/lit/ - Literature

bad. I feel like everything I write is shit, probably because it is

>>6325647

Fail to plan, plan to fail my friend.

I'm thinking about cashing in on my good looks instead

Does anybody else here actually intend to pursue legit publishment?

I'm 23 now and ideally I'd like to be able to get something published before I'm 27, but the fantasy market is more than a little saturated. I need to figure out in the next few years how to flesh my stories out in a way that really sets me apart.

How do you guys really go about getting inside of your character's skin?

>>6325678
just look at what everyone else is doing and do the complete opposite

I'll start writing when I feel like I have something to say. Otherwise I'd just be adding to the noise.

>>6325644
Today I'm gonna start that novel
Just like every day...

>>6325702
Not a problem when your MC is a thinly-veiled insert of yourself, and no one else's character is every really explored.

If it can work for Murakami, it can work for you.

>>6325740

I actually try not to read too many works of fantasy because I know the overwhelming majority are horrifically terrible and I don't want them tainting me.

Have you guys ever thought about what name you would publish under? Would it be your full name or initials?

My first name is pretty androgynous but I expect I'd probably use initials just to be safe, but then E. White is pretty close to E. B. White...

>>6325762

kek

Pretty darn well. I'm having a good time of it. Finally starting to look past myself and just write whatever feels best and most enjoyable. Then I can go back and refine it with a more critical eye.

Everything I write has improved remarkably since I've adapted this mindset of not thinking while I do it, weirdly enough.

>>6325771

>since I've adapted this mindset of not thinking while I do it, weirdly enough

That actually sounds like pretty good advice. I guess you're really writing for the heart instead of your head.

>>6325767
on the pen-name, i say just go with it. hell, title your first novel The Elements of StyI(capital i)e, and rake in them misclick dollars. you might even become a meme artist, like tao lin or classic paul dano.

>>6325782
To some extent, yeah. It just feels better to do.

Also, I got my first short story publication after adapting this, so I figure I must be doing something right.

It's like the more you think about what you write, the less honest it becomes. The less honest a piece is, the less worth it has. If there's none of you in your writing, you won't want to write it, and the publisher won't want to read it. They look less for great prose and more for great souls.

>>6325644
It was going well for a few days and then Dota 2 stuck it's addicting cock into my perpetually vulnerable asshole and I'm still riding.

Am I the only one who just likes reading and hasn't even considered writing?

>>6325824

In a world of almost 8 billion humans, obviously no, you're not the only one.

George Orwell’s famous six rules for writing:

>Never use a metaphor, simile, or other figure of speech which you are used to seeing in print.

>Never use a long word where a short one will do.

>If it is possible to cut a word out, always cut it out.

>Never use the passive where you can use the active.

>Never use a foreign phrase, a scientific word, or a jargon word if you can think of an everyday English equivalent.

>Break any of these rules sooner than say anything outright barbarous.

Not good.

Does anybody else here feel that they may have the talent to create something that could potentially become a best seller, but the scale by which you would have draw and plan things out seems dauntingly terrifying?

Something I realised that drew me towards specific pieces of literature was the sheer size and complexity contained within them the texts, but as always there's a fine line between driving to flesh out your creations and completely over-saturating your world to the point where it becomes tired and mundane.

Bump.

very well. finishing up a short story that im submitting to a competition. its a little abstruse but im happy with the writing.

>>6325830

I know

>>6326152

Good job.

>>6325644
I get through about 1,000 words/one scene a day.

Considering that I'm working full-time and going to school, I'm alright with this pace.

When starting work on a project does anybody else like to keep logs of all their details for everything included in their world so that they have something to fall back on/consult when it starts to become too expansive?

idk if this is normal when it comes to writing as a lot of people still work in longhand.

>>6325860
And in the same essay Orwell say that it's likely he'd broken these rules at some point, and he certainly did. I agree with most of them, but honestly I like some word variety too, so I don't mind exotic words. (Who would tell a painter to only use primary colors, for example.) If you were to follow Orwell's rules you would end up with, I don't know, Hemingway's writing style I suppose.

