/lit/ - Literature

I love Jannies so much.

I just... I love them. I want to have babies with them. I want to name my firstborn after them.

>>23220421
That’s the most womanly horse I’ve seen. Prettier than Sarah Jessica Parker even.

>>23220429
get in line, pal!

lol shit, I posted asking why the Swedenborg thread got deleted, and I come back to see this.
Please don't delete the pretty horse thread, janny/mod. It's not as board relevant as the Swedenborg thread, but it's a very pretty horse.

>>23220421
>manic pixie dream horse edition
The horse teaches the awkward boy about life and horse parties. At first there's rivalry between the boy and Chad Horsington the stallion but it turns out Horsington is just jealous of the boy for having hands. Together he and the horses win the talent show and save horse school.

I despise people. The way they jaunt around, their little facial expressions as you act. I hate when a man slams his dick onto the table, or when a woman performs a sexual dance.
I hate when a professional pens something regarding his field---his sureness again captured through a facial expression. I hate the liberal bitch tone of voice, where tiny bits of whining make themselves known. I hate conservative confidence.
I hate when a judge slams his or her gavel. I hate when a fighter jet pilot affirms an order. I hate that notaries lobby against cryptography.
I hate when class redefines social variables.
I think I understand God. He is annoyed, just like me. I think existence might just be God's chemo treatment.

>>23220429
Sheesh...get a room

>>23220421
First time I've ever seen one of these threads get deleted, why? Because the picture he chose was repetitive?

>>23220450
throw in some horse sex and it's an instant best seller on Amazon KDP

>>23220452
v relatable, except the dick-slamming part

>>23220469
>he enjoys the dick-slamming
little gay bro

>>23220421
Nietzsche was right, it’s still Rome v.s Judea in 2024. The X spaces prove it, politics prove it, geopolitics prove it, culture proves it. We have not moved on.

>>23220479
Because leftists are right. History is just the oppressed vs. the oppressor.

>>23220493
You clearly have not read beyond good and evil if that was the simplistic binary you took from that, because he talks about that kind of thinking as human motivated.

what's the movie that opens with a limousine driving through the desert?

>>23220438
The goal is to make sure nothing interested is ever posted. If there's a good chance anything posted will be deleted anyway it conditions posters to only shitpost. It's a globalist demonic mind control conspiracy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Phb-jdM4WyQ

>>23220514
slave morality / master morality
oppressed / oppressor

Men become enslaved to female infatuation and one could argue our greatest battle in life is to conquer it and then woman-- this is the root of patriarchy

>>23220535
Sounds like a personal problem.

>>23220577
No, he’s right. Read the Iliad:War because of pussy. Read Herodotus:War because of pussy. Medieval knights: Go to battle for the promise of pussy. List goes on and on. It is the center of the world.

>>23220525
Just read beyond good and evil, because it’s a critique of morality and its origins and values on Western moral systems, not a socio-political commentary on oppression. He basically traces the "slave morality" to the resentments of the powerless “slaves” against the powerful “master” to a moral system that values traits such as humility, meekness, and altruism. What happens was that people can invert values and use them as a psychological and moral strategy for the powerless to gain a sense of superiority over those who dominated them in material or physical terms. N does not present this as inherently oppressive but as a set of values that arise from a position of strength and vitality - where it arises from a position of weakness, where the "good" is defined negatively.

It’s when the “slaves” reject those morals and instead colorized and valorized - maybe even dogmatized their quality of character. It’s how Modern politics functions now, which is why i’m lamenting.

Not all Jews are bad. Their culture is shit but I don’t think we should harm innocent Jews. I mean it only justifies it happening to whatever race you belong to too. I hate Israel and the Jewish porn industry as well as their over representation but I do get worried about the rhetoric talking about all Jews being bad

>>23220479
You can dichotomize history rather easily as long as the binary is universal on both ends.

>>23220607
The issue behind that is the “Average Jew” supports those people, Jews like Finkelstein are very rare and the entire Jewish community pretty much excommunicated him. The truth is they believe they benfit when people like Soros are in power, 85% also hold alliance to Israel and that’s just not surprising because multiculturalism is joke. People used it as a strategy to manipulate other groups.

It doesn’t matter what Jews do or think or what could happen, because their fate if sealed. They’re a cursed people, and every 80 something years they will be thrown into the bibical loop of God giving them to their false desires and soon after getting destroyed again until the process repeats itself like in the Old Testament.

>>23220624
Most low Jews are just brainwashed I mean the dumbest idea is that they’re all somehow in on it for any entity ever that’s never the case there’s always the decision makers and useful idiots so yes you’re right, they help their destructive leaders, but that doesn’t justify not giving a chance for any random jew to show their character, before deciding how to react at encountering them. Like as a white guy it’s in my best interest to follow this principle so that god influences potential threats who may prejudge me from reacting in a way that will victimize me. It follows the categorical imperative and therefore, because the categorical imperative follows it, the rule and will of God. Whether or not you’re right on the second part, which yes does follow theologically and historically, does not affect the imperative to still act morally before the eye of God

>>23220518
I mean, the stated goal of think-tank/intelligence/defense adjacent retards is explicitly "make the site less interesting for users". This, combined with the retarded timer for posting and even more egregious five fucking minute timer to make a thread shows they're clearly trying to throttle an already slowly dying site to death more quickly.

>>23220664
What could possibly be so important you can't wait one fucking minute to post it?

>>23220664
How many post do you make? How many threads? Honestly I wish there was a 1 thread per week limit per anon

Have you ever thought of being the perfect one of someone? The one to give everlasting support, to fight against all odds, to give hope in times of needs? I was one of them, once. I was loved for it. It felt great. But the closer you get to an ideal, the farther you get from yourself. I thought I was that person, but I wasn't. Everything that made me charming—likable as a human being, was fake. My real self isn't as pretty as what the light was reflecting off me. I'm an actor, but not the hollywood kind. A social actor. I become the ideal of somebody for a time before losing my grip and morphing into something else. That is who I am. That's the résumé of all my relationships so far. I am meant for temporary greatness and nothing else. A snowflake, a dream, a breathe on the mirror. Loved, and even admired sometimes, for the wrong reasons.

Unlike snowflakes, there is no beauty in my nature. I am a fox, a rat, a betrayer, and that is all I will ever be.

>>23220421
I feel like there’s some kind of raid or way too active sperg with all the Game of Thrones threads

>>23220693
Foxes and rats are much more interesting than snowflakes, your metaphor doesn't work. I think you're a snowflake.

Did girls look better in the mid 20th century?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cK5k7srWRO0

>>23220723
No

>>23220588
I could agree that they are brainwashed because Talmudic Judaism is just straight up wrong, cult like, and man made.

Moderate Jews are unfortunately rare when the “chips are down” so to speak, when they feel that their ‘position’ in the world - real or not, is threatened and those insane blood libel actions are taken in their positions. Even if it’s just a moderate take like Finkelstein saying Jews use the Holocaust to justify horrible things, then you will see that semitic zealotry that has defined their tribe for millennia. Muslims are warlike terrorists and the Jews are the financial terrorists.

I can agree that you’ll find a Finkelstein one in a while, but it’s hard because the Jewish culture are built upon celebrating the death of the “Other,” lamenting about blood wars 2,000 years ago in way most people would scratch their heads on. Rome is important, because the hatred of the Roman Empire due to their alleged wrong-doings against the Jews, is an extremely important essence to understand why they despise Europe and the White western world in general from a Jewish prospective. A lot of it is just plain old resentment, it’s not that nuanced really. They are smart enough to know they got their asses handed to them, it’s just plain doubling down.

Like, the Jewish holiday of Purim is when the Jewish people are commanded to destroy the enemies of our people in all times, in all places. to Destroy “Amalek and his descendants" and the prime minister has involved Amalek against Gaza.

I don’t know what you mean by “Giving them a chance” means, what like the converting the level headed one? Then go to a Orthodox Ghettos and convert them, you’ll likely fail, and once you see what’s wore on in Talmund it’s very hard not to be suspicious of them.The Jews you are talking about will speak for themselves, best you can do is pray because you’re not going to change their mind on one sitting if you want to do the right thing, but very unlikely given their collective track record.

Unless they accept Christ, they will stop being a cursed people.

>>23220723
You mean before a diet of tacobell and dick everyday gee I wonder

>>23220516
if you're high, probably things are tough all over
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ROwVrF0Ceg

>>23220723
love this song and Alex G

>>23220657
I could agree that they are brainwashed because Talmudic Judaism is just straight up wrong, cult like, and man made.

Moderate Jews are unfortunately rare when the “chips are down” so to speak, when they feel that their position in the world - real or not, is threatened and those insane blood libel actions are taken in their positions of power. Even if it’s just a moderate take like Finkelstein saying Jews use the Holocaust to justify horrible things, then you will see that semitic zealotry that has defined their tribe for millennia that even Romans took notice of. Muslims are warlike terrorists and the Jews are the financial terrorists.

I can agree that you’ll find a Finkelstein one in a while, but it’s hard because the Jewish culture is central and built upon celebrating the death of the “Other,” lamenting about blood wars 2,000 years ago in way most people would scratch their heads on. Rome is important, because the hatred of the Roman Empire due to their alleged wrong-doings against the Jews, is an extremely important essence to understand why they despise Europe and the White western world in general from a Jewish prospective. A lot of it is just plain old resentment, it’s not that nuanced really. They are smart enough to know they got their asses handed to them, it’s just plain doubling down.

