/lit/ - Literature

Keep in mind OP is an atheist. Not a bible basher.

Return to Aristotle.

Problem solved.

>>4240108
>implying this doesn't mean a return to God anyway

>However, the Ubermensch will never be born because people are content to be pacified with escapism (drugs, video games etc). Humans are increasingly turning away from reality to indulge in fantasy.

YOU DO REALIZE THAT THAT ASSUMPTION IS ITSELF A SYMPTOM OF THE "GENERAL" SOCIAL NIHILISM TO WHICH YOU REFER?

THE ODDS FOR THE OCCURRENCE OF THE ÜBERMENSCH ARE INVERSELY PROPORTIONAL TO THE DEGREE OF DEGENERACY.

A REGRESSION TOWARD RELIGIOUS TRADITIONALISM WOULD ONLY WORSEN THE SITUATION, AND IT WOULD BE A SYMPTOM OF DEGENERACY ITSELF.

the übermensch concept will be born at some point.

btw. the biggest bummer of christianity is that the messiah is not coming back. i mean jesus' morality is mainly based on the concept of the judgement day.
he'll not be back.

so either we wait for jesus, or the übermensch to save us from decay.

>>4240123
What does degeneracy mean to you?

Civilisation is not based on sheeple, it's based on elites. So whether the common man wants the Overman or not will not have any effect on the outcomes. We are already able to change our genetics with potentially big competitive advantages. In biology this is called an unstable equilibrium. The first one of a group of people or a group of civilisations to adapt a profitable new pattern will have so many advantages that the group has to follow or perish. Basically, we are just waiting for the first Eugenic war.

I'm not much into philosophy, but how can you build something on morale that comes from a self-respected lie? That's a top tier hypocrisy for me. Might work, but I'd rather jump on a lego brick barefoot.

If you can "force" the God revival, you can skip and force only the creation of morale. Can't you?
The only difference is that the God-based morale is forced through the fear of punishment, which is why it's easier to implement and enforce. But... That's just immoral, dude.

>>4240150
Would you?
http://youtu.be/fpAZJzD3L1E?t=2m18s

>>4240101
>Moral relativism is bad.

shut up faggot

>implying anyone here understands Nietzsche
>basing your angsty theory on his books
>such shitposting

>>4240101
>The concept of God allowed for a defined moral and value system.
>People don't agree on it.
Seems pretty useless.

What do you think this is, some buffet? God ain't fucking food dipshit, you don't 'revive' him.

>>4240295

>Food
>Revive

Put that metaphor down, son.

>>4240295
mad christfag detected

>>4240311
Nope. He's dead and theres nothing you can do about it.

>>4240320

>>4240101
relativism is bad
>says you =P

>>4240101
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man

>>4240101
>Moral relativism is bad.
Is this a koan?

You propose to revive god by first announcing it here?

He's due for a proper makeover I admit of such. So he's revitalizing through emergence from 4chan.

I take it Nabokov is to be his holy most prime disciple?

Then I, for one, found me some religion.

>>4240359
Are you retarded or autistic?

>>4240101
>The concept of God allowed for a defined moral and value system.
When you look at religious times the only advantage of this is that it required people to be more creative to work around these values and justify their own desires, sharpening their sophism and general mental abilities.

But these nihilistic times also have their own advantage. The dull get lulled to sleep, the weak are allowed to weep, the strong take advantage and the wise reinvent themselves. As far as Nietzsche would be concerned, only the latter group counts. The whole value game has never been played by large groups anyway. It's always a vanguard endeavour.

I think we live in glorious times. I can live a Spartan life on welfare and dedicate myself to living well and thinking well. As long as this exists I'm happy to ignore the silly games of politics and economics and focus on greater things. In the first world, only dumb and weak people still need to work. For the rest of us, the playground is opened. We can talk shit in the agora again all day. Let's reinvent those values.

>>4240384
Yes.

>>4240101
>However, the Ubermensch will never be born
False.

