/lit/ - Literature

I mosey on in to the book vending cuboid which appears rather busy today; the incessant bleating in what should be a privatized library is nothing short of maddening. Someone must’ve left the stables open on accident.

I am here seeking a tome which might momentarily pierce my robust intellect as I’ve found most cerebral pursuits throughout this endeavor we call life rather mundane, and my neurology is yearning for sustenance as the thirsty wanderer craves an oasis. Unfortunately, however, my already jaded senses are abruptly assaulted by a high occurrence frequency (occurrences per square second) of trivial genre fiction. The wasted ink would’ve found better use in children’s spin art. Frustrated, I approach the man behind the counter who I’ve deduced is some sort of customer support representative.

Excuse me, do you have anything for someone with a tested 130 vci?

A what?

A 130 vci.

What’s that?

Ohhh boy. This one might take a while *looks around, chuckles*.
A 130 verbal IQ, as measured by the Wechsler Adult Intelligence Scale. A score of 130 on the verbal comprehension index puts me in the 98th percentile for all living human beings, or homo erecti, as I like to say.

Sorry sir, I don’t understand what you're asking exactly.

*Chuckles some more* No problem, it’s not your fault after all. It’s just that I’ve perused the inventory of your little shop here and the materials presented look rather… cursory. I’m looking for something that might prove challenging to my rather formidable cognitive apparatus, and I’ve experienced the utmost disappointment in this effort. For instance, the marked absence of Richard Dawkins is truly chilling.

Oh. Ummmm… Well if you’re looking for something challenging we do have a philosophy section.

Ah yes, philosophy. I was made to read Plato in university. His Republic was simply adorable. But no, I’m looking for something more scientifically inclined, or couched in logic and reason if you will. Something by Sam Harris, perhaps?

Sorry sir, we don’t have any titles by that author.

Alas, just because one deals in books does not necessarily mean one deals in knowledge I suppose.

Sorry about that. Is there something else I can help you with?

No no, you’ve tried your best. Thanks anyway.

Now isn’t that funny, he wants to know if he can help me. Surely I can’t be the first one to notice the extent to which comedy so often finds its roots in the absurd. He mustn’t have meant any harm by this remark and yet our interaction has left me with little more than an unsavory aftertaste. Curse this communication gap that so often rears its ugly head.

Although the excursion into the rubbish-ridden reading retailer proved wholly unfulfilling, even the feeblest of minds realize there’s no utility in pouting over pasteurized product. Hopefully the messenger bag vendor has better things in store.

If genre fiction is so wrong, what should I write about? Two people drinking tea?

>>23404688
Why are you letting other people tell you what to write?

>>23400554
for a professional editor? $1200 a book. but if you can't afford it, reply to this and I can cut you a break

>>23404688
Don't let the lit-fic seethers get to you. Not one of them has posted any of their own writing. And the one that did (K.K. Wing, "The Beautiful Kingdom") wasn't a seether. Write whatever you feel like.

>>23404698
Why are you being a fucking moron?
>>23404821
Just because they haven’t shared their work with your retards doesn’t mean they’re not right. They just know not to throw pearls before swine.

>>23404759
what's your fiverr page again? I haven't decided whether I'm gonna let someone publish my litrpg or do it myself, so I may or may not need an editor. tbd

>>23404901
Bait used to be believable
Unfortunately this thread is especially gullible, so you're still gonna get serious (you)s

I was watching a video and the guy said stories are about change and the MC must change for the story to be good. Then I thought of all the movies I've seen where the character doesn't change and are still 10/10s, like Ghostbusters.

I only bring it up because my story takes place over the course of less than a week and my MC doesn't change, because unless you're going through a 9/11 scenario no one changes that fast.

>>23404913
I think it ultimately depends on the kind of story. If the story is about your character, then yeah, there should probably be some kind of change. But if you look at Poirot books, there's really not a lot of change involved in any character, and especially not Poirot, because the story isn't about him, it's about the crime.

>>23404901
>your
you*

>>23404905
https://www.fiverr.com/matthewg42

We offer coupons and custom offers, so most clients don't pay full price

>>23404821
>Book overview
>The Gold Rush is over, but the lure of riches tempt Fei-Ming to abandon his homeland of China to the Kingdom of the West; America. Working as a coalminer, Fei-Ming befriends Hutchinson Callaway, a Dixie fleeing the destruction of Civil War, and Montgomery Antelmann, a Yankee with a mysterious past. There the three men forge an unlikely friendship in California and together navigate the climate of a 19th century San Francisco. Armed only with the stubborn belief of self-determination and united by friendship, the three find their version of The American Dream.

https://www.amazon.com/Beautiful-Kingdom-K-K-Wing/dp/B0BTRTBP5H?dplnkId=0e1b2ff9-41cb-42e1-8128-7663759b7164

Lol someone actually wrote a non schizo, non incel, non fantasy story here? And shared it? Color me surprised. Which begs the question, why didn't he try to traditionally publish it?

>>23404984
He did. He didn't get any bites. (IIRC)
I think one agent told him it straight up was too offensive or something. I might be misremembering though, this was a while ago

>>23404984
>two 5* reviews
>open up sample chapter
>it's actually competently written save an error or two
What do agents want? He probably needed to shop it around more

>>23405008
>What do agents want?
It's really not hard to understand: something that sells. Like you, me, and everyone else, agents want a way to buy a house and pay for their kid's tuition.

>>23405008
is he actually chinese? agents might nope out of a white guy writing about chinese immigrants

>>23405016
>It's really not hard to understand: something that sells
then why do they all request stories about lgbt minorites with disabilities? i'm pretty sure that doesn't actually sell.

>>23405021
That was probably the problem

>>23405031
Because you have brain rot and like to consume rage bait in the form of the most outrageous agent profiles
If you actually browse through agents in your genre they'll usually describe the types of stories they want, then there will be a throwaway line like "and also we love diversity of all types, so BIPOC, LGBT, etc is highly welcome!" But it's almost always just one or two throwaway lines whereas the rest of the agent profile is talking about the real shit they want

>>23405061
you don't know how these people operate if you think the diversity thing is just for show and they "really" want a white guy to send them a story about white guys. it would be very refreshing if they were merely two-faced, but these are typically narcissists that believe their own lies. it's not a rational thing at all.

>>23405098
How about you go look at what's actually getting published and put onto shelves? And selling? It's not the shit you're talking about. Those books aren't manifesting out of thin air. Agents are accepting and pushing them to publishers.

>>23404994
>it straight up was too offensive or something
It must have had a white man somewhere in it. Sad that's all it takes these days to get you shut down. I say the word Indian in my manuscript and I will not budge. It stays.

>>23400554
>>23404759
What's red pill on editors?
Can you have multiples? I wouldn't trust one person, but if I hire 10 people to review the book and 3 of them all have the same critique I'd take it seriously so long as 3+ of the others didn't praise the thing the first 3 critiqued.

I'll start plotting the next one today so the dread doesn't have time to set in.

>>23405193
I think in general the more is better, it just comes down to how many you can afford. There was that anon a couple weeks ago who's editor wanted a full re-write with a change in MC, etc. That's not what an editor should be doing. They should be working to make yours better, not turning it into theirs.

What I wonder is okay, you hire one, you do the changes. Now do you have to pay again to get the final draft re-checked or is it included in the first price?

>>23404688
duh i dunno. what kinds of things have authors been writing about for thousands of years? thats right, video game novels.

>>23405212
>What I wonder is okay, you hire one, you do the changes. Now do you have to pay again to get the final draft re-checked or is it included in the first price?
Probably the first option. I mean you're basically asking them to do the work twice.

>manuscript will never be picked up by a publisher
>too short
>I'm an unknown
>it's not a "hot" genre
>look at self publishing
>need a developmental editor
>need a copy editor
>need a formatter
>need a graphic designer
>$2000 minimum, probably more with tax and tip
>book will sell 3 copies

>>23405257
>set price at $1000 per book
>that's 50% profit
>amazing
>you are now a successful author
>repeat until rich

>>23404675
cliche, hacky, boring, mean spirited, no attempt to actually investigate the psyche of your character in an evenhanded manner, not funny

>>23405257
>2000$ minimum, probably more
>book will sell 3 copies
This is why agents and publishers are the way they are, by the way

>>23405257
Don't forget buying ISBNs and barcodes.

>Writing low-fantasy story (gods exist, but very soft magic)
>One character is very autistic about hating them (gods don't give a shit just like you wouldn't give a shit if an ant made rude gestures at you)
>Toy with the idea of giving him a sort of mechanical compass (sorta like a pocket watch version of pic related, except with things like Passion, Truth, Hunger, Secret, and Silence, name pendings) so he can constantly checks if he's following the tenets of any god in particular and if he is, go against them
>If I make the compass magical in itself I explicitly makes him rely on a tool crafted using what he hates, and I think he's much too seething about gods for that
>If I don't make it magical it's a weird gizmo he carries around but I need to make it simple enough so readers don't need to overthink it

Just a small conundrum I currently have. I'll figure it out eventually, I just like talking about it online, it usually help me when I'm stuck.

>>23405319
Just make it clear the character views the object like a compass, which responds to a magnetic field, but isn't "powered" by it. So your gizmo just "reacts" to godly powers, but isn't fueled by them. Obviously that's just a matter of framing, but I don't think readers would scrutinize the reasoning too hard. Seems believable to me.
Barring that, you could frame the character's desire to annoy the gods as greater than being reliant on an object pseudo-powered by them. He could be mildly annoyed but more than willing to use it if it means avoiding their tenets.

>>23405350
That's interesting but in my setting there's only the gods and that's it, nothing is supernatural that doesn't have their uttermost source in them. And when you have something like the God of Physical (as in, atoms combining into molecules) Phenomenons it's hard to remove yourself from them completely. That's part of why he's very angry, but since anger is also the domain of another god, he's trying to keep it in check. Except there's also a god of balance and neutrality so he can't even lay very still in a room meditating.
The idea I have is that he's manually turning the dials based on the day he's having and the temptations he experiences. If he gives in to a great buffet, he turns the Hunger Dial up, and the next day he eats frugally and turn it down. And if later that week he wants to eat a buffet again he saves up by not giving into his hunger early on so he has a "stock" to go through. He can't get them all but he can sort of... circle around them so they don't catch up without getting in each other's way. Like you need to actually spin the plate to keep it on the stick.

