/lit/ - Literature

switch charizard and kadabra
the USSR was the red dragon, the Nazis were the hypnotists

>>5961168
>if they existed at the same time
w-what?

Kadabra even has the SS rune on his belly. The Nazis were into the occult. This shit needs changing.

>>5961173
But the soviets were the ones with the hypnotists according to Indian Jones 4...

>>5961178
>...and were the lone superpowers.

Reading comprehension my eidelweiss.

>people actually believe the soviet were as evil as the nazis
>BELIEVING THE HOLODOMOR WAS INTENTIONAL
>literally went from serfs to cosmonauts in 50 years with way more ground to cover then everyone else
>first country with near 99 literacy.
>raised standard of living massively with comparatively few deaths when compared with the near one billion deaths caused by capitalism.
>fastest industrialization in history
>somehow an evil failure

Mfw

>>5961184
So you're reading it as if it said
>If they were the lone superpoweres at their time
Not reading is superior reading comprehension?

>>5961205
Some people think that governments operate on good and evil terms because life has to be like a saturday cartoon.

>>5961209
The and implies both are conditions that must be met. So OP isn't wrong.

However, you're right the first part is unnecessary. Because we know the first condition is assumed to be true.

>>5961205
You have to also take into account that they had to survive two major wars and restore themselves without the support of others. Which is also astonishing.

Also, what this >>5961216 anon said.

>>5961205
what country are you from?

>>5961229
>>5961229
Im glad stormfags have not infested everything good on this website yet.

>>5961209
>>5961222
"If they were the lone superpowers at their time" could mean that they were the only superpowers in their respectable eras of superiority, or it could mean at the same. I think both parts of OPs statement are valid and necessary. Also, just cus they existed at the same doesn't mean they were at the apex of their power at the same time. USSR peaked in the 1950s.

>>5961248
>implying
SSUUUPPRRIIISEEE MUTHAFUCKA!

>>5961229
Well, their dead soldiers actually made their societies more manageable, they still had to deal with food shortages that would make the american depression look like a barely slow year.

>>5961255
Those are two perfectly well written variants.
>If they were the lone super powers at their time
>If both of their apex had happened at a single point
But OP's sentence is dumb.

>>5961229
And yet every image of somewhere exposed to soviet influence has some sort of grim, decaying air about it. Perhaps that can be whittled down to Eastern European attitudes in general, yet there's something distinctively blank I found in talking to people from other historically communist nations like China. They seem more driven to itemize things before any sort of emotion, something human comes to surface.

>>5961205
>>5961229
Hitler took the fatherland from being France's crippled little bitch to the absolute technological and military and economic powerhouse of the world in barely ten years. They went from 10000% inflation and people literally starving in the streets after WWI to the most fantastic Olympic Games the world had seen in a decade.

Nazis arguably did more with less than the soviets.

>>5961267
Or you might be influenced by the pics you saw as you grew up in a country with more than 4 decades of propaganda.

The Soviets correctly diagnosed their society's social ills as originating in economic exploitation and dominance, and thus turned landless, penniless serfs and workers into poets, engineers, cosmonauts, doctors, agriculturalists, teachers, all manner of learned, literate, free-thinking persons able to unlock their potential, once they overthrew that economic system. Nazis openly stated that their only plan for fixing their problems was eternal warfare and the extermination of "non-Aryans", because that would somehow fix problems... They actually tried doing so, almost wiping out whole populations all over Europe.
In contrast, all of the death tolls aimed against socialist states have been intentionally inflated and the nature of deaths that occurred in those states were deliberately misidentified (being at the helm of the dictatorship of the proletariat gives you magical powers of weather control!) by Western counter-intelligence and bourgeois dissidents that fled into the West's mighty teets. Then, they taught their populace that denying the false charges is the same as Holocaust denial... even though Nazis recorded their disgusting campaign and left bodies. On the other hand, archive data confirms that muh Gulags weren't death camps in the slightest, that even the most fanatical Red Guard attack wasn't anything close to even Kristallnacht, and none of the many "intentional" famines were intentional, and very few were nearly as bad as claimed. Also the fact that there aren't any bodies confirming the 900 billion. No communist has ever claimed that communism has clean hands or that there haven't been mistakes or violence committed by communists, but they are categorically different.

>>5961205
BUT MY COGNITIVE DISSONANCE
THEY TOLD ME THE COMMIES WERE GOING TO STRANGLE MY DOG

There are seriously people that are still infected by Red Scare.

The Nazis said they would do bad things, and when they gained power what a surprise they did bad things.

The soviets basically said they would do good things, emancipation of the working class etc, but when they gained power they ended up doing bad things.

The Nazis were probably worse from a basic moral perspective, but the failure of 20th century communism was the bigger historical catastrophe.

>>5961270
Germany was only a military powerhouse that was highly successful at creating an efficient viking-economy (raiding other countries, taking their resources, using overt violence against locals immediately and without provocation to keep dissidence as low as possible). Even in imaginary scenarios where Hitler didn't try invading Russia and was able to more-or-less control all of Western and Central Europe, the Nazi economy would have collapse as soon as the war machine halts / stretches too thin. War Economies only work temporarily.