Is there anyone else here who is primarily interested in writing non-fiction?

>>6326246
it seems like one level up from procrastinating. Why don't you just write?

I've been steadily filling in the outline to my more favored project. I've got a couple sample chapters done, pretty excited for what the outcome may be.

>twenty fifteen
>not using Scrivener

>>6326271

I can't write shit if I don't have a plan in mind. I need details and descriptions of the characters within, the environment they exist in, personalities, temperaments, details, details, details.

idk, I don't think I am procrastinating, I just like to be thorough.
I've read so many books where because the author failed in proper planning there were plotholes and retcon out the wazoo, which degrades the text overall and I don't want to be that kind of writer, but I can't remember every little detail in my head alone, I need to get it down.

God. I've been mixing scotch with tea all night and I have to pee every few minutes it feels like.

My lazy ass hasn't gotten around to actually writing a story I've had in my mind for years, but does anybody happen to know a good timeline maker so I can keep track of things i have planned for it?

>>6326358

Its called MS word.

>>6325830
>almost 8 bill
nigga it is like 7.3, your 'almost' is fucked up

On Chapter 15. Doing well, hope to get to +40,000 words, as well as be done by December this year.

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10815441/1/CIA-Rises

>>6325860
>George Orwell's famous six rules for writing like George Orwell

Quite okay. Doing some outlining for now while I research the war-related stuff I want to read and create based on. Pretty fun and laid-back, feels like I'm doing something worthwhile.

Not too good. I used to be able to write a simple story in a month no problem. Now it's taken me a week just to edit a couple of average-sized chapters. My poor brain feels like an overheated toaster. Is that normal or should I go to a doctor?

>>6326608

try amphetamine or modafinil

>>6325644
FINE, I'll get out of bed.

>>6326969
see
>>6326961

Yesterday I managed to write a bit more than a thousand words when I usually struggle to write 400.
Feels good man.

So just what exactly IS everybody writing about?
What's your genre?
Do you feel you have a strong enough plot?
Are your characters as well fleshed out as they could be?

>>6327423
The protagonist goes through a dissociative fugue, the reader finds out only in the end.
Psychological novel, I guess
Yes
No

>>6326961
>modafinil
>Mental (psychiatric) symptoms, including: depression, feeling anxious, sensing things that are not really there, increase in activity (mania), thoughts of suicide, aggression, other mental problems.
>sensing things that are not really there

Is this sentence properly written: "When there's will, there's time"?

I don't think it's incorrect, but makes me feel like it could sound better.

>>6327423
thanks for asking!

right now, among the things I feel I could expand I have:
>A black humor dysfunctional family reunion short story
>Light novel trash (that I feel could get easily published by a specialized editorial and feels tempting to just get a contract, any, before turning 25) that mixes action and comedy in a urban fantasy setting with a big cast of characters.
>two short chapters of something about a girl going to school and a shitty teacher, maybe gonna steal a bit of boogiepop phantom
around 2000 daily words but I'm not really getting anywhere with that

>>6327442
Please.

>>6327442

I think "Where there is will, there is time" sounds better.

>>6326266
philosophy grad student, reporting in

>>6327423

Fantasy/adventure genre set in an alternate reality where forms of magic, once previously respected and revered has been usurped by the worship of technological advancement.
Magic users, now reviled as blasphemous to the new world order, have since been driven to the point of assumed extinction, the source of their power thought to have finally died out hundreds of years ago.

It's cliché as fuck but I'm having a wild time drafting everything.

Creating entirely new worlds with historical figures and religions and politics is arduous but fun; it feels like I'm weaving a tapestry, thread by thread by thread.

>>6327667

Also I'm kind of scared because I know for a fact that something like this has probably been done in some form or another by some author I've never head of.
I mean it's fantasy, originality in it's purest form is extremely difficult to stumble upon at this point. All I can hope for is that I plot it well enough for it to stand out amongst the rest.

