/lit/ - Literature

Kierkegaard

The Shack by WM Paul Young.

>>3799911
any particular work?

>>3799912
What kind of a dealy is that, anon?

>>3799911
>>3799918
Fear and Trembling and Sickness Unto Death I suggest.

>>3799906
Have you tried the Bible?

>>3799926
Yes, yes I have. And let me stop you before, "hurr durr, well if you didn't like that then derpy flerpy herpy blerp"

>>3799921
thanks, anon

>>3799918
I think The Shack is a popular novel about "getting into" Christianity, but I've never read it. I've seen it compared to Pilgrim's Progress, which you should maybe check out if you don't mind the somewhat archaic prose. James Mason once did a really good reading of some excerpts from it but I've only seen it on vinyl.

>>3799906
The books Blue Like Jazz & The Prodigal God are both great.

So may I ask why? It seems a bit of a backwards idea to seek out a leap of faith, I'd normally imagine some natural occurrence, perhaps some stroke of luck being the catalyst you need, not a book that you read for the express purpose of convincing yourself of whatever it is you're having trouble with. I don't have any intention of insulting you for your approach to this, but it seems very strange to me to want to be Christian in this way.

Mere Christianity by C.S Lewis, Or some of Max Lucado's stuff. Not sure "philosophical" works will help with a theological problem but you can look up some of the christian existentialists.

Also, fuck off with the"herpy derp derp" shit. There's no such thing as preventative faggotry. It's just passive aggressive and annoying. Don't act out in the behavior your hoping to avoid.

EVerything by chesterton

>>3799906
john edwards sermons
c s lewis works

>>3799906
Dostoevsky and later T.S. Eliot, especially his Four Quartets. I actually took a seminar on them together int he religious studies department. Was a little annoyed at the whole "only cure for modern society is Christianity" thing, but it sounds like what you're looking for.

>>3799906
The films of Andrei Tarkovsky.

Orthodoxy: An Introduction by Lossky

>>3799906

You want Saint Augustine. On Christrian Doctrine and On Free Choice of the Will are the way to go.

"An Alarm to Unconverted Sinners" by Joseph Alleine (1672)

http://archive.org/details/alarmtounconvert00alle

>>3799983
>>3799978
>>3799973
>>3799972
>>3799965
>>3799961
>>3799958
>>3799945
>>3799942

thanks, /lit/

>>3799906
The Year of Living Biblically, Selected Writings of Thomas Aquinas, Confessions of Saint Augustine, The Language of God.
Those sort of things. Though I feel the last book is most what you're looking for.

>>3800037
Also I'd suggest "God's Arrow Against Atheism and Irreligion" by Henry Smith (1550-1591), starting on page 333 of this volume:

http://books.google.com/books?id=vtQTAAAAYAAJ

Reading and comparing Plato, Aristotle and Augustine of Hippo gives you new ways of thinking, in philosophical way. Try Google.

>>3799906
How is the new season of AD? I'm still in the process of rewatching the series before jumping in.

Anything by Donald Miller. Also, the Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis

>>3799921
Fear and Trembling was what put me back to Christianity some days ago.

>>3800563
>some days ago
lol

>>3800120
It starts off pretty bad, but it picks up after the second episode.

>>3800610
?

>>3800616
*seventh

>2edgy4/r/atheism
God I hate you right now, op.

hey guys i'm kinda christian
guess being christian is edgy now
swag swag swag swag tybg

>read the Tao Te Ching
>become a "philosophical taoist" (but avoid the term because really taoism is a religion even if the Tao Te Ching and works of Zhuangzi specifically are more philosophical than religious as we usually think of religion in the west)
>like Christianity more than I did when I was a Christian

>>3800628
it is pretty interesting to see how fast "culture" inverts itself these days.

>>3800623
That's what I've been hearing. Due to the very different multiple-stories-in-one-timeline format it takes awhile for things to start coming together. I'm rather looking forward to watching it though. Just need to hurry up and get through Season 3. Really should've started refreshing myself on the series a full month ago.