>>4240348
=P

>>4240123
>traditions and religion equals degeneracy
>being this retarded
Come back when you can figure out why both of those are important for a healthy society by yourself instead of parroting some overthinker faggot.

OP you can't do that because people will just kill him again for the same reasons as before, and we'll be back in the same place. You can't have a revived-God-because-God-died-but-we-need-God.

>>4240428

1. RELIGIOUS TRADITIONALISM IS OBSOLETE NOW; STAGNANT. SEEKING REFUGE IN IT WOULD BE A SOCIOCULTURAL, AND SPIRITUAL REGRESSION.

RELIGION ITSELF IS A SYMPTOM OF DEGENERACY; IT IS INSTITUTIONALIZED & STAGNATING SPIRITUALITY. ALL MEANING & PURPOSE HAS BEEN LOST, OR FORGOTTEN, AND ONLY SYMBOLISM, AND ROTE RITUALISM REMAIN.

2. WHO AM I "PARROTING", ACCORDING TO YOU?

>>4240428
>arbitrary conceptions of stability and stagnation as a sign of health

Kek.

>>4240434
>>4240441
As I said, came back later.

>>4240451
Your ideas of a healthy society seem of the dullard nation of shopkeepers variety, you drowsy petit-bourgeois cunt.

>>4240101
Denying extremes only makes the happy medium uninhabitable.

>>4240434
Why do you post in all caps?

>>4240454
Okay, okay, I got to ask.
How does religion even interferes with progress?

>>4240503
He's playing a character.

God is also fantasy and escapism, though. But it isn't nihilism.

>>4240388

>I can live a Spartan life on welfare and dedicate myself to living well and thinking well

Ok, have fun shoveling in the Big Macs in your 800 sq ft apartment.

Our times are not glorious, they're entirely oriented around the propagation of the world's ruling minority's power using the general population as nothing but a cash crop to cultivate. We're all slaves in our own way bro, don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.

>>4240504

Every time a religion has been involved on either side of a war, whether it be for justification or unification or basic control, it helps to hinder progression. Every time we as a people spend time towards religious gatherings or constructing monuments or structures alike, we are wasting time, resources, and thought that could have gone towards developing a better society. Donating time towards religion really is just devoting time to something that produces no directly beneficial effects on the world other than empty comfort of mind.

>>4240101
>rampant materialism, greed and apathy.
Are you insinuating these things were not rampant in the past?

You're mistake was thinking I'm not already a part of that minority power.

It's good to be on top.

>>4240504
By providing the positive qualities you consider it to have.

>>4240434
Religion is inspiration for the working class, the Delta personality types who seek no goal in life whose only purpose is to rot away, Religion gives them a means to their end of mediocrity. Without it what will these ingrates have to keep working the menial jobs? They'll have by comparison worse means of degeneracy such as television, prostitution, and chemical use. Mankind itself is at risk of continuing in an uniform fashion without religion.

>>4240582

THAT IS WHY THE SOLUTION IS A BETTER FORM OF GOVERNANCE, NOT A REGRESSION TO A PRIOR STATE, NOR VOID OF SECULARISM.

ETHNONATIONALISM, HYPERCAPITALISM, PANTHEISM, ARE THE THREE PRIME ELEMENTS THAT CONSTITUTE A PERFECT SOCIETY.

>>4240589
To a vaporwave soundtrack.

Übermensch is the idea of man as the creator as opposed to man as the creation, but for man to be an dequate creator he must acknowledge creation on some grounds. Übermensch does not solve nihilism. A good film on this subject would be Andrei Rubilev by Tarkovsky or the novels of Dostoyevsky. I'd produce a sizable treatise on this subject within this post, but I'm tired this morning and I've been tired in general of creating large posts on 4chan.

The bell making sequence in the latter half of Andrei Rubilev is pure genius.

>>4240589
Pantheism will never blend with Hypercapitalism. Noone will care about natural elements when they are consumed by their own greed. They'll only care when their life, or their next life, is threatened. That is what an animal does it lives against conflict. If there is no physical or metaphysical conflict then animal will no longer know how to define its life.