Fantasy is still largely pleb tier, but I have fun writing it.

>At a sauntering pace he moved forward with the oscillating, up-and-down motion of a merry-go-round. A mild knee injury was causing a subtle terry fox-esque limp in his gait. His old joints felt the consequence of every impact. Left, right, left he went, on and on and on.

Have I finally described someone running in a /lit/ approved fashion?

>>6327699

Include a reference to the Iliad and you'll be there friend.

You're gonna make it.

>>6327718
Can you help? I didn't start with the Greeks

How to go about avoiding clichés in your work when they're the most logical/apt work?

>>6325798
>tfw know that feel

>>6327676
>what is Arcanum?
I bet you also make fun of 'STEM nerds'

>>6328620

I am a STEM nerd.

How do you guys go about conjuring up names for characters and locations?

Do you make them up on the fly or put a bit of research behind their meaning or attribute foreign influences?

Not a lot of writers on /lit/ huh?
I remember this place being a lot more active at one point. I guess it's true, 4chan really is on it's way out.

Decently. I'm 50,000 something words into what I'm tentatively planning to be the first in a series of episodic short stories. It's proceeding at a snail's pace and I already want to go back and do some rewrites of certain scenes, but it's coming along.

>>6329252

What's the genre/theme and how many characters have you established?

>>6325644
wrote short piece for video (below) earlier. May just be SB rip-off.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xT-u_6tOSwo&feature=youtu.be

>>6327442

When there is a will there will be time.

Sometimes a poetic one-liner hits me as I'm walking and I stop walking and comtemplate the fact that I'm a fucking genius.

>>6329186

> writers on /lit/

If you read through a post your writing thread you'd know none of these aspiring 'writers' are writers at all, because none of them can write. The ones who can aren't going to stick around when outnumbered by the lowest common denominator.

>>6327433
>In the United States military, modafinil has been approved for use on certain Air Force missions, and it is being investigated for other uses.[74] As of November 2012, modafinil is the only drug approved by the Air Force as a "go pill" for fatigue management.[75] The use of dextroamphetamine (a.k.a., Dexedrine) is no longer approved.[75] One study of helicopter pilots suggested that 600 mg of modafinil given in three doses can be used to keep pilots alert and maintain their accuracy at pre-deprivation levels for 40 hours without sleep;[76] however, significant levels of nausea and vertigo were observed. A second helicopter study found modafinil was comparable to dextroamphetamine and was well-tolerated.[77] Another study of fighter pilots showed that modafinil given in three divided 100 mg doses sustained the flight control accuracy of sleep-deprived F-117 pilots to within about 27 percent of baseline levels for 37 hours, without any considerable side effects.[78] In an 88-hour sleep loss study of simulated military grounds operations, 400 mg/day doses were mildly helpful at maintaining alertness and performance of subjects compared to placebo, but the researchers concluded that this dose was not high enough to compensate for most of the effects of complete sleep loss.[79] In law enforcement, tactical paramedics in Maryland (US) may administer 200 mg of modafinil once daily in order to "enhance alertness / concentration" and "facilitate functioning with limited rest periods."[80]

>>6326266
Dis
Study social and political science
Would like to write pop-anthopology, leftist politics books and short stories.

Novel's still on the backburner but the research for it is plodding along steadily. Not exactly banging out the short stories either but I'm definitely writing more and better, less contrived ones now. I'm also writing significantly more and better poetry than I have in the past. I think it helps a lot that's I'm getting feedback from irl friends about my work, some of it is really great and it's extremely encouraging. I'm grateful to know these people.

>>6327645
>>6329491
Thank you both.

>>6330988

Yw.

>>6325644
Terribly, been getting drunk often to try to forget a woman. Writing has nothing to do with said woman, yet I feel compelled to write about the bitch as a release. But, by doing that I start thinking about her and the cycle continues so I'm avoiding writing for now.

>>6329491
This happens to me all the fucking time, I will often stop what I'm doing in public to write something down. Except then I remember that I'm a lazy bastard and never realize the potential of my one-liners, so they sit unread and undeveloped on shoddy pieces of machinery that could fail at any moment.

