/lit/ - Literature

>>2467145
When it comes to this, you should go to /sci - /lit is a bunch of deep&edgy dicks who thinks they love to be alone.

Anyways, what do you mean with "surrounded"?
If you're comfortable with being alone, you don't think about it, you have your concentration elsewhere. In public, you most likely put a larger emphasis on your appearance.

>>2467169
> In public, you most likely put a larger emphasis on your appearance.

This.
Is A
Is all but a mere illusion ,OP

talk for the sake of talking, dont expect much out of conversations. its all just small talk :)

>I feel more lonely when I'm surrounded with people than when I'm alone
>feels like my world is imploding
Wut.

>>2467211
Energy Economics 101

> Don't invest useful energy to gibberish talk
> Self devaluation to the long term
> Search for real opportunities to debate
> Margaritas per porcos.

Prefer the company of clever and virtuous solitude, to the nonsense, and self-destructive vice of blank minded speaking.
Spare your words for real opportunities.

>>2467226

enjoy not having friends.

>>2467228
>Enjoy having intellectual friends, who discuss ideas and grand concepts.

Fixed that for you (not even that guy).

>>2467231

oh, and what grand concepts would those be?

>>2467228

> Enjoy not having friends.

I'd rather not qualify this acquaintances whom you know nothing about but merely creating links of relationships braided in the mutual flattering of ego.

Friendship is a serious matter. It's a life long investment of energy, time and intelligence. It's a dual creation of a fortress to be inhabited by two persons. It is pure and beautiful, to be cherished from the ashes of the fire to the rebirth of the phenix.

I sincerely doubt one could speak of someone as a friend, if there was not a deathwish between them.

>>2467145

Sartre /10.

when you are alone, the world is your world. it is a play thing for your subjectivity.

when your world becomes invaded by others, layers are subjectivity are added. you realize the world isn't your world anymore. you become aware of the limits of your subjectivity.

as your focus reigns inwards, you feel the world collapsing and constricting around you.


know the feel bro

>>2467234

thats only idealized friendship, real world works differently

>>2467232
We often discuss the amount of stupidity it is possible to show through a single post on 4chan. It seems we were wrong.

>>2467239
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sy4pp-rSU80

>>2467145

Consider the possibility that what makes you feel alone is not because of other people, but rather because said people are not united with you in such a way that they readily share your beliefs.

If you were to be surrounded by people whose feelings you shared, you would immediately feel less lonely.

Perhaps in coming here you feel less lonely, which is perfectly consistent with the suggestion I am now making.

>>2467234
Sure is normative in here.

>>2467237

Opposing an ideal concept of a relationship to realistic matters is a foolish antagonism.
An uncountable commitment is absolute in it's essence, a journey to the end of the mind.
Reality knows no such things as relative boundaries. The only value of a friendship is the absolute relativity to one another.
In a sense, you are the own creator of your principles, you are the own to estimate yourself. Letting someone in the treasured caves of your soul, is an important bet you place upon your own abilities to suffice the intellectual and emotional needs of another, as well as for him to nurture and provide from his own.
from vice or virtue, we search only fidelity.

>>2467255

well, compromise those values.

>>2467263
Care to explain, or expand your reasoning ?

>>2467272

whatever concept of friendship you hold, you still need human interaction for a healthy mind, so just talk to people, and you'll fel better, because you did a social thing.

>>2467272
>reasoning
It wasn't an argument. Neither was >>2467255.

>>2467279

I agree with the need of social interaction, though as the main concern of my participation was to explain my own need of intelligent and qualitative nature of this social exchange. I have not once exposed a refutable idea upon the quantitative needs of friendly relationships. I think to each his own estimation of one's need. Human after all.

there's nothing to be said; literature is totally pointless, heck everything is, so just go with the flow, man

Why do people need friends anyway? It's all just everyone talks about their problems and meaningless mundane bullshit and no one listens and cares about anyone but themselves.

>Love reading books (solitary activity)
>Study in a program that requires you to argue amazingly
>Want to get grades for scholorship
>Spend all your time alone, reading, and arguing in papers
>Have no friends because you talk about things that nobody knows about and argue about everything
>Can't talk to fellow literature incline people because they have all read different things than you.

Well....fuck.

ITT: losers

>>2467313
Oh the irony...

>>2467311
Wrong.

>>2467312
>Have no friends because you talk about things that nobody knows about and argue about everything
I know this feel very good ;_;

>>2467379
>do the same
>everyone loves me

You're just dislikable people, stop blaming other people for "not getting you".

