/lit/ - Literature

Bran's story is the hardest to predict. His appearance in the last book was short yet we see him see many things through multiple visions, what could they all mean? what's next for him? did he really eat Jojen (I personally don't think so) George has confirmed that the "hold the door" part from in the show is real, but would obviously be done differently, does that mean he tries to come back to Winterfell? How will he be king? will he have some humanity?

>>23433463
What are you looking forward to most?

>Battle of Fire
>Battle of Ice
>Battle of Steel
>Battle of Blood

Battle of Blood for me. I wanna see krakens.

>>23432486
>Blackfyre v Lannister
>Blackfyre v Baratheon
pretty based ngl, might try that one for real

>>23433463
Wtf? I can’t believe that hack has his own general here, I’m so disappointed on this board

>>23433463
buy an ad nigger faggot

>>23433463
First for George is fucking fat

>>23433563
He will warg into Hodor and rape Meera and it'll be so hot.

>>23433463
• 2010: "The First Chapters Are Done!"
• 2012: "I really look forward to publishing it in 2014."
• 2015: "I'm determined to finish it by 2016. I cancelled two convention appearances, anything I can do to clear my decks and get this done."
• 2016: "I am not going to set another deadline for myself to trip over. The deadlines just stress me out."
• 2017: "I think it will be out this year."
• 2017: "I am still working on it, I am still months away."
• 2018: "Work on Winds of Winter continues, and remains my top priority. It is ridiculous to think otherwise."
• 2019: "If I don't have The Winds of Winter in hand by the end of the year, you have here my formal written permission to imprison me in a small cabin on an island."
• 2020: "There is a lot of work to be done on the upcoming spinoff show, but I won't be writing any scripts for the series before finishing The Winds of Winter."
• 2021: "I will make no predictions on when I will finish. Every time I do, assholes on the internet take that as a “promise,” and then wait eagerly to crucify me when I miss the deadline."
• 2022: "I hope to wrap up the story line for one of the viewpoint characters of W.O.W. this week. Maybe even two."

Reminder that George is a fat lazy liar.

Kekaroooooooo

>Look for pics of book Rhaena because she's apparently very hot
>That ugly nigger from the show pops up

I'm tired fellas

Sooner or later I hope we get a glimpse of THIS

Has anyone else realised there's a correlation between the increase in popularity of incest porn and the decrease in productivity of this disgusting fat fuck?

>>23433770
fire > steel > blood > ice
blood has the potential to be cool but if euron's shit turns out to be a nothingburger it'll be the worst of the 4 by a mile. right now i have ice ranked as last but it's not a crazy low last, just that we know stannis is gonna win and he'll live, plus i'm not sure how much of the actual battle will be shown with the captive greyjoy siblings as the POVs. but if euron was just bluffing, or it's underwhelming, like the kraken is just a regular squid but big, it'll be boring and all for nothing. maybe he can warg into it or something, i don't know.
fire is basically the culmination of all of the essos plotline so far, i'm excited to see how it ends, who survives, and where it'll go from there. steel is of interest just to see how faegon acts in his first real fight and how the golden company squares up against the never-before-stormed storm's end.

>>23433770
Ice>Steel>Blood>Fire
Ice will be cathartic.
Steel will be fun to see more of Aegon/Connington winning. Storyline could go anywhere really as well.
Blood will be interesting to see the extent of Euron's powers
Only thing I am excited about with Fire is to see Barristan get killed like the chump he is

>>23434139
i want a full world map

>>23434139
I don't think we're getting to any Lovecraft references. They're there to fill the far east with mystery.

What's her endgame?

>>23434251
here you go bro

Man I love when Aegon I is called 'The Dragon' it's so badass, no adjectives needed.

>>23434139
I could live without it, but if we don't go to Asshai for at least one chapter I'll be pissed, been hyping it up since the first book

>>23434574
He doesn't seem keen on exploring it more.

Make the Bran chapters end, I cant take them anymore

>>23435253
Filtered

>>23433563
Bran III ADWD is my favorite chapter in the series.

I got a feeling Sam's going to be the big BIG death in The Winds of Winter. He could kill Euron when he invades Old Town completing his arc of not being a total coward I think if he does find the cure for Greyscale and treat Joncon then Jon could potentially find some documents Sam has on him from the citadel that causes him to murder Sam out of denial that proves Aegon is a fake.

I told my friend I'd buy him the $600 League of Legends skin if The Winds of Winter actually comes out this year

I hope I didn't just fuck up.

>>23435835

I'd say December or Januray 2025 at the latest. I think he's wrapped up Winds after the blue flower post just going through editing stages now.

>>23435826
Euron will be defeated by Hightower wizardry when Leyton and his daughter turn the Hightower itself into a death ray

But yeah I think most of your assessments on Sam could be right, though I dunno if George is gonna kill his self-insert.

>>23435835
I'm always an optimist but you're probably fine. If TWOW comes out this year I'll eat my hat.

>>23434574
Its clear he wanted Dany to go there with the whole "pass by the shadow" thing and Quaithe but things have clearly changed, so between Marwyn and Moqorro she 100% isn't getting anywhere near Asshai.
>>23435826
Jon is not getting cured, him going (at least partially) insane and turning on Aegon is his fate.

>>23435835
Yes you fucked up

>>23435835
Lol no. What is even making you hesitate?

>>23435897
George is showing his face at worldcon this year after that memorable blog post back in 2019.

>>23435849
If he had finished it, he would have announced it.

>>23435849
>>>23433975

>>23435835
that skin is only available for a limited time anyway

post asoiaf memes

You are viserys with all the knowledge of book 1, what do you do to get the iron throne? Starting from 1 year before book 1.

I dont understand how people think it will be finished. He is probably surprised himself he has lived this long

>>23436108
PLAP PLAP PLAP PLAP

>>23436108
I'd probably be knocking up Dany to make me an heir from the moment she was ready. I've only one sister, I can make one alliance with her. If I keep trying I could many daughters and heirs to continue the line. I'd hope Illyrio was into long term investments.

>>23436108
I don't think there's a right answer to this question because Viserys failed due to Targshit madness and no foreknowledge will prevent him from losing it and getting himself killed.

>>23436151
Would selling her off in exchange for unsullied not be better?

>>23436108
Literally nothing would change aside from Dany getting her dragons earlier and being pregnant while at it.

>>23436132
>>23436151
>>23436164
But she was 12 at the time...

>>23436161
You know that she can get 3 dragons right?

>>23436176
I forgot about the dragons

>>23436179
Thats just a classic viserys

>>23435849
>the blue flower post
schizo

>>23436170
*13 and she had bled already but truth be told a heir would be second or third in his list, his funeral pyre would come first

>>23436067
That peach, what did renly mean by it? also in that scene he says "You'll be pleased to know she came to me a maid" of margery, which is a bizarre thing to say unprompted. idk feeling vexed rn

>>23436190
He was flaunting his sexuality, obviously

>>23436161
one valyrian slut would be worthless to the proud Ghiscari. Drogo "bought" her with nothing essentially, he may have never even intended to give viserys an army, and Illyrio probably expected as much too.

>>23436197
why would stannis be pleased renly's wife was a maid? surely that would be the expectation, it's never alleged Selyse was not a maid either. Stannis claps back with "in your bed she's like to die that way", which is a slam dunk, but the setup from renly is just a weird thing to say

>>23436190
>"You'll be pleased to know she came to me a maid"
lol
>"In your bed she's like to die that way."
lmao
>"Oh, I expect I'll get a son on her within the year. Pray, how many sons do you have, Stannis? Oh, yes—none." Renly smiled innocently. "As to your daughter, I understand. If my wife looked like yours, I'd send my fool to service her as well."
rofl

What was the best cover art? the ones with the rendered niknaks on the cover were always offputting to me ( the ACoK cover art should have shown a peach obviously), and these bland landscapes are not much better.
Anything depicting a character is known cringe so what are we left with?

>>23436176
Yeah but the dragons are hatched from literal magic and it's really not clear what the conditions were to birth them. The best hope is to disappear or fake your death in Vaes Dothrak, then hide out and let everything unfold as usual until the dragons hatch. Maybe send word to Illyrio to come rescue you beforehand so you don't have to wander into Qarth. But without further knowledge beyond AGoT... Illyrio picks them up, marries Dany to fAegon and Viserys still loses.

>… but then somehow he was back at Winterfell again, in the godswood looking down upon his father. Lord Eddard seemed much younger this time. His hair was brown, with no hint of grey in it, his head bowed. "… let them grow up close as brothers, with only love between them," he prayed, "and let my lady wife find it in her heart to forgive …" "Father." Bran's voice was a whisper in the wind, a rustle in the leaves. "Father, it's me. It's Bran. Brandon." Eddard Stark lifted his head and looked long at the weirwood, frowning, but he did not speak. He cannot see me, Bran realized, despairing. He wanted to reach out and touch him, but all that he could do was watch and listen. I am in the tree. I am inside the heart tree, looking out of its red eyes, but the weirwood cannot talk, so I can't.

