/lit/ - Literature

>Modern translation:

There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way to death.

They don't think it be like it is, but it do.

Sometimes what seems right actually isn't.

>>5106742

It's saying that human reckoning on its own leads ultimately to separation from God.

>>5106763

under rated post

there·of
T͟He(ə)rˈəv/
adverbformal
of the thing just mentioned; of that.
"the member state or a part thereof"


now you can figure it out yourself

>>5106812
I don't need a definition. My thread is for exploring the deeper meaning of this passage.

>>5106792
Same guy.

What on the surface appears right might lead to bad consequences.

or

What on the surface appears right might come from reasons that are bad.

>>5106823
Go with the obvious interpretation and be done with it. The people who wrote the Bible weren't exactly deep thinkers.

that which we assume true might be false

our preference to hold onto the unproven can be problematic

when living a certain way, which is assumed right and just, it is still subject to god's judgement

basically to realize we know naught in the manners of what is truly right, and the penalty we might pay later on

inb4 someone deconstructs the proverb to provide proof jesus loves gays

>>5106829
But it's more about how it appears right *to you*.

So it seems the passage is saying don't trust yourself because what seems right to you will lead to your death.

Seemeth is an old word for ejaculate. It means if you junk your spunk over some guy (during a threesome etc) you will get killed.

>>5106850
unto is an old word for in the anus

>>5106742


the very reason a thing can appeal to you is the reason that they can lead to ruin, that they appeal to you is a defect of character.


AS I PASS through my incarnations in every age and race,
I make my proper prostrations to the Gods of the Market Place.
Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all.

We were living in trees when they met us. They showed us each in turn
That Water would certainly wet us, as Fire would certainly burn:
But we found them lacking in Uplift, Vision and Breadth of Mind,
So we left them to teach the Gorillas while we followed the March of Mankind.

We moved as the Spirit listed. They never altered their pace,
Being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the Gods of the Market Place,
But they always caught up with our progress, and presently word would come
That a tribe had been wiped off its icefield, or the lights had gone out in Rome.

With the Hopes that our World is built on they were utterly out of touch,
They denied that the Moon was Stilton; they denied she was even Dutch;
They denied that Wishes were Horses; they denied that a Pig had Wings;
So we worshipped the Gods of the Market Who promised these beautiful things.

When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.
But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;
But, though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "If you don't work you die."

Then the Gods of the Market tumbled, and their smooth-tongued wizards withdrew
And the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe it was true
That All is not Gold that Glitters, and Two and Two make Four
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings limped up to explain it once more.

As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of Man
There are only four things certain since Social Progress began.
That the Dog returns to his Vomit and the Sow returns to her Mire,
And the burnt Fool's bandaged finger goes wabbling back to the Fire;

And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins
When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return!

>>5106742

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

In that context would it be right to assume death as a punishment?

>doing right also could lead one to death

That is how a read that.

>>5107363
>doing right
Yea but you're doing only *seems* right. That's the point of the OP. It's warning against that. That's how I interpret it.

>>5107363
I don't think death is operating as a punishment here. As I read it it's saying:

"Some actions seem right to a man (who is not a divine being), but because of a man's limited knowledge these actions in fact can lead to death."

The message being to trust in divine wisdom and will, not the course of action advocated by mere men.

>>5107727
>The message being to trust in divine wisdom and will, not the course of action advocated by mere men.
I think it means that too. Also, in the greater context of Proverbs, I think it's further reasoning to fear God.

>>5107326
>all this b8
0/10

The answer, OP, is that men do things in a bid to conquer death, which seem right, for they satiate some feeling associated with death, some slight which has been cast upon the man by death -- they are a straw man, essentially (eg. HH's lusting after young girls in Lolita, because death has taken one from him in the beginning, or that whole killing insects bit that kids so love to do).

>>5107989
This is the right answer btw, and that book is filled with profound cleverness.

>>5106742

"Many Times the People Desires Its Own Ruin, Deceived by a False Appearance of Good; and That Great Hopes and Mighty Promises Easily Move It"

Machiavelli: Discourses on Livy - I:LIII (chapter title)

I mean, it's a much repeated theme. Things that seem good are sometimes bad for the very reason that seems good.

>>5106958
Ay lika dis.
>>5106800
Also this.