>>3800629
>tfw similar tale

Nice enough religion, only some unscrupulous individuals give it a bad name. Same old story.

>>3800120

I hate it. No comedic timing, and they're trying way too hard with all the "great dark period" stuff. I stopped watching it in disgust.

>>3800632
>atheists

>>3800654
Are you... Are you following me?

>>3799906
You want to become Christian?
If so then go for Orthodox Christianity its least corrupt church of all.

>>3800703
>Orthodox
>Not corrupt

Pick the Syriac Orthodoxy Church, they have the oldest liturgy.

>>3800722
I said least corrupt, I didn't say it isn't corrupt.

>>3800654
Edgy religiousfag, fuck off. We don't like your kind 'round here.

>>3800731
Fair enough. Though the Mennonites or Quakers are probably the least corrupt of any denomination.

>>3800740

>>3800741
The Quakers gained political and economic power in Pennsylvania colony in part by refusing to fight but allowing others to fight the natives on their behalf. That's pretty hypocritical.

Also, isn't it really only the Russian Orthodox Church that's corrupt?

>>3800758
Well, they're the biggest. Everybody has dirt though. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/feb/19/religion.uk

>>3800752

>>3800758
It's not hypocritical at all actually.

The God Delusion

>>3799911
>>3799921
ctrl+f "concluding unscientific postscript"
no mentions yet

OP, this is the Kierkegaard work you want to read. It's huge but it is his magnum opus that far surpasses Sickness Unto Death and Fear and Trembling. You'll see. It will be worth it. Just don't expect to be able to go to Church again afterwards.

The Kingdom of God Is Within You by Tolstoy might be something for you?

Haven't read it, but an anarchistic priest recommended it for me.

>>3800839
>glorifying Stalin
>not hypocritical

Sure thing, honey.

Reading the Gospel of John again did it for me.

>>3799934
Well, you said;
'Let me stop you before, "hurr durr, well if you didn't like that then derpy flerpy herpy blerp"'

So stop us from saying that?
Honestly, if you think being a Christian is some kind of "switch" between not-being-Christian and being-Christian, than I think you are more interested in truly joining an establishment such as a church.

If that's your choice, it doesn't really matter if you read books about Christianity, it matters more to read about the different interpretations of God and his functions (e.g.; what's the difference between Calvinism, Protestantism, Catholicism, Anglicanism, etc., etc.)


Another helpful comment;
Plato is often seen as the intellectual father of Christianity (both regarding idea of heaven, of love, of "God", of duty)

Try God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens

>>3800758
>large institution
>not corrupt
Thanks for the laugh anon.

Tolstoy's The Gospel in Brief.

Tarkovsky's films. Bresson's films. Dreyer's films (especially Ordet - dat fucking ending)

>>3799906
Find a Rabbi or a Jesuit and ask him if he has any recommendations. They're often more scholars than religious leaders so they often have recommendations aside from reading Luke again.

>dedicating your life to a magical space wizard like a fucking primitive
>having a functioning brain is HURRR DURR EDGY

I'm not religious, but I enjoy Kierkegaard. One of my philosophy professors is a Christian and he's the one who suggested him.

>>3803745

Lose the angst.

It's a sign of weak resolve.

>>3803759
>studying philosophy in college

>>3799906
No joke: LOTR, Crime and Punishment

The Brothers Karamazov nearly converted me....Though could have been the crippling humidity and cheap booze. Either way a decent read....

>inb4 2edgy4/r/atheism comments
Don't you think you should read the popular atheist texts as well as the christian ones.

>>3803909
>Don't you think you should read the popular atheist texts as well as the christian ones.
Couldn't he just read Christian texts and texts about life, gardening, whatever and decide? Why read books written by people with creepy agendas?