Yet, I jerk it to futa daily and fuck my responsibilities harder than a belligerent step dad while blissfully ignoring the impact of my apathy until I'm in a dreary sleep deprived state when it's too late to make any progress regardless.

Anyone else?

>>6325644
Haven't done anything for my PhD all weekend. I don't feel bad about it really, because it wouldn't really help me that much in my day job.

Very bad, my brain has decided it wants to write poetry instead of prose.
I know very little about poetry.

>>6329491

Addendum: When there is a will there will be time still.

Now you are truly welcome.

>>6331380
The best way to forget a woman is to turn her into literature.

>>6331583

>tfw fallen in love with my stories initial secondary antagonist
>a fictional fucking character

Oh god I've become a trope.

>>6331591

>the best way to forget a woman is to turn her into literature
>immortalise her in ink this will definitely help

>>6325702

Schizophrenia. Nah...I ain't /x/. What I want to say is you can, from time to time, in your everyday activities, assume the persona of your character in going about them (hopefully, he's not a mass murderer, right?). I'm not suggesting you go full weirdo, alienate your friends and force the institutions to get involved, but I'm suggesting you try to at least adopt your character's trail of thought, his manner and composure. If, for example, your character is the kind who'd go exploring on a whim because he/she is just that much free spirited then take that detour and go check out that unrelated thing- especially if it's something they would like.

The reverse process I use is to try to put my characters into situations that are a bit closer to my everyday life in form of practice writing. Choose a sort of setting that's somehow memorable to you personally, a setting in which you know exactly how YOU would feel (your old high school, an outing with your friends, your office) and place your character in it, inventing through his dialogues and monologues how he would feel (which is obviously different from you, though there are, of course, some similarities that make things easier)
Basically, you should do a bit of what your character would wanna do and you should make them do what you would wanna do. It's a good way of getting closer to them.

>>6331596
More like exorcise her with ink and make her yours forever, transcend her initial state so far and hard the real Jessica will never be this beautiful again but in your rituals

>>6331596
Worked for Hemingway

>>6325644
I got a massive boner writing a kind of sex scene

felt good man

rarely write, very affected when I do. don't have a voice & can't make one, every path's a dead end

Tfw have to OD on caffeine before I feel like writing anything. What drugs do you guys use?

>>6332580
It's always good when you can get aroused by your own work.

The last time that happened to me, I was writing my main character having a violent fantasy about killing her best friend. That was a weird boner, let me tell you.

>>6332585
caffeine & sad music. works every time

>>6332585
cigs

>>6332587

I had a dank induced dream of being my character and going out of my project building to take a shit in an outhouse of his urban dystopian shithole. And he wanted to record that process with a camera and sell it online for some reason. That's how I learned my long forgotten MC was, apart from being a sociopath, a raging narcissistic homo.

Also an extremely weird an surreal boner.

>>6332585

Trust the ancient ones (by ancient I mean not so ancient frenchies): booze helps (if consumed to the point where you can still type)

Other than that: weed is good for coming up with stuff but terrible for writing it down- just my experience. You can throw your motivation, concentration and syntax out the window.

>>6325644
Doing ok, OP. Mostly editing

>tfw I set out to write some goofy grimdark military sf
>tfw I keep reading history books and wanting to make it deeper
>tfw I can't write a paragraph without thinking 'huh I wonder how that would work logistically and if it has any parallels with herp a der

it is full blown autism

>>6332637
No, it's natural to think about that sort of thing if you're an avid reader.

Just do what you can handle. Don't go Full Wolfe if you can't really nail it.

>>6332652

I need to stop sitting around daydreaming about shit and just put something down I guess, it doesn't matter how smug I feel for grounding things in reality if I never write it

>>6332674
>I need to stop sitting around daydreaming about shit and just put something down I guess

Ah...the nub of all our issues

Don't worry, we'll get to it. You will too.