>>4240514
Try rice and beans @ 300 sq ft, baby.

I get money to do as I please. I don't feel exactly enslaved. Feels good to be lumpenpatrician.

>>4240529

Modern conceptions of materialism began in the era of Newton. Hume being a great example of materialistic thinking. As we progress into our post-Einsteinian age we will abandon the idea of 'fundamental matter'. It's already been abandoned in Quantum theory... OP is unnessecarily pessimistic.

>>4240506
What character?

>>4240609
>socialism works because I get to laze around and get paid for it
It's like I stepped into a special needs school.

>>4240601

A great scene, but not as great as he entire bell sequence:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1FmE2t9Y_I

>>4240613
A doucebag

>>4240603

THAT RATIONALE IS FALLACIOUS; YOU ARE ASSUMING THAT CAPITALISM IS EXCLUSIVELY MATERIALISTIC; THAT IT DOES NOT ALLOW FOR SPIRITUAL DEVELOPMENT, OR METAPHYSICAL NOTIONS, WHICH IS NOT THE CASE.

A STRONG SENSE OF SOCIOCULTURAL & HISTORIC COMMONALITY, VIA ETHNONATIONALISM, AND RICH SPIRITUAL LIFE VIA PANTHEISM, FORESTALL THE HEDONISTIC & DEGENERATE PERILS OF CAPITALISM.

THE THREE PRIME ELEMENTS ETHNONATIONALISM, HYPERCAPITALISM, AND PANTHEISM, COHERE INTO A HARMONIOUS WHOLE, BALANCING EACH OTHER.

>>4240526
see
>>4240451

>>4240613
No one in particular, just someone more interesting than himself.

>>4240150
>but how can you build something on morale that comes from a self-respected lie?
Welcome to Plato, bro.

>>4240659

Just by typing in caps? Lol. Nice projection.

I like how when someone stands out from the rest, he is immediately accused of pretending, or faking it.

Stay mad. You are the definition of the untermensch.

>>4240359
>religion with Nabokov as a saint
Sign me up

>>4240623
The whole only remains harmonious if it denies the existence of anything outside itself.

>>4240101
>materialism, greed and apathy
That was any different before? Oh wait.

If you compare the value system of the first world, with any time before, you can easy see how much going away from the bullshit religion forced people upon brought us, even thought there is still a fuck ton room to improve.

As for ubermensch, niggers apparently still don't get what was meant. It's not an idea for civilizations but for individuals.

>>4240675

THAT IS ONLY ACCURATE WHEN "THE WHOLE" IS BASED ON SPURIOUS PREMISES, AND COERCION.

>>4240670
If you say so.

>>4240526
>implying the crusades didn't plunged europe from a bunch of barbarians and misers to the zenith of civilization
>not knowing the role of the church on science in the middle ages
>ignoring the advancements on art, architecture, engineery and philosophy motivated by religion
>ignoring the role of religion to unify countries and give rise to civilizations
kekarel

>>4240589
who the fuck is Protophanes? :^O

>>4240623
is that how an utopia works?

>>4240689
>implying the crusades didn't plunged europe from a bunch of barbarians and misers to the zenith of civilization
Where did you pull this shit from? Pre renaissance Europe was pretty shitty yo.

>not knowing the role of the church on science in the middle ages
Best you could find is that they "stored" the shit from before and build a minimal standard but generally the role of the church was passive at best.

>ignoring the advancements on art, architecture, engineery and philosophy motivated by religion
Prove that it was the main motivation.

>ignoring the role of religion to unify countries and give rise to civilizations
What good did it do again? Hostility that is present in the modern day because my skyman is more real than yours?

>>4240704

>Pre renaissance Europe was pretty shitty yo.

fuck you so much you stupid piece of shit. You are so outdated it's actually painful to witness

>>4240707
Well, go on, show me the huge improvements comparable to ancient rome.

