/lit/ - Literature

>>6262005
It's as valid as anything else in Christianity.

>>6262005
Your understanding of it is probably infantile.

>>6262012
Reason then asks: why not get rid of it altogether then?

>>6262005
Nah, it's one of the more obviously true doctrines.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annihilationism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Universalism

No one here knows what they're talking about.

>>6262019
>>6262048
Are you religious? Be honest.

>>6262005
It is not
the concept of hell isnt a christian invention but fear is a magical device that can turn anyone into a sheep
fear is the greatest weakness of human race

>>6262052
Are you irreligious? Be honest.

>>6262012

I'll concede that... but upon closer reading of the old testament, the idea of Hell never existed to them nor would it have made sense in the logic of that universe.

Disobey and God would literally kill you himself but God keeps making covenants and he grows as a more empathetic character as the Old Testament goes along.
Jesus' death is clearly a promise that he has your back no matter what and that he won't murder your ass himself. Ever. It's all good.

But because noone need fear Gods wrath anymore... there was no "punishment" to fear. So Hell was invented to still threaten people in Gods place but absolve God of responsibility because if God was sending people to Hell himself, Jesus' Death would have been a trick and an Hypocrisy..

>>6262063
Without fear nothing would be accomplished. You call that a weakness? Plus cut out the sheepshit. You aren't an "enlightened individual" you are as full of folly as the rest of man and the fallen angels hate all of us.

>>6262063

>2015
>not fearing everlasting alienation from the Almighty.

Ah, ye poor benighted heathen.

>>6262085
kinda weak bait tbh

>>6262065
But agnosticism is more reasonable than theism.

>>6262101
No bait here. Also please explain your position in an original and coherent manner. I'm all for a "civil" discussion. Shitstorms bore me.

If God is so smart, then why do you fart?

>>6262109
>Humanity and its musings
>Reasonable
Pick one. Only a supreme intelligence can display true reason that humanity cannot grasp. So place your faith in that Being and through a communion gain true knowledge, wisdom, and enlightenment. We're all lost in about the cosmos here anon.

>>6262130
Sick rhyming mang, ball's deep, ba;;s' deep!

>>6262020

Reason is not Truth. I could reason that there is a small chance there's someone watching me masturbate through my window but until I actually look... every thought about it is only a very educated guess but a guess none the less.

Personally, I see God as just a word for a system of being. No God entities exist outside of existence.

>>6262144
>44
nice
but this is a sincere question

>>6262130
As a firm reminder that it's an exit, not an entrance.

#StopGayMarriage
#AdamAndEveNotAdamAndSteve
#420yoloswag

>>6262166
dang...

There is no "Hell" with a capital H. It's not a place. There's no Hell mentioned in the Bible. Hell just a concept of not being a apart of the existence beyond the universe's definition of life.


You want into this realm? You cant just "believe" in it. Cant be innocent of all crimes, because earthly crimes do not matter, although its pretty uncommon a mass murdered or some shit will make it there.


The only way to get there is to "get right" with the supposed ruler of the said realm beyond death, who will be referred to as God. Yeah, God shows empathy towards humans. He created life, he rules in the realms after life, so he does have some feelings toward life forms, humans included. However, what he really...really....really prefers is life forms that are well aware enough to acknowledge him and want to be with him.
To the early Christians, refusal to acknowledge him and then to die, was like a hell. You had the chance and blew it. Your life is over. That's it. Just blackness. The Christians life is over, but the Christian exist in a realm beyond death and life.

>>6262085
when fear failed to cause the end of the world during the cold war
or when instrumented fear make you hate someone you never met
yep i call that a weakness

im tired af so pls dont be bothered by the simplicity of my args

>>6262005
umm op you DO know that heretics go to HELL, right?? im gona have ta tip my fedora at u

>>6262141
>dismantling reason with reason
>placing reason on some scalar value by which you can measure one as greater than another
>being this vulgar on the internet

Disgusting

>>6262180
No when fear made possible the survival of the human race. When fear of the unknown yields discovery and fear of death yields a productive life.

>>6262184
Vulgar? Truth hurts baby. It also sets you free.

>>6262189
Fear of death doesn't lead to a productive life. One can sit on their ass all day, contemplating and fearing death.


Productivity is simply the desire to be better, do better, create something better. It doesn't come from fear. It just comes from...that desire.
The most productive person in the world may not even think of death. Death may be an afterthought, as long as he keeps improving.

>>6262005
I donno.

...

Hey, will we ever have flying cars, think?

>>6262005
how will you frighten people into believing whatever you say without Hell?

>>6262189
thats all the difference between a weakness and a fault
And now that the world is fully explored and the fortresses fully built, whats left ?
now we fear what we've been told to fear
Of course there is legitimate fears, but we drowned it in an ocean of
>buy a gun or niggers will rape you're daugter
>buy that pimple cream or ppls wont fuck you
>or you're with us or you're with the terrorist

>>6262218
Sharp pointed fallacious rhetoric posted en masse over the Internet could work, it's certainly built up Atheism's cause.

>>6262005
you can ask SATAN HIMSELF when you see him

i'm sure he will have a VERY thorough answer :-)

>>6262207
The brevity and finality of life gives us an urgency to live to our potential, to give each day our all because it might be our last. Carpe Diem, Memento Mori and all that good stuff. Its interesting, your posts reflect a lot about you as a person. You might want to gain a different perspective. To fulfill our potential we must be constantly evolving, changing our views. Lack of movement, motivation is as bad as death. You quit moving in life, you're dying. You are on borrowed time. From the moment you are born. How does this make you feel?

>>6262228
>Sharp pointed fallacious rhetoric

oh you mean like a Bible?

>Will Christianity ever dispose of the idea of Hell? It's so fucking stupid...
It's not stupid at all. It's a brilliant idea: "Become a member of our global corporation or we promise that you will be tortured for eternity in a lake of fire."

