even hinted in the bible, of course any pastor worth his weight isn't going to preach it
Oh, COME ON. God's old covenant was sealed with circumcision, he didn't require adulthood for that, did he? When Christ says don't hold back the little children (literally "infants" in Greek), it's clear God doesn't want infants held back from the covenant. The idea that infants couldn't get into the covenant is a very confused heresy.

>>6690622
>he believes in something because he was born into it and that makes it intrinsically correct

>>6689671
Anglicanism isn't really protestant.

>>6690482
Pentecostal pls go.

>>6690671
True, but Milton wasn't really Anglican.

>>6690670
>implying I didn't go through a rebellious atheist stage
>implying I didn't investigate Eastern religions

>>6690696
Not thoroughly enough apparently.

>>6690269
And if postmodernism had any value, that might matter.

>>6689659

Joel Osteen isn't representative of all protestants and many denounce him for not even using the Bible. It skims over Anglicanism and Lutheranism.Also, are you using protestant as an umbrella term for non-Catholic? Not every denomination has or recognizes roots in the Reformation.

>>6689659
>prosperity gospel does not equal Protestantism
Read Ross Douthat's "Bad Religion" for an interesting insight into the heresy of Joel Olsteen

>>6690589
What does the Church of Denmark have to do with Kierkegaard?

>>6691008
Quite a bit, seeing as how Kierkegaard faulted it for not being orthodox enough, rather than for it not being Protestant enough.

Fixed, brothers of the same feather flock together. I think I know who made this thread

>>6691018
Explain

>>6691072
Goethe was hardly a protestant

>>6690636
>Lakewood Church adheres to literally every single consistent Baptist doctrine.
Citation needed
I've never heard any theological teaching from Joel

>>6691072
John Calvin is the best representative of Prot I can think of
Besides Jesus and the apostles

>>6690589
>fideist
>practically Catholic

rio jej, you papist cunts will perform any kind of mental gymnastics to avoid accepting that Protestantism is true and your idol worship is an affront to the word of God

>>6691096
Baptists tend to be very suspicious of theology. Most doctrine is not theology, though, don't conflate the two.

The site has their doctrines mentioned throughout it

>Once you make a decision for Christ, we encourage you to take that next step of faith and follow in believer’s baptism. The water itself is not special, but a demonstration that you no longer are your old self; you have been buried, and now resurrected in Christ and walk in His power, purpose and love.
For this we can see that the congregation rejects infant baptism, and that they do not consider baptism to be a sacrament. Pretty core baptist stuff right there

>>6691109
Also from their site

>We believe water baptism is a symbol of the cleansing power of the blood of Christ and a testimony to our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

>We believe in the regular taking of Communion as an act of remembering what the Lord Jesus did for us on the cross.
Indicates that they also do not consider communion to be a sacrament, very Baptist. Lutherans, Presbyterians and Methodists, for instance, all consider both baptism and communion to be sacraments

>>6690241
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG55ErfdaeY

>>6691099
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Declaration_on_the_Doctrine_of_Justification

Furthermore, I don't think the Church of Denmark was ever fideist, since they only incorporated Luther's catechism into their doctrine.

>>6691072
Yeah...no. Goethe as an example of an protestant author is pretty wrong. Just because the Faust has religious themes doesn´t make it a religous text.

>>6691130
The Church of Denmark was explicitely pietist at one point and Moravians were welcomed by the Danish king, their colony now some kind of Unesco site or whatever
See >>6691099, you papist cunt.

>>6691178
I'm not a papist, I'm Anglo-Catholic, the Church of Denmark is in full communion with my Church :^)

Don't conflate politics with doctrine

>>6691130
Kierkegaard was a fideist.

>>6691179
You're still wrong then, you Anglo-Not-Really-Catholic cunt

>>6689659
>le dank catholic maymayer
>le corrupt curch selling letters of indulgence

>>6689659
There's Paradise Lost, but, as people are saying in the thread, it is an anglican poem.

But the thing is protestantism doesn't really like pictural arts. This makes narratives problematic to them.

They don't have any problem with music, though. So there's Bach,

>>6691194
I'm guessing you don't know what "catholic" even means. All Lutherans consider themselves catholic, just not Roman Catholic.

>>6691259
Milton was a fucking puritan, not a high-church crypto-Catholic Anglican.

>>6691259
Milton wasn't Anglican, he was super Protestant.

If you're going to go for an Anglican epic poem, the closest thing is The Faerie Queene

>>6690269
>Weber, at this point, is just an academic punching bag for postmodernists.
I wouldn't say he's 'just' that, considering that obsessive postmodernists are the only ones who use him as a punching bag.

>>6691275
Don't go confusing Anglo-Catholics with Anglo-Papists. There's nothing "crypto" about Anglo-Catholics being Catholic, we ask the Virgin Mary for intercession, affirm transubstantiation and so on. But we don't consider the Pope as our the head of our Church. Whereas Anglo-Papists do, they just disagree with what that authority entails, hence why they aren't Roman Catholics.

>>6690481
I'm currently reading Titans of History by Montefiore, he's pretty cool.

People make fun of me for being autistic about micro-subgenres of metal, but you Christfags are honestly rivaling it.

>>6691325
It's nihilism and new age bullshit all the same

protestantism is civilization though. Unless you consider span to be civilized.

>>6689671
It's just a poor copy of The Divine Comedy so it really represents protestantism

>>6690279
B A S E D
A
R
R
O
N

>>6691348
How the heck is it a copy of the Divine Comedy?

>>6689659
It could be almost any other Dostoeyevsky book because they're all the same