/lit/ - Literature

For the communists.

Yes. Did you have a follow up question prepared or was that it?

>>2944487

Who are you going to vote for and why?

>voting

lol, why don't you go do some more useless things

It's compulsory where I'm from.

This isn't literature related :\

no, I would rather just complain regurgitate sophomoric nonsense I hear about how our government has failed us etc. etc.

nope

>>2944492
votin fer mitt cus fuck niggers

i don't vote because i don't know what i'm talking about with politics and i'm not willing to put in the time to learn enough to feel comfortable.

>>2944519
Essentially, every party does the same thing but words it differently.

Yes, I always vote.

Nei

no. american elections are effectively an illusion of choice. the masters that be have no interest in allowing citizens a voice in fundamental state concerns, one might say rightfully so. but regardless, as it stands, it's total bullshit for me to bother with such nonsense.

No.

>>2944535

This is all well and good until you realize that you're basically saying poor people aren't going to be allowed to have healthcare until you can have a socialist utopia. Which is fucked-up.

>>2944557
what? i don't care about that. *stupid tangential impotent ranting ahead* what i do care about is the hawkish foreign policy we've pursued of the last 50 or so years. they are completely unconscionable. i'm also vehemently against the wasteful misuse of resources central to western industrial societies. i would have these curbed profoundly.

>>2944566

You don't care about poor people having healthcare? I care about the things you care about too, you can care about both.

My state is already decades ahead of the rest of the nation.

I have no need for federal reform.

>>2944535
Sort of this. Despite everyone preaching democracy, liberty and free choice, the typical voter is presented with a fork in the road leading to much of the same. I'll probably still vote, but I'll feel bad knowing that it won't matter since it won't probably end up being for a Republican or Democrat.

If we had oil out of the stock exchange, then we'd have a ball game on our hands.

I usually don't vote, but I will this time. I'm increasingly alarmed at how the republican party has devolved from a center right coalition who favored business interests, states rights and rational individualism into a mass of bloviating xenophobic warmongering idiots who do not accept the fundamental tenets of science, who are beholden to fanatical religious mouth breathers, who are anti-intellectual and anti-cosmopolitan, who luxuriate in their moral turpitude even as they pay lip service to "family values," and who have replaced concrete, rational policy prescrptions with empty platitudes and outsized, mindless patriotic zeal.

I don't like Obama, but Mitt and Ryan scare me.

Yes, I'm from England and I vote for the Labour Party

>>2944570
i care about the poor being treated humanely and receiving livable wages, but i'm on the fence about socialized healthcare. i just don't know if that is something we should relegate to the state. it just seems really creepy to me in a brave new world sort of way. but honestly, i don't know enough about it to have a firm opinion.

>>2944566
Three things:

1. Proof that the voting system does not work. If you cannot provide any valid evidence to support support this, then I will consider your opinions. If not, you're on the same level as fundies to me.

2. You don't sound smart by throwing escoteric words around on 4chan. In fact, you sound like a shameless try-hard.
3.
>wasteful misuse of resources central to western industrial societies.
If you are talking about things like, oil, minerals, water, etc... than they are crucial to ALL societies. Not just the industrial. Not just the Western. All of them.

>>2944521
Yep, for instance, the Republicans are pro-life, which means they don't support a woman's legal right to have an abortion. Many don't even support this right in extreme circumstances such as rape. The Democrats, however, are pro-choice and do support this right. But despite these different titles of "pro-life" and "pro-choice" both parties agree on how and when abortions should be legal.

Wait...you're just an idiot.

Yes. democracy is pretteh good. its fair to say we would probably all be dead without it

>>2944507
>australia

>>2944588

So... you're against the foreign policy and treatment of the environment, but your idea of the poor is entirely abstract, and you have no education at all on what socialized medicine means? You see, it's at times like these I wish I wasn't a libertarian socialist, because so much of the anarcho-left is made up of really badly informed people who are capable of saying stuff like they want to see the poor 'treated humanely'. As though they were talking about livestock - except of course they probably think about livestock more often than about the nine-tenths of the population for whom privation isn't a fucking lifestyle choice.

>>2944588

So... you're against the foreign policy and treatment of the environment, but your idea of the poor is entirely abstract, and you have no education at all on what socialized medicine means? You see, it's at times like these I wish I wasn't a libertarian socialist, because so much of the anarcho-left is made up of really badly informed people who are capable of saying stuff like they want to see the poor 'treated humanely'. As though they were talking about livestock.

[REPOSTED TO REMOVE A RANT]

Suffice it to say, I think you should think about this more.

I find politics hilarious, at least here in the US. Its one giant popularity contest. I vote for the congress, that's it. I could care less about the prez.