>>23405098
Here's a video of an all-too-typical agent, coming up with threadbare reasons to reject submissions: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aduzco1VJZE
>>23405141
When we try to discuss what's actually getting published, put onto shelves, and selling, litfic seethers shit all over us. There's no way to win here.
>>23405170
No, part of it involved an angry mob seething against immigrants, and I believe the N word was used.
>>23405302
Amazon gives you a free ISBN and barcode if you publish a paperback version with them.

>>23405418
I can't tell if the guy in the video is real or someone doing a parody.

>>23405257
>need a developmental editor
>need a copy editor
>need a formatter
>need a graphic designer
only the last one is really true in terms of getting sales, and even there you might get away with doing it yourself if you have basic skills.

>>23405418
>historical fiction in the 1800's
>not using the word nigger
The fuck?

>start webnovel
>5 chapters in
>Getting popular
>Thousands of views
>Comments
>Reviews
>High ratings
>Suddenly feel too much pressure to preform and stop writing.

Such is life

>>23405503
Many such cases

>>23405435
it's real and it's not even unreasonable. after going through 100,000s of these submissions you would also develop similar instincts. guess what, a guy who drones on about what an amazing life he's had and says nothing about the book is probably a waste of time

>>23405668
>guy who drones on about what an amazing life he's had and says nothing about the book is probably a waste of time
He's just being friendly and personable to gain favor with the agent. The guy should at least one page of his manuscript before deciding its trash just based on a cover letter.

>barbarian prince is captured by empire that they have regular skirmishes with
>forcibly married to an Empire princess
What might be some ways she'd seduce him in prison?

What would be some reasons a princess of a civilized people want to marry an unwashed savage?

>>23405726
>What would be some reasons a princess of a civilized people want to marry an unwashed savage?
Big dick aura

>>23405714
>He's just being friendly and personable to gain favor with the agent.
boasting about how cool and interesting you are is not friendly, it's narcissistic. to actually gain favor with the agent he should have looked at the situation from the agent's perspective and provided him with useful information.

>The guy should at least one page of his manuscript before deciding its trash just based on a cover letter.
again, the agent has seen 100000 of these already. he's making a character judgement from the way the guy presents himself, and it's probably accurate, than manuscript is 99.9% likely to be boring as shit. people are not unique, they fall into types. it's like a woman that can tell you're an anxious wimp from just the way you walk up to her, before you even say a word.

I'm trying to write scifi after reading Alastair Reynolds. I clearly have a long way to go. I was told that I should put mire exposition and stop using unexplained Jargon, but I'm confused as this would be the first page, so it makes sense to not immediately hold the readers hand. Thoughts?

“Immeasurable. Absolute. Fortified. Yet maintains a saccharine and vibrant atmosphere?“ the Magnoid ponders. “Would you consider this plausible?“ the windbreaker clad gentlemen asks. “IM” snorts the magnoid. “Your so called bachelor pad is 2.5 Kilometers along all axes, kept afloat by the strongest modern propulsors. Where would we land this to even begin our work? Is the size not enough of a deterrent for any would be criminals? There are too many variables to consider here, Vox.“

“Mighlin, Did you not receive a 45 million Vellat payment BEFORE THE MEETING? Do I seem like I enjoy lightening my accounts by one one thousandth out of pleasure? Do the job, doesn't matter how long it takes, solve those variables, and you'll receive the other 55 Million Vellai upon completion.“

“The attitude is unnecessary, place yourself in abeyance and I may consider contemplating where to begin.“

“Thats all I wanted to hear. One moment while I set up the gateway.“ snapping his left middle finger and thumb, a swirl of ultramarine nothingness appears in front of him. Placing his right palm in the center of the swirl, a door seemingly made of frosted glass opens itself. Within it lies a seaside room, he takes one step in. “Yo Migh, rough estimate?“

“Assuming I start any time soon, about 55 years.“

Vox pulls a small blue and white marblesque orb and tosses it towards Mighlin. A Chromium palm shoots towards the orb, catching it gently. “Vox, just because you produce these things doesn't mean you should be reckless.“

“I appreciate your concern, Migh. Fortunately they do not shatter unless meant to. Now… shatter that one once you're done.“ Placing his other foot inside the doorway, the doors frame vibrates into an ultramarine swirl, returning to nothingness.

>>23405141
>How about you go look at what's actually getting published and put onto shelves?
male writers who started their careers 10+ years ago, women and minorities

I'm trying to write scifi after reading Alastair Reynolds. I clearly have a long way to go. I was told that I should put mire exposition and stop using unexplained Jargon, but I'm confused as this would be the first page, so it makes sense to not immediately hold the readers hand. Thoughts?

“Immeasurable. Absolute. Fortified. Yet maintains a saccharine and vibrant atmosphere?“ the Magnoid ponders. “Would you consider this plausible?“ the windbreaker clad gentlemen asks. “IM” snorts the magnoid. “Your so called bachelor pad is 2.5 Kilometers along all axes, kept afloat by the strongest modern propulsors. Where would we land this to even begin our work? Is the size not enough of a deterrent for any would be criminals? There are too many variables to consider here, Vox.“

“Mighlin, Did you not receive a 45 million Vellat payment BEFORE THE MEETING? Do I seem like I enjoy lightening my accounts by one one thousandth out of pleasure? Do the job, doesn't matter how long it takes, solve those variables, and you'll receive the other 55 Million Vellai upon completion.“

“The attitude is unnecessary, place yourself in abeyance and I may consider contemplating where to begin.“

“Thats all I wanted to hear. One moment while I set up the gateway.“ snapping his left middle finger and thumb, a swirl of ultramarine nothingness appears in front of him. Placing his right palm in the center of the swirl, a door seemingly made of frosted glass opens itself. Within it lies a seaside room, he takes one step in. “Yo Migh, rough estimate?“

“Assuming I start any time soon, about 55 years.“

Vox pulls a small blue and white marblesque orb and tosses it towards Mighlin. A Chromium palm shoots towards the orb, catching it gently. “Vox, just because you produce these things doesn't mean you should be reckless.“

“I appreciate your concern, Migh. Fortunately they do not shatter unless meant to. Now… shatter that one once you're done.“ Placing his other foot inside the doorway, the doors frame vibrates into an ultramarine swirl, returning to nothingness.

>>23404901
serious (you)

>>23405857
come back when you have two chapters

>>23405939
I'm still working on it, I'd just like your thoughts/critique on this one page

>>23405956
You got my hopes up this was porn.

>>23405726
>What would be some reasons a princess of a civilized people want to marry an unwashed savage?
Punish daddy for not getting the pony years earlier or looking at her wrong for fucking Ty'Ron or whatever your fantasy equivalent for niggers is

>>23404635
I love writing so much bros

>>23404635
Actually this one comes first, read this one first, then the one above, then the one after

>>23404635
3/3

>>23404635
2/3
Sorry I'm drunk and I forgot which order I posted shit in

Bros, how do I get this metaphor to work? I can visualize it and want to compare her ears to that of a cat's, but it sounds clunky.

>Jenny's ears perked up like a cat's when it hears a bird.
>Jenny's cat-like ears perked up on hearing about a bird.
>Jenny's ears perked up, cat-like, at the mention of a bird.

>>23406122
>At the mention of a bird, Jenny's cat-like ears perked up.
Maybe I'm retarded, or you're just over thinking it.

Could you critique my writing?
>>23405857

>>23406138
I'll critique yours if you critique mine

>>23406150
Well, which one is yours?

>>23406122
>Like a cat who is alerted to nearby prey, Jenny’s ears perked up to the sound of [blacked porn on another passenger’s phone]
Replace the last clause with whatever you want.
I’m American, btw.

>>23406155
The three screenshots above. Sorry I posted them out of order but I'm sure you can figure it out

>>23406164
One change id personally make out of the first image:
>She was born in the midst of those who were powerful, drank from its breasts, and bathed within its perpetuity
And "of power" seems almost redundant based on the previous statement.

Well written otherwise. Unfortunately it seems to be either Victorian era fantasy or steampunk, I'm personally not intrigued by such things, although it was quite well written.

>>23406173
I'm very Tolstoyan. Admittedly the shit I sent is a result of my first draft and my unedited daily writing sessions. But I'm vain and I like to know what people think of my stuff.

>>23406076
What have you written?

>>23406180
Ahh, that makes sense. I could never get into period pieces, my mom would love your writing though. Im pure science fiction. Although I started recently, I too like to know what people think of my writing.

Please review mine

>male character (my self-insert) has to initiate conversation with a cute female his age
>drawing a blank on what he says for the last two hours
I don't think "sweatingman.jpg" is good dialogue.

>>23406201
What is the context in which he is initiating the convo?

Is royalroad a good place to post horror/mystery?

>>23406052
>0 mention of black people
>Pic is of a Conan like barbarian
Why the fuck do black people end up becoming the subject

>>23406227
royalroad is a litrpg and cultivation website. at a minimum it has to be power fantasy of some flavor.

so no

>>23406237
...will a gunslinger MC fulfill the power fantasy condition or no..?

>>23406229
Wasn't James Earl Jones in one of the Conan movies?

I feel like the color of my writing background heavily affects my inclination to write. A black and white background makes it better to develop suspense or serious moments, meanwhile a matte background makes it easier to draft an adventure. Am I being a schizo or this actually true? Try it out for yourself and tell me how it went.

>>23406090
>>23406093
>>23406083
pretty cool. what's the summary/pitch? this isn't lesbian-aristocracy-anon, is it? the prose is different iirc.

>>23406239
Is it a power fantasy involving a gun slinger? Or there's just a gun slinger?
Even if it's a power fantasy, it's starting from behind because it's not litrpg/cultivation/progfantasy.
Probably just seek tradpub

>>23406229
It's 4chan
There's always one of them around

>>23405726
Women love a bad boy

>>23405726
>>23406350
It's literally the romance interest archetype of 1 out of 2 female stories out there, the other being the misunderstood playboy.

>>23406350
>>23406362
I guess if her options are
>Savage close to her age that has control over big territory
>Old noble fuck in some random keep
She'd pick the savage.

But what about seduction techniques? I wanted the barbarian to be very antagonistic to her at first.

How much does it cost to pay someone to narrate your story into an audiobook? Where do you even find these people?

>>23404635
Not a period piece, actually cyberpunk-ish in a world of my design. But thanks! I saw your post in the last /wg/. So the biggest issue I have with it is, first of all, the fact you only posed a small snippet which makes it hard to look at things like prose and character. However, going off of what you posted, and given your love for Alastair Reynolds, I can see you love the jargon-loaded prose that he's known for.

