/lit/ - Literature

Men are needed for the survival of the species due to the nature of human reproduction. Always a good point to make.

"Les Femmes Savantes" by Molière. Funny, anti-feministic play. It would be the best to read it in French but there are good German and English translations if you can't understand French.

>>448546
http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com/sciencetech/men-no-longer-necessary-for-sperm-production/750

Sorry, but we are on our way out.

It is the nature of the world, survival of the fittest. As the slow progress of men has finally made it to the point where physical strength no longer equals, women are gaining their rightful place in society. You can see the evidence all around you of their general higher intellectual and emotional maturity: more and more young males are going in to prison, the percentage of men in the college population is decreasing, males are more likely to be born with birth defects, men are more likely to die young, societies with more women in leaderships roles are advancing culturally and technologically.

Hopefully soon, more people will elect to have babies in this manner and more women will be born. Maybe we could even make a law for people to have babies with this method. Then men can fade back and the general happiness and progress of the world increase.

>>449048
AND then everyone will die and heat death of the universe

>>449048

>>449048
THIS, but with gay men

anything written before the 1900's

You could try: Camille Paglia . She is lesbian and she is OK with date rape

>>449048
Until they all hit their periods, at which point World War III will commence, and they will have nobody to piss off but their own kind.

Good arguments are nice. But arguing with any emotionally-driven and dogmatic person is a mistake.

How does one win over another's ill-founded emotions and intuition?

>>449096
with a bitch slap

>>449099

That was pretty much all that came to me. It was a mistake to "progress" to not hitting women. I don't advocate beating them senseless (moreso) but it's natural to correct children with a little smack (most of the smarter animals do it) and most women have all the self-control of children.

>>449048
Cool story, sis.

>>449109
You suppor child abuse

>>449048
>There is some question about whether a sperm cell created from a female could produce viable, healthy offspring. The human female sperm cells could not in their current state produce offspring as they do not have the correct amount of genetic material.

Troll harder, bitch.

Sometimes when my wife shits on the floor I smack her with a newspaper and rub her nose in the shit and shout "SEE THAT? DONT DO THAT"

The best criticism of feminism is history.
All the greatest artists, scientists, authors, politicians, philosophers, ect have been men.

>>449117
As I said in my post, I am male.

I think it is likely scientists working on this will find a way to get this to work. If they don't, though, there are other ways reproduction of soley females could be made to happen.

>>449147
The argument against taht: women historically have been ignored/haven't been allowed sufficient education to become one

>>449162
You don't need an education to become an artist or philosopher, bro.

>>449157
You do realize that being a male doesn't exempt you from being a bitch, don't you?

>>449157
List said ways. Otherwise, stop talking.

Like anyone here knows how gametes work

>>449181
They each contain half the genetic material necessary to make a human being. After a sperm and egg combine, it turns into a parasitic growth that grows up to be an idiot regardless of gender.

I think black people should be eliminated from the gene pool. Just IMO

>>449197
Haha wouldn't it be funny if there were someone named, heh, Gene Poole, phahahahahahahaha

>>449209
http://www.facebook.com/people/Gene-Poole/100000422845990

>>449213
Wut

Even if you do support feminism you should never let on. Women won't respect you for it. Most of them still want you to be dominant over them.

>>449241
Why would anyone support feminism?

>>449250
To bang a feminist, obviously.

>>449250
So that you can troll people on 4chan. That is the only reason feminists have ever existed. So they could troll people on internet boards

>>449250
Something approximate to this

>>449258
Have you ever seen a feminist? Instant boner killer.

>>449178
Cloning.

Keeping large reserves of human sperm.

Animals such as mice and pigs have been used to grow human body parts. Dna from males could be used to grow body parts on such animals and then these body parts could be used as containers for male genetic material which could be taken to make sperm and make more body parts to grow on animals. Then as the baby is growing it could be seen if the baby is male or female and act accordingly. There is some research that mother tesotosterone and estrogen levels could affect whether a baby will turn out to male or female. If this turns out to have a great affect, they could be manipulated during pregnancy to try and get female babies.

(Side note: In the future, if it is possible to find a general ideal hormone level for women, people might try to acheive this through selective breeding or dietary and supplementary hormones.)

>>449241

I support feminism, but the rare 'I actually want equality' kind. All but one woman I know couldn't figure out what I was talking about.

>>449270
I support this, but only if they don't allow the black ones to breed

>>449278
The sexes cannot be equal as they are not the same. This can be reduced to mathematic proof; but fuck just take it for what it is man.