>>5961313
>"bad" things

I might be able to grant that "the act of overthrowing incompetent, exploitative governments and their cronies" and "genocide" are both "bad" but they're extremely different degrees of bad with the latter being unacceptable and the former being what they call "necessary evil".

>>5961305

>what's a holodomor

I'm sorry but trying to argue that the implimentation of 20th century communism never lead to genocide is willful ignorance.

>>5961368
>hurrdurr keep the red flag flyin Stalin did nothin wrong

How does it feel knowing that pure ideologists like you are what's holding back any hope we have of escaping the logic of capitalism?

>>5961305
>900 billion
Wut?

>>5961372
genocide supposes intent

>>5961395
Yes, the breadbasket of Europe simply ran out of food and starved 7 million uppity Ukrainians to death.

Thank you for clarifying comrade.

>>5961384
Literally no one said Stalin never did anything wrong.

>>5961372
>what's a holodomor
A famine like the billions of others that have happened in the Ukraine, and around the world, but this one was utilized as an attack campaign against the Soviets by the Western fascists/capitalists, even though there are famines (like the one that preceded it in the 20s) which were much worse, which is why the Western powers used older photographs from these famines and claimed they were victims from the 'holodomor'.

>>5961395
the khmer rouge was just banter

>>5961401
>huffing ideology this pure

>>5961415
>"We were never communists." - Ieng Sary

Soviets had better /lit/.

Why are there so many apologists for the soviets among libtards and former subjects? That kind of whiney "mug glorious comrade" attitude is what's keeping russia in the hands of gangsters. The German people admitted their mistakes and after the fall of the 3rd Reich they became an economic powerhouse once again. Those fucking ex soviet mongoloids are still groveling in their track suits and talking about the glory days when they had to build their cars out of motorcycle parts and stand in line for salt.

At least the Nazis were efficient, had morals, and provided a decent standard of living for their people.

Also, don't forget that the Nazis never, ever announced or admitted to the genocide. The plans for the final solution were done in secret, and the extent of the holocaust wasn't revealed until after the allies liberated the camps.

>>5961412
you're shit style goverment still falls apart with automation of the work force, not only that but has there ever been a communist country that was wholly democractic, and while we're at it has there ever been one that allowed people to speak against the state or even just the status quo?

>>5961434
>He actually thinks commies are running Russia

>>5961168
both seem pretty wretched. they were classic enemys though.

>>5961434
>At least the Nazis were efficient, had morals, and provided a decent standard of living for their people.

>>5961458
Pretty sure you misread the post.

>>5961434
>At least the Nazis were efficient, had morals
You should've stopped before this, now it's too obvious. 1/10 for effort.

>>5961168
How old are you

>>5961453

While I'm not an apologist for Communism, I will say it's completely ridiculous and moronic to ask that Communism be "wholly democratic." There has never been a "wholly democratic" state, and there never will! It's impossible. That doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it, and that doesn't mean that, indeed, Communism, whenever it has been implemented, has failed miserably to do so, but it's absurd that you put such a demand on Communism, but let Capitalist and mixed systems get away with imperfect democracy (which is the only kind that exists).

>>5961301
that's why it followed to get to know others who were actually there before traveling myself. A microcosm of this would be my poker faced Russian friends telling me they were raised to not freely smile around others, for it was considered impolite. A social quirk, perhaps, but I think it speaks a lot for the mentality of the society from which it sprouted. there's just something off about them compared to their direct western European neighbors.

>>5961412
You're bringing up Povolzhyeto defend 20th century communism? Now I've seen it all.

You know very well that wasn't just a Ukrainian famine, it mostly affected Russia and parts of Donbass. You should also know this was during the Russian civil war and Bolshevik war communism, but I'm already guessing you think a policy which involves confiscating quotas of grain from peasants had no effect on this famine.

>b-b-but western propaganda used wrong photos!! This proves Holodomor just kinda happened
Nobody is buying this.

What are you hoping to achieve through obfuscating communist atrocities? If we really want things in the west to change, we need to look seriously at why the promise of 20th century communism collapsed in the way it really did and start from the beginning again.

>>5961168
They both existed at the same time and the communists won.

Thread over.

>>5961461
>first animal rights laws
>first anti smoking laws
>alcohol use discourage
>promotion of family unit
>first nationally coordinated effort against cancer

>>5961473

HASN'T failed miserably to do so*

>>5961453
>you're shit
:)

>but has there ever been a communist country that was wholly democractic and while we're at it has there ever been one that allowed people to speak against the state or even just the status quo?
Depends on what you mean by "wholly democractic" or "speaking against the state". If you mean 100% direct democracy, the communes of Maoist China and the Soviets are pretty close to that. If you just mean largely democratic, they all were, much more-so than in the Western bourgeois states.
>he thinks he's living in democracy
Despite boogeyman accusations, criticism was allowed. Even under Big Bad Stalin. The difference is that the communists also allowed opinions contrary to the bourgeoisie.

>>5961466
I dunno the nazis did try to give the appearance of morals, it's not to far fetched that he be either deluded or an idiot.

