/lit/ - Literature

bump

Yeah it's not surprising in the least to me that the people shitting in that thread are from /pol/

Tell us something new, /pol/ has been here for months. Can't accept people holding different views to their own. Particularly not on the most sacred of places, 4chan.

>>3989344
>/pol/ has been here for months.

So that's why the board has been noticeably shittier.

I visited /pol/ for a while. There was the occasional interesting poster or debate in a thread, but eventually the overwhelming amounts of stupidity (mostly in the form of ignorant racism and prejudice) drove me away. I do agree with some conservative ideals that they have a reputation for holding though nonetheless.

For one, the classics of the Western canon should be appreciated, not criticized, and the dangers of feminist group-think ideologies stifling free speech. Yet at the same time I'm not gonna judge someone based on their race and blame everything bad in my life on 'the jewwwwwwwwwwwws'.

So I came to /lit/. I welcome any similar minded person who has been influenced by their conservative philosophies yet aren't stupid enough to be prejudiced and paranoid.

/pol/ has been here for at least a year or two

>>3989349
and yes

wow, i always thought /pol/ was crazy when they complained about shills. huh. guess i was wrong

>>3989350
>the dangers of feminist group-think ideologies stifling free speech

Where is this actually an issue?

this actually pisses me off that they're able to caricature us in this way because we won't go along with their "red-pill" (jesus fuck I hate that expression)

i mean honestly, most of the time someone from /pol/ posts a black person and says "I hate niggers" and we tell them to fuck off. they're delusional in a retarded way that does not even have charm (like, say, /jaypee/

>>3989362
/jp/ really is much more charming than /pol/, isn't it

and the thread promptly died with a total of seven replies, two being from the OP

welp, looks like /pol/ isn't interested in raiding /lit/ after all, huh?

but don't let me interrupt you children in your glorious battle preparations

>>3989354
read
>free speech
as actually meaning
>when i feel that my voice isn't being heard enough even though i have most likely spoken over women and/or minorities for the vast majority of my life

>>3989354
/pol/ doesn't understand what free speech is, don't try and reason with him.

>>3989319

Sshhh, you will get banned for complaining. Every time I have reported /pol/ raiders I have received a ban.

>>3989369
>>3989370
high 5

>>3989354
women who want to be motherly homemakers are demonized by feminists who want them to all embrace their 'sexual freedom' and parade around in slutwalks.

Do you really think that is a good thing for our culture?

>>3989368
>but don't let me interrupt you children in your glorious battle preparations

because that was totally happening in this thread

>>3989375
That's... not really what's happening, though

>>3989376
Yeah, this isn't battle preparations, this is 'same thing we do every night, Pinkie'

This is exactly like the /mu/ obsession.

You fuckers need to stop blaming the idiocy of your board on other boards. You and /co/ are the fucking worst about this kind of shit, too.

>>3989368
i love how everyone ignores this.

>>3989369
This just sounds like /lit/'s way of saying check ur privlidge fgt

second post: bump
I guess someone is a samefag in this thread

>>3989379
have you ever watched MSNBC?

>>3989381

Imbeciles are better ignored.

>>3989381
They rather keep to their intellectual holy war. Hell, there was only one poster agreeing with the OP.

>EVERYONE GET READY
>itZ /pol/!!!!

i think we can handle some underage reactionary illiterates

>>3989386
Not really. I try not to watch the cable news channels, because they're all full of idiots and nonsense.

But I live in and amongst the people who would be the most involved if there were a charge against motherhood. And there's not. Almost all of it is about choice. In terms of what people actually want and do, most people are perfectly fine with traditional motherhood. And certainly, domestic skills and things of that kind, people are pretty enthusiastic about that, from what I can see.

>>3989375
>women who want to be motherly homemakers are demonized by feminists who want them to all embrace their 'sexual freedom' and parade around in slutwalks.

Where are they demonized? There is probably more social and economic pressure for women with kids to work, but women who choose to stay home aren't necessarily demonized.

>>3989344
The main demand I have is for right wingers to _cite and discuss literature_.

There's a wide variety of bourgeois ideology worth talking about, but those fuckers want to hold forth unsubstantiated opinions.

FRIENDS FROM /pol/ DEWEY 300 to 399 is SOCIAL SCIENCE. DEWEY 900 to 999 is HISTORY. READ SOMETHING AND TALK ABOUT THE WORK.

Whether it is /pol/ or not there is an issue of people purposefully posting politics threads here or doing /pol/ threads as it pisses us off time after time.

I think the former is because /pol/ has such a fixed climate that if you want to discuss something that doesn't fit their world view then it's better to post it on another board.

I used to like some of the politics threads on /lit/ but at times half the front page is taken up with them. There are other places I can go to discuss politics online, I struggle to find other places where I can discuss books.

>>3989354
some people hold "free speech" to be a universal ahistorical good; some for reasonably argued reasons, some because they were fed ideology in middle school.

>>3989401
it's like how the only thing that /pol/ has to say about Ezra Pound is that he hated the jews

>>3989398

My mum was part of a feminist group once and got kicked out because she decided to stay at home and raise kids. That was in the 80s though.

I think the fear of the crazy tumblr feminists is overblown, you look at the general public and /pol/'s beliefs chime better with them than tumblr's.

>>3989408
Yeah, shit was crazy in the 80s, but that was 30 years ago.

And tumblr kids are crazy, but they're teenagers, what do you want, of course they're idiots

>>3989404
>Be on a literature board.
>Discuss literature that have formed over centuries from authors who've held radical beliefs and dared to write them and print them in books despite the authorities persecution
>Argue against free speech


It's like you dont know shit about history.

>>3989401

Issue is, as with any board on 4chan, people go on it and it creates a form of confirmation bias.

People visit /pol/ because they are sympathetic to its ideas, they then get their recommendation and news from it which creates this feedback loop.

Same with /r9k/ which seems to foster insecurity and fear of being social instead of being a place to let off some steam.

/lit/ does it too, people come on here for books, read the ones recommended, discuss it and goes round and round so everyone is reading the same things as each other.

>>3989411
book burning is in

intellectual freedom is out

get with the times stormfag /pol/ hurdurdur

>>3989408

Nobody cares about your fucking mom.

>>3989409
>implying things have become better

Feminists are literally campaigning for the destruction of the family and the traditional household

/pol/ here, don't worry most of us don't give a shit about raids or /lit/ for that matter.

But if you've noticed a rise in political shit posting, it's very likely SRS posing as /pol/ in order to bitch to moot and get the board deleted because MUH FEELINGS. They've even tried to become mods to censor whatever bothers them but moot knows better.

Just ignore the shit posting and move on

Peace.

>>3989424
>>SRS posing

I fucking hate your lingo.

You mulletheads should all pop your cherry and move on.

>>3989422
Ok

Both sides are as awful as each other.

For the extreme feminists and other groups, free speech ends where it becomes offensive or 'potentially' harmful to social groups.

For /pol/, free speech is being able to shout down and drown out any other voice and shutting down any 'potential' harmful to society speech.