>>2944595
>Proof that the voting system does not work.
the voting system *works* but largely in favor of those who effectively own the system, who have the most money, of course. all i'm stating is that the public's say in real governmental matters is an illusion. they do what they want regardless of our opinion, because they can. there's so much evidence for this, but i'll just link to a few examples.
in none of these did the american public have any significant decision:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_MKUltra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat

also, info about those in power:
http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html

>You don't sound smart by throwing escoteric words around on 4chan
i'm not trying to sound smart. i'm seriously only using the first words that come to mind. i thought here i wouldn't have to dumb myself down. so please don't always assume such nasty things about posters here.
>If you are talking about things like
i'm talking about the mass senseless consumerism that is at the heart of it all. it is just fucking idiotic. we live as though we're the last generation of humans that will ever be.

>>2944647
Asks for proof. You give Wikipedia... Oh god my sides!

>>2944634
>have no education at all on what socialized medicine means?
care to provide some links? i'll gladly read them. i apologize for my offensive ignorance, but it wasn't like i was pretending to know anything about it anyway.

>>2944648
None of those events is even disputable, there are people who are still living who have experienced them all, there are thousands of first hand accounts of it happening, the government has accepted responsibility for all of those events.

>really having such an aversion for Wikipedia that you deny reality

>>2944638

Yeah, but it isn't unless you're insulated enough to be part of the problem.

lolno

voting & recycling are two of the most egotistical activities imagineable.

>>2944480
Yes
>>2944492
Gary Johnson
Because I agree with him the most.

>>2944650

Here's a good outline of one system to begin with:
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hcs-sss/pubs/system-regime/2011-hcs-sss/index-eng.php

I'm too tired to go extensively link-hunting atm, but if you aren't, you can find it yourself.

>>2944709
thanks!

Who is the girl in the OP? She looks like my neighbor.

>>2944687
go back to school and learn what egotistical means while you're there.

>>2944754
kitty pride i think

No, probably because, even though I do keep up with politics, I have absolutely no opinion whatsoever as to which political philosophy I prefer. If I did vote it would be because I prefer one candidate over the other. I am pretty much indifferent towards anything that isn't totalitarianism, which I'm opposed to. And bonus points for anyone offering socialized medicine, cause I'm a type one diabetic and it kinda sucks I gotta pay for all of that shit. But I CAN live with it.

>>2944693

wouldn't it be greatly interesting to see Johnson win a substantial part of the vote? Even winning in one state would throw the nation such a curve ball. I'm voting for him too, and I hope everyone else reading this does too.

Yes,
Because there is a difference between having very little control over how the country is led, and having no control.
Not really interested in abdicating what little power I have just because I'm outnumbered and overwhelmed. Don't feel like making it easier on them.

I'm voting for Obama and it's retarded to do otherwise. Conservatards are ridiculously mobilized these days (tea party, etc.) and it's my fucking duty to vote on the side of their opposition when it's as close a race as it is this election.

I don't like Obama, but Obama is not Mitt Romney.

No point in my area, it would make no difference if every person who doesn't vote, voted against the party who holds it, they would still hold it.

Unfortunately I live in a elderly constituency (once had the highest pensioner and women ratio in the country), and they all vote the same.

There are also no candidates for minor parties standing frequently because they know there is no point so spend their time on marginal constituencies instead.

Weird thing is we have a radical constituency neighbouring us with the only Green MP in the country.

>>2944535
>no. american elections are effectively an illusion of choice.

Typical fucking amerifat forgetting about local elections. How are your roads, faggot?

>>2945182

You live near Brighton?

Brit here, I vote Green. I know they will never get in but I believe environmental issues are the most pressing thing for society over the next 50 years.

Yes.

Voting should be compulsory too, like in Australia.

In Portugal, I'll vote next year for the first time. I'll vote for the Communist Party!

I voted for this guy last year because he bought me a pint.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_Militant_Elvis_Party

I'm voting socialist (crypto-communist).

>>2945357
Republican: caricatures his opponents to have any hope of winning an argument.

>>2945366
When America was at it best was government bigger or smaller than it is now?

Voted conservative two years ago for damage limitation reasons. That didn't work out so well but I still believe they are a better choice than Labour.

Also voted for Boris in the mayoral elections because he is a badass.

>all this liberal told

yes, usually I vote. I voted in the last election, there were some referendums I wanted to vote on.

>>2945376
>Misunderstanding the term 'liberal'

>>2945376
oh lol he has that so wrong. welfare and social securi isn't about compassion. it's not charity. charity and comssion are all well and good but it's not the business of government. government stands for the common good. providing a basic subsistence, an insurance when shit hit the fan, your life hits the skids or when you can no longer look after yourself ensures a healthy working society where people can get back on their feet, where those that never lost any ground don't lose faith simply because their friends are relatives are suffering round about them.
the most successful societies are socialist societies state education, public libaries, public transort among many other things
a libertarian society is just a divided and broken society. celebrities might fair well there but at what cost?