In my opinion, even if you're writing hard sci-fi, there still needs to be a human component to the text that transcends the jargon loaded prose that a lot of the authors in this genre are known for. The thing that will seperate you from this rest is relying less on appealing to those sorts of people, and instead focusing on universal truths like character, allusions to greater texts and history and simple, basic facets of human existence (fear of death, Oedipus etc) rather than overloading the reader with terminology that filters anybody out of the know. Idk i am drunk and I can give more in depth feedback if you post more.

>>23406253
This is lesbian aristocracy but also much much more. It's incredibly spiritual. I am the guy that posts a lot of it. However, I am trying to be a bit more plot focused. Believe it or not I listen to the feedback people give me in /wg/ and here, although it's a first draft, I tried to be a bit more active.

Pitchwise, in the simplest wording possible, given its absurd length and depth: picrel. Although this is a very VERY badly worded description of everything that happens.

>>23406385
>
More than you'd pay for an editor. These audiobook narrators are not worth the trouble unless you've got a friend there.

>>23406386
Ahhh, that seems more my style then, I look forward to more of your work. And thank you for the genuine feedback. I'll put it to good use.

Every time I write I just can't capture the feeling of a different person speaking even with flairs. Is it time to dumb down their vocabulary?

>>23406402
if your book is selling well then having it narrated is definitely worth it. audiobook sales are a big portion of an author's profit in certain genres and is def worth the investment

obviously, if you aren't even selling books yet don't have it narrated -.-

>>23406201
Just get a girl to write it for you. I had a reader tell me my dialogue made my MC come off as a manipulative rapist. When I wrote it the intent was he was slightly nervous and trying to ease into the conversation with small talk before bringing up the topic of what he wanted. I guess that made him "predatory", in their words.

Can anyone recommend some novels that write on cars and driving in a beautiful or at least interesting way? Cars seem to generally fall into this category of objects that are either a completely practical consideration that is given virtually no attention, or they're written about in autistic detail that quickly becomes tedious. Firearms are often the same way.

>>23405503
>shit out chapter 1
>throw it up for that sweet dopamine hit
>wow, people like it!
>uh oh...
I'm glad you failed. I hope you learned something from the experience, but I severely doubt it

>>23406489
thats what characterization is for. you dont need to make characters talk a certain way to differentiate them. a reader can tell who is talking just with context and knowing how one behaves and reacts by pre established actions and dialogue, like being agitated with something specific or indifferent to a subject matter.
You can set up these things to allow the reader to draw those connections themselves, whichout needing to incessantly guide them

>>23405503
that pressure is called, "not actually having anything else planned after" isnt it

>>23405503
When in doubt, just write smut.

I'm starting to think web novels are a dead end. I made more money from 1 person reading three of my books on KU than I made from 20,000 people reading my web novel on RR. Feels retarded to give away works for free and beg for donations, when you can be paid per page upfront

anyone who is struggling to get started should consider writing slop or smut. w/ all the built in expectations/tropes acting as guidelines, it's like coloring in a coloring book. you can just dive in and practice writing. hopefully you understand the structure of what you're writing though.

>>23406820
how many books do you think you could you pump out a year?

>>23406832
I've been consistently doing three since 2017.

>>23406836
was originally going to ask if you think you could do ~3 books a year. so, yea. right on.

What is the consensus on brand names in fiction? I got this line

>Reluctantly leaving the interstate, Jackson followed the ramp onto the overpass and headed for the town center. Expectation became reality when he was met with a Burger King, a Motel 6, and a Chevron station that shared its parking with a drive-thru coffee kiosk. What else could be expected of a rural mountain town?

I could change it to "Rapid Burger" or something generic but it's set in Washington state and I think Burger King will help the reader connect.

>>23406853
as long as you're purposely making that decision, either way is fine. and both ways are used.
i don't believe you need to name names here, and it might even distract the reader, for little return.

>>23406853
Why would adding a burger king make the setting of "Washington State" more believable? It's a worldwide restaurant chain, there's no one on earth who associates burger king with Washington State specifically

>>23406890
I just mean the setting is reality, Earth. Not some fantasy land. I guess Burger King is more associated with low income areas like a backwoods town versus a Black Angus Steakhouse.

>>23406836
damn. the quality must've dipped hard. I'd ask for a sample but I already know what to expect already

How do I get inspiration bro's? I've got a book inside me but can't get it out.

What do I do with short stories? I have a bunch of them. I don't care about money but I want to get exposure

>>23404984
>non fantasy story here?
Do I count if it's bronze age dark fantasy, informed by history?

>>23407044
AO3.

>>23406922
With every new book I write, I raise the bar for quality higher, and with each book I exceed it. Brainlets couldn't understand

>>23407011
Have you tried going to the bathroom? Maybe take a laxative beforehand.

>>23407011
try taking adderall but use it only on the weekends and try to hit a 10k word target each weekend for 10 weeks, go off it for a month then reread your shit and see if it was worth it

>>23407570
My writing is most productive when I am thinking in the bathroom, but sitting on the toilet or standing in the shower for too long pretty much destroys my back.

>>23406669
No I have it planned out. Getting my plot points to match my theming is the hardest part.
>>23406754
(but I do)

>>23407753
What's your theme? A theme is basically the motivation behind your character's actions, or the consequence. So plot points should be written with that in mind. At the end of the book, the motivations and consequences of the protagonist should match the overarching theme.

>>23407087
>bronze age dark fantasy
>Fantasy
What do you think?

>>23406820
I mean 20,000 views on RR is low, though? You can get 10-50x that in like the first month or two of posting if you write something that trends--and that's the nature of web serials; you have to trend. There's new authors there who start posting their story and 30 days later have a $10,000/month patreon lol

KDP/KU will probably give you a higher minimum base, yes, since you get auto money from page reads and purchases. But if you're writing in the right genre, web serials are crazy lucrative right now. Even trad pub is starting to put eyes on litrpgs and such. Dungeon Crawler Carl just got signed by one, I believe. A bunch are being turned into web comics and shit.

>Feels retarded to give away works for free and beg for donations
Don't need to beg. Literally just post an announce "hey I made a patreon" and if your story is popular, and you offer advance chapters, you'll blow up
Of course, you have to be popular first. People have to like your writing enough to want to pay for it. But that's a requirement in any form of publishing, beyond the pennies you get for a few page reads on KU.

This is a weird question, about is there a guide anywhere on how to describe the shape of boobs?

>>23407794
Loss of "natural" spirituality and the consequences of losing its unspoken laws that keep balance is one of the main themes I'm looking to explore. At the same time I want interesting fantasy scenarios that are solved with clever solutions. Like actually clever, so it takes me a while to design them.

>>23407864
NTA. I think this sort of thing kills your creativity; on demand writing sort of requires you to open up a community on discord and pander to them and their whims, its no different from having a youtube channel. I think writers and readers should be separate, otherwise it stops being an honest form of self-expression and transforms into personalized propaganda. I just can't see myself doing it especially since I write because I think something needs to be said and not because of some consumerist excuse. On the other hand, there is some sort of pressure within to pander my writing to these genres but once i start doing it, I won't be able to finish my current work and I fear the corrosive effects of this sort of practice will contaminate my true need for expression. It's certainly very tempting indeed.

>>23407876
Unironically look into the menwritingwomen shit on what not to do (or inspiration, depending on what you are going for)

>>23407906
That doesn't seem too difficult. Most if not all your character interactions should climax on this kind of theme. Their conflicts should be based around it and the interesting scenarios should be a close second. Otherwise what you are getting stuck on is on your writing priorities.

>>23407913
>on demand writing sort of requires you to open up a community on discord and pander to them and their whims
Not at all dude. Sure, the more you target the widest audience's preferences, the more general appeal it has, but plenty of successful litrpgs are pretty niche/weird takes on the genre. It just has to be *in* the genre.
Stuff like the Wandering Inn is 90% slice of life and character work with dreadfully slow power progression, so it doesn't even necessarily have to be 'kill stuff get stronger'
This isn't to say you can write whatever story you want, because other people have to be interested in it. The weird schizo manifestos people post here, or like a historical fiction or a romcom or whatever else, wouldn't sell. But still, there's a decent amount of variance in what people will read within the umbrella of litrpg and cultivation, and you don't have to read comments and pander to them.
For that matter, I basically ignore my commenters. I write the story I want to write, I just use a background litrpg framework to do it.
I'm pretty flexible in what I'm happy to write about, though. I find a lot of genres cool and just enjoy telling stories. Litrpg pays best so while it's maybe not what I would write if money wasn't in the equation, it lets me write full time. So I'm super grateful for the community's existence.

>>23407942
Huh, no shit? Really?

>>23407955
You seem pretty experienced, do you only have fans for the hard LitRPG stuff though? Have you made any successful works in RR without a stat box?

>>23407985
getting sassy after you asked for help on how to write tits?

>>23407990
People in the community jokingly call it "crunchy vs creamy", where the stats + skills parts is more prominently displayed and focused on, or if it's more in the background. Both types are popular, though crunchy stories tend to be more "kill enemy and get stronger" where "creamy" stories follow more traditional storylines/don't focus as heavily on progression (as a general rule, exceptions apply like with everything)
I write somewhere in the middle, where there are stat boxes and system screens and such, but I can go 5, 10, 15 chapters where there's only a few [Inspects] to describe items or monsters or whatever and basically no stat stuff going on.
So the direct answer to your question is yes, I use stat boxes, but they can be pretty sparse. Wandering Inn (one of the biggest) doesn't use stats at all, or even skill descriptions, or even inspect screens (iirc?) so you can almost write a litrpg that's just a normal story, but people are [Level 35 Fighters] instead of "fighters who have been around for a while and seen a few things", if you get what I'm saying. It's really dealer's choice

>>23407992
That wasn't my intention. I was more trying to reply with humorous incredibility.
So go to r/menwritingwomen and sort by TopAllTime?

>>23408008
How much do you get via patreon monthly?

>>23408026
Around 4k and it's growing month by month. Haven't published to Amazon yet either which according to other authors, can be anywhere from another 50-150% of your Patreon income, depending on how well it suits the market over there. So I'm doing okay, but I'm not one of the litrpg kingpins making 7 digits lmao

>>23408031
how long did it take you to grow it to that level?

