/lit/ - Literature

benis

God

an uncreated creation

A complete void; absolute nothingness.

Death
Not in an emo sort of way where it is glamorized, but just in a sense of the absolutism of it.

Symmetry

imperfection

Anal sex

The law of non-contradiction

>>3636431
i love how out of all the mentioned concepts ITT these 2 signifiers establish the most vivid, coherent and nearly tangible impact upon the imagination

>>3636411
Pleasure.

Human civilization progressing to a near T-3 civilization, however that long of a time made earth a lost place in the galaxy and humans don't know anything about its location. Then an accident occurs and 1 galactic human child soldier ends up on Earth to find that humans still live on earth but living a primitive lifestyle. Interactions between a local human girl and a galactic human sparks the galactic human's mind about what it means to be a human.


Gargantia thread GO

Slavery.

Sunhawk.

Racial purity.

>>3636465
Hodor!

space. not just outer space, but every space, all space. although "perfect" is a tough word to tackle

Chaos.

>What is the purest, most perfect idea, concept or thing you can think of?
The Scientific Method.

/lit/s of GTFO.

Existence.

her ;_;

>tfw

>>3636564

You just had to do it, didn't you?

>>3636465
>>3636468
You two make me sick.

Personally, and I know this is gonna sound pretentious as all hell, I hate the idea of perfection. It terrifies me to no end. Perfection is dull, desolate, lonely, and most of all inhuman. Out species isn't built to accept it or become it, not yet anyways. Give us another five hundred thousand years of evolutionary growth and my mind might change, but a perfect society is as of now impossible to uphold, in my opinion.

>>3636580
So, for you, perfections is imperfection.

>>3636596
For how our brains currently function, I'd say yes.

>>3636580
Disliking perfection is like not wanting to be content. It does not compute.

>>3636596
>Sunhawk !dZaerAHgfQ
Sunhawk #sunhawk

>>3636607
I disagree entirely. Why must content be found in the arms of reason and logic and perfection? Surely you don't believe humans are constructed this way?

We like to think of ourselves as these highly intelligent beings who are able to understand all that the universe has to offer, but I can't help but doubt that. As Dostoevsky explains pretty clearly, within human nature is caprice, random acts against reason.

If content is to be found in perfection, then why don't why we all act accordingly to it? Why do we put so much value into things like spirituality, something that is so beyond flawed in its reason and logic? I don't understand why I(and many other great minds) thrive with a spiritual sense of being behind my mind of logic, but I do. And if that's the case, how can I say I'm a vessel that wishes to see perfection?

Everything.

>>3636635
I merely meant that it isn't right conceptually. You make negative statements about perfection, which makes it something other than perfection. Saying that perfection is dull (assuming you dislike dullness) is like saying you dislike your favourite food. Within the concept of perfection there is no room for imperfections. You can't criticise perfection without it being something other than perfection. You can't say what's wrong with it because you will be instantly talking about something else.

>>3636635
>We like to think of ourselves as these highly intelligent beings who are able to understand all that the universe has to offer
No, we don't. And it is precisely because we don't have a perfect understanding of the universe that we strive for one. The quest for perfection is our prime mover, our raison d'être. We are not perfect, we don't have perfect knowledge, so we endure every conceivable hardship to tray to attain our holy grail; perfection.

>>3636635

Perfection is subjective and mostly meaningless, because "flaws" are subjective and perfection is just a lack of flaws.

Reason and logic are tools that help people achieve goals and navigate reality.

People who navigate without reason or logic are mostly insane and idiotic.

Even spirituality has its own internal logic. If you are Christian you are going to pray to Jesus not to Vishnu, that would be illogical. etc.

Dostoevsky just repeated what was common sense at the time, and thought our only salvation was through his christian religion. His books were really silly because of this

>>3636663
>Even spirituality
le epic dawkins xd god is not great le cancerous conservative

>>3636635
Further, without fantasies of perfection in my mind, I find myself to be more content with my life than I have ever been in my short twenty-one years on this planet. I live life, I don't constantly try and alter it or the environment surrounding it.

>>3636650
Well that's an argument of semantics, but I get your point.

I guess I was explaining my disdain for logic's description of perfection.

If I had to define my own, for the age I live in and who I am, I'd say perfection is, as the above anon mentioned, imperfection. Or perhaps... passive imperfection. If that remains within the realm of sense.

Actually... I used a term the other day while discussing Joseph's Campbell's work and view of life. It was, 'existential aplomb.' If I'd have to define perfection in anyway with the words that I am given, I suppose it'd be with those.

ebb/flow/flux/motion/whateveryouwanttocallit. not just that everything exists, but that it is in flux is the highest order thing I feel I can comprehend. It's Heraclitus' river.

>>3636663
I think you are vastly overloooking the true purpose of spirituality, friend.

I am not speaking of religion when I call upon spirituality. If you were to ask me what God I believe in, I would tell you that I am an atheist. But I understand the merits of spirituality and belief in something that is beyond you, and I get why it is important.
Spirituality is not about logic, matter of fact, it's the reverse. It's about giving up reason in your mind and tearing down the walls of over-analytical thought. It's about living life in unknowingness, and allowing your attention to be wrapped up by what is really around you, and not so much by things that you will never see or truly understand.

