/lit/ - Literature

yea

>>4079621
My life's pretty fun, yo.

Not having children seems like a pretty utopian thing. Look at Japan.

having well-educated white children is a pretty safe bet, though

I don't really like kids anyway.

I don't really want to be judged by my parents though. And then I imagine some decendent, one of my brother's children's children, looking at a family tree and seeing nothing after me. Seeing I've contributed nothing. It's a dumb thing to worry about. Really I can only think of selfish reasons to have a kid.

>>4079652
>Really I can only think of selfish reasons to have a kid.
aren't those pretty much the only reasons to have a kid anyway, though? it seems like when people have children it's to perpetuate their bloodline, because they feel it will give them some kind of satisfaction, or even because it's just something you're supposed to do. how often do you hear someone say they want a child because they're hoping he will end up loving life or something like that?

>>4079655
I never wanted children until I realized that one day I'm going to be old as fuck and I'm not going to have any family to help me wipe my ass or take me in when Social Security goes bust and I'm out on the streets.

>>4079621
>our world is filled with violence, poverty, inequality, and general unhappiness/dissatisfaction/discomfort. is it right to bring new life into this world, knowing that they will be subject to this aforementioned pain and suffering?

It's also filled with vaginas, great food, books, and movies.

How can you justify not having children?

>>4079655
I see your point. I remember my mum telling me about a friend of hers who worked with horses. She slipped into the conversation that she never had children, which I interpreted as my mum insinuating this woman put her love and effort into animals because she had no children. I dunno if my mom will ever say something similar about me.

I might be a shitty dad anyway.

People have children because their genes are the only thing they have to a claim of permanence.
When people are old and in their deathbeds they tend to look around to see what it is that they have made that will live beyond themselves, a sort of legacy. Children is an easy way to say that I have existed, that I have mattered.

idk i guess i'm undecided regarding the issue of children. deep down i would like a kid one day, but i do acknowledge that my reasons are mostly selfish.


i guess i should focus on getting a gf before thinking about kids though

>>4079662
those are all nice, but do they really outweigh all the negative things in the world?

I can't stand kids. Not my neighbor's, not my cousins', not my sister's. They drive me nuts and I have this feeling if I'd had one of my own I'd end up smothering them due to annoyance.

re: antinatalism... well, it makes sense. If you don't live, you literally don't miss out on anything. But we're alive and we really have no notion of what not-existing is like, so all our opinions and views on the matter are mere bias and conjecture, I guess.

umm, so they can venerate your spirit so as to prevent you from becoming a hungry ghost or worse?

Don't have children, no one cares.

you really can't, especially when orphanages are packed with children and the world population is maxed out.

>>4079621
But every soul sleeping in the Chamber of Guf will inevitably be born, anon.

>>4079706

The world population is far from maxed out.

>>4079693
For me they do. If the same isn't true for you, you don't need to have children. What's the big debate here? To each his own.

>>4079693
>do they really outweigh all the negative things in the world?
They don't really need to.

to be immortal

>>4079706
I doubt it will stay like that for long. Most of the worlds population is in China/India. China is now suffering from a lack of women due to decades of families killing their babies if they came out girls and India will be from starvation and other maladies.

>>4079706
yeah this statement is the kind uninformed people make that shows just how little they've attempted to understand about a given topic

>>4079714
This. If you hate your life and wish you'd never been born and are over the age of 16, then apply the lesson of your life and don't have children. You shouldn't anyway in that state, you'll fuck them up.

If you don't hate your life, then there's no problem.

>>4079716
Well, why would you have children if you thought their lives were mostly going to be shit but with a few tolerable moments thrown in there?

>>4079728
>decades of families killing their babies if they came out girls
>this is what Murricans actually believe

>>4079714
>What's the big debate here?
i just think it's an interesting topic and want to hear what others think about it.

I can't justify it, having children seems to come primarily from selfishness and lack of consideration of the factors you mentioned. I will never have children.

>>4079730
I wouldn't. But the fact that there are negative things
>in the world
doesn't mean my kids are going to get hit with them, does it? I might feel differently if I was a poor peasant in the middle of a warzone, but my life's been pretty cool so far.

>>4079738
and evolutionary programming, of course.

Do you people seriously believe that it is possible to justify anything and the whole concept isn't a castle in the air conjured to make you feel warm and fuzzy inside? Do you even lit.

>>4079739
>does it?
No, but the phrasing ("all the negative things") seemed to imply that negative things are pervasive throughout life, in which case your kids will likely get hit with them. It's clear to me now that you disagree with that assessment, though.

>>4079743
Expound on this.