>>2467384
>everyone loves me
Bet those guys are hating on you pretty hard right now

>>2467379

i'm guessing that you exaggerate your intonations and you gesticulate passionately. don't do this, it gives your interlocutors the impression that you care. learn to present your opinions in a monotone accompanied by a neutral facial expression and people will think 'wow this guy is the embodiment of truth' instead of 'wow this guy is a douche trying to justify his insecurity' (because in reality people don't focus on the content, they are just reflecting on their judgements of you as a character while you talk)

>>2467379
Get friends that enjoy discussions. It doesn't matter whether you like the same music, films, or any other detail - as long as you share the same basic elements; the love for discussions, exploration, challenge, and you can accept some friction.

>>2467395
Obviously an exaggeration, most people then. My point still stands that the problem they think they have doesn't have to be, they make it so.

>>2467418

how quaint you are, quaint guy

>>2467311
>Why do people need friends anyway? It's all just everyone talks about their problems and meaningless mundane bullshit and no one listens and cares about anyone but themselves.

Exactly. Knowing how true friends are hard to find, why would I spend my time on people like this? I could read some book instead of wasting my time with them.

>>2467236
>>2467249
Thanks, this actually makes some sense.

>>2467494

You're welcome.

>>2467226
WAAAT
this is extremely ridiculous
there aren't enough people to have intelligent conversations with, everyday.
simple as that

>implying you use energy for smalltalk, etc and don't charge from people's emotions

You should read some Bukowski.

"I've never been lonely. I've been in a room -- I've felt suicidal. I've been depressed. I've felt awful -- awful beyond all -- but I never felt that one other person could enter that room and cure what was bothering me...or that any number of people could enter that room. In other words, loneliness is something I've never been bothered with because I've always had this terrible itch for solitude. It's being at a party, or at a stadium full of people cheering for something, that I might feel loneliness. I'll quote Ibsen, "The strongest men are the most alone." I've never thought, "Well, some beautiful blonde will come in here and give me a fuck-job, rub my balls, and I'll feel good." No, that won't help. You know the typical crowd, "Wow, it's Friday night, what are you going to do? Just sit there?" Well, yeah. Because there's nothing out there. It's stupidity. Stupid people mingling with stupid people. Let them stupidify themselves. I've never been bothered with the need to rush out into the night. I hid in bars, because I didn't want to hide in factories. That's all.
Sorry for all the millions, but I've never been lonely. I like myself. I'm the best form of entertainment I have. Let's drink more wine!"

>>2467702

Is this guy actually liked by /lit/? It is only vaguely different from your everyday 4chan-post.

>>2467909
No, I hate Bukowski. He was a pathetic ugly man with a severe case of sour grapes.

That said, solitude is a-ok, but not because other people are stupid. It's simply that solitude is the most productive time.

>>2467921

I'm inclined to say that that is only true if you have unproductive friends.

>>2467927
Very true. Almost all of my friends are drunk, drugging losers who sit around and whine about women and refuse to try hard at school or get a meaningful career. They're sort of like you guys.

>>2467921
You might hate bukowski, but I hate you

>>2467943

I don't believe I'm anything like that.

>>2467943

Further to this problem of yours: unless all those things are also true of you, you should not be having that problem.

>>2467313
This.

>>2468029
Yea, you guys are a bunch of fucken losers!

The only reason I come on /lit/ is to influence burgeoning intellectuals and to spread the prophetic words of Bukowski.

Bump!

I went to college, talked to people, talked to my friends, had sex with my girlfriend and I still felt lonely. I'm back home and I feel less lonely now.

>>2469395
>had sex with my girlfriend
problem right there, true intimacy can only occur between two men.

>>2469426
i like this guy.

bump

>>2468049
>the prophetic words of Bukowski.

Rejoice for that is not all you are spreading.

Stop being so guarded.

You cling to concepts and mental arrangements instead of being emotionally open.

THIS is your problem.
This IS your problem.
This is YOUR problem.

>>2470080
I can't argue with this.

>>2470080
>being sure of your beliefs is a crime
Why don't you go fuck a whore now?

THAT'S BECAUSE YOU'RE A LOSER, OP.

Probably because you're depressed.

>>2467145
Sounds like you aren't killing enough animals, OP.
Go find a cat and feed it into the nearest machine.
Maybe you'll feel better then :-).

you'll grow up and get over yourself. and once that happens the magic begins, op.

>>2470119
does self hate stop in mid twenties? or is it more you get less self absorbed therefore you don't trip yourself up as much as you used to which results in being able to actually make a true best friend who then reaffirms you like mommy and daddy should have done and then you're happy?

>>2470095
Defensive...

I didn't say it was a crime, I said it was a problem.

