/lit/ - Literature

>>23432455
This is a troll post but Mario Vargas Llosa and Gabriel Garcia Marquez alone are better than any of American writer of the last 50 years.

>>23432459
are you mexican or merely mistaken for one?

>>23432463
blonde hair green eyed gringo with slav blood (I speak spanish tho)

>>23432473
>east european who speaks thirdie
curious thing you are

>>23432463
Mexicans dont give a fuck about those niggers.

>>23432478
all spanish speakers are mexicans to white people
>hurr spain
makes em mad when you call em mexicans
a good tactic given the nord vs med dichotomy of this website
group 'em in

>>23432455
when he talked about the difference between germanic and latin words
>'ghost' is a fine saxon word, whereas 'spirit' is a light latin word
really reminded me of robert graves talking about 'femininity' vs 'womanliness'
https://youtu.be/q45-AE5ZK1k?si=xdvQZDaAh7Gy9aKC&t=561

>>23432477
this is /lit/ doesnt everyone here aspire to speak a few romance languages?

>>23432504
nobody should speak it as a native tongue, it's like being born with fetal alcohol syndrome

>>23432507
who said I speak it as a native tongue, i said i'm a gringo

>>23432512
i dont speak thirdie mate i dont know what that word means

>>23432459
Hinting that those writers are anywhere near Cormac McCarthy is like comparing Percy Jackson to Homer.

They're far bellow O'Conner, Pynchon, Nabokov, and DeLillo.

Honestly, they're bellow the great genre writers also, Wolfe, Ligotti, Kay, ect...

>>23432520
https://youtu.be/U8Kum8OUTuk?si=qmi3HRgz745plBDL&t=111

>>23432580
>Dellilo Ligotti Kay
I like how you tried to sneak in those trash writers that are inferior.to cunts like vargas llosa and garcia marquez like anyone wouldnt notice.

>>23432581
says here poor brown people think gringo means white
you said you have some slavic heritage though?

>Sudaca discovers synonyms and etymologies
>Sudaca shits on his own culture the moment he's noticed by angloids
>Sudaca never writes anything of worth in the language he supposedly prefers
Nice joke, Georgie. You got me. As Bolaño said, this is a boutade on his part.

>>23432520
>i dont speak thirdie mate
you just did

wait a second
is this a fucking argie?

>>23432455
>explicitly told people that his native language was absolute shit
This didn't happen at all.

>>23432610
yes

>>23432601
are you implying polish people aren't white or? What's going on here?

>>23432580
I like some of those writers but both Gabo and MVLL are better then everyone you listed
>in my humble opinion

LMFAO HE'S ARGENTINIAN

HJOLY SHIT

/sp/ AND /int/ WILL NEVER HEAR THE FUCKING END OF THIS NOW

BASED NIGEL FOR THE SUGGESTION

>>23432623
just a meme lad haha
you can take some flagbanter right?

>>23432633
course m8
I'm canadian so i dont care about any of the banter just so long as americans don't forget that they're inferior

>>23432626
wdym? This gets posted on /int/

>>23432599
That's just how incredibly mid llosa and marquez are.
Ligotti is clearly better then both. If you think otherwise then you just illiterate. Sorry but thats just a fact. One can debate if marquez is better then the other two but that's the level he's on.

>>23432640
>canadian
>slavic blood
...?

>>23432644
some nigel posted this guy with a meme about english looming over ESLs
sports, language, etc are merely tools, mediums, techniques, etc to invoke seethe from people you dislike
so i think i'll ruminate over how to mix it with that working class dogshit that is povertyball

>>23432650
yea its called immigration brah

>>23432702
>non-anglo canadians
hmmmmmmmmm

>>23432705
Alberta to Manitoba is all Ukrainian
There are a bunch of Poles, Italians and Portuguese in Ontario
Quebec is French and Irish

The WASP dominance of Canada is overstated.

>>23432481
The line between racism and lack of knowledge about geography is vague, but I think you just defined it

>>23432742
banter's not racism lad

>>23432455
It says a lot Bolano is like the only literary figure thus far that understood Borges as a petty, lonely attention whore contrarian above anything else (kind of like OP and anyone who uses this as a talking point, nature's fractality is incredible).