>>448540
yeah, it get irritating.
However, some of it is correct. Don't get pissed off and say fuck feminism just because there's some die-hard radicals in the movement.

I am OK with all-woman paradise fantasy world as long as there are no niggers

>>449270
LOL CLONING. You copy something, you get errors in the DNA. Eventually, the quality of the genetic material degrades and it dies faster than the original creature. That's why the first cloned sheep died.

Reserves run out.

That's still using male DNA, so you're admitting that reproduction requires males to work.

>>449250
>>449258
>>449262

Yep. Some men feel that appearing to support feminism or expressing their support of feminism will earn them points, as basically all women are required to at least pay lip-service to it.

It won't earn you points. To feminists you're still an evil man. But furthermore to that you're a weak and cowed man.

It does not unite the sexes in equality, it seeks to divide us with women getting a larger share than they had. (or even a larger share than us)

>>449305
>It does not unite the sexes in equality, it seeks to divide us with women getting a larger share than they had

Herpity derpity doo. Feminists trying to get power is the best reason why every man should object to it. It would mean men giving up power they already have, and it isn't rational to give up power for any reason, except temporarily as a means to greater power.

But an all women world would just self implode in an all out bitchfest.

>>449305
>>449321

lol people actually believe this

>>449359
lol some people don't believe this

>>449359
Women had less power than men. Feminism's early goals were to give women equal rights to men. Which means that they wanted more rights than they had. They wanted more power. And they got equal legal consideration. Did they stop? No. They kept going because they wanted more power. Their goal is to gain power over men, legally, socially, and philosophically. Feminism is just Machiavellianism with tits.

Women make up 1/2 of the population. Any situation they are in is their own doing. How can it possibly be true that we live in a world determined exclusively by men?

That's the type of arguments I was looking for.

Or perhaps that the women's movement will ultimately fail because the women having children aren't the CEOs on Wallstreet but the housewives in Mexico.

Don't tell me people haven't thought of those questions and responded to them or is everyone here so sensitive to women's issues that they don't want to delve into them or they're so immature they can't get passed the trolling of lol women belong in the kitchen bullshit.

>>449109
I love it when men talk about self-control like they have any.

>>449082
And how many wars were started by men who were insecure about the size of their penises? Don't pull that menstruation bullshit. Men start wars because they have a hard-on for fucking other countries.

>>449147
Was this before or after millennia of oppression?

>>449166
Yet all the best artists and philosophers were educated.

>>449241
Really? Because I would respect the fuck out of him.

>>449285
Golden retrievers and bulldogs aren't the same. Does that make one superior to the other?

ITT: Idiots who think feminism=female supremacy.

>>449758
I think maybe you should read the thread before you make sweeping generalizations about everyone being a fucking misogynistic.

>>450735
>>450728
>>450724
>>450721
>>450710
>>450697
Try harder

what do you people find in these threads to make you want to reply to them? i dont understandddddddddddd

>Implying that people are straight by choice.

>>450745
If more followers of feminism didn't think of feminism in this way, then there would not be a problem.

An example of feminism from http://open.salon.com/blog/jodi_kasten/2009/05/27/equal_rights_for_men:

There are many, many ways I can think of that women are not yet equal to men. We still only make a fraction of what men do on a per-dollar basis. (76 cents I believe?) We are not allowed into full combat in the military. We are judged on our ability to be mothers and housekeepers before our ability to do our jobs. All of that is real and I am the last person to say there aren’t a million other reasons that women have not yet attained equal status with men.

However, I have a bone to pick with my female counterparts. Feminism is all about each woman having the right to choose her own path. We should be allowed to do whatever we want in this life and not be judged by society’s arbitrary sex roles, right? Absolutely.

What about men? Do they enjoy this right?

Some examples:

Bob and Jane are a middle class couple. They have two children. They get an amicable divorce. There is a custody hearing. Both of them are good parents. Both of them want to be the primary custody holder. Who gets the children? Seriously, every single time, unless Jane lights up a crack pipe in the courtroom she will get physical custody. Bob is expected by society to be happy with every other weekend and two weeks in the summer. Don’t believe me? What would you think if you heard that a woman only saw her children every other weekend and a few holidays? I PROMISE you would think, “What did she do to lose her kids?” But, with men, that’s just the way it goes, right?

What message does it send to men about what sort of fathers they should be when it's made clear by the courts and their ex-wives that their most important contribution as fathers is a timely child support payment?

Even in less weightier arenas men lose out. If you drive by a house with a dying lawn, is your first thought about what a crappy homeowner the WOMAN is who lives there? Doubt it.

