/lit/ - Literature

De Sade did it first

9edgy6me

>>3284452
Gor is pretty cool. It seems there are actual people who turned it into a lifestyle. I wish I could meet them.

>>3284485

There are societies where the opposite is true - men get led around on all fours, in chains, willingly.

Takes all kinds.

>>3284490
Do tell me more. I love this concept of deeply-ingrained, natural, conscious submission but simply can't find books on it. Can't figure out what to search for.

>>3284490
>obligatory femicunt post

>>3284498

You might want to read up on some sex-positive feminism. Some of its variants are interesting.

Other than that, just read De Sade and Venus in Furs

>>3284485
Oh wow.... She is gorgeous.

>>3284503

I wasn't making any kind of moral statement in either direction.

You're the one who brought sexism into it.

I'd prefer the gender flipped version where women rule and men serve.

Of course it would be the really erotic version where all the women are super hot and use men for their sexual pleasure. And they would have supernatural sex powers, like three tongues or something.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'd rather just wait for Monster Girl Quest part 3

>>3284504
When I saw De Sade be mentioned I didn't think much of it... I'll check everything out.

I'm kinda afraid though, I don't find bondage by itself all that attractive. Bondage is latent domination that must be expressed. It's some kind of in-your-face exception to the rule. I fancy something more... psychological, ingrained, inherent. Gor's been keeping me pretty busy, but Venus in Furs sounds very aligned with my interests.

>>3284503
Nah, gender wars don't figure into this. Gor has free women who are pretty much equal to men socially.

It's about the conscious, consenting domination and/or ownership. I find the sheer concept deeply erotic.

hawt

>>3284538

>I fancy something more... psychological, ingrained, inherent.

You'll love both De Sade and Venus.

Read Justine and Juliette

>>3284507
Isn't she? Not a woman I'd post on /fit/, but I would regret absolutely nothing.

>>3284527
>the really erotic version where all the women are super hot and use men for their sexual pleasure

Yeah, when your version is that idealized I for one wouldn't mind being submissive. Hell, I'd even argue that I wasn't actually being submissive since I was actually getting what I want because women have some sort of innate need to pleasure me. It's just that they are dominant enough to do it systematically.

When we talk about being completely submissive, though, the idea quickly loses its appeal. At least to me.

>>3284557
fucking disgusting

>>3284557
At least post attractive chubby women.

>>3284570
That's when you get into distinguishing hot fantasies and hot realities (which people who don't get laid alot can't really do). A friend of mine who does get laid aplenty and is into BDSM and other roleplay stuff talks about that.

>>3284452
>Has /lit/ read these novels? It is about a primitive planet where males dominate unrestricted and unashamed, and women are slaves.

Is it conan? What novel is that?

Conan is awesome btw. Women are depicted honestly.

Just read a recent story about a rich woman whose husband is a successful lawyer and she decided to become an escort for fun.

Typical

>>3284586

if she lost 30 lbs her body would be decent

>>3284586
>Body Type: Thin

>>3284586
hahah yoga, zumba, pilates and trying to stay healthy. Can't go a day without chocolate

>>3284586
8/10, I like her face. She is chubby, unlike the Gor girl who's outright fat. But hey, I'd rather have a BBW than a sack of bones one can barely touch. I honestly think she is quite attractive, and when I see her in this position with her legs spread open I just get so...

>>3284598
No, it's Gor. Look it up.

>>3284588
I'm 18 years old and a virgin but I try quite hard to not have any of those typical nerd preconceptions. I don't think this interest in domination comes out of some sort of hatred of women, I do have a quite dominant although shy personality. I just enjoy being in control and get really frustrated when I lose control of the situation.

I guess what I find interesting is that the ingrained domination frees me from the responsibility of "proving myself".

Wow I looked Gor up and it seems quite deep. Has any of you read the entire series, and if so, could you please offer me a summary of the series? Are there any highlights besides the maledom stuff

>>3284724

>seems quite deep

I'd love to know what you consider 'shallow'

>>3284733
It seems to be, I haven't actually read much of it

>>3284724
it's probably stephen king tier. i'd rather read it than king by the looks of it.

>>3284743
>stephen king

... sorry, I'm afraid I'm a bit too new here

>>3284724

Gor is about the fundamental struggle between man vs nature, freedom and subjugation.

It explores the most important themes and in the most aesthetic of senses.

People who can't appreciate it can't stand honest depictions of reality, violence, struggle, and human emotion.