>>5961485
>they all were
laughing_proletarian_dictators.mp3

>>5961423
>old guy says they weren’t really communists so Khmer Rouge isn't worth analysing as an adapted implimentation of Marxism
>btw capitalism caused 9/11, DRC, every modern war etc

>>5961487
Giving the appearance of morals is the same thing as promoting morals, in most ways. The clean and healthy living programs instituted by the nazis are actually still around in Germany today, along with that kind of moral mindset, and are one of then reasons Germany is still an efficient, happy country while Russia is kleptocracy in the throes of the worst heroin endemic the world has ever seen. Plus crippling rates of alcoholism.

>>5961485
>saying things like 'Big Bad Stalin'
/lit/ is not 'anti-/pol/'.
Please take your high school histories elsewhere.

>>5961478
>You're bringing up Povolzhyeto defend 20th century communism?
Are you illiterate? The point is you anti-commie robots pick and choose and manipulate your events deliberately. "Holodomor" was bad but wasn't even the worst, you just choose it because it unambiguously falls at a time when Soviets had authority.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Droughts_and_famines_in_Russia_and_the_Soviet_Union
But we all know communists control the weather!

>You should also know this was during the Russian civil war
Are you saying the 'Holodomor" didn't occur during the Soviet famine of 32-33, or that the Civil War didn't end exactly a decade before that? Ruh-roh.

>>5961502

>>5961473
Well alright, I was being a bit unreasonable to say wholly democratic, most democracies ARE either republican democracies or parliamentary, I got a little bit impassioned when I saw

>Western fascists/capitalists

having said that...

>>5961485
then please enlighten me to the many parties of modern day china or maoist china, and the many parties of soviet russia as well as it's satellite states.

>The difference is that the communists also allowed opinions contrary to the bourgeoisie.

Wow who would've thought soviet russia allowed opinions against the very group of people that marxist doctrine vows to destroy.

Lets see
Talk bad about the great leader Stalin = Death
Be born without "perfect" genetics = Labor, torture, possible medical experiments and death
One's a choice, the other you cant fix
Seems like an easy enough choice for me

>>5961205
>literally went from serfs to cosmonauts in 50 years with way more ground to cover then everyone else
Agreed, but just to add to that in case anyone wants to know more.
>Between the poverty stricken year of 1924, when Lenin died, and the relatively abundant year of 1940, the cultivated area of USSR expanded by 74 percent; grain crops increased 11 percent; coal production was multiplied by 10; steel output by 18; engineering and metal industries by 150; total national income by 10; industrial output by 24; annual capital investment by 57. During the First Five-year Plan, 51 billion rubles were invested; during the Second, 114; and during the Third, 192. Factory and office workers grew from 7,300,000 to 30,800,000 and school and college students from 7,900,000 to 36,600,000. Between 1913 and 1940, oil production increased from nine to 35 million tons; coal from 29 to 164; pig iron from 4 to 15; steel from 4 to 18; machine tools from 1000 to 48,000 units, tractors from 0 to over 500,000; harvestor combines from 0 to 153,500; electrical power output from two billion kWh to 50 billion; and the value of industrial output from 11 billion rubles to more than 100 billion by 1938.

>If the estimated volume of total industrial production in 1913 be taken as 100, the corresponding indices for 1938 are 93.2 for France; 113.3 for England, 120 United States; 131.6 for Germany, and 908.8 for the Soviet Union.

Schuman, Frederick L. Soviet Politics. New York: A.A. Knopf, 1946, p. 212

>When we consider Stalin's facts and figures, it becomes clear that we are witnessing the most concentrated economic advance ever recorded--greater even than those of the Industrial Revolution. Within 10 years a primarily feudal society had been changed into an industrialized one. And for the first time in history such an advance was due not to capitalism but to socialism.

>>5961502
Why would it be useful to analyze KR as a communist group when they said themselves they used the label to trick rural Cambodians into implementing their agrarian nationalism?
>btw capitalism caused 9/11, DRC, every modern war etc
But... but it did.

Stalinism was the worse tragedy of the 20th century because communism started with noble intentions and much like the French revolution it was usurped by terror and power-mongers.

Nazism has the biggest death toll on it's hand and is a legit evil ideology, but it was the last explosion of imperialism in an already changing world and in retrospect it have never survived very long.

All totalitarianisms collapse, however totalitarian communism was a an even bigger black mark in the history of humanity than all other totalitarianisms combined because it took Marx's genuinely uplifting philosophy and turned into terror and lies while also killing any possibility of future communism, condemning us to more decades of capitalist exploitation and destruction of human dignity.

>>5961543
Why do you think having "many parties" means having democracy, or different opinions? Is this what you see in modern Western states, especially the US? If anything the socialist single-party model employed by Soviets and China is more honest and logical, as it reflects the majority's overall view of building socialist society under socialist politics by people devoted to that socialism, though they may individually have different ideas of how to do this. Chinese or Soviet communist politics were never, ever monolithic, and consciously so.

>Wow who would've thought soviet russia allowed opinions against the very group of people that marxist doctrine vows to destroy.
To clarify, I meant that being in opposition to the bourgeois states.

>>5961545
All that AND he was easy on the eyes.

