/lit/ - Literature

>>3318006
>Are bookstores outside of North America this bad?

No. They are far worse in the USA than in Europe.

What the hell is wrong with modern grocery stores?

The food just keep getting more and more unhealthy . Today I saw shelves full of food with big flashy packaging and shocking brands but whose real nutritional content could probably be condensed into something the size of a garden pea. Best sellers are often of this format. Meanwhile, the healthy, vitamin enriched food with tastes aimed higher than that of a nine year old are tucked away where the typical customer won't even notice them.

The vitamin section was especially disgraceful. Practically every vitamin was pandering to people seeking to rewire their stomachs and improve their digestive performance. These kinds of foods are spun as some radical new understanding of nutrition when in fact they're just applying marketing hype to principles that have been known for decades. You would think from looking at them that the types who read them are obsessive, gullible, insecure, and desperate to gain every little perceived advantage they can - that's what grocery stores are saying to customers who browse this section.

The front of the store is the worst part. No decent food is ever shown here. The rules of marketing dictate that this is where they should display chocolate, flashy holiday cards, teddy bears, and works of fiction written for teenaged girls.

Are grocery stores outside of North America this bad?

Thank you, capitalism.

The market has spoken. Deal with it.

What the hell is wrong with modern music stores?

The titles just keep getting more and more moronic. Today I saw shelves full of CDs with big flashy covers and shocking titles but whose real aesthetic content could probably be condensed into something the size of a ringtone. Best sellers are often of this format. Meanwhile, the long, well-developed music with tones above a Grade 9 level are tucked away where the typical customer won't even notice them.

The pop section was especially disgraceful. Practically every CD was pandering to people seeking to rewire their brains and improve their sex life. These kinds of CDs are spun as some radical new understanding of dubstep when in fact they're just applying marketing hype to principles that have been known for decades. You would think from looking at them that the types who read them are obsessive, gullible, insecure, and desperate to gain every little perceived advantage they can - that's what music stores are saying to customers who browse this section.

The front of the store is the worst part. No decent CDs are ever shown here. The rules of marketing dictate that this is where they should display chocolate, flashy holiday cards, teddy bears, and works of fiction written for teenaged girls.

Are music stores outside of North America this bad?

>go to buy let the right one in
>the only copy they have is titled "let me in" and has a shitty cover

What the hell is wrong with modern hardware stores?

The tools just keep getting more and more moronic. Today I saw shelves full of tools with big flashy packages and shocking titles but whose real utility could probably be condensed into something the size of a swiss army knife. Best sellers are often of this format. Meanwhile, the power tools that require more than a Grade 9 shop class to use them are tucked away where the typical customer won't even notice them.

The gardening section was especially disgraceful. Practically every product was pandering to people seeking to rewire their gardens and improve their vegetable yield. These kinds of books are spun as some radical new understanding of agriculture when in fact they're just applying marketing hype to principles that have been known for decades. You would think from looking at them that the types who read them are obsessive, gullible, insecure, and desperate to gain every little perceived advantage they can - that's what hardware stores are saying to customers who browse this section.

The front of the store is the worst part. No decent tools are ever shown here. The rules of marketing dictate that this is where they should display chocolate, flashy holiday cards, teddy bears, and works of fiction written for teenaged girls.

Are hardware stores outside of North America this bad?

>>3318030
This.

The bookstores don't give a shit about your intellectual growth or ideological convictions; they want as much of everyone's money as possible and for everyone to get the fuck out.

The market will always behave in a utilitarian manner because that's the best way to turn a profit. The store owner probably doesn't give a single fuck about books or literature. He spends his/her money on living the yuppie lifestyle, having a nice house, happy spouse, frequent trips to Cancun.

Very few bookstores will cater to the intellectuals because hardly anyone is an intellectual by definition; they cater to the statistical average because most people are in that part of the bell curve. Without a large enough target audience, they can't sustain their business.

That's often why scholarly works are so expensive and why publishing firms of the works are primarily larger umbrella organizations, i.e. University presses. That's also why Penguin sells shit-tier literature along with their cheap paperback classics.

Whatever you learn in University, diversity fights an uphill battle against pop culture. And it sucks, but whatever. It's the way things are.

