/lit/ - Literature

C#

>>4933785
Mi-microsoft?

>>4933779
Where did his obsession with splashing people with drinks come from?

>>4933820
beats me. I found it really interesting because its such a childish reaction.
Something on the line of a toddler throwing sand on his adversaries at the sandbox.

>>4933820
ersatzhandlung

What is OP's picture about?

>>4933874
It's that Elliot Rodger kid that shot some people

>>4933874
I'm sorry mate, I should've been more clear in my OP.

>>4933779

Whoever wrote this derives their identity from an object, that object being a sexy girl, and without that object they feel devasted.

When you derive your sence of self from a sexy girl, that sexy girl is an object.

>>4933891
>>4933850

How can I get a basic grasp of psychology?

>>4933899
there is no way to get "a basic grasp of psychology;" one can only obtain a "basic grasp" of whatever popular ideology purports to measure the full extent of a man's psyche.

>>4933918
What do I have to read to be able to analyse stuff like this guy did >>4933891 ?

>>4933934
Freud probably. Maybe Lacan.

>>4933820

So I am not the only one who thought "Holy crap, this just like someone paraphrased Notes from the Underground" while reading Elliot's manifesto?

I found it interesting remembering what Dostoevsky wrote for the introduction to NFTU; "Not only do people like this exist in society, but they must exist".

We all know someone like Elliot that we went to school with, or just go to /r9k/.

Are events like this inevitable regardless of gun control regulations?

>>4934016
Elliot probably would have been ok if his parents had the common sense to just hire an escort to fuck him.

>>4933944
the standard at most western universities is a big fat introduction by a guy called Zimbardo but that wont nessecarily help with these kind of literary analysis. maybe you should read introductions into freud, lacan, fromm etx

>>4934026
Depends. It would have probably made him see women more as objects and probably made him murder hookers instead.

While reading I realized that by the age of 18 he was totally lost. There would have been pretty much nothing they could have done to change his mentality.

He grew up with his father absent and a divorce. Many kids go through this but Elliot's response to all of this, probably due to his Aspergers meant that he was pretty much destined to become who he was.

I found it interesting that he did obsess over three things; WoW, Girls and the Lottery (After I read that he had read 'The Secret' I lol'd, only a mentally ill person would actually take the things in that book seriously).

But the thing was, never once did he actually speak to a girl. Not once did he talk about a discussion he had with a girl. If he did we would have known about it, he even mentioned when a girl smiled at him. He just sat around a felt that he was entitled to girls coming up to him and offering sex.

He was /r9k/ made flesh.

>>4934016
Yeah, mate. First thing that popped in my mind while reading this was "Notes from the Underground"

>>4934081

>probably due to his Aspergers meant that he was pretty much destined to become who he was.

Most aspies aren't destined to become mass murderers, bro.

Whether it was his environment or some sort of benign pathology within him he became a pretty clear aberration from the normal aspie. It'd be wrong to simply call him just an aspie and leave it at that.

>>4934081
>only a mentally ill person would actually take the things in that book seriously
Well, people do take the Bible seriously...

>>4934133

>meta self-aware fedora bait

I am all sorts of confuse.

>>4934016
>t like someone paraphrased Notes from the Underground
It's probably longer than notes from the underground lel

>>4933779
People's reactions to Notes always makes me chuckle. I frequently hear people go on and on about the main character being so brilliant and telling it like it is, and I just know they only read the first half of the book.
Because he sounds brilliant in the first half. He sounds like he has it all figured out. Then you read the second half, where he actually puts his ideas into practice, and he just has the shittiest time.
I love the book, both halves, but it's just funny when people like it for the exact opposite of the message the book as a whole had.

>>4933891
Intellectualism is absurd,

>>4934343
The second half is what makes this Radger kid relatable to the novel.

>>4934363

Humans are absurd, therefore any perceptions of them noted down will seem absurd.

>>4934367
I wasn't talking about you guys, I meant IRL
Notes is short enough that I assume everyone on a literature board talking about it will have read it all.

I will probably be proven wrong at some point in this thread though.

>>4933934
Sartre + de Beauvoir

>>4934016
full disclosure: have only read what was posted here and seen his bmw video and one more.

