/lit/ - Literature

The Recognitions by William Gaddis

the limericks and coprophilia are the among the most notable aspects of pynchon's oeuvre thoughbeit

also DeLillo but that is its own can of worms

>>23861734
are still among*

Tim Robbins? Still life with woodpecker guy.. or nah

>>23861734
I read The Recognitions a while ago but I still think about it every day, thx for reminding me that I should read JR next

and well, even if looney tunes and shit eating are characteristic of his work, Pynchon is stunning in the sections without them. The Herero chapter in V. and the Isla/Franz Pokler sections in GR are fucking amazing (also some of Tchitcherine's bits and The Secret Integration). I can't say the same about Slothrop throwing pies at planes though

>>23861690
So, pynchon but worse?

>>23861734
I came here to post this. It's amazing to me how much love Gaddis does not get.

>>23861743
DeLillo wishes he was like Pynchon. He won't be read or even remembered in 20 years.

>>23861906
Libra will always have a steady fanbase

>>23861903
Going through pages of dialogue without really knowing who is saying what can test the patience of even some post-mo readers.

>>23861818
>I can't say the same about Slothrop throwing pies at planes though
I can.

>>23861690
i'm glad my looney tunes concept has taken hold.

>>23861690
I was thinking about Celine's North when reading GR.

>>23861690
What makes it good? I'm very serious when saying that I've never been more frustrated by a novel. Am I meant to be dazzled by the references? There are thousands of them and I know them, but what is the point? I can't tell if Pynchon is merely showing off, in that case this is a failure, or is making a point about something which I find either banal or purposeless, in that case he needs to make that point in a better way.

>>23863132
it's not some sort of failure if you simply don't like something. stop buying into this board's tendency towards servitude to the canon. you have your own mind and tastes, and you should exercise them, if it's FOMO (for lack of a better term), well, you may be out of luck, but my condolences, as I know the feeling.
In summation, one man's trash? Another man's treasure.

>>23863132
If you're visiting a theme park, do you scoff at the mechanical engineering involved and say 'who are they trying to impress', or do you enjoy the roller coasters?

He's giving you a chance to explore a sprawling psychedelic World War 2 Europe laced with secret tunnels connecting film sets and bunkers and ruined cities and decadent lairs, all fuelled by the collective fantasies of a population who can't tell where their minds end and the industrial fantasy-production machines begin.

Personally that sounds pretty fun. It feels like I'm in touch with history, not History Channel history but history as I dimly feel it beneath the surface of scraps of 1940s culture, the off-screen presence beheld by the sad moviestar faces starting out at the Atlantic. It's the future being produced in the churning bowels of the past. There's no 'point', but there's plenty to think about.

I recommend some Guy Maddin movies if you want to get into the right mindset - maybe Archangel for the war propaganda, or Careful for the Teutonic libido. Maddin is obsessed with a slightly earlier era, but I think the sensibility is kin to Pynchon's.

>>23863208
I should add that this guy's post is correct >>23863158

I just wanted an excuse to ramble about GR.

>>23863132
Never have you ever read the Stephenson's Cryptonomicon or any of his othe YA novellas and been thinking 'yeah, but this stuff is for children'.
I guess I'm shallow but GR is like the adult version. Like a honest to god good adult version of YA and I like it that way.

>>23863132
Anon it's not a puzzle to solve or a classical painting to feel inspired by. It's a funny joke. If you don't get it then you don't get it, it doesn't make you smile, ok, it not a competition,.

>>23863243
to be fair, several books are indeed puzzles, and there are some relatively hidden delights in GR

>>23863208
>If you're visiting a theme park, do you scoff at the mechanical engineering involved and say 'who are they trying to impress', or do you enjoy the roller coasters?
Who goes to a theme park alone? Maybe some people, but I wouldn't enjoy it. Since reading is a solitary activity, I can't imagine enjoying being merely entertained by the spectacle of the jokes and references, and I do get them and do think they are funny, but that is not what I read for. Whereas at a theme park with friends, it's okay to be merely entertained, since there's a secondary aspect. Cervantes is a good counterexample. I think Cervantes is funny, and I'm entertained, but I'm not merely entertained, since Cervantes has a point, there is a definite Thing to know about in Don Quixote. I don't sense this in GR, I don't end up knowing anything new with it, aesthetically or intellectually. Does that make any sense? I'll check those movies out, I suppose.

>>23861690
>Anything like Thomas Pynchon but without the Looney Tunes and shit-eating?
Brother karamazov

>>23863290
Sounds like you're just reading to impress yourself

>>23863132
The reread

Play Metal Gear Solid

>>23863132
For me, it's the way Pynchon reveals an international conspiracy that's pulling the strings by having a looney tunes esque adventure with an idiot savant protagonist, and the way he weaves fantastic real life events into the story. There's also passages that stay with you, Pokler's story, or Byron the Bulb, or Blicero's speech, or the dodo story, or Tyrone researching about his history and the rocket or Pokler fantasizing about working for a scientist dictator and having power by being a bureaucrat.

>>23864764
No.

>>23861690
Looney Tunes shit eating is the essence of americana. That's the point.

>>23865379
Then why is it all euros in the shit eating scene?

>>23865384
CIA programming

>>23861690
>Anything like a hamburger but without the bun and patty?

>>23865400
Oh right I forgot about that

>>23864982
>by Hideo Kojima, or as he's known around my crib, God.

>>23863132
I really think the references and nonsense and inane complexity and 100s of characters are meant to appease his more psued readers and hide the sublime beauty's underneath. Because you know theres so many other books that do these things and are reddit garbage but pynchon is innately not that. Not that these references are necessarily bad but theyre certainly not the point of the book. Mason and dixon has significantly less cartoon bullshit (though there is some) and its mystery and beauty is more overt. GR has that same mystery but its more overarching and subtle

>>23863290
You do not sound like a fun person. If you're autistic, my apologies. But I can't imagine someone I'd want to go to a theme park with less than you.

>>23861906
he's better at writing than pynchon

>>23866810
Pynchon writed well

>>23863290
>there is a definite Thing to know about in Don Quixote.
If there's a one paragraph summary of "the message" possible for a work then it's a trivial work.

>>23866810
I find him easier to get into but not as rewarding

>>23861690

>>23865441
>demurely
Pynchon was on that demure train before it was cool