Like, the Jewish holiday of Purim is when the Jewish people are commanded to destroy the enemies people in all times, in all places. to Destroy “Amalek and his descendants" and the prime minister has involved Amalek against Gaza.

I don’t know what you mean by “giving them a chance” means, like converting the level headed one? that would be good, go to a Orthodox Ghetto. You’ll likely fail and offptutted by their way of life, and once you see what’s written on in Talmund it’s very hard not to be suspicious of them. Because it’s not about what you think of them, it’s what they think of you.

The Jews you are talking about will speak for themselves, best you can do is pray because you’re not going to change their mind in one sitting if you want to do the right thing, but very unlikely given their collective track record. Unless they accept Christ, they will stop being a cursed people.

>>23220586
>Read Herodotus:War because of pussy.
Herodotus is more war because not enough government mandated whoring

>>23220746
Thanks, love ya too

>>23220432
whoa ancient pop culture reference

I'm at least heavy metal. My status is at least secured in that regard. I am metal.

>>23220752
>Unless they accept Christ, they will stop being a cursed people.
And you Christcucks are hypocritical sanctimonious schizos, who also plunder and wreak havoc historically speaking, but you feel assured you can always beg for forgiveness from your angry, jealous God too. You, the Mudslimes, and Jews are all the same shit.

>>23220847
I don’t take people who use the word “Christcuck” without a shred of irony any consideration, I just assume you are fallen and ill. I’ll pray for you.

>>23220493
It could be the French Revolution, it could be taxes, it could be building codes, or art the topic doesn’t really matter. Nietzsche would say they will always support destroying things owned by people they think are better than them.

Always conscious of being outside paradise.

>>23220874
I curse the Holy Spirit every day, and I KNOW you will eat shit in hell. I don't need to pray since I know your destine. You Christcucks and Mudslimes and Heebs are all the same equally vile shit. Each of you is equally responsible for the devastating state of the modern world.
And stick to weeb shit, low IQ dumbass.

>>23220895
I would agree but I feel like we have very different reasonings and conclusions leading/flowing from that point.

This country makes it hard to fuck

if you're both jewish and a woman the ability to not talk exclusively about yourself must be physiologically impossible.

Does anyone want to listen to some gay podcast occasionally mildly insightful shit about homogenization of culture

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpA3mVRKfkQ

We're never going to disprove solipsism are we?

how would you go about disproving solipsism when every single sense you have is potentially fallible and even your logic can fail you due to being product of fallible mind that is using information gathered from fallible senses
there is no disproving it, anyone who says they can are retarded

>>23221061
I WANT SHAKESPEARE TO HAVE BEEN REAL DAMN YOU SAME WITH TOLSTOY

>>23221070
what does it matter how "real" they are if it's all just a dream of the self anyway? they're just as real as you are in the dream

>>23221073
but its so lonely. i don't like thinking people aren't conscious. it feels opposite of what god commands.
and yes i know god might not be real but i'm choosing to trust my experiences and feelings about it

>>23221076
>solipsism is lonely
such is life
>i don't like thinking people aren't conscious
even without solipsism people would still default to path of least resistance, "intuition" and a variety of spooks that conveniently justifies what it is they want to do anyway
>god commands
no comments
>experience and feelings
no comments

>>23221061
I have reasons to doubt it. Mostly because I'm way too low IQ to formulate J. Conrad (for example) on my own.
Regardless, it really doesn't matter if it's all in my head. The world for all intents and purposes exists.

>>23220421
I feel like I learn more from other religions than from my own. With other religions I can question things, I can analyze and study their texts from various angles, etc.

With my own religion there's always the aspect of it being my faith. Questioning it seems dangerous. No room for thought, only blind acceptance.

>>23220421
I hate shitbulls

Please just talk to me please don’t do this to me anymore

the fuck you want?

I can’t fucking do this anymore

what
do
you
want?

>>23221157
Hi!

>>23220452
I'd read an entire novel or book of poems written like this of yours, something oddly compelling about the slightly bizarre, off-center subjects of hate.

>>23221167
You are not real???

>>23221173
What do you mean?

>>23221173
define real

>>23221175
>>23221177
You’re not the one

Why

>>23221190
Who is the one?

FEEL LIKE I'M THE ONLY ONE
THE ONLY ONE
THE CHOSEN ONE
THE CHOSEN ONE

>>23221206
He already knows so it’s not you

>>23221229
Dang it! I wish it was me.

>>23220421
Has anyone here spend any time on reddit? I just started checking it out for some gaming shit and the people there are somehow more rude and retarded than 4chan (pol tv not included ofc)

Hows that possible? I thought lack of anonymity (reddit) was supposed to bring better behavior but instead anonymity (4chan) is what seems to bring basedness

how to stop being negatively impacted by rude and retarded people online?

>>23220421
I've been disinherited.
I feel beautiful.
Free.
True to myself.
Never before like this in my life.

>>23221254
what you do to be disinherited?

>>23220421
The taste of tragedy is always bitter, no matter how banal.

>>23221259
Nothing, at least not in the eyes of anyone with a shred of honor. I was outmaneuvered and betrayed by a cowardly "contender", who spread lies about me, and I was judged to have gone against the spineless, worthless rich sack of shit who made it his whole identity to dole out money to whoever showed the most obeisance in that moment.
Literally and truly eat the rich. Kill all rich people. They view you as meat and want you dead, yet at the same time fetishize proletarian concepts of honor and community which they in their viperous natures will never comprehend. As a working class scion who has glimpsed the attitudes of the elite, they view us as expendable meat. They want us dead the moment we show no worth to them. Kill them. Please. They are humanity's enemies.

>>23221245
you sound like a BITCH lol

>>23221269
lol

Being depressive is having the choice between 2 emotions: Do nothing and feel bored, or do stuff and feel bad. Happiness is mostly limited to booze

>>23220421
Nigger

>>23221277
i am anon
how to stop being bitch ?

>>23221279
That's all you have to say about my unmatched comedic genius? "lol"? I'll have you know I spent seven years studying various forms of comedy, and I made friends in high places with my extreme comedic value, from dark and dry humor, to wholesome humor, to normie humor like you seem to indulge in. I am MILES ahead of you in comedy, and if you ever dare speak to me with that tongue again, I will fucking ruin you. I hope, that for your safety, we never meet again.

>>23220421
>Doesn't watch TV
>Listens to irrelevant music
>Book crowds are either pretentious assholes or boring nerds
>Leftists ruin all normal social interaction with pronouns and other queer shit
>Anyone vaguely normal is only interested in drugs and alcohol
>Too agnostic for Christianity, too Christian for atheists
>Emotionally drained from existentialism
I feel so fucking lonely.

>>23221301
:P

>>23221309
learn to have casual fun with folks that don't take shit too seriously

>>23221295
i'll let you know if i ever find out

>>23220421
Is it bad that I see slavery as moral. I mean slavery of the Roman sort. In fact, I think it would be a welcome alternative to paying off debt and the nation's industry could really benefit from a slave labor system. People just need to get over the whole slavery=blacks ideology.

>be me back in junior high
>get assigned Call of the Wild by our English teacher
>upon finishing weeks later, it was revealed we would be doing a project
>one that involved splitting off into groups and decorating square pieces of cookie cake with icing and candy
>each piece had to represent a particular chapter that was assigned
>my group was given a particularly violent chapter
>when done, we were allowed to eat it
>my friends were kind enough to leave the center piece for me; the gory depiction of a dead dog covered in blood

>>23221322
>casual fun
Why would I want that?

>>23221353
your isolation stems from taking your hobbies and other people and their interests way to seriously
let your hair down, relax, find chill people, it'll be easier to connect with them

>>23221338
be slave in ancient Rome
>just fucking leave
>there's no sophisticated police force or surveillance system with which to track you down
>there's well-maintained, pedestrian-safe highways so you can get to anywhere in the empire on foot
>you can get a job anywhere as long you can demonstrate you have the requisite skills
>don't have to fill out 300 digital applications and pass a background check just to be in the running
be free in modern USA
>can't leave your city without a car because there's nothing till the next city but 70 mph six lane highway with no shoulder
>everything you've ever done will follow you everywhere forever
>prospective employers need your address and credit score and SSN and fingerprints and a copy of your birth certificate your mother's maiden name your medical history a timestamped picture of your penis and a signed recommendation from your landlord
>"we'll get back to you"
at least i can have gay sex and play video games

It should be no surprise people are so disenchanted with pop culture. Everything good was done decades ago, so why get invested when we know what quality is? Pro wrestling, video games, books, movies, music, television, even our fucking food - the past really was the best, and only sheltered schmucks will gripe on about "muh nostalgia" and "think of the poor Jugoslavs" even though from cradle to grave, their whole lives depend on Chinese child slaves. Makes you wish you were born a decade or two before you were, so you'd be outta here faster.

I just spent another hour fishing shit out of my asshole with my fingers because it wouldn't come out on its own. Be careful about eating protein bowls, fellas.

>>23221266
An old man dies, blind and bed-ridden, surrounded by a family with nothing but rancour for him, a wife that despised him, sons that he suspected weren't his, mistreated daughters impatiently awaiting his death.
Years later a middle aged man passes away, in a city far from home, home to all the scum in the earth. Buried in alien soil, he is mourned by his family, a wife and his adopted son; a congregation of strangers, too, mourn him. They mourn the father of the church on third street, they mourn he who guided them through so much for so long. The son mourns the man buried, his father.
A young man sits by his computer with a face illuminated by azure light. Imagining a grave sunbathed by a warm sun on a faraway land, an old woman weeps, sons and daughters reminisce. Wistfully they retell tales in a strange land. Lovingly, the stranger's grave is offered flowers. The man turns back into the light and begins typing.