That is probably the best marketing gimmick ever conceived. Imagine if apple could do that, could say, "If you don't buy the new iphone6, we promise that you will be tortured for eternity in a lake of fire."

In marketing, the promise of reward and pleasure is so weak compared to the threat of punishment and pain, but only governments and religions can get away with that approach. Christianity needs it too. I doubt they could continue to recruit members with the promise of heaven alone.

>>6262226
Who says it all ends here? Do you really think we as humans have reached our fullest potential? Have you? Ghandi and Sartre had some interesting things to say about mankind and change.

>>6262215
>Hey, will we ever have flying cars
There are already six different companies selling road legal flying cars.

>>6262267
>Ghandi
pagan
>Satre
atheist
Neither of them will be very happy at the Last Judgement :-)

>>6262245
life is brief ??? compared to what ?
you says his post reflect his personality but what about you ?
do we really have to be productive now that we're 7billions ? can't some of us just sit and watch the sun slowly rise and set ?

>>6262267
wow you're taking the subject on another debate
all I say is for us (rich country inhabitants) the primitives fears such as "will I be alive tonight ?" or "will I eat and drink enough to survive ?" are pretty much dead
what should we fear now ? Just tell me

>>6262275
>Not acknowledging the infinite mercy of God
>Condemning people to hell
God is love and guess what. Hell might be not as full as you think it is. Maybe its a lonely, desolate place. Where Satan and his minions exist outside of the Joy of God's presence. Even Satan has a chance at forgiveness. But he probably would not seek it due to pride. God knows that we all have a chance of salvation and is counting on us. Don't get it twisted.

>>6262296
>love and mercy
H E R E T I C

>>6262276
Compared to the existence of the universe, to eternity.

>>6262295
The indifference of mankind for one. You're scaring the shit out of me for that reason.

>>6262005
Heaven and Earth shall pass away but Christ's words shall never pass away:


The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

- Matthew 13:41-42

>>6262296
God touched me in a naughty place.

>>6262314
Hey, thanks for posting that image!
I had lost it, and was going to use it to demonstrate that the film "End of Evangelion" was unoriginal hack work.
Now that I have it again, I can do that!
So, thanks.

>>6262306
which are two things absolutly uncomparable

dont get the god complex

>>6262325
You're welcome.

>>6262326
>dont get the god complex
Who do I look like? Kanye West? Bono?

>>6262325
>"End of Evangelion" was unoriginal hack work.
How even?

>>6262313
The concept of "indifference of mankind" is blur as fuck to me
first, indifference of what ?

>>6262340
Oh I forgot one that /lit/ loves apparently Russell Brand.

>>6262340
well comparing a human life with the universe' age is an absolute nonsense to me

>>6262343
Exhibited by mankind to his fellow man and his environment in general.

The thing is: we're deterministic beings. And really as "beings" we aren't individuals set apart from the rest of the universe. Having free-will would make us gods. Therefore, we are the mere puppets with the giant hand of ideology stuck up our anus. We are voices, actions and matter to abstract ideas (good, evil, lame, cool, funny, intelligent, etc.). When people are sent to Hell, it is the totality of their beings (which was ultimately, a hellish thing). It is a separation of the good from the bad, like that of the separation of the surface of the Deep with the Heavens, or the Firmament with the surface of the Deep. It's not Hitler in Hell as we know him. It's not little boy Hitler or man Hitler or old man Hitler. It's all and everything that Hitler was (which, by assumption, was a bad thing). After 1000 years, Hitler wouldn't be a saint in Hell. His true nature would simply become more and more revealed with the passing of time, as the eternity of suffering overtook him and he went even more insane, and unable to control it or accept his place, his anger and sinfulness only progress more and more, every year becoming more dark, more vengeful, more pleasure-seeking. In Heaven, being in the complete presence of God, the saved souls will progressively become more and more holy as they live with God, are in tune with God, seek his Spirit, learn more, become more a part of him and lose the few parts of their sinful humanity. This will continue until they become as godly as possible and essentially become parts of the Whole which is God and the Hell-bound souls become tied to the Whole, the totality which is Hell. There is no distinguishing of "person" from "setting." There are only 2 things in the universe--both are places, creatures and ideas. They are also actions: to do good, to do bad, to rejoice, to suffer. They are Nouns and Verbs: the totality of All.

>>6262314
Makes me think if I read The Bible I can steal an idea for my very own so, so very original magnus opus myself.

>>6262342
Much of the film's visuals and narrative can be found in earlier material.
It still works as an elaboration on Anno's mental state at the time and could be considered a good movie, but it's not the astoundingly original creative masterpiece that /a/ would have you believe.

>>6262314
Fanaticism isn't eternal mate
Christianity can die out relatively easy given the proper conditions

>>6262357
okay so sadly thats what I understood in the first place
how is that even slightly related to my previous posts ?

>>6262369
>tfw people have been saying variations of this for over two millennia

>>6262369
So can the "us vs. them" mentality. I'd rather see that go first.

>>6262375
and it's been actually happening for the past two centuries

>>6262368
>works as an elaboration on Anno's mental state at the time
How this any indicator of quality?

>Much of the film's visuals and narrative can be found in earlier material.
I'm not quite following, mind exemplifying?

>not the astoundingly original creative masterpiece that /a/ would have you believe.
Would you say anything of the TV series is original?

>>6262381
Whatever helps you sleep at night.

>>6262381
There are more Christians in the world than ever. More people of faith in general, actually.

>>6262251
>sharp pointed
naw
>rhetoric
doesn't necessarily try to prove a point, it's more aphoristic in the sense that it uses metaphors and allegories to portray divine truth, without any argument. It's important to remember that the Bible is a religious text, and not a philosophical one, so most truths in it are found to be either self evident through the metaphysics of the religion or proven through logic by the likes of Aquinas.

>>6262374
Just food for thought. We all exhibit it at one time or another.

>>6262389
Accept Satan faggot.