Welcome to earth. The humans here are actually sheep. Enjoy hiding in your basement, judging society.

What the hell is wrong with modern 4chan post?

The content just keep getting more and more moronic. Today I saw threads full of tripe with big flashy words and shocking subjects but whose real educational content could probably be condensed into something the size of a sentence. Popular threads are often of this format. Meanwhile, the thick, well-researched threads with language above a Grade 9 level are saged away where the typical poster won't even notice them.

The literature section is especially disgraceful. Practically every thread was pandering to people seeking to solve an existential crisis or look for recommendations. These kinds of threads are spun as some radical new understanding of anonymous communication when in fact they're just applying social-networking skills to principles that have been known for decades. You would think from looking at them that the types who post in them are obsessive, gullible, insecure, and desperate to gain every little perceived advantage they can - that's what 4chan is saying to posters who browse this section.

The front page is the worst part. No decent threads are ever shown here. The rules of marketing dictate that this is where they should display animu, vidya, and waifus.

Are imageboards outside of North America this bad?

>>3318053
Don't underestimate the versatile efficacy of the Swiss Army Knife, bro.

Montreal here.

Why can't I hold all these feels?

Enjoy living in America.

Thank you /lit/. Best thread of the evening.

What the hell is wrong with modern /lit/?

The threads just keep getting more and more moronic. Today I saw pages full of threads with big flashy pics and edgy titles but whose real educational content could probably be condensed into something the size of a post line. The most active threads are often of this format. Meanwhile, the meaningful, well-researched threads with language above a Grade 9 level are tucked away where the typical poster won't ever notice them.

The front page was especially disgraceful. Practically every thread was pandering to people seeking to retread their arguments and improve their trolling performance. These kinds of threads are spun as some radical new understanding of literature when in fact they're just applying nonsensical arguments to principles that have been known for decades. You would think from looking at them that the types who read them are obsessive, gullible, insecure, and desperate to gain every little perceived advantage they can - that's what /lit/ is saying to posters who browse this board.

The front of /lit/ is the worst part. No decent threads are ever shown here. The rules of shitposting dictate that this is where they should display requests, flashy pics, tripfag blogs, and works of fiction written for neckbeards..

Are boards outside of 4chan this bad?

>posting modified versions of the OP post many times over.
Good job on being original.

>>3318251

Welcome to 4chan. First day here?

>>3318240

You basically did exactly what I did a few posts up.

>>3318006
I disagree

>>3318270
>joke got stolen on 4chan
>seriously what are you mad about
>also you stole my joke (hardware stores)
>also I stole my joke (music stores)
>also I stole my joke (grocery stores)
>also I stole OPs post

>>3318265
not the guy you're replying to, but i've been on 4chan for years now and i still roll my eyes at those kinds of posts

they're really among the worst. even an over-indulgent ironic shitpost gets a smile out of me

>>3318270
>implying it's not more different from yours than yours is from the OP.

>>3318300
So I did the first reply, and the joke was that the OPs complaints about book stores dont have to do with the country being illiterate, but with capitalism. That is a sort of tedious argument to make, so I saved myself the effort by showing that the affect of capitalism/invisible hands/etc (see how tedious it is :) ) on layouts of stores isn't limited to bookstores.

>>3318329
You are wrong.
It's both illiteracy and capitalism.

>>3318341
If people who liked books owned bookstores and didn't have to worry about selling books, they'd arrange it any fucking way they like

Knock B&N all you want, but you must accept the fact that you are knocking about a corporate gargantuan of a supermarket of a bookstore. In that regard, you are knocking on the open door here. If the people demanded classical tomes, B&N would supply them. Your criticism ought to be aimed at the public or corporate culture or genre fiction or whatever (spare us)- don't shoot the messenger!

Positives of B&N
- affordable classix (B&N series, penguin, etc)
- decent philosophy section (depending on demographics)
- opportunity to find your /lit/ qt

cons
- degeneration of small bookstores
- peddlers of contemptuous books as you mentioned, have to deal with many-many-many-many unsavory covers in your journey
- have to contemplate the sad state of affairs that is contemporary literature
- get accosted by filthy nookmonger at the entrance
- shit-ass doodoowater coffee in the corner
- have to consider the fact that our society too readily embraces the escalator
- classix oddly mixed in the receptacle of contemporary literature
- that feel when no /lit/ qt

>>3318389
Psst. Guess what? They're doing poorly and all set to go out of business, soon.