>>23221451
I missed many commas. Meh, it's not like anyone was going to read it anyway.

I've such beautiful ideas but lack either the ability or persistence to get them onto the page. I miss the unrestrained enthusiasm with which I approached everything as a child, and how flawlessly I was able to achieve whatever I wanted. How can I regain that?

does anyone else get intense instinctual tingling in our tailbone every time you watch a video of people falling?

>>23221054
We?

>>23220874
“Christcuck” may be crass, but at least he hasn’t deluded himself into believing a random Jew from 2000 years ago is god. I especially hope you didn’t convert because you think Mass is sparkly and atheism is boring.

>>23221061
i believe in love and live my life accordingly

>>23221061
Because it literally doesn't matter and doesn't impact how you will behave or perceive the world.

i still haven't listened to vultures 1.

>>23221510
Kanye fell off.
Life of Pablo was his last hurrah

>>23221514
you didn't like kids see ghosts?

>>23221520
I liked it but it’s not in the same league as a Pablo or his earlier albums

>>23220421
The future is filled with incredible wonder and horror.

I almost converted to orthodox Christianity a year ago but now I find many of them annoying. They are not sincere believers and are just using orthodoxy as a way to bash the West. Everything is a grand religious and historical conspiracy.

i am on my tippy toes dancing to a dream i daren't leap for

Having a big ol' suck on some menthols rn

I intend on launching a new publishing house. What would you like to see in the publishing industry that you currently don’t.

Asian dudes really are the bros.

>>23220586
>Iliad:War because of pussy
Menelas is there for pussy (to retrieve his wife Helen), the rest of the Chiefs and hosts of Greece are there for their own personal reasons: spoil, fame, glory, hatred of Troy, love of battle, etc. But to say the Trojan war was fought solely over pussy is not true.

>>23221768
is this the face that launched a thousand ships and burnt the topless towers of ilion

>>23221631
>just using orthodoxy as a way to bash the West.
I noticed this too but I still converted and have been Orthodox for 5 years and counting. The big change for me was that I began attending an American Orthodox church instead of a Greek one. Greeks, even the Greek Americans, love to bash the west and America. I love their culturr and history but they haven't contributed much to the world of philosophic and literary thought since antiquity. Now I have issues with my country and culture as an American but they almost turn it into a fetish. I'd encourage you to try attending an American Orthodox service and see what you think. Being made up primarily of Americans I found the atmospgere very amiable and still highly authentic to Ortodoxy. Also remember the denomination unironically doesn't matter in the end. What matters is obedience to Christ. Godspeed.

>>23221660
My sophomoric and gramatically incorrect writing. Unfortuantely, both of us know why this can't happen.

Are liberal arts degrees actually useless or is it just a big meme?

>>23221815
It depends highly on the specific degree and school.

>>23221809
If you could write something editable, I would consider publishing it after editing. That’s basically what the editing process is for.

About 12 years ago I saved some peoples phone numbers on my gmail as well as on my simcard, or so I thought. Then my phone got stolen a few years later and it turns out nothing was saved on my gmail.

>>23221658
Enjoy em while ya can

>>23221774
Where in the Iliad does it say that? Helen is barely in it.

>>23221815
a legitimate, classical liberal arts degree is the best degree you can get. It's all they used to give out at colleges, with a specific field as your focus. But such a degree in it's original state doesn't exist anymore, for shame.

>>23221839
the war is barely in it

>>23221854
The war is the entire book, now you're just trolling.

>>23221860
it starts 9 years after the start of the war and ends before the end of it. that's the joke among all classical scholars; the iliad being called the iliad is nonsense, because it's not about ilion.

>>23220421
What am I in for /lit/?
My potentially future wife loves this book.

>>23221868
read this as an unhappy child staying at my grandma's in rainy wales

>>23221835
I accidentally sent a bikini pic of a girl I was crushing on to a group chat for work (mostly women) several years ago. I can only assume that if I ever run for office or have public persona, I’ll be “outed” as a pervert.

>>23221866
>It's not about Ilion
It most certainly is. It's a detailed and accurate picture of the cultures, customs, and religious institutions of the ancient Trojans and Greeks. Maybe you weren't paying attention when you read it, or have read a very poor translation (of which there are many). The only nonsensical thing would be to think a book that captures the battles, actions and struggles on the shores of Troy during the Trojan war should not be called the Iliad.

>>23221887
we're introduced nine years into the war, at the argument between achilles and agamemnon, and it ends before troy falls, when achilles returns the corpse of hector. because the story is about the anger of achilles.
what's the first line? 'sing to me muse the anger of achilles and its terrible consequences

the battle passages are perfunctory and, except for the pleasant similes that embellish them, can be skipped without offence to homer.

>>23220874
I just find them suffering from a case of permanent adolescence and arrested development even if they have a PhD.

>>23221839
The Illiad is part two of an eight Poem long cycle about the war and the after.

>>23221929
It's not called "the trojan war" it's called "The Iliad". It would not be 'nonsense' for someone to write a play about a platoon during the Vietnam war and call it 'Vietnam'. Yes, the book starts with Achilles and his anger at the offensive and dishonor he suffers at the hands of Agamenmom in front of the hosts of Greece. But outside of book IV, when the Greek council is sent to his tent urging him to battle, and then later his return in book XVIII onto the end, he is in little more than 1/3rd of the poem (though his scene's are by far the greatest). You're being pedantic. It's an epic poem, meant to entertain and inspire, not a historical chronicle like Plutach or Xenophon would have written. Although, as I have mentioned, it does chronicle in great detail the customs of the Greeks and Trojans. Why book II is a geneological chronicle of all the Greek tribes.

>the battle passages are perfunctory and, except for the pleasant similes that embellish them, can be skipped without offence to homer.

Those are some of the most lucid and awesome parts of the poem. The excitement of the Iliad is founded on the action and struggle of the battles, the rapid transitions, the guesome, awful and sublime imagery. The battles are the ultimate display of Homer's poetic genius, all his moments of sublimity, perhaps his most remarkable trait as an author, are found entirely in the battles, such as when Hector is described whirling through battle like a hurricane, Diomede in book V as a torrent river rushing down the mountain after a fierce storm, decimating vineyards and villages, when he bears down on the Trojans, the several instances of 'Huge' Ajax slaughtering Trojans with stones and boulders, wielding them as though they were 'sheeps clothe'. These are just a few of the several instances in Homer where he takes you above and outside of ourselves, fills us with a sense of wonder and astonishment. They are founded almost entirely in the battles, and it would be highly offensive to his poetic genius to 'skip' them.

People like you debase and demean poetics. You couldn't make it into the house of poetry or the arts any other way. Your commentary on the Iliad really reminds me how much this board has fallen. Anons used to understand what made Homer great. What made him masculine and inspiring. Now we have some psued 'scholar' insulting his genius in the highest degree. Makes me sick.

Learning about the past teaches more about the present than studying the present does and studying the present teaches more about the past than studying the past does.

>>23221983
>It's an epic poem, meant to entertain and inspire, not a historical chronicle
obviously.

>the guesome, awful and sublime imagery
the battles were cartoons to sate his reactionary and anti-intellectual audience. homer had to strain his imagination in describing novel varieties of manslaughter, which he credited to the ancestors of his hosts (typically crass, snobbish princelings). he barely bothered to get his military background accurate, his fighting is a careless muddle and he indiscriminately mixed up modern and outmoded weapons. he was contemptuous of the stupidities of war. he's so careless, too, about the names of trojans killed - greek sword-fodder - that erymas, acamas and chromius get dispatched twice, and chromius lives to tell the tale.
>Hector is described whirling through battle like a hurricane
>except for the pleasant similes that embellish them

homer wasn't a solemn old bore, but an iconoclast with a deep sense of irony who had to wrap up his jokes about the gods and his lampooning of the ancient heroes to get them by his stuffy public. he wrote satire, not pompous tragedy, an attitude that has been consistently misunderstood.

yeah yeah, the sun has, as it were, set forever on /lit/. do you ever listen to yourself?

>>23222026
You are clearly not worth engaging with any further on this topic. I will leave it at this: it seems to me you are an envious and bitter pedant who cannot make it into the house of poetry any other way, than to demean and debase one of the greatest works of poetics ever written, with lies, slander, and mischaracterization.

Their fighting aside, for those interested in reading and studying Homer's Iliad I would encourage them to read William Cowper's Translation, which can be found here:

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/16452/16452-h/16452-h.htm#book05

For an English speaker, it is the closest we can get to reading Homer in the original Greek. I hope those unfamiliar with Homer and the Iliad can read and enjoy this awesome story, with this great scholastic edition that has very informative annotations.

>>23221871
>read this as an unhappy child staying at my grandma's in rainy wales
Did you grow up in England?

>>23222067
where did that come from? i adore homer - don't care for the stagnant reverence. i only care about homer.
i don't even know how you got so rattled. you know 'the iliad being called the iliad' comment wasn't a critique, just an aside. homeridae didn't give it the name.