>>6262390
And they're pretty much all uneducated niggers or favela dwellers. There are more people than ever. Your retarded cult is dying in the west and there is nothing you can do about it. There are entire television shows dedicated to mocking you. Stay mad.

>>6262398
How old are you?

>>6262389
>>6262401
Why are you not even hiding that you are participating in a cross-board raid?
Is /lit/ this poorly moderated?

>>6262389
but he is right you have to be a fool for not recognize that christianity lost 90% of his influence over the last centuries
think about how fucking powerfull it was 500years ago

>>6262400
>dat impotent frustration

>>6262405
I am a fool.

>>6262401
24. You don't really have the right to ask that since I was just shitposting in response to your shitpost, bub. It's a fact that the percentages of religious people have been going down over the last 2 centuries, you can't deny that in earnest, no matter what you tell yourself.

>>6262409
Oh man that Teresa of Avila is kawaii as fuck.

>>6262409
>anime
teenagers please go, this is an adult discussion
>>6262405
*he tips his fedora at u*

>>6262400
funny how you ended by "stay mad" while you just posted the most edgy/mad comment of the thread

>>6262400
You seem upset. You also want him to be upset? Why are you so angry that you wish others the same anger. It is a poison flowing through your veins. Instead of wanting unity, you wish to tear humanity apart. Instead of love, you spread hate. Why are you taking the easy route instead of changing the world for the better?

God: OK, let's tally up the points anon. You posted the fedora meme two hundred and fifty six times, and received it twenty times. Two hundred and fifty six minus twenty is a positive number. Welcome to Heaven!

>>6262414
At one time, there was only 12 of us.

>>6262417
>complaining about anime
>on 4chan

>>6262400
Please recommend me some of these shows satiring the god fearing (serious).

>>6262423
AMEN

a life free of hate is the hardest but the most beautiful thing to acheive

>>6262428
Imagine when there were zero. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVg2EJvvlF8

>>6262428
Whom are you quoting, my dear cross-boarding friend?

>>6262438
Keep imagining.

>>6262440
>not using meme arrows
>Anno Domini MMXV

>>6262446

>>6262449

>>6262428
well 11 because Judas kinda fucked it up
and jesus was more into bar mitzva and cut penis

>>6262446
>>>/pol/
That's where your Christianity belongs [denomination is irrelevant].

>>6262457
Were you quoting Jesus? That didn't really sound like something he would say.

>>6262460
Did Jezus ever cut a foreskin himself?! I need to know this.

>>6262465
Why are you being so intolerant of that anon?

>>6262465
Christianity belongs everywhere.

>>6262466
>66
(i'm quoting you're post number)
nice 1 guy

>>6262467
Do you ask if he was cut or if he did cut other dudes ?
>yes and IDK

>>6262377
>us vs them
>dying out
You do know that it's an inherent part of human nature right? That's not something you can get rid of, it doesn't work that way.
>>6262375
>over two millennia
You wish your pagan trophy system was that old heretic

>>6262467
No, that would have been done by one of the Pharisees.

>>6262470
If hypothetically I had the power to destroy all religious persons I would without a doubt, now if this is enough for me to get labelled as "intolerant" then so be it.

IF GOD'S SO NICE, WHY WON'T HE SAVE PEOPLE AFTER THEY DIE??

>>6262479
>You wish your pagan trophy system was that old heretic

Christ's ministry began two millennia ago.

>nuh uh de Romans made it all up! it was a big conspiracy by Saul of Tarsus!

>>6262480
more likely yes

Isnt Jesus foreskin relic acutally a thing ?

>>6262485
Because they didn't want to be saved.

>>6262465
Actually Christianity is split on /pol/
95% of the people who champion it are only doing so to continue the counterculture that the board is founded upon.
Pic is quite explanatory

>>6262489
that gif is confusing me, both by itself and the intent of your post

>>6262005
If there is salvation there must be something not-salvation. I am more partial to a Hinduism rebirth and reroll than a climactic finality found in Christianity, but it does still have its appeal.

>>6262492
WELL I'M SURE THEY WILL NOW
SO HOW ABOUT IT?

>>6262484
I wouldnt say intolerent
edgy kid seem to be more suitable

>>6262493

>>6262495
Study the Scriptures.

>>6262484
That's too bad. Maybe one day you'll be a hit at parties and gregarious. Just joking. But seriously. religious people love you, even if you don't return that love. Jesus loves you too and of course God. He's your biggest fan and wants you to love your fellow man. He wants you to go to Heaven.

>>6262503
If wanting a better world for all of us labeling me as as "edgy kid' is a small price to pay.

>>6262507
So why did he make Hell in the first place?

>>6262507
I want the Lord to jizz all over my face.

>>6262507
and I love all the loving peoples

end of the thread

>>6262509
Satan had to go somewhere.

>>6262514
Why not just destroy him entirely?

>>6262517
God is merciful.

>>6262509
So Satan and his minions can have their own place. They lost the joys of being in his presence, but they can regain them. See>>6262296

>>6262517
God doesn't really blot things out of existence.

One might even make the argument that God CAN'T destroy, or rather, not that he can't, but it is simply not in his nature to do so.

>>6262489
Christianity as a belief system didn't exist until the First Council of Nicaea technically as up until that point there were no concrete rules as christians almost always held somewhat different beliefs depending on who was preaching to them and where exactly they were located. But if you really want to get technical it was an established religion in the Levant at around 50AD but was still a cult until around 200AD which was when being called a christian meant you believed the same thing as any christian anywhere else in the world which is how you classify a religion.
Christianity is not two thousand years old so stop trying to pass it off as such, dogma doesn't even dictate this so why are you?

>>6262504
Initial creation wasn't a containment board but a way to have discussion without having /b/ shit all in threads

>>6262508
Just misguided then.

>>6262532
I could repeat the same gimmick all over again every time, let's call it a day.