> I think it takes a lot of guts to write this sort of stuff.

no it doesn't

"there was once a woman who was weak-willed and submissive like all women and she gave her sexy body to the very strong and dominating man who liked it very, very much"

see there's nothing brave about it, because of everybody is anonymous.
you think because the author's name is on the book that it isn't anonymous? Nah, he's anonymous just like we are, because reputation doesn't really matter in our society and you can always just say things like "I'm doing what the public demands", "I'm only satisfying the desires of others", "artistic license" to evade all accountability.

>reputation doesn't really matter

WHAT DID YOU SAY ANON!?
yes I said reputation doesn't matter
BUT REPUTATION IS EVERYTHING, IF YOU DON'T HAVE A GOOD REPUTATION* 13 YEAR OLD GIRLS WILL LOOK AT YOU AND THINK YOU ARE A LOSER

*if you aren't dressed properly or don't have a person with you

no, reputation doesn't matter. Think about Roman society if you want a society where reputation mattered. I read an article today on VHM.com of the 100 best women secrets of 2012, at the top 1 was a woman who dressed up as another women and fucked her husband (not that exciting I know), her husband tied her up and gagged her, and she said in the article "I had never been licked or fucked like that before". See, it doesn't matter in our society if you are chaste or debauched . . . it just doesn't fucking matter. Everybody is kind of chaste and kind of debauched = everybody still talks about wanting to find true love while at the same time enjoying things like masturbation and excessive drinking. I know I'm yammering on at only one point of society but you can extract the point of what I'm saying and apply it in countless other players which all give you the same result: reputation doesn't really matter.

>>3284765
Yes. I believe Gor tends to be reduced to some sort of "revenge on women fantasy" by people. I think they couldn't be more wrong. Gor made me explore feelings I didn't know I had, and after I got into it I just wanted more and more. I feel quite strongly the need to dominate at every level, as in, owning people. After reading it I found that it is equally as important if not more important for the submissive party to accept their status.

>>3284765

Why are

>honest depictions of reality, violence, struggle, and human emotion.

Interesting artistically or aesthetically?

>>3284786
>other players

places

these glitches in my text always happen when I'm really tired

>>3284792
Personally, I can relate to the themes explored by the novels. I find it to be so gripping that I imagine myself in it.

>>3284790
probably 1 of those books where you are like 'yeah i read nietzsche too' on every page and you wonder why he made THIS kind of tribute and then you just give up and then you don't and you start raging you're pouring alcohol on the book and flicking a lit match at it and laughing maniacally while you pound the streets throwing nocturnal pages in people's windows the police's sirens start up and you know you're trapped...you're running out of time and you don't know where to go.

>>3284801

That's not an answer.

>>3284807
Why are you so angry?

>>3284811
you have no right to ask that and no right to know the answer.

>>3284827
Your non-answer tempts me to speculate. Was experience with the book simply that bad? Do you break down when you encounter similar concepts in separate works?

All art is the result of an organic process. They aren't self-contained works. They aren't pure and new and free of references. That is a good thing.

>>3284844
who gives a damn about me and why the hell are you tempted to know the essence of nothing?

>>3284853
I'm trying to determine the reason you disliked the novel so much.

Can we go back to talking about Gor?

>>3284885
WTF IS GOR

>>3284895
a fucking awesome tale of females being completely owned by males

just thinking about it made my dick hard

>>3284912
>horny teenagers

>>3284922
>butthurt feminists

>>3284948

I'm not anyone in this thread, but nothing about these books is necessarily against certain brands of feminism.

Encouraging fantasies of these kinds is empowering to both sexes.

Nice needless reply, though.

>>3284792

Interest is subjective.

Aesthetic quality depends on the right subject coming in contact with the right work.

Gor is aesthetic and deep. Not all readers are good enough readers to appreciate it.

>>3284979

>deep

How so?

Let's hear what a good enough reader has to say about it.

This was great.
.

>>3285017


Use of language, soliloquy, metaphor and dramatization synchronizes with the symbolic rendition of the character's struggles in completely authentic and layered way.

It's hard to describe why something is beautiful or deep. You have to see it for yourself.

>>3284586
So close, yet so far.

>>3285043

In what way is the character symbolically rendered? What about this rendition is authentic? What are these layers? I'd like to hear you discuss the book instead of describing it.

>language, soliloquoy, metaphor and dramatization synchronizes

Oh, so it's just another novel?

>>3285079

>please read the book for me and feed me its nectar

>>3285094

If you can't explain why the book is deep, please do not claim it as so.

Or feel free to. Just know you haven't justified your opinion.

>>3285111
>Just know you haven't justified your opinion.

refer to:
>>3285043

>>3285127

You've given an opinion. That I can see without the redirect. I've yet to see you justify it.

