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/lit/ - Literature

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3245902 No.3245902 [Reply] [Original]

Why does hierarchy exist, /lit/? Does surplus inevitably have to be divided unequally?

>> No.3245909

>>3245902
No, but humans exist in a constant state of competition for resources. Attempts to equalize resources fairly usually result in redistribution of resources towards certain individuals at later periods, and/or disinterest from individuals without motivation towards better production.

We're all playing the long version of the Prisoner's Dilemma, and we keep losing because of it.

>> No.3245911

>>3245902
>Why does hierarchy exist

Some people are better than others. Others are just luckier than others.

>Does surplus inevitably have to be divided unequally?

Yep.

>> No.3245914

>Why does hierarchy exist, /lit/?

because people are alright with it

>Does surplus inevitably have to be divided unequally?

practically, it will end up this way.

>> No.3245916

>>3245911
this is really just evasion of the question. What is the origin of human inequality then?

>> No.3245921

>>3245902
>Why does hierarchy exist?
Cause I'm bigger than you.

>> No.3245922

Because it's pretty damn difficult to have a large social unit (greater than 150 persons) without some sort of organizational hierarchy.
If there is no single group with the right to use force, then individuals tend to use force against eachother and you get lots of murder.

>> No.3245923

>>3245916
Genetics, history, and circumstance. Not to mention, again, the constant competition for resources.

>> No.3245924

>>3245916
whatever genetic and environmental factors create the differences between humans.

If anything scarcity is what makes us constantly work towards improving. It is a great thing.

>> No.3245927

>Why does hierarchy exist, /lit/?
>What is the origin of human inequality then?

There are just so many books about this. Please read. And to anyone answering, please read some too instead of giving your teenager top of mind answer.

Foucault, Freud, Marx... it goes on forever, pick your poison. Anyone involved with politics talked about this at some point.

>> No.3245930

>>3245924
>>3245923
You see. These guys don't read much.

>> No.3245933

The filthy fascists descend upon the thread.

No OP. It does not have to be like this.

>> No.3245936

>>3245933
and yet you provide no compelling counterargument...

>> No.3245935

>>3245930
But I have so many other things to do, like work my shitty job so I can survive and come home and view entertainment so I don't stress about it.

>> No.3245938

>>3245916
>What is the origin of human inequality then?

Difference. If two things are different, they must be somehow unequal.

>> No.3245940

>>3245935
Alright.

>> No.3245942

>>3245933

Flutter away, faggot.

>> No.3245944

>>3245940
Well.

Ok.

>> No.3245945

>>3245930
Right. Not enough lit, too busy with science.

I forgot this was /philosophy/.

>> No.3245953

>>3245945
Don't imply that philosophy ignores or is contradicted by science. That particular guy is just being an ass

>> No.3245963

>>3245953

Hooray, /lit/'s shittiest tripfags together in one thread.

>> No.3245964

>>3245945
This is /lit/. Not /sci/.

You ought to read and develop your ideas a little more here.

>> No.3245971

Not all humans are equal when it comes to innate ability, so why should society force economic equality?

>> No.3245970
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3245970

>>3245936
I present to you the revolution and our contemporary world. The fight goes on of course, but we outnumber you dolts

>> No.3245975

>>3245970

Wonderful non-answer.

>> No.3245978

>>3245971

Ability to profit is not necessarily a rubric we should use to determine worth

>> No.3245981

>>3245975
y so srs?

i'm telling ya, you guys can't talk without debate

>> No.3245983
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3245983

>>3245964
I think the anony-fascists from /pol/ are a bigger annoyance than /sci/s or even the /mu/s

Sage/hide/ignore.

>> No.3245991

>>3245983
You do know FDR was a fascist sympathizer? FDR regarded Mussolini as "that fine Italian man". That was of course before it was unfashionable to say something like that.

>> No.3246000

>>3245991
I know more about Roosevelt than you do apparently.
Read a book.

>> No.3246002

>>3245991
Not to mention the New Deal was a reflection of many of Mussolini's policies.

>> No.3246005

>>3245991
Because both Mussolini and Roosevelt had socialist tendencies, y'see

>> No.3246012

>>3246000
The books I read don't always confirm my biases. Maybe you should try to follow suit?

Mussolini comes up 17 times.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Deal_and_corporatism

>> No.3246018

>>3245978
"Ability to profit" is pretty darn vague. It required many skills which, if someone contains all of them, they can, in my eyes, be considered more worthy to society (generally, barring that they aren't terrible people) than those who don't hold those abilities.

I know it makes me sound like a horrible person, but I don't think society could function any other way. Imagine a society where a CEO made as much money as his worker. What would be the person with the abilities required to be CEO's motivation to actually put in the extra effort to be one if the monetary incentive wasn't there? We should take care of the poor and the disabled, but we can't eliminate hierarchy in general.

>> No.3246032

>>3246018
Prior to the 1970s the Gini was declining.

If you don't know what the Gini index is, you ought to exit this thread now.

Money is a shit motivator as any assessment of HR, Org Studies, IR or Labour History will provide.

Fucks sake, Taylor knows this—and if you don't know who Taylor is, get the fuck back to /pol/ or start reading.

>> No.3246035

Greed.

Await the revolution.

>> No.3246036

You imbeciles are quick to mention /pol/.

>> No.3246039

>>3245991
What's your point? Early Italian fascism had a lot of roots in some very radical left wing ideas, I consider myself an anarchist but I have a huge amount of respect for early Italian fascism and I consider the death of fascism as a political ideology a horrible thing.

Seriously, read some early fascist writings, they're far more left wing and progressive than most modern liberals are.

>> No.3246055

>>3246032
John B. Taylor? You seem to think that flaunting how knowledgable you are is a substitute for argument

>> No.3246069

>>3246055
Fred Winslow

>You seem to think that flaunting how knowledgable you are is a substitute for argument

/pol/ is for argument, this board is for literature son.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIw-earymbI

>> No.3246192

ITT: stupid fucking people.

The very definition of what a civilization entails is the division of labour, thereby implying hierarchy.

lr2benotstupid.

>> No.3246211

>>3246192
Not really, you can divide labour without a hierarchy, it isn't even hard.

>> No.3246870

>>3246018
> Imagine a society where a CEO made as much money as his worker. What would be the person with the abilities required to be CEO's motivation to actually put in the extra effort to be one if the monetary incentive wasn't there?
That's not how motivation works, see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6XAPnuFjJc

>> No.3246883
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3246883

>>3246211

>> No.3246891

>>3246211
incl specialisation? i doubt it

>> No.3246901
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3246901

>>3246870
here's what author Dan Pink said about his own book
"Carrots & Sticks are so last Century. Drive says for 21st century work, we need to upgrade to autonomy, mastery and purpose."

it's nothing more than wishful thinking on the part of Americlap "liberals"