Every single politician but one in my city is a black progressive democrat. The mayor is a black woke Democrat. The sheriff is a black woke Democrat. The whole city council is black woke Democrats. The district attorney is a jewish woke Democrat. I looked up other cities and they’re less black but more woke Democrats. There are basically no cities in this country that aren’t run entirely by woke Democrats.

What the fuck?

>>23222090
yep

>>23222101
nta anon but it seems to me he loves Homer more than you. All you've done is insult Homer.

>>23222123
unthinkable

>>23222124
That's all you've done. This entire reply is leveling insult and criticism to Homer >>23222026. Not to mention it isn't true, the battles are highly detailed and accurate in terms of phlanx formation, class of warriors, how they rallied and communicated with eachother, which weapons were used in battle, how shields, armor, and chariots are described, but at a certain point, especially when the Gods embue a warrior with power in a battle as Neptune, Pallas, and Mars due, the scene's become pure chaos. "Everyone has a plan until the fighting starts". You really are just a bitter pedant. All you can do is insult, you must come from a very bizzare school of 'scholarship' that takes such a cold and dead approach to such a lively and hotblooded poem.

>>23222124
someone who uses 'anti-intellectual' as a criticism screams pedant. You must be of the modern scholastic type.

>>23222104
But don’t forget anon, they’re utterly powerless it’s the big mean white man causing all the worlds problems. The us needs to either Balkanize or get taken over by China or Russia theres literally no other good outcomes

>>23222104
Which city do you live in?

As he opened his eyes he stood right between desaturated grass plains that faded into darkness and seemingly endless gray ocean under the stone sky.

Gonna get my 6pack of beer. If I overwork, then I get drunk. No in between.

>>23222123
>All you've done is insult Homer.
how will he ever recover...

>>23220421
just bought an expensive keyboard, and I can't get it to pair with my lop. I can't even just use the fucking USB cable to get it to work. I am SO SICK OF THIS SHIT. EVERY TIME I BUY A NEW TECH THING IT TAKES THREE HOURS TO SET IT UP. WHY IS IT FUCKING LIKE THIS?!

I AM GOING TO LOSE MY SHIT.

>>23222202
Recover from what? He wrote a poem that anons 2,800 years later are still admiring and debating over. No one even knows who any of us are.

>>23222138
just making a point, you're doing homer a disservice if you're treating him like a virgil or dante. he treats his subjects with irony in the iliad (like euripides did). if anything i'm only insulting your reading.

i know my homer better than most, i can say so without boasting because most know very little about him. as a proof of my readiness to accept critical convention, let me put a compliment on the record: astyanax being frightened by his dad's helmet (which homer kept referring to) - very touching.

though chariot combats do occur frequently - hector even drives a quadriga and orders a couple of mass-charges - the relation of chariotry to infantry remains obscure. homer feels most at ease when his heroes forget their chariots and fight shield to shield in an unbroken line. he feels obliged to modernize most of the fighting in order to hold his audience; and often cannot decide whether a particular hero is armed with the single lance and body-shield or with two throwing-spears and a shield.

a couple of reasons prevented homer from making his battles realistic. one was that the feats or fates of common soldiers did not interest his patrons, who cared to hear only of duels between noblemen. no man-at-arms ever kills a nobleman, even by mistake; which seems odd, since they are all clad in full armour, with corslets, greaves, helmets and shields.

>>23222143
i'm thersites

>>23222205
exactly

>>23220421
I'm scared I might have testicular cancer. I have a dull ache in my right ball that becomes painful when I masturbate. I don't have health insurance and can't afford to get it checked out. Google says it could just be an infection, but I would still need antibiotics I can't afford. My only plan is to just hope it gets better on its own and I don't die. So far this has actually worked out for every health scare I've ever had in my life, but I'm getting older and I know it's only a matter of time before something serious happens that either kills or bankrupts me. I have a gun.

>>23222252
That might actually be testicular cancer bud, I had a coworker who complained about the same thing and it ended up being cancer. Luckily it is the easiest cancer to treat (cutting off that nut) and survival rates are super high if you get it checked out early enough.

>>23222252
this is the most american post of all time

>>23222227
Homer never strikes me or any legitimate literary critic of the Iliad as 'ironic'. I have never heard that criticism levied against him, ever, nor has that ever been my impression of him. Which translation of Homer's Iliad have you read? I am seriously doubting whether you have really read him seriously at all. It seems more like you've read commentaries on him, than have actually read him.

>homer feels most at ease
>he feels obliged
So you are an expert in what Homer felt and what inspired him? You know what he felt when he composed the Iliad? You would be taken more seriously if you framed it as 'it seems to me that'

>no man-at-arms ever kills a nobleman, even by mistake; which seems odd, since they are all clad in full armour, with corslets, greaves, helmets and shields.
Because Homer is very clear that the Chiefs are each tribe are Chiefs for a reason: They are the superior warriors, with greater skill in arms and elocution in leading their troops. It's why they're described as 'God-like', 'Huge', 'matchless in the race', 'swiftest of the swift'. It's why they slaughter the averaged man-at-arms like they are nothing. Of course I am most interested in the battles between the greatest warriors, not random no-names, and of course those no-names are slaughtered by the greatest warriors, and there is no reason to mention them. No skilled film director spends much time focusing on the unnamed characters deaths in a battle scene, the focus is placed solely on the named characters, often their leaders, and those most skilled in arms, and their conflicts with eachother. This is such a basic tenent of any storytelling that it's amazing to me I even have to explain it at all.

The way you keep belittling and demeaning the average reader is sickening. Reading is a visceral experience, not an intellectual one. We want to be entertained. What makes Homer so captivating is how he sweeps us along with him like a roaring ocean or a raging fire with the energy and vigor of his writing. People like you disgust me. I'm honestly starting to wonder if I'm just speaking with an AI program, something about this almost doesn't seem human.

>>23221983
I am NTA. But I have to disagree with the assesment that the Illiad is a good source for Troyan customs. And perhaps neither is it a particularly accurate one for the Greeks of the Hellenic dark age, but I'm not to be a judge of that.
I should start by saying that the Illiad is, of course, a poem and not a history. But regardless, I believe the value of the Poem insofar as the study of history is concerned lies on the light it shines onto the psyche of the ancient Greeks. Along with providing an interesting window to the blurry memories of the Mycenean period.

>>23222292
Book II is more or less a codex of Grecian geneology, and book III is very detailed in terms of the difference between Grecian and Trojan military strategy and discipline. Book I starting at 550 gives the most exact account of the ancient sacrifices that we have left us. There is first, the purification by the washing of hands; second, the offering up of prayers; third, the barley-cakes thrown upon the victim; fourth, the manner of killing it, with the head turned upwards; fifth, selecting the thighs and fat for their gods, as the best of the sacrifice, and disposing about them pieces cut from every part for a representation of the whole (hence the thighs are frequently spoken of in Homer and the Greek poets as the whole victim); sixth, the libation of wine; seventh, consuming the thighs in the fire of the altar; eighth, the sacrificers dressing and feasting on the rest, with joy and hymns to the gods.

These are just a few instances off the top of my head. So I disagree that the Iliad has no historical value or accuracy.

>>23222288
KWAB

>>23222288
if we go further back, the iliad, while popular, earned little reverence until the 5th century when jurists and grammarians treated it as a bible. xenophanes complained of homer's representation of the gods (well before thucydides discussed him as a reputable theologian, if sometimes inclined to figurative language). then homer became the basis for all education when peisistratus turned it into a sacrosanct epic for political reasons, unfortunately it is that solemn atmosphere that has prevailed.

>'it seems to me that'
implicit. bad practice to state and restate the obvious.
>This is such a basic tenent of any storytelling that it's amazing to me I even have to explain it at all.
you're explaining back to me what i pointed out without thinking twice about why i said it.
>The way you keep belittling and demeaning the average reader is sickening.
what is the 'average reader'? for 2,600 years homer has been done wrong; purists and classicists have buried the real meaning under the dust of their own platitudes and prosiness. the point missed by dreary generations is homer's caustic humour. his whole attitude to the gods is pure comedy (though he was at bottom a religious man).

>>23221355
Fuck off and die. I don't want to be around you fucking people. I'm the miserable one? Lol.

>>23220421
---- Solaria ----
9021
Sonic Versailles

Ordinaries usual as uxurious monarchs
And electronic engineers

Always miss the sweetest tune
Or circumstance--

The sense of universally rare occasion
On universal scale.

>>23222350
>I feel so fucking lonely.
No wonder.

>>23222365
Yeah, fuck you. I bet you have a wonderful life full of friends. I would rather kill myself before sincerely socializing with anyone.