>>3285138


Being unsatisfied with an answer is a different problem.

>>3285152

Being satisfied with your vacant answer is your own prerogative

>>3285018
I agree.

>>3284452

>OPs glorious picture

>tfw you will never have a harem of woman slaves in this backwards society

>>3285018
"The most complete and perfect institution for the total domination of a woman is that of female slavery," I said. "How could a woman be more perfectly and completed dominated, more helpless, more dependent on a male, more vulnerable, more subject to a man's will, more at a man's mercy than to be literally his, an owned slave?" I looked at her. "Pretty Vella," I said, "to look at you is to want you, to want you is to want to own you, completely, every bit of you, to have you completely at one's mercy - completely."
"It is such lust," she wept. "It is such a complete and uncompromising desire. What could compare with it? I had not known such passion, such desire, could exist. It overwhelms me. I can scarcely breathe. And I am to be its helpless victim."
Tribesmen of Gor - Page 320

Beautiful.

>>3285332

Sure you can, if they consent to it.

>>3285338

True natural love.

>>3285338

This is unironically bad. The concept is great but the thinking isn't there.

>>3285344
Rape and submission by force isn't fun if they want it.

Holy shit, guise, guise, guise, guise, do you think there are girls on /lit/?

>>3285351

Nor is it ethically correct

>>3285363
We should make them our sex slaves, but they are probably ugly.

>>3285350

You aren't a good enough reader. Simple.

>>3285363

First day here? This board has more females than any other

It's all man's fault that women have the freedoms they do today.

If it wasn't for those blasted philosophers the world would be a much better and more natural place.

>>3285367
>2012
>ethics

>>3285375
No I come here a fair bit, just haven't noticed apparently.

Funny if you look at reviews of Gor on youtube most of them are from females who love the "Gorean" life style and being dominated.

Go figure. He has a point.

>>3285371

Your taste is the only valid taste? Anyone who dislikes what you like is incorrect?

You're being extremely childish.

>>3285388
>You mean that men seek to dominate and women seek to be dominated? No way! It's like they were made for each other.. a perfect match almost.

>>3285381

>better

arbitrary

>more natural

is =/= ought

>>3285382

You're an extreme nihilist? You believe in pure chaos?

>>3285397
>arbitrary

In his opinion.

>is =/= ought

In his opinion.

>>3285400
The burden of proof is on moralists. I've yet to be convinced that life has an objective meaning.

Daily reminder that anyone who has read Nietzsche can never become the Ubermensch.

>>3285351
Except Gor isn't about force. It's about intrinsic domination of women. The women accept it fully and their slavery comes from within them.

This is the single most beautiful thing I've ever imagined. Truly, love is to want one all to ourselves, fully. Truly, love is to want one to want us to want one.

>>3285404

Who said anything about objective meaning? We can have a system of ethics without assuming this.

>>3285401

Now you get it.

>>3285368
If they look like and are as sympathetic as >>3284485, I would welcome them into my home.

>>3285421
But your ethics are arbitrary and subjective based on your opinions.

>>3285420
This is just fantastic. If I hadn't just jacked off my weener would be more than chubby.

>>3285420
>Truly, love is to want one all to ourselves, fully.

>>3285428

So is your alleged lack of them.

>>3285439
Also, women are treated like intelligent beings, there are entire passages dedicated to masters learning from their slaves. The essence of slavery just means submitting to her master. It's not really much different than submitting to God or something. If her master wishes to turn her into a wise and educated woman, that's what she'll be.

>>3285445
Lol'd

>>3285446
No, because the burden of proof is on you. Until you can prove that there is a certain way I ought to act, no action is morally superior or inferior to another.

>>3285420
>love is to want one all to ourselves, fully.

What a load of shit

>>3285456

I've arbitrarily decided that suffering is something I find wrong.

You've arbitrarily decided that no action is morally superior or inferior to another.

>>3285457
What is love, then?

>>3285462

Personally defined.

>>3285456

Prepare to be judged for your decisions.

>>3285375
>This board has more females than any other
Fat chicks tho?

>>3285461
>You've arbitrarily decided that no action is morally superior or inferior to another.

No, that's not a decision. This is like saying that Atheism is a religious belief system, it's the lack of one. Not believing something is not a position in itself. It's the default position from a logical point of view, and one I won't move from until there is evidence that certain actions are morally superior or inferior.

>>3285470

Quite a few lookers, actually.

>>3285474
What do they think about Gor?