How about at work? Women can openly talk in the break room about the hot new guy in Receiving. What kind of pigs are the men who talk about the hot new manager who happens to be a woman? If a woman asks a male co-worker out on a date, the worst that can happen is rejection. For a man, the worst that can happen is the loss of his job and a sexual harassment suit. Is that gender equality?

Women can wander the world and hug every child they see without suspicion. If a woman gathers the neighborhood children together to organize a community garden, she’s a saint. If a man does it, people wonder if he’s a pedophile. Don’t believe me? Imagine you’re in a toy store and a woman shopping alone comments on what a beautiful little girl you have. You are pleased and flattered. You fill in the woman’s story in your head. She’s probably an overworked mother out to buy toys for a birthday or holiday. What about the middle-aged man wandering that same store alone? Wouldn’t it at least cross your mind that he could be a pervert? Of course it would.

I'm all for equality of the sexes if it means I can wear women's clothing in public.

It’s completely okay, even applauded, when female writers, comediennes, singers, song writers and talk show hosts make sweeping generalizations about ALL men being stupid, sex driven, lazy assholes. How do we feel about men who say that women are all crazy, hormonal, irrational, ditzy, frigid bitches?

Thousands of men in America today are routinely physically abused by women. What shelter do they show up at with their children and the clothes on their backs? What would it take to get you to believe that a six-foot-tall, 200 pound man is abused by his tiny little wife? But, every single one of us has seen a woman who could easily beat her husband’s ass being smacked around by a wiry little Napoleon-like man. What would you think of a man you heard say, “I am afraid of my wife?”

What a wussy, right?

I must say, I don’t know a single man, NOT ONE, who thinks I am a lesser person because I have a vagina. The men I know see women as mysterious, alluring and even holy. Men are now often the stay-at-home parent. Women have the option of being the sole breadwinner in a way they have never been allowed before in human history. I know my husband would do that for me in a second.

People want what they can’t have. Women are sent the message that any man will sleep with them because sex is all they think about. Sex makes them stupid, right? Men are told that women will “hold out on them.” We all want the unattainable, what we can’t have.

What would you think of a man who told a woman he would give her diamond jewelry if she had sex with him? How is that different than “holding out” on a man because he doesn’t give you jewelry? Or take out the garbage? Or mow the lawn? There should be no "price" on intimacy.

We will only have equal rights as women when we FULLY recognize that each person is a human being, regardless of sex, with the same wants, needs and feelings as everyone else. Sure, we’re hooked up differently. But, how can we expect to be treated equally as women when every man is characterized as Homer Simpson?

One final thought - I was clothes shopping with my almost-12-year-old daughter the other day. We saw t-shirts that said, “Girl Power!” – “Girls Rock!” – “Boys Suck!” – and my personal favorite “Boys Are Great, Every Girl Should Own One!”

I also have an almost-11-year-old boy. If he went to school with a shirt that said “Boy Power!” or “Girls Are Great, Every Boy Should Own One,” how long would he last? I guess it just goes without saying that boys can do anything, including staying silent while girls are brought up in a culture that has swung from female empowerment to male bashing.

suppose all I really want to say here is that it is wrong to judge any sex as a whole. Men and women are individuals. We all begin as children and children do what is expected of them. If we expect men to be stupid, sex-crazed frat boys, many will comply. If we expect girls to think “Boys Suck,” they will comply.
We do NOT have to stand on the backs of men to get ahead.
We can go forward together.

>>450832
who's stopping you?

>>450846
The same thing that stops women from earning as much as men, apparently.

The best counter is "I agree: it is a fact that the linguistic and logical nature of british/american society is phallocentric. I will do my best to support women in their endevours to tackle male chauvenism, but I will not go as far as to support female sexism."

>>450859
I can deal with that.

>>450859
This, basically one of the only sane responses in this whole shitty thread.

>>449209
This, basically one of the only sane responses in this whole shitty thread.

Femanon here. All of this bullshit about MALE LANGUAGE is nauseating. I cant read a textbook anymore with the word 'he' in it without having some self righteous feminist classmate attack the teacher about it.

What the fuck. It is not a policeWOMAN, it's policeman. Pronounced policemuhn. I dont see what the big deal is, but whenever I say that I get called dirty names. -__-

>>450995
You may be a bit naive.
Sure, when it's pronounced 'muhn', that's fine. Unfortunately it goes deeper than that.