>>2945410
Lurk more

>>2945375

>Also voted for Boris in the mayoral elections because he is a badass.

NO. Stop it. At this rate the 'Boris, lol' vote is going to make him Prime Minister, I'm not even fucking kidding.

Then again, I voted Lib Dem in the last general election, so I'm feeling pretty guilty myself over that one.

>>2945412
I'd rather Boris than Ken, which is why I voted for him. It wasn't just a "he's so funny!" vote. Ken is almost as disgusting a politician as Galloway. Almost.

Pic related

>>2945411
back to /b/ with you.

I helped vote in the Green party in Brighton, I continue to vote Green whenever I can.
The only arguments I've come across for not doing this are either "They don't talk about environmental issues on their website therefore they aren't environmental any more!" which is dumb - they're not a one-issue party, and "They have no experience in power!" which is so stupid I don't even want to address it.
I have very little faith in any of the parties however.

>>2945412

What was wrong with voting Lib Dem? They're better than Labour with its surveillance state and 5000 new laws.

Is Nader running?

>>2945445

Not really. True enough the last Labour government was a total clusterfuck of big government + laissez fairism (should be contradictory but somehow those cunts made it work), but this government doesn't strike me as any better with its deliberate ideologically-driven attacks on all working public services and its total lack of any and all coherent economic policy beyond meaningless tax breaks for the very rich as a token slap in the face to the rest of us.

Sure smells like statism here.

>>2945484

But that's hardly the fault of the Lib Dems - they're a minority partner in a coalition government; they don't have much of a say. They should've gone with Labour in the first place, but still.

They're kicking out Nick Clegg soon though. Hopefully that works for them.

What happened to the Tories' plan to cut back on government intervention in our lives? It was they who passed the law banning under-age cartoon porn, wasn't it?

>>2945493
I like shoehorning isms in wherever I can, I call it shoehornism.

>>2945503
You should be proud of that ironic post. You're a true asset to the 4chan community.

>>2945507
>You should be proud of that ironic post.

I am proud. I even allowed my self a smug grin when I posted it.

Because there are no Fascist parties in my country. The New Zealand National Front is no longer around anymore I don't believe.

>All these leftists and useful idiots ITT

>>2945519
Sauwelios said you sucked his dick.

>>2945519
>implying the next best thing to fascism isn't authoritarian socialism

yea
just for some 3rd party every year

>>2945519
new zealand is like 60% white now.

that's why the leftists(jews) want to turn shit into a "multi-cultural" hell hole, it automatically means a large underclass that votes for them, and destroys the bonds between whites so they think that you should vote for whatever promises you the largest financial gain.

>>2945527
>implying you're not just some edgy faggot who would perish if we didnt have a liberal democracy.
it's good to know that you're too crippled by your theories and personality to actually take action though.

>>2945527
I agree, Stalin was alright in many ways apart from his genocidal tendancies. He industrialized the economy and revitalized the soviet national spirit....

Then the whole thing fell apart when it started liberalizing.

>>2944585
>Labour
literally kill yourself

>>2945535
ya no. You don't need to fucking kill millions, forcibly collectivize the agriculture, confiscate mass amounts of wealth, to "industrialize".
if there had been no commie revolution at all, russia would have been far more industrialized in 40 then under the soviets.

The idea that you need a command economy to industrialize is pure fantasy and communist apologetic's.

the thing fell apart because they had been stagnating for decades.

>>2945430
green are just a bunch of luddite communists, why the hell would you vote for them?

jesus look at all the disgusting statists and leftists in this thread... /lit/ is probably the shittiest board on 4chan, we should get moot to delete it.

>>2945540
Actually No. The Revolution lead Russia a long way, 90% of Russia was Agricultural when the Revolution took place. In 40 years they were sending people into Space. They Industrialized the country as no one had seen before.

Also, The Soviet Union brought important Social Changes, which were imposed to other countries. Paid Vacations, Old Man's Retirement Fund (don't know the name in english), Woman's Rights (almost 80%, if i remember right, of the woman in Russia worked alongside man in the 30's) etc...

>>2945535
That's why I'd rather vote for some crypto-stalinist socialist party than for some sort of populist "national liberalism" type of thing. To me a strong state and solidarity are more important than the make up of the population.

If you want cultural integration, Stalin knew perfectly fine how to do this. You just strip them of their shitty religion and force them to play their part or else.

>>2945545
>being an anarcho-capitalist
>seeing neo-feudalism as utopia

>>2945540

>if there had been no commie revolution at all, russia would have been far more industrialized in 40 then under the soviets.