Your pro/con list is irrelevant.

Book stores have needed to change their business model for years. The corporate one is falling apart, looks like B&N is going to sink rather soon. Corporations are just bad news on so many levels.

I had an idea for a coffee/sandwich/general eatery place with an adjoining library/book store. You could find a tattered copy of something that you've been reading on your lunch break and you decide you like it some much, you can ask them to order it for you (Or go ahead and buy online yourself. Whatever. They can still make money from the food end of the business) Of course the look of the reading and eating spaces are all very homey and inviting... You'd like what I had in mind.
Now these books would be a decent mix of classics and contemporary since our model isn't to sell sell sell so much, but if the clientele want a copy of 50 Shades or Hunger Games, the clerk will just scratch his head and order it.

>>3318030
Lets destroy the corporate model first.

>>3318389
You forgot to put under cons:
>never carries anything you might want to read besides high-school-tier classics

>>3318522
So you're book store concept it's actually a cafe?

This could save all sorts of businesses :D
>record stores
>travel agency
>newspaper stand
>stationary store
>church

>>im being a dick about but yknowwhatimean?

>>3318522

Hey, I really like your idea.

Emphasize the quality of the food and coffee and I would go very often.

>>3318075
Chain stores are shit. If you're lucky you will find an independent bookstore that caters to readers. There's one in my town, run by an elderly German immigrant, that's stocked with rare first editions, recent translations of foreign classics, and texts on all sorts of tight shit.

>>3318522
Isn't that kind of what Borders did?

>Today I saw shelves full of books with big flashy covers and shocking titles but whose real educational content could probably be condensed into something the size of a Wikipedia article.

It's almost like they are seeking to maximize profit by appealing to the largest customer base possible! Seriously, this isn't hard to fucking understand.

>>3318564
It's exactly what most Barnes and Nobles are like: tons of books and cafe food/coffee. The only difference seems to be less books. Not really sure what this solves.

>>3318540
What I miss most about my local Borders is the chairs. There's no public squares to hang out and loiter in in this city. Its all mega malls and Starbucks. So boring. So the idea is to create a nice public space for slow down time.

>>3318548
I wish I had the funding and the head for business...

>>3318573
There's also the fact that you're female, so you would undoubtedly fuck it up somehow.

>>3318081

Best Post Evar.

>>3318564
>>3318571
If people are focusing less on physical books and more on heir kindles and such, let them. These places are going out of business because they're trying to sell big. The corporate big box hyper-capitalist model has failed in the modern society.

Here I just kind of meld the public space with the book store and coffee shop. Higher quality products and slower pace.

>>3318577
You pick the drapes than, buttercup.

Alright, I'm done. This whole non-venture makes my heart melt with longing...

>>3318586
>than
>than
>than

Just kill yourself.

>>3318583
>The corporate big box hyper-capitalist model has failed in the modern society.
>what is McDonalds?
>what is WalMart?
>what is Apple?
>what is going on outside my house?

Your idea for a small cafe/bookstore is feasible, in that there are a bunch in NYC. If you know what you're doing you can turn a profit, but you won't be revolutionizing anything. I've thought of opening one myself.

>>3318586

>than

>>3318586
>fuck capitalism!!!!
>man i wish I could open my own bookstore :((((

>>3318603

>expecting consistent logic from someone who pines for attention on an anonymous site

>>3318592
Hmmm Are you sure that's not acceptable? I can admit when I'm wrong

>>3318603
There's a huge difference between capitalism and and corporations son.

>>3318594
>I've thought of opening one myself.
But corporations haven't.
I did mean to say that the corporate model has failed to adapt for book stores, but they are in fact failing society in general. McDonalds, Walmart etc are parasites killing small businesses and everything else in general.

>>3318639
>there's a huge difference between capitalism and and corporations

The only difference between a small business and a "big" business is that one makes more, that's it. Stop rationalizing your inconsistency by romanticizing small businesses.