>>3285470
Hey, /lit/ girls, post pics. Thanks, pprecciate it. (I meant to leave out the a btw.)

>>3285470
it's inevitable

>>3285482
This is the ugly cunt who posts with that shitty butterfly name.

>>3285479

There's nothing wrong with submission under consent when it isn't informed by an oppressive cultural dialogue.

I don't see why there should be a qualm. I'm a male, though.

>>3285487
>when it isn't informed by an oppressive cultural dialogue

You betas are so cringeworthy, I swear.

>>3285487
I'm expecting to see some feminazis pop up and try to set fire on these books

>>3285488

Feel free to argue the point if you disagree.

That dichotomy is cringeworthy as fuck

sex itself is inherently rape to a woman.

the act of penetration is like a club beating an open wound.

>>3285492
Cultural dialogue cannot oppress anyone.

Jews getting put in ovens = oppression

Women getting called whores when they fuck the football team = not oppression

>>3285493

Haha what??

>>3285499
ALL SEX IS RAPE BECAUSE IT IS WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF A SOCIETY WHERE THE POWER STRUCTURE IS DOMINATED BY WHITE MALES, AND THEREFORE WOMEN ARE UNABLE TO GIVE INFORMED CONSENT INDEPENDENT OF THE PATRIARCHAL CONTEXT OF SAID ACTIONS.

>>3285498

Why is it you think Jews were put into ovens?

Think. I know it's hard.

>>3285498
who cares if they fuck the football team, are you jealous you can't be the center of a hot gangbang with the football team or something?

>>3285506
The act of oppressing them was oppression, not everything that led to it, you fucking orwellian cunt. Words aren't oppression, go fuck yourself.

>>3285486
I know he's new and all, but please refrain from posting more pictures of the unattractive, "anarchist-reformist" nitwit.

>>3285505

Why is it that those who parody opinions on this board always end up sounding sillier than that which they're up against?

>>3285498
>women getting called whores at all

Why? I would very much like a society in which women are not afraid to have as much sex as they want to. They might even start taking the initiative instead of the other way around. I'm tired of having guess what women are thinking in order to start shit.

Nature oppresses women.

it gave them a period just out of spite.

>>3285506
because they started putting russian communists POWS into ovens and when they realized they were losing the war and there would be no way to relocate the jewish population out of europe their hand was forced and they started lighting them up, it didn't have to end like that but american and russia put the germans in a corner

>>3285510
>anarchism
>not anarcho-capitalism

0/10 would not pity fuck

>>3285505


this is pretty hilarious and true

women rights activitsts are this deluded.

>>3285509

I'd argue that language works as an ideological oppressor, and leads to violence in the way that you demonstrated.

Our thoughts, our speech, inform our actions.

>>3285511
oh, that was a parady opinion? i thought he was quoting anrea dworkin or something lol

>>3285517

Maybe of the tumblr variety.

You've got a pretty restricted worldview

>>3285519
>Our thoughts, our speech, inform our actions.

Yeah, we better get a government agency to monitor those things. We wouldn't want any mean words or thoughts to oppress the heroic minorities who have permanent victim status!

>>3285511
Because that's the point of a parody?

>>3285532
Roasted

>>3285525
Actually, that statement is the logical conclusion of mainstream feminist thought.

>>3285526

I never said or implied any of that.

I merely expressed an opinion as to what would constitute a moral act of submission.

>>3285532

I meant the poster, not the post.

>>3285540

Hah, what? Care to cite me some mainstream third-wave thinking on the issue?

Feminism is a slave morality.

Good books. Movies were shit, but everyone here knows that movies are always shit.

>>3285453
awesome

Why aren't people discussing these epic books?

>>3285815

I just scrolled through the thread. The writing seems pretty mediocre, the concept only vaguely interesting. Meh.

>>3285554
Emancipation is slavery now?

>>3285367
>ethically
>correct
>in one sentence

my sides

>>3285395
I just watched SUPER.
I cried at the end.

>>3284666
its not that she's fat, it's just that she's not attractive. Like I like my women fluffy, but they also need to be attractive and not look like rosie

>>3285473
but you're fucking wrong. Atheism is not "not believing" in something, it's a denial of the existance of any gods and a ridged adherence to that ideal.

I'm agnostic, and atheist are just as "religious" as christians. And just as annoying. If you and I disagree on if water vapor exist or not why wouldn't those two arguments both be classed under the same heading?

>>3285462

> Babby don't hurt me
> Don't hurt me
> No more

>>3286783
Eh, I think she's pretty attractive. Maybe it's because of the positions she put herself in?

>>3286802
>i give you my love
>but you don't care