>>23432459
>Gabriel Garcia Marquez
Not defending the Americans, but what author from the last 50 years can beat him?

>>23432755
>latam anime nonce
every time
post flag

>>23432459
>proclaims literal whos as though they're great literary masters
Why are spics like this?

>>23433225
>I don't know them, therefore, they're literal whos in literature
typical retard

>>23433243
If they're not a household name they're literal whos

>>23433272
They're household names.

>>23432502
he did say "ghost" is a fine saxon word, he said it's a dark saxon word in contrast to the light latin "spirit"

>>23432455
Cervantes was less than five hundred years ago your fucking retard.
And regardless, what do you mean by "relevant? There are levels of relevance.
Regarding Borges as a writer. I think the works he is better known and praised for can get at times a little fastidious. But that's mostly personal taste. My favourite story of his is one which he considered to be quite bad. So take my opinions with a grain of salt.
>>23432463
>Mexicans
>Reading
Even if they do they probably read Mexican authors like Juan Rulfo, Azuela.
I'm a carpentierfag myself.
>>23432755
I will indulge you, why do you think Bolaño was right about Borges?

>>23432455
The funny part about Borges, It's when globoludos use his opinion against peronismo but they seethe too much when he said Soccer is for people with zero braincells. If he was alive probably hates Messi, Maradona and all those footballers that argies love

>>23433280
Only in spic land. To normal people they're not.

>>23433464
Normal people don't even read. They're names known to readers worldwide.

>>23433464
they both won nobel prizes.

Borges is simply a relevant current writer, but he's not the best.

Cervantes has the same status as shakespeare on the western canon.

Wouldn't say that english is better than spanish, because both are well respected languages with a major genius in the western canon.

Trying to argue that cervantes is better than Shakespeare, is just a mental masturbation excersice for mitwits.

But pretty sure this is a troll thread.

>>23433471
So? Most people don't read nobel prize results.

>>23433489
100 years of soilitude is among the most relevant novels of the XX century.

>SINGULAR relevant spanish speaking author of the last 500 years
lol nice bait

>>23433494
Relevant to whom? It doesn't describe the zeitgeist like Of Mice And Men or The Great Gatsby did. It doesn't shift popular culture like The Lord of the Rings or 1984 did. It doesn't make its way into common idioms like The Trial did for Kafka Trap. It's completely irrelevant to anyone who doesn't already have the niche interest of 20th century literature.

>>23433522
It defines on the global stage the picture of north south american peoples.

>>23433528
Describing some irrelevant region of the world is hardly relevant for literature as a whole.

>>23433482
learn to use commas before throwing the word "midwit" around

so this guy can only be one of the groups? how long have you been arguing this?

>>23432646
I disagree but hey we are all entitled to our own opinions

>>23433545
Harry potter and Shades of gray are more "relevant" than Shakespeare if we're gonna measure current popularity polls.

>>23433548
It's a talking pause anon.

People don't speak in long sentences.

>>23433555
Its not about popularity. Shakespeare has had a far greater effect on culture as a whole than those two have.

>>23433562
You're not speaking.

>>23433564
100 years of solitude has had influence, but it will require a bit more of time before it gets on the canon.

It was already recognized by the likes of Bloom as the defining hispanic novel of the golden generation of latinoamerica.

Already voted as the second major novel in the spanish language by the royal academias.

>>23433571
No, but you don't read in long sentences, having a comma that allows a small rest, is closer to how a person speaks IRL.
It's more natural to add pauses between sentences than really longer than breath sentences.

>>23433577
Cute headcanon but that's not how commas work

>>23433579
No, but It's how you add pauses that follow the speech.

retard.

>>23433583
complete nonsense

>>23433585
Do you realize humans add pauses when they speak and never speak like a rapper in full complete word salad autismo?

>>23433586
Do you realize you already said that and I already replied to it?
Are you so fucking dumb you don't comprehend what you read?

>>23433522
>Of Mice And Men or The Great Gatsby
100 years shits on both those mediocrities. A book Borges praised as one of the greatest books ever btw. Your chauvinistic ignorance and dismissal doesn't take away from its greatness, nor does it make Garcia Marquez any less of a household name of world literature.