[citation needed]

Seriously, nobody takes that shit seriously any more. The Tsarist regime was as reactionary as a regime gets - plus even under that system the Russian government was starving its own people in order to export grain for cash. The only question is whether industrialisation was worth the terrifying cost in human misery, to which the answer is 'maybe'. Like sure, without Soviet industrial power the Allies could never have won WWII, but then again, if not for panic about Communists then would the Nazis even have come to power?

Swings and roundabouts, but it's fair to say that the sort of deliberate, methodical and methodological inhumanity of Stalin can't ever be justified morally, whatever the pragmatic arguments.

>>2945549
the "revolution" crippled russia and destroyed vast amounts of wealth.
industrial production dropped immensely and didn't recover until the early/late 30's.
agricultural production never recovered.

The built factories at the expense of everything else.
The rocketry was almost entirely east germany, just looted from nazi germany.
most of their technologies were looted from america via jewish spies.

>>2945559
you are literally delusional if you think that "worker solidarity" trumps race and genetics.

>>2945560
>he doesn't understand anarcho-capitalism

>b-but we shouldn't get rid of cancer because of the threat of getting different cancers in the future!

>>2945540
The system was working fine through Lenin and Stalin, after that though they started to liberalize. Big mistake.

It was no mistake the Union fell after Gorbachev's massive liberalization. And it is no mistake Crack and plummeting birthrates currently plague the Russian Federation today.

I vote but I try to stay aware from politics. It's a headache to get into and far more fun to just generalize from afar.

>>2945566
> Authoritarian paranoid mass-murderers are always preferable to the man trying to give Russians some degree of personal and economic freedom

How can you sit at your computer, and actually believe the things you type?

>>2945562
the tsar was reactionary only in regards to political change.
He was welcoming and encouraged industrialization and economic growth.

further he fucking abdicated way before the revolution anyways.

>>2945569
leftists rarely think things out.

>>2945565
Just because I believe the absence of hierarchy in society can't last doesn't mean that I don't understand anarcho-capitalism, it means that anarcho-capitalism doesn't understand humanity.

>>2945567
>generalize from afar

Congratulations, you just summed up 4chan discussion in three words. Having no idea what's going on, just throwing insults at each other.

>>2945566
>Working fine under Lenin
>Almost ten million deaths from War Communism
>People resorting to cannibalism
>Economy plummeted to massive lows
>Working fine

Why are commies so dumb? There's a reason that Russia is the only European country that is still 3rd world.

>>2945575
careful, don't ruin their carefully contrived fantasy that everything was doing great until stalin ruined it.

>>2945574
I try.

>>2945573
Anarcho-capitalism doesn't attempt to understand humanity. Anarcho-capitalism is the default state of humanity. Think about your daily interactions, particularly in your personal life. Do you employ middlemen with guns to achieve your goals? If you answered no to that question, then congratulations and welcome to voluntarism.

>>2945575
>>Working fine under Lenin

Christopher Hitchens:

"He continued to regard both Vladimir Lenin and Leon Trotsky as great men, and the October Revolution as a necessary event in the modernization of Russia. In 2005, Hitchens praised Lenin's creation of "secular Russia" and his discrediting of the Russian Orthodox Church, describing it as "an absolute warren of backwardness and evil and superstition".

>>2945535
>self-proclaimed fascists not knowing that Fascism is vehemently anti-communism

>>2945587
>Hitchens was a great militant atheist, therefore his word on every subject is law!

You do realize he supported the Iraq war, right? And was a neo-conservative.

>>2945575
>measuring a country's success by deaths among the population

>>2945587
is this supposed to be some sort of reputable source?

>>2945590
Uh, I'd have to say, the death of 50 million of your own people says something about your leadership.

>>2945590
>measuring a country's success by it's rapid industrialization and ignoring everything it fails at.

Commies are deluded.

>>2945585
Actually I do. I collect welfare which is made up out of people's taxes, and when they don't pay them men with guns will do something about it. I'm quite the rogue.

>>2945590
>Heavy industry fallen to output levels of 20%
>70% of locomotives were in need of repair
>Coal production decreased from 27.5 million tons (1913) to 7 million tons (1920)
>Overall factory production declined from 10,000 million roubles to 1,000 million roubles.
>Grain harvest decreased from 75 million tons (1913) to 45 million tons (1920)

>Saved only by return to a free market system with the NEP

Yeah, go Lenin you hero

>>2945602
I bet you're so proud of yourself. Acting edgy on the internet, especially 4chan, makes you are a unique and special snowflake.

>>2945591
It's mostly so because of the internationalism. Other than that, corporatism doesn't differ all that much from state socialist economics. They're not the same of course, but state socialism and fascism are more akin to each other than say, fascism and capitalism or liberalism.

>>2945611
No, merely amused. I am proud of the fact that I use the system to my advantage instead of whining about it though.

>>2945610

>>2945610
Did you miss the part where the Soviets had to fight a bloody civil war against the Whites and the various imperialists helping them?