Why wasn't this scene adapted? It seems like quite an emotional scene for Bran, but D&D just ignored it.

>>23436563
by the time they got to bran in the cave, they'd already thrown in the towel.

>>23436563
>"… let them grow up close as brothers, with only love between them," he prayed,
N+A=J bros...

I think the plan is for there to be multiple Azor Ahai incarnations doing some kind of heroic shit that fulfils the prophecy in different ways simultaneously. Jon, Dany, Stannis some shit with the Daynes, etc. there's too much setup. It'll be another "red comet" situation where everyone has their own interpretation after the fact. Having one true messianic figure was never on the cards for georgy boy i suspect

>>23436588
>and let my lady wife find it in her heart to forgive…
There would be nothing to forgive had he not sinned first bro...

>>23435835
you're safe, feel free to make the same bet next year too.
>>23435849
meds

>>23436636
Wouldn't lying to her be a sin?

I loved reading Fire and Blood, and the Dance of the Dragons was book kino, but I'm very worried about the future seasons of HOTD. Mainly how the show will adapt its female characters, most of all Nettles. I'm not some /pol/tard who read the book and freaked out that one of the four dragonseeds was a black girl. Shit, I didn't even care when Nettles and Daemon fell in love or how she was a great dragon rider and an exceptionally moral person. I'm worried though that the HOTD showrunners are going to turn her into a girlboss and a quippy badass who always comes out on top.

People often say that Sauron would be like a kid in a candy store if he were in Westeros. But, would he really? First of all he wouldn’t have all of Melkor’s evil monsters and races, but also he’s probably unprepared for just how fucked up the minds of people in this universe can be. Like, many characters are unironically worse than Orcs, and Sauron reportedly had a lot of trouble wrangling his Orcs.

>>23436773
Keeping a secret is not the same as lying, we know from Cat's POV he simply never talked about it. So no, that is not the sin.
>>23436849
For what its worth, it should be evident from being a dragonseed she is a mutt not a negress (even if she is ugly). Not that HOTD was good to being with but you're watching a HBO show expecting it to be good after the first season... and you're worried? I really don't know what to tell you.

It's crazy to think that even if we got A Dream of Spring it wouldn't be enough to wrap up the story and an eight book would be needed

>>23436849
With the Velayrons getting the “we wuz kangs” Hollywood blackwash special, nettles is very likely going to be cut.

>>23436929
Yup, I got a gut feeling that S2 is going to be hot garbage, with all the problems the first season had being dialed up to eleven.

>>23436929
>he simply never talked about it
So lying by omission which is just as bad since it lead everyone to believe he shamed his wife by not being faithful to her.

>She was sopping wet when he entered her. "Damn you," she said.
>"Damn you damn you damn you." He sucked her nipples till she cried out half in pain and half in pleasure. Her cunt became the world. She forgot Moat Cailin and Ramsay Bolton and his little piece of skin, forgot the kingsmoot, forgot her failure, forgot her exile and her enemies and her husband. Only his hands mattered, only his mouth, only his arms around her, his cock inside her. He fucked her till she screamed, and then again until she wept, before he finally spent his seed inside her womb.
Why is George such a coomer

>>23436190
>>23436197
>>23436209
iirc there were rumors that Robert had slept with her. He boned her cousin(?) at the wedding as well.

>>23436604
We learned in the last book that the PtwP would come from the bloodline of Aerys and Rhaella. There aren't many candidates left, so it will probably be Jon, since his secret lineage links him to the prophecy.

>>23436231
>AGoT cover
The Iron throne, the tall menacing, lopsided one from the artbook/world book
>ACoK
A peach with a bite out of it as you suggested
>ASoS
You don't want to spoil the Red Wedding so maybe the First of the FIrst men as a landscape artwork, dragon glass daggers in the foreground
>AFfC
Obviously you have crows circling a battlefield and eating the dead, no distinguished heradlry of the dead, war makes corpses of us all
>ADwD
Dragons circling Meeren, the city besiged, or the Weirwood tree above the cave entrance to Bloodraven

Thats what I would do

>season 1 of the show was bad
>Expect season 2 to be any better

>>23437653
I wonder if the fell in Winterfell means where Winter fell and the Others were pushed back or if GRRM is using the old noun for hill.

>>23437653
ADWD should have coins on its cover

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjGvjmZ1QQ0

>>23438351

tl;dw - ADWD has a large overarching theme of money being at play. Everyone's dealing with the Iron Bank, from the Night's Watch to King's Landing. Littlefinger's debt scheme is reaching its peak.

The red wedding was a mistake and Robb shouldnt have died there
Youre telling me theres hundreds of soldiers part of a plan to slaughter the king in the north, breaking sacred guest rights, with ravens flying between Harrenhall, the twins and kings landing and none of it gets leaked? Not a single superstitious person goes and reveals it?

>>23436929
What's special about Nettles is that she looks 100% summer islander, not mixed. And the implication is that she's an unironic dragon tamer, always feeding Sheepstealer before riding him and doesn't seem to have a magical bond like the Targs do with their dragons. She has huge implications on the books, particularly whether or not someone without Valyrian blood can ride a dragon or not. Ofc Preston thinks her existence is crucial to Quentyn's survival, so he's losing his mind about her getting cut
>>23437025
All things are pointing towards Nettles' plot being rolled into Rhaena. It's really dumb, because her plot is interesting about being a poor person who learned how to ride dragons rather than a rich girl who sees dragonriding as her right. All anti-feudalist nuance is getting blown out of HotD. After all, in the books Aegon and Rhaenyra are both bad for Westeros, one is a lustful sexist, and the other is an incompetent racist. Making the Velaryons black made the Greens both sexist and racist on face-value when "Valyrian Supremacy" is still being implied by the Blacks faction, but falls flat when the 'mixed family' is the silver-haired kids with a dark-haired mom and the "racially pure" family has black people in it lol

>>23438415
How would they know where a bird is going? Most likely it was coded to some degree anyways.

>>23437653

I'm genuinely surprised someone like Michael Whelan was never considered for painting the Ice and Fire covers. Anyway here's what artwork I'd do for each cover if I got the chance

>A Game of Thrones
Either Winterfell or The Iron Throne
>A Clash of Kings
Green fire destroying the ships at Battle of Black Water
>A Storm of Swords
Oberyn vs The mountain circling each other ready to pounc and strike with a cheering crowd in the arena
>A Feast for Crows
Blind Arya or maybe the Iron Born gathered on The Kingsmoot on Old Wyk
>A Dance with Dragons
Nude Cersei doing her walk of shame
>The Winds of Winter
Maybe a sacrifice happening in front of the trees or a weirwood tree itself or a graveyard covered in winter
>A Dream of Spring
A blue rose spourting from the wall emiting an otherworldly ethereal yet beautiful glowing light

>>23437020

He could still do a time skip at the end of THe Winds of Winter and do the generataional family saga like he always wanted but he'll need one more book A Time for Wolves if he was going to pull that off. There's no way I can see him managing Aegon then Daenery's invasion and finally The Others and the new Long Night coming to fruition all in two books without feeling rushed as hell.

>>23437653
In order
>Naked danenerys
>Naked sansa
>Naked dany again but different angle
>Naked asha
>Naked cersei
>Naked George

>>23437020
the punchline is that TWOW has a 5-year timeskip in the middle of it as soon as Aegon takes King's Landing, Melisandre burns Shireen after Stannis' death in the Battle of Ice, Dany meets Tyrion and Victarion, Davos finds a feral Rickon who warged too much, and Cersei flees to Casterly Rock after poisoning Tommen.

>>23438554
He was rewatching the hobbit

>>23438554
Based. He’s not wrong. I wish he’d recognize the faults in House of the Dragon too, though. Black Valyrians is definitely showrunners “making it their own”.

>>23438622
Hes a hypocrite since he will roll in his pile of money instead of fixing the issue

>>23438554
It’s soul crushing to see out of touch old people notice something much younger people noticed much earlier.

>>23438640
It’s not that he’s a hypocrite, it’s that he is overly gentle and good natured. He’s just a soft old man. You can tell he’s also sheltered, and a bit stubborn in his world views. I don’t blame or fault him for that.

>>23438648
There is no way he is that retarded to not have seen what they did to Stannis. I get the old hippish ideals but its been shit for a literal decade now

>>23438658
It doesn’t matter how he feels, he still won’t say anything along the lines of “Um, the Valyrians are actually pale white people…” since he’s smart enough to know that they would execute him for it.

They already tried cancelling his latest book because of his association with Linda Antonsson, over pic related. Luckily, he defended her, since he doesn’t use the internet much, and told her to just ignore them.