>>6262528
Where does it say in the Bible that God in unwilling to destroy?

>>6262533
Fair enough.

>>6262531
That wasn't me, but by the >>>/pol/ I meant all unwelcomed opinions/beliefs should stay there, that was my joke.

>>6262529
>Christianity as a belief system didn't exist until the First Council of Nicaea technically

To you, Christianity is just another religion that was "started" at Nicaea. To Christians, Christianity began with Christ Himself and His apostles. We're on two completely different wavelengths.

>>6262522
Merciful my eye
>Tell everyone you create that you love them all equally
>Some of them think you're being a dick
>You tell them to shut the fuck up and submit
>One of them says no and grabs like minded people to try and fight back against your iron fist cuz that ain't love
>You win
>Send the originator to a dark place where your discarded creations reside when they die
>Make sure to tell your new minions that he was just an evil dick who hated creation
Sure, benevolent

15 3 2 13
9 10 11 8
5 6 7 12
4 18 14 1

>>6262541
Just as the "Father of all Lies" (Satan)/would want you to believe. Paradise Lost was a work of Creative Fiction BTW. Lucifer isn't a tragic hero.

>>6262541
Who are you to judge the Almighty? How can a finite being judge an Infinite Being? Do you often judge others without having all the information? Or do you think you know as much as God does?

>>6262423
>>6262421
>blunt facts and words I don't like = mad
>NOUNOUNOUNOU
>obviously way too invested in this

Hahaha. Your retarded cult is still a dying mockery. Stay mad.

guys it's ok, you'll get into heaven so long as you never leave any doubles unchecked.

>>6262539
No
a religion is an established belief system with rules and faith based assumptions of life
Jesus saying a few words of wisdom and people taking them to heart doesn't make it a religion
Fuck even the Jews aren't that arrogant, they establish when their people first existed and then establish when their religion was founded.
Not when the first time a jew talked to god
You can be indoctrinated all you want and even though religion and logic can't exist at the same time you CAN use logic to weed out blatant bullshit

>>6262552
Bill Maher isn't a scholarly or credible source.

>>6262429
Moral Orel.

http://www.adultswim.com/videos/moral-orel/love/

I suppose really there are more movies than shows, though. This one isn't an autistic random mess like most of adult swim's stuff though, its claymated and the episodes have thought put into them.

>>6262554
Like I said, we're on two completely different wavelengths. Christianity is more than a religion, it's the truth.

>>6262564
It's also an alter boy delivery system.

>>6262537
understood, a thousand apologies
>>6262549
Actually he is because the part of Lucifer being a horrible demon of pure evil is a work of fiction thought up by zealots from Italy in the fifteenth century
Hell being bad wasn't even a thing until Dante's Inferno
You can go by the bible, but when you start to talk about things being works of fiction most of your religion falls apart since the renaissance saw a large portion of what is now considered canon in christianity made up by religious nuts

>>6262568
>Hell being bad wasn't even a thing until Dante's Inferno

Bullshit. Jesus mentions a realm of punishment for sinners.

>>6262551
I know nothing
I have been told however that such actions existed(this information supposedly came from people who wrote down god's instruction word for word)
And henceforth I can judge based only on those portrayals of sed actions.
IF the bible does tell truth(which it doesn't) based on it's information God is very much so a massive cunt and did wrong by Lucifer
It is not wrong to question your own god, free will and our infinite questioning is supposedly a gift that should not be squandered so say he.
Anyone who tells you they are too great to be analyzed simply wishes not to be seen for what they truly are

>>6262577
>word for word
>oh god take all of my keks

>>6262568
>Hell being bad wasn't even a thing until Dante's Inferno
No he just made a solid system of tortures and levels of it. The idea of hell as a bad place predates The Divine Comedy. You are using some loaded language that is unscholarly also and makes it hard for me to take your positions seriously.

>>6262577
You aren't questioning, you're judging which is your prerogative but it is God's prerogative to hold you accountable for your judgements.

>>6262577
>based on it's information God is very much so a massive cunt

dropped

The flight plan I just filed with God lists Me, my men, my mum Mary here, but only some of you. Now, first ones to pray get to join me in salvation!

>>6262587
If you feel the inflicted area you will see that it isn't a painful feeling but a truthful one.

>>6262589
God only wants 1 percenters.

>>6262574
Doesn't call it hell either
And by what jesus supposedly said that would just mean a place that wasn't heaven
If heaven were real the worst hting that could ever happen to you would not be torture for eternity by fire
It would be knowing that for the rest of existence you would not be in heaven but in a place filled with other undeserving people reflecting on their lives and unable to join in the kingdom of god.
The whole Dante Inferno dichotomy insisted that hellfire pains those under it's flame and never get used to it's infliction of pain so that the body never becomes numb to it and it is always a fresh wound.
You would never have the time to reflect on knowing that you are stuck in hell forever because you would be too focused on pain
Hell, were it real is a dark place where you sit and reflect on your life over and over filled with the grief of knowing you can never see god or any of your loved ones ever again.
Remember, from everything we are told of god he favors mental torture over all other methods

>>6262561
Being alive is, and anecdotal evidence is the only reason you are indoctrinated in the first place. Stay mad /pol/.

>>6262589
Christ?

>>6262594
>but a truthful one.

hahah somehow you've convinced yourself of this without reading a word of scripture

>>6262595
A third angel followed them and said in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives its mark on their forehead or on their hand, 10they, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever. There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.” 12This calls for patient endurance on the part of the people of God who keep his commands and remain faithful to Jesus.

>>6262596
>It was then anon knew he was talking to a person showing a lack of coherent thought, possible a stark raving lunatic. Thus anon left the thread. This madman had thought of the false victory.

>>6262601
>6262601
I've read about a quarter of that holy toilet paper crap, most likely more than you.

Unfalsifiable nonsense.

>>6262258
Do you think the Vatican has a marketing team?