I would have thought he was acting (albiet fucking badly), and criticised the script/story for writing such an unrealistic character.

well fuck me.


notes from the underground seemed a much more realistic character to me. with that said, I read some of anders breivik's and he also seems realistic. this elliot rogers dude just lives entirely outside of any area of which i can empathise with, which sorta worries me.

>>4935236
Fuck you man, you have no idea what your talking about.

>>4935244
explain

>>4935253
Dude just read what you fucking said, and then ask that question. You're not looking at the implications of this matter and how widespread it can be don't you see?

>>4935257
apparently not

i see implications as being fairly narrow, am i wrong in thinking that he lies well beyond the bell curves for
a) importance placed on sex (girls as status)
b) narcisissm
c) locus of control
d) deciding to kill people for dumb fucking reasons


i know there is a problem with society but this dude is clearly an outlier and not a good example for the problem

or am i missing the point entirely again? (no hate actually wanna know im pretty sheltered)

ive listened to all manner of armchair philosophizing about this dude all day on facebook, laurie penny's thoughts on this shit, etc.

and all ive got to say is: fuck tumblr. fuck mallgoths. fuck this gay earth. I dont feel bad for this asshole, i hate him for adding for my fuel to the fire, another opportunity for every asshole tumblr twenty-something to pontificate about how society hates women

>>4935267
Your not wrong and you have part of it right, but did you consider that this was a long time coming. How this age is promoting further people like him?

>>4935277
what is it about this age that is promoting further people like him?

>>4935285
Lol for the record the first replies to your comments I was just equivocating an messing around. I didn't even read what you wrote. But now that I have I see this might turn into a good discussion.

To answer your question we have to connect the dots with movements like feminism and the responses to them like the MRAs and the MGTOWs. Sure sex was always important in society, but it was never flaunted like this. Pornography is ubiquitous, the constant pressure to get laid in the younger generations is stifling. We live in an age where sex is marketed, shown off, and put on an extremely high pedestal coupled with the fact that we are instilled with the idea that everyone will be able to reach fame, fortune, and love. This a dangerous combination as now everyone feels entitled to what they can't have Frustrated kids like Elliot are common, and things like this may be more common in the future.

>>4935267
Actually what I think is funniest about this whole thing is the importance on sex/status is pretty normal for modern society. Its why you're getting so many people on the internet getting weird feelings when they see their exact attitude reflected in this guy.

His manifesto is hillarious though. Its like some funny post modern novel but its set in real life. 8.4/10 best new shooter.

>>4935303
I'm not that guy, I actually agree with what youre saying.

very rare to meet a normal, practical person. everyone wants to feel like a superstar.
another thing ive noticed is that in tandem with stuff like tumblr and burning man post-hippiedom is this rise of people who can only relate to others in terms of sexuality, and people really obsessively wanting to keep relationships on their terms.

people like jane fonda have remarked on how boys in my generation seem like they have "low emotional intelligence" but one thing that really disturbs me is how people dont seem willing to acknowledge how there's this really noticeable detachment from reality in girls my age

>>4935268
>i hate him for adding for my fuel to the fire, another opportunity for every asshole tumblr twenty-something to pontificate about how society hates women
This so hard.
Dude kills more men than women, but it's the women who are the important ones.

>>4934133
T-tips f-f-f-f-fedora!

>>4935344
I guess the problem lies with both genders who have unrealistic views of life and the younger generations as a whole who are suffering delusions of grandeur. I guess that's what happens in this world of globalization and consumerism. What I really miss are the days when people interacted with each other in their communities. That nostalgic feel of riding your bike through the streets and waving at people that you know. Can life can any better? If I ever have kids I a going to move to a nice rural area close to nature with a strong community where I can see my kids grow up with the ability to find joy in the simplest of life's pleasures

>>4935303
actually the last comment wasnt >>4935236

anyway i agree + would also add distance between people, social networks and the tendency to display only the best parts of your life.
frustrated kids of course, frustrated kids like elliot, hopefully not. anyone with any level of self awareness should be able to see through some of what goes on, or at least inconsistencies within their personality (eg: i am a gentlemen, fuck all bitches).

but like i said i can barely believe the dude exists, so id be pretty blind to the thousands more falling into the same trap

>>4935334
new post modern is living our your fiction so that people are interacting with your story, its criticisms and influences real-time

maybe hes a genius

>>4935344
yeah strong entitlement among girls.
of course this means the 6/10 will fuck the 9/10 dude, get pissed when he doesn't wanna date her because he's got his pick of all the 6/10s who deserve a dude like him

>>4935383
>but like i said i can barely believe the dude exists, so id be pretty blind to the thousands more falling into the same trap

This age where everything is exaggerated and dramatized leads to kids like Elliot. They think their in some movie where the world revolved around them. Conceit taken to a new level. We will see more like him, I promise you that.