>>23408031
So is it legal to publish on the rr website and then make a book once you are done?

>>23408038
Once you're on kindle unlimited it's exclusive. So you have to take down your content from all other sites.

>>23408033
Very quickly to 3k, then slower growth since then. After you fall off Rising Stars, visibility drops immensely. The next big jump comes from Amazon, both in KDP income and additional visibility in that community. Some patreons even grow after they take down their story from RR, since the visibility from Amazon algos is a fresh new market to tap, basically

Today I finished chapter 13/25.
It's full of exposition. It's all tell and no show. I wasted today. I'm sorry.

I'm running out of steam bros... I don't have much left of the book, but the closer I get, the less I want to go on. I want to start a new story so badly now.

>>23408046
How many chapters do you post a week, and how many did you post while you were on rising stars? Finally, how long are your chapters?

>>23408008
Very insightful, so it's all a matter of emulating game-y systems, even if they're just a style choice for the story. I personally find LitRPG systems cumbersome because they add too much unnecessary clutter for this reason, but they sell like hotcakes so good for you either way.

>>23408109
Here you go, friend:
>https://www.royalroad.com/forums/thread/116847
Straight from one of the goats (commercial success wise). Not that I mind answering your questions, but there's comprehensive resources out there that already do

>>23408095
Post a snipped bro

>>23408135
No

>>23408095
Post a snippet bro

>>23408140
No!

>>23408129
I strip the systems down to being pretty barebones so they don't intrude on the story. It's like 80% an aesthetic/framework thing. People just like having a comfy setting to start their next story in, with familiar tropes. Which is probably why fanfiction is so popular too (and all genres with established tropes desu). People know they like the straightforward progression scheme litrpg offers, so they go read more litrpg instead of taking a risk on something new and scary (human nature, basically)

>>23408134
>https://www.royalroad.com/forums/thread/116847
I've read that post and find it absolutely soulless. I've read some of his content out of morbid curiosity and have no doubt that this money making type of writing is 95% luck.

>>23408178
Such is the reality of publishing and making a living as an author. It's not for everyone. I still make content I enjoy writing, but you do have to treat it like a business to some extent.

>>23408178
What do you mean by luck? Are you saying if one of these people started a new pen name on Royalroad and a new story with no connections, they couldn't do it again with high consistency? Because that's wrong; they could.

>>23407864
You're one tiresome cunt. I've seen you post the exact same dollar-worshiping sermon a hundred times by now in these threads. I don't care. If you want to mass-produce video game larp fanfic for a living, go ahead. I don't. I hate that shit. And I hate you. You disgust me like a poo-in-a-loo eating his own shit and proudly preaching what a fine dung-eater he is, and how everyone should have a diet of crap because it's the easiest and cheapest way to stay alive. You're worse than the mormons that go door to door asking if you believe there's justice in the world, passing flyers, because you keep coming to the same door every fucking day, and are unable to comprehend what a irritating cretin you are. Please kill yourself immediately.

>>23408202
I've never advocated for writing for money, I just take part in the discourse when other people bring it up. Your posts are always hilarious though!

>>23408202
you should get your blood pressure checked

>>23408205
No, you're the sleaziest, slimiest braggart I've ever seen. You make Frank Gardner look like a tactful gentleman. Whenever some retard happens to mention web novels, you're there, rubbing your palms together, links ready on the clipboard, excel sheets fired up, set to tell everyone about the benefits and best methods of consuming feces My god, I can almost smell you through the computer screen

>>23408223
>I can almost smell you through the computer screen
Read your posts, then mine, and reconsider who is the unhinged 4chan stereotype here

>Whenever some retard happens to mention web novels
Yeah, cuz this is a writing thread and I can actually give insight on how the web serial scene works. Seeing how people respond and have level headed discussions with me, I'm likely more wanted here than you

I'm not gonna let myself get dragged down into another ridiculous back and forth, so let me just say I hope you find happiness. It's not normal to have these reactions

Keeping dialogue interesting while also being somewhat realistic is a real challenge.

>>23408202
>>23408223

I'm working on a short comic where a spaceguy is stranded on a desert planet, one of the panels is the terminal screen of the spaceship to make the reader understand that no one is coming to save him
right now it's looking a bit barren, what's something i can include to make it look more legit
also this comic will be submitted to an international manga contest, do you guys think this english would be understandable enough for an old japanese guy?

Give a synopsis of what you're writing right now.

>>23408202
which personality disorder is this

>>23405726
>What might be some ways she'd seduce him in prison?
How cunning is she? I'd go with
>Talk to barbarian
>Claim she's also being forced into marriage
>Help barbarian escape.
>Get past guards and defenses
>Caught at last moment, tossed back in jail
>Barb watches as princess whipped for treason.
>Barb agrees to marriage to spare her further punishment
Of course, it was all a scheme for them to form a bond. She wasn't really going to let him escape.

>>23408294
Litfic seether

>>23408274
>do you guys think this english would be understandable enough for an old japanese guy?
Add a no signal wifi sign.

>>23408274
Oh hey, I remember you

It looks alright already, I think being barren works to its advantage Maybe something like
>Attempt #456 - 19/02/2358 - FAILED TO CONTACT
>Attempt #457 - 20/02/2358 - FAILED TO CONTACT

Making the attempt number so you can show how long he's been here exactly (and maybe you can even throw the readers a twist or two by showing that the number resets randomly so he hasn't even been there for only this long), but maybe the uncertainty works in your favour.

It would be interesting if you would show that in the early days he was focused on contacting a rescue team specifically, but at some point it switched to contacting anyone

>FAILED TO CONTACT RESCUE TEAM
>FAILED TO CONTACT RESCUE TEAM
>FAILED TO CONTACT RESCUE TEAM
>INCREASE WAVELENGTH BROADCAST TO ALL CHANNELS ? WARNING - POWER SOURCE DEPLETION RATE +20% - Y/N
>Y
>FAILED TO CONTACT
>FAILED TO CONTACT
>FAILED TO CONTACT
>FAILED TO CONTACT
>FAILED TO CONTACT

Why is everyone here a bunch of Ignatius O'Reilly's?

>>23408196
It's an algorithm game. And if you're playing the quantity >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quality route and shitting out 10k+ words a week then you are 100% in the quantity to appease the algorithm game.

>>23408247
If the dialogue was 100% realistic then it wouldn't be worth writing a story about now would it?

>>23408294
Terminal contrarianism. This website runs on it.

>>23408383
I agree, but that doesn't mean it's luck?

>>23408410
An algorithm isn't random. It measures engagement and boosts visibility accordingly. The writer still has to make something good enough that people actually read and review it.

>Write chapter
>5k words
>Damn, this is boring, nothing happens
>Rewrite the outline completely
>Have a go again
>Much better
>5.5k words

Anyone else trying to write comedy? It's difficult to find people to give feedback with.

>>23408643

>>23408645

>>23408643
The problem with your comedy is that your comedy is through nonsense rather than subtlites. Yes yes we understand it's a critique against the DEI initiatives and everyone is following along, but here executives are logical and precise rather than be a bunch of bumbling dolts that acknowledges DEI initiatives are the proper way to go. Humor in literature must be very insincere and ironic, so it works through words rather than visually like film.

Take a look at Dylan mulvany and Bud light, there has to be a reason why they okayed the ad, despite their branding. What would cause them to do it if they weren't a bunch of bumbling dolts?

>>23406385

AI these days is pretty good for that. have you tried it?

>>23408095
There is nothing wrong with telling. As long as it is important information and not describing the cereal your protag ate last week then you're good.

>>23408134
It just feels wrong to charge money to read a story. I pirate all my entertainment - tv, music, games - so to turn around and ask people to give money for what I wrote feels hypocritical, like my story is just SO VALUABLE and is so much better than every other show or movie out there that it needs to be locked behind a paywall.

>>23408682
That's a good point. The character of Gideon is actually a bit of a bumbling idiot as demonstrated in the next chapter, but I should rework the start. Does anything jump out in the prose or is it serviceable? I've been trying to improve it at all recently (it was incredibly bad before)

>>23408274
>do you guys think this english would be understandable enough for an old japanese guy?
Absolutely. They throw English into anime all the time. How much of it is understood, I don't know, but they are required to take English classes these days from elementary through high school. That said, I've read only about 20% of the population can actually speak English. But I can't speak French but I can read it with ease. Consuming is vastly easier than creating. For those short sentences it should be easily understood, imo, but I am not Japanese. You could ask /jp/ or /int/ if you really want some natives to weigh in.

>>23408705
I think the prose itself is fine, since the story is clearly modern. Keep the dialect and prose of the time period. It makes for better reading.

I would never have a knight in the 1200's use the word fuck, mother fucker, cunt, or other modern day insults. They'll be using cur, scratte, or insult them calling them a butchered pronunciation of the word Muslims.

Then again bridgerton broke broke that rule so what do I know

>>23408694
I don't follow. All the stuff you're pirating has a price too, so you're just listing it as equivalent value, not more valuable. And if you get big enough people will pirate from you as well via patreon scraping sites

>>23408247
Chances are, whatever you're saying doesn't need to be in the form of dialogue.

>>23408781
The stuff I'm pirating has a price but I'm not paying it. But I would be saying I should be paid for my work, which means I value mine higher than anything else, which I know it is not as good as the masterpieces out there.

>>23408490
"Good enough" is the key here. All you need is a few hundred slop consuming idiots to click your story to start boosting it, and then every other slop eater will brainlessly click the freshly "hot" title.

>>23408756
I'll take fine. Last excerpt I posted was torn to shreds.

>>23408245
I mean if you only ever talk about trend chasing and being a sell out poser, people are going to start making connections. Maybe you could also mention the benefits of writing as a passion, or having an artistic vision, without feeling the need to degenerate your art just for money? Maybe others wont be so quick to assume something about you then.

>>23408320
>>23408321
>>23408716
this is what I ultimately came up with
"SOS call failed" is a janky phrase but I think a japanese man can more easily understand and is more concise, considering this is supposed to be for a short silent comic that can't use dialogues

>>23408821
You're overthinking it. People either like it or don't. They'll pay or not.

>>23408490
>>23408827
There are ways to cheat the algorithm by going no brakes on quantity>>>>all, like authors releasing chapters with only 1.5k words nonstop. I wonder if it's fine to release the first few chapters being 2x as long as the next ones to hook the reader before playing cheap.