National Socialism was our only hope, because unlike Judeo-Bolshevism it was actually based on correct premises. Race is an undeniable, inescapable biological reality and if you ignore it for the sake of political correctness you are an enemy of science just as much as a flat-earther. The soil is the lifeblood of a people. It is the duty and honor of the strong to rule over the weak and to seek to strengthen themselves against their opponents. A currency should not be based on gold or silver or debt but on the labor of the people who use it. Central banks and the international finance dynasties are cancers which must be cut out of reality. The basis for society should be biological and ideological purity. That is the only way to create a truly classless society. Hail Victory, comrades!

>>5961557
>evil ideology
Heh.

>>5961557
Go to bed Leon.

>>5961557
>Stalinism was the worse tragedy of the 20th century because communism started with noble intentions

You realize that Marxism was based on gnosticism and kabbalism, right? It was Satanist bunk from the beginning. There were no noble intentions. There never were.

>Nazism has the biggest death toll on it's hand
Marxism killed 100 million people. National Socialism never started WWII.

>and is a legit evil ideology
Hahaha. Unlike Judeo-Capitalism or Judeo-Bolshevism, right?

>but it was the last explosion of imperialism in an already changing world and in retrospect it have never survived very long.
There is nothing imperialistic about National Socialism. The Third Reich sought to free the nations of Europe from the twin empires of Red Jews and Money Jews.

>>5961548

Even if Khmer Rougd consciously only used Marxism to dupe people into supporting them, even if you want to believe every failed 20 century communist regime only used Marxism as a useful lie, the fact is Marxist ideology allows for that lie to work and let people like Pol Pot to get away with it.

>but it did

Of course it did sperg, the point is you can't just focus on the nice functional examples of an ideology (though I'll admit this is in relatively short supply with economic Marxism) you need to include all of its derivations, adaptions and inconsistencies.

Comrade Stalin in this thread will keep his crusade for as long as he believes he's fighting the good fight, but really he's just as uselessly consumed by ideology as the 'anti-commie Robots' he professes to hate.

>>5961612
Goodnight Adolf.

>>5961557
Uh no marxism isn't an uplifting philosophy, it advocates totalitarianism presupposing that the guy who heads it isn't going to be a dick and just use it as an excuse to allow himself to do little to no work, and live a lavish lifestyle free from the consequences of his own actions, despite what ever hardships might happen to his own people.

It would be much easier to allow automation of the work force to happen, while instilling a love of hobbies in the group of people who are about to be unemployed tax the shit out of the people who make the most money and institute just a good ol'fashioned socialist state with out the required blood shed and sacrifice needed to form a communist regime, yeah I'm speaking in generalities but that philosophy seem a bit better able to cope with various extant imperfect democracies and until then stay capitalist, not anarcho-capitalism, no one with sense ever advocates that.

sorry for the rant

>>5961602

Nazism was an evil ideology in the context that it was based largely on the same age old stereotypes and racial hatreds of anti-antisemitism and 19th century colonialist scientific racism.

There was nothing new about Nazism, it's just old fashioned imperialism "we invade and kill you for your resources because we are of a superior race".

With Stalinism a new kind of evil emerged, the totalitarian evil of perverting truth and turning it into double speak, creating a system were no one was innocent and everyone had to suffer.

Most ignorant people think WWII was a war of ideologies but in fact it was three super powers projecting and testing their technological/scientific machinery betting on who can kill people more efficiently, the Atom bombs or the concentration camps?

That kind of war mobilization was made possible by technology, it was fueled by technology and ultimately waged to tests technologies limits in the human industrialization of killing.

Bottom line is, in war,and especially in such a war, there are no good guys and bad guys.

>>5961613

I think the fact that the USA and the CIA protected and financially sponsored the Khmer Rouge renders moot the point if Pol Pot was a "true communist".

>>5961633
>Nazism was an evil ideology in the context that it was based largely on the same age old stereotypes and racial hatreds of anti-antisemitism and 19th century colonialist scientific racism.
And that's "evil" how exactly? How can the truth be evil?

>There was nothing new about Nazism, it's just old fashioned imperialism "we invade and kill you for your resources because we are of a superior race".
The Third Reich was defending itself against foreign aggressors. It wasn't in the empire building business. Nice propaganda, though.

>Most ignorant people think WWII was a war of ideologies but in fact it was three super powers projecting and testing their technological/scientific machinery betting on who can kill people more efficiently, the Atom bombs or the concentration camps?
You actually think the purpose of the concentration camps was the kill people, and not just house potentially fifth columnists for the duration of the war? You know that all the Allies had concentration camps, too, right? They just had the luxury of being able to feed their inmates and protect them from disease, because they were winning the war.

>>5961632

Ugh you know nothing about what you are talking about.

Capitalism is never going to allow for a full automation of work because that would essentially render everyone unemployed.

When Marx advocates freedom from wage slavery , he in fact advocates menial labor to be done by machines , so that humans can involve themselves in labor they really care about, making creations that aren't taken from them by capitalists who sell them for money.

>>5961613
>Someone claims to believe in an idea, convinces people that they want to implement the idea
>Turns out Someone only wanted to manipulate the people, Someone never implemented the idea
>In fact, Someone fought against and killed people that believed in the idea
>This is the idea's fault

What

>>5961656
Can you tell me more about Third Reich defending itself?