>>4935393
i hope not i might have to take back some of what i said about american psycho being a stupid book

>>4935257
>anon states what he would have thought
>"you have no idea what you're talking about"

I love it when people on 4chan know what you think better than you, and aren't afraid to tell you with a 4th-grader typo.

>>4935402
Read my further comment >>4935303
I was actually trolling and seeing if I can drag on the conversation by equivocating.

>>4935380
>>4935393
I just graduated HS in a smallish town, and wish that I had got the same disconnect as most people around me. Like I get to sit here and watch all this stupid shit hit the fan, but watching it and having even a slight clue is painful.

>>4935383
>of course this means the 6/10 will fuck the 9/10 dude, get pissed when he doesn't wanna date her because he's got his pick of all the 6/10s who deserve a dude like him

that's not exactly what i meant. I just look at stuff like tumblr, asofterworld, postsecret, and i just feel like girls my age are absolutely looney. a couple of the girls on my facebook who i used to know, i just had to unfollow them because it was like a daily window into the mind of a manic pixie crazy person and fuck me if im not crazy enough already

>>4935407
i woulda talked to you regardless cuz


no need to live by the agressive, ego-driven and one upping society you openly criticize

>>4935414
I was literally just bored and sleep deprived. I don't even know why I did it. Lol

>>4935354
His 141-pages "manifesto" can still be summed up, for the most part, by "I hate women how dare they not have sex with me". Though it's clear that the guy had a problem with everyone else, his level of misoginy in particular makes Schoppy sound like a radical feminist. He even says, at one point, that in his dream society women should be eradicated, except for a few ones (for reproduction purposes) so that men can carry on with building a civilization on their own.

>>4935410
What do you mean exactly?

>>4935418
That's all fine and dandy, but writing something and doing something are completely different things.
In theory he hated women more than men, but in practice he harmed more men then women.

>>4935419
the last four years of my life have been like >>4935413 said about the daily window into a crazy person, its not even just girls. Though maybe its because I've actually come of age and can finally realize how absurd it all is, but man...
Also I apologize for any lack of eloquence or any actual point here, its 3AM and I should go to bed.

>>4935267
i don't really think so, especially in LA/santa cruz
towards the end, he had a counselor telling him he just needed to get the fuck out of there but he was too deranged at that point to listen
when his parents tried to send him to morocco they had the right idea

>>4935426
I see what you mean. Being around teenagers in this day and age can be depressing. To be honest though, it has done wonders for my self-esteem when I see what supposedly smart kids are acting like.

And I got you beat here, its 5:30 AM and I have to spend all day tomorrow working during my town's parade.

Is it possible he's a comic genius? 4chan has inspired morbid irony before.

>>4935380
You seem to be idealizing something you don't know (or haven't known for long). Relationship in small town can be poisonous. People are more connected, but that doesn't mean they are happier or more emphatethic (in some cases they are just constantly spying, walking and gossiping on each other). The yearning for authenticity is understandible, but authenticity is not a state, it's a struggle. I think you better teach your kids (by example mainly) how to decently treat other people and deal with them on a human level.

>>4935441
i feel like his manifesto would be more deadpan and less poe

>be quiet awkward 21 year old who enjoys solitude more than company
>still a virgin, never even approached a girl for sex
>i like plenty of girls, my favourite person on earth is a girl
>everyone will assume i'm a ticking timebomb on the verge of slaughtering the lot of them now

t-t-thanks elliot. some girl on facebook just posted that she was scared because she "knows people just like that freak". is this is the beginning of the true end for the male recluse?