>>23438668
I actually didnt care as much about them being black as them being ugly. Their whole point is to get cucked and have a baby that doesn't look like them so its kinda funny to me

>>23438668
Based. Didn't know Linda had that dawg in her

>>23438415
Not that many ravens actually. Tywin would've send someone with the initial message given the importance. The actual planning would've been done solely by Roose and Walter. Given that between the Frey and Bolton's forces you have half the army already the chances of a leak diminish. If there's any hole in the red wedding it would've been everyone on Roose's side "agreeing" to betray their liege... is what i would've said were it not the Boltons but any other house. Just remember that every big house in westeros has a second one in power and prestige literally waiting for an opportunity like this. Well, as Tywin would have it not every house.

>>23438668
>>23438713
Was just reading a bit of the drama about Elio and Linda and redditor/wokerinos really are insufferably disingenuous. The same people who nitpick "well actually, how is there only one language in all of Westeros?" suddenly think it's uncalled for to call out why they changed an established character's features and go with "do you think genetics actually works in this made up dragon world, bigot??"

Pedowood deserves all the shit they're getting and I really hope it burns to the ground

>>23438760
Elio is also Hispanic, which makes her look even better. Insane Redditors cannot separate their own perceived racism from…people who just want a more consistent and faithful narrative. It is indistinguishable to these people. These morons.

>>23438668
Honestly since Game of Thrones clearly had a different Valyria than A Song of Ice and Fire I wouldn't care about black Valaryians were it not for the fact that absolutely nothing is done with it and its not incorporated into the world whatsoever.
You hear constantly about the red hair of the Tullys and about the golden hair of the Lannisters, the plot is kickstarted because of the phenotype of House Baratheon not matching Joffery and yet House Velaryon doesn't have any relation to the color of their skin? There's no prejudice about that at all?
The Crannogmen get harassed for being manlets but House Velaryon doesn't have a single trait culturally associated with their dark skin, ? It doesn't even need to be negative even though the most obvious thing to do would be to say that they have the blood of pirates, you could just say that dark skin is associated with being a good sailor or some dumb bullshit and have that be one of the many things Vaemond uses to push against the claim of the Strong bastards but no, even in a world with known prejudices about minor characteristics, they're not willing to do that because it could be seen as insensitive.
Do cheer when the black guy gets his head cut off by the aryan ubermensch tho.

>>23438974
The funny thing is, in the original show, season 2 to be precise, they actually told, to the viewer, that a certain race-swapped character (Xaro Xhoan Doxos) was *from* the Summer Isles, to account for the change.

There was none of that in HotD. They didn’t even attempt to write something like “this house was originally a descendent of seafaring summer islanders, assimilated over time by Valyrian culture”, when they absolutely could have done so.

They. Didn’t. Care.

>>23438986
>Xaro Xhoan Doxos
What’s even funnier, is that this name sounds like it came from the Summer Isles. Jalabhar Xho, etc.

>>23438486
lost

>>23437020
how would you call this hypothetical 8th book? I'm thinking it should be something Summer related

>>23438974
HBO shit isn't canon, simple as. As much as GRRM wants to be remembered for an intricate, character-driven fantasy political theater, people only care about the dragons. I am willing to be he is even gonna to subvert the dragons in the books somehow, but the general fan of the series doesn't care.

The general fan, the one who made GRRM a worldwide name, wants to see EPIC dragons. People are watching HOTD for the dragons. They thought Dany was epic and they want more Dany scenes. They want the whole Dany family with a TON of Dragons. That's it. For all the intrigue and politics, people just want the EPIC CGI at the end of the day.

>>23437020
fuck the five year gap; why does GRRM have an obsession with a specific number of books? Just write enough books to tell the story like no one cares if it is only three or seven. I would read eight books, or twelve, or six, or ten.

>>23438554
does this idiot read anything besides genre slop

>>23438459
>one is a lustful sexist, and the other is an incompetent racist
I may be retarded, because I can't figure out which is which.

>>23440622
>The general fan, the one who made GRRM a worldwide name, wants to see EPIC dragons. People are watching HOTD for the dragons.
There's nothing really to back this up, the last few seasons had plenty of ebic dragon moments and people still hated it.

>>23441074
people only thought they wanted to see dragons fuck shit up, what they were really getting off on was the characters, drama and intrigue. in 2013 people were saying "can't wait until the dragons grow huge and dany fucks shit up in westeros!" not realising they were watching the best episodes of the show.
HOTD is even lower fantasy than GOT. it's pretty much a regency costume drama with some dragons on the side. there's no wargs, shadowbinders, greenseeing, glamors, resurrections etc. basically no magic at all besides the dragons, which just act as

What does the thread think happened to Rhaenys? Seems pretty likely to me she survived but was injured or crippled even from how Martin sets up the events in F&B. But I wonder if she ended up as a hostage and bearing some Dornish lord progeny, (Daynes purple eyes?). Although the latter events are even less supported in the text.

>>23441858
Like this guy needs anymore chocolate.

>>23441074
No need to play dumb, there's only so much the epic dragons can do when the quality was at its lowest. Anon is correct, the normalfaggot watches for the "adult fantasy" and le shocking deaths and ofc, the epic dragons.
>>23442400
Dumb question, she died. But here's a better one: What do you guys think happened to Aerea? Personally i think she encountered a dragon abomination, a once archon of valyria now turned revenant. Commanding a great host of wraithlike wyrms he cursed her and wounded Balerion.

It's over...

>>23443314
YOU FAT FUCK

>>23443314
Fake, even the obese troglodyte would never stoop so low

>>23443408
https://x.com/DEADLINE/status/1796306416812351640
https://deadline.com/2024/05/the-summer-machine-george-r-r-martin-unveils-first-look-still-1235945339/

>>23443314
God I fucking hate you George.

>>23443314
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO GEORGE YOU FAT FUCKING FUCK WRITE THAT HECKIN BOOK ALREADY!!! I SWEAR I WILL LIGHT MYSELF ON FIRE AND JUMP INTO A HIGHWAY IF WINDS OF WINTER DOESN'T COME OUT TOMORROW!!! IF YOU'D HAD WRITTEN ONE-- ONE FUCKING MEASLY FUCKING PAGE SINCE OBAMA GOT REELECTED WE'D HAVE THE HECKIN EDGY DRAGON FUNNY STORY BY NOW!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

>>23443412
Oh fucking kill me, its never been more over

I came from the future. Here's what's going to happen with ASOIAF:

>GRRM dies with about 90% of TWOW done
>publishers release it with minor touches by editors to fill the gaps
>in the end of the book, there'll be an open-ended epilogue telling what was supposed to happen with everyone
>10-15 years later, some writer will get his drafts and write a shorter and more linear take on ADOS, with only the main POV characters, to wrap up everything
>the ending will be praised by everyone, but we'll always wonder what would have happened if GRRM finished the whole story
>re-releases of AFFC/ADWD will be split like the reddit version
>5-10 after ADOS, we'll have a GOT remake with Kat Harrington as Ned Stark

>>23443776
Also, I forgot:

>Fire and Blood vol.2 will be out based on his drafts. It'll be shorter than vol. 1 but much better. It'll be out like 1 year after TWOW

>>23434574
The point of Asshai etc is "the less is known about a place the more wacky exaggerated stories people will make up about it" so actually seeing it would probably be a let-down.

>>23436231
The pulpy-80s-fantasy-vibes original covers had a certain charm, what's so bad about depicting known characters anyway?

>>23442959
>She died
Then what was in the letter to Aegon?
I can't see anything other than "we'll torture kill you are wife" being enough to stop him from finishing off Dorn after how heated the war had gotten.

As to what happened to Aerea my uninformed headcanon was the doom of valyria was a CRISPR magic nuke turning the freehold into a flesh melding cauldron of abominations. Merely returning was enough to infect her and a gigantic patchwork horror ripped into Balerions flank with its claws.

>>23444276
NTA but regarding the letter, threatening to hire a faceless man to kill his heir is also a theory I've seen suggested.

>>23443901
I think you could potentially do it in the same way that the house of the undying sequence, where you don't actually learn much, they just do a quick in and out ending in more questions than answers

>>23444331
Yeah that theories in the text itself, proffered by Grandmaster Clegg but that's not the kind of threat that would make Aegon "Stone-faced and silent" not to mention: "When he rose afterward, men said, his hand was dripping blood". He then burned the letter and told no one of its contents.

I don't think threatening him with faceless men would make him react that way, there's also the matter that while Meraxes skull was returned the body of Rhaenys wasn't.

The one thing I don't get either way is why he returned to Dragonstone overnight on Balerion. That maybe gives creedence that she was alive and not a captive and that they met there, but I'd think it somewhat strange if she was living freely in Dorne. But it would be fairly in Character for George to write a woman escaping the shackles of duty for love.

>>23442400
>What do you guys think happened to Aerea
one of the most tragic events ever written down. Poor girl.

God demonstrated His love to us by sending His Son Jesus Christ, who died and rose from the dead to Give us eternal life. He also promised to heal your body. If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead. He'll give you eternal life.