You know, this would all be so similar if this were offline, so we could all have a good fight and get it out of our systems. Or figure out some other way to cut the sexual tension, I gues.

>>3989422

Really? Most feminists you see are campaigning on some cosmetic battle like putting women's faces on money or something.

There has been a surge in feminism in the past few years and I disagree with some of it, but most people sympathetic to feminism would find those on the extreme as insane as anyone else.

You know, this would all be so much better if this were offline, so we could all have a good fight and get it out of our systems. Or figure out some other way to cut the sexual tension, I gues.

>>3989411
Mate. If free speech meant anything then the Whiskey rebellion wouldn't have been shot down.

Petty bourgeois idealism, petits bourgeois idealism everywhere.

>>3989427
SRS stands for ShitRedditSays. Happy?

>>3989432
>Or figure out some other way to cut the sexual tension

frot.

>>3989408
>I think the fear of the crazy tumblr feminists is overblown

I don't think they should be "feared" but a generation of young kids growing up with that kind of stuff all over the place will certainly have an effect.

>>3989427
>Thinking a political board is raiding /lit/
>Get told that another political board is infact raiding /lit/
>Said board has been confirmed for raiding /v/ /pol/ /q/ /fit/
>Refuse to accept that a political board could be raiding /lit/ as well

Dat dere cognitive dissonance

>>3989438
Given the vacuousness and bourgeois nature of identity politics, it isn't underwritten by concrete struggle at the point of production or reproduction.

Compare and contrast American Tumblr College Feminists with Federici.

What's wrong with feminism exactly

Why don't we just ignore the politics and troll threads?

The only reason people troll /lit/ with them all the time is because it always gets a reaction. /pol/ and SRS and all these other groups don't give a shit about /lit/ and aren't trying to convert them. A few people from those groups may post here just for shits and giggles.

I don't understand why we just don't ignore them and bump literature threads instead?

>>3989438
I don't mind, I feel like it will probably effect positive change overall. I am also a woman and wish more men would just roll with it instead of getting all offended about "muh freedom" or whatever.

>>3989439
the mullethead slayer is a disgruntled jew, so he's bias

>>3989351
What the fuck? /pol/ is barely over a year old.

>>3989444
>I don't understand why we just don't ignore them and bump literature threads instead?

Literature means more than fiction, mate.

Imagine if /co/ started ram raiding literary fiction threads with _Ghost World_ or _Barefoot Gen_?

>>3989354
The University of Toronto is the most obvious starting point. Are you living under a rock?

>>3989438

Are they though? My sister is going to school now and doesn't really encounter those ideas.

I really think you underestimate how apathetic most people, particularly teenagers, are.

>>3989450
>The University of Toronto
What about it?

>>3989368
I'm actually the OP from that thread on /pol/. Notice how I told everyone at the bottom NOT to raid /lit/. And I didn't bump it when people didn't seem to be interested.

>>3989370
>hurrr durrr hate speech is not free speech

You are the problem.

>>3989456
>muh freedom
sage

>>3989456
>hurrr durrr hate speech is not free speech
When did I ever say that?

>>3989442
As put best by a french feminist, "modern feminism is spear-headed by the American lesbian who wants to kill the macho man".

>>3989456
Next time you invite /pol/ over for a chat, please remind them to discuss the literature. Ideas have antecedents in texts, evidence needs to arise from appropriate texts, not web info-graphics, but disciplinary works. Discussion of right wing disciplinary works is more than welcome, if it is detailed and talks about the text, not endless rambling about personal opinion.

>>3989445
>roll with it

I don't think that will happen any time soon. You're asking a lot when you ask a non-college educated blue collar white cis male to suddenly understand and buy into deconstructionist politics and not feel like he's being tricked. It's going to make a lot of people uncomfortable and there will be a lot of resistance, which is why I've always thought the tumblr shit was a little too arrogant and confrontational given what it's really trying to do.

There are probably better methods of convincing people than "oh, you don't agree? that's because you're a privileged shitlord."

>>3989462
How about actual examples instead of quoting some idiot french cunt?

>>3989451
I have a younger sister as well and she tells me to check my privilege (albeit jokingly).

>>3989425
There is a big, big difference between campaigning to have "hate speech" become illegal and drowning out unpopular free speech with more free speech.

LET THE /POL/ RAID BEGIN

>>3989456
>>I'm actually the OP from that thread on /pol/.

May your mother be cursed for not aborting you, you little child skinhead

>>3989466
but idiot french cunt is the best cunt

>>3989464
>You're asking a lot when you ask a non-college educated blue collar white cis male to suddenly understand and buy into deconstructionist politics and not feel like he's being tricked.
That'd be because post-structuralism is a bourgeois ideology produced to wind back the spirit of 1968 in the factories and offices of France. (Can dialectics break bricks?)

> It's going to make a lot of people uncomfortable and there will be a lot of resistance, which is why I've always thought the tumblr shit was a little too arrogant and confrontational given what it's really trying to do.

Or it could be that Tumblr feminism is entirely disconnected from the needs and lives of working class women. It is the ideology of "privileged shitlords." It fails to explain the materiality of the oppression of women, and instead talks about the right of bourgeois college educated feminists to shit all over workers. (Pink and Black, http://libcom.org/library/identity-politics-anti-politics-critical-perspective )

So yeah, maybe it is that.

>>3989450
Basically last fall there were a few conferences and lectures done by men's rights activists. Every lecture got protested by local feminists on the grounds that they were hate speech. Feminists pulled fire alarms and pounded on the walls outside the building to disrupt the discussion.

I watched recordings of the lectures, there was nothing hateful about them at all.

>>3989484
Undergraduates gonna undergraduate.

>>3989484
That is what happens when you give people the possibility to brand words and opinions as hate speech. It's a subversion of the dialogue. Just like how /lit/ screams /pol/ when there is an opinion that is outside the norm. Or how people scream racist when you criticize immigration. Or how Americans scream socialist and communist when you talk about healthcare reforms. It's so tiresome.

>>3989484
Yeah, that stuff is just retarded. But it is worth pointing out that stuff like that cannot properly be said to represent capital F feminism, but is the result of reactionary internet mobilization, which is the real enemy.

>>3989463
I didn't invite them to chat, I invited them to look. There won't be a next time but I'll keep that in mind.

>>3989473
I'm not white and I have a full head of hair thank you.

>>3989477
This guy has it. The way I see it, identity politics was designed by the bourgeois to further divide and subjugate the working class. The tumblr feminist world view is incredibly narrow-minded and dogmatic.

>>3989496
But the question remains, who ultimately determines what hate speech is? It's entirely arbitrary, and you can be sure that pretty much only straight white cis males are going to be prosecuted for hate speech.

>>3989497
This type of feminism is actually increasingly popular among undergraduates.

>>3989471
>When I do it it's free speech, when people do it to me they're jeopardizing my rights
/pol/ summarized

>>3989477

>>3989506
What? Can you read? Please expand on your argument.