...just no. women have been oppressed for CENTURIES, since the beginning of time. for all the shit we have to deal with, and still not have equality, we could at least have these advantages (if you can even call them that) that you're talking about. there's NO way you can compare a girl getting a t-shirt that says "Boys are great, all girls should own one!" to the horrible things that girls and women have had to go through and are still going through today. your arguments are just... ugh.

>>451081
lol

Sex-Ploytation by Matthew Fitzgerald.

>>450751
Uh ... I STARTED the thread and was trying to get it back on track to what I was asking.

>>451081
Should we just completely ignore female sexism and turn into what we're fighting against? Yes, women have been oppressed for centuries and are still being oppressed in some parts of the world, but simply reversing this won't make it go away. All sexism is evil regardless of who it's directed towards, and until both men AND women realize this, there will always be inequality.

>>451081
Wahh boo hoo. All women who believe this are just whiny bitches. They certainly weren't ever oppressed.

Without men, they would have all been eaten by bears and shit. I seriously hope you're a troll. Women deserve to be "oppressed" for being so fucking dumb.

Men invented the world, and the objects in it, and 4chan and all its boards. You can't deny that.

>>450814
Bullshit, they've done research that shows that when you take a woman and man who both work equal times in the workplace that they have the same earning power. What's throwing off the numbers is the amount of time women take off to bear children and be mothers. And then women have the audacity to claim that time off for pregnancy or child rearing should have no bearing on whether or not they receive a promotion or pay raise at work as if the 6 months of experience a man receives during that time is worth nothing and he simply needs to eat it. You made your choice to be a mother, deal with it.

>>451104
You mean that $100 book on Amazon baaaaaaawwwing over the fact that men can't find a super-model type girlfriend who isn't after their wallet? Here's some advice that will save you the money: start dating women with real tits and you might develop a relationship with real substance.

>>451152
..... did you even bother reading the rest of it?

Good to know "feminism" troll threads aren't sure to suceed only on /co/.

Stay classy, /lit/

Jesus, what do you guys think feminism is? You're as bad as fundamentalist Christians who think atheists are Stalinist, Satan-worshiping, baby-raping crack addicts. If you support gender equality, you're a feminist. That's most people. Anything else is something else entirely.

>>451232

>If you support gender equality, you're a feminist.
>gender equality
>feminist

Gee, something sure doesn't add up here.

Women were "oppressed" by men because men are better. That is why, all things being equal; women did not enjoy all of the same rights men had.

But if men are better; why are women gaining ground today?

Because men got the ball rolling on the feminism movement. Men bank-rolled it and spread it via the media, which they controlled.

Feminism was invented for two reason:
*To exploit women in all of the ways men are exploited, ways in which they were previously protected.
*To strip rights away from men in the name of giving them to women. (in reality the women never got them)

Powerful men fanned the flames of feminism to destroy the traditional family and extend their power over the less fortunate of either sex.

Just take a look at any notable feminist. They're fucking headcases. They couldn't seriously change the world.

can you retards stop with this nonsense?

>>451167
Yes I read it, and I think it's pretty cool. I'm just commenting on the 76 cents per dollar bullshit, not the rest of the article.

>>451255
lol

>>451232
I do not however, support 'gender equality'. Gender equality has existed from the beginning of time. Read the first line in my comment here >>449758
Simply put it's impossible for half the population to be subservient to the other half. Any 'inequality' is a choice made by women over centuries that they preferred to be mothers and homemakers over warriors and bankers and what's wrong with that? A homemaker is an equal profession to a lawyer, a warrior, or the president of the whole damned United States.

The problem lies in the fact that society doesn't recognize the efforts mothers and housewives have given to society and women are lashing out because herp derp I don't get public accolades for doing the laundry, I need to get rich and famous to show I can. Who gives a shit? That's not important in life, why should it have been decided that we need to screw kids by putting them in overcrowded daycares or let the school system raise them, I'm too busy rising through the ranks of my business to give a shit.

It's goddamn SELFISHNESS that's causing all this bullshit, bullshit I say and we applaud that as progressive? Holy fuck man, seriously the best thing that's going to happen is when the women's movement fails because of those Mexican housewives I mentioned. The ones who are mothers before they're business executives. We're taking a step back in most western societies and think it's a good thing.

I have a female friend of mine who was a homemaking major (yes it exists) who said one of the most profound things to me I've ever heard on the subject. "Until homemaking can be seen as an honorable profession equality cannot be achieved." That's the problem, not 'let's all be rocket scientists and politicians because that's a great thing!'

Dear god NO.