>>23408974
Looks pretty good, especially that CRT effect with the slight glow.

>>23408955
Except I do say you should write for enjoyment, and that turning it into a job isn't for everyone, nor should it be. But when people ask how to make money I respond with the simple reality of the situation, and how to accomplish it.
Besides, when someone brings up making money why would I reply with the benefits of writing as a passion? It's not the topic at hand. Would be a 'who asked' situation
Ya'll got issues. Go get therapy. I'm not the reason the publishing industry is the way it is. The way you seethe any time someone starts talking about writing for market or even genre fiction honestly just makes me sad for you.

>>23408643
You're trying way so hard to avoid passive voice that you've fallen into pathetic fallacy.

>>23409102
>one sentence too far

oof. couldve got away with it

>>23409102
Just ignore him.

>>23409151
I admittedly do get baited too easily. At least I know he's seething in good faith too

>>23409103
Are you not a fan of pathetic fallacy? I don't actively try and avoid passive voice, I never really wrote it too much. When is it good to use?

>Feeling down
>Get a positive comment on my writing
>Feel a lot better

Really wish I had a fellow writer friend to swap chapters/beta reads with and encourage each other.

>>23409291
What genre do you write in anon? It might be nice to have a discord server or something where people can share what they're working on.

>>23409156
lol. never "seethed" once. at best, Im amazed at the sheer level of defensiveness over something you claim isnt a problem

>>23408295
Fuck, that's a great idea. Thanks!

>>23409296
I write fantasy adventure with some smut but not litrpg (I still tag it as litrpg though for those clicks)

>>23409296
>redditscord
nice try, groomer

"I feel alienated from the world," said John, looking out the window.

"I don't fit anywhere. There is nothing I feel the need to prove or do. My value as a human being doesn't amount to anything for that reason. I'm a ghost, aware of its condition, but unable to leave Earth. There has to be a God, for only God could explain my presence on this planet."

"If there were a God, he wouldn't have tolerated your existence," whispered Curtis through dehydrated lips, tugging at the chains holding him down.

"That's where you're wrong," answered John, not looking back. "Where everyone else is wrong. God is not meant to fit your limited perspective. If you made a terrarium, and insects killed each other for fun in it, would you stop them? You probably wouldn't. That doesn't mean you agree with the killing of ants, or anything as a whole. In making the terrarium because you like nature, you also made insect killings possible. But you don't agree with it. In that spirit, I truly think this world was made by a benevolent God."

"Although He probably doesn't agree with what I'm doing right now, everything is already said and done from His perspective. The war was over from the moment it started, and nothing will save what you love, Curtis, I am afraid," John clarified with a smile.

"You are fucking sick!" cried Curtis, his face covered by his thick sausage fingers. "There will be nothing left of anything if you keep going. Stop now, please, I beg you!"

"Fatties must pay, Curtis. There are too many obese people in this world, and I have no goal, so they must all die," whispered John before pressing the red button on his desk.

Click.

asked this last thread but it got archived
where do you like to write?

>two characters are polar opposites
>reflect this even down to how their speech tages play out, e.g.:
>"XXX," said Tom.
>"YYY," Steve said.

The symbolism is deep.

>>23409409
thats alot of rambling buildup just for some guy holocausting fat people

>>23409446
In my leather recliner in front of my PC in my bedroom with my keyboard on my lap. It's pretty comfy.

>>23408285
Sci-fi short story about a murder that happens on a base on our moon, surrounding an authoritarian society, which also governs the Conglomerate of Nation-States on Earth. The protagonist gets no help in uncovering the mystery from the institutional bodies, who want the populations of Earth and Moonbase to believe that they live in utopias. He later finds out that the Terraforming chemicals deployed by the Conglomerate have had dire consequences on his parents, and the citizens of Earth, and these adverse effects were the motivation to create Moonbase all along.

>>23407153
Is AO3 a good self publishing site? I just got banned on RR and I'm considering alternatives.

>>23409466
That's how I did my last few novels. An old la-z-boy, and a big fat K350 in my lap.

>>23409495
Why'd you get banned?

>>23409507
Someone review bombed my account, and they accused me of making dozens of alternative accounts to inflate my rankings. Has me considering alternatives.

>>23409461
That's the point, I believe, the contrast and sudden, unexpected shift.

>>23409495
It's mainly for fanfiction. People do post original work on there but I don't think it gets much traction.

>>23409530
Ah, thanks. I was looking for something like the English language Syosetu

>>23409169
Really the actual problem is repeating the same structure over and over.

>Sand shifted
>Wind slapped
>Sand escaped

Beyond that I thought it was way too overwritten and not in a funny, ironic way. Many of your sentences feel too overloaded with modifiers. I didn't find it funny because there's no surprise. I didn't feel like you set anything up or that there was any kind of real punchline. I couldn't even find any conflict in the scene. Seemed to me to be just a room full of people talking and agreeing with each other and one guy having a nonsensical outburst of no consequence.

You guys think that drop cap (the first letter being fucking big) is cool or ugly? and what about the hyper detailed ones

>>23409559
I think it's fine depending on your genre. Historical fiction yes. Sci-fi no. I just associate it with medieval text, so old feels right, future feels out of place for it. Just IMO of course. In general I don't mind it.

>>23409559
they're cool but it seems to be a nightmare to get them working consistently on ereaders

>>23409511
a twist needs to be contextual to the story. if it comes from no where you risk becoming a Shyamalan, cuz right now the MC doesnt even have a goal or motivation besides killing whoever he feels ought to die. the plot here is the MC has no plot, and the conflict is faceless existentialism. without clarity of any of these things, it just feels like the author venting in a lit power fantasy form

>>23409570
>so old feels right, future feels out of place for it
what about present?

anyone have any luck with wattpad

>>23409587
Depends on the setting. Rural America? Okay. Sillicon Valley or Wall Street? Seems dated for a flashy and rich place.

>>23409589
that site is literally only used by teenagers looking for low quality romances. please trust that I use this insult knowing how severe it is: it's worse than royalroad

>>23409630
Is RR the best for shitty original fantasy novels?

>>23409606
But again, don't let me dissuade you. I like the look of it. Maybe in a different font it could work for a modern setting.

>>23409639
Yes, by an enormous margin. It's filled to the brim with horrid garbage, but the other sites are genuinely much worse

>>23409589
None at all. They have awful discovery mechanisms. I don't think any of my writing I posted there has gotten any sort of viewership or reaction. I've gotten much bigger reactions on other sites (RR, ScribbleHub, AO3, etc.)

At the risk of sounding cliche, is it normal to feel like you're discovering your story instead of making it up?
I can't seem to brute force a single sentence. Even a rough note that I intend to replace later. Instead, random things will remind me of my writing and it'll be like stars aligning and multiple things will snap into place instantly. Then I'll have anywhere from 5 minutes to a 4 hours to write everything that popped into my head down before I forget 90% of it. And once it's all out, I can't write so much as a single word more.

Most significantly, everything slots into place easily. I never have to make revisions or change things to make them fit. It's just "obvious" that A connects to B, and C to D, and E to F, etc etc, even when it involves 20 characters. I keep reading about the importance of writing every day but I can't do it. And the more I try to write, the longer I go before having an epiphany.

I have to just go about my day and wait for some part of the story to pop into my head, fully formed. Then I have to rush to record it. I don't feel like I'm writing so much as receiving a pre-written story in chunks that range in size from a few sentences up to a few pages. There's no effort. I just write the words exactly as they pop into my head.

Feels weird.

>>23409640
Ok now doing something like this for historical fiction is to much autism?

>>23409700
(random text)

>>23409700
I wouldn't use colored letters.

>>23409692
It feels like when I write I'm telling myself a story. The words flow, and I delegate my brain to autopilot.
Given, I write shitty web novel type fiction that is pure consumer trash, but that's what I like to write. I come up with characters, and place names that are unique, and I do it on the fly. Sometimes I'm writing and I forget the names of the characters/places I have created.

>>23409700
It's just gaudy and unnecessary. Unless you're trying to emulate something else, why bother?

>>23409692
It's awesome! That's called being in a "flow state". Embrace it!

>>23409748
I just find it cool, maybe without color

>>23409794
Did ChatGPT write this post?

>>23404635
Do you think a woman asking her beloved to not wash his cock and balls to build up a musky smegma layer for her to lick clean is too crazy on the freak scale?

>>23409832
Seems normal to me.

>>23409814
No, someone who has experience "flow states" many times, but hasn't in a while, wrote this. What are you even on about?

>>23409915
I'm poking fun at your use of exclamation marks for encouragement like the AI uses.

>>23409973
I don't use ChatGPT enough to be aware of such details. It's been months since I even looked at it. But hey, use it all you want.

>>23404635
>"Make mining sexy again" edition
First sequence of Road to Wigan Pier.
Zola. Germinal.

>Plotting and writing ideas for a prison chapter, everything feels like it lines up but
>I realize half-way that I really want to explore the setting and that as a reader I would be disappointed that the first arc is in a prison.
I came up with all these characters and plot threads and now i'm not sure if I should move the prison to later in the plot...

>>23410056
If you're doing a prison look up Larry Lawton on Youtube. Dude served 12 years in prison and his stories are fucking crazy. Might give you some ideas for details to include.

>>23410056
I dont know if this makes sense but the idea of limited prose for a limited setting was always interesting to me, keep it tight as long as the characters are in said situation. But once said situation is removed, i.e. leaving prison after the first chapter I assume, the writing immediately shifts to be more flowery and descriptive. Then all the plot threads begin to form, or maybe while in the cell the character receives letters or visits from other characters which start the threads in a small way and then they expand upon leaving. I feel like I wrote elthebsame sentence 3 times, but would something like that work for your writing? May be interesting to implement.

I'm >>23405857 btw, if you could give me some feedback

>>23404675
ironic shitposting is still shitposting

Rate my prose

>>23410160
I'd say its really well done and paints an interesting image in my mind. Is this a full story you're working on? May be kino if narrated by John Lee.

Rate mine
>>23405857

>>23410169
It was confusing. Sounded like two robots bickering on the "marvel movie" setting. I'm not sure what even happened at the end there with the ultramarine spell or w/e.

Breaking up the dialogue in the first paragraph multiple times with different descriptions for who I assume was the same character is not a good idea. I also think the jokes like 2.5km bachelor pad would land better of the dialogue wasn't so needlessly verbose.

