/lit/ - Literature

would your opinion of the book remain the same were it written by a popular contemporary author?

>>23296243
I fucking hate Dostoevsky for this book. Nechayev was a brave, committed man who died anemic, malnourished, and scurvy-infested in a tiny prison self with his (no doubt necrotic) arms and legs in shackles for years. The Tsarist head of police offered to let him go if he named names and he slapped the man in the face (hence the aforementioned shackles.) There was nothing the least bit cowardly about him. He didn't deserve to have his name dragged through the mud by this this pussy reactionary Christcuck.

>>23296243
Okay

>>23296283
>Nechayev was a brave, committed man
Obviously not that brave or committed, considering he spent his whole life talking about violent revolution, but never participated in one himself.

Not actually my favorite but go ahead

Hard to pick favorite. But this i think is close.

>>23296300
He was in Russia, there weren't any revolutions during the time he was alive. That was the whole point of the Nihilist movement, to use terrorism and assassinations to try to start a revolution.

>>23296283
im pretty sure he did deserve that though, people who brag about wanting to commit campaigns of amoral atheistic terrorism do in fact deserve to be separated from society
his name wasnt dragged through the mud by Dostoevsky, Dostoevsky just held up a mirror to the man. if you dont like what you see in that mirror, then thats a problem for you to solve
notice how you dont even deny anything, you just say "hes brave" and "he committed" as if that is suppose to matter in any way, as if you think being brazen and committed to real metaphysical evil is somehow a virtue that should earn him his freedom, completely nonsensical.
>" bro how dare you lock him up, he was really committed to destroying the lives of everyone around him and brave enough to frivolously gun down an unarmed man for the crime of turning away from evil. so brave bro so brave"
no.

>>23296351
Idk. I can see where he is coming from even though I agree with you. In a world of inauthentic posturing, sometimes a guy who sticks to his guns to the bitter end can appear, at least at first glance, as something virtuous.
I agree that in the total summation, he isn't, but I understand that impulse to view it that way.

Terrorism also never occurs in a vacuum, generally its a product of a failing in society. Personal responsibility matters, but especially in situations where terrorism is on the rise, like a collapsing Tsarist regime, the responsible leader would look at this as a cry for help rather than solely as a threat from "metaphysical evil agents."

>>23296365
>the responsible leader would look at this as a cry for help rather than solely as a threat from "metaphysical evil agents."

these arent mutually exclusive

the last leader of Russia who saw the situation for what it was and actually tried to help people and made a real significant difference was payed back by leftists with one assassination attempt after another until they finally killed him, and the reforms stopped after that, that was the event that pretty much set Russia up for its collapse. i believe Lenin himself acknowledged that conditions had to be made intentionally worse for people in order for the bolsheviks to gain power. being a reformer is a death sentence around leftists because leftists cant afford to have peasants being given land and and a seat at the table in local government institutions etc. and generally having their lives tangibly improved, because real tangible progress makes people more difficult to exploit

men like netcheyev are not some beaten dogs lashing out, they are are psychopath manipulators and exploiters. greasy rats. they are slimy losers and I cannot see anything virtuous about their commitment to their own machinations

>>23296400
I'm certainly not excusing him or anyone else for that matter; but be careful what you choose to see in others, because you'll inevitably bring it out in yourself.
>men like netcheyev are not some beaten dogs lashing out, they are are psychopath manipulators and exploiters. greasy rats. they are slimy losers and I cannot see anything virtuous about their commitment to their own machinations
I agree that these men get it tragically wrong, but they are still just men. Not rats or some phantasm of evil.

>>23296351
My point was that in Demons Dostoevsky portrays the man as craven, unprincipled, and weak. None of which is accurate if you’re actually familiar with his biography. Call him evil or psychopathic and you have a point, but there’s nothing to the accusations of cowardice.