>>23438640
I think he figured easy money.
>>23438622
He likely will eventually, it's just bad etiquette to shit on a show you're connected to while it's still around. You wait for the dust to clear and afterwards you talk shit while not pointing to anyone that still has a career so you don't make unnecessary enemies. Hollywood BS.

>>23444382
Wrong thread, preacher.
>>23444362
Fucked up story but man I was locked in when reading that part. Old Valyria is a fun boogeyman.

>>23443776
I think after he dies his wife will sell it to Japan, who will translate the entire series into Japanese and then back again before releasing it in English.

>>23438622
He won't live enough to shit on HBO, he's contractually obligated not to slam on their shows no matter what he may think.
>>23444276
The war was going on for a while then and Dorne was hellbent on destroying itself instead of bending the knee and moreover Aegon was tired.
While i like the idea of a CRISPR nuke i believe that was more of a consequence of the already widely spread blood magic. Whatever it was likely involved terraforming one of their volcanoes. Sounds extremely retarded when you think about it considering how close it was from the city so maybe foulplay was indeed involved.

>>23444362
When Barth described her crisped flesh like ‘pork cracklings’ I got hungry

>>23441074
because people love to hate, almost as much as they love to consume. The entire business model of Disney is currently to keep pumping stuff out so people on youtube can make long videos talking about how BAD it is so people go consume the product and tlak about it.
House of the Dragon is proof that asoiaf became a victim of its own success; the masses just want EPIC dragon cgi. They don't care about the inheritance of Castle Rosby or the house sigils of lesser Westerlands lords

I hate seeing the 'Robb didn't have a plan but acted like he did to guilt trip Edmure' theory gaining traction.

finally

>>23438668
that boxer looks like my old one :(

>>23446668
>The entire business model of Disney is currently to keep pumping stuff out so people on youtube can make long videos talking about how BAD it is so people go consume the product and tlak about it.
???
Theyre hemorrhaging money. Theyre not making anything close to what they would be if their franchises wouldnt be shitting the bed. If disney could keep youtubers from shit talking their shows they'd do it.

>>23447285
is it just me or do they put less effort in the newer books
agot seems to have many more illustrations

How come R'hllor actually delivers some miracles while the other gods do nothing? How can anyone believe in the Seven or the old gods when theres actually people getting revived and murdered by red priests

If Bolton wasnt so autistic Lady Stoneheart wouldnt want to kill jaime

>>23447679
I am so fucking tired of this question being asked so fucking often.

It's not hard to start a cult/religion, truly, since it merely requires some stupid form of propagated belief, which can be fucking anything, and as such these stories are not supposed to have truth or a background to them.

Now, ask yourself what is backing the religions of the asoiaf world, or what's not backing them. It probably isn't what the faithful think it to be. Faith does not require truth as a rule.

Melisandre is fooling herself about her own god the same way she fools those who flock to her religion, she's merely one or two steps higher on the ladder of ignorance. It is entirely possible R'hllor is just some powerful troll wizard from afar, using a glass candle, the same way the greenseers in their trees can be argued to be the old gods.

>>23447711
>>23447679
the red priests practice magic, but nothing they do is exculsive to Rh'llor, as fas as we can tell. Mel is a shadowbinder, like mirri maz dur who worships the lamb god. Seeing visions of the future can be done by greenseers, resurrection can be done by the others, and we also see Mirri resurrect. drogo, even if she was just trolling Dany, so it seems to me that Red priests are just priests that also happen to practice magic, not that they draw their power from a divinity.

Explain to me again, why didnt Barristan stand up for Ned when he pulled up in the throne room?
"like carving a cake", wasnt it? Barristan the bold? More like Barristan the couldnt be bothered to guard the king

>>23448517
Because Ned was just a Hand and he isn't part of the Handsguard?? If the new king's first decree is to walk back everything the old one did, that is his prerogative. Ned's whole stick was Joffrey not being a king at all which is not something Barristan or anyone else could assess in the moment, hence why everyone knew it would devolve into who has more man.

>>23447699
Pretty funny in a fucked up way. I'm assuming Jaime said this sarcastically

>>23433563
Bran's one of my favorites, tbqh

What's your favorite castle names lads? For me it's Godsgrace, Nightsong, High Hermitage and of course the Eyrie.

Benjen:
“You don’t miss much, do you, Jon? We could use a man like you on the Wall.”

Also Benjen:
“The Wall is a hard place for a boy, Jon.”
“You don’t know what you’re asking, Jon. The Night’s Watch is a sworn brotherhood. We have no families. None of us will ever father sons. Our wife is duty. Our mistress is honor.”
“You are a boy of fourteen,”
“Not a man, not yet. Until you have known a woman, you cannot understand what you would be giving up.”

So what was his whole deal? Did he want Jon in the NW or not?

>>23450921
He wanted Jon the man. Not Jon the 14 year old.

>>23450921
>Military uncle telling his 14 year old nephew he will make a good soldier

>>23450921
Was just complimenting his nephew. Never actually expected him to join and suffer through the reality of being a watchman.

>>23450921
Yeah, when he was older. But Catelyn forced the plans to be accelerated when she demanded Ned send Jon away once he went south.

I love bashing Ned but goddamn when i stop to think about it, Catelyn did more harm than possibly any other character in the story. She's a woman sure but Jesus, Robb and Jon were buttfucked by her and Jaime might just die on her orders... Forget Euron or Bloodraven, she is the real enemy.

>>23451928
Catelyn is the skyler of got

>>23453075
meant for
>>23452437

Posting my reading order again for a new generation of /grrm/

I'm rereading ASoIaF one POV at a time. I try to imagine I have no knowledge of the books so I can experience the narrative unfolding in broken up, personal ways. I'm still on the first POV, Tyrion. Here's the order I intend to go:
>Will
prologue for the series
>Tyrion
"main" character, explores every general area/plot
>Catelyn
the WotFK from the North's POV
>Ned
what really went down with Ned and the start of the war, anyway
>Jamie
compare/contrast Ned with Jaime
>Brienne
logical followup to Jaime, nice Honor Trilogy
>Merret
one off to set a tone for Lady Stoneheart and wrap up WotFK POVs
>Sansa
Brienne is searching for her, so let's see where she disappeared off to
>Jon Snow
gets mentioned in one of/the last Sansa chapter, and he's Lord Commander of the Night's Watch now, let's see what he's doing up there and clear the rumors of what's happening up beyond the wall
>Arya
Jon thinks of Arya, thinks she's getting involved twice, let's see what Arya is really up to after she vanished in book one
>Melisandre
Arya saw the black brother in Braavos, and is also doing spooky magic stuff, so let's cut back to the Wall
>Cressen
let's wind the clock back on Melisandre and see how this Stannis stuff really started
>Davos
follow the Stannis story, then the North Remembers story to an extent
>Chett
Jon was away for the battle at the Fist of the First men, so let's go to Chett real quick to see how the Night's Watch is outside of Jon
>Sam
Let's follow Sam out of the North; the Night's Watch has been thoroughly covered now let's sail back South
>Pate
it's Pate from Sam's chapter :)
>Aeron
the ironborn are attacking the Reach, so let's see what they're up to
>Victarion
This Ironborn was sent East to the Dragon Queen that gets mentioned from time to time, so let's see if he makes it to her
>Asha
another Ironborn from the Kingsmoot, and then more of the Stannis plot
>Theon
I thought Theon died? He showed up in Stannis' camp though? What happened to Theon?
>Varamyr
Theon is maybe experiencing some spooky Northern Magic stuff, let's do Varymyr real quick
>Bran
now this is the real spooky northern magic stuff. What's lil bro been up to?
>Cersei
she's the catalyst for Bran's story, and an antagonist for many others, time for her to have her focus
>Areo
Myrcella+Dorne time
>Arys
Myrcella+Dorne time 2
>Arianne
the real Dorne POV, also leading into...
>Jon Connington
so those guys Tyrion trolled really went West, let's see how that all went down
>Kevan
damn, the entire story has been a set up for the Dragon Queen I guess.
>Quentyn
Let's go to the Dragon Queen through Dorne POV
>Barristan
the last POV before Dany, and one with an aged perspective of the entire story
>Daenerys
let's see how this little girl became the Mother of three dragons

Just finished Tyrion A Clash of Kings, impressions so far next post >>

>>23453339
Finished Tyrion's CoK POVs. Tyrion in AGoT starts off with his brother and sister and their kids in Winterfell. In hindsight, Jaime ending the chapter by coyly asking which side Tyrion is on, and Tyrion responding coyly back that he's always put his family first, is a bit ominous, because that's the only time Tyrion and Jaime have interacted thus far. I think in nearly every CoK Tyrion chapter he thinks fondly of Jaime, and when he's saved by Pod he thinks it's Jaime as he drifts off. Tyrion clearly loves Jaime, so it'll be great to see them finally interact.

Speaking of Pod btw, wow his entire presence is a minor part, entirely of a meekish boy, but he comes fucking through when Tyrion leads the sortie to the Mud Gate. Tyrion tells Pod he isnt supposed to be with him and the Kingsguard, but Pod just responds "I'm your squire, my Lord." Props to Pod.