>>3804037
>Couldn't he just read Christian texts
>Why read books written by people with creepy agendas?
Why do this Anon? Why leave yourself open to such an easy joke. I'm not even going to say it, I'm just going to let you put two and two together.

>>3804042
It was his big plan to appear retarded!

>>3804042
>Why do this Anon? Why leave yourself open to such an easy joke. I'm not even going to say it, I'm just going to let you put two and two together.
Because I don't think your conception of Christian texts (some stupid salesman from America rather than Dostoyevsky) are truly examples of Christians at all, but I can't say this either without getting made fun of.

>>3804047
How typically Christian, picking the stuff you like and ignoring the stuff you don´t. No wonder nobody can take this jewish fanfiction seriously.

>>3803798

>treating everyone who views your baseless and honestly downright ridiculous beliefs as stupid and will try to ward you off of them for the good of society by explaining how ridiculous they are like a manchild

Proof of a mature adult.

>rolling your eyes at the above because he's a complete idiot

Angst.

>the only right way

Keeping your mouth shut when someone opposes you and not demanding the same from you because your opinions are worth being heard unlike his.

I heard the left behind series is a good start. After all, you don't want to go to hell, do you brother?

>>3803745
>actually believing in evolution

Do some research, kiddo. Theres so much evidence of evolution being false that its ridiculous that so many people believe it still. Likewise, theres so much evidence in the world of a creator, its hard to believe those things just came to be.

Darwin himself called it a "theory" and even admitted the fact that there was very likely a form of creator.

>>3804225
>theres so much evidence in the world of a creator

Go away, loser.

>>3804132
The world and its "education system" being taught in schools has really clouded your mind. Christians arent what you hear about on the internet. They arent religous zealots that condemn anything ungodly to hell (well, there are but that isnt how the Bible says we should act)

I dont think you've ever met a true christian. I dont man someone that "calls" themselves a believer. I mean a genuine christian. I doubt you've met one and I know for a fat you dont know what a Christian really is.

>hurr how typically christian saying you dont know what you're talking about

You really dont and its really sad that you're heart has hardened this much

I want to get into Christianity because I have crippling depression and self-hatred. Will Christianity cure this?

>>3804226
Ok then. Give me evidence right now that there is no creator. Give me evidence right now that the "doctrine" you believe in, is indeed, true.

>>3804245
>I have crippling depression and self-hatred. Will Christianity cure this?

No, it will exacerbate it.

>>3804245
Christianity wont. Accepting Jesus Christ as your savior will.

I suggest looking up some famous sermons or maybe going to a church. Im telling you now, some pastors can be EXTREMELY boring and some churches can be just plain retarded by teaching something not in the Bible.

Find a fun pastor or go to a church you enjoy to learn more. It will take some time to find the right place. I dont wanna sound like a broken record but we really are living in the last few years, so the sooner the better

>>3804248
What makes you say this?

>>3804225

"Theory" is the highest form of scientific observation, idiot. It's the new term that you allot to your hypothesis (what you're probably thinking of) after finding reproducible evidence that it's sound. Scientists never claim that their observations are absolute by calling it "fact" because they're smart enough to realize that any observation could have holes in it, even when the observation is sound enough to produce things like hybrid crops or new breeds of dog like evolution.

Or do you actually believe that poodles were running around the Earth with the dinosaurs?

>B-But I didn't come from no derpa-durn monkey! That's just herpa durpa ridiculous! My lord and savior God the Father made man out of clay! </kneejerking>

>>3804246
You can't prove something doesn't exist. Prove there are no unicorns. Prove there isn't a 50 foot dolphin statue on Mars.

Give me a break.

>>3804245
not really, but it can channel those feelings into something productive that might move you out of your slump. Or at least it can give you a community, but if you're looking for a belief that will make you feel better in and of itself you could just do some New Age junk instead

captcha: complete itrsage

>>3804262
I've never been able to get into Christianity or Spirituality before due to hardcore skepticism. Is there anything you recommend for getting over this?