>>23433577
>defining hispanic novel of the golden generation of latinoamerica
Ok fine but that makes it relevant to only that part of the world. The Knight In The Panther's Skin is the defining literary work for Georgia, that doesn't make it relevant in general.

>>23433589
I can't reply directly to every point in a literal sense.

>>23433594
It's relevant to latinoamerica.

Which is a major civilization on the planet.

>>23433590
I'm not talking about quality you ignorant spic. I'm saying Marquez is not a household name nor relevant for broader literature, which he isn't. No amount of coping will change that. Spanish stuff is niche, not mainstream.

>>23433599
>Which is a major civilization on the planet

>>23433594
>Ok fine but that makes it relevant to only that part of the world.
Same goes for gatsby and of mice and men, yet you name them as exemplary 'zeitgeist' stuff.
>The Knight In The Panther's Skin is the defining literary work for Georgia, that doesn't make it relevant in general.
"The Knight In The Panther's Skin" doesn't have the same readership nor translations, nor importance as 100Y. Disingenuous comment from an obvious anti-Hispanic hater.

>>23433599
>I can't reply directly to every point in a literal sense.
....what?
Dude are you ok?

>>23433601
Garcia Marquez is a household name, you retarded nigger. And he will be even bigger in the upcoming years, so keep crying over a much superior writer than you. It's essentially canonical at this point.

>>23433604
Yes?

There's 10 civilizations.
Latinoamerica is one of them.

>>23433609
I'm schizo.

>>23433471
nobels only matter for science you fucking retard

>>23433605
The hispanic world is not important, so why would its literature have importance? I swear you fags are as bad as indians with how delusional you are about your own region's importance. You're a peripheral region just like the middle east or southeast asia.

>>23433625
Conmebol is the only relevant futbol federation that competes with UEFA.

And world cup is very relevant to normies.

>>23433498
lets just its my blood

>>23433625
>The hispanic world is not important, so why would its literature have importance?
Non-sequitur.

>>23433625
>The hispanic world is not important
a neutron bomb of truth was just dropped

>>23433615
>I'm schizo.
No, you're painfully low IQ

>>23433623
Say that to Alfred Nobel, the founder of the prize, retarded nigger.

>>23433628
>povertyball

>>23433640
World ball. Played everywhere from the richest to the poorest countries. Meanwhile goymericans call themselves "world champions" after St Louis defeated Knoxville.

>thirdies think europeans still care about povertyball
yes, yes, correct
keep watching and DO NOT ATTEMPT to watch our firstiesports

>>23433640
yes, povertyball is more relevant to normies than literature.

>>23433653
europeans love soccer and love the champions league.

>>23433653
nice cope, fag.

>>23433648
Soccer is for poofters and wogs in Australia

>>23433661
Any country that calls it soccer should be nuked in an ideal world. Australia? Mogged by everyone in literature. Irrelevant prisonhole.

>>23433665
You're talking about sports, Australia is the best sporting nation on earth.

are you seriously telling me fucking latam mexicans are on this fucking board?

haven't they
learned their
fucking place
yet?

>>23433680
based bruce

>>23433701
It's our website now. Cope & seethe.

>>23433701
I'm colombian.

>>23433680
In fucking cricket maybe, not sports actual people care about.

>>23433716
>>23433712
>>23433701
anyone who speaks spanish or Portuguese is mexican

>>23433719
Football
Cricket
Swimming
Athletics
Sailing
We even somehow get gold medals in the fucking winter olympics we're just that much better than everyone else.

>>23433734
bradbury doesnt count and you know it kek

>>23433734
But can you suck a cock better than Americans? Doubt it. Those guys are pros.

>>23433754
https://www.topendsports.com/world/countries/australia/events/olympics/medals-winter-winners.htm

>>23433716
Hey bro, I’m going to Bogotá for a few days at the beginning of next month
Anything in particular you’d recommend I see? I’ve been to almost every Central and Latin American country, not Colombia yet though

>the Spanish language is too cumbersome
chinga tu puta madre

>>23433766
I'm not from bogota.

I think they have like a theater festival or some shit.

My advice would be to do eco-tourism, since the thing that first worlders are impressed more about colombia is the nature.

I don't think Colombia has anything on the "civilized" sense that would impress an european or american, so it would be better I think if you enjoy the colonial towns on the touristic areas.