Being extremely intellectually cagey about relationships is detrimental to forming good relationships.

Is that not obvious?

>>2470131
Could you at least give an example of what you're babbling about?

>>2470133
I don't know bro...

It just pretenses, assumptions, labeling and judging in general are damaging to making true friendships.

Whats wrong with being open and seeing the good in people?

>>2470142
Could you at least give an example of what you're babbling about?

>>2470143
Too pragmatic? I've lost track of my point.

I suspect you might catch the drift though.

>>2467255
>spout zen-like koans
yeah that's the solution.

if y'all weren't a bunch of solipsistic fucks, you'd all be oodles happier. So get your heads out of Prufrock and stick your reproductive organs into other peoples' reproductive organs.

>>2470156
You know, you're probably more right than you think. I'm willing to bet that most of the brooding in this thread has its origins in sexual frustration. Neitzsche certainly would've been less of a sourpuss if he'd gotten more tail.

>>2470156
I'm guessing from your cynicism that you're strictly heterosexual and have never experienced honest free love. But I have an example to help you empathise with the people you claim to be giving advice to. Well imagine someone feels really lonely and yearns for physical intimacy. A lot of people say they should true to make friends at school or clubs, find someone to get close to there. Whereas you'd be the guy advising them to pay for a prostitute because it's simpler.

Another thing to add is that I've known people that had have sex before but have still pretty much the same mindset as people you tell to "get laid lol". I don't mind you giving your own personal accounts but try not to make people feel bad about not doing such and such, it only reinforces the hivemind to do these sorts of things that won't necessarily make someone any happier.

>>2470173
Not advocating cynicism. Merely noting that you guys complicate the simple pleasures of life, construct mental barriers—in essence, "prisons without walls"—all because you are so in love with your own conception of self (and your intellectualism). You have to discard parts of your self, and eschew this kind of blinding self-absorption, before you are ready to find happiness in others.

>>2470174
Worked for me.

>>2470178

The point is only that most of the melancholy in this thread is self-inflicted. I wouldn't be surprised if most of you had a latent masochist thing. I bet most of you relish the very image of your suffering and wouldn't part gladly with it.

>>2470186
Again, give an example of such a mental barrier. I think you are making assumptions or perhaps simplifying things if you think everyone here is inherently self defeatist instead of merely unlucky or understandably scared, have limited means, etc.

>>2470200
You say that as if self hate is voluntary. When it has a physical manifestation you'd be less likely to assign them personal responsibility and guilt for their problems I'd bet.

Again I think you're going off personal experience too heavily and I also assume you haven't had much experience with others' neuroses. I wouldn't mind other than the fact I feel assigning guilt and personal responsibility where it isn't due is the opposite of helpful for a lot of these cases.

>>2470219

I sincerely believe I'm not being idealistic: those "physical manifestations" can be transcended. You have to want it. People here still want to wallow in sel-pity.

>>2470234
It's pretty easy to make your advice seem helpful when you've not given any examples of cases that can be transcended. How do you know for sure it applies to the people here?

>>2470248
Personal experience. No, I have no particular reason to believe that my anecdotal evidence will universalize. All I'm saying is that it can be done. Maybe I made my case too strongly.

>>2470257
Yeah but my point was a lot of people might agree with your advice and use it to guilt themselves further. You know those times when we have to tell people "it's not your fault"?

>>2470270
It might not be their "fault", but they'd better take responsibility for their lives if they want things to improve.

I was at the Starbucks with my two friends today.
We talked about a lot of stuff, and I was pretending that I'm smiling and laughing, but didn't actually feel that way. I only felt loneliness.
I don't know what to do anymore, maybe I should see a psychiatrist.

I asked my philosophy teacher about this and he told me that I should read more stuff form Nietzsche and Sartre.

>>2467311
My friends have widened my limited perspective greatly.

They expose me to ideas, differing frameworks for processing information, and provide opportunities that I would not have otherwise had. For instance, crashing at a friend's place out of town, or having my views challenged by someone who put just as much thought into theirs.

>>2470095
The problem isn't beliefs. The problem is when you start getting wrapped up in ideas that don't apply very well to your situation.

For instance, my friend's girlfriend texted him a good morning, one hi during the day, and one goodnight, and he got on her case for being "clingy", saying that three texts in a row are unacceptable. That's the kind of shit we do to ourselves because we've grown up seeing and using patterns to get ahead intellectually while having a stunted emotional growth.

socialization is something you have to approach on your own terms, but just try to have fun with it. Say things you like to say. Do things with people that you like to do.

>>2471580
Good, start with Nausea then proceed to read The Wall.