"I'm telling you, Francis, we need more brimstone this year. Our competitors are really heavy on the 99 virgin thing this season and we are loosing clients. We need to counter with very liberal views on fagots while jacking up the damnation for heathens..."

>>6262612
No but there must be a Fedora marketing team.

>>6262612
it just spontaneously happened over the course of centuries :^o

>>6262612
Yes, actually, they want attendance, and they want their tv views.

>>6262609
i doubt it since all your individual study and insight amounts to no more than the "god is a cunt" meme. that and you think lucifer gave man free will lmfao

>>6262580
>Implying type of speech cannot be taken seriously simply because of how it's conveyed
Also hell was thought to be a bad place but the idea of torture and hellfire didn't exist until The Divine Comedy
>>6262585
God doesn't have a prerogative, he does whatever the fuck he wants
and judgment is a natural destination for questioning. Unless your questions go unanswered you always judge in the end
Regardless of how fucked up your theology is the christian people were given by their creator the ability to question their world and existence therefore it is to be done with any and all and god is no different.
Remember, god does not require love but obedience, as long as you follow the rules he will love you, you can certainly be indifferent to him and still be accepted into heaven(see every pagan ever who never did any wrong and was ignorant of christinanity even existing because of location)
If he didn't want to be questioned and judged you would have not the capacity for either. Your limitation of it is your own fallacy created by monarchs to keep themselves from judgment as well.

>free will
this does not exist

>>6262619
>wrong
>i don't believe in free will
>i haven't even said enough for you to be saying some of that
>weak trolling is now obvious
>good day faggot-chan

>also the bible is nothing but a fucking meme in merit
>so it's very fitting, eh, eh ,eh?

>>6262627
>i dont believe in free will
you sure dont believe in correct greentexting, right?

>>6262109
wtf agnosticism means acknowledging that theism might be true

>>6262627
Who exactly are you quoting?

>>6262627
>god is a cunt :^)

>>6262612
>Do you think the Vatican has a marketing team?
The Vatican have a huge marketing team. The Pope even hired ex-fox news journalist, Greg Burke as his personal PR agent.

>>6262630
yes sir, no sir, i'm not sure sir

>>6262631
more like acknowledging it may not be false

>>6262632
not you

>>6262606
That's punishment for worshiping Satan
Not hell
Last I checked you don't go to hell for worshiping Satan you go for being a shit person or not following the rules
>>6262619
The person you're responding to didn't say that
I called God a cunt
and by all accounts if you stop acting like a 3 year old and read the bible you would see that god is a dick a shit ton of times.
Ignoring that just means that you aren't being a true believer because you are ignoring the true word of god and his actions

>>6262608
But you obviously are still posting. Too bad about your little outburst. Cult's still dying though. I can tell you're going to remain mad, but stay mad :^)

>>6262622
So your agreeing with me now after I called you on your b.s. ok then.
Also look at this
http://www.fallacyfiles.org/loadword.html

>>6262400
you know anon the bible probably isnt correct but you could be wrong too...

>hell exists
>therefore god exists
damn

>>6262647
tfw the whole Bible is based on a fallacy
kek

>>6262647
to which of my responses are you referring?

>>6262650
religious logic revolves around the idea that god exists and it's for this reason i cannot take most of their opinions without a grain of salt. Whatever the argument may be, going into it without a good basis of logical understanding should be enough to make me sceptical of all religious people's thoughts and OPINIONS.

>>6262641
that's the only thing close to hell in the bible

> if you stop acting like a 3 year old and read the bible

which you haven't done. you haven't read the bible and you do not understand it's message. so you see isolated incidents that you interpret through a liberal humanist lens and you call god a dick consequently. but there is nothing that he has done that gives you cause to curse him with the very air he gave you

>>6262664
All religion is an opinion since none of it has ever been proven
Ergo all religious debate is to be scrutinized for lacking support of fact

>>6262648
I'm not an atheist, or even really an agnostic and christianity doesn't have a 50/50 shot just because muh agnosticism in any case.

>>6262686
i'm not implying it's a 50/50 shot, i'm just saying it MIGHT be on to something, even if its specific interpretation of god or creation is incorrect. what i was saying besides that is that maybe we should just acknowledge that human interpretation isnt probably isnt objective and that we really have no idea where we actually came from outside of magical assumptions (and yes the big bang/singularity theory fits here too)

>>6262668
No, jesus specifically says there is a place for sinners(ie: hell)
I have read most of it(I refuse to read the Gospel of John)
And what I speak of is not isolated incidents
The entire bible is pretty much a chronicle of why not to like god in any way.
It tells with explicit detail how he demands that any and all do exactly as he says or else he will banish them to an existence of utter horror.
he also constantly manipulates people to do his bidding and then tells them it was for their own good, the list goes on and on and on.
If you took all the things god did and pointed to a person and said they had done all of those things you would hate him with a fervor unlike any other. You would call them the most hateful of words and treat him with nothing but distaste.
But as soon as it's your "lord and savior", he's a perfect entity that mustn't be questioned and does nothing but good for the people he has created.

>>6262708
Don't take the fun out of it

>>6262005
i guess the idea of burning forever or any other human torture is a p stupid idea of an afterlife punishment. if hell or something like it is real its probably worse than anyone can comprehend

>>6262712
satan pls

>>6262712
>No, jesus specifically says there is a place for sinners(ie: hell)

where?

>If you took all the things god did and pointed to a person and said they had done all of those things you would hate him

> incidents that you interpret through a liberal humanist lens
> incidents that you interpret through a liberal humanist lens
> incidents that you interpret through a liberal humanist lens

and you ignore the good he has done. you value the lives of sinners who have died over the life of god

>>6262721
Desert retards knew what fire was and how bad it hurt, they were told they would experience that but a million times worse.
Classic way for religious nuts to convert followers
>appear smarter than the common rabble
>tell them that if you don't listen to my god bad things will happen
>given them a tangible equivalent that is quite painful
>fuck that I don't like fire I'll do what you say
Direst farmers aren't all too bright

>>6262741
its not like anyone knew anything anyway, might as well go with it.

kinda reminds me of this new-age atheism shit

>>6262342
Ask /m/ and they can name off dozens of anime Anno ripped off. Thinking Evangelion is original and interesting is like thinking Eragon is unique and a literary first. In other words, fucking retarded and revealing of how shallow one is.