>>6332674
That sounds like a good idea. Remember that you never just puke a finished work, so you'll be able to add all the deatils you want after you get the general thing worked out.

>>6332696

that's part of it I suppose, I keep trying to take on all this stuff and come up with perfect connections in advance, but I started off just trying to write something fun and atmospheric. Getting mired in detail is stupid

>>6332686
Sometimes that tiny nub becomes a huge nuisance.

>>6332740
you're getting me horny anon

>>6325644

It's not.

>>6332747

I'll address anyone's nub for a fiver

Why do you think I'm here?

>>6325644
I gave up writing about 9 months ago, and I can honestly say it's the most liberating thing I've ever done for myself, letting go of the delusion of becoming a famous writer. I swear, it's like my life is coming back to me and I can accept the mediocrity that was bestowed on me at birth by my plebeian parents and I really feel ok watching T.V. and popular movies.

>>6332765
You should be shot in the face, cut into tiny pieces and fed to your mother.
NEVER EVER EVER GIVE UP

>>6332765
same thing happened to me with making music, i sold all my music gear and music theory books and realized i'm just not really interested in making music after all and it's time to stop pretending, giving up on your dreams is a key step to becoming an adult...ever wonder why famous musicians and writers and shit are such douches? because they never reached this stage of development due to their dream "coming true"

>>6332753

You reminded me of this one time I decided to put in "tenner" in a British corpus for unofficial meme-related research,

All the results were related to prostitution.
You damn sick brits sure love the pissflaps of your cheap whores.

I'm trying to write a spooky ghost story but I'm just not feeling it at all. I need to get on with it because a friend with connections can get it published if it's any good.

>>6332765

it's a shame you gave up for that reason. I don't delude myself that I'll ever get more than a few tolerant comments from friends, let alone famous. I still love it just because it's fun.

>>6332783
>a friend with connections can get it published


I'll address your friend's nub for a publishing

>>6332771
there's nothing worse than some old fuck deluding himself that he's really a famous rockstar/artists/writer, it's almost as embarrassing as the local sports hero who still lives in high school even though he's 45, same thing except at least the high school football hero fucked some hot chicks back in the day, you don't even have that

>>6332765

hm this is like the hbo show girls where the main character gets accepted to iowa after 4 seasons but then drops out and quits being a writer to be happy

:\

idk... I'll give it four more years (until 25)

>>6332784
>a few tolerant comments from friends

Why the hell would institutionalized elitist recognition and mediocre economic success ever be more satisfying and fulfilling than just having your friends say: "Wow, that's a damn good story, anon."

Of course I'm not talking about false encouragements. I hope we can all tell the difference.

>>6332799
half-hearted comments from your friends don't pay the rent

>>6332791
Yeah but you're not the tenth of the writer I am. (Stewie griffin voice)
"How's that novel you're working on? Hmm? Still trying to write the great all American novel? Got some exciting dynamics in there for your main character? Some friends become enemies? Some enemies become allies?"

>>6332805

Neither does being a "full time" writer.
Jesus, ever heard of Moslow's pyramid of self-realization? Apply that shit to economics and your lifestyle.

You can only work on your dream once you've cemented a future for yourself in case that dream fails. Yeah, it's hindering and it sucks but it's the only way to go about it in this society.

>>6332797
>wanting to be happy

You're a worthless weakling if you give in anon. I can guarantee you're pathetic and stupid as well.

>>6332822
That's why it's called chasing a dream. If they were easy to catch everyone would have theirs.

>>6332799

I didn't mean to do down the stuff that really matters, like just having someone say 'yeah send me more when it's done' and mean it. But realistically I'd be even more happy if I had that and a little recognition, just a little. That's not mindless hunger for fame.

>>6332822
>Moslow
you mean Maslow? retard...

Also, to reach "self actualization" you have to meet your "love needs" first so if you subscribe to that heirarchy a little virgin beta faggot like you ain't gonna make it past the most basic level

(protip: maslow's heirarchy is fucking stupid and conflates various physical needs like air and water to love and esteem, which it should be obvious, is stupid)

>>6332835

Yeah. Awesome. But my misspelling and you being a dick don't change the fact that people should get a job/education that allows you to get a job before pursuing a full time occupation as writers.