>>4240689
This is accurate
>every time a religion has been involved on either side of a war
This is too general of a statement, considering that this is almost every war before the 1700's, because religion was the unifying force, not government (ex. Italy during the 1400 was mostly warring city-states held together by the Church). As for religion hindering process, going with the crusades, there was a huge amount of cultural and scientific thought that was being absorbed by both sides from the other, as is natural for any two cultures in any extended contact.
>we are wasting time, resources
That is totally arbitrary, it's like saying "all the time that goes towards making art could be going towards African babies!" You don't get to arbitrarily decide what is best for people to spend their time on, and it's incorrect to assume that because time is spent on one, it is impossible for time and effort to be spent on the other.

>produces no directly beneficial effects on the world
Here, I have to assume that you have no real knowledge of religions at all. Many of these groups gather together money from their members and spend it on churches, orphanages, medical centers, colleges and other schools in all areas, etc. As an aside, Plato and Aristotle considered that time spent pondering and considering the intangible forms of a higher reality was time well spent and their ideas live on through the "official" philosophy of the catholic church, Thomism.

>>4240713
You are aware that ancient Rome was also heavily religious, right? Even if they compared badly to Rome, it hardly helps your "religion hinders progress" argument.

>>4240713
>Slavery
>Land tot he people to do what they wanted
>Free time
>MINUSCULE
Before the middle ages the idea of points, commas, and even spaces between words wasn't even a thing.
>Perspective
>Construction of color
>Sticking your rock blocks with sticky things instead of just gravity
>Basic medicine ideas like cleaning instruments and opening and stiching.
>Complex economic systems that make the "I'll destroy you and get your stuff" method useles
Rome was a shit hole and all they could do was get better.

>>4240723
I am not the same anon and never made the argument though. My point was only that the time after that till the renaissance, the progress got slowed down and giving how the Church, while preserving knowledge, didn't do much to increase it than stealing from sand niggers, they might have played a role.

Religion =/= religion after all.

>>4240728
Slavery is a new thing now? Anon please. Thats how Rome and most civilizations before them fucking worked. Invade shit > get slaves.

Yes, the spelling standard is a point. (though I mentioned it in the first post, even though not specified) Not sure if all of the things, like construction are correct thought. The shit they had was pretty advanced.

Though specially numbers were a thing where Romans failed indeed.

>>4240123
Degeneracy is subjective

>>4240746
>stealing from sand niggers
Aside from the fact that you can't "steal" knowledge, only withhold or share it, those sand niggers were also as equally religious as their European counterparts. Almost all (as far as I know, all of them entirely) of the famous mathematical developments in medieval Iran and other Middle Eastern areas came from religious people, and many of them were philosophers and theologians as well. To state the obvious, the ancient/medieval Arabs are well-known for their mathematical innovations and developments.

>>4240771
Dunno, invading their lands is a quite a push for "sharing", though guess some of it came through normal traders too.

Besides, again, I am not arguing against religion but against the catholic church specific. The quaran is a lot more liberal to scientific ideas and winning of new knowledge.

>>4240746
>My point was only that the time after that till the renaissance, the progress got slowed down
No it didn't. Almost everything we use as 'material culture' has been invented in the Middle Ages.

For fuck's sake, Romans didn't even have underwear.

>>4240821
Because a tunica is clearly cooler either way.

>>4240779
>The quaran is a lot more liberal to scientific ideas and winning of new knowledge.
Thanks for destroying my sides.

>>4240826
Pls, I dislike both but just look at the way it threats subject that go under "muh magic" in the Torah lvl2

So practically we're all waiting for this guy called Ubermensch that will tell us what to do and what to think? Who is the Ubermensch?
Is Putin Ubermensch? He seems pretty uber imho

>>4240610
OP may have meant materialism in the consumerist "buying shit, fuck yeah" type of way.

>>4240858

IT IS NOT LITERALLY ONE PERSON, IDIOT.

IT IS A CONCEPT OF A SUPERINDIVIDUALIZED KIND OF HUMAN.