>>23410160
>the night was far from young
cut, or maybe make it
>Moonlight cast long shadows across the cobblestones of White River. Kono found it comforting: the tall buildings looming overhead and the narrow, tight streets reminded her of the underground.
whatever you do fix the comma splice in 2nd sentence
and the comma splice in the 2nd paragraph "in the dim moonlight"
you also have 3 semi colons in a very short period of time. personally I wouldn't. I'm more a fan of dashes than semi colons. I use regular colons more semi colons - certainly not more than once, or possibly twice, a chapter - but maybe that's just me
>Kono and Amelia lezzing out
w/e you do you
it needs work. How many mc's do you have for this story? If you have this much internal monologue in such a short amount of space maybe make it 1st person

>>23410178
Not even similar to a marvel movie, that wasn't even verbose. I wrote at a 5th grade level. But I should tighten it up. In my mind it was very cut and dry what was happening and who was speaking, but of course I would, I wrote it. Much work to be done, I appreciate that feedback.

>>23410183
I meant verbose as in the lines were too lengthy.

>>23410189
Even worse, I wrote at a 5th grade level, and the sentences were too long. I'll rework it, thanks

>>23410179
I swap perspectives so a first person pov would be too jarring. It is the path I've chosen :/

Also no, the second sentence is not a comma splice. The sentence is correctly structured as it consists of an independent clause followed by a dependent clause introduced by a participle phrase ("blanketing the thin streets in a comfortable darkness"). The comma is appropriately used to separate these two parts of the sentence.

You are right about the semi colon overuse; I've restructured the sentences. I don't know if I'm too attached to "The night was far from young" to cut it or not. Is it repetitive? Perhaps. But I like it.

>>23410196
>The sentence is correctly structured as it consists of an independent clause followed by a dependent clause introduced by a participle phrase ("blanketing the thin streets in a comfortable darkness")
Okay, I see the problem I'm having. The tense is wrong. Change it to
The moonlight cast long shadows from the tall, downtown buildings and blanketed the thin streets in a comfortable darkness.

>>23410196
It is certainly repetitive, but it works for emphasis, so I enjoy it. As long as you like it, is all that really matters.

>>23410200
NTA, but the tense was also correct. Consider this sentence:

"He ran the brush down the glass, cleaning the window."

It's a way to separate two clauses.

>>23410216
it reads like total shit
but whatever, lez it up

>>23410218
/wg/ Grammar and Futa smut

>>23410228
again. it reads like total shit. both
>"He ran the brush down the glass, cleaning the window."
>"The moonlight cast long shadows from the tall downtown buildings, blanketing the thin streets in a comfortable darkness."
are fucking embarrassing. but you do you. you want a stroke job, not feedback. it's shit. that's my feedback

>>23410160
Every time Konoanon posts the thread devolves into comma splice general.

As for the prose itself, it has strong imagery and a good story with a strong closing line. You stumble some with describing how the day folk act, while the character is walking at night. This could be cut or presented differently. Furthermore, the sentence with the fantasy is awkwardly structured. I think a list of provocative sexual imagery is strong for the mental state you're trying to convey, but the first clause needs work.

>>23410235
>Pale moonlight cast long shadows from the tall downtown buildings, blanketing the narrow streets in a comfortable darkness.

This is my edit. This sentence does three things.

1. Describes an image (duh)
2. Pans from the moon, to the building, to the street. The sentence is a cause and effect linear story.
3. Gives us the characters foreign perspective on the scene. The adjectives "Comfortable" and the verb "Blanketed" imply safety, which is not something we normally associate with darkness and shadow.

I'm keeping it as it is because of those strengths. Your recommended replacement was both less fluid and lacked the connotation of my diction.

>>23410240
I'm still struggling with how to make those sections work. Thank you for this feedback.

Just write like Brandon Sanderson and use tons of fragments, comma splices, dashes, one word sentences and exposition about nonsense.

>>23410269
For me, it's King

>Then it came down on her again, like unpleasant presents raining from a poison pinata: the realization that character name was dead.

>>23410160
>Clatter of a clumsy cat

That alliteration better not be intentional, faggot.

>>23410313
I like it. Anon, keep the alliteration, it's cozy.

My story starts from the protagonist leaving a student dorm on graduation. She's an orphan, has no money, and nowhere to go, no future prospects, or ambitions. Then she meets someone who offers to arrange things for her, for maybe personal reasons and the plot kicks off from there. Very simple. But writing it down, it's such a downer start.
>muh dead parents
>no home, no friends
>probably dead soon
>roommate died too
It quickly drains your will to go on. Things get fun when the other character shows up, but how to drag the reader there? It's a kind of inescapable starting point.

>>23410331
Make her entertaining. Give her an inspiring personality. Etc.

>>23410235
Why are they embarrassing, because they make you feel funny? Can you provide some coherent feedback.

>>23410160
Me again, >>23405857
really liked your work so I attempted a narration.

https://voca.ro/16MJG0tCLgdD

>>23410344
Moonlight isn't casting shadows. The buildings are casting shadows.

>>23409508
did the faggots allow you to at least remove your content?

>>23410331
>has no money, and nowhere to go, no future prospects, or ambitions
Why are you including me in your story?

>>23405857
As an extract, jumping straight into the very stilted way they talk is very jarring. In the actual book you will need to establish this thoroughly before putting in any long winded dialougues like this where both characters have this neo-courtier manner of speaking.
Typically, it is best to restrict that sort of thing to scenes where the unusual style is making or adding to some other point about the setting or story, and outside of those cases to give more broad strokes impressions of the conversations to avoid bogging the reader down too much.

>>23410365
>Under pale moonlight, the tall buildings cast long shadows, blanketing the narrow streets in a comfortable darkness.

Fixed. Thank you for the truly based pedanticism.

>>23406122
Third is best if she doesn't have literal cat ears, second is best if she does

>>23410377
Ahh makes sense. This is actually how it started, so you suggest I do some exposition leading to it? And even then restrict it?

>>23410160
I like this. It's a lot telling, so maybe you could imply how Kono feels about things elsewhere in the story as bits and pieces rather than info dump it here, but I don't really have a problem with it. Lines like "on this night the cool air was not refreshing" could be re-written like "On this night Kono suffocated on the cool air" to give it more of a feeling of it stifling her, which is unusual from the norm.

The only part that feels cliche is the "brought her back to the present" line. Maybe you could say something like "The clatter of a clumsy cat shattered/fractured her reverie." I say shattered or fractured only because it sounds like something breaking, like the cat had broken something (Kono's daydreaming).

Overall I like it.

>>23410386
This reads much better and calms my autism. I knew there was something wrong with the sentence, it just sounded off, and I was having difficulty putting my finger on it.

>>23406375
>But what about seduction techniques?
Well your typical literary barbarian is an ambitious conqueror representing the right of might and natural law. Representing herself as a challenge to be conquered and possibly belittling his ability to do it despite being physically weaker than him would appeal to that. Do you need him to fall in love with her or just fuck her?

>>23406610
Not a car but the steam boat in Heart of Darkness is well handled

JFC you idiots don’t even deserve to be in slush piles. Straight to the trash.

>>23410506
None of us think we're good. We post here to give and receive critique. We are learners. Now post your writings and let us criticize you. Wont do it? Not surprised

>>23410292
holy fuck. that guy's supposed to be good?

>>23407845
Cause when I think of fantasy I think of /lit/RPGs or contemporary fantasy. Stuff that's more about giving the characters some cool power. I much prefer fantasy that's more mythological and mysterious, where how the world works isn't known by the people. It's like the Hobbit versus Harry Potter, in Harry Potter there's a school in Magic. In the Hobbit there's a single wizard who knows a bunch about magic, but there's way we the audience can understand how it works.

>>23410551
not "good," entertaining.

>>23410685
>the fantasy i write isn't really fantasy
>because it resembles tolkien
???

>>23410740
Well maybe if we were more interested in "good" things, things wont have to suck so bad now

>>23406820
You guys are getting paid for this?

>>23410751
i don't think it helps anybody to wallow in this kind of resentment. if you think you can write better, then write better. the authors in your screencap are entertainers and they found an audience that is evidently entertained, so why the butthurt?

>>23410751
You can't convince me these aren't all AI-generated by this point.

>>23410160
Way too many adjectives.

>>23410751
it genuinely puzzles me that people pay 5 to 10 dollars waiting for some few chapters to read this slop

>>23410925
when has too many adjectives ever been a problem?

>>23410292
You forgot the narrator throwing random slurs like he just busted a nut.

>>23410945
Always

>>23410929
Stuff like this doesn't even have to be good. The average consumer of litrpg trash just wants to read something easy. It doesn't have to be this prose-laden story like Min-Maxing my TRPG skills in another world.
Most of these random isekai light novel/web novel/video game story/help i got stuck in this cliche environment and the title is also the synopsis type stories are 2/10s and people just eat them up.
Kinda gives a crappy author hope

>>23410955
I've read some and the writers are usually skilled alright. You can tell by the structure, the transitions, the grammar, the dialogue, but the ideas are dogshit and soulless.

>>23410955
What really confuses me is that these stories are often NOT easy to read or any fun due to the author's lack of skill. There are long, boring passages with no obvious point where nothing of interest happens, awkward sentences where the author's intent is left a mystery, dialogue seemingly penned by autistic aliens, bad grammar, irrational skips in time and location, continuity errors, awful pacing, etc. Excavating the story from such a mess of borderline illegible text is a painful chore, not entertainment, never mind something you'd want to pay for. But it seems many do.

>>23404635
Hi /lit/. We seriously need your help. Can you please report this thread? >>>/u/4213114
It was made by a spammer who doesn't even like our board's subject. Please report it. Thank you.

>>23410979
That's from a bad translation. Sometimes they are machine translated and the translator just cleans them up a little bit.
A good translator is worth their weight in gold.

>>23410945
>“When you catch an adjective, kill it. No, I don't mean utterly, but kill most of them--then the rest will be valuable. They weaken when they are close together. They give strength when they are far apart.”

>>23410979
i've been looking into that romantasy crap for women that's so popular these days and i've had similar feelings despite those being tradpubbed books that must have gone through a real editor. lots of dull exposition and the sentences are often awkward to parse because they're ass-backwards in their construction or go on a weird tangent that doesn't follow what came before. it all feels very scatterbrained and unclear. i just have to assume a lot of the (teenage girl) readers are simply skimming this stuff without quite comprehending it, just scanning the page for the next bit of dialogue or physical action.