>>6262544
wut wut wut
i am not a robot

>>6262708
Religion trolls all of us on a daily basis, the unfortunate ones experience it first hand, and the ones which get the brunt indirectly are even poorer souls.

>>6262005
http://www.theguardian.com/news/2014/nov/26/-sp-my-life-in-hell

already heading that direction

>>6262760
even jesus spoke against religion

>>6262750
So can you summarise or must I suck my thumb and move on? I'm not a fan per say just curious.

>>6262544
>44
that's all I need ,-)

>>6262740
>Life of god
a being without measure that cannot stop existing does not live it merely is
That is not life, life has a beginning and an end, therefore since god has neither he does not live
Also repeating the same thing over and over like it has any actual meaning just shows how close to your ancient farmer brethren you truly are
Take a man, force him to murder his son to prove his worth, and then at the last moment stop him and say nah you're all good you proved you could.
That would mentally break any father.
It doesn't matter where you come from or who you are or what you believe. That is a horrible thing to do.
Also murdering people for being people doesn't change no matter what good you do, you still murdered innocent people.
The fact that you have to justify all the fucked up things god did proves that he was a shit person

>>6262766
it literally doesn't matter. japan doesn't put much emphasis on artistic innovation really

>>6262764
That man has a flute up his arse, and i'm betting it was God's work.

/thread

will "checking dubs" SAVE you on the DAY of HOLY JUDGEMENT?!?!!??!?!?!?!??!??!?

>>6262245
>>The brevity and finality of life
typical slogan from a hedonist-wannabe

>>6262747
New Age atheism is what happens when you give children knowledge but without any guidance whatsoever
The sad thing is atheist means lack of spirituality, yet there is now a church of atheism
It's like the word racist I swear, ever evolving for the needs and agendas of others

>>6262785
Trips or higher. Check mine for validation of the truth I speak brethren.

>>6262779
that is one fancy man

>>6262790

>>6262794
>794
further proof that POST NUMBERS are signs from the COLD, EMPTY, GODLESS universe of the inter-net

>>6262773
>a being without measure that cannot stop existing does not live it merely is

i guess that's why he's referred to as a 'living god' all the time in the same bible that you supposedly read a lot of.

>That is not life, life has a beginning and an end

because you say so? this is some high schooler speculation from someone who is not well read in philosophy

>like it has any actual meaning

it has no meaning to you so that's why you literally just tried to give examples of something i was pointing out are terrible examples? you interpreting the actions of god through a liberal humanist perspective?

>It doesn't matter where you come from or who you are or what you believe. That is a horrible thing to do.

really?

again, because you say so?

>you still murdered innocent people.

innocent? see this is where you're fucking up. you don't understand that sin had entered the human race. the human race is guilty of sin and it is inescapable, except if you are jesus i.e. god himself

>The fact that you have to justify all the fucked up things god did

you're the one assuming they're all innocent. maybe you just skim read the old testament

so basically i can come to the conclusion that you actually didn't read the bible or if you did you failed to pick up on key information and all you can offer is your own personal (incorrect) interpretation that you have based your entire criticism on. do you lack the self-awareness to measure your knowledge against the outside world? or did you just not read the bible?

>>6262811
>personal (incorrect) interpretation
Incorrect because it goes against your own assessment of your skylord?
And yes life has a beginning and an end
Why? Because if you are going to suggest that sed statement is false you are going into philosophical territory which is something you cannot do because philosophy has done only two things with the god question
Come to a stalemate
and prove it's not real
You cannot aptly apply logic or a philosophical approach to christianity because it is the antithesis of both.
>this is some high schooler speculation
Notice how you have result to insulting me because you lack any credible input.

>earnest discussion about which forms of unfalsifiable nonsense are best
wow

>>6262853
>Incorrect because it goes against your own assessment of your skylord?

incorrect because it fails to acknowledge the passages in the bible that would have prevented you from sharing your dumb opinion for how wrong it is if you had actually read them

>Why? Because if you are going to suggest that sed statement is false you are going into philosophical territory

that's not a reason m8

>Notice how you have result to insulting me

fucin bants m8 how does it work

>>6262484
Are you 16?

Are you a recent atheist convert? Because you know converts make the best zealots

>217 posts
>30 IPs
gay mother of SHIT

>>6262905

good lord

>>6262549
How can we tell only with the Bible that God is actually good? What if he is actually lying and want us to think all of those things? We have no way to know the truth. The only answer here is "because god said" which is not a valid one and "have faith", which does not solve a thing.

>>6263037

Fundamentalists put their faith in the scripture as much as they place it in God.

>>6262901
I love how twice I've been asked my age because I would want to change the world for the better. A world without religion is for the better, fact. Getting rid of religion would make the world a batter place, fact. Now what is the next logical step for creating a better world in the future? Guess.

Next you're gonna call the leaders of past in the Soviet Union "kids" too. Stop being so naive, really.

the only solution is to kill every single human being.

>>6263092

That means jackshit. I could have faith that Satan was tricked into all of this and that God is in fact a mind controlling demon. Does that convince you?

>>6263115
Hardly.
Also we could just re-educate them.
I was just hyperboying back there, you know.
Sure I'd kill a few IF IT WAS WORTH IT. But that's in practice isn't often the case and killing people might actually have th epolar opposite effect in some cases.

All I was saying is yes I'd get rid of religion if I could, that's all. AND intolerance isn't inherently a bad thing, far from it, we're intolerant of racism (generally) so why would religion be such a step away. ...