>>4240616
>socialism works because I get to laze around and get paid for it
That's pretty much it, yes. Apart from the lazing around part.

>>4240858
>biblical literalists get their paws on zarathustra

>>4240388
>In the first world, only dumb and weak people still need to work.
Katana class edginess.

>>4240101
>Nietzsche's solution is the philosophical concept of the Ubermensch.

Solution to what?

>>4240892
It's not very edgy at all. If you can't survive on proper welfare you either incapable of managing your finances or you can't withstand giving in to living above your means. The first implies dumbness, the second weakness. It's quite commonsensical.

>>4240896
Cultural nihilism.

The solution to moral nihilism was nazism, the only way for white europeans to preserve a link with their roots, but we destroyed it. Now we are orphans.

>>4240901
Oh noes, safety nets, how disgusting, our corporate overlords don't have full power over our lifes.

>>4240101
So materialism, greed and apathy's only solution is to believe in a deity who scares you out of it? We're in a sad, immoral state of being if we have to be scared into being moral

>>4240916
Do you even read the posts you respond to?

>>4240875
Superindividualized kind of human? What does it mean? So at some point there will be many ubermensch? And more non-ubermensch? What makes them Uber?

>>4240924
>thinking God is all stick and no carrot
>2013

>>4240932
Why don't you go read Nietzsche first instead of expecting people to deliver you his philosophy in bite size pieces on an image board.

>>4240933
But god doesn't exist. He's no stick and he's no carrot. He aint nothing.

>>4240936
Because I tried to read him, but I don't have the background to even try to understand it.
Sorry for upsetting you anon, hope I didn't waste your precious time

>>4240944

You don't need "background" to understand his philosophy; you only need rationality.

>>4240952
You do need a background, otherwise a lot of it will fly right by you. The problem is that this by-flying happens almost unnoticeable to the reader. Which is why Nietzsche has such a notoriously large army of uninformed misinterpreters.

You don't see what you're missing until you're not missing it.

>>4240746
Slavery got dropped in the middle ages, at least they didn't leave for it. There were colonies but it was pretty much the same relationship that center and periphery countries have right now.

>>4240841
can you be more specific?

>>4240963
Serfdom isn't that far from slavery thought and actually offered people shittier positions, compared to lets say a greek slave who worked as a teacher.

>>4240933
I'm really glad that if I'm a good boy when I die god will give me a nice pat on my head and a well done :)

It's not like I can find personal satisfaction and accomplishment by being moral without the promise of heaven

>>4240976
You're comparing wrongly. Serfs weren't treated worse than Greek fieldniggers.

>to "revive" God
That's all religions are about, even in ancient times. God is not invented and God is not just there, it has to be cultivated. All religion does is try to reconnect you with the past link you once had with God, with nature, with your traditio, your childhood and yourself. Morality comes from our consciousness and true religion puts you in terms with everything else. The sad part of it is that any method, rule, or word will dry out into meaningless with time.

And that's what happened to what Nietzche said. This:
>we have the rise of nihilism, evidenced by rampant materialism, greed and apathy.
is exactly a collateral effect of this extremely heightened esteem for the individual over the concept of God. Eventually, you have to substitute it, for instance, with scientificism in which what we know is of utmost importance, rather than intuition, feelings, decision, faith, etc. Thus, it may manifest itself in the guise of "things known by men", that is "we know we are fruit of evolution, therefore I'll derive meaning from it and I'll say to myself I'm here to survive and procriate". Or you could place your morality in the value of tradition, for example, "progress of civilization", "advancement of technology", etc. The belief that we are moving forward.

con

>>4240976
>Serfdom isn't that far from slavery
I wouldn't say that at all, also you have the possibility to get away and even escape a noble anger for whatever you committed by taking refuge in a city.