I often have my narration prose deeply contrasting with my characters' as if an old sage was describing some zoomers going on about their day. Is that a problem for the reader?

>>23410979
>>23411013
You would (or wouldn't) be surprised to see how many litrpg authors have their indians face stamped on their kindle page pics. Be it survivor vias or whatever, but it's pretty much like in IT kek

>>23410979 #
>>23411013 #
You would (or wouldn't) be surprised to see how many litrpg authors have their indian faces stamped on their Kindle page pics. Be it survivor bias or whatever, but it's pretty much like in IT kek

>>23411060
99~% of litrpgs are doodoo, it just makes sense.

I thought litrpgs were for amateur writers who were scared to plot the story themselves so they leave it to RNG?

>>23411050
Fuck the reader. Unironically. Write the book you want to read.

>>23411153
this is the best advice when writing but i just can't take it, i'm fucking obsessed with how i am perceieved by my hypothetical audience and it murders my drive even if i have no intention of ever publishing.
ocd, autism, who can say?

>>23411153
Nah, Sanderson writes in yumi and the nightmare painter that books die if they aren't read

>>23411181
you have to put it aside in the writing stage. Sure, consider it in the editing stage, but it will hold you back if you let those thoughts creep in too early.
The problem with this approach is obvious if you read any normie's opinion on a piece of media. Once you realise how superficially and politically driven most criticism is you will be free of those restrictions

>>23411050
"That's their problem!"

>>23411050
I think there's a certain term for making the narrator their own character rather than having them objective or colored by the protagonist's point of view, but generally I don't think it's considered an issue if you make it clear that the narrator is their own character with their own perceptions and biases, personally I quite like the idea

>>23411181
>ocd, autism, who can say?
Just cowardice.

>>23409700
kino?
just kidding I will not use this shit

>>23409692
i have a similar experience but it's biting me in the ass because i find it impossible to substantially change what i've written. i can polish the actual sentences and maybe expand upon something, but changing plot events seems unimaginable because, like you said, it's "just obvious" that x should lead to y. i have a finished novel from which i would theoretically want to remove an attempted rape scene because i know people will be butthurt, but i just can't. i feel like it might even be tradpub-worthy but i'm scared of sending it to agents because they might say "ok but remove x and add y" and i can't do that like i can't bend my knee the other way

>>23411050
It's called third person omniscient, but don't let the narrator preach too much, have him describe what no other character can see.

>>23411019
This doesn't sound accurate. Adjectives can be used to setup an atmosphere. One adjective can link many in the consecutive sentences.

For instance: The black buick shone against the white backdrop of the hotel building as if to blind those who would dare look. Kevin, was wearing a white ski mask and a dark leather jacket as he emerged from the car. A grey deagle hang from his ebony trouser's holster and a jacknife hid above his left army boot....
As he exited the snow white enclave, a white blazer had replaced his jacket as he headed towards the white Cadillac on the opposite end of the parking lot. Donning a red cap, Kevin was a new man.

These adjectives in the first paragraph are set up in order to pay off the last one. If you followed this retarded rule, these paragraphs would cease to make any sense.

>>23411050
It worked in The Grapes of Wrath, so go for it if you have fun doing it.

A thread or so ago I posted some exerpts from my sci fi pulp noir first draft. Would anyone want to read all 30k words of GARBAGE I have so far? I might even be up for doing a reading swap. I don't need line by line crit, just a vibe check as I try to dig myself out of the depressive slump now that my manic phase has dried up.

>>23411019
>>23411019
Sometimes this is the case, sometimes it isn't As with all things involving prose it's all about variety. Sticking to one rule will make your writing bland.

>>23411432
I'll read some of it but no way I'm getting through 30k words today

>>23411299
That's what gets me, too. It's a cascade effect.

Most recently, changing ONE interaction 2/3rds of the way through the story because the only logical outcome I could otherwise see would have been catastrophic for the MCs caused me to rework dozens of sections. It ultimately led to one character being born in a different city. But the absence of that character from their original birthplace caused two other characters to miss meeting when they needed to in order to have the relationship that they have by the time of the conflict that initially prompted me to revise the story.

So I had to go back and look for moments their paths may have crossed earlier in their lives, and the only opportunity that made sense also had consequences for other characters, causing yet more revisions reverberating down their stories as well.

It's like painting a picture on a surface of still water and then dropping a pebble in the middle of it. Every little change ripples through the entire story.

It's enough to tempt me to say, "If it's catastrophic for the MCs, it's catastrophic for the MCs. I guess this story just became Grimdark and I need to study up on how to accurately depict PTSD. I hope no gets too attached to that character."

>>23411578
>It's enough to tempt me to say, "If it's catastrophic for the MCs, it's catastrophic for the MCs. I guess this story just became Grimdark and I need to study up on how to accurately depict PTSD. I hope no gets too attached to that character."

Or, better yet, "I guess I'm changing MCs 2/3rds of the way through this story."

It's tantalizing to consider making that the climax and picking up the rest of the story in a sequel.

>>23410366
I have it backed up, I kind of want to keep writing there if possible. Not like there’s anywhere better.

wtf it's going to take a week to get an account on AO3?

>>23410392
It may not be necessary to do all that. Just framing the dialogue with little described reactions would go a long way. Some facial expressions and nonverbal communication for example. That would give it a little more life instead of being a wordy paragraph duel.

>>23410551
King is the original slop author

>>23410269
>>23410292
>tfw you haven't read anything newer than Gene Wolfe because you don't want to pollute your writing style or accidentally copy popular authors
>but so many people giving writing advice say "you have to read A LOT to be good at writing"
I don't know if I'm making a serious mistake or not. Guess we'll find out.

>>23411691
Unfortunately you probably think it will make you original but another anon who is inspired solely by Wolfe is replying to you now

>>23411695
Fortunately, Wolfe's style is so meticulous and layered that it's difficult to discern when someone is copying him.

I've read The Book of the New Sun a dozen times and I'm convinced the man didn't waste a single sentence. Each one has some greater impact on the overall story. I'm still finding hidden details and connections even after twelve reads. I swear there was one secret that was mainly detectable by noting an apostrophe used in a slightly different way in two different passages, and that was the only thing prompting the reader to look at them side by side and realize that they were talking about the same thing.

>>23411707
Agreed. I remember moments in Citadel that seemed like a slog to me on the first read that have become the most fascinating parts for me. As for writing like him I've been practicing 3rd person to ensure I'm not just copying BOTNS, but then again Long Sun uses 3rd person and it's just as good.

>>23411485
Thank you, anon. No need to read it all at once, or at all, but I'll drop an email so you can get back to me whenever it's best for you, or even in chunks. This is the first pass, I'm writing this a few hundred words at a time over lunch breaks, or bigger segments when I have a moment in life. It probably all meanders too much, uses too many adjectives, and has no clear focus or objective. Future drafts will try to cut down on lore blurbs, get some slog parts punchier/tighter, and try to focus on whatever the 'what is this story about' once that emerges from the narrative. Anyways, even if you have a little fun reading it I've accomplished my goal in the story. If at any point you're reading and think 'hey I think this story is about X' I'd love to hear your thoughts, because sure as heck I don't know.

Have a Google drive link because I don't know how else to share PDFs

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1i4DziLZiSWQEC0psP9CPBvuGUkTzQ6CC/view?usp=drivesdk
blankpagesandstarlight@gmail.com

Cheers.

>>23411729
I'm reading it now. I'll drop you an email a bit later.

>>23411707
I dropped that inane slop on page one, how tf do you read it twelve times?

>>23411758
>he's reading it
>mfw
Looking forward to it!

>>23411729
>https://drive.google.com/file/d/1i4DziLZiSWQEC0psP9CPBvuGUkTzQ6CC/view?usp=drivesdk


>A woman clasped the receiver to her ear, her eyes trying to peer through the glass
surrounding her, but it was all fogged up from the outside.

Comma splice on paragraph one means a dropped story.

>>23411775
I know what it's like to give your work to someone else so just to calm your nerves I can say that my first impression is good enough that I am reading more and will try to give you decent feedback. I'm not really going to focus on line-by-line or grammar stuff.

>>23411798
that's not what a comma splice means, retard

>>23411798
See pic
>>23411809
I appreciate that and I'll try switching to decaff

>>23405319
I mean, if there are any texts revealed by the gods, you could just make him very knowledgeable about what it is they seek and let him work against it

Or if there are any oracles or priests, you can have him ask them how to get their favor, only to go in the opposite direction

I like the idea of the "moral compass", but you would need to have it work somehow
Perhaps it's a sacred, stolen instrument that was blessed by all the gods and that's how it can tell whether you are going against their wishes

>>23411817
Sent you my initial impressions. I got up to page 18.

>>23411798
How are you fuckers so confused about such a simple grammatical concept? Jesus Christ. Have the good grace to recognize your retardation and never try to correct someone again

>>23411923
I got it! I'll send you a followup. It's great feedback, exactly what I'm looking for, and I really appreciate it.

>>23411774
0/10 trolling
My copy opens with a forward by Neil Gaiman calling it "the most remarkable SF work of the last 5 decades" amid a few pages of him stressing, repeatedly, to read patiently and carefully, because of all of the subtle details you'll miss if you try to power through it like a YA novel.

He mentions that Wolfe had told him that he believed a good novel was one that was enjoyable to read the first time, and yet more enjoyable the second time. Most of his books are so different on re-reading that their themes and tones change significantly.

BotNS is exactly like that. It IS a work of science fiction. But on first reading you're very likely to experience it as a traditional fantasy. It's only after the first read that your understanding changes and it becomes a science fiction novel.

>>23411966
No problem. Never give up.

I know this sucks, but it's my first time writing anything since I had to in highschool. I've been reading more, and it struck me about 20 minutes ago to write something so this is it:

I'm 16 years old and all the early middle aged women want to have sex with me. Late one night, at the behest of one of those soon-to-be undesireables, and under the guise of literature hand-delivery (a process obsolete ever since the introudction of the Royal Penny Post in 1840), I slipped out the back window. I carefully eased the gate latch and began a measured, all fours creep so as not to alert the motion detecting searchlight pinned above my mothers bedside window. She was in the onset stages of a few things herself, but any remnant of youth having long since faded, they proved to be dementia, sciatica and alcoholism. Most likely recovering from a bender of all three, she did not notice an alert from the searchlight regarding unauthorized motion on the duplex perimeter. However, our mexican immigrant neighbors directly opposite did receive and silently make note of that warning. Yet, feeling no obligation to warden a young "wedo", proceeded to sit on the stoop, stare blankly and sip Mickey's.
As I reaquired bipedalism, my steps gliding with rhythm and purpose, it struck me that I had forgotten the book. Even more concerning than this lapse was the possibility that Jenna would annul the 10 second smooch she offered as reward. Didn't matter anyway, that horny old bitch couldn't read an eye test chart even if she was fucking an optometrist and he helped her study.