>>4079750
Nihilism 101, baby. Nothing matters, the only reasonable response is mindless hedonism.

>>4079733
Villages would spring for sonograph machine so they could abort the baby early. Those that didn't do this would just leave the babies in the wilderness.

lmao no1 cares

i know if i have a child my life will be given instant perceived 'meaning' and evolution will gift me 18+ years of something to pour my self into
i want children more than anything

The only thing statements like this proves is that even humans cannot be anthropomorphized without causing logical inconsistencies.

It's all because it is physically impossible for human to define human; knowledge is a set and sets cannot contain themselves.

>>4079733
Are you retarded? Gender-specific abortions (i.e., kill the baby if it's a girl) are a major issue in China and India. In fact, the British in India spent decades clamping down on and eradicating the practice, only to have it spring up everywhere again once they left. Indians are fucking barbarians, but I digress. The gender imbalance is one of the most serious issues facing both Chinese and Indian society.

>>4079805
>Seriously suggesting this isn't because of capitalism

Get. Out.

>>4079812
>got a problem? blame the capitalists!
>lecraftymarxist.jpg

>>4079805
Yeah, abortions are a major issue. Killing the babies
>if they came out girls
not so much. Although granted it has happened.

>>4079815
I tell your mother "now go on, pop that pussy for me"

Pain and suffering make for a strong people. Otherwise, I don't 3000 years of history to come to be for nothing.

>>4079819
When I say "kill the baby if it's a girl" I am including babies that are still in the womb when they are murdered.

>>4079815
Not him. but in a socialist state people don't need to breed boys to take care of them when they get old. This practice does exist because of capitalism, because people are actually creating human capital to live off in their old age.

>>4079815
>Feudal China: people expose daughters
>Revolutionary China: no infanticide at all
>Capitalist China: people expose daughters

I WONDER

Would Plato prefer Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union?

>>4079837
top kek. The preference for males is due to a desire to pass on the family legacy in the form of the patriarchal male heir, combined with poverty which makes keeping unnecessary children (such as females) undesirable. It's just as much a fault of their culture as of capitalism.

>>4079847
>It's just as much a fault of their culture as of capitalism.
Luckily socialism does away with both.

>>4079854
Indeed.
Unfortunately, capitalism re-installs both.

>>4079847
At least for China >>4079837 is right. It's the duty of sons to take care of the parents, so having a son guarantees having support in old age. Wanting to keep the family going is part of it too, of course, but you can't ignore the financial aspect.

Doesn't India add a whole other level of fuckedness by making people actually pay dowry to marry off their daughters? At least China does that the right way round...

>>4079866
(mind you, I wouldn't say it's exclusive to capitalism... it's basically any system in which the state doesn't provide for old people)

>>4079866
>Doesn't India add a whole other level of fuckedness
The answer is generally yes in most matters.

>>4079621
>how can you justify having children?

>OP still believes in free-will
>hahahaha

>>4079621
1. antinatalism is SJWism taken to its logical conclusion, it becomes indistunguishable from christianity

2. it defeats itself, it self-abolishes because it proclaims nihilism as a way to deal with deontology (it becomes indistunguishable from christianity)

3. only deontological retards see any merit in it, 'atheists' that never stopped having theist mentality (christianity again)

4. guilt is so 2000 BC (christianity)

5. only babbies that failed logic 101 make any arguments about non-existent agents and/or claim non-existence is a form of existence (see christianity)

6. if you think morality can be objective I suggest you just go back to your jesus already

tldr: antinatalism = christianity in new clothes for even bigger retards

>>4079709

perhaps from the standpoint of "how many mouths can the earth feed" but it is becoming abundantly clear that overpopulation is certainly becoming a problem for the systems of human civilization.

>>4079660
children have a horrible return on investment

>>4080098
>SJW
>if you think morality can be objective I suggest you just go back to your jesus already
>antinatalism = christianity in new clothes for even bigger retards
i can guess what kind of clothes you're in, boyyo

>>4079621
>dat cover

>>4080222
kill yourself

>>4080222
>2013
>entire argument consists of a singular ad hominem
>nothing to say yet meme shitspam
i can guess what kind of clothes you're in, boyyo

you are the cancer that is killing /lit/

>>4080237
so edgy, is this why they wouldn't let you in church anymore?

>>4080255
his entire argument consisted of comparing his opponents to Christians
I don't really give a fuck about engaging idiots so I'll use memes instead of something thoughtful
sorry if your mad

>>4080261
Help clean up /lit/, report the shitposter (tick his post, click report in bottom right corner)
The more reports the faster he gets a vacation.