>>5108066
Give an example, anon.

>>5108072

Heroin feels good but it kills you because it feels good. Auto-erotic asphyxiation, gamboling, etc.

I can't think of much in terms of literary examples right now, I'm drunk. Play with any number of religious texts. I'm thinking something in the Bhagavad Gita or Tao Te Ching will have your answer. Some of the "AVOID ATTACHMENT TO THE FRUITS OF YOUR LABOR AND LOVE THE LABOR" stuff.

>>5107989
I don't think that's the meaning at all.

>>5108123

> kills you because it feels good

I mean that the constant increase in our search for synthetic feelgoods (vice) we replace what is actually good for the easy ways of feeling good.

You know all those heroin addicts that are absolutely convinced that heroin isn't destroying their lives, and people just need to get over the fact that they love heroin? Despite the fact it leads them into poverty, homelessness, depression, literal death?

That is the extreme case of what this passage is talking about.

>>5108123
Dumb.
>>5108125
It is.

The most striking part of human psychology as known to the profound is that we are all in a bid to conquer death with all things. As daVinci said: "While I thought that I was learning how to live, I have been learning how to die."

you people are retarded. it's the fucking bible, not a facebook post.

it's literally saying that what's right sometimes leads to death. it's not condeming that fact, it's telling you that death is a possibility in being ethically correct.

the reason you want to to condemn the "ways of death" is because you're not willing to die to be right.

>bible
>actually existing

lel everyone knows the bible isn't real

>>5108190
Fair enough.

>>5108176
Fag.

>>5108190
Dumb.

>>5108176
>It is.
It says nothing about conquering death. It's more like the way you think will exalt you, will in fact lead to your death.

>>5108206
Death, or the fear of death, is the driving force behind the "ways." And notice it contrast these ways against that which feels "right." It's the same shit that has kids who were abused growing up to become abusers, anon, it's conquering infinity, being lord and master. I'm absolutely certain I'm right, to be honest, that's such the major piece of psychology.

do half u plebs really think that 'ways of death' means literally death

i mean the whole damn book is allegorical even when it's not being allegorical and yet somehow we e/lit/erati can only surmise that when the word death is used it must be talking about ceasing to exist bodily

i mean rly

>>5108219
to be honest, you're caught up in your words, and if you could step outside your... method of understanding you'd see that we're saying something similar.

>>5107996
>>5107989
samefag faggot faggy fag fag

In Jewish theology, death is humanity's punishment for sin. Original sin condemns all humans to die. Sin and death are practically synonymous.

That's why Christ absolving humanity of its sins --> eternal life.

The proverb is saying that humans can mistakenly believe sinful acts ("the ways of death") to be virtuous ("seemeth right"); the point is to accept YHWH's law even when it seems (to the limited and flawed human intellect) to be wrong.

>>5106742
The verse is speaking about the difference between worldly, human knowledge and divine knowledge.

It is a further advisement by Solomon along the same theme as this:

5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
6 in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.[a]

7 Do not be wise in your own eyes;
fear the Lord and shun evil.

From Proverbs 3.

>>5108261

... nice

Although, as a Jew, I was not taught that. I was taught that was one interpretation of many. Original sin is more a Catholic thing. Our punishment is our awareness without eternal life.

I think this is >>5107727 the most accurate interpretation.

Everything else in this thread seems like mental masturbation.

>>5108243
>to be honest, you're caught up in your words, and if you could step outside your... method of understanding you'd see that we're saying something similar.
No, you really aren't.

>>5108368

well enjoy your fucking brain tumor, you fuck up peon. If you manage to get the shit off your knees and the plank out your eye I hope to hear from you again.

faggot faggot faggot faggot faggot

>>5106742
Just because it sounds like a great idea, doesn't mean it is.

>>5108381
Did you know, CUNT, that calling a man a "faggot" is actually to make a wish upon him? Same with how you called "samefag" -- oh, it a bastard to be opposed other men. I could link you to some very interesting videos on the matter, if you'd like.

>>5108386
I agree, anon, it is perhaps the pettiest of psychology.

>>5108386
>>5108394

Sorry,

I finished the bottle and aborted the conversation.

I wish you well.

>>5106742
There ain't no wrong and there ain't no right. There is no 'right way'.#falcorwasracemixed