>>3318654
Please stop talking about things you know nothing of AS IF you knew anything about them. For your own sake.

>tfw you want to see qts in the bookstore but you know that you're less of a pleb if you buy online, and you're not a pleb at all if you pirate books

>tfw I went to buy books in a bookstore, just to see what it felt like.

>a qt stood behind me for about a second, looking for some books

>>3318666
Any line you draw between small business and big business is arbitrary. I'm sorry to rip apart your deluded worldview.

Paranormal Teen Romance

It seems like they keep expanding the romance and young adult sections while the philosophy section has become pretty much entirely merged with Christian Inspiration or some shit.

The history section at my local B&N is seriously only like two shelves.

>>3318667
I know it sounds pathetic but I have one memory of browsing for books at a bookstore. There was one other person in the same aisle, a pretty little brunette woman. She wasn't paying attention to where she was going and bumped into me. When I turned towards her she flashed me this gorgeous smile and and said, "Excuse me."

I still remember the smell of her hair.

>>3318679
>girl says excuse me as she walks by
>she wants to fuck

>>3318684

It was a metaphor and double entrende, you unromantic philistine.

>"excuse me" - "screw me"
>"flashed me this gorgeous smile" - "flashed me this gorgeous vagina" since both can handle penis

Goddamit man you could have got laid.

>>3318679

I've had similar encounters, I just always get shaky and nervous and only think of all the perfect replies later as I masturbate furiously to the dream of not being a waste of space

>>3318674
Mine has Astronomy and Astrology on the same shelf...

>>3318706

But they are related!

This thread has been hilarious.

To answer OP's question: Waterstones in the UK doesn't sound this bad. Yeah, there's chocolate, tacky gift ideas, and a shit load of celebrities printing money but there's also a pretty broad 'classics' section and in my local shop they display different authors/types of work now and then.

This normally coincides with film releases - when The Great Gatsby film started being advertised, there was a little display on Fitzy boy. At least they're trying

I worked with this guy who actually bought those psychology books. Weirdest mix of "im sensitive!" and "Im a real man!" that Ive ever seen. he would go to restaurants and write this diary of sorts about the "psychology" of people using his barnes and noble book as reference. but it wasnt like cafes of coffee shops that he would go to. it would be buffalo wild wings or something and he would often go alone, order a beer and write. he was really fit and worked out all the time too. joined the navy a year ago and i never saw him again.

OP's part about insecurity and obsession just reminded me about this guy. his name was chuck.

>You jelly?

http://www.thelibrarybar.co.nz/

I haven't been here, but I hear it's great.

>>3319162

Chuck sounds like a weirdly interesting guy

>>3318341
I would say that capitalism contributes to, perhaps even drives illiteracy and anti-intellectualism. So long as the market assumes everyone is pants on head retarded there is very little chance anything will change.

>>3318522
This has already been done, where do you think the big chains stole their idea for a coffee shop inside their book shop from? Here in Brisbane (ausfag here) there is a little hole in the wall bookshop in fortitude valley (cannot remember its name) with an excellent café built in, I went in for the books but I keep coming back for the atmosphere.

>not going to your local bookstore

Well I live in Yurop. Big bookstores are half-good. Basically because they have to pander to all kinds of people so of course they have to use the most obvious marketing tools to get your average joe.
In my case, I need philosophical books (because next year I'm going to a very selective university for postgraduate) and I also need these maths and business books (GMAT and all, mental performance stuff) because in two years I'm trying a selective business school. I do not go in the same kind of shop. If I want to improve my math skills and mental performance, sure I just go to these big shops because there are thousands of students like me who want to get in a business school (not as late as me though).

But whenever I want to enjoy some literature or philosophical stuff, whether they are obscure or not, I just head to my local bookstore. And they ofter have much classier books. They don't even sell these mental performance books anyway.

I don't even care what these big bookstores are selling because there are enough good small bookstores near my home.

Pic related, that's one of the three local bookstore.

It's because of women. They love to read shit, so it spreads.

>50 Shades of Ass

Bookstores around the world are filled with this cheap crap. I think it's doing better in the UK, they actually have commercials for books, which we don't have here, for instance.

Not sure about America.

