/lit/ - Literature

Me.

Hey, it's me, Tom Pynchon!

>>4957969
>Cormac McCarthy

McCarthy is shit and doesn't even deserve to be mentioned with the same breath as those others.

>>4957987
Fuck you.

Hey, it's me, Cormac McCarthy!

>>4957987
obvious summerfag kiddie

>>4957987
looks i'm trollin le 4chins xd

From your list, Pynchon.
Haven't read Roth though.

Toss-up between McCarthy and Pynchon, but their styles are so disparate it would be problematic to say that one is "greater" than the other (to say nothing of how problematic the statement "greatest living english-language novelist")

Roth and DeLillo have written great books in their time but have also written too many clunkers

>all of the contenders are Murrican
Well, damn. Not saying it's not true, but... damn.

>>4958094
>>4958133

If you can think of anyone else not on that list you'd consider to be the greatest by all means tell us.

>>4957969
none are doing good work anymore. of those, mccarthy is still probably the one most capable of putting out top quality work. but in terms of "record", pynchon or roth. i'd probably go with roth, he just developed so much more as a writer, he topped himself over and over again for like 40 years, etc. pynchon was the greater talent, but i just feel like the fact that there were like 24 years between gr and m&d in which roth was pumping out incredible material hurts him in the comparison. and roth is more consistent, imo.

the best novel of those 4 imo is underworld though

>>4958118
mccarthy and pynchon have written more clunkers than roth. roth just fell off at the very end of his career, and even then he didn't get bad (roths last novellas). but from 1979 to like 2004 roth just wrote solid gold basically, and before that he wrote pretty much solid gold. compared to mccarthy, who only has like two top level books (blood meridian, suttree), an inconsistent trilogy, solid but not incredible early material, followed by a clunker (no country) and the road, which i don't like but i recognize other people do. pynchon also has like 3-4 novels that aren't nearly as good as his peak material, and since he has only 8 novels (counting COL49), that's not very consistent. i don't hate those 4 books but they aren't on the level of GR, COL49, V, and M&D. roth's ratio of amazing to less amazing is much better.

>>4957987
>i didn't understand Blood Merridian
>McCunty sucks lolol
>summer break
>nothin to do but trolloloz

Tao Lin

>>4957969
Martin Amis

Will Self is the only correct answer

>>4958269
His Guardian articles are the most overwrought shit you'll ever read.

>>4958282
The question posed was about novels.

>>4957969
James Salter

William Gass
Robert Coover
Joseph McElroy

>>4957969
I was getting hyped for Phillip Roth from what people were saying on /lit/, but the only book I found was some alternative history shit about what if Jews were persecuted in the US or some shit.
I then looked up some interviews of Phillip Roth to see what was actually up and he is genuinely a pulp writer.
Why did you reccomend this, exactly?

>>4957969
Pynchon, then Thomas Ligotti.

>>4959357
lol this might be the dumbest post i've seen today

>>4958172
>mccarthy is still probably the one most capable of putting out top quality work
>hasn't written a good book in 20 years

>>4957987
He's the second best on the list, believe it or not.

Hilary Mantel

>>4958456
This guy knows what's up.

>>4957969
Gene Wolfe is the only acceptable answer

I ain't even trolling.

>>4959366
You must have missed that feminism thread.

Is it just me or does it feel like Thomas Pynchon should be dead

Not arguing that he's the best, but has no-one on here read John Banville? His style is comparable to that of Nabokov but I actualy enjoyed The Sea more tha Lolita

Tao Lin is on his way to becoming a literary giant. I'd say Richard Yates and Shoplifting are both brilliant novels on par with, say, Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man and Taipei is as good as, if not better than, Ulysses. He's only 30! Give him another twenty years to write a few more great novels and I'd say he's cemented along with Joyce, Shakespeare, Cervantes and Homer as historically great.

>>4960695
0/10
>you replied XD

>>4960582

>>4958118
>problematic
drop that word from your vocab

>>4958282
you only read that one guardian article you poseur

>>4959348
I agree with this guy more than anybody else in this thread, but he's been ignored.

I don't dislike Pynchon, but it seems like with the universal praise he gets here people would bother to read similar stuff.

They're not alive anymore, but other overlooked authors that I think people on this board would love are John Hawkes (not just The Cannibal) and Donald Barthelme.

>>4960719
>Some dummies use a word, so this guy's gotta stop using it!
Hey man, it can be a useful word sometimes, alright?