>>3989505
Might be true. Shouldn't worry too much about it. If young men lose too much power and feel too alienated something will happen. It's a historical fact. Revolution and societal default. ie. lots of violence

There is much to be said about the inability to criticize and subsequent lack of criticism regarding modern "tumblr feminists/minority activists".

From the perspective of a working-class white male, their opinions and perspective reeks of basic tribalism at its inner-core. It isn't equality for all in a reformation or revolution seeking to subvert the status quo and thereby achieve the egalitarian position but rather an attempt to subvert the majority by placing itself in a position higher than the majority. A transfer of privilege if you will when the problem is the privilege in the first place.

Much of their arguments(This stuff is much much more common than you assume. It is explicitly taught in many classes which also reek of bias) suffer from the lack of a possibility of falsification. Any disagreement is met with "your white, you can't comprehend" but this assumption of the incomprehensibility of such arguments apriori due to someones social person is just an easy way to write off criticism by groups who are frankly full of passionate but not very smart people; intellectual followers who parrot ideas that give them a feeling of power, that lend a feeling of what they believe authenticity should feel like for someone in a minority position. Little do they understand they are part of a petit-bourgeoisie movement that has been constructed by those with political power to buy constituents, create division, and continue the need for the same leaders to continue "working on" their political representation and goals when very little changes.

This is serious stuff and I really think the revolutionary ideal of our youth has been turned into a frankenstein due to identity politics. The working class must be united and not divided due to divisions of race and gender. These types of stratifications will be mitigated once class divisions are mitigated.

>>3989506
Excuse me? You can say whatever the hell you want to me and no matter how hateful, bigoted, oppressive or malicious and I would NEVER petition to have you fined or thrown in jail for it.

>>3989558
fukken CAPPED

write a book please.

>>3989508
Dumbest image I have ever seen on /lit/

>>3989558
Same poster here.

An example that really bugged me.

I was in a really good pre-law society at a higher-tier university where you applied and they took kids with good grades etc who had also overcame significant obstacles to education etc.

One of the members was a puetro-rican kid who was very concerned about "la raza" and fighting for "equality".
I thought he was cool at first but I finally met someone who I could not possibly be friends with because I realized he was an enemy and hated all white people regardless of their class.

On his facebook he posted a bingo chart of things "white makes say". A caricature of "pirvledge blind" things that was supposed to highlight the ignorance of white males to their great advantages.

I don't deny this is true by any means and some of there did capture some of the ignorance I had seem such as things like "why can;t they just get over it etc".

But one thing really really bugged me- there was a bingo tile that read "Capitalism oppresses all people, whites included". And that was supposed to be an ignorant thing white people say??? It's true! the poor whites are significantly oppressed under capitalism and they get some of the least benefits due to their lack of political capital as they are so divided. But i digress, the fact that he would post that and basically create propaganda that DIVIDES people of similiar class circumstances rather than UNITE them under the banner of anti-capitalist really bugged me and I told him I didn;t appreciate the unfair caricature of my race's beliefs, if someone did something of a latino or african american, people who really feak out, but white people have become docile to their benefits of their own culture, race, and class consciousness.
We are not superior at all, we have caused untold amounts of suffering that I believe we hold some responsibility NOW years generations later to try and mitigate, but I refuse to support the empowerment of others if that empowerment does not serve the goals of egality but rather the replacement of the same power structure causing so much problems today.

I hope I don't sound crazy, this has been a big intellectual struggle for me lately as I realize the tribalism nature of racial groups and how each groups is fighting for interests even though everyone can share some similiar ground to work together. I have also realized how disgusting it is that the groups being politically pandered to the most are only so because of the political capital they contain for politicians. A simple insight but one when I realized the true force of, changed the way I look at political representation and the question of "who deserves the surplus".

>>3989558
>>3989581
Thanks for making these posts. Now I dont have to post in this thread at all.

>>3989508

I don't mind Penny's writing except for one thing.

She constantly claims to be part of the most oppressed and working class people when she was privately educated and comes from a wealthy background.

I don't think that should prevent her from commenting on issues regarding the poor or most disadvantaged but I wish she would stop pretending she is one of them.

>>3989563

I agree, but I feel an important part of free speech is also to be able to communicate well with the other person. Listening to them, letting them speak, not just shouting them down.

>>3989590
She's not from a wealthy background – her Dad only made 80k a year. She doesn't pretend to be 'one of them' either.

/pol/ and the tumblr feminists both make the same mistake. The unwillingness to look at individuals.

Take the tumblrs first. On a general scale, men have more advantages than women which I think is worthy of rectifying. However, many white men don't match the general trend. For many of them they are not privileged or at an advantage: they are poor, lack job security and have all these other issues. The inability of the tumblr lot to see these individuals creates animosity as a lot of men feel they are not oppressors, they are in fact pretty poor off themselves.

Similarly, /pol/ has this obsession with black people being genetically inferior to white people. Evidence does suggest that broadly black people tend to be less intelligent. But it is a trend, they don't allow of the many black people who are intelligent, far more intelligent than most to exist.

Both of them tar everyone in a group with the same brush, and suggest ideas that harm anyone in the group who doesn't fit their stereotype of it.

>>3989597
>80k pounds a year
>not from a wealthy background

Give me a break. How many millions does your daddy make?

>>3989597

>her dad only made 80k a year.

Are you kidding? Considering average wage in the UK is 16 to 25k?

>>3989606
>How many millions does your daddy make?
About 750k-ish

>Are you kidding?
No, I'm not. 80k before tax is not 'wealthy'.

>>3989607
>pound
>dollar

>>3989613
>About 750k-ish
What a surprise.

>No, I'm not. 80k before tax is not 'wealthy'.
Yes it is.

>>3989614

80k a year converted in dollars is still about 50-60k which is considered pretty wealthy. Not rich but far better off than most people.

>>3989618
>Yes it is.
No, it really isn't.

>>3989621
>80k a year converted in dollars is still about 50-60k

£80k is $121k

>>3989622
What is wealthy then?

>>3989590
>She constantly claims to be part of the most oppressed and working class people when she was privately educated and comes from a wealthy background.

Welcome to the social justice movement. They're mostly a bunch of privileged college-educated women who desperately try to commandeer and represent people who are actually underprivileged. It's all a pissing contest to pretend to be the most underprivileged as if it legitimizes their point of view. These days kids think being underprivileged means being a black lesbian transsexual Muslim Hebrew, they completely ignore true privilege which is wealth. This is done by design. Identity politics was literally crafted specifically to divide the proletariat, and it works quite masterfully. Just look at what happened to OWS.

>>3989597
80k a year is in the top 15% in America.

>>3989632
In that case £80k is in the top 10% of US annual incomes. Certainly wealthy, though may not seem so relative to someone who makes almost a million per year.

>>3989634
>What is wealthy then?
"Wealth is our organized capability to cope effectively with the environment in sustaining our healthy regeneration and decreasing both the physical and metaphysical restrictions of the forward days of our lives.

how many months could you live your current lifestyle if you lost your job? That's how wealthy you are. If you could live for 5 months - then you are 5 months wealthy. If you could live for a year - then you are 1 year wealthy. But what about true wealth? That is enough capital, or income each month from investments and sources other than your job to cover your living expenses each month - then you would be wealthy forever - free to do whatever you wanted with your life."