>>5961656

you are a /pol/tard and logic flies against your head so I'm not going to debate you about the things you are fanatically attached to as an ideologue.

I'm not going to debate widely accepted historical facts like Nazi genocide or questioning Hitler attacked first because that would be laying legitimacy to your ignorance and promote lies and half truths.

If you want to discuss about the specific things I mentioned over why WWII was waged for please fell free to do so.

>>5961589
You're a fucking moron if you think race matters beyond anything more than just the olympics, and as far as the inevitable argument about the differences in intelligence between races, we don't understand enough about how our mind works to pass judgement and even if we did then we should all just bow to our jap and chink overlords, while white men serve as sergeants/shock troops and blacks serve as rank and file you fucking moron.

>>5961612
>there is nothing imperialistic about an ideology that's expressed through the conquering of other nations so that they may better serve as "living space"

>>5961671
Indeed. National Socialism has never been tried.

>>5961640

That was after they were overthrown by Vietnam m8. Did the CIA fund your high school bully or something

>>5961677
The Danzig Corridor was stolen from Germany in a street mugging writ large. Poland was carrying out a genocide against ethnic Germans. The Polish military attacked a German radio station. Germany defended itself. The Soviet Union invaded Poland at the same time. France and Britain both declared war on Germany, and Germany alone, ignoring the USSR's invasion of Poland. Every other military action the Third Reich undertook for the duration of the war was in the interest of self-defense.

Germay had no interest in extending its borders after the war. It wanted to be at the forefront of a union of National Socialist and Fascist states and nothing more. It even wanted to establish new states for oppressed ethnic minorities.

>>5961680
No, it definitely was. They even started a world war over it.

>>5961691
You don't actually believe this shit right?

>>5961681

Pol Pot would have never survived against the Chinese sphere without the US help in the first place.


Please read your history, or if you want to be the typical "communism is eveil111" lolbertarian pick a genuine tragedy done by Totalitarian Communism like Stalinism or at least an honest marxist like Lenin and not an insane nationalist like Pol Pot or Juche.

>>5961671

Now apply your logic to the inconsistencies in capitalism. See how stupid it is?
Ideology =/= idea
The Khmer Rouge were openly committing genocide and justifying it using ideas derived from Marxism. It worked for 4 years. This is worth looking at, but you're way too insecure like most modern day 'communists'

>>5961660
>Capitalism is never going to allow for automation of car factories companies absolutely hate paying pennies per hour as opposed to minimum wage
>all countries that aren't full blown communist are anarcho-capitalist and not some form of socialist state with capitalist leanings because things are only ever one thing or the other.

>>5961678
This post says literally nothing.

>>5961679
I have a degree in anthropology. My specialty is biological anthropology. Genetic ancestry is real, and it's far more important than you give it credit for. Go on clinging to your Enlightenment ideals of universal equality though. I'm sure they weren't invented as a crutch for capitalism.

>there is nothing imperialistic about an ideology that's expressed through the conquering of other nations so that they may better serve as "living space"

The Third Reich conquered other nations because it was fighting a defensive war. Germany never had much of an empire. If you're looking for an empire, look at Britain, or France, or Spain, or the USSR, or America.

>>5961692
Germany didn't start any war. Google Strasserism.

>>5961706


>Delusional visions of peasants living off the land.

>Marxist

Please kill yourself.

>>5961691
>France and Britain both declared war on Germany,
w-what?
Britain had open market with Germany well into the French invasion. Do you have any idea of what you're talking about?

>>5961696
Point out what you disbelief and let's debate it, then.

Make an actual argument.

>>5961717
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_and_French_declaration_of_war_on_Germany

>>5961706
>Now apply your logic to the inconsistencies in capitalism.
Where did anyone do that with capitalism? I can't think of one.

>The Khmer Rouge were openly committing genocide and justifying it using ideas derived from Marxism.
Not really m8 but it's interesting that you keep bringing up this idea that capitalism and communism have both failed some platonic idea of themselves but only communism seems to be subject to criticism.

>>5961711

Only Randroids and "Ron Paul 2012" fags think modern day capitalism is socialism, by refusing to call a spade a spade.

On the second point , capitalism only allows industrialization in terms of efficiency.

A company will fire all of it's personnel the same type of work can be done by machines, but someone has to create and repair those machines. So full automation is never possible.

Please read your Marx.

>>5961712
>Germany didn't start any war.
German invades Poland on Sept 1st.
UK and France declare war Sept 3rd.
The USSR invades Poland on Sept 17th.
Do Neo-nazis go backwards in time?

>>5961712
Then the perfect race doesn't exist yet you dumb nignog, the only way for it to exist is to take the so called athleticism of the negro and big penis lol , the advance genetics of neurons and other assorted brain meats of the superior white race, katana making from the japs, stir it all up and what do we get? Oh, yeah the master race, so you best start fucking black bitches or asians and letting both fuck your mother and your sister can't let dem dum niggers go off and fuck the first inbred trailer trash white girl they see. Because of course if you knew anything about inheritance and genetics you'd know inbreeding is real.