Tyrion's CoK story is him working to save the city from the war. It is fun learning of the war happening off-page; first it's Tywin vs Robb in the west, then the fear of Stannis and his ships, then Renly's impossibly-large host, then Stannis attacks Renly instead of King's Landing, Littlefinger moves to broker alliance with the Tyrells and Tarlys and their faction while Stannis sieges Storm's End, Dorne is bought off with alliance, and the Greyjoys even get a shoutout when Balon becomes King of the Isles and the North. Most of all is Stannis. Stannis is this ominous, off-page threat, and the main antagonist of the plot. It is Stannis who drives the fear in Kings Landing more than any other faction. Stannis is the one true enemy. The ending of Tyrion's last chapter is a bit of a cliffhanger, but also has a sense of determination to it, as if Tyrion is angrily stomping and clawing his way back into the narrative next book.

Cersei is shown as fucking dumb the entire time. From her first scene to her last, she is cooked. She really comes across as vain, spoiled, and detached from reality, either from her lavish feasts AFTER the riot in king's landing, her getting distracted with Stannis' letters and missing the subtler details, or just the knowledge that Tyrion learns she lost Arya Stark somehow.

Fuck Shae. She's a naive whore, literally. Her scenes were annoying and I felt GRRM focused too much on the sexual stuff here. Thoughts of Tysha are understandable, to an extent, but at the same time I don't really like the story, so personally most of anything Tyrion does with whores isn't for me. Chataya's and Alayaya's time on page is nice, though, lol.

Bronn, Bywater, Shagga; Tyrion's men all felt fun. GRRM does well to give minor characters personality. On that front, Seeing Varys and Petyr in the POV narrative was fun. Littlefinger becomes an adversary, Varys an ally.

The only other major plot Tyrion hears about is the capture of Winterfell by Theon and the death of Bran and Rickon. Wild to hear about, and Cersei admitting Jaime pushed Bran because he saw them was interesting lore
>cont

>>23453409
overall really enjoying the Tyrion-only-POV intro to the asoiaf narrative. Tyrion has gone from the Stark's Winterfell with his family and the royal entourage, to the Wall with Jon, then prisoner of Cat and Lysa, and to the battlefield for his Father, to now staying entirely in one location: King's Landing. In book one he was an unlikely, even unwilling adventurer, now in book two, Tyrion is not just a player in the game of thrones, but a true force behind the clash of kings. He out wits, out maneuvers, and out battles his adversaries, whether they be across the Blackwater or across the small council chamber. Clash of Kings Tyrion fucking won, but the stage is set for him to discover what the cost of his victory has been next book.

Through Tyrion's POV, the reader learns that the war with the Starks rages on, and Robb and the Northmen show no signs of slowing down or losing. Sansa as prisoner seems to be the only hope of keeping Jaime alive, and elsewhere in Westeros the Baratheon brothers make war amongst themselves. Stannis was beaten back from Kings Landing with Fire and Sword, but that does not mean the war is over. And curiously, the pyromancers ask if Dragons have been seen in the world, for their magic seems to be growing stronger, as it was in the time when Dragons last lived...

I'm looking forward to the Tyrion-only Storm of Swords experience! I think this POV order was a great idea and it's surely a unique way to experience the narrative. Maybe I'll even be done in time for Winds of Winter to come out... heh....

>>23443623
This but unironically

I'm rereading the books and just noticed that when Jon describes the Starks and the royal family coming in the great hall, he leaves out Bran. Was this a mistake on GRRM's part or did Bran not attend the feast? Would be strange if he hasn't considering even the 3 year old Rickon was there.

>>23453829

Reminder that Jon Snow is a fucking sensitive crybaby

Tyrion literally made him tear up and cry on their first trip to the Wall

Jon Snow will rise from the dead and go on to kill dany to stop her from melting the Others so he can give them guest right at Winterfell then he will go back into the lands of always winter to be their guest forever

>>23454354
he was a 14yo little lordling. even as a bastard he was a pampered little shit like all the retro so it's no wonder. he lived in magical world of honourable knights and pretty ladies from the songs, same as Sansa. then he got hit with a reality check (just like Sansa also). some teary whining is expectable is what I'm saying

>>23454984
like all the others*
phone keyboards were a mistake..

Another nothingburger blog post from george shilling some other author.

>>23433770
Now that I think of it, this would've been impossible to adapt if D&D didn't end up cutting anything and George actually released on time. Imagine the headache of trying to explain to execs why GOT randomly needs 10x the budget for one season. You could spend a whole season on these 4 battles alone and still run out of time.
>>23434033
I still dream of spring.
>>23434195
The build up to the battles are way more important than the battle itself but fire has more things going on both before and during it so my guess is people will find that more appealing. It's an absolute cluster fuck compared to ice which will probably just be fake Theon burning on some hill, the Freys falling through ice and Stannis losing something in some surprise twist at the end when they take Winterfell. Steel feels less climatic, a lot of it will be Arriane's POV which is distracting and they location will be just fog with sounds of swords clashing before people fall of a cliff. Steel is just set up for whatever will go down in KL afterwards. Blood might go full Berserk eclipse mode with the magic element. I mean if you believe the Giants in the Wall theory Michael mentioned then it'd be the second major plot point that matches with a popular anime, which isn't a lot but it's more than one. This has the potential to beat out fire but I doubt George will go that deep into the magic part of it. Some Kraken will destroy some ships at most, I doubt we'd get something like the sky turning blood red.
Fire > ice > steel > blood for the battles themselves
Fire > blood > ice > steel for the potential visuals
>>23436067
D&D butchering the Stannis side of the story as early as season 2. We lost out on so much kino
>>23454562
You do realise you'll never get a POV chapter again. Everyone is going to get pumpfaked with a Jon Connington chapter and the seething will be hilarious. At best he's a Fire Wight fucking shit up, he might never actually respawn too which is funny.

>You do realise you'll never get a POV chapter again. Everyone is going to get pumpfaked with a Jon Connington chapter and the seething will be hilarious. At best he's a Fire Wight fucking shit up, he might never actually respawn too which is funny.

>>23455577
>alt shift x and glidus mentioned in it

>>23455992
>"it'd be the second major plot point that matches with a popular anime"
what's the first one?

Jon x Satin pls laugh

>>23438486
>Naked George

Reminder that George R.R. Martin is a clueless old codger who's about as subversive as Leave It To Beaver and only half as imaginative.

Bros can u recommend me another fantasy book?
Asoiaf spoiled me so much I don't think there's any better fantasy series...
Tried Brandon Sanderson but that was really cringe...

>>23458674
>Tumblr is even more autistic than 4chan
Do you maybe think that maybe his point wasn't that hobbits don't procreate? Could you maybe compare the works of the two authors in your head and try and understand what he meant?

>>23458905
Dragonbone Chair? It's a large influence on ASOIAF but it's played pretty straight up without much "subversion"

>>23457105
AOT with the titans inside the walls and ASOIAF with the Giants in the Wall.
>>23456381
Zoomer lingo.
>>23458905
That's the issue with getting exposed to peak, you can't even enjoy mid anymore.
>>23459252
But does it actually hold up against ASOIAF?

>>23459252

I'm seconding this though I've only read the first two books super comfy in how the author slowly unveils everything but you can tell the stuff with the Norns and Sithi is what inspired GRRM in creating The Others

>>23459340

>Giants in the walls

Weirdwoods. There are weirwoods in the wall, I'm fairly sure this has been hinted at a couple times.

>>23436108
Not be such an annoying cunt towards Khal Drogo.

why do people think we need someone to bring jon from the dead, when just leaving a corpse alone is enough to bring him back as a wright?

No need for Mel or Stoneheart's kiss of fire
Jon will raise as a mindless wright and go to the lure of the closed Necromancer White Walker in the area.

>o but how he returns to himself
Now you just need GHOST (Jon backup) pov.

Ghost roams free like Bran's wolf dreams and is the new pov where he follows "vaguely" Jon's ice wraith body and eventually they merge and from now on we can have some look in the White Walker's "culture" by Jon.


That is how he will almost fulfill the Night's King prophecy. Somehow he, as an Ice Wraith gets the Kiss of fire and completed the song of ice and fire and make a peace deal with the WW and Humans

>>23459096
>Could you maybe compare the works of the two authors in your head and try and understand what he meant?
What he meant was that he has no understanding of subtext. He said that he can't imagine hobbits having sex. He implied that the way the hobbits were written was entirely sexless. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it's because he thinks the hobbits' psychology and society are too wholesome for him to imagine as being anything other than a sexless paradisal state, because he doesn't imagine sex as being something that wholesome and well-mannered creatures engage in, which is why he writes sex in his stories the way he does.