>>450814
>We still only make a fraction of what men do on a per-dollar basis. (76 cents I believe?)

reason.com/archives/2007/04/30/the-truth-about-the-pay-gap

hey everyone

penis>vagina

>>451304
Penis enters vagina

Anyone who is anti-feminist is machist. In other words, a sexist and racist faggot who thinks that men are superior to women, thinks that beating women and children is fine, and hates fags in order to repress their repressed homosexual desires.

He also believes in either God or Hitler.

In short, anti-feminists are the cancer of our modern society.

>>451310
Agreed.

>>451310

you are a troll, right?

>>451325
Maybe, maybe not. Here's a hint: that post is not a sage.

>>451293
>Any 'inequality' is a choice made by women over centuries that they preferred to be mothers and homemakers over warriors and bankers and what's wrong with that.

Evolution doesnt work like that kid.

Some massive faggot thousands of years ago said that we are ruled by some magical skygod and there are still millions of retards elieveing in that myth.

Its because they choose to believe? Of course not. It was imposed on them as children, as values by their parents, by their leaders and by society in general. Same with gender roles, it is a social imposition.

In the bible it says somewhere that is a sin for women to wear men's clothes. Its a religious law. Joan of Arc was burned to death because of that.

>>451293
If homemaking is such an honorable profession, then why do so many men look down on it? Why is it perfectly honorable when a woman does it, yet openly mocked when a man does it?

>>451331
My brother's a homemaker, yes I'm the writer of >>451293
and I applaud him for doing it. The problem is it doesn't work that way 98% of the time and you know it. Women have proven better at being child rearers than men and it has to do primarily with genetic disposition which has been in force for millions of years. It is rare if not next to impossible to find a species of animal where the male does the child rearing and yet we think we can fight against DNA with words? Doesn't work that way my friend. Doesn't work that way at all.

I don't give a shit about feminism. I just like making up bullshit stories in these threads about why things are so.

>>451358
I don't doubt that women make ideal homemakers, but I am thoroughly opposed to the idea that biology dictates destiny. My own mother devoted a great deal of time to her four children before entering the nursing field. This resulted in my brothers, sister and I spending a lot of time with daycare providers, but we all still turned out pretty well. In spite of having four kids and a husband in the military, my mother was still able to pursue the career of her choice and provide for her family. I see this as a living example of feminist movement triumphing.

>>451358
Well humans have the advantage of reason while other species' do not.

I mean yeah they're guy and girl brains but how much of that is innate and how much is thought?

>>451481
other species reason. what separates man from beast is awesome modern tech. beast only has primitive cellphone size of shoebox

>>451470
"My mother was great regardless of her actions. How dare you say anything bad about my mother"

Reduced your argument for you.

How about the fact that men who are homemakers live some 5-10 years less than men who are not because they are not equipped to handle the stress of homemaking as women are, or the fact that women hear a higher range of sounds making them more capable of hearing babies cry? That's just what I know from casual listening, I've never even looked into what differences science has found.

Plus the more we study the genetic differences between men and women the more we will come to an understanding that women are genetically created to be homemakers and men are not. We're still in the infant stages of such studies and feminists try to ignore them because it upsets their fight for power.

Men are naturally stronger but I want to be a fireman too, it's not fair! Men have more stamina but I want to be a soldier too, it's not fair! Men have faster reaction time then women but I want to be a pilot too, it's not fair!

Lets put lives in danger for lol "equality". Good one feminists, real good one.

>>451496
In case anyone doubts reaction time
http://www.colorado.edu/eeb/courses/1230jbasey/abstracts%202005/21.htm

The stronger and more stamina is well known enough that I shouldn't have to quote anything. But women insist on equality in jobs where such things are vital.

>>451496
this picture simultaneously refutes and supports your arguments.

>>451496
Men die on average earlier than women do regardless of their professions. Hell when it comes to fetal deaths male babies die a lot more than females do.

>>451492
I'm no zoologist but last I checked only a few mammals in the primate and some dolphins were shown to exhibit basic reasoning.

>>449157
ah but you see sir, once there is only one gender there will be no males OR females. Because what is a female if a male does not exist? That's truly the best thing to remind feminists or sexists of any kind, the concept of a "superior sex" can only be entertained as long as an opposite sex exists. Even if sexes are equal. We define one another, without one the other cannot exist.

>>451521
If clumps of bacteria can be shown to "reason" (i.e. solve complex problems), then you either have to figure out what it is you really mean by reason, or just throw it out as a line between man and beast

>>450814
you know why women aren't allowed in full combat rolls in the military and men are? Tell me, when a man gets taken prisoner by say, the taliban, what do you think they'll do to him? Belittle him, chain him, beat him for information if they think he has it, maybe behead him. What do you think they will do to a woman they take prisoner? I am NOT a fan of the military, its a barbaric organization made up of neanderthals. But some of the rules in place NEED to be in place. And that is one of them. Considering 1/3rd of all female soldiers are raped by their fellow US soldier...I don't think we need to be putting them in a position to raise that rate, do you?