>>6332823

>projecting this hard

kek

imagine someone ur age wanting to be a singer or a nba player

>Go to write.
>Get a small amount done.
>Remember high-school and how every time I tried to do anything I was mocked by everyone who spoke to me.
>Remember that the constant stream of disapproval crushed me so much that I can only begin writing in absolute secrecy and cannot admit to having any goals out of a fear of hostility.
>Remember they're all successful and I'm still living in my parents house because the only job I can get is 9 hours a week being paid until the table for below minimum wage.
>Remember I can never accomplish everything.
The motivation to write is gone but at least I get surge of motivation to lie down and feel horrible.

Very good, I'm yanking my pee pee while writing about my characters having sex right now

>>6325678
Yes. Even if I write the biggest piece of shit the world has ever seen I will publish it. I'm determined now. I will not leave this world without leaving behind a shitty little book with my smug fucking face on the inside cover.

Does anybody else get themselves to dream about their stories in order to harvest ideas and inspiration?

I swear the best material comes to me when I'm unconscious.

>>6333219

That's the spirit anon.
That's the way.

All of you faggots that are already giving up take note.

>>6332765
>>6332778
>>6332784
>>6332799
>>6332805
>>6332822
>>6332831
>>6332835
>>6332859
>>>>>>>caring what people think of your writing


>>>>>>>not doing what you love


>>>>>doing something for fame or money
>>>>>>>pretending you had a passion from literature when you gave up because no one noticing you
>>>>>>>>>Requiring self validation from others and not from within
lmaooo

>>6333939

Nothing wrong with writing for fame and money if you believe you've got what it takes.

Nothing sadder than a secret genius who never bothers to capitalise on their talent and potentially deprives the world of something great.

>>6333988
>Nothing wrong with writing for fame and money


>wanting to write for other peoples validation
>wanting to write in order to gain social status
>Nothing sadder than a secret genius who never bothers to capitalise on their talent and potentially deprives the world of something great.

>implying you owe the world anything

lmao

>>6325678
I'm trying for it.

I got one book finished that I'm trying to get published, about halfway through the first draft of another.

I got about 4 rejects so far. It's not really that big of a deal to me, any successful author will tell you about how many times they were rejected when they first started out.

For one, i realized i have no idea how to write a query letter. So anymore all i do is study how to do it. There really is an art to it. The best piece of advice i got from a published author was: Imagine you're trying to explain your story to a ADHD 10 year old.

My advice, read EVERYTHING on queryshark. I remember i browsed around it when i first started writing queries but i thought it was bullshit, now I know, as dumb as it is, they definitely know how to write a query.

>>6333163
sometimes lying down and feeling horrible is great, i'm looking forward to do doing later tonight

>>6334136
Queryshark is great for getting into the mind of an agent.

I've read queries on there that i thought was the dumbest, cheapest, easiest fucking trick ever, but then that agent just creamed his/her jeans and wrote "SEND ME THE MANUSCRIPT!"

I heard that one slusher who comes on here sometimes who said "There's no bad ideas, just bad execution". That really is true in publishing, there's mountains of great books that will never be published because the author refuses to play the game. And there's tons of terrible books that get published because the authors know how to present it.

"So I have been hanging out down by the train's depot. No, I don't ride.
I just sit and watch the people there. And they remind me of wind up cars in motion.
The way they spin and turn and jockey for positions.
And I want to scream out that it all is nonsense.
All your lives one track, can't you see it's pointless?
But then, my knees give under me. My head feels weak and
suddenly it is clear to see that it is not them but me, who has lost my self-identity.
As I hide behind these books I read, while scribbling my poetry,
like art could save a wretch like me, with some ideal ideology that no one can hope to achieve.
And I am never real; it is just a sketch of me.
And everything I made is trite and cheap and a waste of paint, of tape, of time."