>>2945623
did you miss the part about how they fucking started it?

>>2945612
Corporatism is more a perversion of Capitalism than it is socialism.

>>2945610
Taking over the largest country in the world with a little group of people will cause some temporary chaos, yes.

>>2945623
Did you miss the part where more people died from War Communism than deaths by the Whites or the Greens and almost as much as in the First World War?

>>2945616
It takes strong moral fiber to be a man of integrity such as yourself. Oh well, we'll both end up the same way in any case. I can only hope what you do brings you happiness.

>>2945632
>Temporary chaos
Nope
>Little group of people
Nope. The Politburo was small but the Bolshevik/Communist Party was massive

>>2945628
>>2945633
>>2945610
>>2945597
>>2945563
>>2945575
/argument

>>2945587

Are we supposed to be impressed because Hitchens, noted academic parasite and smug, charmless prick, liked Lenin?

>>2945685
Are you one of the new breed of butthurt militant agnostics that rage against atheists?

>>2945711
>militant
why

why is it always that word

>>2945711
Not who you were replying too, but Hitchens was a misogynistic neo-conservative cunt.

You can place the blame on imaginary militant agnostics all you want, it won't change reality. He isn't worthy of all the praise heaped on him by hero-worshipping r/atheism faggots.

Labour party member reporting. So, yes.

>>2945720
Why is your party so terrible?
Why did you join it in the first place?
Why is an insufferable faggot like Ed Miliband in charge?
Do you ever contemplate suicide?

>>2945723
don't' forget, why do they hate the country they live in and want to see it destroyed?

>>2945718
Hitches identified himself as a marxist.

>>2945726
Sorry, I didn't want to overload the poor leftie with too many questions.

>>2945727
Even worse.

>Responding "no"
You're part of the problem.

(I'd sage, but this is still at the top)

>>2945729
>From a thread yesterday

"Hitchens became a socialist "largely as the outcome of a study of history, taking sides ... in the battles over industrialism and war and empire." In 2001, he said that he could no longer say "I am a socialist." Socialists, he claimed, had ceased to offer a positive alternative to the capitalist system. Capitalism had become the more revolutionary economic system, and he welcomed globalisation as "innovative and internationalist", but added, "I don't think that the contradictions, as we used to say, of the system, are by any means all resolved." He stated that he had a renewed interest in the freedom of the individual from the state, but that he still considered libertarianism "ahistorical" both on the world stage and in the work of creating a stable and functional society, adding that libertarians are "more worried about the over-mighty state than the unaccountable corporation" whereas "the present state of affairs ... combines the worst of bureaucracy with the worst of the insurance companies."

Hitchens has commented on his political philosophy by stating, "I am no longer a socialist, but I still am a Marxist". He stated that "I still think like a Marxist in many ways. I think the materialist conception of history is valid. I consider myself a very conservative Marxist". Hitchens frames the recession in terms of Marx's economic analysis and notes how much Marx admired the capitalist system of which he was calling for the end, but says that Marx ultimately failed to grasp how revolutionary capitalist innovation was."

>>2945727
Specifically "Trotskyist" wasn't it?
>>2945729
Read something on the subject please. Not a hit piece either.

>>2945575
You don't know absolutely anything about the history of the Soviet Union, do you?

>>2945635
Thank you. I actually am a man of strong moral fiber, it's just that I have different morals. I'm an opportunist by principle.

Yes, I'll vote for the communist party and then switch to the lib dems when I have to vote between the two biggest parties, like always.

>>2945744
On marxism? I've read enough of Marx's work to dismiss anyone who follows the ideology. (To an extent.)

>>2945740
> Responding "yes"

You're part of the problem.

>>2945762
> I've read enough of Marx's work
By which you mean five pages of the Communist Manifesto and some quotes on the Mises Institute.

Don't kid yourself, all communism haters follow a very basic formula. Uneducated, loudmouthed, and anglo. You haven't "read enough" of anything to dismiss it, and you never will.

>>2945764
Nice ad hominem, couple that with your generalization and barely-hidden animosity to opinions different to your own, and you become everything that's wrong with /lit/.

>>2945763
Fascist.

>>2945770
I can do that too!

Statist.

>>2945769
Our suggestion you read up on it still stands. Just go away if you prefer ignorance.

>>2945764
Don't kid yourself, all communism lovers follow a very basic formula. White, middleclass, uninformed and naive.

>>2945711

No, I'm as atheist as Hitchens ever was, I just think he was an insufferable tosspot with nothing to add to any field of knowledge or endeavour. Like all the other neocons he made a career entirely out of the sleaziest sort of schmoozing, coattail-riding and shameless backstabbing. Any thought or creativity on his part whatsoever is incidental and too minimal to mention.