>Are bookstores outside of North America this bad?

You tell me:
fullybookedonline.com
nationalbookstore.com.ph

Have any of you ever been to The Strand in nyc? 5 levels, they stock EVERYTHING. Top floor is Folios and rare first editions, bottom floor is used books, inbetween is everything else

>>3319424
http://www.strandbooks.com/about-strand-books/

>>3319377

>Pic related, that's one of the three local bookstore.

>three local bookstore S

You fucking French faggot, learn English properly.

I hate your white books. Love English books far better.

>>3319424
I've been there a few times. The stuff inside the store is overpriced to the point of absurdity. I only browse the $1 and $2 bins outside.

Also, I keep hearing that the Strand is in constant peril of being shut down. Any truth to this?

Don't get me wrong, it's still a thousand times better than B&N across the square, there. At least The Strand looks like it's for people who like to read (even if the staff is disturbingly snobby).

I like bookstores because I can browse and read magazines I usually don't buy. I do buy some. But I always chuckle when I ask for a book and they don't have it but offer to order it for me.

Orly?????

I was going to buy it if they had it. I can (usually) order a used copy from the Intertubes for much less.

Also, more real girls at the bookstore than on-line even though they are wearing clothes and don't have a dick in their mouth or ass.

>>3319436
Sorry but I'm not even French.
I do like Penguin Classics though.

>>3319466
went to strand a few weeks ago - its cool but cramped as shit in there and overcrowded with people. they have lots of books but not much space.

>>3318522

>I had an idea for a coffee/sandwich/general eatery place with an adjoining library/book store.

That's what Waterstones, the largest book-store in Britain, has. It's shit. It's Costa Coffee (not sure if they have that in America), which is essentially the shittiest chain of High-street coffee shops we have. There's only ever old people in there and it's not a relaxing environment at all.

>>3319625

Waterstones is pretty good IMO. My own got rid of it's coffeeshop about 5 years ago.

>>3319716
Your opinion matters less than anyone's on /lit/ about.

>>3319625
Cody's in Berkeley did this. Now closed. Too many bums out front, only bathroom on Telegraph. The owner got greedy and expanded into a basement in downtown SF where no one ever went and it smelled like mold. The thing about a cafe is you are basically giving thieves a nice place to sit while they stuff books into their bags. Cody's had tags in all of their books, easily removed. Kind of a bummer, their book displays were usually decent lit instead of the junk in a chain bookstore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cody's_Books

>>3319839
That's what's so funny about Sunhawk's insistence on tripping. He's the least respected person on the board, and everything he contributes gets panned viciously. He can change it all around if he simply just drops his tripcode.

That's some pipehittin' vanity, right there. It's somewhat admirable, despite being totally idiotic.

Bookstores are businesses. Why are there so many crappy books on display? Because there's a lot of crappy people willing to buy them. It's bait. But to be fair to B&N, I've never gone inside and not found what I was looking for (except Melville's "Pierre"—go figure). They usually keep a great supply of good/classic authors and poets, you just have to look for them.

Books A Million is truly the hell-hole of all bookstores, though. I wish it tanked instead of Borders. I loved Borders.

>>3319864
>But to be fair to B&N, I've never gone inside and not found what I was looking for (except Melville's "Pierre"—go figure).

You either read a lot of vanilla, or your B&N is atypically well-stocked. I've left B&N more often with nothing than with what I went in to get.

>>3319876
Yeah, I'm not sure how B&N works from store to store. I've been to some in other cities with hardly anything worth buying... but the one nearest my house always has one or two of the books I'm looking for.

EG, a few days ago I went and found a book of poems by Hopkins. Went back yesterday to buy it and it was gone. Maybe some locations have have patrons with better taste who quickly snatch up those single copies.

>>3319908
>have have
damn it.

I don't know why I'd go to a bookstore to find books, unless they are the kids' fantasy fiction trash that I enjoy so much.

I order anything good on Amazon.

I only go to B&N these days for their shitty comics and manga section.

>>3319359
Never said it was an original idea. There is a gap -black hole- in my community, in its lacking of social gathering places.
>>3319625
Than this is not what I had in mind.
>>3319846
Aww. Damn petty crimes and greed.