The majority of £80,000 is eaten up by taxes, mortgage repayments, utilities, insurance – they are in exactly the same situation as someone earning £20,000, only the box they pay mortgage or rent on is slightly larger. If you take away that income stream, the overheads are so high that they will be broke in the same amount of time as the £20,000 guy.

>>3989578
Seems like >>3989644 and >>3989635 agree with it.
Why do you say it's dumb?

>>3989635
That image. Are you implying that Miss Penny is in need of something?

>>3989650
>Why do you say it's dumb?

Because in 2013, the notion that "only the proletariat are qualified to discuss the proletariat," when used in relation to contemporary British society, is total imbecility that demonstrates a complete ignorance of modern society.

>>3989657
"grab the straps."

Grab the straps. I hated hearing that. It meant a long session, a session including strap-ons, canes, paddles, unable to move for hours. When Laurie settles into a session she really goes for it. My pants hit the floor around my ankles, my hands reached for the straps, my lovely mistress, hair recently returned to natural color, made the straps tight so I couldn't pull away. I was meat hung from a butchers hook.

I looked into Laurie's eyes and she looked back, sparks flew. Her lithe body, barely five foot two inches was taught from many years practicing feminism and yoga. She has small shoulders, firm breasts that match her stature, 34A. She tapers to tiny waist that flares into hips that hide a wonderfully tight butt, round and well pronounced. She has strong legs that are perfectly toned.

She circled around me a couple times, inspecting. She grabbed my under shorts and pulled them down to meet my pants at me ankles. She circled again, took my cock in her hand and jerked it a few times. I couldn't but begin to rise to her although I knew it would mean more punishment for getting hard in her hand.

Now, seeing her standing to my side, I saw her arm extended knowing the first lash was seconds away. It landed squarely across my ass and I sucked in a breath hard and fast. She was giving me a series of strap blows that I couldn't count. They were landing so fast that the sting of one didn't register before the next blow landed...

>>3989645

Sorry, but I find that to be a ridiculous definition of wealth.

Just because you have less disposable income does not mean that you can say that a person on 100k a year is as wealthy as someone on 20k a year, that's absurd.

You, on £80,000 p.a. have chosen to spend the majority of your wealth on a lavish house and utility luxuries that someone on £20,000 can't afford. YOU made the decision to turn your vast salary into more long term assets rather than keep it all as disposable income.

A better definition of wealth would be how long you could survive with your current salary were you fired yesterday - but while living at the absolute minimum living standard, and that includes living in a shitty house and having to skimp on the fuel bill.

You're not poor just because you spend your money.

>>3989659
That's the core argument for the social justice movement. If you are privileged you're have no say in the opinions the matter of those without privilege. And now you go to say that it doesn't matter? Get your shit straightened out.

>Average individual earnings for full-time workers in Britain were £26,000

Penny is clearly very privileged considering that it was only her father that earned £80k yearly considering her mother has the same job.

>>3989603
I don't think anyone believes that there doesn't exist outliers from trends.

>>3989662
>Sorry, but I find that to be a ridiculous definition of wealth.
Take it up with Buckminster Fuller.

>Just because you have less disposable income does not mean that you can say that a person on 100k a year is as wealthy as someone on 20k a year, that's absurd.
Why is it absurd? You seem to be mistaking wealth for material trinkets. Generally someone on 100k would be able to survive for longer than someone on 20k if their jobs were lost simultaneously, but not always.

Say 20k guy has a mortgage, has paid off half, has no family, a car worth 2k, and 4k invested in bonds. He gets fired today and can't get employed.
Now say 100k guy is renting a large penthouse apartment, has a wife and two kids (so tuition fees and other expenses) and a rented Lamborghini. He spends all of his income on rent. He also gets fired today and can't get employed.

Now that they are both fired, the 20k has money tied up in his assets, and has annual bond payments. The 100k guy is completely broke in a month; the 20k guy is wealthier. Having a rented Lamborghini doesn't equate to wealth. Expensive material toys are not a good measure of a mans wealth.

>>3989661
This is hilarious. We should make more fan fiction about political pundits and uk based politicians.

>>3989663

>>3989661
...When Laurie stopped, she turned on the remote camera, the monitor was in front of me. My ass was flaming red and already bleeding in places. Now, monitor on, I could see the punishment being delivered. Her arm extended again as another series of fast hard blows rang out against my ass and upper legs. I continued watching each strike, almost hypnotized by the view of leather strap striking skin, skin ripping as it takes each strike.

She was still thrashing me aggressively, I could see the color of my ass turning a deep purple. Eventually the strapping would have to end and she would cool me with some ointment leaving me to anticipate the next round. When the moment came that she stopped strapping, the cool ointment being applied hurt, cool against the hot damaged skin.

She applied the ointment with one dainty hand, that was normal; however, she used her other hand to reach between my legs to fondle my balls, that was not normal. After she was satisfied that my ass was properly anointed, she came around my front and looked into my eyes; I looked back. Not sure what she saw in my privileged eyes, I saw something different in hers, not just the usual feminist look, there was something else, sensual.

She grasped my cock again and stroked it, then dropped to her knees.

"Don't you dare cum. If you cum, I will thrash your ass to the bone."

She sucked my cock into her mouth, licking and tasting along my length. Every few seconds she reminded me not to cum. "Not on my mouth, not on my face, not on my clothes, no cum." Then she would take me deep in her mouth and suck more.

As she sucked, I couldn't help but sway my hips into her...

>>3989442
they're taking away our privilege

>>3989676
..."Are you going to cum?"

How do stop a fired bullet exiting a gun barrel? I exploded into Laurie's mouth.

"I told you not to cum," she screamed. Slapping my cock with her hand, she stood, walked behind me.

She checked the camera and monitor, picked her favorite paddle, and displayed it to the camera lens. There was nothing for me to say, I did cum and she told me not to, she was going to make me suffer. In the monitor I saw her taking a firm two hand grip, pull her arms back, and swing. The paddle landed squarely and firmly leaving a new large welt. She wasn't swinging as often with the paddle as with the strap. Each swing of the paddle came after she adjusted her grip. Two, three, four, ten, thirty, I lost count, the monitor showed nothing but a large purple welt that was my entire ass. The pain began subsiding as my nerves muted, I wondered how much more I could take.

The blows were fierce, my ass vibrated against each blow. Two more, three, five more, I was straining against the straps trying to stay on my feet. I took ten more blows before calling out, "Marx!"

Hearing Marx, the blows stopped being delivered. "Are you okay? I can't believe how much abuse you took." I was released from the straps and all but collapsed to the floor and crawled away to my recovery area. My breathing was still labored and feeling was returning to my ass. The pain was putting me on the verge of blackout when I felt ice packs spread across my abused ass cheeks. The sudden cold against my recovering nerves was more than my senses could take; I did go unconscious.