>>2945769
>Nice ad hominem
What a generic start.

I'd love to ask you a few basics of communism at this point, by which I mean things like: what it actually is. Given that you're probably one of the "b-but 100 million died" crowd, you'd learn more about communism in the wikisearch I'd force you to than you have learned in 18 years of american public school system.

But whatever, I couldn't care less. I like to keep right-wingers dumb and uninformed, and all I have to do is let you people follow your natural path.

>>2945781
He wasn't even a neocon, dumbass.

YAII

>>2945772
No no, you mean "democrat"
If you stand against the vote, you're some kind of tyrant supporter. Even if you think a stateless and completely unhinged society is best, you're only setting it up for a fall into barbaric tyrants.

>>2945778
>uninformed
oh the irony.

>>2945787
>people actually believe this

>>2945787
Not that guy, but what if I reject voting because both political parties in my country are a very slightly different versions of each other, and voting for either one really won't make a difference to anything?

>>2945781
>with nothing to add to any field of knowledge or endeavour.
But but but you guys call him a "NEW ATHEIST"
You're a tosspot.

>>2945785
>implying I'm american

If you didn't have such a superiority complex, and respond to everything I say in such a vitriolic and abrasive manner, then you might actually enlighten more people to your beautiful version of communism that somehow actually works.

>this is what communists actually believe

So delusional.

>>2945787
If you stand for the vote, you support the immoral initiation of force by a select amount of individuals with a monopoly on lawful violence.

>>2945785
>b-but Stalin and Mao weren't true communists!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

>>2945787
Uh, voting and democracy is tyranny too.
If you were opposed to tyranny then you would likely support some sort of constitutional monarchy.

>>2945792
There are other ways besides the vote to make ourselves heard, but ignoring this right only weakens it. As a protest against a failing system, withholding your vote only plays into their hands.

gtg. Enjoy your /pol/ thread guys

>>2945799
>tells me I'm using "no true scotsmen" argument
>article he links me to has a "misattributing the fallacy" section with the example of communism

Oh god my sides

>>2945800
> tyranny then you would likely support some sort of constitutional monarchy.

0/10
Fuck outta here

>>2945801
>that image

I think he may have gotten that slightly mixed up.

>>2945796
HAHA wow.

>>2945803
What are you talking about?

>>2945797
>No replies to this

Ah well, gg until next time statists.

>>2945801
lincoln complaining about corporations when he started a fucking civil war that killed 1 million americans.

what a joker.

>>2945796
>communism
>women rights
>welfare for veterans
>healthy food

Another point for american system.

Whoever made this is an idiot, but don't presume you're any wiser than him.

>>2945807
nice touch.

hide information, keep capitalists stupid. worked for over a century.

>>2945813
Communists accusing capitalists of censorship, now I've seen everything.

>>2945815
>explain why the communist model doesn't actually support propaganda
>"but China and the USSR did it"
>explain why China and the USSR weren't communists
>"this is a no true scotsmen argument!"
>repeat

The joys of arguing with liberals. Stay blissfully ignorant faggot.

>>2945723
It's the best there is. Take from that what you will.
There needs to be a governing party and Labour have provided the best such ones since 1945.
I would prefer Dave to Ed.
No.

>>2945820
>every communist ever employs propaganda and burns books
>W-WELL IF THEY WERE A TRUE COMMUNIST THEY WOULDN'T HAVE DONE IT

>>2945822
>doing exactly as the greentext predicted
dropped

Yes. Though I may not fill out the form.

We are calling it "voting white" around here. If there's no party to vote for, you vote white.

The problem with communism is that some small-minded, selfish, greedy people want unequal wealth and resources at the expense of everyone else. They take more than their share by coercion or subterfuge, subjugating the poor and leaving them starving, against the principles of communism itself.
These people are called capitalists.

>>2945830
Brazil?

I vote for an entirely democratic ticket, EXCEPT for my friend's dad who ran for sheriff or county commissioner or something. He's one of few Republicans who can defend his beliefs so I respect him enough to vote for him.

>>2945821
>and Labour have provided the best such ones since 1945.
you mean how they literally bring the country to the brink of collapse and the tories have to save things time and time again?

>>2945832
>the problem with communism is human nature aka capitalism

ftfy

Yes.. good goyim, communism is great! hehehehehehe

>>2945838
We can fix that for you.

>>2945828

>Point out an excellent argument against your own point
>Be mad when they agree with that very same point

Stay crazy communists.

>>2945837
>literally voting for a negro

are you just dumb or ignorant?

what is it about the democrats that appeal to you? War mongering? Deficit spending? Promoting mass immigration and a flood of non-whites with their resulting crime to white neighborhoods? Anti-business pro-union agenda?

>anti-communists getting told again and again
>resorting to cheap name-calling and strawman image-dropping
It's almost like /pol/ when it's not summer.