>>451496
>How dare you say anything bad about my mother
>Implying that anyone said anything bad about my mother

I was using her as an example of how feminism can work without TEARING APART THE VERY FABRIC OF TRADITIONAL FAMILY VALUES ZOMG!!!!!!! And regardless of her actions? More like, because of her actions.

>>451545
Are men unable to be raped? Rape isnt about sex or gender, its about violence, degradation, and domination. A man is just as likely to be raped by his captors as a woman.

Dont throw the whole rape argument around when you dont understand it.

>>451545
that's because no soldier who was taken prisoner will even CONSIDER to admit he was raped by the ones who captured him. The rate for men who do not file charges for rape is as high as 98% (See Krug et al, 1998), mainly because being a man who was raped is actually quite worse than being a woman who survived it.

>>451527
I need some citation of this. Pretty sure that when people say humans reason they're stating that we're capable of thinking logically, deducing things i.e. get a bunch of info and using your own interpretation of a set of data (along with your own bias and whatnot) to come to a conclusion

Bacteria just adapts and functions efficiently everything in it's genetic makeup is designed for its survival. It cannot make any sort of logical deductions or stray from it's programming. Every science thing be it book, show, teacher or professor I've ever encountered has stated that microorganisms aren't thinking nor are they capable of thought.

But I digress. Science is always fucking itself up with some new findings and this has nothing to do with women and men. Women are great if they wanna play big man let 'em. It's cute.

>>450853
wanna know why women don't earn as much as men statistically? Maternity leave. That's it. That's the big secret conspiracy. STATISTICALLY SPEAKING women are not at work as many hours a year as men, and generally that's because of children. Now are those circumstances totally fair? Well you could argue that they're not and I would listen, or you could say they chose to have to kid so deal with it. Either way it's irrelevant. Fairness does NOT mean you should be paid the same as a coworker who works more than you. Find a woman with no children, who works 5 days a week 340 days a year and you will also find she makes as much as her male counter-parts. But that's not the argument, the argument is ON AVERAGE women make less, well ON AVERAGE they clock less. That's it.

>>451081
yeah cuz you went through centuries of persecution personally right? It's this same logic that says I can't criticize affirmative action because 140 years ago people had black slaves

>>451554
>A man is just as likely to be raped by his captors as a woman.

lol yes the homophobic, misogynistic, sharia law run taliban is just as likely to rape a man as a woman. Do you HONESTLY believe that?

>>451554
Ok, this coming from a guy who researches rape for about 5 years: it's not ONLY about violence, degradation, and domination. It actually diverges quite a lot between rapists (see A. Pardue and B. A. Arrigo
Power, Anger, and Sadistic Rapists: Toward a Differentiated Model of Offender Personality - it's an interesting review of the 1977 model proposed by AN Groth, W Burgess and LL Holmstrom.). I have interviewed imprisoned rapists and their discourses vary wildly on motive and modus operandi. And it can't be said that some rapes happen completely devoid of these effects - solely based around sexual pleasure (and thus, violence and power do not enter the equation; often because the rapist does not perceive it as a rape).

>>451573
Sodomizing a man with a tool or weapon is not considered homosexual in the eyes of Allah. If you do it with your dick or fingers than yeah it's gay

>>451554
fine I take it back, you wanna go into the military, have your unit get ambushed and captured, then as the men are being beaten and the hadjis are stripping your pants off you can yell MEN ARE JUST AS LIKELY TO BE RAPED AS WOMEN! Be my guest. I'm sure they'll understand. But as for my girlfriend, she joins the army over my dead body

>>451573
have you ever seen any study on homossexuality in afghanistan and iraq? maybe you should look beyond religion as a defining factor. if america has had closet homossexuals during equally distressing times for gays, do you really think they simply do not exist there?

>>451578
you're not familiar with the historical practices of how the taliban treats prisoners are you? why anyone would want to get rid of a law that keeps them out of the military is beyond me, if they ever reinstate the draft I'm going gay

>>451589
Nah actually I was just speaking out my ass (GET IT!?)