Forgive me if I'm being uncharitable to the person who straight-up didn't understand why Gandalf coming back from the dead was so impactful in The Lord of the Rings. As in he literally thought that Gandalf's sacrifice was rendered meaningless by his return.
https://screenrant.com/lord-of-the-rings-george-r-r-martin-gandalf-death-criticism-wrong/

>he Lord of Storm’s End had been clean-shaven, clear-eyed, and muscled like a maiden’s fantasy. Six and a half feet tall, he towered over lesser men, and when he donned his armor and the great antlered helmet of his House, he became a veritable giant

>>23460287
The Night's Watch will burn Jon's body.

>>23459340
I know the giant one that's what anon said too I was asking what was the other one. anon said there were two

>>23460313
>le tolkien was PERFECT and George just didn't get it
You faggots are unbearable.

>>23433770
The Field of February 30th
The Sea of Nevergonnahappen
The Battle of Baloney

>>23444382
Amen.
Any thoughts on when George will repent of his sloth and release the fucking books?

>>23457616
this one is a big hit on reddit

>>23460329
Why is everyone attractive?

>>23433463
Chances of WINDS at least being finished, but not released, this year?

>>23460313
>I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it's because he thinks the hobbits' psychology and society are too wholesome for him to imagine as being anything other than a sexless paradisal state, because he doesn't imagine sex as being something that wholesome and well-mannered creatures engage in
Then you'll lose that limb because you're imagining things
Plus he literally says in that quote that thinks sex is important can result in very noble actions

>which is why he writes sex in his stories the way he does.
And which way is that exactely?

>Forgive me if I'm being uncharitable to the person who straight-up didn't understand why Gandalf coming back from the dead
It's (you) who straight-up doesn't understand the fat man's real gripe with Gandalf's ressurection
He simply thinks it's just too convenient and lessens the stakes

Also Tolkien didn't like allegories and being as devout as he was he would never think of intentionally setting up Gandalf as a Christ analogue, as he believed he could not "capture" the same depth as the Gospel and more importantly he would just find it in poor taste

>>23460641
That's just Ned being Ned.

reminder there are no gods in George's cynical atheist world. Old gods are just a gestalt consciousness of a thousand years of greenseers uploaded to weirwood dot net, all the essos god's miracles just being blood mages and shadow binders doing their thing attribute the feats to their chosen deity, and finally there's noting really miraculous being attributed to the seven at all than can prove they actually exist.

>>23452437
>Robb
would've been fine if he listened to her advice
>Jon
her actions towards him are entirely justified
>Jaime
deserves it

>>23460790
NTA but its not that simple. Tolkien had VERY complicated feelings on allegories, he literally struggled with it his whole life because he reckons his work is as litteted with it as his contemporary Lewis who did intent in making allegories.
Also stop feeding (You)s to obvious bait.

>>23460976
>"It should have been you."
>justified

>>23459654
Michael talks about ASOIAF on YouTube gave a pretty decent defense for the idea that there are giants/people attached to the weirwoods on the wall.
>>23460343
Oh here >>23455992
>Blood might go full Berserk eclipse mode with the magic element.
In Berserk there's an eclipse after which some wild shit does down as the antagonist begins a sacrifice ritual that kills his friends. The battle of blood will likely include Euron making some sort of blood sacrifice that will kill some of his own men along with the enemy ships. There's a vision of Euron transformed into some sort of monster and a battle in blood red sea. It's not a 1 to 1 without the actual eclipse but it's the first thing that came to my head and a lot of people would notice the parallels if Winds ever comes out. I'm genuinely hoping it comes out in the next 3 years.

>>23460882
I wish that there would have been at least one "miracle" or happening related to the Seven during the timeframe of the books. The fact that there isn't really makes the Seven boring compared to the other faiths. Maybe George didn't want to make medieval Catholicism seem exciting or dynamic, even though it definitely was.

>>23462227
My thoughts exactly. Georgie boy feels borderline pagan with how much he felates all the heresy with cool shit. The faith not having anything even as myths back in the andalos is very stupid. But he is a hippie so what did you expect.

>>23460342
Night's Watch is currently going crazy, Jon was just stabbed, three factions where being held in check thanks to him and they might even need to deal with Bolton men, Jon's cold body locked into one of the morgues, conserved by the cold might raise pretty soon. Hell, even the queen's (stannis wife) men might, on their ignorance, prevent Jon from being burned

>>23460882
You know that there's a lot of different system of deities and if it's a magical hive mind or a literal humanoid god in mount Olympus or a spectral being or an idea that survives on their believers "believing" energy... It's still not atheistic

I don't think GRRM is taking any religious parralels with his story but do you think Aegon is potentially the golden calf of Ice and Fire? Especially more obvious when you see the army he is with is called The Golden Company

>>23461847

Griffith vs Euron would be interesting I find them rather similar characters Euron is just more open about bein evil.

>>23462227
It's called "The Song of Ice and Fire" not "The Song of Pseudo Pagan Greek/Catholicism"
The force of Ice and Fire are the supernatural principles, the setting is dualistic not monistic

>>23462563
>The faith not having anything even as myths back in the andalos is very stupid.
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Hugor_of_the_Hill

>>23460882
>finally there's noting really miraculous being attributed to the seven at all than can prove they actually exist.
As you said yourself, there are no gods, only magic, and people interpret things through their religious beliefs.
The Seven Pointed Star do mentions an Andal receiving visions from the Seven that would triggered the Andal's invasion, magical visions interpreted through religious beliefs.

>>23462839
The Old Gods get supernatural occurrences, the Drowned God gets supernatural occurrences, the Red God gets supernatural occurrences, and the Many-Faced-God gets supernatural occurrences; all of these during the main books. But the Seven get exactly none. There is some real bias here from GRRM, and it damages the quality of his worldbuilding and writing.

>>23460882
What is a god is a matter of perspective, and greenseers can certainly play the part.

>>23462981
>the Drowned God gets supernatural occurrences
CPR is not a miracle. Brain damage is not a miracle.

are you guys ready for the crackpot schizos to try and justify how George RR Martin basically wrote the answers to the mysteries of the setting in Shadow of The Erdtree after the 21st?

You guys are genuinely mentally ill for maintaining interest in this failed project for so long. It had potential, but it came and went. It's time to let it go.

>>23462227
In Gurm's lapsed Catholic mind giving any credit to the Seven would be like admitting his whole life has been a mistake.

why is there no gay incest?

>>23463466
>you cant like an unfinished project
What a gay attitude

>>23462981
>The Old Gods
associated with the forces of Ice

>the Drowned Go
this >>23463121

>the Red God
associated with the forces of Fire

>the Many-Faced-God
literally Death which is associated with the forces of Ice

>>23433463
>sex with
Imagine shilling sex with a GRRM thread. I know these canned posts are pre-written and handed over to whatever Indians posting here, but damn, the whole shilling the series like shitters do for video games is pathetic.

>>23459340
>But does it actually hold up against ASOIAF?
imo it does.

>>23459252
It's fairly "subversive" for its time but not in the current sense we think of it. There are some things that caught me off guard the first time I read MS&T. One of them being just how much Simon suffers physically and mentally in that book or how some events play out.

>>23458905
In terms of fantasy there's not much that scratches that itch like ASOIAF does. Like the other anon said, Memory, Sorrow and Thorn is very good, imo. It's like a bridge between Lord of the Rings and ASOIAF.

>>23433463
Geeeeooooorge just write the hacking boooook, AaaaaaahhhhhhhH!!!!!
I just want to get Wiiiiiinds, iiis it that fucking haaaard?!?!?!!?
Aaaaaaaaaahhhhhh!!?!?!?!!!

Is Robin Hobb any good? Gurm loves to suck her clit and i hear he ripped off the skinchanging system from her

>>23464614
He's a terminally obese 75 year old fatass. He keeps letting himself be sidetracked by other projects. He's also stinking rich, such that he wouldn't need to ever write another page of anything at all even if he lived to be 150. And for the cherry on top he's an atheist who could not care less about his legacy. He doesn't even have children of his own. As far as Gurm is concerned, he got maybe 10 more years to enjoy his newfound wealth and then it's dreamless sleep forever. Why would it matter to him that a small army of readers is going to resent him? He'll be too dead to take any notice.

Everything is working against the possibility of Gurm finishing his work. The sooner you come to terms with it, the better off you'll be.

>>23464918
shouldn t atheists care most about leaving a legacy?

>>23433463
I don't know who this is but as soon as I saw Sew with and she's a GRRM character the first thing I thought was "how many times she's been raped?"

>>23465011
From the atheist's point of view, the universe stops existing at the time of his death. Why then should he care about any legacy - good or bad - in a universe which won't exist to him / from which he'll be eternally removed?

>>23465179
You're confusing atheism with nihilism

ADWD turns 13 years old next month

How are you going to celebrate?

>>23465179
I used to be an atheist for most of my life and i've never thought that the universe would stop existing at my death, nor have i even heard any atheist think this. legacy is just as important as it is for theists, because even though you are gone the people you've interacted with go on living, the effects you had on the world are still there after your death. this is not about theism or atheism, caring about legacy is a personal thing, some people care about it some don't regardless of if they are or aren't religious

>>23464918
>10 more years

You’re being real generous anon, I say two more years, three max.