>>4240987
But these are all ill developed ideas. For they imply exactly what you said:
>Humans are increasingly turning away from reality to indulge in fantasy
Whereas I think it is the opposite: people indulge themselves in reality and keep a distance from all fantasy. Therefore, not living it, not understanding one's own relationships, because they are lacking the clarity of expression that only a poetic image can achieve. Fiction is seen as fantasy and fantasy is seen as not real(God is dead), child's play, worthless lies.

But it is the opposite: the myth, the fiction, the fantasy, the utopia, the dream, the desire, the lie... These things are much more real than ordinary life, because they are the ones to make evident our morality, our ideology, our intentions.We are left without the image of God to reflect us, so we seek a mirror everywhere else: from videogames, ads, science, from schools and movie theaters. And at the same time, we are taught to reject certain things: "poems are trivial, religion is a fraud, metaphors are less real than other modes of expression". The result is that we are overly skeptical about immersing ourselves into fantasies and then a much bigger frame of mind slips under our feet without we noticing. Your ideology is hidden, your morality is seen by yourself as fact, your God is undercover, working with a different name.

cont

>>4240101
Nietzsche also said that we can't escape the decadent downfall and that perhaps the best thing to do is to hasten it before new things can come into being.

>>4240994 cont
The idea is to meditate on one's morality. Through God we had a door to that, but of tricky interpretation and sometimes corrupted ones along with the tough ruling of an institution. Without it, we don't even have a door, much less interpretation and thought. Or rather, we have many doors, enough to make any anxious teenager depressed. The instinct here is to erase all others. But in times of gregarious global exchange, that converges into me ignoring you, on moral terms. Afterall, we can do business and talk about bands and videogames without touching our religion or morality, you see?

In this scenario, you are either numb enough to go on without ever questioning any of this, or go depressed by the lack of prospects, or embrace something else, as mentioned before, to guide your moral and aesthetic judgement. Except it was not meant to guide you (contrary to religion), and so it may be a frustrating teacher. You'd lack faith in it, because, instead, you'd have faith in that faith is a worthless thing. You see where I'm getting at?

>>4240886
I lol'd

>>4240991
Keyword possibility. As the other Anon noted, they generally were treated better than the usual slave, given the landlord wasn't a complete dick but from my quite limited knowledge about history, the options a slave had (given the provided the right skills) were probably more diverse than what a serf could achieve.

>>4241005
The teaching, and generally intellectual professions market just wasn't as big, you have to admit.

But nothing really prevented you from trying your luck at the nearest city and becoming an apprentice to a craftsman or something, if you were young enough.

I think the ubermensch is the man who surpass a conception of live where everything is unimportant except having great experiences and enjoying your life.

Creating his own values means he does great things for himself only and with the idea that his life is the only one he has (eternal return of the same)
The absurdity of life is surpassed by the idea that the actions now have a mystical goal again that is to make your own life a "paradise" (as if you had to live it again and again) where you deploy your will in the most fulfilling way.

But isn't Nietzsche advocating delusions, like the ideologies he criticizes and call nihilists?
Isn't he asking his ubermensch to be a slave to a certain transcendent doctrine?
Doesn't this idea of a man trying so much to be "hard" look ridiculous?
Is he really cheating absurdity, or sinking in it?

Anyway, how is moral nihilism a bad thing?

>>4241023
>I think the ubermensch is the man who surpass a conception of live where everything is unimportant except having great experiences and enjoying your life.

Nietzsche reduced to yoloism. Incredible. Kindly remove yourself.

>>4241026
How is it a good thing?

>>4241026
>>4241029
How is it a thing?

>>4241030
>surpass
Big word to complicated for you m8?

>>4241030
Thing is, that yolo is not a bad idea itself, just promoted by idiots to do idiotic things.

>>4241034
Holy shit, I accidentally a word. Apologies.

>>4240101
Strange how we are all so quick to categorise video games as escapism when novels and films are escapist anesthetic of the same level

>>4241055
But anon, people who read books are so much smarter while only kids play video games are dumb plebs.

Ir doin it right /lit/?