>>5961506
>Russia is kleptocracy

implying america is not, with our crony-run military-industrial complex

>>5961744
Your timeline is wrong.

Poland attacks Germany on 31 August.
Germany defends itself on 1 September.
UK and France declare war on Germany 3 September.
The USSR invades Poland 17 September.
UK and France never declare war on USSR.

Gee...something seems fishy about this scenario.

Why did Hitler invade the USSR?

>>5961748
>Then the perfect race doesn't exist yet
That's why the National Socialists wanted to restore the Aryan race through selective breeding of its strongest remnants.

>>5961612
>You realize that Marxism was based on gnosticism and kabbalism, right?

>>5961763
Self-defense. A war between the USSR and Germany was inevitable. The USSR was gearing up for war. The longer Germany delayed declaring war on the USSR, the less chance it had to win.

>>5961769
Marxism is applied Judaism. Judaism is an atheistic, materialistic religion that hates Christianity and seeks to elevate the social position of Jews above all else. Marxism is an atheistic, materialistic religion that hates Christianity and seeks to elevate the social position of Jews above all else. Do you see the similarities?

>>5961759
Even if we pretended the Gleiwitz Incident wasn't proven as a false flag operation by the Gestapo (which it was), "Poland" didn't "attack Germany", you fucking ignoramus.

>>5961777
The Gleiwitz Incident "false flag" narrative was a postwar Ally fabrication for propaganda purposes, and a painfully obvious one at that.

Gleiwitz is in Germany. Polish soldiers attacked the radio station there. How is that not an attack on Germany?

>>5961776
actually, communism is applied christianity. read the acts of the apostles and you will see the early christian communities lived in what we call communism today: no private property

>>5961728
well you're correct in the sense that full automation isn't possible but I think we both kind of want the same thing I think our sticking point is the method in which we achieve it, to put it simply my view is automating the work force can be a good thing, provided a populace is well educated enough to spend their time wisely enough, so that very few people turn to drugs and hedonism until self destruction as means of achieving happiness.

>>5961783
Except that Christians believe in God, live to serve God and not themselves, and are not willing to sacrifice the entire human race for the benefit of Jews (with the exception of a few American protestants under the influence of AIPAC).

>>5961678
>>5961678
>>5961678
>you are a pol tard
>so im not going to debate you
/lit/ embodied

glad to see your time at community college is helping you to be open minded

>>5961679
>EVOLUTION STOPS AT THE NECK!!!!
kekekekekekekeekekekek

>>5961781
citation needed or tinfoil

>>5961767
So? Why not just gain a complete understanding of how genetics works and just create the ultimate race while saving other "blueprints" so you might change as necessary to suit environmental challenges so that you can waste less resources on manufacturing gear and equipment to over come what ever the environment throws at you? In this sense I know it kind of ends up shitting all over your idea of fucking some hot blue eyed blonde hair swedish chick, but if you head the team at least you get to say the first person of the master race was a white guy right?

>>5961801
lol how does disbelieving a conspiracy theory make me tinfoil?

Literally the only source the Allies' court historians have for the false flag narrative is one man who had a vested economic interest in exaggerating his role in the war. And this man only emerged with his story after the war was already over, at a time when the Allies were desperate to pin the whole war on those evil baby-eating vampires from outer space, the Nazis.

>>5961801
>or
That implies he's not proven he's tinfoil

>>5961168
>Ever not siding with the society built on egalitarian principles defending itself against a racist nationalist state bent on mass racial genocide in "a war of annihilation." 20-30 million Soviets died to save the world from fascism.

>>5961794

Please stop samefagging

I know that your containment board was fucked like a cheap twin and that you are a little emotionally distraught, but here we try to keep the board quality up.

>>5961805
You seem to fundamentally misunderstand the beliefs of National Socialism.

National Socialism recognizes the right of all races to exist, if they can survive the struggle for existence, and exist as a volk with a homeland to call its own, and not as a parasite upon the volk. There is thus no one "master race" and no need to exterminate all races except for one. The Japanese and Chinese are master races just as much as the European Caucasian races. The Negroids have a right to exist.

>>5961820
>he thinks the Third Reich wanted to kill everyone in the USSR
Ha. You realize that most of the ethnic minorities the Russians oppressed actually sided with the Germans and fought alongside them, right?

>>5961825
lrn2samefag

>>5961801
attack the ideology dude, he's trapping you with unnecessary sticking points, merely proving that it wasn't a false flag doesn't change the point that hitler wanted more countries under his control, and tried to enact eugenics with little to no understanding of how genetics works, also to the /pol/lack who's in this thread you can't deny that hitler wanted an excuse to expand germany, all you have to do is read mein kampf to understand that.

>>5961836
While that may have been true at first in regions like Ukraine, through their treatment of the population, and disregard for the Russian/Ukrainian auxiliary troops. And in the case of minorities many did join and fight on the false pretenses of national ambition offered by the Nazis.

>>5961836
>Ha. You realize that most of the ethnic minorities the Russians oppressed actually sided with the Germans and fought alongside them, right?