>>2945853
>anti-communists getting told again and again
you gotta stop talking those drugs, you are getting to be delusional.

>>2945853
>every communist country ever was a dictatorship that killed its own people, used propaganda and censored information they didn't like
>W-Why can't you stupid capitalists see how great communism is? Enjoy your shitty capitalist countries and their extremely high living standards!

>>2945846
>>2945846
I know man we're like totally for stoping this white genocide and the PC dictatorship because I went outside today and some cop told me to convert to islam and asked me my sex and gender it's getting crazy and all, but not this time ok?

>>2945794

What 'you guys'? I don't call him that and I don't know anyone who does, stop assuming things. I find Hitchens personally repellent and totally unoriginal, and I dislike the way that he insinuated himself into a position as HST's 'protégé' and then displayed total ingratitude and lack of respect to him as soon as he thought he could get away with it.

All of you are just trolling each other now.

>>2945863
I fucking hate whoever made this thread. Fuck you all.

>>2945864
Sometimes I fantasise about being a mod and banning half the user-base.

something something hegemony patriarchy oppression


*posted from my iphone at starbucks*

>>2945867
sometimes I fantasize about ejaculating inside your mother lol

#owned #bawssashell

>>2945861
2 hours of muslim prayers to kick off the DNC m8
open your fucking eyes

"capitalism is death, down with innovation and freedom"

~posted from my ipad

>>2945881
>>2945870
Stop.

>>2945877
What the fuck is an DNC?

>>2945884
Democratic National Convention. But I wouldn't expect a negro supporter to know that.

>>2945836
>Tories

>'Saving things'

Funeral is on Wednesday, all are welcome to attend.

>not voting for obama to offset romney votes as much as possible.

it's a close race, niggaz. let's not pat ourselves on the back with our green party votes and realize that it's better to keep a dem in office than the fucking christian right.

The last thing America needs is a corporatist Mormon, so I'll be voting for Obama, who at least isn't a Mormon.

>>2946383
>The last thing America needs is a corporatist Mormon

I laughed this is true, the very notion of it is absurd and the fact that it may be a reality is even more terrifyingly hilarious

>>2946387
I really don't think he stands a chance at all. We like to pretend he does, because democracy, people's choice, blah, blah. But honestly, this election is a wash.

>>2946343
>it's better to keep a dem in office than the fucking christian

I sure don't.

No. I'm an American and a nineteen year old white male whose (white) father's annual income is in excess of $250,000. Politics don't have much of an impact on my life, therefore I am unable to consider politics with the gravity that a less privileged person does. Therefore, it is not fair for me to vote.

>>2946472
Also, I'm just a teenager what do I know about anything?

Yes, in spite of the immense complexity of domestic and international politics, my general ignorance of even popular news, and my ambivalent moral position, I do vote.

>>2946467
>democracy is bad

EDGYASFUCK.png

Brit here

its a sad day to see a half negro to be elected democratically,even if almost was 4years ago it hasn't gotten any better by time, the founding fathers must be rolling in their graves.The last lot of presidents are non the better or worse, but a half black just goes against all principles of the united states history and founding.

>>2946545
What difference does it make? He's just the face, it's not like anything actually changes. If you locked someone in a room during the election, let them out a year later and asked them to guess, just by the state of society, which political party won. They wouldn't have a fucking clue.

>>2946551
the united states was a country founded and to benefit white europeans, to see such total ignorance for that fact at present is saddening, as is the current racial demographic changes that is changing the face of america possibly forever is happening on a extraordinary fast pace . The future looks bleak.

>>2946595

>the united states was a country founded and to benefit white europeans

until we kicked you the fuck off the continent. fuck off you racist relic from a has-been nation. worry about your own politics and royal family (lol)

>>2945797
>>2945808
reminds me of this quote from starship troopers:

>Jean Rasczak: All right, let's sum up. This year in history, we talked about the failure of democracy. How the social scientists of the 21st Century brought our world to the brink of chaos. We talked about the veterans, how they took control and imposed the stability that has lasted for generations since. We talked about the rights and privileges between those who served in the armed forces and those who haven't, therefore called citizens and civilians.
[to a student]
>Jean Rasczak: You. Why are only citizens allowed to vote?
>Student: It's a reward. Something the federation gives you for doing federal service.
>Jean Rasczak: No. Something given has no basis in value. When you vote, you are exercising political authority, you're using force. And force my friends is violence. The supreme authority from which all other authorities are derived.

of course the movie was more of a spoof and the book took its fascist themes more sincerely, but i think there's something to this that should be considered, whether you're an anarchist or a fascist. i know we have plenty of both here on /lit/

>>2946497
Go back to /b/ you memespouting uninformed neanderthal.

>>2946472
>Politics don't have much of an impact on my life

So your dad didn't enjoy those Bush tax cuts?