>>4080229
Why

>>4080266
Are you the same person who's been spamming "rule 6" in every other thread?
I think you should take a vacation from this site whether or not you're banned.

>>4079866
>At least China does that the right way round...
>implying there is a right way round

>>4079621
I have found life to be more rewarding and exciting than it is disappointing and boring. Time may bear me out another way, but happiness in this world is certainly possible.
Besides, having kids often brings a couple closer together, and it can make people happier, in the long run.

>>4080267
Yeah what the fuck. I'm pretty sure I'm the one who posted it last year. That's too weird.

Yesterday I happened an e-famous person on facebook, two degrees away from me, who only had ten friends.

I must be cosmically fucked or something. Reality is starting to glitch.

It is my desire to adopt if I'm ever reach a point in my life where I want to raise a child.

I don't care about passing on my genes. I desire only to pass on my attitude.

>justify

no one can justify certain things, we just DO them.

so yeah, you are right, you discovered that fire burns... now what? nothing has changed, just deal with it and dont be a fag.

>>4080255
>the cancer that is killing /lit/

lol newfag detected. we are a rotting corpse months and months, soon to be years, ago.

>> is it right to bring new life into this world, knowing that they will be subject to this aforementioned pain and suffering?

If you're raising your kids to be losers and whiners then this applies. However some people are winners and will raise their kids to be winners. If you and your spawn can't keep up, at least try to stay out of the way.

STOP WITH THIS FUCKING TROLLING, please

>>4080946
>lalala i can't hear you antinatalists I invested heavily in this ride surely it must be real, good and worthwhile

Man cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor.

>>4079621
making my DNS survive, become immortal that way

>>4079621
OP everything you have said has been happening since the fucking dawn of man. I don't understand what you're trying to say. Life will never be a utopia, and you have to understand that everyone is selfish.

I like children and I like to care for people. Would be great if it was a little brown girl with curly hair.

>>4080951
is that a Bill Hicks reference?

>>4081124
Just a casual tiny one.

>>4081105
>wanting a brown child
degenerate

>>4081070
>Life will never be a utopia, and you have to understand that everyone is selfish.
so why continue it?

i dont think i will ever have kids.im scared that i will pass my psychological issues to him/her.
i should learn to handle my own existence before bringing another life to the world.

I hate it when people say that the world is overpopulated so I shouldn't have children.

So I should suffer because irresponsible Africans can't keep it in their pants? A child born in the west to intelligent parents and given a stable upbringing is going to do more good than some slum-dwelling indian working in a sweatshop.

>>4081105
Daily reminder that you will never be a little girl of any kind.

>>4081269
people don't have kids in an attempt continue life, nerd. it's not about the kid's feelings and it never was. nobody gives a fuck about the kid, he's just gonna have to deal

No philosopher or serious student takes David Benatar seriously. He only is popular among some emo internet bloggers who are trying muster up courage to kill themselves.

His arguments are ridiculously illogical and flimsy, if you actually read his book you'll have a few good chuckles.

how can you justify not having children? our world is filled with harmony, wealth, equality, general happiness/satisfaction/comfort, aesthetic beauty, good will.

>>4079621
>our world is filled with violence, poverty, inequality, and general unhappiness/dissatisfaction/discomfort

If that's all the world is to you how do you justify your continuing existence knowing full well you can step out at any time and in a myriad of rather painless ways?

>>4081444
my death will hurt others. the non-existent can't harm people.

>Being a hedonist
>2013

>>4081269
>>4081269
Why? Because it brings me pleasure to continue it. I enjoy life for its merits, and strive to make the negative outcomes as minuscule as possible.

ITT: Babby's first nihilistic breakdown. Get over it already.

>>4081600
3edgy5me, you should sell t-shirts with that phrase printed on them

I'm waiting to meet the perfect woman who can help me raise 20+ children into a brood of terrifying scared ridiculously independent psychopathic terminator pagan assassins who will take like the wind and prowl as shadows to slowly but surely eliminate all written literature in existence so that the purity and puissance of our glorious nordic race can once again triumph over the weak and treacherous christian bookworms

Someone who notices that may try to change it. Someone who notices that has kids twice as likely try to change it.

How can you justify not having children? Are you so selfish you'd rather see the world fall apart?

I'm convinced that people who become parents do so because they've given up on themselves. They get old and settle into comfortable routine and realize they're drained of energy and potential to become someone great so they play the baby lottery in hopes of being a great parent and raising a child that will bring them happiness and fulfillment through its self actualization, which of course hardly ever happens.

>>4079706
Only low-IQ third worlders are causing over population. If you're a smart Westerner, having kids is the best thing you can do for the planet's future.