I think first worlders want to see more something like the encanto movie, more than a first world shitty rippoff.

>>23433769
>the Spanish language is too cumbersome
When someone sounds like a retard like Borges did, probably. There's an interview where he admits he was raped and sodomized by his uncle like it's something very normal. He was an annoying weirdo.

>>23433773
>giving travel advice to the gringos who shat on Gabo
You have no shame.

>>23433766
>visiting countries where men fuck donkeys as a national pastime

>>23433773
Appreciate the tips man, yeah I’m for sure going to take a day trip somewhere, go on a hike while I can

>>23433781
I like Marquez, he’s not my favorite of the Boom but his work was instrumental for forming my current tastes

>>23433794
What are you gonna do about it

>>23433794
Angloid women prefer to fuck dogs over Angloid """"men"""".

>>23433794
those are costeños.

not all the country are costeños.

>>23433763
did you seriously link a random fucking website instead of wikpedia you fucking petrol sniffing bogan (abbo they'd say in australia but that's racist in the civilized world) cunt?

This board got so bad that I'd vocally demand for the execution of every one of you, if I did not know how miserable you are.

>>23433855
bogan and abbo aren't the same thing you septic poof

>>23432473
Do you work in computer graphics?

>>23433982
i'm danish, half-saxon
both mean retard in your dialect
wanted to make you offended is all

Can someone rec me a spanish book and why they like it, without sounding you are regurgitating academia

>>23434004
>i'm danish, half-saxon
kek the only people in the world who describe themselves in such a manner are Americans
he was right about calling you a septic

>>23433795
I like carpentier. I have read no other Latin American Boom authors. My inherited library doesn't have him.

>>23433286
ah. he did say 'a fine dark saxon word' to be fair

>>23432455
>Anglo seethe thread #302582022GAYBLM2992
Tiresome

OP ... in literature, a degree of brashness and daring when it comes to holding and defending position and proposition is quite desirable. But within reason OP. And positions and propositions, brashly ventured or not, ought not arise from illiteracy and personal limitation in such an obvious fashion, otherwise the grand illusion topples and we see a typical monoglotgloid EstadosuniDENSE.

>>23432580
pseud

>>23434007
I read a generic un libro de la historia mexicana and thought it was interesting, educative, and funny. That’s why I read it and would promote it to certain people.

>>23432580
Monolingual pseud detected lmao

>>23432646
>using 'mid' unironically
>atrocious grammar
Back to tiktok with you, zoom-zoom

>>23432455
>SINGULAR relevant spanish speaking author of the last 500 years in english countries*
Fixed that for you

>>23433464
>Americans
>normal
Lmao sure, mutt

>>23433613
Stop arguing with him. He's either an entitled newfag, or a troll. Either way you are feeding him.

>>23433464
Why the fuck should normalfags matter here? Are you really so retarded that you think that popularity overtakes quality, you mongoloid faggot

>>23433625
>actually, what I meant to say all along is that that region is not important at all so I won

>>23433680
>Australia is the best sporting nation on earth.
Nigger, what? People unironically talk more about congo soccer players than whatever the hell those roo-fuckers are up to

>>23433794
>living in a place where white women would rather fuck nig-nogs than their own race

>>23432455
>Singular
There are dozens of relevant Spanish speaking writers in the last century, you illiterate mutt.

>>23432455
"Singular" means extraordinary rather than only which is the meaning you were going for you dumb fucking ESL midwit

>>23432646
You can't even speak basic English, let alone Spanish. Log off forever, brainlet.

>monolinguals will never experience Domingo Faustino Sarmiento

>>23432455
Reminder Borges regretted saying that.