If he’s still alive by the end of 2026 I’ll be genuinely surprised.

>>23465288
>the effects you had on the world are still there after your death
What reason could an atheist possibly have to care about that? If you're a Hindu or a Buddhist, you'd expect to reincarnate into this world after a while and the Hindu version of Martin might figure that he wants his next life to be able to enjoy the finished Song of Ice and Fire. If you're a Christian or Muslim, you'd expect God to sit in judgement over how you spent your time on Earth. Tradcath Martin might figure that he has a moral duty to not betray the trust of his readers and that he should use his God given talent to have as positive an impact on the world as he can. But the actual Martin thinks that everything just goes black and that's it. He won't be affected by his actions after death, only before death. And before death, the only consequence of his actions which matters is whether they or not they result in pleasure. Eating is pleasurable, hence he is a fat fuck. Making an effort to finish his life's work isn't pleasurable anymore, hence he doesn't do it.

>>23466131
Do you think atheists don't care about the people around them?

>>23466146
Atheists may care about some people around them, but that's the point: After death there will be no more people around them ever again. Or at least that's how they must see it if they actually think it through.

>>23466166
Belief doesn't effect object permanence.

>>23463991
>associated with the forces of Ice
I keep feeling like the children of the forest, throughout their past histories, would know about both ice and fire magic, being a race of nature and the seasons, obviously; although maybe not the survivors of men.

>>23433463
I demand abridged versions of his books. I dropped ASOIAF after some random banquet in the third or fourth book. It was too much.

You now remember this kino.

https://imgur.com/gallery/game-of-thrones-reenvisioned-as-feudal-japan-wuLsm

>>23467853
It is indeed kino

>>23465270

I hope we at least get some Winds of Winter announcement next month in GRRM's notablog post about the ADWD anniversary. That means if it's announced in July then chances are it could be released sometime in either September or October

>>23436108
I believe they were already in Pentos 1 year before Bran 1, right?
>realize Varys and Ilirio playin' games
>wait until eggs
>grab Dany and eggs
>GET OUT OF THERE STALKER!
>>23436132
>wait till Dany hatches eggs
>>23436132
>go west
>>23436132
>DragonForce-ThroughtheFireandFlames.mp3
>>23436132
>be metal as fuck as I save the world from ice zombies on top of a motherfucking dragon
>>23436132
>>23436132
>>23436132
>>23436132

>>23464892
It's certainly not bad if you can get past the MC, think isekai protag personality meets YA fantasy rags to riches special bullied heroine in the body of Bran if Bran was like Arya and not a bitch

>>23436604
GRRM seemed to certainly want it that way, Jon, Dany, Stannis (as a in universe red herring), Victarion, maybe Aegon, maybe Tyrion etc. etc. Its all because he wants to subvert the chosen one trope, too bad he is the definition of an impulse writer and just had to snuck in motherfuckers who see the future accurately and time travel, with hints of them working to bring about the chosen one and shit. I suspect this contradiction, among others like it and bloat, is what originally put the breaks on the series, then he just got bored and here we are

>>23468150
I'm starting to assume that "the dragon must have three heads" was implying that the PtwP was threefold.

So when Elia gives birth to Aegon, the maesters tell Rhaegar that Elia can't have anymore kids due to birthing complications. That's why Dany sees Rhaegar telling Elia that the dragon must have three heads. Spelling it out to her that he needs to have a 3rd child to satisfy his prophecy-autism, even if it's not by her because he doesn't want to kill her in childbirth. He then abducts Lyanna, with or without consent, and marries her in a polygamous marriage so she can give birth to the third head of the dragon. So Jon is legitimate, but without setting Elia or her children aside.

>>23466131
People can value things that they won't experience.

>>23464892
Liveship Traders trilogy is really good. Faarseer is just ok but I still got attached to the characters.

>>23467792
True, they uses dragonglass and helped the Last Hero for the dragonsteel sword. They are probably the ones who turned the Valyrians into dragonlords.

>>23433463
How does GRR Martin pull off such a gritty, grim and (relatively) realistic world? Normally, grimdark and dark fantasy stories are boring as fuck and ridiculously melodramatic (crap like Prince of Thorns for example). But Game of Thrones is fucking incredible despite following those same tropes. What gives?

>>23468284
There's an underlying sense of hope to it. Bad grimdark indulges itself too much and wants to bask in the glory of its edginess, ASOIAF shows how good can still prevail in nihilistic circumstances. Even though super good guys like Ned get the axe, it's the legacy he leaves behind that inspires others to continue living honorably

>>23468284
Yeah it's like the other anon said, there's an existing optimism and it isn't just 100% edge and grimdarkness. In order for the dark parts to really be stand out, you have to show those same characters happy and enjoying life in their world. You can't have a story of only highs, or a story with only lows.

Normally I wouldn't talk about the show, but I think the contrast is important in this case. In the later seasons of the show, you see the 'bleak medieval filter' get turned on. Everyone's clothes turn black and stop having color. If you go watch an episode from season 1 and then immediately watch something from season 6-8 you'll notice it. But moreover, the world gets a LOT darker after season 4 in the show and more nihilistic. The 'good and honorable guys' die and are punished for their good doing, that is, until it becomes a straight up good vs evil show after Jon's resurrection.

"The Grand Northern Conspiracy," which is the entire payoff for Ned's honor is cut from the show. As a result, the tone of the story takes a very nihilistic turn. The hope in the world that we see in ADWD comes from events like seeing that Ned's honor didn't die with him. It's STILL remembered and honored, through Robb and his other children. Ned's honor cost him his life, but it won him generational loyalty. "The North Remembers" is the payoff. That it wasn't all in vain. That these people are going to risk everything to save fArya and baby Rickon. You take that away from the story, and it just becomes another generic grimdark edgefest where no good deeed goes unpunished. Being honorable is a double-edged sword, just like 'fighting dirty' is. The Lannisters morals got them gains in the short term but with long term consequences, while the Starks' morality lost in the short term but with consequential gains in the future.

>>23468349
Very good example with the grand northern conspiracy. It adds layers to it, that specific characters like Jon are driven by Ned's honor on the micro scale but that also on the macro scale vast swaths of the North are honoring that legacy too

>>23468284
My take on it is that Martin is just really damn good at portraying people scheming against one another. That's at the heart of what makes the very appropriately named Game of Thrones so much fun. Different people with different motivations and different means locked in a battle royale of wits. And as an anon once pointed out to me, it's beautifully layered too. On the lowest rung you have factions playing regular 2D chess. These are the Great Houses, Lannisters, Starks, Baratheons etc. who are directly waging war over the iron throne. Then one step up you've got Varys and Littlefinger playing 3D chess. Euron is probably here too. These guys plan for the long term and bide their time. They're letting the Great Houses hack each other to pieces and wait for the opportunity to swoop in and install their choses candidate. But then there's another step up and you got entities like Bloodraven and the Others whose machinations span centuries, playing 4D chess as it were. Seeing all these tangled schemes within schemes unfold is not something you get to see very often. Too bad it also seems to be Martin's undoing in the end because it became too much to juggle, but even what we get is impressive regardless.

But I'll agree with the other two anons that it probably helps that the scheming isn't just masterfully crafted, there's also still some goodness in the world despite the ubiquitous backstabbing. Not all factions are the same but with a different coat of paint, not all are just powerhungry assholes, so there are some you can reasonably root for and who have a shot at achieving their goals too.

If Euron is the Griffith of Ice and Fire then who is the Guts equivalent?

>>23469044
Victorian. If counting people he doesn't know than the Hound 100%

>>23468284
How is ASOIAF grimdark? This shit isn't dark souls bro, its more like elden ring... ffs stop throwing words around, it makes you sound retarded. Also low fantasy would be the adequate term (tho i can understand some people calling it dark fantasy).

>>23469061
This. On my second reread I didn't know why it was considered grimdark. The story's a lot more hopeful than what the initial layer seems to present or what reddit fans would lead you to believe. Obviously, the story is very dark and where it left off in ADWD is a harsh spot but I wouldn't say grimdark.

I don't know anything about WH40k, but I imagine the difference is that its world is actually dark not just the novels. The world of ASOIAF as read in the source material isn't all that bleak compared with real history, it's just that the main series is set during a particularly bloody civil war.

Tybolt Lannister

That's it, that's the post

>>23470007
Brothers really are more trouble than they're worth.

you can fuck ONE asoiaf female.
WHOMSTW?

>>23470461
Rohanne Webber

>>23468265
>They are probably the ones who turned the Valyrians into dragonlords.
I don’t think the children of the forest are aquatic fish men rapists

Was re-reading the scene where Davos learns about the history of White Harbor and Wolf's Den how the Starks had a strong connection there maybe if Winterfell is beyond saving then Rickon could temporarily be housed there for safekeeping until Winterfell is resotred to its former glory?