I'm going to go ahead and respond for him. He obviously doesn't know. Most people don't know that basically every relevant nation had big numbers of people fighting on Germany's side. A special mention for the French.

>prefering Communism
>over literally anything

>>5961846
forgot to end my first sentence: ...they lost any potential loyalty from both Ukrainians and Russians (including the Bandera-ites).

>>5961825
not samefag you dipshit :)

>>5961839
Hitler only wanted to free countries from the control of the Jewish central banks.

Hitler only wanted to unite all ethnic Germans living outside of Germany in a Greater German Reich. This basically means he planned to take any territories with a majority German population, which I think included parts of Poland and France. He also wanted to take back territories stolen from Germany after WWI, which I think all happened to be ethnic German anyway.

Hitler also had some dreams of reestablishing a German empire in Africa, and perhaps taking over some territory to the east where Slavic peasants could work under a German aristocracy (lebensraum), but he never really developed these ideas and it's unclear if he ever would have actually implemented them.

That was the extent of his territorial ambitions. They're modest compared to what the British, French, or Russians actually did, and nothing at all compared to the empire Americans have built since the end of the war. It's hardly the "taking over the world" the Saturday morning cartoon version of history would have you believe. Imperialism was always more Italy's thing, because they actually wanted to live up to the Roman Empire's legacy by taking over Africa.

Attention all pol posters! This is a public service announcement: Dont bother trying to have a civil debate here. The denizens of lit will shitpost you to oblivion. >>5961794 is a great example of their mentality.

That is all

>>5961846
>>5961848
>>5961850
Something like 1 million Soviet citizens fought under German command, with a couple million more serving as "foreign helpers."

There were Soviet citizens who fought in the Battle of Berlin.

After the war, the Western Allies handed over tens of thousands of Soviet-born Third Reich fighters to the Soviets to be shot or shipped off to Siberia to die worse deaths.

>>5961205
>poor as fuck country
>got baited hard by America into producing so much shit that their economy collapsed
>years behind America technologically
>cars made of compressed paper because their economy was garbage

Commies sure love to trump up the greatness of their failed states. I bet you own a Che Guevara shirt

The Soviets would have been best for the world, there wouldn't be a Capitalist America to stop communism from flourishing.

>>5961168
>Which is worse? Terminal cancer or ebola?
>Which is worse? Burning alive or being dipped feet first into a wood chipper?
>Which would you rather ingest? Arsenic or cyanide?
>Who was worse? The Nazis or the Soviets?

>>5961900
The Third Reich was the high water mark of human civilization. If they were still around we would have colonies on Mars and cancer would be cured.

>>5961916
ok then, why did einstein leave germany?

>>5961879
>>to be shot or shipped off to Siberia to die worse deaths
>implying the Nazis wouldn't have done the same thing
>implying most of the Nazi recruited soldiers weren't just used to mop up partisans by committing mass war crimes
>inb4 muh waffen ss honor
/pol/ please leave

>>5961919
Because he could no longer use his Jewish privilege to promote his mediocre intellect and keep Aryan geniuses from the door.

>>5961916
>The Third Reich was the high water mark of human civilization

>>5961916
>high water mark

Meaning the world was drowning?

>>5961879
Unlike the Nazi animal's death camps, the gulags were actually just re-education prisons, but all Nazi fighters deserve gruesome deaths.

>>5961836
>>5961848
>>5961864
>>5961879

Why is /lit/ being invaded by nazi revisionists?

>>5961466

>muh 6,000,000,000,000 chosen

They were very moralistic. When people talk about the evil the "nazzies" had done, it is always related to violence. They also neglect to acknowledge that all governments deal in coercion, otherwise they would not be governments.

Lefties have a warped sense of right and wrong. Corruption and degradation is the new "morality" to them while extolling the sins of pacifism as some sort of twisted ethical high-ground.

>>5961927
>>5961932
>>5961937
>>5961939
All this red butthurt.

>>5961480

>conveniently forgetting the western allies propping them up and carrying them through the entire war

Soviets had a lot of manpower, so what?

>>5961949
No, man. Not really.

>>5961947
Because moot nuked /pol/ and the refugees fled to other boards. If you want the Nazis to leave, email moot to tell him to bring /pol/ back.

>>5961961
/pol/ still exists. They don't like it they should just leave, no one wants them.

>>5961947

It's a way to cope with their trauma over moot fucking their cancerous containment board.

Just sage and hide, they come here to shitpost and derail threads anyway and never contribute anything of value in terms of discussion.

>>5961817
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/12-20-45.asp

>>5961475
>A microcosm of this would be my poker faced Russian friends telling me they were raised to not freely smile around others, for it was considered impolite.
I live in a post communist block, I always smile and say thank you and whatnot, always get a smile and a thank you in return. Used to date a girl from Russia and know quite a lot of people from Russia in general and I have the complete opposite imagery of them since every time we meet each other talk to each other they constantly smile, actually.

>>5961886
>>years behind America technologically
What period of time are we talking about exactly?

>>5961168
Nazis by far

Gee, OP
Can't you see?
You shouldn't have whittled your list
To two from three

>>5961971
And if the Axis had won they would have trotted out all sorts of Allied minor military officials before kangaroo courts to confess to everything from the Sinking of the Lusitania to the Wall Street Bombing. What's your point?