>>2946671
Durr, it's
>Something given has no value!
Nothing about basis in that.
Did you even watch the film?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_urWSSZgwU

>>2946702
He undoubtedly did. Does Romney intend to keep those around? I don't even know.

>>2946770
What happened to that cool old guy? I can't remember his name, but everyone was making a big fuss about him.

>>2946776
Ron Paul, that's it. What happened to him? I thought he was really popular.

>>2946623
you should be aware you dribbling retard leftist that those men that founded your country were racially englishmen as were most who fought against the british empire in the revolution, but clearly history is not your strong point, if it were you wouldn't reply with such a comment anyway.

he Number of purely white People in the World is proportionably very small. All Africa is black or tawny. Asia chiefly tawny. America (exclusive of the new Comers) wholly so. And in Europe, the Spaniards, Italians, French, Russians and Swedes, are generally of what we call a swarthy Complexion; as are the Germans also, the Saxons only excepted, who with the English, make the principal Body of White People on the Face of the Earth. I could wish their Numbers were increased.-Benjamin franklin

>>2946784

>racially englishmen

lol, what the fuck do you even think that means?

>>2944595
lrn2firstpastthepost

>>2946781
My understanding is he went back to Valhalla to slumber and feed.

>>2944648
0/10

>>2946784
I don't quite understand your post, sir. All I was saying is the impression I got from the interwebs was that Ron Paul was set to be the next president. Or so it seemed a few months ago. Your rant has kinda confused me.

>>2945373
>boy things sure were better in the good old days!
>back when anyone who wasn't a heterosexual white christian man was oppressed or treated as second-class

>>2946822
>CHECK YOUR PRIVILEGE CIS BIGOT SCUM

>>2946822
meh. My social standing would have been higher by default then.

>>2946826
I was mostly referring to being black, jewish, gay, disabled, mexican, asian, a woman, etc.
but go ahead and shitpost ironically while non-ironically posting logical fallacies

>>2946790
>racially englishmen
>englishmen
>lol, what the fuck do you even think that means?

you moron.

>>2946833
you're describing a perfect place for a white man to live

Why should niggers be allowed into white countries? They do nothing but destroy. Just look at Detroit, Harlem, and South Central Los Angeles

>>2946837

For real? You think 'English' is a race, and I'm a moron for not recognising that? Us Britfags are like the most mongrelised people on the planet. Our history is basically just a litany of men who came here and had sex with all the women who were here at the time.

>>2946851

>Detroit
destroyed by the collapse of the industrial sector it relied on

>Harlem
thriving cultural centre

>South Central Los Angeles
Yeah okay, niggers gonna nigger. There's plenty of social reasons for it which have nothing much to do with race, but whatever.

Anyway, dunno why I'm arguing with stormfags now, sageing for a shitty thread full of trolls and rage.

>>2946857
>Britfags are like the most mongrelised people

ah its nothing new to see a blithering leftist subscribing to the common liberal thesis of what being english is racially. The most common descent of English is either of Germanic descent or of Iberian, hardly "mongrelised", we (the english) can all in this day of age join in praising our fathers on both sides.

>>2946851
>Why should niggers be allowed into white countries.

>tfw I'm a white South African.

>>2946864
>Detroit
That place has been totally obliterated by niggers all the crime, white flight and collapse of a civilised city is almost solely down to these sub humans

>>2946857
I love it when Americans get all national pride, then say "I'm Italian" when watching the Sopranos, or "I have a bit of a temper, but that's because I'm irish"

>>2946886
whites were in south South Africa before blacks and practically built the country into a civilization,it was not till the boers went north did they encounter the migrating black tribes, the bantu i think. South Africa can be classed as a historically white country, as of now things are different since the fall of apartheid and has consequently gone to shit

>>2946886
Why was Paul Kruger so unpopular?
BECAUSE HE WAS A TOTAL BOER

Also he claimed to only have read one book: the Bible; he'd fit right in at /lit/

every pol thread always ends with nigger discussions

>>2946878

It must be nice to subscribe to an ideology where you don't have to present any proofs whatsoever for your ideas since they only concern concepts like 'race' which exist entirely in your head. Real convenient.

>>2946921
Are you denying that race exists and there is no difference between the races, how can one be so scientificity ignorant . I can answer that only a leftist egalitarian could.

You claim that the English are mongrelized, they are not. Mestizos are mongrelized, Jews are mongrelized, American Negros are mongrelized,Mixed race people are mongrelized. The English are not mongrelized.

>>2946919
always

>>2944480

Every election.

>>2946956
Ok there Norman, calm down.

>>2946679
imperfection of a political system isnt grounds for replacing it

>>2947011
i take it you're lost for words.

>>2947019
why not?

because

>>2947130
because no system is perfect.