>>23469056

I'd say Victarion reminds me more of

>>23470461
>>23470647
Dacey Mormont so it can be me on the left

>>23470461
For me it's Jeyne Westerling. A girl who is so loyal that she remains committed even after your death and when her family are trying to turn her against you.
Also, Catelyn's POV mentions five times that Jeyne has good hips, which is George's way of saying that she has the best ass in Westeros.

>>23471209

Was meant to say Victarion reminds me a little more of Grunbeld than he does Guts I completely get the comparison between The Hound and Gut though

It's actually over. Winds of Winter is just going to be giant slow burn worldbuilding book like Dance and Feast. What a waste

>>23471398
Who cares what kind of book it is at this point? People would gladly read any continuation of the story.

>>23471683
I care. I'm not really interested in le worldbuilding for a world that's finished as soon as the next book is released. I want to see what happens to my favorite characters and their storylines as much as he can possibly progress them in a single book.

>>23436108
Do nothing and hope I can one ride of the fucking dragons. if bastard faggots like Rhaenyra's mutts can ride dragons, I probably will too. Drogo dies, marry her and pop a son out of her and then kill her once we conquer Westeros. Proceed to marry both Margery and Sansa. I'll fuck Sansa on top of Joffrey's corpse (I'll keep him alive until our wedding night).

>>23472064
Oh right and make Cersei watch next to Jaime's corpse. Maybe have her finger Sansa's bum for old time sake.

The Lengii are a tall people who live over subterranean mazes on the island of Leng.

The Lorathi Mazemakers were a tall people who built mazes on the coasts of Lorath.

Is there a connection?

>>23472105
Humans were taller/longer back then, and were probably used as breeding stock for something abominable and aberrant from the seas, and forced into slave labour.

>>23472105
https://youtu.be/TQl16mRvq6E?si=QkICZTpmWMhr_QWl

>>23472105
Leng is right next to Asshai too…

>>23434487
>Lands of always green
Kek

>>23436201
What was Illyrio's plan for Viserys anyway? He allegedly wept over Viserys fucking things up, but then he basically let Viserys march straight into a lion's den without protection. Prince Doran also implies that there were plans to marry Viserys to his daughter to seal the Targ-Martell alliance in the upcoming invasion of Westeros. But the mere existence of Aegon, who has been raised to be the perfect prince, entails that there never really was any place for Viserys in the post-war order as envisioned by Illyrio and Varys.

>>23472190
What readers have to understand is that GRRM had no fucking idea what Varys and Ilirio's plan was and made stuff up on the go (it still makes no fucking sense). Including fAegon is the single worst decision he ever made with the series.

>>23472166
>>23472105

There has to be some connection between Squishers, Maze Makers and Ashai.

Victarion's going to save Daenerys from the Dothraki before they get a chance to murder/rape her this is what causes their romance to bloom

>>23472274
not the most unlikely thing to happen to be honest

>>23472278

I wonder how Daenery's is going to react to Victarion's hand that will no doubt be interesting to see especially if it does something interesting with her dragons.

>>23468080
based

>>23471278
then a book later, from Jaime's POV:
She did not look dangerous. Jeyne was a willowy girl, no more than fifteen or sixteen, more awkward than graceful. She had narrow hips, breasts the size of apples, a mop of chestnut curls, and the soft brown eyes of a doe. Pretty enough for a child, Jaime decided, but not a girl to lose a kingdom for. Her face was puffy, and there was a scab on her forehead, half-hidden by a lock of brown hair.

>>23472308
She'll see Victarion's hand as evidence for R'hllor's power and as reminiscent of her own fire miracle. I think Dany is meant to accept or become involved with the religion as part of her messiah complex.

>>23472190
doran makes plans to marry baby viserys to arienne with Willem Darry

Then Willem Darry gets killed, Viserys and Dany run away

Then years later, after running around the free cities a bit, they fell into the clutches of Illyrio. then Illyrio makes his plans to use Viserys as a sacrificial pawn to attack westeros with a dothraki army.

if it was a master plan to use viserys and dany from the time of Aerys' fall, then his actions dont make sense. However, if it was a stroke of luck that Illyrio hears the beggar king is in pentos and just scoops him up, it adds up a bit better.

belwas *says* that Illyrio wept, but belwas was employed by illyrio and probably realizes its his job to speak highly of him.

>>23472394
Ilirio thinking Viserys could in any way convince anyone of anything after a whole year of hosting him is retarded beyond belief. Besides isn't it also known the golden company rejected him during the greyjoy rebellion, what support would he have with an army of barbarians?

>>23472342
>Pretty enough for a child, Jaime decided, but not a girl to lose a kingdom for.
Keep in mind that Jaime would probably say that about any woman who isn't Cersei.

>>23472190
To sow sedition and dissent. Nothing more, nothing less. If it seems chaotic it is because they are actually, constantly adapting "the plan" which is finally putting a Blackfyre in the throne. For all his talk of serving the realm, which in all fairness he does, Varys (and Illyrio) were going to kick start a war had not Joffrey killed Ned. Long live Aegon Blackfyre first of his name, King of the Andals, the Rhoynar, and the First Men.

>>23472569
What's so important about getting a Blackfyre on the throne?

>>23472268
Deep ones, fish folk, squishers, merlings, whatever you want to calm them. They’re responsible for all the oily black stone.

>>23472657
something something illyrio's wife and varys are blackfyres

>>23472657
What's so important about getting a Blackfyre on the throne? Nothing, for them is personal >>23472971

>>23472971
>>23473083
That's kinda gay, I was hoping that Varys is more principled than that. But if his endgame really is Blackfyre ascencion, that makes him just another petty "no MY family deserves the iron throne!" faggot. As if we didn't already have enough of those.

>>23471278
>good hips
>>23472342
>narrow hips

so which is it?

>>23473531
the only explanation is cercei has a gigantic wubba lubba badonkadonk and jeyne's looks narrow in comparison to jaime. I have to trust baby-machine catelyn's judgement on this one

I hate how I've forgotten everything and will need to reread the series before the next book comes out

>>23473539

>>23459252
It kinda sucks but in a good way. It's probably a series you should have read when you were 15. It's super slow but super comfy. Less intrigue and meta-context than ASOIAF

>>23473531
Jamie is colored of being cunt struck by Cersei, so he'll automatically think any other woman is inferior

>>23473531
George fucked up.

>>23473539
>>23473569
>>23473655
Being a particular Catelyn hater, my headcanon is that her initial assessenent is pure cope with the fact that Robb is stuck with the girl, when in truth she was likely to die giving birth.

>>23474052
pretty embarrassing, if it was me i'd pretend i did it on purpose and change the plot.

>>23470461
Penny - she's fun size :)
but honestly Brienne I put her twat is tight as a noose

>>23474266
Brienne fucks you

>>23473539
>baby-machine catelyn
Kek. Never thought of her this way, but it's so true. I remember reading AGoT for the first time, and being taken aback during Catelyn's first chapter. In literally one of her first pages, she internally talks about how she wishes she could give Ned another kid. She has literally already given him five healthy kids, three sons and two girls. I guess all of the Tully fertility genetics got taken by Catelyn, and Lysa got jack shit.
So if anyone is a good judge of a girl's fertility and childbearing potential, it has got to be Catelyn. If Catelyn says that Jeyne has good hips, then that girl is probably bottom-heavy as fuck and built to pump out like eleven little Starks.

>>23474397
>I guess all of the Tully fertility genetics got taken by Catelyn, and Lysa got jack shit
I'm pretty sure Lysa's reproductive system is fucked up from her abortion but I might be misremembering

>>23474397
Catelyn is definitely a high-fertility and very genetically fit woman. Shit, all of her kids except for Ayra look nothing like Starks and everything like Tullys. They are also all good looking and healthy kids. Robb inspires men to crown him king as a fucking teenager. Sansa is supposed to be the great beauty of the realm. Catelyn became pregnant with Robb after just one night with Ned. That woman must have ovaries of steel. Ned's sperm never stood a chance.

>>23474052
It’s POV. The conflicting accounts work.

>>23470461
Probably either Jeyne or Sansa

>>23474940
GRRM straight up said that it was a mistake. Subsequent editions have fixed the mistake.

What could Ned Stark's missing bones do in the story?

>>23475347
Rattleshirt turns out to be alive, and through an ancient loophole in the North's legal code, he becomes Lord of Winterfell and Lord Paramount of the North by wearing Ned's bones.

>>23475347
Maybe just a tiny bit of closure knowing that at least his remains are where they should be in Winterfell's crypts.
GRRM won't allow that to happen though because it's a miseryporn story. That bitch that hates Ned will probably get them and they'll end up being Ramsay's dog bones or some shit

>>23475331
I don’t care. If he never said it was a mistake it still wouldn’t fucking matter.

new
>>23475904
>>23475904
>>23475904
>>23475904