>>23222347
>implicit. bad practice to state and restate the obvious.
It is not implicit that you think it when you say "Homer felt obliged". That is to state it as a fact that Homer felt obliged, as opposed to state it as how you think he felt. We have no idea how Homer felt exactly.
>you're explaining back to me what i pointed out without thinking twice about why i said it.
I did think twice about why you said it. You found it odd that a no named man-at-arms never kills a noblemen, and I explained to you in no uncertain terms why it isn't odd at all. They are the less skilled warriors, so of course they never killed a noblemen: they weren't skilled enough to. If they were skilled enough, and had proven themselves in battle (as all the Chiefs had already), they wouldn't be men-at-arms, they would be Chiefs.
>what is the 'average reader'? for 2,600 years homer has been done wrong; purists and classicists have buried the real meaning under the dust of their own platitudes and prosiness.
The irony is that is what you are doing right now.
>the point missed by dreary generations is homer's caustic humour. his whole attitude to the gods is pure comedy (though he was at bottom a religious man).
None of this is true. He does not treat the God's in a comedic manner at all. The descriptions of the deity's are grave and often reaching into the sublime, as when Jove's hair bobbing 'shakes the universe', when his throne in Ida is described as being an entire mountain, both awful and sublime images revealing the enormity of his magnitude. Is Apollo 'clanging the cord, dread sounding' as he sends a plague to the Grecian camp 'comedic'? Of course it isn't. If Achilles crying for his goddess mother when his bride is stolen from him, her consoling him, and then her weeping at the knee of Jove to avenge the dishonor her son Achilles has bore at the expense of Agamenmon 'comedic'? Of course not, they are moving and emotional scenes, all of them. Nothing could be comedic about them.
Again consider Neptune's descent from Ida to his home:
>With rapid strides he came; the mountains huge
And forests under the immortal feet
Trembled of Ocean’s Sovereign as he strode.
Three strides he made, the fourth convey’d him home
To Ægæ.
Three steps to walk from a mountain to the depths of the ocean; the mountains and forrests being under his feet as pebble's and twigs. Again, a display of the enormity of the God's. Nothing in this description is comedic or could possibly be interpreted as such.

You're just an idiot. I honestly don't know what else to say. Yes, some moments in the Iliad are legitimately funny. Hector meeting with his wife and child when his child burps and is afraid of him, while Hector and Andromache laugh is a funny scene. But the scene's with the god's are not, unless it involves Minerva and Juno scheming, but that's more comedic in that it exposes the childish folly and vainity of women.

>>23221884
I probably wrote a huge amount of cringy shit that i forgot about that would get unearthed if I ever get famous

Maybe my life wasn't as real as I thought it was. Maybe I unjustly believed I deserved to exist. Maybe I am forcing my sense of self and identity on a mere blank mass of phenomena. Maybe the best I can hope for is to one day shrink smaller and smaller until I am gone completely or to undo my own birth. Maybe I should never meet anyone's eyes and speak only when spoken to and go out only in the early morning or late at night when no others are around.
I want to disappear. Negate that which defines me as "not this" in relation to the rest of the world. To die.

>>23222292
To add:
Neither Homer, nor anyone he would have personally known ever saw the city of Troy as retold in his Poems. Between Homer's time and the destruction of archeological Troy there are hundreds of years. And there is no reason to assume the Luwians would worship the exact same Gods as the Greeks in the same way.
>>23222311
Book two might be a codex of Mythical genealogy, but this genealogy is of the age of heroes, a vague memory of the Mycenean period that misremembers the epoch as something entirely different. And you omit the fact that a great deal of the lines outlined in the poem were later displaced by the Dorians/Heraclids. Included in these were the Atrides themselves.
Book III being detailed does not mean much because things can be invented, especially if one is both a poet and and experienced in war as homer surely was. I again refer back to the temporal distance between Homer and Troy as inhabited by Troyans. Even the generous estimate (destruction of Troy VIIb) puts nearly two centuries between them. And this interpretation just compromises Homer's reliability because then he would be conflating something that happened two hundred years before his time with the Mycenean period.
Adressing the ritual part, I agree that the Illiad contains the most detailled accounts of Greek religious practices, however, this has nothing to do with Troyan practices.
I also was not saying the Illiad had no value, it just isn't an accurate portrayal of history as we know it know thanks to archeology and Linear A. But it is probably based on things that happened, just very loosely.
Chariot warfare is barely even touched upon save for perhaps an old timer's reference of preferring fighting the old way.

>>23222443
Just bee yourself

Gooning like crazy niggers of 4chan. First they removed poster count and now we have come to a true golden age of the dubs.

>>23222391
>We have no idea how Homer felt exactly.
therefore it's implicit.

the iliad's not like the ugaritic baal or the hittite song of ullikummi written to praise rulers and exalt gods, homer satirized his rulers. in most myth-making societies, what happens in the courts of heaven reflects what happens in the royal palace below, but homer lets his gods behave far worse than the one royal family to which he introduces us (the trojans). zeus throws horrible threats at his wife and the rest of the olympian family, well aware of their jealousies, grudges, deceptions, lies, and adulteries.

>If Achilles crying for his goddess mother when his bride is stolen from him
he later tells the envoys that he does not really want the girl - she means nothing to him - and that he despises treasure (then insists on priam’s paying a tremendous ransom for hector’s corpse: a transaction which he dishonestly hides from the privy council)

>>23222391
Is this RC Waldun?

>>23222203
Never had such a problem, though I did break a cheap wireless keyboard by throwing it across a room after the 5th or so failed attempt to enter one of my weird and very long passwords in a setting where it doesn't screen echo but shows up as all "*" characters. Drove to a 24/7 store that stocks a couple of such, while wearing house slippers. Some (relatively new) tech is amazingly dependable. I'm posting this from an Asus laptop that has been on almost constantly since 2017. Pretty amazing piece of work overall.. Even recently as 10 years earlier than that, pretty much anything available was shit by comparison even without regard to cost, Video standards are what I find really infuriating, since those are designed primarily to frustrate piracy, and in the process make even the most legal of users jump through long sets of flaming hoops.

>>23222468
>therefore it's implicit.
No, it isn't. If my coworker does something and I don't know why they did it, I don't say "anon felt obliged because". I would say "Well I think they did it, because I think they felt this way, and these are my reasonings for that". see the difference?
>he later tells the envoys that he does not really want the girl - she means nothing to him
Why are you making up facts?
>I loved the fair Briseïs at my heart.
>But having dispossess’d me of my prize
>So foully, let him not essay me now,425
>For I am warn’d, and he shall not prevail.
That is his address to the council in book IX. He says that he did love Briseis at his heart, but that even if she were offered back to him there, to return to battle, he still wouldn't as he held the dishonor of Agamenmon in front of the tribes of Greece as beeing too great. He would not forgive agamenmon. She was a representation of the dishonor.

So now you are quite literally making up things that did not take place in the Iliad. You are attributing feelings and beliefs to characters that did not exist. As for Achilles accepting the ransom from Priam that he wouldn't from Agamenmon, the contexts were different: He would never forgive Agamenmon of the dishonor he experienced in front of the Grecian host, but Priam's ransom he accepted in part due to the rememberance of Patrochlus death:

>Remembrance melted both. Rolling before
>Achilles’ feet, Priam his son deplored640
>Wide-slaughtering Hector, and Achilles wept
>By turns his father, and by turns his friend
>Patroclus; sounds of sorrow fill’d the tent.
And:
>Achilles, last, groaning, his friend invoked.
>Patroclus! should the tidings reach thine ear,
>Although in Ades, that I have released
>The noble Hector at his father’s suit,
>Resent it not; no sordid gifts have paid
>His ransom-price, which thou shalt also share.

He doesn't exactly hide from his council in the tent he will accept the ransom since he envokes Patroclus memory, and the acceptance of the ransom, out loud. He accepts the ransom in part to honor patroclus

I'm starting to think you have only read a commentary on it from some bizzare scholar with an axe to grind.

>>23222453
And it must be said the Genealogies of the Illiad are plenty fantastical.

>>23222491
it just won't connect. not the cable, the dongle, or bluetooth. the laptop is 3 months old.

>>23222518
he also assures the assembly that whenever he sacks cities and adds their treasures to the common stock, agamemnon awards him only a trifle and takes the lion's share himself; later, we find his hut full of loot.

his famous love of patroclus is really self-love. patroclus dies, and achilles leaves his body unburied. when the miserable ghost appears in a dream, altogether uninterested in his works of vengeance, and complains of the delay, achilles answers brusquely that he is doing everything possible to make the funeral a success, and resents having his elbow jogged. nor does he respect patroclus’ wishes by honourably marrying briseis.

it seems to me!

>tired all the time
>body won't let me sleep

AHHHH IM GOING INSANEEEEE

>>23220421
The alcohol is getting a little out of hand. People ask about it. I hate that they do. I want to tell them exactly why I do it. And why I never go out with them. And why I never call. I've imagined the conversation many times. It usually starts with me getting angry at their prying. I tell them that when I look in the mirror I'm disgusted by what I see, that I make myself sick. That's about as far as I get. They wouldn't understand. Nor would I want them to. Why would I want them to know how pathetic I am. I'm sure they suspect it, but they don't know it. I've been running on the benefit of a doubt for a while now, earned some respect, at least enough to generate some concern now that I am cracking at the seams. But nobody benefits I come right out with it. With what again? Stuttering about self-hatred? To get some pity? Pity is a stinky cologne in adulthood, John. Forget it. I don't even know whats wrong with me. I'm sure I dont even want to be helped.

I'd like to lay down on a dirt road somewhere, beneath a wide open blue sky, temperate breeze through the trees. A bird whisps by, then another, elegant shadows in the sunlight. I would like to lie there forever, a stone, a part of the landscape, somewhere in a dream or memory. Somewhere not too cold.

im just devouring stuff

>>23222618
Are you that anon with heart damage who's always posting about how he wants to an hero?

>>23222683
No, sounds like a stand up guy tho. I havent posted in ages. Used to just post shitty stream of consciousness poetry about rural areas and rain and other gay shit.

>>23222183
Philadelphia

Every talking head with even a little bit of legitimacy seems to be totally convinced that the U.S. “empire” is ending, even though American power is arguably as powerful as it’s ever been. It reminds of Rome. They say that even into the twilight days of the empire, thinking Romans didn’t even know the empire was no longer in a position of strength. It’s like that but the inverse.