>>6263146
no, every living thing has to die
it's the only way

>>6263148
okay. let's gas the lot. we'll start with the californians.

/lit/ - Christian Memes

>>6262750
I suppose Ulysses isn't a literary first?

>>6263121
what in scripture says god is a mind-controlling demon?

>>6262471
>white Jesus
Embarassing

>>6262643
If it is getting more popular every year how can it be dying?

>>6263431
Because infant morality is falling and ignorant babies are the main area of recruitment.

>>6263417
>some idiots actually think they know how a particular man looked 2000 years ago based on speculation

>>6263444
So it isn't dying? How can it be dying and having exponential growth at the same time?

>>6263417
People from the Levant can look pretty white, especially back then

>>6263446
His mother was Jewish and he lived in the Middle East, it'd be pretty fucking ridiculous if he looked remotely WASPish

>>6263449
Population explosions, of microbes etc, typically helps to either destroy or severely curtail the next generation of microbes. Their success in one generation will be harmful to the next, due to things like destroying the environment in which they thrived. Trees have a growth spurt when you destroy the rootstock, a last gasp before death. There are lots of ways dying can be proceeded by growth.

Christianity might be growing but it definitely isn't exponential growth. Also the quality of growth should be considered. Many christians don't regard other people who declare themselves christian as truely christian. Well they will include them when trying to show how big christianity is and then exclude them at all other times.

>>6263455
It's not even important how he really looked. Every church has its own depiction. He is Asian in China, no one cares for historical correctness.

Jesus looked like Bin-Laden.

>>6263481
Yeah, I'm not against the practice tbh. I just find it galling when Christians shit furiously on brown and Jewish ppl without seeing any apparent contradiction

>>6262005
>We are as forlorn as children lost in the woods. When you stand in front of me and look at me, what do you know of the griefs that are in me and what do I know of yours. And if I were to cast myself down before you and weep and tell you, what more would you know about me than you know about Hell when someone tells you it is hot and dreadful? For that reason alone we human beings ought to stand before one another as reverently, as reflectively, as lovingly, as we would before the entrance to Hell.

>>6262400
>entire television shows dedicated to mocking you
>early christians endured persecution, ghettoisation, torture, execution and genocide, as well as Augustan satire
>modern christians belong to institutions millions strong, literal armies of christ in every single walk of life and social and economic sector with impossible to ignore political influence, with heads of state in America, UK, Germany and many other civilised nations
>entire television shows
>entire
>television shows
Plosive guffaw out loud.

>>6263735
you're a joke my man

>>6262554
Yeah I'm sorry man but I'm going to have to disagree, Islam emerges when the prophet Mohammed first begins preaching, but the actual practices of Islam were not solidified and practiced by all Muslims until a few years after his death. For pagan religions too, we do not make the distinction of an established religious authority existing as necessary to identifying the faith. Christianity's rules and faith based assumptions are and were as consistently changing as any other faith, and from the earliest years after Christ's life beliefs central to Christianity and not Judaism mark out Christians with sacred rules and a unique faith. (and it was recognised as such by Rome) Why should Christianity be the only religion which requires a formal council to be declared an official religion?

>>6262141
Wait how do you even know reason is Reason, and that only a can ascertain it? What is this True Reason? And if you call humanity unreasonable, then how in the hell have we ascertained and realized a god through nothing but "faith" and assumed it correct? If you really think we're capable of that than it'd be contradictory to assume humanity is not incredibly reasonable and powerful beyond our limits.

>>6263113
>"batter"
>pro-commie
>making claims about something you can't experiment with
>side steps question

What even fucking are you? The atheist version of a Creationist? Get the fuck out

>>6262400
>he hasn't found happiness yet

Guys we should really help...

>heaven exists
>therefore hell exists
whoa

Hell = being away from God.

Lakes of fire is a heretic protestant belief.

>>6263930
Read Augustine fag.

>>6263930
>Lakes of fire is a heretic protestant belief.

And hell and death were cast into the pool of fire. This is the second death.

And whosoever was not found written in the book of life, was cast into the pool of fire.

- Revelation 20:14-15

You were saying?

>>6263957
>>6263960
>reading the bible literally
That's heretic talk.

I'll play the devil's advocate:

What if hell is just a metaphor for some kind of disgraced mental state that comes from not following Christ? Say, for example, we follow the protestant interpretation of salvation. In that case, "hell" may be that condition where the person who rejects Jesus experiences the wrath of God that Jesus saved his followers from. The daily shame, guilt, agony, etc of such a person's existence would be their "eternal torment."

>>6263971
kek so true

>>6263982
That's literally the Catholic interpretation of Hell.

>>6263971
The Bible and the Church say the lake of fire exist. You say it doesn't.

Bible and Church > You

>>6263991
No, Hell is a physical place where the bodies of the damned will be physically tortured for eternity.

t. St. Augustine

>>6263992
The Church also killed a guy because he said the earth was round and orbits the son.

See >>6263971 for how not to read Bible.

>>6263999
Thanks for the tip, but I trust St. Augustine more than some anon on 4chan.

>>6263999
>999
thassa guud trypull

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_hell#Hell_as_a_place_or_a_state

Nobody knows.

>>6263992

Lmao the church has made up a lot of shit in the past. I would be wary of being led astray by the words of men.

>>6264016
Are you sure you're a Catholic?

>>6264003
Try reason it yourself for a change fellow anon. Also I bet you don't even know how that guy got to that point or if it was even logically valid. So much bias with them religious folk, why even argue I ask myself.

>>6264005
Check 'em good baby.

>>6264017

What does that have to do with the church (or the individuals within, however you want to describe it) making shit up and running with it?

>>6264018
>Try reason it yourself

The Bible says it exist and a Doctor of the Church says it exists, I have faith in both of those authorities and therefore I believe it exists. Why do you presume to lecture me about my own religion?