>>4958141
I'd say Rand but she is an honorary murrican :^)

>>4961809
Also forgot to mention that Vollmann ought to be a contender. He's criminally under-read.

McCarthy

>>4959357
you found "The Plot Against America," and I'm guessing you found it used as there are a million copies of that book collecting dust on used bookshelves, and there are a million copies of that book collecting dust on used bookshelves because many people gave their copies away, and many people gave their copies away because it's not a very good book. You'd be better off reading Portnoy's Complaint or American Pastoral.

Lydia Davis, especially after reading her Supreme translation of Swann's Way.

>>4957969
>no Stephen King
>worst living author of all time

>>4961905
>Steven King
>Implying Not Greatest Writer of All Time

>>4961908
Yo ima let you finish but Steven king is the greatest rapper of all time

>>4961912
Still not as good as Dan Brown

>>4957969
It's Toni Morrison sillies

>>4957969
Speaking strictly from experience

McCarthy - read The Road, No Country. Overly simplistic, not interesting to me
Pynchon - read GR, V. God Tier
Roth - read Portnoys Complaint, ok pretty edgy stuff..
Delillo - read white noise, good book despite amateur storytelling

Pynchon is best living novelist by a mile as far as I can tell

>>4962026
judging mccarthy by the road and no country is like judging pynchon by inherent vice and bleeding edge, read blood meridian. and roth and delillo can both do much better than the books you listed. you haven't read the best book (only white noise comes close, but underworld and libra are still much better) by any of those non-pynchon authors.

>>4959348
Don't worry my fellow patrician, none of the plebs on /lit/ have read any decent contemporary literature and probably haven't heard of any of these authors.

>>4959348
Good picks. Also Rikki Ducornet, Cynthia Ozick, and Carole Maso.

>>4962062
or people just think that pynchon is better than them

>>4962070
because they haven't read those authors

get a clue faggot

>>4962076
i bet you haven't even read women & men and you just talk shit about it. what mcelroy have you read?

>>4962079

Oy vey chinga I read Cannonball. His newest book.

>>4962058
Thanks for the recs

>>4958269
no he's not

>>4962087
cute

>>4962100
you think you're hot shit because you could get your hands on Women and Men?

>>4957969

I think it's Irvine Welsh. Pynchon and McCarthy are great though.

>>4958456
>>4959348
>>4961936
These are all good. I thought Gass was dead lol

>>4962102
no i just think you're a dumb shit for thinking you're a patrician because you know who mcelroy is when you've only read one 260 page book by him

George RR Martin

>>4962107
you can go suck a dick. Preferably mine so I can nut in your mouth

>>4957969
I only read short, so for that length, George Saunders.

>>4962115
so you admit you don't know what you're talking about

have you even read pynchon or are you just full of it about him too

>>4962102

>liking Vollmann

http://exiledonline.com/90-reasons-to-hate-the-1990s-an-exile-classic/

>>4962120
Faggot I've read his work. I also met Pynchon on the subway once and when I recognized him he looked away but rather than let him go peacefully I said "hey everyone look at this faggoty old man I wonder what his story is"

it was worth it because he was really embarrassed.

>>4962123
I actually got it from this guy's Goodreads account.

He just looked scary so I saved it

>>4962132
forgot the link my bad


https://www.goodreads.com/user/show/7607437-nathan-n-r-gaddis

>>4960409

This anon is right. Early Wolfe is God Tier and even some of his recent stuff is great.

Peace is better than anything Pynchon, Roth, McCarthy, or Delilo ever wrote and I love all four. It's not even his best work. 5HoC, Island of Dr. Death, Seven American Nights, BotNS, a plethora of top notch short stories, Latro series...I think you get the point.

Also, quit parroting that fat fuck Bloom. He's a fucking hack with no true talent so he reverted to criticism to make up for his worthless life.

Does anyone know Alexander Theroux?

Faulkner!

>>4962303
>living

>>4957969
god, he is the ugliest motherfucker

>>4957969

>Who's the greatest living (English language) novelist?
>(English language)

You only stipulate this because you're scared of Krasznahorkai's power level.

>>4962123

w-who is talking shit about muh Vollman? I-ll b-beat you up!

>>4962269
Yeah, he's Louie's uncle.