>>3804258
But there is plenty of evidence proving we didnt come from monkeys. I suggest you do some research.

I dont mean google it and read the first link and take it as fact. I mean take the time, a couple hours at least, to read into both christianity and evolution(or anything else) Look up some debates. You're gonna be surprised.

Why are so many people falling for such obvious trolls in this thread?

Also, everyone who's interested in Christianity should look at this Wikipedia article and give up the "Jesus died because God needed to punish somebody" shit that became popular later on.

>>3804271
You're right. Humans did not come from monkeys. They came from chimps.

>>3804271

I'm sorry, I'm not going to take you seriously when you clearly can't even be bothered to understand what evolution is.

>>3804273
Forgot the link.

http://en.wikipedia/org/wiki/Christus_Victor

>>3804273

It's funny because Old Testament God is pretty much the most arrogant, sociopathic asshole that you could think up.

>>3804267
Just let go. Are you worried that people will think of you as "dumb" and "ignorant" for believing in a higher being? Are you afraid of what they will think? Perhaps you will think less of yourself for buying into the "lies"?

Who cares. What have you got to lose? Do you really want to risk eternal damnation, or do you wnat to be on the safe side? The rewards for christianity being true outweigh the punishment for it being false

>>3804267
A lobotomy.

Hmmm, I started going to church around 7 years old. I personally saw Christianity relieve depression and turn average/bad people into productive members of society. I've also seen people "backslide" and go back to complete shit. How come some people can't live a fulfilled or at least life without religion?

>>3804281
Fixed:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christus_Victor

>>3804288
*atleast a normal life

>>3804278
>this guy must be retarded, he thinks monkeys and chimps are related! Haha dont believe this guy hes dumb!

>>3804279
Tell me whats evolution? Is it not the belief that humans evolved from more primitive life forms?

Ever been in a debate? Calling someone dumb wont win.

>>3804267
I'm not really sure, unfortunately; my mom's a pastor and I spent most of my youth in churches, so most of the books I've read have been edifying works for uneasy Christians. I like C.S. Lewis' works a lot (Screwtape Letters or Mere Christianity for something a bit more serious), Pilgrim's Progress as well, but despite what people will tell you those works are mostly meant for Christians. I guess some people here really like William Lane Craig and some people hate him, but I've never read him (I think he deals with skepticism quite a bit, however). I don't know, credo quia absurdum has never been much of a problem for me.

>>3804288
Ever think that maybe it really is true, thats why its so apparent?

People like to label christians as dumb so the world could point at someone and say:

>If you dont believe this then that automatically makes you smarter than millions of people! Doesnt that make you feel good!

>>3804295

We didn't evolve from monkeys, we had common ancestors

>>3804284
Haha, it's a good thing we don't unload death from the skies on unbelievers for such silly reasons any more. "Good without God," indeed.

More seriously YHWH is far more human than most other theisms, and if you read Sodom & Gomorrah without comprehending the implications of Abraham actually arguing with God whom to save in the city ur pretty dumb


For your own edification with regards to the infographic, incidentally:
>The "Other" category is really a very grey zone. The Obama administration would call these people "military combatants" because they are of-age males. However, many people in this category are actually civilians. It's just that many of the bodies are beyond recognition or there are conflicting reports on the ground about who they are. It's never clear exactly who they are or what threat they pose. The high-profile targets, however, are the people who [we] know have direct affiliations with the Taliban or Al Qaeda. However, say a military combatant's house was hit and his neighbor's house was also hit in the strike, the neighbor would be automatically termed as a military combatant if he was male. Because of this, we did not want to call these people military combatant and there is not enough data to break these men out further.

>>3804302
>Other religions also make people happy
>therefore they must also be true

>>3804295

Yes and no.

It's the passing of the traits.

You have brown eyes. Your son has brown eyes. You have low metabolism. Your grandchild has low metabolism.