>>3636676

you can be a logically consistent Christian, consistent with the bible that is, maybe not with reality and actual history, etc...

>>3636700
>Spirituality is not about logic, matter of fact, it's the reverse. It's about giving up reason in your mind and tearing down the walls of over-analytical thought.

You have a reason to believe this, don't you? Or did you just flip a coin and accept it for no reason at all?

>It's about giving up reason in your mind

Elaborate. Give some examples.

>>3636676
>le epic dawkins xd god is not great le cancerous conservative
Read your Guenon and Evola.

>>3636707
>Elaborate. Give some examples.

>>3636707
>You have a reason to believe this, don't you? Or did you just flip a coin and accept it for no reason at all?
I'll explain with this. A compromise, if you will.
The human man is at a crossroads. One half of the man is fascinated with reason and logic, and holds it as dear as he does a longtime lover. But the other half, arguably his lesser half, is composed of something else. As I mentioned before, caprice. This act of denying reason just for the sake of denial. Why are we constructed in such a way? Why do we claim to love reason and in the same movement defy it?

See, I'm not saying that life is completely without reason and we should completely abandon it, I'm simply trying to convey the possibility that maybe there are some damaging effects to the amount of logic and reason that is so heavily integrated into our culture. We aren't reasonable organisms, not all the time, so to live completely by such mechanical tenants is in itself, well, quite unreasonable.

>>3636724
Ultimately, I'm saying we should embrace our flaws, not force them into this idealized form of 'perfection.'

Leave perfection to computers, I much rather remain imperfect.

>>3636682
Based Logos.

>>3636724
You're going to love the impending technological singularity.

>>3636732
Absolutely terrified, mate.

>>3636724
> I'm simply trying to convey the possibility that maybe there are some damaging effects to the amount of logic and reason that is so heavily integrated into our culture

Like what?

>>3636732
>technological singularity
Mere fiction, pal. Not happening - ever. Gotta feel sorry for the 'researchers' in the AI field though. All those hours spent of dreaming and contemplating of the impossible.

At least it gives some hope to the salivary and overly-enthusiastic children, you know?

>>3636757
why won't it happen?

>>3636744
Like denying us the right to be what we naturally are.

If I were to follow the rules of reason and logic presented by my society and culture. I wouldn't be doing what it is I truly love, what fills me with more verve than the love of a woman or the bond of a strong friendship. Logic tells me I should not waste my time writing works that will most likely grant me nothing but a 'poor' life and a 'sad' lifestyle. It tells me to get a job that I hate, and to put all of myself into a career that means nothing to me. My culture wants me to spend the free time that I have not creating, but polluting my mind with vapid entertainment. I deny that because of my caprice, because of my naturally developed(or underdeveloped) instinct to turn my nose up at reason and walk the other way.

And because I do, I'm happier and love the life I live more than I ever have.

>>3636757
What specific part of the singularity do you struggle to comprehend? Bus speeds, transistor orientation for enhanced CPUs, neurological comparability with binary systems, the operation of cybernetic feedback loops; seriously, tell me which particular aspects you don't understand, and I will explain it to you.

>>3636757
>airplanes
Mere fiction, pal. Not happening - ever. Gotta feel sorry for the "researchers" thinking that humans could possibly fly. All those hours spent dreaming and contemplating the impossible.

>>3636764

You are confusing "logic and reason" with 'cultural values'.

Here is what logic would dictate to you:

If, X makes you happy
and, you want to be happy
then, you should get X to be happy

Logic.

I hope you realize your mistake and stop speaking incorrectly.

Death. Life separates us all, but in death we are united.

>>3636771
Lol. I remember reading an article about Alexander Graham Bell. He had the audacity to claim that 'one day, America will be connected by a single telephone in each major city'. Naturally he was ridiculed for such a stupid statement.

>>3636767

Economics trumps the singularity.

We already have the technology and abundance of material to feed the entire planet, but billions are without water and food daily.

>>3636767
>He thinks namedropping a bunch of AI terminology is going to give any coherence and verity to his illusory pendulum
We all have hopes and dreams, you know.

>>3636782

We don't have any AI yet.

So imagining a super AI is kind of silly.
Sure it might happen, sure we might be living in the Matrix, who knows.

but there's no reason to think it will happen anytime soon or even in the next 500 years.

Once we get some rudimentary AI, then we can talk.

>>3636800
>we don't have any AI yet
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/17/ibm-watson-jeopardy-wins_n_824382.html

>>3636778
Is the logic that is derived from our cultural values not the logic that we are meant to live by? Isn't that the logic that we should fear?

As I said, I'm not saying that logic is a negative thing and should be banished, it's the second side to the same coin of who we are(As you used it, it's a very positive factor of life). But as we put more credibility behind it, people we begin to use it as a means to control and distill our minds.