>>6264019
He wants you to share the same blind bias as him. Submit now.

and then there's always this faggot >>6262048

>>6264019
If you're a Catholic, you believe what St. Augustine wrote because he has the authority of the Church.

I don't think you're actually a Catholic. . .

>>6262005
Nothing will ever get rid of hell. It's eternal.

>>6264027
And you must be a catholic, because you take the uninspired writings of catholics over the inspired Word of God.

>>6264040
>>6263960

>>6263930
No clue why you think God is in the Lake of Fire.

Ironically, most catholics will find to their horror that salvation is not, and never was, a corporate event.

>>6264027
This isn't true.

>>6264041
Exactly. It's properly in the bible and therefore true.

The catholics can be no more sure of the existence of hell than they can be of purgatory, another place the catholics invented extra-biblically.

>>6264021
Is your religion with the Church or with God? Was Augastine not a human who reasoned what he did himself? Is Augustine your prophet?

>>6264045
It's moot. Unless the person you believe is Jesus, it doesn't matter who you believe about what.

>>6264045
Yes it is.

>>6264047
Hell is not extra-biblical.

>>6263960
>>6263960

>>6264050
Augustine is a saint and one of my teachers.

Nothing he wrote contradicts what is found in Scripture.

They created hell inititally as a way to make money. Before banks, the Romach Catholic church basically said if you don't donate a portion of your income every year then you're a shitty person and you'll go to hell. And boom, here we are on 4chan

>>6264052
No, I remember specifically a pope saying that no particular author, even St. Augustine, has any doctrinal authority. Only the Church's magisterium has the authority to bind one's conscience on matters of faith and morals.

>>6264050
In the last few years of his life, realizing how influential his writings had been in the Christian church, he wrote "Retractions" a work that examined all his previous writings. He contracted a sickness and died in 430.

Just like Aquinas, the closer he got to death, the more he realized that his work was hay, stubble and straw.

>>6264052
Purgatory is extra-biblical, yet catholics believe it to be true.

That foolishness has the effect of causing catholics to not believe that hell is real, unless the same people who invented purgatory tells them it is real.

Which they do not, instead calling a physical eternal Lake of Fire "a protestant heresy".

>>6264060
Do you honestly believe that the magisterium rejects St. Augustine's teachings?

KEK

>>6264056
He had also turned against Manichaeanism and wrote against it defending the goodness of creation and "describing sin to abuse of free well."2 He also he worked against Pellagianism and taught that the grace of God is what enabled man to believe, that man was not sinless, and infant baptism was acceptable.

>infant baptism was acceptable

>>6264069
>calling a physical eternal Lake of Fire "a protestant heresy".

No. Catholicism endorses Hell as a physical place of punishment for the physical bodies of the damned. See:

>>6263995

>>6264075
Manichaenism is rightfully condemned as heresy as is Pellagianism. Man is not sinless as we inherit original sin from Adam. Are you a gnostic or something?

hi

>>6264076
It doesn't matter.

The bible says Hell is a physical place of eternal torment for the (resurrected) physical bodies of the damned.

>>6264082
>infant baptism was acceptable

>>6264096
Amen.

>>6264008
No one who relies on wiki as their authority on the afterlife knows, sure.

Most of the rest of us actually do know.

>>6264105
I'll take the One in the thorny crown.

>>6264047
>reading Revelation literally
ishygddt

>>6264116
I read the Revelation of Jesus Christ as it is meant to be read, yes. It explains itself quite well.

Of course, without the Holy Spirit to guide a person, how could you understand the least thing written therein?

>>6264115
Wise choice.

Do people believe that the creator of the universe, an being intelligent enough to create everything from DNA to the earth, to quarks to brains will punish people for not believing in one particular religion where he came down to earth as a human and sacrificed himself in a remote corner of a long dead empire? Sorry if this sounds euphoric but this belief is just silly and I don't know how any can believe it.

If there is a God its defiantly not any one that man has dreamed up.

>>6264124
Well, the artist got the sign mostly right, even if he got the cross mostly wrong. That cross wouldn't kill anyone.

>>6264125
He will punish them for many other things. You are subscribing your simplified version of justice to god.

>>6264125
All true. We really do believe that, and we really and most definitely did not dream Him up.

>>6264125
>will punish people for not believing in one particular religion.
No. God does not condemn for one. Your theology-fu is weak.

>>6264143
He does, actually. You either believe He manifested in the flesh as a man, paid the sin debt of humanity, rose from the dead, and offered salvation to all who believe, or you are lost.

>>6264161
>He does, actually. You either believe He manifested in the flesh as a man, paid the sin debt of humanity, rose from the dead, and offered salvation to all who believe, or you are lost.

That's only one fucking religion, a stupid one I might add.

>>6264121
The Holy Spirit tells you there is literally a lake of fire? Coz that's not what he tells me.

>>6264168
It's not a religion at all.

It's the unique chance to avoid paying the penalty for being born spiritually dead. If you neglect so great a salvation as the one provided by God Himself, what hope do you have?

>>6264170
Yes.

So either you do not have the Holy Spirit in you, which I strongly suspect is the case, or you are not asking Him the tough questions.

If you think you have the Holy Spirit in you because you ate crackers and drank juice, my suspicions would be confirmed.

>>6264173
And I suppose he told you this lake of fire is at the centre of the earth too. Plosive guffaw out loud.

>>6264173
>seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand

>>6264213
You're confusing Hades/Sheol with Gehenna.

There is no known location for Gehenna, nor is Hades/Sheol actually, physically, in our earth.

>>6264294
It's strange to watch this happen, isn't it?

>>6262178
As a Catholic this is pretty much what I was told by the church hierarchy while going through RCIA

>>6262414
The percentage of religious people around the world has remained stable, actually, it's just in Western Europe and North America that the overall percentage has gone down.

>>6264059
Just because it's made up doesn't mean it's fake.

>>6266432
Just because it isn't real doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.