>>23411989
I'm not interested in what Neil the hack Gayman has to say because A) the man has no taste and B) forewords are written solely to sell books with the most syrupy praise conceivable. If anything, the fact that the publisher had to get a celebrity of his caliber to shill this work robs what little good will I might've had for Wolfe. You're a child to fall for these games, but then again, you wouldn't be reading fantasy if you were an adult

>>23412092
what exactly do you want feedback on?

are there authors that just straight up make up words as they go along and do away with all grammatical conventions in favor of their made up words?
i read nietzche did that a bit and i was gonna read him anyways but im curious if there are authors that do that, i think its interesting to see how authors go about doing that

>>23412119
is it trash

>>23412104
Both of those authors are better than you will ever be and deep down you know it. It's why you seethe this hard. It's a coping mechanism.

>>23412128
Define trash

>>23412163
idk man lol not sure why i even posted it

>>23412128
not really, but could use some editing. It's too short for me to really give good feedback

>>23412169
true! well see if I cant get some inspiration to write more. Seems like a very difficult art to get into imo.

Then only reason I tried is because I've been reading more to relax my mind from other creative pursuits and I felt that it would be an activity that could inform the others. in that sense I shouldnt be looking for feedback so i deleted the post. thanks for responding

>>23412184
You're overthinking it. There was nothing wrong with what you posted.
>Seems like a very difficult art to get into imo.
If you read and practice it's the same as others. What are your other creative pursuits?

>>23411798
Just correct this with:
>A woman clasped the receiver to her ear while (with) her eyes tried (trying) to peer through the glass surrounding her, but it was all fogged up from the outside.

>>23412230
I have been playing music for a long time, but only about 4 years ago decided to write my own stuff. I became confronted by the fact that I struggle to be creative or original lyrically and musically (although I'm reading Recognitions now, and it seems in a way Gaddis making an argument against the inherent value of originality that I had not considered).

Took a break from music for a few days this week to relax and something else struck me: I cannot very well express anything verbally in a social situation unless I get on an aspergic-roll, and I don't have much of specific internal dialogue (I think very abstractly, rarely in sentences or with words). Despite this, I realized it's possible I might have a way with words and that practicing writing might help nurture any other forms of creation and my mind in general

It never occurred to me because I'm extremely unoriginal (although hardworking and "gifted") and I'm not the best at communicating/being charismatic. In fact I'd go so far as to say I don't have much personality or redeeming qualities of any kind except for work ethic. Maybe writing can be useful for replenishing my baren mind and soul.

>>23410751
>A Crafting System Apocalypse
>Skill Hunter Kill Monsters Aquire Skills Ascend to the Highest Rank!

>>23412281
sounds kino desu

retards have always been the based among us

>>23412280
In that case I'd suggest you care wayyyy less about whether it is trash or not and just write. Have you listening to music and writing lyrics while listening?

>>23412316
you are why everything sucks

>>23412329
don't you have a cloud to be shaking your first at, you old curmudgeon?

>>23412352
oh no i used the wrong word

>>23412317
wanting validation is a problem for me, I'm like a child in that regard lol.

I've tried a lot of different things with writing lyrics. The good thing is that ultimately as long as they arent the worst most distracting lyrics youve ever heard, it dont matter too much. I'm not doing singer songwriter with only vocals and an acoustic guitar. But still if I want to create something real and true to myself, I'll need to be singing about something.

>>23412104
Let's see your credentials then. Gaiman and Wolfe's used toilet paper is probably better prose than you've ever dreamed of writing.
Le Guin also famously called Wolfe "our Melville". Multiple people have called him "your favorite author's favorite author".
It takes more than a salty teenager on the internet to degrade any of that.

>a minor plot point in a story I'm writing is shared with a popular TV series
It's joever, isn't it? I'll have to juke this...

>>23412394
Are any of these authors trending on RR rn? Have they written any LitRPG with a proper magic system? If your answer is "no" to both questions then you're out of touch grandpa.

>>23412415
pseud gets btfo so tries to act like a retard to pull attention away

sorry man the word 'litrpg' is only a bogeyman to you

>>23412352
clouds cant be fixed. artistic degeneracy can be. your shit isnt the same

>>23412439
I don't think anyone is trying to pass off their sloppy litrpg story like it's art. Just entertainment to be consumed.
Should TikTok, YouTube, Pop Music and Rap, fast food, 99% of movies and Tv, etc all be destroyed as well? Because those have 'artistic' subcommunities too, just like literature does. Someone is gonna post 'unironically yes' as a meme answer, but if you truly genuinely believe that, you probably have no friends irl
and if you don't believe that, you just have double standards when it comes to writing because that's the hobby you're involved in
Just, pull the stick out of your ass. Go touch grass. Make a friend.

>>23412456
>if you hate goyslop you have no friends
>unironically saying consoom

you love sucking shit so much you make an army of strawmen for it. nope. I will never accept it. I would sooner lead a Fourth Reich just to eliminate it and all the disgusting flith who worship it like you

>>23412484
>I would sooner lead a Fourth Reich just to eliminate it
but you're not going to do any such thing. you're just going to sit there and seethe until the day you die

writing?

>>23412484
Insults by a genuine 4chan creature like you are in reality complements. I am glad we have incompatible views of the world
Like I said, go make a friend. Or try I guess. Forecast isn't looking great

>>23412484
dude are you the same person that's been calling everything a strawman? I've noticed some retard using that word way too often and almost always incorrectly

>>23412534
>delusional consoomer thinks hes above 4chan users while using 4chan

you belong in an asylum

>>23412484
Strawman?
how is pop music not the fantasy/genre equivalent to literature? or blockbuster movies/tv/tikTok to Film? which are both respected arts.
fast food to cuisine is a bit of a stretch I guess, but the comparison holds up otherwise.
so do you hate it all and think it should all be purged or you just hate low brow literature only? in which case the argument holds. where is the strawman

>>23412554
Bro you gotta be joking. There are definitely levels of insanity on this website. Everyone here is a reject to some level but it's a very, very deep pit

why aren't you guys writing instead of arguing? neither the next great american novel nor the next blockbuster fantasy slop will be created like this. Stay strong anons! Resist your base human nature to bicker!

>>23412561
you all need to be purged. faggot consoomer scum

>>23412587
>I got blown the fuck out, have no good arguments against anything said to me, so here's a meme and an insult!
Yikes. For someone championing the virtues of true art you're kinda a brainlet

>>23412566
thats right, walk it back

>>23412594
you have no argument. all you have to say is "duhh you relly hate slop? huh must have no frends"
shut the fuck up and go back to eating your shit you subhuman trash

>>23412597
What did I walk back? I'm not a 4chan creature like you. The only thread I use on this entire site is this one. I shouldn't have to specify that there are levels of 4chan degeneracy, since even this site recognizes /pol/ users as something else entirely. I just had to point it out for a retard like you apparently.

>>23412606
>can't even point out where his precious strawman is
Christ man sit down and shut up you're making pseuds look bad

>>23412606
>You have no argument
>yet your argument contains a strawman fallacy! Ha!
Ok

Is there a rule of thumb for how big a synopsis or outline should be? Or how many words of actual story should come from each part of an outline?
I just realized I'm pushing 40k words total across my outline and still have a bit more to go before I start fleshing it out. I can't fathom how this is supposed to turn into 100k-120k words and not 400k+ words.

>>23412686
400k+ would be unpublishable for a debut author. Some established authors can get away with it because they have clout already.
Are you sure you can't split that enormous outline up into multiple books?

>>23411729
NTA but gave it a look. I thought it was better than most of the stuff that posted on these threads, but also thought it was a bit loose and boring. I think the opening hook/scene could be a bit stronger by making the stakes clearer and building up to a better climax. As it is, it felt like mostly exposition.

The dialog in the next scene I also found a bit flat. I would try to make it more indirect and to omit cliched responses where a specific gesture would be stronger.

>>23412694
I could and have already identified the best natural points to do it. The problem is the chronology gets messy and I worry that vibes don't hold up when you split off some of the plots. There's a threat I'd like to keep at the forefront of readers' minds that is heavily focused on a few characters at first and don't become relevant to the other 90% of the cast until more than halfway through their arcs.

But there ARE subtle hints and references before then. I wrote them such that you'd read a chapter where the threat is more explicitly depicted and then within a page or two of the next chapter you'd see a veiled allusion to it. Readers aren't supposed to catch all of them, but hopefully near the end it clicks and they realize that it's been in front of them the entire time.

I'm not sure how that would hold up if I split the storylines into their own books.
And is it common for first timers to start off with a series? Is that not too ambitious?

I'll get back to writing a main book later on, but right now I'm making a cooking book with my mom's recipes since I'm helping her with some stuff. I formated everything into a good table with some colors and a good clemente font and I made two graphics, one at the top of the page and one at the bottom. The only in the top isn't really needed, but I made it anyways. It doesn't feel professional enough, since it looks like a table with two images I made there. I'm not sure how to make the formatting look good.

>>23412858
Why not just try to look through some cookbooks and copy styles that you think look good? You can use gpt-vision to identify the fonts and layout via screenshots.

>>23412905
I guess so, I like the font, it's more so the formatting. But I guess that will work.

>>23412594
I agree with the schizo anon, marvel movies and tiktok should not exist and they didn't exist not so long ago, same for litrpg or whatever you call your garbage

>>23412415
I’m trying to write a litrpg right now that is a slow burn with a detailed and “real” feeling magic system but also one that is high fantasy in a high fantasy world from the viewpoint of a small person who consumes as he goes.
Maybe it’s not an interesting concept but I’m still going to try and do it.


Continuation thread when!!?

>>23412724
Thanks for the feedback. I definitely feel it could be tightened up, and some of the dialog workshopped. I will keep these things in mind when I do my second draft.

previous anon was correct in saying I neednt be asking for feedback in such an early stage of my writing, but I'm curious how this strikes anyone