>>4935422
In practice he harmed people indiscriminately. I don't think he specifically set out to kill exactly two men for each women or whatever. It's not even about which gender he hates more (because at the end of the day he hated everyone). It's more about how is inability to have normal relationships was catalysed, so to speak, by his sexual frustration. Guys like him are also an expression of what's unhealthy in our gender relationships. I agree that "society hates woman" is a bad way to sum it up, though.

>>4935455
Technology was the beginning of the end for all manner of introverts. Good post, though, I too have had these thoughts.

>>4935455
If you like plenty of girls it is likely that you talk regularly to some of them. Facebook and Tumblr, despite what /pol sometimes believe, are among the last things on Earth that should bother a man.

>>4935448
>You seem to be idealizing something you don't know (or haven't known for long).

That may be the case. I spent a large portion of my childhood in Syria, where my parents were from. Life there was simpler and people still had that neighborly bond that I have rarely seen in the states. And you would actually see kids playing outside, something that is also become more rare. I learned a lot in those days, I was able to explore and venture on my own. I don't think I would have had the same experience here in an American suburb.

>>4935455
Yup. If you don't follow the mainstream anymore, you will be vilified as some kind of monster. People are already starting to see you as suspicious if you don't have a Facebook! So much for the individuality we tried to create, only to make ourselves into clones of each other..

>>4935407
I hadn't read far enough my bad. I think the 4chan culture of aggressivity tends to lower the quality of debate, this makes me prone to take baits.

>>4935463
what if you have a facebook but never update it and use it as a type of messenger because fucking everyone and their dog is on it like me? am i suspicious?

>>4935460
Syria is probably not a case of what I had in mind...although living there as a kid and as a parents are probably very different. The reason we crave simplicity nowadays, I think, is not that we lack socialization but precisely because we are hysterically over-socialized. Living in a modern hub doesn't mean you're connected to no one (that would be some sort of hermit life, rather peaceful in a way) but that you have a vague, general and unfulfilling relationship to everyone in the city, and it drains you energy. That's the core of the problem: we need to reparticularize relationships, if that makes sense. Moving to a less crowded area can help, but that's not a solution in itself.

>>4935473
That's true. We are all guilty of taking baits. But I think this Elliot incident might convince people that their words have more damage on people like him.

>>4935476
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2012/08/06/beware-tech-abandoners-people-without-facebook-accounts-are-suspicious/

You might be soon.

>>4935484
I see what your saying, we need to focus on quality rather than quantity when dealing with human interaction. Gotta love nature though.

>>4935460
an american suburb is a depressing place to grow up, people hate each other and they grow up sick. maybe we're doing something right that they aren't doing somewhere else, but our social fabric has denigrated to shit tier

>>4935494
True that. The conformity is mind numbing. Sucks that more advanced countries have shit relations with their neighbors. I guess this is the cost of advancement. But does it have to be this way.

>>4935510
if human relationships are based on selling yourself it will be that way

>>4935517
Lets hope not.
Anyway goodnight guys. Its 6:00 am over here and I have to get up at ten to walk in a parade in the blistering heat, with all the suburban shits I have been complaining about this entire thread staring at be. Should be fun.

>>4935488
>their words have more damage on people like him.

Yet it seems that what hurt him the most were his own words.
>>4935510
Conformism isn't really correlated with technological advancement. There are horrifying forms of conformism in India for instance, where the parents of a girl who has been defaced with acid by a rejected suitor will not report to the police for fear of backlash.
>>4935488
>Gotta love nature though.
Good environnment makes for good relationship with oneself, and I guess it's the forst step. We should really have prettier cities. Even a modern megapole like New York becomes more charming with artfully disposed trees.

>>4935510

warning post below unrelated


speaking of, the insane lack of self awareness of fucking governments in power

the hypocrisy of things like drones, internet slowdowns and mass invasions of personal privacy is on the same level of narcisissm-can't do no wrong my own interest is best as fucking elliot rogers soon to be synonymous with mental killer. if anyone else acted the same way they'd be the first to act on that shit

>>4935354
>Dude kills more men than women, but it's the women who are the important ones.
Are you an idiot? Seriously, are you an idiot? I'm on /lit/ yet your reading comprehension is zero.
He went to a sorority planning to kill all the women he could find. Then most likely he would have committed suicide there.
It just so happens that out of all the shots fired, he managed to kill a guy and two women (disregarding the apartment bodies, talking about the shots). I bet you that when the list of wounded is made public there will be more females than males. The bicyclists were bonuses.