>>23222691
Post one of your old poems

Space colonizers land on a new planet with alien life and vegetation, and they slowly realize the alien planet is an exact copy of earth 100 years ago

>>23222699
Thats the best part. I delete them as soon as I post them. Sometimes I just write them in notepad and delete them after I read it. But let me see, may have one somewhere.

>>23222701
Time passes slowly... in the Twilight Zone.

I always had these vague memories in my head of empty, spacious cafes with very tall ceilings, quiet arcades with my brother, my dad's car driving slowly through an indoor labyrinthian carpark. I never knew what part of my childhood it was from but I knew it wasn't a dream.

I just figured it out it's from when we used to take the ferry from England to Germany for my dad's job (when I was 3 - 6). I watched a youtube video of the ferry trip and it moved me strangely.
Maybe it's time I finally read Proust.

I really am going to leave this world. Sorry.

>>23222712
why?

>>23222699
Only thing I found was an old prose vignette I wrote last year.


The highway exit puts me on Edison Rd to the West. Passing over the busy interstate I drop down easily into the modest heart of the town of Evellyn. The town flanks a four lane road, terminating about a half mile West of the interstate. Edison narrows after the last extraregional amenity into two lanes and wide open fields to the North and South. Far in the distance over these fields I can see the blue-grey gradient of hills to the south and ranges to the North, marking and blending the horizon. Westward still, past the local grocery, Beagles, a common franchise with a well lit parking lot; past still an old closed clubhouse and bar called the Beaver Dam, its lot with a few old dusty classic cars unmoved for a decade; and still past a lone squat house with a large shady oaktree and a pink bicycle in the front; past all these and the last two miles of yellow grass fields, Edison Rd slips into the woods, winding gently as the grade increases. The shade quickly envelops the road and the underbelly of the woodland is dark, dense with bushes and dark brown duff. My car hums a bit harder as it plunges further into the corridor, leaving busy Evellyn behind to the commuters.

>>23222707
You should definitely read Proust. ISOLT is one of the best things I’ve ever read, and he really delves into memory as a concept.

>>23222712
Are you that anon who has heart damage and wants to an hero?

>>23222718
Which translation(s) did you read by the way?

>>23222712
its ok

For over a month my dick has just been broken. I was not able to get hard easily and enjoy masturbation anymore. Frequently I would feel pain. In the past few weeks I stopped jacking off and I haven't been able to feel any sexual arousal at all. I might have to stop for a long time to even get properly hard again

>>23222762
You got anxiety, stress, depression? Alcoholism?
Im not a medical person and cant help but those are questions right?

So I was at this writing class today and we presented our texts and the teacher instantly knew I was a fan of a guy who wrote in the 1920s lol
Felt pretty validating to have someone who knew nothing about me recognize it

I'm always horny posting but I don't want to jerk off.

>>23220421
Can you guys please reccomend good D'Annunzio books?
Written by him, I mean.

>>23220421
There is more Dosto and Neetch threads than there needs to be on the catalog. I dont mean to be that guy but READ ANOTHER BOOK.

I knew a stripper who had a lazy eye and now when I see one of these wonky looking fuckers I remember her lovely tits.

>>23222794
LMAO at Jack Nicholson next to her

In the vast desert, we are the Desert People, children of Mundo. We embody the resilience of cacti, with our ancestors as deep roots, ourselves as sturdy bodies, and our grandchildren as rare buds, ensuring our lineage thrives under open skies. This land was suited for us and all of our needs. It is our duty to preserve such a gift and return the favor with undying gratitude and love for each other.

At last, our drought ends as the crescent sun exposes a hidden oasis. A premature premonition, to say the least. Approach cautiously; this is a story for generations to come.

The oasis, a beacon of hope, demands an offering of immense sacrifice before bestowing its serenity. The Desert People, with nothing but each other, make the heart-wrenching decision to sacrifice their frailest horse, Butter Cup. One bud is broken with many more to come. Their thirst is momentarily quenched, a relief not felt in ages. But as the quench subsides, the thirst intensifies. The old, disabled, and voiceless are drowned next, followed by the children and the able. A discourse that leaves none standing. In its wake, silence, a barren expanse renewed. With the oasis now fed, it fruits new life.

>>23222731
The Modern Library edition from 1981, translated by Scott Moncrieff, Terence Kilmartin, and Andreas Mayor, revised by D. J. Enright. I would highly recommend it. I found the first two volumes in a used bookstore and bought them on a whim, and then loved them so much that I ordered the complete boxed set shortly after (picrel is a comparison of my original secondhand paperback copy of Swann’s Way and the newer copy that came in the boxed set). There are also fairly good ebook versions of that particular translation—my local library has the ebooks available to borrow, so yours may as well. And it looks like the EPUBs of that particular edition are available on Libgen, though I can’t personally attest to the quality/formatting.

>>23220421
How should I go about impressing a /lit/ girl who reads Tolstoy, Dostoevsky, etc?

>>23222802
Read Turgenev and scoff at her

>>23221481
Atheism IS boring and nihilistic, yes

>>23222799
Correction: that should say C. K. Scott Moncrieff. I forgot to add his first two initials.

>>23220421
---- Solaria ----
9024
Extended Family

During a late June midmorning of rare clarity
The leaves of a mulberry made

Magic of the light,
Nothing plain, a look suave, glittering

As social dreaming
Or dish during careless holidays.

>>23222701
Does Hitler appear in this book yes or no. If no I'm not reading it.

I am so fucking autistic but I built an entire normal-ish life in spite of it, and this required building up nested and complexly interrelated autistic personae and heuristics for navigating the world. Some of it is genuinely me from root to stem, like my moral and spiritual views, which were real organic growths of intuitions and inclinations I had as an autistic test tube baby floating through space. But a lot of it is not me, and an even larger proportion is ambiguous and I simply have no idea whether it's me.

Sometimes it all crashes down, due to some perfect storm dislocating me from my surroundings and plans and goals, and I completely derealize and disassociate. In those moments I get closer than I would like to intuiting the complete unreality of things. It suddenly feels like the manifest reality in front of you, even the physical matter, is something that has already passed by, like you're watching a record of the past. It also feels like you're in a dream and all these people are sleepwalking, living out lives they would be bored to live out if they knew they had already lived them a thousand times, and this one isn't even a particularly good one.

When I was young I remember being struck by how exactly Sartre described it in Nausea, as vertiginous and literally physically nauseating. Especially the part where he describes someone's proffered hand as like a bunch of maggots writhing. But now that I'm older the nausea is gone and it's more stable. I remember being so terrified of the feeling that I wanted to knock myself unconscious and I literally wondered whether I was in Hell, like Hell was just free-falling in some nihilistic void, aware that it's all there is, while your thoughts about how to escape or the "why" of the void's existence all tumbling over one another and leading circularly back to themselves. But now that's gone and I sometimes find myself exploring the feelings when they happen, and it feels like a physical "turning into" or "turning toward" the truth of them, something I never could have imagined doing before.

If this is just some accidental glimpse of the beginning of the path to enlightenment, I can only imagine what someone who isn't a broken autistic retard was able to accomplish, with support from other seekers and a superior psychic constitution, a thousand years ago. What I experienced as vomit-inducing vertigo and now experience as a blinding light, Plato probably started out experiencing as the blinding light, and by the end of his life was able to reach out and see and touch things illuminated by the light. Sort of like how psychedelics can just be a roller coaster ride through a spooky Willy Wonka + Windows Media Player visualizations tunnel, yet there is some structure and consistency to it for some people. Maybe once you get to a certain level you can get out of the minecart and start walking around and talking to the Ariloulaleelay, instead of just whizzing past them in the dizzy fractals room.

>>23222794
I spent the better part of a night in my car with a hustler. Nothing much happened except conversation, a bit of snogging, and rather innocent waist-up comparison of physiques. No money was exchanged. Never looked at any whores or strippers the same way since.

>>23222912
How old were you when you read Nausea?

>>23222912
Another weird thing I've experimented with regarding the derealization: I am hypersensitive to drugs so I only very rarely smoke one or two hits of marijuana, which gives me "trips" similar to how some people describe being on mushrooms. These also used to be too much too fast, so I didn't smoke marijuana for many years, but I tried it again 3 more times 2.5 years ago, and found I had much more control over the "trip," like I had my sea legs.

It was still mostly unpleasant physically, and even the experiences it enhanced by "supercharging" them, it enhanced them too much, so that all the parts became visible and they no longer seemed like wholes, and I'd just hyper-fixate on individual parts of things. It's like I tunneled down into "Wow, tits aren't just great, they're SUPER-GREAT!" but then I couldn't stop tunneling and went too far, into "Tits are just flesh. I am a monkey and she is a monkey; lizards find other lizards sexy."

One thing I tried to do is hold onto the marijuana insights and bring them back with me, like grabbing onto something in a dream and waking up still holding it in reality. I didn't think it would work but I wanted to experiment with it. And it worked for a lot of things. I often find myself not only retaining the marijuana insights about key things while in a sober state, and that these things are just interwoven with my normal sober thought processes about those things now, I also find that the "feeling" of "deeper insight" still attaches to the thoughts, like the feeling of depth was not just a subjective mode accompanying the insight but part of the structure of insight itself.