>>451585
this is irrelevant, of course there are homosexual people in iraq and iran, do you think that's going to magically undue the socio-political atmosphere of the region for a few minutes just to let 1 gay taliban soldier buttfuck the male prisoners? the point is they live in a totalitarian theocracy in which raping a woman is A OK but gay sex gets you the death penalty. If you are a female soldier captured (honestly in any country during any war) the odds of you getting raped go up 100%

>>451591
yeah, we all knew that already

>>451580
I said nothing about wanting to go into the military, but its silly to say a woman is more likely to be raped solely on their gender, like its the presence of a vagina that makes turns a man into a slobbering rapist. Sure, she probably would get raped, but because its another form of torture in such a situation, not because its just something you do when you have a woman at your disposal.

>>451599
Fuck you laugh at my gay jokes

>>451603
Why wouldn't rape be the number one torture option for women?

>>451607
why wouldnt it for men? its degrading for both sexes. Seems like itd be even more degrading for a man, imo.

>>451597
Yes, rape has been used as a weapon for as long as wars have existed, from ethnic cleasning, to vengeance and even to keep soldiers morale.

Yet, it is entirely possible that it happens all the time and is: 1. under reported, 2. reported but kept hidden, 3. used exactly because of the demoralizing effect, even under the religious circumstances.

If those guys are willing to break half of the Qur'an laws that deal with peacefulness and acceptance, they sure as hell won't stop at this one specific law if this gives them an edge against a technologically superior army, affecting the grunts in the field is about all they can do.

>>451603
you don't just experience wanton torture as a POW, but if you honestly think a woman is not more likely to get raped because she is a woman, then you are beyond the capability for reasonable conversation and I can see no point in continuing. Conversation can be made with reasonable people who are in touch with reality and are able to humble their egos enough to see that they might be wrong. It cannot however, be made with the dogmatic. You can try and argue that it is in fact I who is being unreasonable, but frankly my dear, I don't give a damn

>>451612
Because those Taliban fags are DERP DERP religious doing any sort of gay stuff is not ok.

But a woman even if she's an AMERIKKKAN PIG is A-Ok in the eyes of the Holy Allah.

>>451612
because heterosexual soldiers, even if their moral compasses are so skewed that they are willing to rape a women (considering that in the region of iran this is considered acceptable, and female rape victims can actually be jailed for being raped, this isn't unlikely) would not be willing to rape another man. Anyone who argues that sexual pleasure doesn't play into a rape is completely ill-informed on the subject

>>451618
>>451618
>>451618
>>451618
FUCK YEAH CLARK GABLE AND SHIT UP IN THIS BITCH

>>451618
I never said you were unreasonable. Im just saying you cant state these things as fact when theres simply not enough evidence to support either idea. Sure, a woman probably would get raped, but a man probably would, too. Thats just my point, but you seem to let it get under your skin like im saying that women never get raped and its actually men that do.

or i could just say reasonable/unreasonable over and over and pretend its a winning counterpoint like you are.

>>451618
Bitch status:
Told [x]

Double told [x]

I don't see anyone here saying women will not be raped, it's fairly obvious.
The real question here is: why do you think rape is WORSE than any other form of torture?

>>451629
>>451629
>Im just saying you cant state these things as fact when theres simply not enough evidence to support either idea.

sigh, ok sweetie, look:

" The U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (1999) estimated that 91% of U.S. rape victims are female and 9% are male, with 99% of the offenders being male.[6] In one survey of women, only two percent of respondents who stated they were sexually assaulted said that the assault was perpetrated by a stranger.[7] For men, male-male rape in prisons has been a significant problem. Several studies argue that male-male prisoner rape might be the most common and least-reported form of rape, with some studies suggesting such rapes are substantially more common in both per-capita and raw-number totals than male-female rapes in the general population."


I am saying, that unfortunately rape is a crime almost exclusively perpetrated by men, against women. This is horrible, but true. And there is all the evidence in the world to support it. Do men get raped? YES. But is it more common for it to happen to a woman? NINETY-ONE PERCENT MORE LIKELY, THAT is why women are not allowed in full combat roles, because they are practically GUARANTEED to be raped if captured. WAR SHOULDN'T EXIST, but it does, and the age old practice of protecting "the women and children" IS NOT chauvinistic it is simply realistic and ALTRUISTIC.

>>451638
here's some citations, swallow it bitch.