>>4934016
Yes. Its impossible to tell just how crazy they are because they are smart enough to recognize that you are watching them. His family probably thought he just had a minor case of Aspergers and hated women--not something entirely murderous. You can't prevent these people from coming about.

>>4935619
>He went to a sorority planning to kill all the women he could find.

Even that he fucked up in his fuck up of a life.

Shine on, you crazy diamond..

>one person out of a couple hundred million goes on a shooting spree
>"See, this is why X theory on society is true. I told you all that X theory was completely right. X is why society is so fucked up."

This all seems like a massive confirmation bias for anyone that holds opinions on sex or narcissism.

>>4935545
>Conformism isn't really correlated with technological advancement. There are horrifying forms of conformism in India for instance, where the parents of a girl who has been defaced with acid by a rejected suitor will not report to the police for fear of backlash.

Shhh, let them live in their fantasy were modernity has some how harmed society. Give them their outlet.

>>4935633
Good thing it didn't happen.

>>4935639
it has and it hasnt

the irony is that our perspective is atypical and on average probably more "enlightened" than that of people from say uzbekistan or wherever, but we have sort of lost the benefits of feeling as though we're all in this together as a community

>>4933779
CWC 2

>>4935619
>Intention matters more than consequences
Fuck off Kant, he killed four men and two women.

>He voices his contempt for everyone from his roommates to the human race, reserving special hate for two groups: the women he says kept him a virgin for all of his 22 years and the men they chose instead.
Women may have been the CAUSE of his hatred, but he hated many, many people.
(By cause I mean what he thought was the cause. The actual cause was probably a shitty home life and some mental instability)

>>4935619
Anyone who knows basic psychology can see that he hated everybody, men and women, including himself. He just happened to hate women in a way that the media can use to its advantage.

>>4934016
Unfortunately yes.

The basicest basicest moral of Dostoyevsky is that people should be nice to each other and that even the worst person is redeemable.

Whether the Underground Man actually believes in his romantic ideals, whether he's a narcissist or a saint, doesn't matter anymore than it matters whether Don Quixote was really a hero or if he really believed in chivalry. The important thing is how other people treat them, and according to the Underground Man, "they won't let me be good."

I like to hold onto the optimistic view that the Underground Man actually could show sensitivity and empathy, but I don't know if Elliot Rodger could. Instead of someone rebelling against ideals of upotianism and social progress, change him to someone obsessed with videogames, with feminism, with women, with anime --- either way, the person goes "Underground", gets socially isolated from other people, and that's what makes this stuff happen.

>>4937051
>and according to the Underground Man, "they won't let me be good."

And that's why we don't allow crazy people to be the measure of their own situation. Rodgers had plenty of outlets for doing good, productive work. He shut out the world, it didn't shut him out.

>>4937070
That's the paradox, not only of that, but of Don Quixote as I mentioned. Are they both too sensitive and too idealistic, or is the world too callous and cruel for them?

>>4937051
>>4937070
>>4937083

I just realized that I don't understand why people become underground men. You say it's because of the way people treat them, but that only feels like part of it.

Why didn't OP search for "soaked"?

>>4935303
>we live in an age
>connect dots
>more common in the future

cut it out with your retarded future predictions, sex was always a fucking important thing for horny boys in their puberty, its nothing fucking new. that this guy snapped has fuck all to do with "modern society", guys like that existed throughout human history. read an encyclopedia about killers and then come back with with far reaching conclusions about the effects of modern society that are most likely the result of your own prudery and frustration rather than any real "analysis" whatsoever. fuck you.

>>4937208
>sex was always a fucking important thing for horny boys in their puberty, its nothing fucking new
Well duh! What is new is this society we live in, where people are more exposed to things like sex. You don't seem to be getting the point here.

>>4937253
Poor Jack the Ripper, truly a victim of his times.