>>23296284
you are young and spanish

>>23296303
you are young and havent read much

>>23296335
this aint your favourite book. either you havent read it or you didnt enjoy it

>>23296426
Nope, far from it, 41 years old and American.

>>23296426
I am young and haven't read much you're right
10 book under my belt, my favorite so far is TBK
Im now reading the trial by kafka

>>23296243

>>23296423
Nta, but was it Pytor Stepanovich that was supposed to represent this guy?

>>23296243

>>23296423
he is weak and craven though, what you mistake for "principles" and "strength" is just an outward construct built around what is in reality just a collection of indulgences which he has given himself up to entirely. nothing but fatal weakness with good PR. its no different than dysgenic junkies and assorted yuppies and losers turning their failings into some kind of social activism in order to present their weakness as something greater and more noble than it really is, and to justify wallowing in their own filth instead of at least TRYING to do better, which is hard and takes effort.

>>23296243

>>23296325
>That was the whole point of the Nihilist movement, to use terrorism and assassinations to try to start a revolution.
And you're upset he went to prison?

>>23296243
It's this one.

>>23296614
Not him, but at that point one is just redefining cowardice to mean something much more conceited. And this is a different cowardice than what is portrayed in Verjovenski.
And really, you are also redefining weakness as something far more obtuse. Weakness is not a physical quality to you, it's the failure to live up to "virtue" and "good".

One of my favorites

>>23296761
picked up

>>23296243
Why did Stavrogin do it bros?

>>23296303
what is your favourite bro?

>>23296243

>>23296589
a petulant twat and a fag

I bet less than 1% of /lit/ has read this but go ahead

>>23296243
drinks a lot, a little autistic but socially active

>>23296303
bisexual, poor sense of humor but well-dressed

>>23296330
secret sicko

>>23296335
skinny and anxious, passionate rateyourmusic user

apologies to those whose books I've not read

>>23296283
>scurvy-infested
How fitting, a nihilist dies infested by the lack of something.

>>23296553
stupid boring long-winded inessential ffffool

>>23297730
ketamine

>>23296335
slept with one girl last summer

the nigger of the narcissus

Responding to all the anons of books I've read myself

>>23296330
Has a problem with authority, bit of a gambling addiction as well

>>23296335
Thought the book would cure him of his addictions, probably made them worse.

>>23296553
Wishes they were born in a different time. May or may not like gin and tonics

>>23297584
Anxious, mutters under breath a lot. Gets headaches easily

>>23297742
Tried smoking cigarettes to look 'refined' ended up coughing and spitting all over the place, now favours elfbars

>>23297849
Sociopath, has an interesting view on art and it's value

>>23296243
Here's my favourite.
I didn't read the others in the thread so will not comment on how you all are.

>>23297755
kek

>>23296243
I read Demons the PV translation. I liked it a lot, but want to reread with a different translator. Do you have preference? I like McDuff a lot but he didn’t translate this one, I also like Magarshack but I don’t think his version exists as an ebook. Maybe Katz or Maguire?

>>23298507
I've (only) read the Maguire translation
I liked it, id recommend it desu

>>23298507
Maguire is based and redpilled as the kids say.

>>23296243
You’re an atheist
>>23296284
You’re very conservative
>>23296535
You enjoy simplicity
>>23296626
You’re homosexual
>>23297598
You like rock music
>>23297900
You are easily frightened

Bump I want more psychoanalysis

>>23297900
Someone who wants to fit in to society desperately.

>>23297903
Either you work out a lot or not at all

>>23298523
Correct

I don't understand having a favorite book as an adult.

>>23299009
As an adult, it should be about what themes and messages speak to you personally and provide insight into what motivates and drives you as a person. Or perhaps you just like the prose.

>>23296243
This or her Helen in Egypt

kino ending

>>23296243

>>23299323
a furry

>>23299323
a furry

>>23296283
Based. Kinda sad that the best Russian writer was a christuck

>>23296243

>>23296243

>>23297868

>>23300286
it's good but also a bit ... american