“Habla de una traducción norteamericana de sus cuentos, publicada por
New Directions[1094]: “Por la ley del menor esfuerzo, el traductor siempre
traduce la palabra española por la palabra inglesa más parecida. Si yo digo
habitación, traduce habitation y no room. Resulta un estilo rarísimo y un
idioma que apenas es inglés. Yo dije en alguna ocasión que una ventaja del
inglés es la de ser un idioma mitad anglosajón, mitad latino. Ahora me
castigan por esa frase. Parecería que más que ventaja, es un peligro, una
calamidad.”
(From the Bioy Casares 'Borges' diaries)

>>23436863
To faggots here who can't talk spanish:
By the law of the lesser effort. The traductor will always traduce the spanish word to the more similar english word. If I said habitacion, it traduces habitation instead of room. It results in this highly strange language, that is barely english. I said in one ocassion that there is an advantage to english, is that it is an language anglo-saxon, and half latin. Now they punish me for for that phrase. It would seem that that more of an advantage, it is a danger, a calamity. And sorry for my engrish traduction, I am feeling kinda bad today :/

>>23436949
Your translation is strangely good because it is so bad that it illustrates his point perfectly.
Anyway, in literature too those faults can be felt. It's the reason why Ezra Pound rejected Milton so strongly.
The problem with English being a mutt language is that it destroys its purity of sound. Borges praises Spanish's purity of sound in another passage of the Bioy book:

"BORGES: «El español tiene mayor pureza de sonidos que otras lenguas.
Está libre de la ü del francés, del exceso de consonantes del inglés. Es un
idioma excelente: yo observo tan sólo que no produjo tantos escritores
buenos como el francés o el inglés."

Translation:

"Spanish has a greater purity of sound than other languages. It is free from the French ü, as well as from the English excess of consonants. It is an excellent language: I merely observe that it didn't produce as many good writers as French or English."

Keep in mind Borges's aesthetic was that of simple realism that started dominating the world after Flaubert and Maupassant in the 19th century, so it is perfectly natural he would prefer realist French and English writers, who represent the apex of that style. He also preferred Tolstoy to Dostoevsky.
Spanish genius is mostly Baroque, has always been, and Borges struggled a lot with baroque throughout his whole career, he considered it a kind of literary danger, I believe. There is also a strong autobiographical component, in that Borges in his youth belonged to a highly Baroque movement, ultraísmo, and a lot of his later literature is actually a reaction against that.

>>23436949
>traductor
>traduction
lmao

>>23436992
Funny how that works

>>23436949
>el traductor siempre tradcuce la palabra español por la palabra inglesa más parecida
>proceeds to leave "traductor" as "traductor"
Risum'st.

>>23436992
Milton is leagues better than Pound, so his opinion really matters little.

>>23439554
No, Milton does indeed write an overly latinate English. I admire Milton, and agree with your judgement of his relative merits compared to Pound, yet it has often been said, rightly so in my opinion, that Milton, while being a great poet, can be a terrible influence on other poets.
Anyway, it's easy to see how an abundance of synonyms may lead many writers astray. I think Borges was right to moderate his views.

>>23440393
That's a great point you made about Milton being overly Latinate; that's probably the reason he never moved me the way Shakespeare did, who seems to be more Germanic and barbarous and passionate in his language--or who seems to combine the Germanic and Latinate sides of English more fluidly et perfectius.

>>23432455
Cesar Vallejo is the greatest Latin American poet, and in the running for top tier 20th century poets in general. Borges' poetry is more commendable than his prose-- he was principally a journalist, like Orwell.

>>23436949
>By the law of the lesser effort. The traductor will always traduce the spanish word to the more similar english word. If I said habitacion, it traduces habitation instead of room. It results in this highly strange language, that is barely english.

Borges is terrible in translation, at least in prose due to this very effect. You might enjoy CHROMOS, Felipe Alfau, which opens on just this.

>>23433766
You're coping. Make shit pay. Go places for a little adventure to make a hecking experience to distract from your miserable life. You work. You drink. You travel. You talk about it. You repeat. You cope.

English his ugly. It's only used worldwide because it's convenient for mercantile activities only, thanks to it's simplistic grammar.
This means nothing of meaning will ever be said in english and no englishman will ever say something meaningful.

>>23440567
seethe on juan

>>23433727
Shouldn’t Australia be blue in this image?

>>23440683
He's right. There are many languages considered beautiful by people who don't speak them (Italian, which is close to Spanish, being a typical example of such), but Germanic languages are usually not among them.

>>23433363
>why do you think Bolaño was right about Borges?
NTA but I learned more about Borges from The Savage Detectives than I ever did through angloid material.

>>23432455
>SINGULAR relevant spanish speaking author of the last 500 years
Amerifat education