>Moral relativism is bad.
It is? And here I was thinking that it's a demonstrable fact of human existence evidenced by the relative quality of morality across time and space on earth.

>>4240428
Settle down son, you're on an anonymous internet image board.

What is the Ubermensch? I never understood that shit

The death of god is a step towards the ubermesnch. Your proposal to go back and revive him doesn't make sense.

Who needs the ubermensch anyway? The last man will do just fine.

>>4241134
Probably because you haven't read Thus Spoke Zarathustra.

Niggaz said God was dead, so I'mma bring Him back

Sorry, I can't take serious discussion on 4chan seriously. Carry on.

>>4240952

>Being rational
>Understanding Nietzsche

He was an irrationalist & a mystic...

>>4240689

Yes, and all of those things happened in the past. I was speaking about religion as a current force on the world.

>>4242841
I'd safely assume that the decline of some advanced countries is due to a estrangement from religious values justified by fields that have nothing to do with morals.

>>4241869

>2013
>being this retarded

>>4242853
>I'd safely assume

This is the general level of argumentation in the neverending stream of "philosophy"/religious threads on /lit/.

>>4240101
>he thinks the ubermensch is literally an individual man with special powers who becomes the chosen one like Neo in the fucking Matrix or some shit

come back when you graduate high school

>>4242902
Where exactly did I say that you fucking clown?

>>4240434
>RELIGION ITSELF IS A SYMPTOM OF DEGENERACY; IT IS INSTITUTIONALIZED & STAGNATING SPIRITUALITY. ALL MEANING & PURPOSE HAS BEEN LOST, OR FORGOTTEN, AND ONLY SYMBOLISM, AND ROTE RITUALISM REMAIN.

No, that's what Religion is when it has degenerated.

>>4240526

So much cognitive dissonance here.

>Every time a religion has been involved on either side of a war, whether it be for justification or unification or basic control, it helps to hinder progression.
So when the Medieval Christians went to war in the Middle East that "hindered progression" because it had a spiritual aim (recapturing the Holy Lands), but when 'murrika and its allies go to war in Iraq/Afghanistan that wasn't "hindering progression" because it only had material aims (like cheap oil).
Do you not realize that the Christians in Medieval times thought they were making "progress" by fighting in the Middle East.

Progressivism is it own religion. Well, not really, its more a popular superstition, it doesn't really deserved to be called a religion.

> Every time we as a people spend time towards religious gatherings or constructing monuments or structures alike, we are wasting time, resources, and thought that could have gone towards developing a better society.

How are you meant to know what a "better society" is unless you have a religion? Without a moral structure we don't even have the tools to say what a good or bad society is.

>Donating time towards religion really is just devoting time to something that produces no directly beneficial effects on the world other than empty comfort of mind.

the fuck?
This reminds me what Kierkegaard said about worldiness. Being worldly (worshiping things like wealth, etc.) means to worship the indifferent.
"No directly beneficial effects on the world" --- what the hell is "the world"? Presumably this indifferent thing, this thing that cares nothing about us whatsoever. So why should we care about the world? "Empty comfort of mind"? You mean happiness? The thing that everybody wants in some form or other?

The problem with people who are against religion is this --- there's no such thing as a man without religion. If a man doesn't belong to a visible, real religion then he'll belong to an unconscious one. For example, how many people today who "don't belong to any religion" still belong to the cult of celebrity and the cult of wealth and the cult of sex? If you don't worship God then you WILL end up worshiping some false god whether you admit it or not (like Mammon, or Aphrodite). The only thing worse than "common religion" is common irreligion. People with a religion ARE LESS LIKELY TO BE CONTROLLED, because they have a strong, uncompromising set of values that will make them thirsty for justice. If you don't have a religion then IT'S SO MUCH EASIER for you to be taken in by the cult of advertising and celebrity and credit cards and luxury commodities.

>>4241238
Witness the resurrection of Jesus 5

>>4240858
>Who is the Ubermensch?Is Putin Ubermensch?

The most cringe worthy questions on /lit/...