>>4937278
Faggot stop thinking that things haven't changed at all through the ages when they have. You are young and have never known more than the few years you have been alive, so stop making assumptions on the little experience you have living. People have always killed people, but the reasons have changed and the context has as well. Society has changed from the perfect dad society it once was into the type that was present before monogamous relationships were the norm. If the kid was born 100 years ago, he would have settled down with a women in his level and lived out his life normally.
Fuck you, you dumb complacent fuck.

>>4937312
>the reasons have changed and the context has as well

human nature has not changed, neither have basic forms of psychological disorders or the usual effect they take.
he did not kill people because "modern society", he killed people because he was mentally ill.
there have always been serial killers, there have always been sexual crimes during every age in human history. just accept the fact that this stuff is nothing new instead of trying to instrumentalize it for some flimsy critique of modern society based on your own pretensions.

>>4937370
>he killed people because he was mentally ill

try telling that to tumblr.

but on another note, havent the last 20 years shown you anything about how modern society seems to have some very troubling, specific relations with the mentally disturbed?

>>4937393
>some very troubling, specific relations with the mentally disturbed?

like what?

>>4937370
>human nature has not changed, neither have basic forms of psychological disorders or the usual effect they take.
Look at this dumb fuck. Yes human nature at changed drastically since the ten thousand years of civilization we have had. And it continues to change, although slowly. We are not immune from our environment.

>he did not kill people because "modern society"
Our modern society puts sex on a high pedestal rather than being modest about it in the past.

>he killed people because he was mentally ill.
Get your pseudo scientific shit out of here.

>there have always been serial killers, there have always been sexual crimes during every age in human history
Agreed, but things change and the reasons change too.

>just accept the fact that this stuff is nothing new
But things have fucking changed drastically and we have as well. Things are only going to get much more different in the future, now that we have the ability to understand the biological building blocks that form us. Again, stop trying to make assumptions on the past and the future from your small experiences in life.

Instead of critiquing my ideas friend, who not critique your banal approach to life as if nothing has ever changed and human nature and history has remained static. You're a boring person with a boring outlook on life. Are you so afraid to face the fact that things change?

>>4933952
Shit I'm going to have to avoid conversations about him now.

>>4937400
well, in my view part of motivation of a jack the ripper or ted bundy is the desire for fame. But In the last 20 years weve had about a half-dozen attention-seeking looney tunes. I definitely feel as though this modern compulsion to receive attention is exacerbating/overlapping with the mental problems of disturbed people

>>4937458
>human nature at changed drastically
empty declarative statement.
>things change and the reasons change
empty declarative statement.

> things have fucking changed drastically and we have as well
empty declarative statement.

>Things are only going to get much more different in the future
empty declarative statement/ unlikely future prediction with no basis other than former empty declarative statement.

>stop trying to make assumptions on the past and the future from your small experiences in life
ad hominem.

>your banal approach to life
ad hominem

>as if nothing has ever changed
empty declarative statement.

>You're a boring person with a boring outlook on life
Ad hominem.

10/10 arguing, would debate again.

So instead of pulling all these opinions completely out of your ass and not backing them up with anything other than personal insults, why not give a few examples? Can you back up any of your statements with a single fact (and while you are at it, also answer my earlier question that I posed to point out yet *another* one of your empty declarative statements - the question which you conveniently ignored to write that very convincing post of yours?) No? Thought so.

>mfw

>>4935637
Try and mention a confirmation bias the next time you hear some self-affirming jackass spouting his vitriol, see what happens. He won't even know what that word means, or be open to the idea of analyzing anything he said.

>>4937051
the person goes 'underground', socially isolated etc., yet strangely enough all this douchebag seemed to want was to fit in and belong to society (as he thought he would by having a gf)

>>4937504
>empty declarative statement.
Human behavior has changed and our brains have physically changed as well. This is well known. You are a dumb nigger

>empty declarative statement/ unlikely future prediction with no basis other than former empty declarative statement
Have you seen the new research that is coming out of technology, genetics, and neuroscience? We understand ourselves a lot better than we once did and advancements are only going to increase more rapidly.

>ad hominem.
Ad hom is rejecting someones premise because of their character. I am rejecting your premise because it is wrong and explaining to you what you are doing wrong. Making fun of you after I reject your premise is not ad hom you dumb fuck.