You aren't looking at all sides to this argument I'm putting much effort to convey, you are only trying to make your point.

>>3636786
Sure, I agree. But there are numerous financial incentives behind it. Not to mention that we actually like throwing money around -- the MarsOne mission, for example, has six billion US dollars as it's most conservative value.

>>3636793
>AI terminology
*Very basic computer science terminology. I deliberately toned down any 'jargon' so you would be able to comprehend it.

Existence exists

>>3636771
>Compares scrap-iron to an unrealizable project trying to simulate the human intelligence
>Misses the philosophical implications of AI
Dawkinsfags, please. Contain your over-enthusiastic orgasms.

>>3636809

that isn't AI.
Chess programs aren't AI.
Calculators aren't AI.


study up on what AI actually entails.

>>3636829
>>3636827
>actually believing in the uniqueness of human intelligence
Don't do this

Mathematics

>>3636811
>Is the logic that is derived from our cultural values not the logic that we are meant to live by? Isn't that the logic that we should fear?

Is english your second language?

You are confusing reason/logic with cultural values.

A cultural value can be something like the pursuit of "Wealth" in America or practicing "Islam" in Saudi Arabia.

Logic is universal and doesn't change from culture to culture.

you are completely confused. please use a dictionary.

>>3636800
>Once we get some rudimentary AI, then we can talk.
We already do, but AI is not that essential when you factor in outsourcing of human cognition -- Human consciousness is all that's needed to spill out.

We have already merged technological interfaces with the human nervous system multiple times; neurologically, optically, and directly into the brachial plexus. We know, and have proven countless times, that man and machine are compatible. We just need to safely play with neurological integration.

Interestingly, it's the pharmaceutical companies spearheading this at the moment. The potential to patent digital drugs; that is, stimulating the CNS at the base of the neck to induce the production of neurotransmitters, and the stimulation of receptors, is too financially lucrative to ignore.

>>3636827
I always thought the purpose behind AI creation wasn't to simulate the human mind, but to create a different one entirely.
One that would function on absolute logic, absolutely. And the idea of this singularity is that once this supposed 'super AI' that controls the entirety of humankind's infrastructure, and becomes virtually invincible, decides to wipe out the human race due to our illogical nature.

Or am I just talking out of my ass right now?

>>3636838

>>3636829
Study up? How about you define your terms. You said AI, so I interpreted "Artificial Intelligence".

>>3636411
Where did you get this picture from? This is exactly the thing I see in my dreams, I need to know, please, anyone have an idea what the picture in OP is?

>>3636827
You better not shout
You better not cry
You better not pout
I'm telling you why
You're not a snowflake and utopia is coming

>>3636848
Ok. I'm done.

Obviously, I don't have the skill or ability to get across what I'm trying to explain to you.

>tfw the singularity will only be available for people with customized, compatible genomes, and of the billions of generations you could have been born in, you missed the singularity by 3.

>>3636411
the process of perfecting is the true perfection.
evolution.

>>3636870
I can take it or leave it.

>>3636870
Sucks. But not as bad as it sucks for my kids and grand-kids.

Fuck those faggots.

>>3636863
>Obviously, I don't have the skill or ability to get across what I'm trying to explain to you.

I understand what you are saying, the only problem is you are using the word Reason when you should be using the word Value.

Reason doesn't tell you what values you should start with or what you should desire. It doesn't tell you to be rich or poor, healthy or sick.

Reason is a tool that helps you achieve what you desire and value. The desire can be Money, or it can be Suicide.

>>3636883
Are you saying that reason can't be influenced by whatever a culture's values are?

>>3636899
This was me, sorry. Was posting in another board.

The human race has never skimmed so close to the asymptotic goal of perfection than it did with the creation of the McRib.

The human race never skimmed so close to the asymptotic goal of perfection than it did when it created that most divine of foodstuffs, the McRib.

>>3636938
I laugh at your claim and assert the following:

>>3636927
>McRib
Ahh, good morning America.

Europe would like to invite you to dinner. I can assure you that our cuisine tastes far nicer than it looks.

Gonna go with Descartes here. One's own existence.

>>3636940
That looks very similar to Checkers' Bacon Roadhouse burger (which is also a masterpiece), but I can tell it isn't. please tell me what it is and where I can find it so i can fill this gaping hole in my heart (the gaping hole in question is my aortic valve)

>>3636899
>>3636925

>>3636899
>Are you saying that reason can't be influenced by whatever a culture's values are?


Reason tells you what follows necessarily given certain conditions or values.

It doesn't tell you what those conditions or values should be, those are up to you or your culture to decide.

Reason doesn't say you "should write books and be poor" and it doesn't say "You should be rich and have a family"

Reason says IF you want to write books, well you should know how to READ.
IF you want to be RICH, you should get a good job, etc...
IF you want a brick house, then you need some bricks!

Reason is a thinking process, everyone uses it, some better than others.

>>3636967
>>3636940
google+filename answered my question and goddamnit this is the one thing that makes me wish i lived on the west coast

this is seriously all youve guys got but its a big enough thing that it makes me reconsider my life decisions