# ^ Human Rights WatchNo Escape: Male Rape In U.S. Prisons. Part VII. Anomaly or Epidemic: The Incidence of Prisoner-on-Prisoner Rape.; estimates that 100,000-140,000 violent male-male rapes occur in U.S. prisons annually; compare with FBI statistics that estimate 90,000 violent male-female rapes occur annually.[www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2007/offenses/violent_crime/forcible_rape.html
# ^ Robert W. Dumond, "Ignominious Victims: Effective Treatment of Male Sexual Assault in Prison," August 15, 1995, p. 2; states that "evidence suggests that [male-male sexual assault in prison] may a staggering problem"). Quoted in Mariner, Joanne. 2001. "No Escape: Male Rape In U.S. Prisons. ISBN 1564322580
# ^ Struckman-Johnson, Cindy and David Struckman Johnson. 2006. A Comparison of Sexual Coercion Experiences Reported by Men and Women in Prison. Journal of Interpersonal Violence, Vol. 21, No. 12, 1591-1615 (2006)DOI: 10.1177/0886260506294240; reports that "Greater percentages of men (70%) than women (29%) reported that their incident resulted in oral, vaginal, or anal sex. More men (54%) than women (28%) reported an incident that was classified as rape."

>>451637
........................

>>451637
Cause it's deeply personal. Being sexually violated vs getting punched repeatedly and factor in how soceity treats sex and violence and well it speaks for itself.

>>451642
quite the enlightening answer, anon

>>451638
>>451639
Bitch status:

signed and cosigned of Told [x]

Told on a level bordering abusive [x]

WAIT, does this warrant EPIC TOLD STATUS??


LETS GO TO THE JUDGES!! (judges animooted for your pleasure)
<------- Judges judgment??
EPIC TOLD [X]

>>451629
>cant state these things as fact when theres simply not enough evidence to support either idea
>a woman probably would get raped, but a man probably would, too

>>451651
calculus jokes lol

>>451645
I have read several scientific articles dealing with the experiences of victims of tortured and rape, and they seem to disagree. The actual victims see both torture and rape as continuous and not at all different from one another. (I'd reccomend a few authors but they're mainly south american victims of the various military dictatorships who experienced quite a lot of both)

>>451661
uh huh, that's cute, post links you stupid broad. other anon cited his shit, why cant you? oh also, BITCH BEEN TOLD

This thread

>>451669
fine: http://www.slab.uff.br/bd_txt_lg_autor.php?nome_autor=Cec%EDlia%20Coimbra&tp=a

Various articles by Cecilia Coimbra, Phd in Psychology. She was a victim of both torture and rape in prison during the 70s in Brazil (she was a leftist militant during the right wing military dictatorship).

For the OP, or anybody who's interested really. If this hasn't already been mentioned:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masculism

I'm still waiting for someone to give birth to The Boss. She could single handeldy take down all those fucking terroists.

NEVAH 4GET

>>450814
Woman can have equal rights when they can take punches like a man and not use their "I'm a female" bullshit when ever it is in their favor

>>450995
There is simply no satisfying some people. You wonder why we have words for man and woman but none that are gender neutral? Because we already got rid of the word for males centuries ago to be chivalrous and humble. 'Man' is gender neutral. The old words were 'wereman' (like werewolf) and 'wyfeman' (now woman).

The feminists that complain about this are ignorant of history and won't be satisfied until no words exist that males can refer to themselves with.

Why is this thread is still exists

>>452712
Or: maybe people should try not to punch each other. Crazy thought, I know

>>453199
>>452712
stop bumping this you fagwads

Feminists overcompensate because they're insecure about their concepts of equality and femininity. I don't mean equality in the legal sense; I mean they doubt sexual equality can exist in any social sense. And they act like they want this "sexual equality" to the point that they'll deny their femininity and even try to make up new definitions for it!

>>453199
Feminists do know that. Have you seen the word "womyn" before? lol

>>453265
I haven't, and looking it up, it's supposed to be some stupid way to get "men" out of their gender-specific word thinking it's somehow related to males. This directly contradicts the statement that they are aware of the roots of these words, unless you are implying these feminists are just great big trolls.

>>453199
I hope you're trolling.

Using the neutral term to refer to men when it did not used to is not humble.

Holy shit. This thread has been going for two days.

I ignored this thread before but I just wanted to note that.

>no voice because language itself is male and women are forced to use male language to express themselves they can never be truly heard

You know a lot of languages actually have genders.. like Un and Une, for it the table is feminine or masculine.. so this argument is already null.

>>455220
I never agreed it was humble. It reminds me of something Socrates said to Antisthenes as he was showing off holes in his clothing. "Through your clothes, I can see your vanity."

I don't know when this nonsense started really but it wouldn't surprise me if it was those Victorians' faults. We've effectively lost the possibility of always being gender-neutral now that most people have mutually agreed "man" is a masculine term unawares. GJ English.