I don't know how long I was out, however, Laurie was still with me, soothing and comforting me. When she was in her feminist role, she was 100 percent feminist. But when she hears our duress word, she quickly comes out of role.

"Its going to be a couple months before you're healthy again, there is a lot of damage. We better be careful for a long while."

I smiled as she cuddled me.

>>3989682
0/10 troll...
go home to reddit, grown ups are talking

>>3989670

I'm not mistaking wealth for material trinkets. The definition of wealth *is* the total value of material trinkets a given "person" owns. Or rather, the value of their assets less their liabilities.

What you, Or rather, Bunkminster Fuller has done is take the term and use it to define something entirely different to what it actually means. When people discuss wealth, they're not referring to how long someone can last if they're fired, I'm not saying that as a concept it doesn't have any worth, but it's a silly appropriation of the term wealth because it's measuring something completely different.

http://www.torontolife.com/informer/people/2012/04/05/ryan-gosling-laurie-penny-saga/

This is so funny. Closer is about a stripper (like Laurie Penny, red haired (like Laurie Penny), whos hit by a car (like Laurie Penny?) who saved by a dashing good looking gentleman.

Think about it.

>>3989685
go back to /pol/

>>3989691
go back to /status/

> Similarly, /pol/ has this obsession with black people being genetically inferior to white people. Evidence does suggest that broadly black people tend to be less intelligent. But it is a trend, they don't allow of the many black people who are intelligent, far more intelligent than most to exist.

yeah, that's because of genetics, no racial reasons

>>3989686
>because it's measuring something completely different.
No, of course it's not.

>the total value of material trinkets a given "person" owns.
Exactly, and the sale of those will support a person for longer than someone without.


Look: If I have 20k income from bonds and investment, so don't do any work. I have invested wisely for 10 years, and can now live on the return from my investments in a rented condo in Northern Thailand. I am wealthier than someone who earns 50k from a 9-5 and is paying a mortgage.

Yes, they earn more than me. Yes, the total value of their material trinkets may exceed the total that I have invested. But I can sustain myself forever without forfeiting time for money, and they will be fucked in a year or two. I am wealthier. You see, neither the numerical 'income' figure, or the total sale value of material items is a full indicator of 'wealth'.

>>3989695

I wonder if IQ differences between Whites and African Americans in the USA are because of the way in which blacks were introduced to America.

You would expect that the people shipped off and sold into slavery might be less intelligent, on average, than those who managed to avoid being taken and sold.

>>3989701

Now that I reread your original post I think I missed the point a bit. I see what you're saying now, I misunderstood what you were saying. That actually is a reasonable way of measuring wealth, you threw me slightly by including "Mortgage repayments" as an example of something that doesn't increase a person's wealth in your original post, I'd argue it does in reality.

>>3989659
So you missed >>3989477 which has exactly the same message then? All I did was add lovely Laurie Penny, I didn't change the meaning of the thing. Except to perhaps imply that if the argument applies, it applies to her.

>>3989663
Let's not forget that wealth has no bearings on privilege for SJWs. It's all about gender, sexual orientation and skin color.

>>3989675
Of course she is going to say that. Her family earned more than 95% of her constituents and supporters that's for sure. She's a posh cunt, and far too naive for politics. I trust you gentlemen have seen her debate with David Starkey?

>>3989419
I care about fucking his mom.

>>3989704
>I wonder if IQ differences between Whites and African Americans in the USA are because of the way in which blacks were introduced to America.
Poverty. Current socio-economic status. Wonder no more.

>>3989722
>I trust you gentlemen have seen her debate with David Starkey?
He's a multimillionaire. What has the edited video of her debate with him got to do with anything?

>>3989722
>her debate with David Starkey?
Laurie Penny on David Starkey:

"What's your favourite dinosaur? I always preferred the Archaeopteryx, the little stubby bird-ancestor, but recently a whole new species has been discovered alive and nesting in the discursive swamps of what was once British political culture. Bigotaurus Ridiculus, a spiny-hided predator, is not yet extinct, and a danger to anyone looking to create progressive change in this country.

The Bigotaurus can be found waddling free in the more exclusive watering-holes of London even in the early years of the 21st century, and although most at home in oak-panelled environments, can often be seen on Newsnight and Question Time hunting the clear-thinking egalitarian agendas on which it feeds when it can't get claret. The creature tricks its victims with a camouflage of adorable sexagenarian buffonery.

When provoked, for example by mentioning issues of tax transparency, this particular dinosaur becomes aggressive, baring the sharp fangs it hides in its ponderous jowls. I found that out during a recent encounter with the beast in its natural habitat. At an education festival this weekend, I spoke on a panel about the meaning of "Britishness" with Professor David Starkey, noted historian and hack, who made the argument that English society has become corrupted by the influence of people from other cultures and races.

Describing himself as a lone "voice in the wilderness" and "saying the unsayable", the Professor, who has often been criticised for making racially divisive statements in public, proceeded to say what windbag ultra-Tory talking heads have been saying openly and obliquely for years – namely, that "real British values" are not, as Starkey put it, "entrenched in the foothills of the Punjab".

When I criticised Starkey for playing xenophobia for laughs, and asked why, as an advocate of Britishness, he lives for part of the year in the United States, the dinosaur showed its claws. Leaping to his feet, Starkey began with a furious ad hominem attack before marching up to me, wagging his finger in my face, shouting abuse, swearing and showering me with flecks of spittle. If you call a bigot a bigot in this country, you can expect to be attacked, but I didn't expect the sheer thuggishness behind Starkey's brand of cosy prejudice to reveal itself so publicly.

Bigotaurus thrives in the temperate climate of Britain. It quenches its thirst for attention at the cesspool of the British media circus, to an audience too deferential to put it in its place. In this country, public debate has become a spiteful, irrelevant Punch-and-Judy show, and professional provocateurs like Starkey are paid to create aggressive spectacle that obscures useful discussion. Like the ancient lizards, Starkey and his kind are perilously ill-adapted to the modern world – but they have yet to be consigned to history where they belong."

>>3989720
It was an extremely accurate portrayal on how feminism heralds itself as champions of the underprivileged through its bullshit "intersectionality."

>That's a good little Sambo! Come to our Analyzing the Civil Rights Movement Through the Lens of Feminist Critical Theory class and we'll show you that the true path to liberation is by smashing the patriarchy!

>>3989742
He certainly showcased her idiocy.

>>3989744
this is the dumbest thing I have read all week

>>3989741
Why does the IQ difference persist in the Minnesota trans-racial adoption study then?

>>3989754
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oj9dA6E3fJw

Devastated.

>>3989744
Young progressive socialist feminist girl calling old successful man a bigot because he wants to maintain a British majority in Britain. Cute.

>>3989744
>>3989744
This is brilliant.

>>3989760
Tu quoque.