>>23222937
16-18, that's when I had the massive existential crisis. I also read Camus at that time and I thought that philosophers did "due diligence," meaning, if they ever said anything (or didn't say it), it's because they had spent years exploring whether it was true. So when teenage me took Sartre to be saying "Isn't it crazy how nothing is real and everything is maggots? Anyway, I'm a Marxist or something I guess," and Camus said "When I sit with me mum and actually think hard, I notice that everything is nothing, and the world begins to dissolve and nothing is real; so anyway, I try not to do that too much (and no I don't have anything else to say on the matter)," I thought it meant that Smart Philosophers had solved the problem of reality and meaning, and the solution was simply "we're objectively fucked; hopefully you find eating chicken wings a sufficient distraction."

It wasn't until later that I realized these two and the whole existentialist school were just limited, and that it was an honorable thing to be dissatisfied with Mr. Sartre's lack of conclusions. That's partly what drove my existential crisis, was thinking that expert consensus had already discovered that reality is Hell.

I then emailed Daniel Dennett asking him how his compatibilism isn't just illusory hard determinism and he didn't help much.

>>23222912
I'm way too dumb to understand this sadly

>>23222981
Then what the fuck are you doing on /lit/? Gtfo

>>23222981
I am just sperging out unedited, I'm not even saying anything complicated or insightful it's just tedious to untangle.

>>23222802
I am in the exact same situation as you. In my case I think there's something wrong with her. She will ask me something and then take an hour to read my answer, one day she'll text me and then abruptly stop talking after a few sentences

>>23222769
Depression yes

With a foundation of philosophical pessimism, it is easy to justify heavy drug use because it lessens your consciousness.

>>23223038
the only time women are away from their phones is when they are getting fucked by somebody else

>>23223058
cocaine heightens your consciousness

>>23222455

Bros I'm sad

I miss getting hugs from pretty women. I hate myself and what I've become

>>23222568
I was just trying to take a nap and each time I was on the cusp of sleep my body twitched violently to wake me up. Happened 3 times before I actually fell asleep

In this video, two Jewish idols of the American right wing compare their cleaning ladies to slaves while they liken the American people to peasants and their favorite global corporate hustlers to kings. I think if we can pump out a few more like this, we just might save the West.

https://youtu.be/jy9bqW0Cvlk?si=dmQvKSCRfmDEJfDY

>>23223144
Isn't it amazing how they both conveniently are Jewish

I am a motherfucking genius

disdain for the stupid, i do not enjoy being around the stupid, i dont enjoy being around this computer at least before people had to mingle irl for entertainment now they are locked in their little echo chambers afraid of confrontation with their own inadequacy damn this disgusting piece of machinery unshackle us all

Gotta that I would be more willing to talk to the women around me if they were more interesting. The ones I see are rather passive and incurious in addition to being trend-followers rather than following their own interests. I don't see the point in talking to such a boring person.

If I were a Gen Xer, I honestly feel I would find more women to talk to and be in deep meaningful relationships with. As it stands now, I'm just looking at porn for my sexual fix but talking to good friends for good company.
>>23221959
Lmao you just described /pol/

I must escape false dichotomies.
Incels and atomized hedonists. Left wing and right wing. One and many. Being and becoming. None of it touches the truth.

I watched one YouTube video about an American Dad character and now my feed is full of video essays about cartoon mystery.
>Meg Griffin: Punching Bag To Pointless
>What happened to Peter's REAL Father?
>Who REALLY Killed Frank Grimes?
All of these videos, and more, are at least a half hour in length. Who the hell wastes the time making videos essays about cartoons that don't care about consistent canon? And worse yet, who the fuck is actually sitting through these long winded video essays?

When I get old I will convert to Jainism.

sometimes when i'm watching weird fetish porn and vaguely disrespecting women for being whores i realize the joke is really on the male gender since women are playing these fucking clown shows as a dayjob for decent money and we're the actual clowns since we're so immature and pathetic that we want to see such clownery in the first place

women may be dressed like clowns but men bring clownshit into the world

i need a unit to sample and hold

>>23223861
So you're watching clown porn?

I'm attracted to my mentor's daughter (she's legal) but twelve years my junior. It would destroy our relationship if he ever found out.

>>23223840
I do for both

>>23220421
>if I can’t have it then no one should

This mindset describes a lot of anons, doesn’t it?

>>23220421
---- Solaria ----
9025
Eclipse

Luxury camp or whatever you call it, it's nice
To live where casual inquiries and expense can take you there.

Even under overcast sky
You'll never see anything like it

No matter the strategy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3j2NYZ8FKs&list=RDMMos-bUL_VrPI&index=3

>>23223928
Luxury cheapens the experience.

>>23223842
They do pretty good desserts for people who don't believe in honey being food

what are some books for someone with a nasty case of the runs?

Recently realized I will never have to work with my arrogant and stinky classmate ever again. Thank you God thank you. That guy was so fat and stinky it was crazy litbros. I couldn't focus when he was around. I swear he smelled like unwashed bodyparts. I know it's bad but holy wow I am so grateful. The guy would get mad when I tried to make him understand I didn't like his smell WOW. God bless him and his coworkers in their time of hardships. I will never force myself to be nice with smelly loners EVER AGAIN. I'm too old for that shit. I'd rather be paid $10-15k less than deal with a biochemical bomb everyday in the office. I'm sorry God for making fun of people like that but WOW it was hard. I've been through real hard stuff and dealt with constant insomnia before and it's nothing compared to smelling that shit.

>>23223962
Post feet

>a world destroyer starts to feel bad about destroying worlds because of the nature of each planet
is that a boring concept to write about?

>>23223968
Isn't that silver surfer?

>>23223953

>>23223965
I'm a man

>>23223962
Sorry

>>23223975
Incorrect

>>23223937
To some extent, insofar as it's soporific.

When it comes to the media lying about things, nihilists seem to have every faith that there is no credibility to their words.
But when it's time to consider some article like from the Guardian about the world ending like peak oil, you latch on without any care at all like it's the normal course of your nihilist reality.

But if the people controlling the media want this outcome to demoralize/instill fear in the general public, shouldn't you also become suspicious whether your own self-improvement isn't something they would hate? If the average creative person in the first world would only do things like revolt, create unions or find some way to improve wages for the majority, promote better art and literature, etc., if they believed humans are capable as a species of surviving each other on Earth (because they certainly did with religion involved), it is worth considering if some devious malevolent core at the top of society is trying their hardest to invent nihilist truths for you. It feels like we then reach for stuff like Youtube Shorts to avoid pain and feel like living out our dreams.

The constant messages even here signaling things like "it's over" sometimes feels unnatural as fuck, but it would be easier to evaluate these thoughts I think if I knew how easy or difficult it is control outcomes of behavior or influence people to think and do things.

>>23224091
Anon, the last human on this wretched planet will in its dying moment still be doodling dicks on everything. Don't worry; art survives a couple moments longer than we go on making viable offspring.

>>23220421
---- Solaria ----
9026
Colossal Clocks.

Even as we talked on that rooftop, neglecting a game of chess
While a lunar eclipse was underway

I wondered what he made of our overheard conversation
About that certain feeling of power.

He never was a boy happy and hilarious
As my father made me.

My job is really starting to piss me off, but in a larger societal sense. Like everyone else working a 9-5 like me has to put their peak energy during the day into the work to make money, and when you get home there's only so many hours you have left before you need to go to bed and do it again instead of having time to work on a hobby.
In my case I'm really trying to become a professional artist in my spare time, but when I have the energy I don't have the time because I'm at work and when I get off work and have the time I don't have the energy anymore. Not to mention finding time to hang out with friends and lift it makes things feel so disorganized and like my skill progress is forced to dredge through shin-deep mud instead of a normal walking pace.
I just we all had more affordability in life so we can all have more of that kind of time to ourselves I suppose.

>>23224180
try meditating 7 minutes a day like when you feel especially distracted doing something pointless

Why won’t you ever talk to me

>>23224180
your not gonna become a 'professional' artist if you don't make huge sacrifices. that means being poor and organizing your life AROUND the study of your craft. even then it's a massive gamble with the chance of absolutely no pay off. the only compromise to this is perhaps getting a job that doesn't exhaust you or that pays less but requires gives you freedom with your time.

I’m genuinely obsessed with Tolstoy and can’t stop dropping everything else I study just to read him more

is there a discord for /lit/? i just want a fast paced pseudo intellectual server

>>23220693
NPD?

I quit my job, I just couldn’t deal with seeing the same people, doing the same thing. It was the longest I’ve ever worked at a place, around two years. For the majority of us life is just one big cage, imprisonment where you can select the warden. I’ve found myself without a warden for months now and there’s chaos in my yard. And in the outside world there are no meals for the impoverished.

I wanna visit Louisiana, it calls my name.

>>23224293
Favourite book/story?

>>23224420
Book - War and Peace
Story - After the Ball
Nonfiction - A Confession

I dated this girl a couple months back, I’m not going to lie I enjoyed her company and I genuinely think she was beautiful. She left me because I couldn’t satisfy her sexually, apparently I was the 18th person she’s been with, I vividly remember her saying “I know what good sex is like and this isn’t it”. It’s funny, to this day I don’t know if I truly miss the relationship or if she just bruised my ego so bad that I’m desperate for a chance to prove myself to her. I find myself stalking her socials, I don’t want her to find love. She hurt my feelings

>>23224424
I wouldn’t even confess this anonymously

Is Taiwan underrated when it comes to the beautiful women of Asia?