Certain traits increase odds of survival or chances of mating. Those traits tend to be passed to the next generation. Like, let's say that an aquatic animal with lungs has flippers that allows him to move on land easier, while another's flippers might be more streamlined for the water. Over hundreds of thousands of years, thanks to the passing of various traits, two animals who came from the same ancestor can wind up drastically different.

This can be engineered to our purposes through selective breeding.

For instance, if you want a breed a new breed of guard dogs that are low to ground and fiercely protective, you take all of your dogs who are low to the ground and fiercely protective and breed them, and then breed the next generation who also share the most ideal traits. At the end, you could very well end up with a new breed. That's more drastic evolution.

Given how close we are to monkeys just in terms of our body structure, it's very likely that we came from them at one point.

>>3804325
Man, what the fuck happened in 2006 to toll that many kids?

Is /lit/ the easiest board to troll?

>>3804346

trolling: the art of plebs

Seriously even most intelligent design proponents / fundamentalists / etc - at least the ones who are at least somewhat intelligent and reasonable - acknowledge evolution on a micro scale now (IE, changes within organisms and, to a greater or lesser extent, changes between different species). The evidence on that one is pretty overwhelming. Most of the smart intelligent design people are focusing on origins of life, or at worst the origins of major categories of life forms. You have to be a total loon who completely denies the applicability of evidence as such to argue that evolution doesn't take place at all. Everyone on your own side who is even slightly intelligent has already deserted you on that one, and a lot of those people are really dumb and crazy.

>>3804335
I guess it's a bit of a contested story, but
http://tribune.com.pk/story/229844/the-day-69-children-died/

>The Sunday Times carried a report from a key aide to then-President Pervez Musharraf stating: ‘We thought it would be less damaging if we said we did it rather than the US. But there was a lot of collateral damage and we’ve requested the Americans not to do it again.
>mfw "please don't bomb schools again"

>>3804346
It's not that /lit/ is easy to troll, it's that the trolling is beside the point.

Imagine it like this: a really hungry fat kid is at the circus but his parentals are denying him popcorn because it'll spoil his dinner. Well, a clown comes up to the kid and smashes a pie right in the fat kid's face. Instead of getting upset, the fat kid starts licking his lips and scraping the pie off with his fingers, eating it in joy.

The pie is the troll thread, the clown is the troll, the eating of it anyway is the discussion, the stingy parentals are the IRL society that deprives of us all of the fun topics/tourettes we enjoy, and the circus is life in general.

Not sure what the popcorn is. Poop sex, maybe.

>>3804363
you had me till the poop sex bit

>>3804378
Be fair. Anon DID say "maybe."

>>3804236
Yes and you decide who is a true believer and who isn´t. Doesn´t this sound familiar to you?

>>3804363
What a glorious description.

>>3804363
This is seriously the best analysis of the true nature of /lit/ that I've ever seen

>>3804363
I disagree sir.

The problem I see is:
>the eating of it anyway is the discussion

The discussion is more like the child getting upset, and the clown laughs and throws another pie.

The "discussion" is like talking to a brick wall, because the response is invariably foolishness only designed for mockery.

The pie is never eaten because the pie is made of shaving cream

>>3804404
/lit/ doesn't really get upset though. Maybe one or two people, but everyone else has ideas and opinions and they love the debate.

Nobody would engage in it if they didn't get some enjoyment out of it. And I'd argue that even the ragers are getting enjoyment out of their rage--a lot like how people go to scary movies to be frightened, how is not not possible that people come to certain places on the internet just to get angry (/fit/ goes to "fat appreciation blogs" for this very reason).

Whether or not the discussion is like talking to a brick wall doesn't matter, because the shaving cream tastes like pie to the fat kid. Whether or not it is pie is a matter of contention, no doubt, but the kid eagerly eats it up, anyway.

(Also, spoils his dinner.)

>>3804417
I think the thing that makes /lit/ the most angry, oddly, is clumsy trolling - when someone doesn't put effort in to trolling and does a shitty job.

It's a bit of an odd dynamic.