>>3989761
because it didn't occur in a vacuum

>>3989769
Bourgeois on bourgeois. Painting a Todd red changes nothing, as Andy Anderson knew all too well in _The enemy is middle class_

>>3989787
Toff fuck my phone

>>3989744
The far left truly is as delusional and naive as the far right.

I weep for anyone who does not know this.

>>3989380
this. /lit/'s main problem is /lit/. i say this as a long time /lit/ browser who doesn't even frequent any other 4chan boards.

>>3989769
The contention isn't that he's a bigot—though he is—but that he plays xenophobia for laughs, that he isn't serious. He said "the whites have become black" during the 2011 London riots.

I don't understand why people fetishize Starkey beyond a dull "the enemy of my enemy"; people who study boring special-interest history and act as though this gives them special knowledge of politics are the worst kind of faggots.

>>3989796
>wow it looks like both sides are delusional and naive
>but I'm above all that
kill youreself

>>3989810
>A dichotomy with two polar positions
=/=
>A spectrum with plenty of middle ground

politics ruined 4chan

>>3989810
>there are only two sides

>>3989823
>>3989829
>implying the conditions that drive radicals to their positions don't affect moderates in an equally stultifying manner

>>3989834
"Radicals" are driven by class consciousness. "Moderates" are driven by hegemony.

>>3989834
>the conditions that drive radicals to their positions

You mean being manipulated by bullshit ideologies and false narratives?

>>3989841
I think that this is only true if you count moderates as people who aren't as interested in politics as thinkers on other sides of the spectrum.

>>3989842
to the extent that they're interested in politics at all, yeah

>>3989846
forgot to sage

>bourgeois
>bourgeois
>bourgeois
>petit-bourgeois

This word has lost all meaning now that anyone with a bone to pick with capitalism uses it all the fucking time. Disagree with me? Bourgeois. Wealthier than me? Bourgeois. Not speaking like a simpleton so every retard can understand? Bourgeois.

Just try and go a day without saying it /lit/, it might make you feel better.

>>3989846
>to the extent that they're interested in politics at all, yeah

Historically, all radicals (left or right) have been nothing but tools. Tools to be used by the wealthy and unseen.

If you can get the right and left to bicker and fight against each other it stifles a lot of meaningful dialogue and neither of them is going to rise up against their government. The whole left/right fallacy is propagated for this very reason.

"Nobody is ever going to give you the education you need to overthrow them." Many of today's popular political ideologies exist not to give people a path to liberty but to subvert and delude them.

>>3989846
Time to read Gramsci mate.

>>3989319
At the gates? Lol!
More like they are already room mates. We have /pol/ shit-posts every now and then. I think most posters of /lit/ are p used to it by now. The best you can do is just ignoring them.

any political ideology that acknowledges the corrosive influence of the jew is fine by me

i know some of my marxist m8s are redpilled in that respect. i think a lot of the far left is wising up re: kikes. the banking crisis really shone a light on the problem

I preferred when it was still /new/.

Moot got buttmad, /new/ became stormfront so he deleted it one day.
Then he gave us a second chance and it became stormfront again
Now it's /pol/, but old /new/ was still better than /pol/ is today

>>3989895
/new/ on the other site after it was removed from 4chan was amazing. shame that moot jewed the userbase back to 4chan after a year. now it's just like a carehome for paranoid schizophrenics and breiviks in the making.

>>3989899
>now it's just like a carehome for paranoid schizophrenics and breiviks in the making.

the other site, i mean (the site's name is blocked).

/pol/ is just a bunch of hyperactive kiddies playing make-believe.

>>3989895
Marxism = All problems in society is due to class

>But what if there could be another factor
No! You are too ingrained into society to even perceive the true reality of class.

Gender Politics (Cultural Marixsm) = All problems in society is due to class

>But what if it coudl be because of biology
No! You are too privileged in society to even perceive the true reality of gender.

Class perspective and gender perspective can be useful but idiots always take shit too far.

>>3989899
>>3989901
I never returned to /pol/ again after a debate where the guy started copypasting sources that actually confirmed what I was saying but he was too dense to listen because he thought it was a "source-war" or something like that.

Props to him, he rustled my jimmies which is something only few have ever done.

>>3989903
Masterful exegesis. So good that Kolakowski isn't vomiting himself post-mortem at the degradation of right wing thought.

The weird thing to me is trying to imagine what Marx would think of society now, in the modern west?
He was mostly thinking about power coming from control of means of production. Now we have means of production at everybody's fingertips and access to markets pretty much pushed down our throats. Anybody know Marx's position on Intellectual property? Does the worker own what he invents or creates?

And would he be more concerned with the workers access to education, training and information? The whole political access thing seems to have gone by the boards a bit. What would he have seen as the biggest problem facing a worker or peasant today?

Also, if class is still important, even though 99% of the west would probably say they were "middle class" if asked, though they might fal into either other class if just numbers were used. Does the "middle class sensibility" mean stark Babbitry, or does it defeat the concept of group allegience?
Also, >>3989581
when did Puerto Ricans stop being white?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CzGxqdmsrk

Brit-bongs will soon be gone from 4chan anyway considering the public discoure on nethate. 4chan will most likely be blocked for being a hate site.

See this video without rage.

>>3989873
But it seems a lot of people on /lit/ are new to 4chan and constantly take bait threads.

>>3989929
Fragment on machines. Complex labour power. MOP aren't to hand. Setting up a chemical cracking plant is ducking hard.

>>3989930
I lost it when she asked him to check his privilege.

>>3989944
well a lot depends on what you want to manufacture: Are you making cars or deck chairs? High level production can be led around by the profit leash since they need markets and have competitiors. I've really always wondered why any communist or marxist society feels the need to start at the top, use political power to force things? It seems like a grassroots approach would work so much better. If it's abetter way, it should outcompete the others, and even if its just okay it should have a niche. i think the world has never been more ready for small scale social experiments like that. You could probably even get a grant to study it. I think most of the restraints on socialism as a lifestyle or local adaptation have been removed, and the main objection to the communist societies of the past hundred years and the current day is their compulsory nature, not their economic philosophy. Have your socialist town or county or state with wide open borders and free traffic in and out, and nobody is going to complain.

>>3989350
>ignorant racism and prejudice
whatever helps you sleep at night

sage because nothing to do with literature

>>3989369
>spoken over women and/or minorities for the vast majority of my life
what does this even mean?

When /pol/ says that feminists/cultural marxists want to get rid of free-speech it's usually complaining about hate speech laws that make you liable to go to prison for saying anything racist or sexist, even if it is just a few out of context quotes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iARHCxAMAO0

>>3989621
how much did her mum earn?
was she an only child?

>>3990075
>mum
>Britbong detected.
Hook u in da gabber m8, I swer on me mum

>>3989786
elaborate, please.

>>3989929
>when did Puerto Ricans stop being white?
there are white, black and mestizo Puerto Ricans.

>>3990078
Irish actually

>>3989704
What about the IQ of poor white farmers compared to slaves in the 1800's? It's an interesting question because both groups were being exploited for their labour, had pretty poor living conditions and deliberately divided by the American ruling classes instead of uniting under a united class banner.