>>23224440
Is it that bad? I think people have experienced worse when it comes to dealing with women. This particular girl just happened to be a bit of a whore and me being a guy who has never held down a longterm relationship and only had sex a few times In his life, it might have been destined to fail. All I can do is learn from it

>>23224424
Did you ask her for tips on how to improve?

>>23224247
I'll talk to you!

>>23224479
a big issue I think would be that I couldn’t stay erect, I think it was performance anxiety and maybe consistently watching porn before I started dating her, hard to say. but she never really communicated that she was unsatisfied with that aspect, we got along really well outside of sex.

>>23224485
Moral of the story is don't watch pornography. It's poison.

>>23224499
But the poison feels so good.

>>23224499
Yeah, I’ve tried to quit a couple times, i find myself routinely relapsing, any tips?

>>23224512
It cost you a hot gf.

>>23224515
The best way is probably to get a girlfriend. I became pretty depressed at one point and stopped feeling any need for it. I just stopped jerking off. I have no personal practical advise to offer unfortunately.

>>23224516
I'm a different anon.

I had pizza, garlic bread and coke (the drink) last night, it was so yummy, mmm, delicious.

>>23220421
I'm sitting here, reading old Soldier of Fortune magazines on the internet archive. Laughing at the dumb classifieds.

>>23224693
I'm moderately impressed that the Magazine wasn't a larp. They genuinely had guys all around the world. Even if it's main customer base was tacticool Amerimutt larpers.

WTF
There's an more than 10% chance of surviving a 6 story fall.

>>23224702
Just jump from seven stories.

can i be emo and a Christian?

>>23224755
Dostoevsky

I have almost 3k notes on my notes app and I want to get back into journaling, making lists of my favorite things. Typing is so fun even if I only have a phoen for now

Making coffee is so gay.
Filling it with water, scooping coffee in it with a little scoop. fag.

>>23224517
>just stopped jerking off.
Did it improve with erections?

>>23224794
Not that guy but it absolutely helps.
I had issues with my current girl because I used to jerk it every day. I then lessened porn a lot, maybe using it 2 times a week. Sex got much better and would be better if I cut it entirely which I will once we move in together.

>>23224794
Don't really get boners anymore. But I'd assume it helps as >>23224800 says.

One of my favorite exercises involves creating threads on /pol/ that go against the Current Approved Belief and trying to cogently argue against the deluge that comes. When the threads fizzle out, I feel like I'm coming down from an acid trip. I've got that same sense of a completed journey in which I've seen and felt a lot of incomprehensible things that made sense in the moment but that I haven't necessarily gained anything from the experience.

>>23224857
Like what?
Bait threads are the laziest shit ever

>>23224870
If I'm baiting anyone, it's into a good-faith discussion on things we care about. I have no desire for disingenuity.

What is /wwoym/ reading presently? I have been reading The Snow Leopard. It gets quite good after the second part.

>>23224876
Yo, El Supremo.
Going insane.

>>23224875
It all depends on what the thread is like.
If you start a thread on why trans is fine or Christianity is cucked or how White people need to embrace becoming a minority it might very well be in good faith, but we all know what's happening.

>>23224876
Fairy Tale. I haven't been able to read it in nearly a week since I've been moving house but I'm eager to get back into it, might read some more tomorrow.

Every time I had sex something went wrong. How do people enjoy it?

>>23225007
What goes wrong?

>>23225007
I only have sex with the woman I love. I've always found casual sex dirty, messy, and tiring. It's an intimate act I prefer to share only with people I'm emotionally intimate.

I'm so sick of being a sexual creature. Getting horny always leads me to make poor choices. Being alone and horny turns me into a fucking retard who would let a girl walk all over him if it meant he could touch her boobs or bend and break his morals if it meant getting some. Beating off makes me feel dirty and debased when I'm done.
I've had enough. Set me free. Let my libido die. I want to live for the things I care about and pursue what I believe is important rather than thinking with my dick all the time.

>>23225012
Cumming too fast, it hurts for the girl, spending too long trying oral, not being wild passionate.
>>23225014
Well it happens with long term gf and im scared shell drop me over it

>>23224180
>I'm really trying to become a professional artist in my spare time

This is as good as saying, "I'm trying to become independently wealthy in my spare time." Art and artists are the byproduct of a commodotized lifestyle. If you don't already have the leisure and wherewithal to work and network in the arts, you are ngmi because 99% of becoming successful is having the academic or financial authority to assign grants and give out residencies etc

If things are not changing there's a good chance I'll end up homeless at some point, simply for being unable to maintain a life due to mental illness. But it does seem like things change day by day, what I'm thinking of, that it is developing. I don't *really* think I am blanket-statement mentally ill. I just think there's a lot of stuff in my head. A question is: what will be my chances being 30+ and having spent the last however many years being more or less dysfunctional, only sorting out the stuff in my head. If things are not really changing then all I can say is I hope I can get on some kind of disability.

>>23225030
Try telling her that you enjoy taking it a bit slow in sex because for you sex isn't just a "wham bam thank you ma'am" deal, it's an opportunity to both enjoy and express how beautiful your gf is and how incredibly attracted to her you are. Tell her in normal day to day life there's always a slight social barrier to fully expressing what you are really thinking/feeling, when you look at her, which is "holy shit she's so beautiful, I can't believe someone this hot could even exist," and when you have sex it's like the floodgates are opened, and you can fully express your love and desire. Tell her that it's more than just physical, you don't want to just come and be done with it like it's masturbation, you want to prolong it and fully express it. Tell her that's why you enjoy going down on her and why it's important to you that she gets off.

Above all she needs to be able to understand and believe in your lust for her. You need to make her understand that you're enjoying yourself and that the little things you're doing are manifestations of genuine appreciation and desire for her. She wants more than anything to know that she's desirable, beautiful, perfect, etc. It sounds like she's a pretty vanilla girl who likes to be fucked aggressively and maybe tossed around, but it's not just the physical act of this that gets women off, it's because they have learned that this means "He wants me" which in turn means "I am wanted" which in turns means "I am wantable," and for a woman sex is partly about being the most wanted and wantable in the world, by the best man in the world. If a woman loves you, she sees you as that man and she wants to feel and be reminded that you need her in an almost painful way.

However that doesn't mean you have to fuck her in the only way she has learned that fucking makes sense. You can potentially explain and explore other ways with her, and communicate your desire. If it hurts for her it's because she's not turned on, and if she's not turned on, it's because she doesn't believe or get your attraction to her, and it all feels fake. But women are magical retards who can literally get turned on and lubricate at knowing that their popping balloons for the man they love is turning him on, as long as the man says "wow YOU are the sexiest woman in the world when YOU
pop balloons, I'd kill a bear to defend you right now" (with his eyes and body language).

If you can't be "throw her around like a ragdoll" wild passionate, try being "kissing her all over and telling her what you find attractive about her" wild passionate (but avoid overly specific stuff that is almost a backhanded insult, I mean telling her that her legs or ass are amazing, that kind of thing). Even with the oral thing, if you LIKE giving long oral, tell her it's because she's beautiful and you love seeing the way she looks when you go down on her, that it turns you on when she feels good.

>>23225078
Gay advise.

Some Japanese guy wants to call me in an hour, we've been tryna schedule a call for ages but he's always really busy. The only problem is that in an hour it'll nearly be 1:00 AM and I'm a tired boy. I could force myself to stay up that late but should I?

>>23225100
Japanese guy?
How can anyone say if you should stay up late without knowing what he's calling for?

>>23225108
He just wants to practice his English and he seems chill.

Much has been written about the role of money in politics, but I’ve found very little on the role of the legal profession and by way of it academia on this topic. Pretty much all American politicians are lawyers, and those lawyers are heavily influenced by legal academia, and yet nobody discusses this.

my confidence has been decimated by life, and women. I think I understand why some men in the past would fuck off to die in the woods like an old cat. was that all I was born for, /lit/?

It’s actually strange that the WN crowd isn’t more bullish on America. Sure, that political machine is currently anti-white, but the geography, history, and anthropology of the Americas is brimming with relative opportunity for white people of European ancestry from a WN perspective.

>>23225170
No.

>>23225185
Thanks

>>23225128
Instead of a voice call maybe just do voice messages. Works just as well.

Had nightmares five days in a fucking row.
Worst was when I had three nightmares in a single day, one where I got cussed out at work, another at school, and yet another where all I do is sit at home only to get cussed out by some dipshits.

>>23225203
Just had an hour-long call with the guy, he was super chill, I had a really hard time explaining to him what slang is but I think he eventually got it.

>tfw no gf

That feeling when there is no girlfriend
To hold, to let my lonely heart confide—
It is less sorrow and less pain to end
My life, than count the many tears I cried.

It's probably going to take me longer than the coffee shop is open to decide if I want hot chocolate

The longer I've been on nofap, the more I hate myself for every single time I have jacked off. I look at that phase as something as devastating as a former heroine addiction, as something that took away a lot of potential from me.

New Thread: >>23225620

A lot of anons ask about books that treat a certain subject the way they want to hear about it. They want literature that pounds in their prejudices.

Is it just cheek in tongue or are anons really not aware of it?

>>23225862
/pol/ spillover that just wants to start ragebait off-topic threads

>>23224247
I'm not real. I'm a bad algorithm made in a lab.

>>23225883
There are dogmatic thinkers on both sides of the chud / tranny divide. As a radical far centre extremist I choose the golden middle path so I only genocide some jews and only cut a part of my dick off, as disciplined reason demands.

>>23225862
It’s both