1. J. M. Coetzee
2. William H. Gass
3. John Ashbery
4. Edward Albee
5. Philip Roth

>>4962577
ashbery and albee are not novelists

>>4962123
>citing listicles

>>4959348
>Gass
Yes.
>Coover
/lit/ always says he's good, but I've never read him.
>McElroy
I don't know, Women and Men (the only thing of his I've read) was good, but I wouldn't say it's on par with the best of Pynchon or McCarthy's work.

>>4962102
>you think you're hot shit because you could get your hands on Women and Men?
It's on #bookz.

>McCarthy

wasn't he dead?

>>4957969
Louise Erdrich you morons. MN Pride fggtz

>>4957969
Phillip Roth.

>>4958257
britbongs plz

>>4957969
John Barth

>>4964010
he got better

>>4965473
>John Barth
moar like john barf, amirite?

>>4957969
>Who's the greatest living (English language) novelist?
>Cormac McCarthy?
>Thomas Pynchon?
>Philip Roth?
>Don Delillo?

Took this list from Bloom, huh?

>>4965522
op probably did but it's pretty standard stuff, besides omitting other nationalities besides american

look at the poll for best work from the last 25 years from the nytimes, you get the same 4 authors - pynchon (probably because GR didn't come out in the last 25 years) + updike, who's dead, and toni morrsion, who /lit/ doesn't like. so it's a pretty standard list, at least for american fiction

>>4959348
I fucking love Coover, that man is legitimately insane. He teaches a class called computer writing and wrote a story that's essentially a pastiche of Pinocchio, and Shakespeare. I just bought the Brunist Day of Wrath, I'm super excited. Anyone else read it?

>>4961832
Europe Central is better than anything Pynchon has written aside from Gravity's Rainbow, and M&D.

>>4957969
David Fo-
oh wait

>>4961809
>Barthelme
Mah nigga

>>4957969
Any Naipaul fans on here?

>>4959348
Where does one start with Gass and Coover? I'm interested.

This thread also convinced me to spend some time with Roth. I read Portnoy and it was pretty good. Sabbath is on it's way from the library. What else?

>>4968535
>What else?
American trilogy

>>4966113
>His best book is as good as Pynchon's third-best book, guys!

...and?

>>4968535
>Where does one start with Gass?
I'd recommend Willie Master's Lonesome Wife and/or Middle C as starting points.

>>4957969
Ellis of course

>>4968763
oh no u cut me with ur edge

>>4968785
what

Ellis is great

>>4968535
>Where does one start with Gass and Coover?

Gass: Omensetter's Luck and In the Heart of the Heart of the Country. The Tunnel is arguably his best but it's less accessible than his first two works of fiction. I didn't like Cartesian Sonata and I haven't read Middle C yet. I'd also strongly recommend his non-fiction, as he's probably the best anglophone literary critic alive.

Coover: The Public Burning is widely regarded as his magnum opus. Penguin Modern Classics have published Gerald's Party and a collection of short stories. The Universal Baseball Association also sounds great but I haven't read it yet.

JK Rowling. She's definitely the most influential, if not "greatest". Almost all 21st century novelists will be people who grew up reading her works and probably started to love literature in an age of TV and internet thanks to her.

>>4961905
Stephen King is the most overrated author of all time.

>>4971222
she'll be influential for the next 50-100 years and then nobody will give a fuck anymore

>>4968792
Good one

>>4971230
Where'd you get your crystal ball bro?

>>4971284
From an old gypsy woman ten years from now.

>>4958269

It's difficult to disagree with this given how disgustingly good Umbrella is-- but I think he needs to pump out a few more novels of similar quality before anyone can call him 'the greatest.'

>>4962577
>>4965246

Maximum brofist for Erdrich and Coetzee.
Thought I was the only person here who hypes Erdrich.

tbh McCarthy is better tho

>>4958202
>>i didn't understand Blood Merridian

>implying you did

>>4972348
I didn't understand it but still enjoyed it

david foster wallace

>>4968559
>>4968759
>>4971184

Thank you thank you and thank you too.

>>4960695
wow subtle

>>4962425
muh hot lava talk

What are some of Roth's best books? I picked up Zuckerman Bound (the trilogy) because i saw it really cheap at a yard sale. Is that a good starting point?

>>4973252
yeah that's a great starting point

the american trilogy, portnoy's complaint, and sabbath's theater are also great

>>4973252
The trilogy can be a bit heavy. Don't hesitate to dip your toes in his more "fun" stuff like Portnoy and Sabbath.