They've been at the games for months, anxiously berating us for discussing things they don't understand, convincing themselves the reason they hate us is because we're 'lefties', even though it's simply because we're smarter than them.

>>3989704
>You would expect that the people shipped off and sold into slavery might be less intelligent, on average, than those who managed to avoid being taken and sold.
So why are there no successful sub-Saharan African countries?

Check-mate.

*tips fedora*

>>3990168
*gates
woops

>>3990171
/pol/: 1
christians: 0

/pol/ are always at the gates. that's what vagrants do, because no one wants to let them in.

In other news, water is wet.

>>3990180
This is a rather appropriate metaphor, really. When vagrants, poor and unwashed, crowd around the gates of a city for a long period of time, they come to accept that they'll never get in. At that point, to deal with the agony of never entering the city, they begin to create rumours of the occupants of the city, or simply cast the lifestyles the city-dwellers live in a negative light, even though those who live in the city live, by most standards, a far better life than anyone outside the city could ever hope to achieve.

> 'twas the night before /pol/raid, and all over my /lit/
> you can tell that the mullets were stirring up shit
> their swastikas flying as they started to yell
> about gays, blacks, jews and women as well
> I opened up /lit/, when who should appear?
> but privileged white kids from basement lairs
> "Goy JIDF" they would scream, while saging a thread
> "SRS detected," one of them said.
> "I'm a lot smarter than you," I began to say
> "It's the patriarchy not jews that have ruined your day."
> "FEMINST CUNT, YOU MARXIST CROOK.
> "DO YOU THINK YOUR BETTER JUST FOR READING A BOOK?"
> "I don't think I'm better," I start to say
> "I have just read the source text, I can show you the way
> "to egalitarian bliss, free from the lies
> "of marketing gurus, fake gender divides.
> "Free from the shackles of an identity forced
> "upon innocent children and you too, of course.
> "I don't think I'm better," /pol/, "I know that I am."
> But /pol/ wouldn't "redpill" and stuck their heads in the sand!

>>3990199
Let down by a few half-rhymes but a valiant effort. Bravo!

>>3989319
Does /pol/ still have communist and anarchist threads?

>>3990208
Yes, as well as economist threads and some times history threads. Also the recent zimmerman trial was one the best times that I've ever had on 4chan. And I've browsed for five years now.

>>3989394
Then why was Romney's wife vilified by liberals for being a homemaker? They say it's about choice but in reality they pressure and coerce women into being what the feminists want them to be.

I mean I can't help you if you're just blind to it. A man sees what he wants to see and disregards the rest.

>>3990034
Holy shit, this whole image is crap and I am astounded that you people eat it up so easily.

I like how it totally misrepresents what we've learned from one of the biggest cases of mismanagements, the Kansas City desegregation case, and that it takes a study such as the Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study seriously.

Thanks for proving his point of ignorant racism and prejudice, which can be the only reasons one would uncritically gobble this up, running rampant in /pol/, though.

>>3989603
nice post

>>3990221
>Holy shit, this whole image is crap
>I like how it totally misrepresents what we've learned from one of the biggest cases of mismanagements, the Kansas City desegregation case, and that it takes a study such as the Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study seriously.
What did we learn from it then, and why wouldn't we take the study seriously.

>>3989826
politics ruin everything my friend

>>3990199
>lairs
>appear

>lies
>divides

Other than that, good stuff. 7/10 would read again.

>>3990220
Where did liberals demonize Mrs. Romney? How do you know feminists "pressure and coerce" them, beyond vague superstition of a group you don't like? The sorts of feminists who want to break up the family unit aren't the ones in the pockets of mainstream liberals, my friend.

>>3990199
lol'd fucking hard

>>3990220
>vilified by liberals
It's like you think liberals is this huge fucking club of single minded people, when in reality it's a broad spectrum of people on the left side of the political spectrum.

I'm not left-wing, but you're all retarded.

>>3990274
it's in mainstream news dude. I remember seeing CNN reports on stories of how Ann Romney was being criticized over "never working a day in her life". This is not vague superstition, it is real.

This lady on MSNBC said this with impunity:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3qtpdSQox0

>>3990199
Improved (?) version

> 'Twas the night before /pol/raid, and all through my /lit/,
> you can tell that the mullets were stirring up shit.
> Their swastikas flying as they started to yell
> about gays, blacks, jews, and women as well.
> I opened up /lit/, and who should I find?
> The same privileged white kids: the basement kind.
> "JIDF!," they would scream, saging a thread.
> "SRS detected!" another of them said.
> "Well, I'm much smarter than YOU," I began to say
> "It's the bourgeois, not jews, that have ruined your day."
> "FEMINST CUNT, YOU MARXIST CROOK.
> "DO YOU THINK YOUR BETTER JUST FOR READING A BOOK?!"
> "I don't -think- I'm better," I began to say
> "But we here know a much better way
> "to fight lies and slanders and darkly visions,
> "marketing gurus, who sell class divisions!
> "Free from the shackles of an identity forced
> "upon innocents, children, and you too, of course.
> "I don't -think- I'm better, /pol/, I know that I am,
> "but you would be, too, if you gave up this sham!"
> But /pol/ wouldn't "redpill" and continued to ham.

>>3990289
But she's right.

>>3990199
5/5 bretty good

t. /pol/

>>3990302
Your flow is still a little off, and the glaring typo is still there:
>THINK YOUR BETTER

Back to >>>/youtube/

>>3990289
>CNN
>liberal
Okay.

>>3990374
I didn't make that claim

Why are there so many people taking /pol/ seriously in the first place? It's just a joke board not meant to be taken seriously, just like /b/

>>3990429
I think this myself sometimes, and I hope it's true, but I really doubt it is.

I just went to /pol/ for the first time in an actually very short time, maybe 8 months. That shit is terrible. I don't have the capacity to put into words how terrible that was. It has definitely crossed the line from the previously actually "red-pilled" people critical of near everyone to the people who think they are red-pilled but instead defend the perceived status quo and attack feminists and jews in cases where they are obviously not wrong. It was more like /b/ than anything else. There was not a single communist or anarchist thread, and only about 1 or 2 Libertarian threads. I mean, what the fuck happened

>>3990429
No it isn't

Holy shit, /v/ was right, /lit/ is infested with SRS.

>>3990461
>>3990480
It's always been an Ellis Island (or a Bagram, more accurately) for political spammers, but while /new/ coexisted with the spammers /pol/ has outright merged with them. Their discussions also incorporate more recycled meme content from other /n/ boards (finland, krautchan, etc.)

Both are/were very entertaining, and /pol/ is mostly responding to tumblr's insidious spread more than anything.

>>3990471
/pol/ got way more freepers than /new/ did (the later mostly had people coming from prison planet and the like). Hence, there are catholic generals and "degenercy" crusades against all of tumblr's faggotry and leddit's organized atheism. But even the freepers get shat on from time to time.