>>5961205
Just because Holodomor wasn't intentional doesn't mean it wasn't the result of shitty policy

>>5961916
>I prefer good wholesome Arsenic to that nasty ol' cyanide!

OK.

>>5962218
National Socialism was the antidote to every poison that's been pumped into the veins of Mother Europa since the Middle Ages. The world would be a utopia if they had succeeded.

>>5961168
Has /lit/ become /pol/ now? What did /lit/ ever do to moot?

>>5961168
Doesn't matter. The world lost way too much because neither of them won, but the americans. IF the nazis won, we'd already have reverted to the glory days of monarchy. If the USSR won the Cold War we woudn't have retarded liberal universalism. But no, enjyo the NWO and epic american consumerist culture.

It would have been best if Nazi Germany came out on top.

>>5962227

>>5962239
>2015
>loving your people and standing in defense of Christian Civilization against aliens who hate the West and seek its destruction is considered edgy

>>5961270
He did it while indebting Germany in the British banks, he actually was forced to start war because of thath, otherwise IIIrd Reich economy would collapse.

>>5961205
>>5961216
>>5961229
You fuckers are either western european or american

>>5961248
oh my lord. you don't have a fucking stormfag to condemn a genocidal hatemachine of a regime. you wankers aren't as intelligent as I thought you were

>>5961305
nasty demagogue. read some solzhenitsyn, you little american weenie.

>>5961947
you should be asking why /lit/ is infested with pro-soviet western weenies

>>5961434
>The German people admitted their mistakes
not really, they just over-euphemized it and forgot about it. Just see how many nazis continued to have political power in Germany after 1945.

>>5961612
>You realize that Marxism was based on gnosticism and kabbalism, right?
this nigga

>>5962269
Actually I'm from Eastern Europe.

>Hitler was in power for like eight years
>Stalin was in power for 25 years
>Hitler killed 12 million people
>Stalin probably killed only 7 million
>in less time
>implying Holodomor was intentional
>Stalin was responsible for the Holodomor like Churchill was responsible for the millions of Indians that starved to death in the British Raj during WW2
>no one goes around calling Churchill a mass murderer

>>5962305
what's it like there?

>>5962630
Last time I was outside, it was snowing. Otherwise pretty good.

>>5962305
All the more disgraceful. How dare you spit on the suffering of our ancestors?

>>5962318
Stalin is closer to 40 million, but ok.

>>5962739
why not 400

>>5962744
Idk, he didn't live long enough.

>>5962737
What?

>>5961697
Wasn't the Khmer Rouge aligned with North Korea while Vietnam was aligned with the soviets? China mostly sat that one out. I don't recall the CIA having anything more than an observatory role during the Vietnamese invasion of cambodia. There was probably some minor advising and intel sharing at that point nothing substatial enough to claim "THE CIA HELPED POL POT TO POWER"

I swear it's like you people don't know what you're talking about.

>>5961168
>Which would be best for the world?

Since the Nazi ideology was the enslavement and extinction of anyone not Arian, and their leader was not only a paranoid megalomaniac (which could certainly be said of Stalin), he was also a meth-addict speed-freak who killed any expert opposing him, that question is rather moot.

>>5962763
you use a highly overblown estimation, probably from the cold war era groundless propaganda

>>5962775
>groundless propaganda
What did I excatly propagate? And what's groundless about it?

>>5961879
This totally explains One Day In the Life of Ivan Denisovich.

>>5962775
>groundless

then where did all the people go? underground? fucking idiot. idiot

>>5962786
i missed the quote, it wasn't to you

The faults of modern day capitalism is due to governmental interaction in the private sector and lack of stable and functional institutions in poor countries.

Those who prefer alternatives to capitalism often justify their system by anecdotal fragments and the sheer romanticisation of its allegedly ability to work in a hypothetical scenario where a holistic perspective is skewed to give it the benefit of doubt rather than the historic judgment it received.

Adam Smith did nothing wrong.

>>5962824
>Pure ideology

>>5961951
>conveniently ignoring operation bagration which was the death knell of the nazi war machine
Westerners had a lot of capital, so what?

I mean seriously, all this buttpain over the lend lease is ridiculous. Someone had to do it, and it may as well be the Reds considering the Huns parked most of their manpower within Soviet borders post-barbarrosa.

>>5962824
>Adam Smith did nothing wrong.
Agreed. It's the people who think they speak for him who are doing everything wrong.

>>5961270
eastern europe has always. ALWAYS. had less

To be honest the Anglosphere is more evil than the Nazis or Soviets ever were.

>>5961270
All Hitler did was default on his payments.
Germany was already the most powerful nation in Europe when their last crazy leader dragged them into the war for which they were paying just reparations.

>>5962824
Neither did Marx, he just really liked buff men who worked in factories and sweated with each other all day

>>5962854
>Implying English-speakers have committed worse genocides than German-speakers

>>5962273
You do however need to be more than slightly misinformed to condemn the Soviet Union as thus.

>>5962871
>comparing English speakers to German speakers rather than English to Germans.

lol touche.