>as if nothing has ever changed
Yes because life has always been static

>So instead of pulling all these opinions completely out of your ass and not backing them up with anything other than personal insults, why not give a few examples?
Look into the new technology we have and are developing. Look into the fact that scientist say our brains have changed physically from our cro-magnon ancestors. I guess you can't use reason with the stupid right?

>>4937534
A girlfriend would have projected a heterosexual image to the world, which is what he wanted most.

He didn't want to "fit in and belong", he wanted to look not-gay.

>>4937553
>I am rejecting your premise because it is wrong and explaining to you what you are doing wrong

Well, it is a shit job you are doing and that is why I tire of you and this discussion.
There is no reason to assume that basic human nature has significantly changed in the last few thousand years and as long as you don't come up with a very convincing proof there is no point in arguing this shit any longer. If you think that kid is product of society so be it. I tell you that everytime something similar that has happened in the past - and probably will happen in the future - people mostly argued exactly like that. "It is society!" It was always wrong, its just human.

>>4937557
Of all of the retarded analyses of this thing, from the MRA influence to the fact that he was half-Asian, the "he was secretly in the closet" theory is the dumbest.

>>4937605
>There is no reason to assume that basic human nature has significantly changed in the last few thousand years and as long as you don't come up with a very convincing proof there is no point in arguing this shit
Our skulls have shrunk and our neuro-anatomy has changed. We perceive reality through our brains, if our brains change, our reality changes.

>If you think that kid is product of society so be it
Everyone is a product of their society and genetics. Both are important

> I tell you that everytime something similar that has happened in the past - and probably will happen in the future
Sure things aren't so black and white. But things get a little different with time.

>It was always wrong, its just human
Our behavior has changed dumbass. What do you not understand.
Read The 10000 Year Explosion.

Goodbye you boring nigger

>>4937616
>he was secretly in the closet" theory is the dumbest.

I dunno, anon. The way he sometimes uses the word heterosexual and obsessively emphasizes how much he wants a girl combined with certain aspects of his body language .. I would not completely rule that out

>>4937629
>>4937605
And stop trying to take the high ground in an argument you have clearly lost in. Your last few replies stopped making any sense.

>>4937616
dude listened to whitney houston and loved titanic

it's not farfetched

>>4935637
See? This is why 4chan is asshole of the internet that nobody likes. 4chan is why internet is all fucked up.

>>4937629
>>4937637
>Read The 10000 Year Explosion.
>an argument you have clearly lost

I have not read that book yet, though I might.

I have read lots of history books though since I am a history student - basically the study of change over time - and as far as I can tell from my own reading (which is also the majorities opinion in this field), human nature has essentially stayed the same. consider that the majority opinion. Hence, you will find similar crimes such as these throughout all eras of human civilization which is convincing proof enough that it can not be simply 'modern societies' fault. You explanation is moncausal and simplistic.
Why do you have such a problem with accepting that humans work with very similar psychological processes, with very similar psychological dispositions and very similar medical conditions with comparable effects? You just have to compare 21. cent. war crimes with war in the middle ages or war in antiquity to see that not much has changed at all.

>>4937726
The crimes may be similar but the reason slightly change. And I doubt your a history student. And don't strawman my argument saying I simply blamed it on modern society when I went into more detail about it and said that is pushed already weak people like Elliot to the brink when it comes to sex.

Why do you have such a problem accepting the fact that shit is changing very quickly? Why do you think that human evolution has no effect on us at all?

>>4937748
Whatever, dude. We are going in circles and I would really like to watch something now instead of endlessly responding to anons.

We both have to let go.

Have some boobs as a sign of peace.

Of course I am still right and you are wrong.
This guy is right too: >>4935637

>>4937774
>Tits as a peace offering
Stay golden

>>4937774
Ok, whatever you like. Cya. Have this cool wallpaper.

>>4935436
>To be honest though, it has done wonders for my self-esteem when I see what supposedly smart kids are acting like.

i know this feel. and then these same people turn around and get preachy. It's slowly driving me nuts

Lets all just stop and listen, guys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Wu7Ax78hXo#t=37

>>4933899
>>4933891
sounds like Buddhism 101

>desire is suffering
>death of desire is freedom from suffering