>>3990486
>anyone who isn't moderate, right, or libertarian
SRS!
>anyone who think the people who post on /pol/ are pretty damn idiotic
SRS!

wait a sec,
>/v/ was right
5/10

>>3990471
I know. /pol/ is actually unusable as a board for rational discussion.

>>3990512
I disagree, especially having browsed /new/ for quite some time.

>>3989744
*COUGHS* shes right

>>3989841
>radicals are only poor people
>radicals are poor people at all

Here's one for you: name me one remotely successful radical leader who was poorer than middle class.

>>3990512
You have to remember - and I know it's easy to forget - that this isn't a website devoted to the discussion of literature. This is an anime website for kids and teens (despite the '18' rule) to shitpost on, and as a result it caters to the social dregs who play videogames, watch anime, and are about as educated and articulate as a carrot. I mean look at the top of the page, our board-link is next door to a board for teenage males to discuss the 'my little pony' cartoon franchise. Yes, /pol/ is utterly terrible, but it's expected to be terrible.

>>3989929
He'd probably want 90% of the modern left executed.

Marx claimed that a poor black man had more in common with a poor white man than a rich man of any race. That a poor Chinese man had more in common with a poor white American than a rich Chinese man. This is exactly the belief which identity politics tries to suppress. Nowadays people think class is based on race/gender: this is a disgusting perversion of Marxism that is designed to subjugate and divide the working class.

>>3990045
Oh man "date rape... is... exciting" it's amazing what some buttdevestated faculty can do when they tell their students "THIS IS THE ENEMY, THEY SAID THIS!!!" Thanks University of Toronto feminists for letting me know I should never, ever vote for a woman.

>>3990221
protip: You can never prove that IQ differences in race are entirely cultural or environmental. Never.

It's impossible.

>>3990374
Wow /lit/ I'm ashamed.

Are you guys really so into Marxist theory that CNN is not liberal to you? Have you watched CNN recently?

What kind of warped reality do you people live in?

just ignore the /pol/ posters, let the delusional ass hats believe what they want.

>>3989365
No. They are equally repugnant for different reasons.

>>3989477
I agree, and go futher. When compared to the rich vs poor all other forms of inequality are miniscule. Gay vs Straight, Male vs Female, White vs Black, all these inequalities (real or imagined) pale in comparison to the inequalities created by wealth and power.

>>3990703
I JUST WANT THIS EXPLAINED TO ME

>>3990778
It's really a shame most are blind to this truth.

>>3990208
Not really. We used to have real discussion there. Now everything is fascist/degeneracy/anti-feminism threads. Not that those aren't fun in moderation, but I spent a lot more time in anarchist and libertarian threads when those were around.

>>3989977
>I've really always wondered why any communist or marxist society feels the need to start at the top, use political power to force things?
You haven't read much Marxism have you? Time to go back through class consciousness, workerism, syndicalism, the shop stewards movement, cooperatives.

Fuck you sound like a Stalinist pastiche mate.

>You could probably even get a grant to study it.
You rarely get a grant in the social sciences to replicate previously demonstrated results.

>Have your socialist town or county or state with wide open borders and free traffic in and out, and nobody is going to complain.
They through trade unionists out of helicopters, mate. They complain with the armed force of the state.

>>3990098
Your source is fucking appalling. Next time provide a citation to a specific peer reviewed or UP/Major Monograph Press work. We can't take "Source: College Board" to mean anything other than "Source is 4chan."

>>3990540
I dreamt I saw Joe Hill last night, alive as you or I.

>>3990673
>He'd probably want 90% of the modern left executed.
We know from Marx's withering attacks on socialists he viewed as "wrong" that he'd return to a class position. He'd probably find more in common with Federici and Tronti than Žižek or Negri.

>[he's be against identity politics]
Oh god yes.

>>3990703
CNN is right wing mate. Centrism is when people start doubting the universal efficiency of capitalism, like the Australian Labor Party in the 1960s, or the ILP in the 1930s.

The left begins when you stand for the abolition of capital and the value form.

The Guardian and Al Jazeera are the only centrist major news outlets. Both are centre-right.

>>3990740
/jp/ is more charming than /pol/ to the extent that /jp/ wants to get fucked and tarts itself up for you. But like any attractive "girl" she's a psycho-bitch.

>>3990778
You go too far. The concrete elimination of racism in the factory was an achievement of the class itself in struggle, see the history journal Radical Amerika in the late 1960s on factory floor occupations in Detroit wildcats.

Gender is more interesting still, it is reproduced at the point of reproduction, ie, in the household over housework. (Dalla Costa, James, Federici, Engels). Homosexuality and transexuality too, they're part of the family / patriarchy structure (soft patriarchy, ala Engels).

These divisions as _identities_ in general society are irrelevant compared to the working class / bourgeois divide.

However, _within the working class_ these divisions need to be worked towards being eliminated as a political struggle by workers themselves. The most notable one was women being paid 20% of male wages. As this has formally come up to 100%, and practically come up to 70%; the narrowing of that difference in wage has resulted in more women being able to leave abusive relationships and a more equitable (but not really great, eh?) distribution of work within the household. This was the result of union struggle over the wage.

We can project from this that the way to solve issues for transmen is to up the wages and life outcomes for working class transmen. Bourgeois transmen, can of course, go die along with other bourgeois men. (Homocult)

>>3991107
Joe Hill wasn't particularly successful, never more than a minor organizer. It was his death that made him influential. Ochs himself said it: "he became a minor left-wing hero, and then one day he was accused of murder, and he became a major left-wing hero."

>>3991119
How can you possibly call Al-Jazeera centre right? Have you ever read their opinion section?

>>3991119
> cnn
> right wing

Have you even watched it, mate?

>>3990034
>The racial gap is genetic.

Heartily lol'd. Thanks for the fun read.

>>3991318
Almost everyone agrees that it's at least partly genetic.

Fucking /pol/

>>3991295
Yes, mate, they stand for the continuation of capitalism at all costs.

Regarding Al Jazeera their editorial policy isn't for the abolition of capital but the ameliorations of its excesses. Opinion pages are regularly more left that their outlets—there are no places for left expression.

Finally on Joe: any labour history will turn up proletarian leaders. Stop hungering after substitutionalist parties and you'll see the class in action.

>>3991326
>Almost everyone agrees that it's at least partly genetic.
>almost everyone agrees
>no source to survey polling the american public on whether or not they believe the race gap is genetic

top lel

stay academically pleb

>>3990374
How isn't CNN liberal?

>>3989424
You guys are so delusional it is pathetic. Some /pol/ faggot starts shitposting on /lit/ and all you can say is "SRS! SRS". It is pathetic. You guys are the cancer that is killing 4chan. You guys can't stay to your own cancerous board. Everything, everyone, and every board would be better off if moot deleted it.

>>3991628
>How isn't CNN liberal?
CNN is as liberal as the manchester school.

I see you aren't eating your own baby, care to offer me a fair market price, I feel peckish.

>>3991678
So yes, pretty liberal then.

>>3990493
If you think there's a "tumblr" invasion you ARE /pol/, in which case you need to just go back.